Hi guys ive just started to play modern and as I used to love valakut in standard i thought id try Titan shift. I've got a few questions mainly but please remember I'm new to modern.
1, Why fetch lands, i understand them when utilising land fall triggers, ie lotus cobra, garden etc but just for deck thinning, is it that great?
2, Ive looked at the Titan shift decks closely but they all seem fairly slow in the ramp method, in standard i was aiming for t3 or t4 Titans all the time but here I'm struggling to see that ever happening, am I missing the point?
3, is remand here just to protect the combo?
Thanks for your help guys I'm looking forward to a new type of game.
1. You don't really need a ton of fetches, certainly not as many as some other decks. They're really good at fixing your mana though. You're obviously forced to run a ton of various types of mountains, but red is the least important color to this deck. You really want to get double green and double blue mana as fast as you can most of the time and fetches will help you there. Obviously the ramp spells also help with that, but the deck usually uses a ton of shock lands and only Farseek can go get those otherwise.
2. This isn't a fast deck, and Titan is really your secondary win condition considering how easily he dies to a lot of removal. The main goal is to just stay alive until you get enough land in play to cast the winning Scapeshift. Obviously if you can lay down a Titan early you should go for it, but there are only 4 and no way to really go get it so there are a bunch of games where you won't even see him.
3. Remand is good not only for forcing through your winning Scapeshift against control, but just keeping you alive. Since you actually have to live to get your 6-8 lands in play for Scapeshift, the extra turn that Remand usually buys you is critical. Also, the cantrip is nice to help you actually find a threat since there are only 8 cards in the TitanShift deck that will actually win you a game. The extra turn that Remand gives you can often be the difference between holding on for the win or getting your lands blown up by Karn or something equally awful.
Izzet Charm is fantastic in this deck because all three abilities are actually relevant. The draw 2 discard 2 part is actually the one I use the least because it's so card-disadvantageous I only use it at the end of the game where I know if I don't find a Scapeshift ASAP, I'm gonna end up dead in a turn or two. Most of the time I use it to burn opposing creatures that are causing trouble like DRS or Bob or Aven Mindcensor or Meliria. It's also great at stopping Tron from rolling over you with Karn.
As for Farseek vs. Explore, I've backed off Explore. When it works properly, it's amazing, but I was just having too many times where all it did was draw me a card but I missed the extra land drop. I determined that I liked the certainty of the guaranteed ramp, especially since Farseek is the only card that can get shocklands. Explore kinda requires you to build your deck around it with cards like Serum Visions and Halimar Depths to manipulate your ability to draw into the extra lands you want to play.
Hi guys ive just started to play modern and as I used to love valakut in standard i thought id try Titan shift. I've got a few questions mainly but please remember I'm new to modern.
1, Why fetch lands, i understand them when utilising land fall triggers, ie lotus cobra, garden etc but just for deck thinning, is it that great?
2, Ive looked at the Titan shift decks closely but they all seem fairly slow in the ramp method, in standard i was aiming for t3 or t4 Titans all the time but here I'm struggling to see that ever happening, am I missing the point?
3, is remand here just to protect the combo?
Thanks for your help guys I'm looking forward to a new type of game.
Hey there! Welcome to modern. I've played Scapeshift for about a year now and have a decent amount of experience with Scapeshift and U/W midrange/control in modern so I'll try and answer questions as best I can.
1.) 4-6 Fetches are generally considered necessary depending on the version of scapeshift you are playing. The cryptic versions require UUU to cast cryptic, UR for izzet charms, and GG for scapeshift. Some fetches are needed to ensure you can hit these spells on time. Additionally, the Cryptic lists usually also run Flooded Grove.
Non-cryptic lists are playing Prismatic Omen. This is the biggest and best reason to play with 6+ Fetches. With an active Omen/Valakut, a fetch is 6 damage, with 3 of it being instant, meaning you can take out a pesky haste creature or interact in ways usually not available.
2.)Titan/Shift lists are about brute strength. They usually also involve Omen, but with these lists you're looking to stay alive long enough to either: a)allow them to make a mistake so that you can resolve a haymaker and win -OR- b)try and go off right before you die. This is a control/combo deck. I personally don't play with Titan, as Omen and Scapeshift are win coniditions themselves, so playing 10+ win conditions in a combo/control list will often leave you dead with pieces in hand.
3.)Remand is a jack of all trades. Because Scapeshift win's the game on the spot, often all you need is one extra turn. Whether it's delaying an Ajani, a Cranial Plating, or a Deathrite, this deck needs land drops to win and Remand is often considered a virtual time walk. It pulls double duty protecting your combo.
Izzet Charm is fantastic in this deck because all three abilities are actually relevant. The draw 2 discard 2 part is actually the one I use the least because it's so card-disadvantageous I only use it at the end of the game where I know if I don't find a Scapeshift ASAP, I'm gonna end up dead in a turn or two. Most of the time I use it to burn opposing creatures that are causing trouble like DRS or Bob or Aven Mindcensor or Meliria. It's also great at stopping Tron from rolling over you with Karn.
As for Farseek vs. Explore, I've backed off Explore. When it works properly, it's amazing, but I was just having too many times where all it did was draw me a card but I missed the extra land drop. I determined that I liked the certainty of the guaranteed ramp, especially since Farseek is the only card that can get shocklands. Explore kinda requires you to build your deck around it with cards like Serum Visions and Halimar Depths to manipulate your ability to draw into the extra lands you want to play.
With the new Temple scry lands, any chance you're going to play any of those over Halimar? I also use Explore, but cultivate as well (I play with 3-4 omens and 3 Valas) and I've also been exploring manlands as an option B as I hate Leyline of Sanctity, but I started with halimar depths like yourself.
With the new Temple scry lands, any chance you're going to play any of those over Halimar? I also use Explore, but cultivate as well (I play with 3-4 omens and 3 Valas) and I've also been exploring manlands as an option B as I hate Leyline of Sanctity, but I started with halimar depths like yourself.
I don't think the scry lands are any good here. Halimar digs deeper and lets you set up a better explore, which is what you really want if you're playing Explore over Farseek. Plus if you're not happy with the 3 cards Halimar shows you, the deck is full of cards that let you shuffle your library so you can get rid of the junk.
what do you think about the new planeswalker Kiora, the crushing wave in this deck? Her -1 ability fits perfectly in this deck. She could serve as both a ramp spell and an alternative win con. Being a 4cc planeswalker she will not turn on abrupt decay and path to exile.
Sure, she dies to everything but I think she is worth testing. What do you think?
Sure it fits the theme of the deck... but with little to nothing to protect it... It is essentially a 4 mana explore... IMO not that great unless we become a control shell which wins by scapeshift.
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There are only 2 seasons each year... summer and hockey, and summer lasts too long.
So, this is without a doubt the best deck in modern. Why people aren't playing it more, I have no idea. #DeckOP.
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Modern: Modern is Bad
Legacy:WDeath and TaxesW W45-L16-D11 8 Top 8s 15th Scg Oakland
Current Kiln Fiend Count: 153 Please message me if you want to trade me or give me some.
Commission Rezombied to alter some cards, he's awesome!
So, I just realized that I have literally every card for this deck save Izzet Charm or a couple Telling Time (the mana base, Cryptic Command, Titans, Remand, all of those I've had since their respective Standard), and I'm a long time Melira Pod player wanting to try something else that's good that won't involve having to buy Karn Liberated.
Fortunate note: I played Scapeshift back when it was allowed in Extended (using Wargate as the tutor, lol), and it used Peer Through Depths back then, so now that I'm wanting to get into it... what kind of build should I look into making?
I notice that some builds use Titans and Prismatic Omen, some builds eschew the Omens or Titan and use Cryptics, some builds use Omens and Cryptics but no Titans, one I saw on mtgdecks used all 3. Looking at the latest tournament results it seems that doing any of the above is fine, but what should I keep in mind when trying to build this deck for myself? There seems to be a good deal more flexibility when building it. If that flexibility is meta dependent, I have an almost entirely aggro meta that abuses the hell out of Cavern of Souls (one guy runs Elves, another Death and Taxes, there's a few rogue decks and Kiki Pod), so I'm imaging Cryptic Command would be most used as a Turnabout or something if I would keep in maindeck.
In the end it comes down to prefered playstyle. Both versions can be promo pimped^^
I am no fan of pimp or foils but I have every possible build of this deck full art/promo pimped. No one ever appreciates losing to such a pretty combo though.
I am no fan of pimp or foils but I have every possible build of this deck full art/promo pimped. No one ever appreciates losing to such a pretty combo though.
4-0'd a local modern tournament with CrypticShift last night having never played the deck before we started. It is a little scary how much the deck can win out of nowhere. Games 1 and 2 felt totally unearned, but by round 3 I was feeling a bit more comfortable.
Matchups were Pod, B/W Tokens, Soul Sisters and Jund. I'm still amazed I managed to win vs. Soul Sisters.
Maybe this was discussed already, but has anyone tried a straight u/g version using the prismatic omen with legs from i believe gatecrash? i KNow he's more vulnerable to removal but i feel it would open us up to a little more control, counters, and would make snapcaster more useful.
Based on my very limited experience, the red splash is vital. There are simply some matches were you are going to need Pyroclasm to stay alive.
Besides, you're turning on their removal with a creature that needs to stick on board to have any value. With Tribe Elder or Snappy, you've gotten the value once they hit the table. Why give them a target?
Based on my very limited experience, the red splash is vital. There are simply some matches were you are going to need Pyroclasm to stay alive.
This. I'm not the biggest pyroclasm guy in the world since there are some matchups where it's just a dead card in your hand, but it's so crucial to doing well against stuff like Affinity and Pod that you've gotta have some. Also Izzet Charm is super awesome.
Besides, you're forced to use a bunch of lands that produce red mana, so you might as well take advantage of having it around.
@Tyler, I will admit to being new to modern but I'm amazed that someone can actually propose a Valakut deck without the mountains. Tell me,hows that going to work? Prismatic omen smooths things out and and enables you to require less lands in play when scapeshifting, but the deck still works without it just as well. What your proposing is basically remove part of your wincon, replace with something thats going to die and just hope that your opponent doesn't have the ability or where withall to do so. Btw whats the creature anyway?
It doesn't sound feasible to me, sorry.
Ok maybe i wasnt clear... Ok... There is a creature printed recently that does the same thin as prismatic omen. You dot need mountains if all your lands are mountains unless this effect doesnt make the lands count as mountains for valukut as you play them. If im correct, you play this creature, then either ramp or scapeshift for 2 valakuts and watever lands and win since they enter simultaneously. Im just trying to avoid running 3 color if its possible to run 2 color and not be r/g valakut like in standard when it was legal.
Realmwright is actually a powered down version of Prismatic Omen. When you cast him you have to pick mountain instead of having every type (Although admittingly mana fixing aside this isn't a huge concern). The big deal with Realmwright is he's a lot easier to remove than Prismatic Omen is. One strength of Scapeshift decks is we get virtual card advantage if we don't play creatures for the opponent to kill.
Budget reasons aside, I disagree with playing either version of Scapeshift as a two color deck. With all the ramping in the deck hitting all three colors is very easy, and anecdotaly, once people know I'm on Scapeshift, they tend to save their land destruction for Valakut instead of lands that produce colored mana.
1. You don't really need a ton of fetches, certainly not as many as some other decks. They're really good at fixing your mana though. You're obviously forced to run a ton of various types of mountains, but red is the least important color to this deck. You really want to get double green and double blue mana as fast as you can most of the time and fetches will help you there. Obviously the ramp spells also help with that, but the deck usually uses a ton of shock lands and only Farseek can go get those otherwise.
2. This isn't a fast deck, and Titan is really your secondary win condition considering how easily he dies to a lot of removal. The main goal is to just stay alive until you get enough land in play to cast the winning Scapeshift. Obviously if you can lay down a Titan early you should go for it, but there are only 4 and no way to really go get it so there are a bunch of games where you won't even see him.
3. Remand is good not only for forcing through your winning Scapeshift against control, but just keeping you alive. Since you actually have to live to get your 6-8 lands in play for Scapeshift, the extra turn that Remand usually buys you is critical. Also, the cantrip is nice to help you actually find a threat since there are only 8 cards in the TitanShift deck that will actually win you a game. The extra turn that Remand gives you can often be the difference between holding on for the win or getting your lands blown up by Karn or something equally awful.
As for Farseek vs. Explore, I've backed off Explore. When it works properly, it's amazing, but I was just having too many times where all it did was draw me a card but I missed the extra land drop. I determined that I liked the certainty of the guaranteed ramp, especially since Farseek is the only card that can get shocklands. Explore kinda requires you to build your deck around it with cards like Serum Visions and Halimar Depths to manipulate your ability to draw into the extra lands you want to play.
Hey there! Welcome to modern. I've played Scapeshift for about a year now and have a decent amount of experience with Scapeshift and U/W midrange/control in modern so I'll try and answer questions as best I can.
1.) 4-6 Fetches are generally considered necessary depending on the version of scapeshift you are playing. The cryptic versions require UUU to cast cryptic, UR for izzet charms, and GG for scapeshift. Some fetches are needed to ensure you can hit these spells on time. Additionally, the Cryptic lists usually also run Flooded Grove.
Non-cryptic lists are playing Prismatic Omen. This is the biggest and best reason to play with 6+ Fetches. With an active Omen/Valakut, a fetch is 6 damage, with 3 of it being instant, meaning you can take out a pesky haste creature or interact in ways usually not available.
2.)Titan/Shift lists are about brute strength. They usually also involve Omen, but with these lists you're looking to stay alive long enough to either: a)allow them to make a mistake so that you can resolve a haymaker and win -OR- b)try and go off right before you die. This is a control/combo deck. I personally don't play with Titan, as Omen and Scapeshift are win coniditions themselves, so playing 10+ win conditions in a combo/control list will often leave you dead with pieces in hand.
3.)Remand is a jack of all trades. Because Scapeshift win's the game on the spot, often all you need is one extra turn. Whether it's delaying an Ajani, a Cranial Plating, or a Deathrite, this deck needs land drops to win and Remand is often considered a virtual time walk. It pulls double duty protecting your combo.
With the new Temple scry lands, any chance you're going to play any of those over Halimar? I also use Explore, but cultivate as well (I play with 3-4 omens and 3 Valas) and I've also been exploring manlands as an option B as I hate Leyline of Sanctity, but I started with halimar depths like yourself.
I don't think the scry lands are any good here. Halimar digs deeper and lets you set up a better explore, which is what you really want if you're playing Explore over Farseek. Plus if you're not happy with the 3 cards Halimar shows you, the deck is full of cards that let you shuffle your library so you can get rid of the junk.
Sure it fits the theme of the deck... but with little to nothing to protect it... It is essentially a 4 mana explore... IMO not that great unless we become a control shell which wins by scapeshift.
And all that risk just to run Explore? Pass.
Bant | U Tron | GW Hatebears | Death and Taxes | Scapeshift | UW Tron | UW Midrange
Legacy:WDeath and TaxesW W45-L16-D11 8 Top 8s 15th Scg Oakland
Current Kiln Fiend Count: 153 Please message me if you want to trade me or give me some.
Commission Rezombied to alter some cards, he's awesome!
Fortunate note: I played Scapeshift back when it was allowed in Extended (using Wargate as the tutor, lol), and it used Peer Through Depths back then, so now that I'm wanting to get into it... what kind of build should I look into making?
I notice that some builds use Titans and Prismatic Omen, some builds eschew the Omens or Titan and use Cryptics, some builds use Omens and Cryptics but no Titans, one I saw on mtgdecks used all 3. Looking at the latest tournament results it seems that doing any of the above is fine, but what should I keep in mind when trying to build this deck for myself? There seems to be a good deal more flexibility when building it. If that flexibility is meta dependent, I have an almost entirely aggro meta that abuses the hell out of Cavern of Souls (one guy runs Elves, another Death and Taxes, there's a few rogue decks and Kiki Pod), so I'm imaging Cryptic Command would be most used as a Turnabout or something if I would keep in maindeck.
Sig and Avatar drawn by me.
I am no fan of pimp or foils but I have every possible build of this deck full art/promo pimped. No one ever appreciates losing to such a pretty combo though.
Please post a pic! Sounds awesome.
I will at some point. I don't have the lands except for Valakut or Snapcaster foil atm, someday though.
Matchups were Pod, B/W Tokens, Soul Sisters and Jund. I'm still amazed I managed to win vs. Soul Sisters.
Besides, you're turning on their removal with a creature that needs to stick on board to have any value. With Tribe Elder or Snappy, you've gotten the value once they hit the table. Why give them a target?
This. I'm not the biggest pyroclasm guy in the world since there are some matchups where it's just a dead card in your hand, but it's so crucial to doing well against stuff like Affinity and Pod that you've gotta have some. Also Izzet Charm is super awesome.
Besides, you're forced to use a bunch of lands that produce red mana, so you might as well take advantage of having it around.
Peer Through Depths, though... Holy **** it felt almost unfair.
Ok maybe i wasnt clear... Ok... There is a creature printed recently that does the same thin as prismatic omen. You dot need mountains if all your lands are mountains unless this effect doesnt make the lands count as mountains for valukut as you play them. If im correct, you play this creature, then either ramp or scapeshift for 2 valakuts and watever lands and win since they enter simultaneously. Im just trying to avoid running 3 color if its possible to run 2 color and not be r/g valakut like in standard when it was legal.
Budget reasons aside, I disagree with playing either version of Scapeshift as a two color deck. With all the ramping in the deck hitting all three colors is very easy, and anecdotaly, once people know I'm on Scapeshift, they tend to save their land destruction for Valakut instead of lands that produce colored mana.
Currently Playing:
Modern:
Tron
Titan-Shift