I dont quite understand what you were trying to explain with unlife labman and thoughtseize but I like the idea behind pact and grace. The mirror just seems like a race and labman is a turn slower under ultimate conditions.
The mirror isn't a race because if you try to go off with Lightning Storm / Conflagrate and I have a single Angel's Grace, then you just lose (as you don't have any other way to kill and presumably no cards in your library). In old-school mirrors where neither player has Lab Maniac, it tends to devolve into a Simian Spirit Guide beatdown plan, with both players sitting on Angel's Grace to keep from losing to the other's combo.
If you have Lab Maniac then you can go off with Unlife and then every turn you get another "I Win" opportunity with your draw step so you can keep putting pressure on / burn through your opponent's Angel's Grace until you eventually win the game.
it's not race, since opponent can save himself with Angel's Grace, so Lightning Storm won't work. Only and the best kill in mirror is Maniac. Just set up Unlife + Ad Nauseam, cast Maniac and wait until opponent will be out of Angel's Graces.
I also have slighty diffrent sideboard plan against RG Tron. Instead of siding out Pact of Negation I side in 1 more to have 4 in 60. Tron can disrupt our plan form turn 3 (Karn, Thought-Knot Seer, Ancient Grudge/Nature's Claim when we play Prism/Unlife as late as we can) so having ability to stop disruption and combo on turn 4 with Pact trigger on the stack is nice.
Very nice 5-0 last night at my LGS with the Wish build. I can write up a more detailed report when not on my mobile, but didn't even lose 1 game against the following:
For those playing the wish version, I am curious about recent sideboard choices. I'm on the fence about Dragonlord Dromoka because so many of the more controlling decks I'd want to have her for are running paths/bounce effects. My current board is as follows; any feedback would be greatly appreciated:
i agree with keeping the pacts agains GR tron.
pacting a turn 3 karn into combo next turn is just classy
I have also won this very way many times! Sometimes this is our only real option vs a turn 3 karn.
I'll go into more detail about what I meant about labman and the mirror as I was on mobile earlier. The ad naus mirror is very seldom a race. Our traditional wincon of going to a negative life total and casting lightning storm for lethal with pact of negation as protection doesn't work. If our opponent plays angel's grace in response to lightning storm we cannot respond, we take their life total to 1, and we now have no way to kill them. If you do not have unlife in play you simply die at the end of turn. If we are lucky enough to have unlife in play, a second lightning storm (or way to get it back), and the mana to cast it, we can possibly hit them again on their upkeep or on our own following upkeep if we need to untap in order to have the mana. If they have 2 angel's graces, which is quite possible, then this will not work either. This is why if white decks ever begin to sideboard angel's grace against us it would be very hard to play around.
If you instead have labman in deck and unlife in play you can combo off, pick up your deck, play labman, play a serum vision forcing your opponent to either angel's grace or lose then pass turn if they grace. You will discard most your deck but you want to keep as many pacts as you have (3 or 4 main vs post sideboard) and angel's graces. On your opponent's turn you pact anything that disrupts labman. You do not let them echoing truth it, lightning storm/conflag it, or combo off themselves. On your turn you grace to pay for the pacts you used then draw step to win. If they grace again you should still be okay. Simply pass turn and repeat.
This process becomes easier with duress/thoughtseize. You play those cards after you go off and before you play labman. This forces them to cast grace if they only have 1 or let you take 1 if they have 2 or more. In the event you see their hand and they are without a grace and have no unlife in play or you can remove it (echoing truth) you can win the conventional way with lightning storm. It's possible they have supreme verdict but it's not a common sideboard card and if you use hand disruption, you can just take it before you play labman. Labman makes all of this possible.
The mirror plays out in a much longer fasion if neither player has a labman. It's almost never safe to combo off unless you resolve something like dromoka or teferi. SSG beatdown is usually the plan to force the opponent to have to make the first move. Also just a note that the wish version generally has a favorable mirror compared to the other variants as they can usually cast something like sigarda or dromoka. If you play the list with gut shot in the sideboard you can also go off with unlife in play, cast lightning storm, allow the opponent to grace taking them to 1, pass turn keeping pacts, an extra SSG and a gutshot and play it on their upkeep to zero them. If they have two graces you still lose. I hope that clears this up a bit and demonstrates that labman is fantastic in the mirror. If you play it and your opponent does not, I would say you have a pretty decent advantage. The only time the match plays out like a race is when both players have a labman. Then whomever can pick up their deck with an unlife on the board usually wins.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Modern: UBWAd NauseamWBU URStormRU
EDH: BMikaeus the UnhallowedB RWAurelia, the WarleaderWR
Took 1st place at a really competitive 40 person FNM last night using the spoils version. I felt extremely confident in all of my matches and was able to breeze through most games without even having to worry about much. I think it's safe to say that we are extremely well placed in the current competitive meta.
2-0 against Nahiri Combo
2-0 against UB Thopter
2-1 against GR Scapeshift
2-1 against GR Tron
I'd post my decklist but it's the same one we've all seen countless times. Running 3 each of the Esper temples and 1/1 split of labman/Lightning Storm MB.
Sorry if someone already has referred to mirror match up
but what if you combo off with Nauseam and Grace ,
draw all cards then cast Unlife with 4 SSG and one prism instead of lighting storm?
You discard all except Labman pacts and Graces this turn.
You will cast labman next turn and protect him and unlife with pacts.
I mean you may win in the way i mentioned without knowledge of your oppornents graces.
This implies that you can win when you resolve ad and grace in your turn except oppornents spells like sudden shock or wipeaway.
Ok please dont rip my head off and im sure for some reason its a bad idea but what would you guys think about running 3 brainspoil as ad nauseam 5-7 in place of 2 peer through the depths and mystical teachings in the classic version(I dont imagine it would be worth replacing 3 spoils) and 3 dizzy spell as angels grace 5-7 in place of phyrexian unlife.
Ide just like to hear some of the specific scenarios when this is bad. Basically the first 2 turns you need to hit your rock and dig for your two combo pieces which you now have 7 each of. Play the transmute on t3 and go off t4.
One of the main reasons I like this idea, I play vs infect a lot in my LGS and its nice to have an option outside phyrexian unlife. Obviously vs burn and fast aggro you will want your unlifes back in.
Just a random thought that im sure some of you AN veterans will easily tear holes through.
I would not want brainspoil over teachings/peer. It's sorcery speed which is a big down side. If you grab an ad nauseam and pass turn your opponent could use thoughtseize or TKS. With the instant speed spells you do it on the opponents end step so this isn't a worry. What's also great about teachings and peer is that it finds not only ad nauseam but also grace or a pact. If you already have ad nauseam in hand, brainspoil is not very good where as teachings/peer can find the other combo piece or protection. A great line against blue decks if you have the combo in hand is to cast teachings on your opponents end step. If they let it resolve you grab a pact, if they don't they have used a counter up and committed mana. You can also flashback teachings in the longer matches against control. Honestly I'd rather run dark petition than the brainspoil but I don't think either are good and spoils is better than both for a lot of different reasons.
Replacing unlife with dizzy spell seems even worse. Again sorcery speed means you're probably not transmuting and comboing in the same turn. Unlife has the same problem but makes up for it by buying you a turn or two to eventually combo. Additionally, dropping unlife makes our matches versus a large chunk of the meta worse. Burn, zoo, affinity, elves, and many other aggro strategies become unfavorable. I'm also not sure how access to a turn three grace that you can't cast until turn four helps against infect. You're probably dead already. I get that unlife is basically useless in that match but it's better to have unlife main deck for the numerous decks it's good against and side it out in the couple where it's bad rather than the other way around.
Considering Selling my Ad Nauseam Deck. The only reason i'm considering it is based off its recent GP Charlotte victory and recent rise in popularity. Additionally, since I started foiling it out ive sidetracked into 2 other modern decks.
Out of the 75 card deck there are 48 Foils, 7 Italian Prints, and 1 Artist signed cards. It is difficult to price a foil/foreign heavy list but is around 800.00. Obviously I don't want to take much of a hit on the value especially because it hasn't been easy finding all the foils. Anyway, please post a comment or a like to keep this post afloat and get some visibility.
While making sure I am under 10%, I can not accept lower than 700.00 for the deck which will include Dragon Shield White Matte Sleeves and a Black Ultra Pro tower deckbox. As well as insured and tracked shipping.
The maindeck is 2 cards away from Andreas Ganz 1st place GP finish. The sideboard is just what has worked for me.
I am new with the deck and I was wondering what are the best ways to deal with chalice of the void?
Chalice at one seems worse than zero, but it will obviously depend on opponents style of play.
I was thinking of engineer explosive (because it is also great in a lot of other match up) and it can Be fetched with tolaria west If you run it.
I was also thinking about trickbind, which can counter the trigger ability for the rest of the turn on top of being uncounterable.
Echoing truth is also a good toolbox but I was hoping for something more efficent
Chalice on one is pretty backbreaking but it's not a very widely played card at the moment. I believe trickbind only counters a triggered ability once. It counters activated abilities of permanents until end of turn. It could let you fire off an angel's grace but for the same two mana echoing truth just seems better especially because you can bounce the chalice on their end step and then untap and combo. With trickbind you'd have to play it as you combo off. EE is okay for chalice but I'd rather pack a hurkyl's recall. I'm not sure what other matches I'd want EE. Honestly, chalice isn't popular enough at the moment to specifically sideboard for IMO so the cards we have in the board anyway (recall and echoing truth) seem fine.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Modern: UBWAd NauseamWBU URStormRU
EDH: BMikaeus the UnhallowedB RWAurelia, the WarleaderWR
The manabase is out of this world! It is so efficient. Aside the 4 temples and Tolaria West that come into play tapped, 15 other lands come into play untapped which is why you never get mana screwed. Also, velocity is the most important asset of this manabase : it is so fast with fetchlands, shocklands and legendary lands. Knowing that the meta is fast and aggro, I feel really good early game getting the mana I need and also late game especially because fastlands might be problematic in the long run when needing mana. Some of these lands are awesome:
1) Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth has amazing synergies with the 4 fetchlands (which can be tapped for black) as well as the 2 Gemstone Mine, which are now eternal (can be tapped for black without using a counter).
2) Mikokoro, Center of the Sea is a great drawing engine.
3) Oboro, Palace in the Clouds is a great discard outlet to BG/x.
4) Tolaria West can fetch you everything you need : a Pact of Negation, Slaughter Pact, Boseiju, Who Shelters All, etc.
5) Boseiju, Who Shelters All is just the go-to land against control decks.
Even, you could run :
1) Gemstone Caverns gives you more velocity on the draw and that is quite useful.
2) Minamo, School at Water's Edge is great for corner cases : it can untap Mikokoro, Center of the Sea late game to draw cards, it can untap Gemstone Caverns on the draw for mana fixing and even Boseiju, Who Shelters All.
Cheers!
EDIT: I just thought about a shock manabse that got top 8 at SCG IQ Los Angeles in 2015 by Derk Chad. I know, lots of temples, but still interesting :
I am new with the deck and I was wondering what are the best ways to deal with chalice of the void?
Chalice at one seems worse than zero, but it will obviously depend on opponents style of play.
I was thinking of engineer explosive (because it is also great in a lot of other match up) and it can Be fetched with tolaria west If you run it.
I was also thinking about trickbind, which can counter the trigger ability for the rest of the turn on top of being uncounterable.
Echoing truth is also a good toolbox but I was hoping for something more efficent
Any thoughts?
Echoing Truth is an all star. Deals with everything and is very efficient!
I've been testing Explosives recently and it's been ok, slightly slow. Will test it further
The manabase is out of this world! It is so efficient. Aside the 4 temples and Tolaria West that come into play tapped, 15 other lands come into play untapped which is why you never get mana screwed. Also, velocity is the most important asset of this manabase : it is so fast with fetchlands, shocklands and legendary lands. Knowing that the meta is fast and aggro, I feel really good early game getting the mana I need and also late game especially because fastlands might be problematic in the long run when needing mana. Some of these lands are awesome:
1) Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth has amazing synergies with the 4 fetchlands (which can be tapped for black) as well as the 2 Gemstone Mine, which are now eternal (can be tapped for black without using a counter).
2) Mikokoro, Center of the Sea is a great drawing engine.
3) Oboro, Palace in the Clouds is a great discard outlet to BG/x.
4) Tolaria West can fetch you everything you need : a Pact of Negation, Slaughter Pact, Boseiju, Who Shelters All, etc.
5) Boseiju, Who Shelters All is just the go-to land against control decks.
Even, you could run :
1) Gemstone Caverns gives you more velocity on the draw and that is quite useful.
2) Minamo, School at Water's Edge is great for corner cases : it can untap Mikokoro, Center of the Sea late game to draw cards, it can untap Gemstone Caverns on the draw for mana fixing and even Boseiju, Who Shelters All.
Cheers!
EDIT: I just thought about a shock manabse that got top 8 at SCG IQ Los Angeles in 2015 by Derk Chad. I know, lots of temples, but still interesting :
Love this manabase! Been using it a lot but with 4 Gemstone Mines and a Dreadship Reef instead of Oboro. Fantastic!
@Tom - How did the testing go with the 8 temple spoils version? It's clearly putting up great results despite being slow. I'm not too fond of the manabase but may try the shock/fetch one with +3 spoils, -2 Peer -1 teachings.
Careful, fetch/shock and Spoils don't go well together! You'll be fetching thus pitching lands to the graveyard and this could hurt with Spoils. Imagine if you've fetch four times in a game, you're down to 16 lands. It could make a difference. Really, fetch/shock is for Peer/Teachings.
If you're refering to Andreas Ganz's list that won GP Charlotte, he had 6 temples (4 Deceit, 2 Enlightenment). I'm really not found of ETB lands and 4-5 is the most I could see myslef playing. I haven't played his list, I tried something else : I tested a list with lots of ETB lands and while it worked wonders, it's really not my wheelhouse :
I hate so much being defeated due to a ETB land, it's the worse feeling for me : not drawing the cards you need, facing a bad matchup, making a mistake, etc. These are all better than being mana screwed by a ETB land. I highly recommand the list I posted with 8 temples above, I've tuned it in order to have a fetchless manabase. I tested it a lot to make it work in conjunction with Peer/Teachings and having a sideboard dedicated to most of the field while being funky at the same time. I need to test Ganz list, but I'm just repeating what I said : I want to know if he faced BG/x, Infect and Affinity in the 15 rounds. The only really good thing about the list to me are 3 Spellskite. I'll test it to see because I've been on Spoils and Fastlands/Temples for 9 months in 2015!
The mirror isn't a race because if you try to go off with Lightning Storm / Conflagrate and I have a single Angel's Grace, then you just lose (as you don't have any other way to kill and presumably no cards in your library). In old-school mirrors where neither player has Lab Maniac, it tends to devolve into a Simian Spirit Guide beatdown plan, with both players sitting on Angel's Grace to keep from losing to the other's combo.
If you have Lab Maniac then you can go off with Unlife and then every turn you get another "I Win" opportunity with your draw step so you can keep putting pressure on / burn through your opponent's Angel's Grace until you eventually win the game.
I also have slighty diffrent sideboard plan against RG Tron. Instead of siding out Pact of Negation I side in 1 more to have 4 in 60. Tron can disrupt our plan form turn 3 (Karn, Thought-Knot Seer, Ancient Grudge/Nature's Claim when we play Prism/Unlife as late as we can) so having ability to stop disruption and combo on turn 4 with Pact trigger on the stack is nice.
R1. Affinity
R2. Burn
R3. RG Tron
R4. Scapeshift
R5. Esper Mill
For those playing the wish version, I am curious about recent sideboard choices. I'm on the fence about Dragonlord Dromoka because so many of the more controlling decks I'd want to have her for are running paths/bounce effects. My current board is as follows; any feedback would be greatly appreciated:
4 Leylines
3 Ethereal Haze
1 Batwing Brume
1 Slaughter Games
1 Firespouts
1 BtL
1 Wargate
1 Dragonlord (Sigarda? Vexing Shusher?)
1 Wear//Tear
1 Fracturing Gust
pacting a turn 3 karn into combo next turn is just classy
I'll go into more detail about what I meant about labman and the mirror as I was on mobile earlier. The ad naus mirror is very seldom a race. Our traditional wincon of going to a negative life total and casting lightning storm for lethal with pact of negation as protection doesn't work. If our opponent plays angel's grace in response to lightning storm we cannot respond, we take their life total to 1, and we now have no way to kill them. If you do not have unlife in play you simply die at the end of turn. If we are lucky enough to have unlife in play, a second lightning storm (or way to get it back), and the mana to cast it, we can possibly hit them again on their upkeep or on our own following upkeep if we need to untap in order to have the mana. If they have 2 angel's graces, which is quite possible, then this will not work either. This is why if white decks ever begin to sideboard angel's grace against us it would be very hard to play around.
If you instead have labman in deck and unlife in play you can combo off, pick up your deck, play labman, play a serum vision forcing your opponent to either angel's grace or lose then pass turn if they grace. You will discard most your deck but you want to keep as many pacts as you have (3 or 4 main vs post sideboard) and angel's graces. On your opponent's turn you pact anything that disrupts labman. You do not let them echoing truth it, lightning storm/conflag it, or combo off themselves. On your turn you grace to pay for the pacts you used then draw step to win. If they grace again you should still be okay. Simply pass turn and repeat.
This process becomes easier with duress/thoughtseize. You play those cards after you go off and before you play labman. This forces them to cast grace if they only have 1 or let you take 1 if they have 2 or more. In the event you see their hand and they are without a grace and have no unlife in play or you can remove it (echoing truth) you can win the conventional way with lightning storm. It's possible they have supreme verdict but it's not a common sideboard card and if you use hand disruption, you can just take it before you play labman. Labman makes all of this possible.
The mirror plays out in a much longer fasion if neither player has a labman. It's almost never safe to combo off unless you resolve something like dromoka or teferi. SSG beatdown is usually the plan to force the opponent to have to make the first move. Also just a note that the wish version generally has a favorable mirror compared to the other variants as they can usually cast something like sigarda or dromoka. If you play the list with gut shot in the sideboard you can also go off with unlife in play, cast lightning storm, allow the opponent to grace taking them to 1, pass turn keeping pacts, an extra SSG and a gutshot and play it on their upkeep to zero them. If they have two graces you still lose. I hope that clears this up a bit and demonstrates that labman is fantastic in the mirror. If you play it and your opponent does not, I would say you have a pretty decent advantage. The only time the match plays out like a race is when both players have a labman. Then whomever can pick up their deck with an unlife on the board usually wins.
UBWAd NauseamWBU
URStormRU
EDH:
BMikaeus the UnhallowedB
RWAurelia, the WarleaderWR
2-0 against Nahiri Combo
2-0 against UB Thopter
2-1 against GR Scapeshift
2-1 against GR Tron
I'd post my decklist but it's the same one we've all seen countless times. Running 3 each of the Esper temples and 1/1 split of labman/Lightning Storm MB.
but what if you combo off with Nauseam and Grace ,
draw all cards then cast Unlife with 4 SSG and one prism instead of lighting storm?
You discard all except Labman pacts and Graces this turn.
You will cast labman next turn and protect him and unlife with pacts.
This implies that you can win when you resolve ad and grace in your turn except oppornents spells like sudden shock or wipeaway.
I would not want brainspoil over teachings/peer. It's sorcery speed which is a big down side. If you grab an ad nauseam and pass turn your opponent could use thoughtseize or TKS. With the instant speed spells you do it on the opponents end step so this isn't a worry. What's also great about teachings and peer is that it finds not only ad nauseam but also grace or a pact. If you already have ad nauseam in hand, brainspoil is not very good where as teachings/peer can find the other combo piece or protection. A great line against blue decks if you have the combo in hand is to cast teachings on your opponents end step. If they let it resolve you grab a pact, if they don't they have used a counter up and committed mana. You can also flashback teachings in the longer matches against control. Honestly I'd rather run dark petition than the brainspoil but I don't think either are good and spoils is better than both for a lot of different reasons.
Replacing unlife with dizzy spell seems even worse. Again sorcery speed means you're probably not transmuting and comboing in the same turn. Unlife has the same problem but makes up for it by buying you a turn or two to eventually combo. Additionally, dropping unlife makes our matches versus a large chunk of the meta worse. Burn, zoo, affinity, elves, and many other aggro strategies become unfavorable. I'm also not sure how access to a turn three grace that you can't cast until turn four helps against infect. You're probably dead already. I get that unlife is basically useless in that match but it's better to have unlife main deck for the numerous decks it's good against and side it out in the couple where it's bad rather than the other way around.
UBWAd NauseamWBU
URStormRU
EDH:
BMikaeus the UnhallowedB
RWAurelia, the WarleaderWR
$700
Considering Selling my Ad Nauseam Deck. The only reason i'm considering it is based off its recent GP Charlotte victory and recent rise in popularity. Additionally, since I started foiling it out ive sidetracked into 2 other modern decks.
Out of the 75 card deck there are 48 Foils, 7 Italian Prints, and 1 Artist signed cards. It is difficult to price a foil/foreign heavy list but is around 800.00. Obviously I don't want to take much of a hit on the value especially because it hasn't been easy finding all the foils. Anyway, please post a comment or a like to keep this post afloat and get some visibility.
While making sure I am under 10%, I can not accept lower than 700.00 for the deck which will include Dragon Shield White Matte Sleeves and a Black Ultra Pro tower deckbox. As well as insured and tracked shipping.
The maindeck is 2 cards away from Andreas Ganz 1st place GP finish. The sideboard is just what has worked for me.
http://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/354553#paper
FOIL 1 Laboratory Maniac - NM - 9
ITALIAN 4 Simian Spirit Guide - LP - 24
FOIL 4 Lotus Bloom - NM - 44
3 Pact of Negation - LP - 81
FOIL 4 Angels Grace - NM - 84
FOIL PROMO 4 Serum Visions - NM - 28
4 Sleight of Hand - LP - 12
3 Spoils of the Vault - LP - 12
FOIL 4 Pentad Prism - NM - 28
FOIL 1 Lightning Storm - NM - 12
FOIL 3 Phyrexian Unlife - NM - 42
FOIL 4 Ad Nauseam - NM - 80
FOIL 4 Darkslick Shores - NM - 100
4 Gemstone Mine - MP - 28
ARTIST SIGNED 1 Hallowed Fountain - MP - 8
FOIL 1 Island - NM - 0
FOIL 1 Plains - NM - 0
1 Reflecting Pool - NM - 7
FOIL 4 Seachrome Coast - NM - 68
FOIL 4 Temple of Deceit - NM - 16
FOIL 1 Temple of Enlightenment - NM - 7
FOIL 1 Boseiju, Who Shelters All - NM - 19
FOIL 1 Slaughter Pact - NM - 19
ITALIAN 3 Darkness(Legends) - MP - 20
FOIL 2 Duress - NM - 1
FOIL 3 Lose Hope - NM - 1
4 Leyline of Sanctity - NM - 52
FOIL 1 Patrician's Scorn - NM - 1
I am new with the deck and I was wondering what are the best ways to deal with chalice of the void?
Chalice at one seems worse than zero, but it will obviously depend on opponents style of play.
I was thinking of engineer explosive (because it is also great in a lot of other match up) and it can Be fetched with tolaria west If you run it.
I was also thinking about trickbind, which can counter the trigger ability for the rest of the turn on top of being uncounterable.
Echoing truth is also a good toolbox but I was hoping for something more efficent
Any thoughts?
UBWAd NauseamWBU
URStormRU
EDH:
BMikaeus the UnhallowedB
RWAurelia, the WarleaderWR
4 Simian Spirit Guide
Lands (20)
2 Flooded Strand
2 Gemstone Mine
2 Island
2 Polluted Delta
2 Temple of Deceit
2 Temple of Enlightenment
1 Hallowed Fountain
1 Mikokoro, Center of the Sea
1 Oboro, Palace in the Clouds
1 Plains
1 Tolaria West
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Swamp
1 Watery Grave
4 Ad Nauseam
4 Angel's Grace
4 Lotus Bloom
4 Pentad Prism
4 Serum Visions
4 Sleight of Hand
3 Pact of Negation
3 Phyrexian Unlife
2 Peer Through Depths
1 Conflagrate
1 Mystical Teachings
1 Lightning Storm
1 Slaughter Pact
4 Leyline of Sanctity
3 Ethereal Haze
2 Thoughtseize
1 Boseiju, Who Shelters All
1 Drown in Sorrow
1 Echoing Truth
1 Laboratory Maniac
1 Patrician's Scorn
1 Silence
The manabase is out of this world! It is so efficient. Aside the 4 temples and Tolaria West that come into play tapped, 15 other lands come into play untapped which is why you never get mana screwed. Also, velocity is the most important asset of this manabase : it is so fast with fetchlands, shocklands and legendary lands. Knowing that the meta is fast and aggro, I feel really good early game getting the mana I need and also late game especially because fastlands might be problematic in the long run when needing mana. Some of these lands are awesome:
1) Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth has amazing synergies with the 4 fetchlands (which can be tapped for black) as well as the 2 Gemstone Mine, which are now eternal (can be tapped for black without using a counter).
2) Mikokoro, Center of the Sea is a great drawing engine.
3) Oboro, Palace in the Clouds is a great discard outlet to BG/x.
4) Tolaria West can fetch you everything you need : a Pact of Negation, Slaughter Pact, Boseiju, Who Shelters All, etc.
5) Boseiju, Who Shelters All is just the go-to land against control decks.
Even, you could run :
1) Gemstone Caverns gives you more velocity on the draw and that is quite useful.
2) Minamo, School at Water's Edge is great for corner cases : it can untap Mikokoro, Center of the Sea late game to draw cards, it can untap Gemstone Caverns on the draw for mana fixing and even Boseiju, Who Shelters All.
Cheers!
EDIT: I just thought about a shock manabse that got top 8 at SCG IQ Los Angeles in 2015 by Derk Chad. I know, lots of temples, but still interesting :
1 City of Brass
4 Gemstone Mine
3 Hallowed Fountain
1 Island
1 Plains
4 Temple of Deceit
4 Temple of Enlightenment
2 Watery Grave
Aggro: Naya Burn RWG
Combo: Scapeshift RG
Control: Jeskai Control UWR
Legacy
Control: Miracles UW
Aggro: Burn R
Echoing Truth is an all star. Deals with everything and is very efficient!
I've been testing Explosives recently and it's been ok, slightly slow. Will test it further
Love this manabase! Been using it a lot but with 4 Gemstone Mines and a Dreadship Reef instead of Oboro. Fantastic!
@Tom - How did the testing go with the 8 temple spoils version? It's clearly putting up great results despite being slow. I'm not too fond of the manabase but may try the shock/fetch one with +3 spoils, -2 Peer -1 teachings.
If you're refering to Andreas Ganz's list that won GP Charlotte, he had 6 temples (4 Deceit, 2 Enlightenment). I'm really not found of ETB lands and 4-5 is the most I could see myslef playing. I haven't played his list, I tried something else : I tested a list with lots of ETB lands and while it worked wonders, it's really not my wheelhouse :
4 Temple of Deceit
4 Temple of Enlightenment
4 Gemstone Mine
2 Darkslick Shores
2 Seachrome Coast
1 Boseiju, Who Shelters All
1 Tolaria West
1 Island
1 Plains
Creatures (4)
4 Simian Spirit Guide
Spells (36)
4 Ad Nauseam
4 Angel's Grace
4 Lotus Bloom
4 Pentad Prism
4 Serum Visions
4 Sleight of Hand
3 Pact of Negation
3 Phyrexian Unlife
2 Peer Through Depths
1 Conflagrate
1 Lightning Storm
1 Mystical Teachings
1 Slaughter Pact
4 Leyline of Sanctity
2 Hurkyl's Recall
2 Thoughtseize
1 Drown in Sorrow
1 Echoing Truth
1 Laboratory Maniac
1 Patrician's Scorn
1 Silence
1 Supreme Verdict
1 Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir
I hate so much being defeated due to a ETB land, it's the worse feeling for me : not drawing the cards you need, facing a bad matchup, making a mistake, etc. These are all better than being mana screwed by a ETB land. I highly recommand the list I posted with 8 temples above, I've tuned it in order to have a fetchless manabase. I tested it a lot to make it work in conjunction with Peer/Teachings and having a sideboard dedicated to most of the field while being funky at the same time. I need to test Ganz list, but I'm just repeating what I said : I want to know if he faced BG/x, Infect and Affinity in the 15 rounds. The only really good thing about the list to me are 3 Spellskite. I'll test it to see because I've been on Spoils and Fastlands/Temples for 9 months in 2015!
Cheers!
Aggro: Naya Burn RWG
Combo: Scapeshift RG
Control: Jeskai Control UWR
Legacy
Control: Miracles UW
Aggro: Burn R
http://www.blackborder.com/q/node/19785