Hey guys, I'm having trouble with GW Eldrazi and Taxes. I HATE t2 Thalia more than basically anything right now. and Stony Silence. What do you all generally use against that? I have O-stone, and Push, and Claim....I just don't know what I am doing wrong
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im been losing a lot lately in modo because of terrible matchups (burn, D&T, storm) and i don't see a lot of our usual midrange preys, i noticed that the games i win are mostly those i have turn 3/4 tron and if not, almost 80-90% i will lose. tweaked and tested build but i guess its more on the meta and they really know how to play against us being linear in a way.
i think we need plan B or C, or maybe an early threat.
have anybody tested goyf? was thinking of thought-knot but it still expensive to cast under blood moon and goyf can provide some time to ramp to 6-7 mana. was thinking of cutting 2 relic and 2 worldbreakers for 4 goyfs.
im been losing a lot lately in modo because of terrible matchups (burn, D&T, storm) and i don't see a lot of our usual midrange preys, i noticed that the games i win are mostly those i have turn 3/4 tron and if not, almost 80-90% i will lose. tweaked and tested build but i guess its more on the meta and they really know how to play against us being linear in a way.
i think we need plan B or C, or maybe an early threat.
have anybody tested goyf? was thinking of thought-knot but it still expensive to cast under blood moon and goyf can provide some time to ramp to 6-7 mana. was thinking of cutting 2 relic and 2 worldbreakers for 4 goyfs.
IMO Storm warrants it. If you are "just" hexproof and they storm off for a ton of goblins and you don't happen to have a sweeper it's GG.
The thing is, i am talking "too slow" in terms of "I have turn 3 tron". In these scenarios it doesn't matter if the card costs 4 or 5 mana and i feel like the one extra mana is well worth the small upside in storm. If you don't have turn 3 Tron against burn you're probably going to die anyway.
Basically the only scenario when Witchbane Orb is better is when you want to card an O-Stone in the same turn but that's kind of a nonbo and super slow with Witchbane/OoW anyway.
I've recently been losing to Titanshift 4 more times than I'd like (3 at GP Birmingham, and 1 QF of a PPTQ), so I'd like some more ideas to beat them. I had solid draws, exiled some lands but then they still have plenty of lands to Shift me. I board in Warping Wail, exile some lands but the ETB trigger of Titan combined with more lands is still enough to win.
Ulamog wins games, but no matches yet. Wurmcoil trades for Thragtusk after Reclamation Sage or Nature's Claim, of which they seem to board in enough. Judging from how those games went, Spellskite (which I cut from my list, recently) wouldn't even have saved me if it had lived. I'm on standard Gw Tron.
What to do?
-Leyline of Sanctity: Not a card I like due to its swingy nature, but hardcasting is an option for Gw so it might be feasible. Could buy some time until Ulamog takes over.
-Witchbane Orb: Same as above. Better than Leyline, against Shift. Less good against Burn.
-Crumble to Dust: Splashable on 8 sources? I've played Slaughter Games in Gr Tron years ago, so I'm not a fan of this option either.. I remember.
-Mind Slaver: Worse than an extra Ulamog, in most cases. Though it's nice to cast Shift for them, sac all their lands and inform them you were oddly enough unable to find any lands in their deck.
-Extra Ulamogs: My best idea so far.. But he's so clunky.
-Extra Warping Wails: Just run 4 and counter all their ramp, too?
Edit: -Sundering Titan: Easier to cast than Ulamog. Wins the match just as well. I like it! In what other MUs would it be good? Slightly worse than Wurmcoil against GDS. Passable against Control and Eldrazi.
Edit: -Switching to Gb Tron, and therefore adding Brutality, should help this MU tremendously of course. I'm however currently very happy with the combination of Path and Walking Ballista (yes, I run it and it's great).
I'll take any and all suggestions!
Bonus points if your idea is also good against AdNaus, against which I don't expect to continue my recent 2-0 record.
i board in 3 warping wail for ramp and scapeshift. then i have 2 needles for sakura tribe elder.
you must be mindful of your keep.. you need a turn 3-4 karn, turn 4-5 world breaker\ulamog else you lose
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MODERN
Tron variants
Eldrazi variants
Burn
Infect
Living End
Bloodwalkers
RG Ponza
In my experience without having tron on board on turn 4, tapping out for anything but lifegain is certain death. They still play enough creatures and they empty their hand fast either way.
With four Clasm effects (including two we can dig for with Ancient Stirrings), being able to sweep to minimize creature damage seems like it would mitigate the creature swarm problem. Without Tron, sure they might have the D-Rev right then, but a turn earlier makes all of the difference in the world against the combo match-ups.
With Tron, an interesting situation can happen, particularly against Burn. Say you hand has at least one each of Chromatic Sphere/Star and Nature's Claim, and that your board is currently only lands. With Orbs of Warding, there is no possible line that allows you to Claim it in response to a D-Rev at end of turn. With Witchbane Orb, you can tap Tower and one of Mine or Power Plant to drop both artifacts, then still have the remaining Tron land to pop Sphere/Star for green and hit it whenever you need. Even if the Claim isn't in your hand, if it's the top card of your library, you're set.
As a matter of fact, there are all sorts of places where this subtle difference in mana can really help you pull back or ahead on turn three. Against Burn, you could also drop WBO, Sphere/Star, and then crack for red and Pyroclasm. If you're up against TitanShift, you could drop and crack Map (or mana egg to Sylvan Scrying) to secure a second tower to guarantee Ulamog can drop on turn four if you see him. Against Ad Nauseam, you could do a variation on the first example, instead using Claim to take out their Phyrexian Unlife or Pentad Prism.
The only other card that is solid against all of those match-ups you might consider playing in GR is Thought-Knot Seer. Sure, we can never land it as quickly as anything with Eldrazi Temple, but it's still an amazing answer and threat package that curves well in this deck.
I have a question for y'all. I'm a long time 8rack player who decided to switch decks for a while. Right now I'm building a mono green tron and would like some help and suggestions.
Thanks in beforehand! (Off topic, is this a real saying? Its one in my native language so I kinda used it without thinking, lol)
1) I'm missing two cards main, what would be good here?
2) What cards could I use in my sideboard?
Hey I've been following this deck for a while.
My meta is mostly burn, aggro and some company decks. Also some jund decks as well.
I have about 90% of the cards, only can't afford karn's right now.
Do you think a version of this deck could work without Karns?
Maybe Endbringer and some extra world breaker and ugin, the spirit dragoninstead?
Opinions?
FitzRolf: I woould definitely have a second basic (preferably a Forest) at the very least somewhere in your 75. Also, Oblivion Stone is too good to not play at least three of them. Geier Reach is just cute in this deck; I'd prioritize that second basic, or slot the Ghost Quarter from your sideboard to your main deck instead. You could move your third Relic (or perhaps a singleton Grafdigger's Cage if you're seeing more Elves/Vizier) to the side.
If you're seeing a lot of Affinity, Sudden Shock isn't bad, but it's only decent there, and against Fulminator Mage (at least the first time) and Infect (which is pretty scarce anymore). I'd rather have something more versatile there, like the fourth Claim, or Seals of Primordium. Even Engineered Explosives can do solid work instead there. I see that you have four Pyroclasm main and two Kozilek's Return side...that's probably overkill on the red sweepers. Cut down to four total in your 75, and prioritize more versatile cards that can also interact early, like Explosives or Walking Ballista.
Have you tested Kozilek, TGD much? Recently I've found a lot of luck off the back of the original Kozilek, but I'll admit that's more for fun than anything. A second copy of Ulamog, TCH might be better, or even Emrakul, TPE if you find yourself up against decks you can really punish by taking their turn.
The deck is a lot of fun, and powerful. Make sure you have your lines down for uphill matches, like Burn, Storm, and Ad Nauseam. Good luck to you!
Played a few matches with the Gr version. Love the deck! What do the tron experts think which colour shoulb be played in Gx tron in the actual meta?
If it's a large tournament, or you have no idea of the meta for the LGS you're playing, GB w/Brutality Main has a slight edge - Brutality is the most flexible of the MB splash cards you can run, and it's never really dead.
But all splashes are close, with valid Pros and Cons for all of them. I'd pick the one you're more confortable with and go with it, familiarity with the list matters a lot in modern.
I suggest the red splash with Groves, it is the best manabase you can have. Especially on larger tournaments you will probably face a lot of MU's where Pyroclasm is great, and the Groves have a decent sideeffect against Death's Shadow (just always tap it for colored mana).
Towards the Shadow MU (and other blue decks with Ceremonious Rejection) I remembered a card that was played in Sideboards years ago - Autumn's Veil. Those are back in my SB right now as a 2-of, and already proved valuable. Just having a green mana left when casting a big spell is enough to get your opponent in trouble, and playing 4 Groves right now is self-explaining in the Shadow era.
Played a few matches with the Gr version. Love the deck! What do the tron experts think which colour shoulb be played in Gx tron in the actual meta?
If it's a large tournament, or you have no idea of the meta for the LGS you're playing, GB w/Brutality Main has a slight edge - Brutality is the most flexible of the MB splash cards you can run, and it's never really dead.
But all splashes are close, with valid Pros and Cons for all of them. I'd pick the one you're more confortable with and go with it, familiarity with the list matters a lot in modern.
I expect the meta to be mostly eldrazi tron, affinity, valakut, Ux control and some GDS and CoCo decks, maybe a storm could show up.
I tested some games with black and brutality was ok, rarely great, but basically never dead. When I played against elves I wished I was playing the red version, but was really happy to play the black version against blue moon so I'm still undecided on what secondary colour to settle.
I suggest the red splash with Groves, it is the best manabase you can have. Especially on larger tournaments you will probably face a lot of MU's where Pyroclasm is great, and the Groves have a decent sideeffect against Death's Shadow (just always tap it for colored mana).
Towards the Shadow MU (and other blue decks with Ceremonious Rejection) I remembered a card that was played in Sideboards years ago - Autumn's Veil. Those are back in my SB right now as a 2-of, and already proved valuable. Just having a green mana left when casting a big spell is enough to get your opponent in trouble, and playing 4 Groves right now is self-explaining in the Shadow era.
Greetings!
Gr definitely has the best mana base. The pyroclasms have a huge variance between the different MUs. I'd like to have a more versatile spell, something like earthquake but that also hits affinities flyers.
Gr definitely has the best mana base. The pyroclasms have a huge variance between the different MUs. I'd like to have a more versatile spell, something like earthquake but that also hits affinities flyers.
If you want more versatility MB with Red, you should consider running Lightning Bolt MB and moving the sweepers to the SB. The list that made Top 8 on the latest SCG Classic was running a setup like this.
Hey I've been following this deck for a while.
My meta is mostly burn, aggro and some company decks. Also some jund decks as well.
I have about 90% of the cards, only can't afford karn's right now.
Do you think a version of this deck could work without Karns?
Maybe Endbringer and some extra world breaker and ugin, the spirit dragoninstead?
Opinions?
Hey I've been following this deck for a while.
My meta is mostly burn, aggro and some company decks. Also some jund decks as well.
I have about 90% of the cards, only can't afford karn's right now.
Do you think a version of this deck could work without Karns?
Maybe Endbringer and some extra world breaker and ugin, the spirit dragoninstead?
Opinions?
Thanks!
Anyone?
I couldn't imagine playing Tron without Karn daddy as it's often the best card in the deck with Tron online. But if I had to then I agree that World Breaker would get at least 1-2 of Karn's slots. Depending on meta the other's I might fill with TKS if combo-heavy, and with walking ballista otherwise. Endbringer is a good card but I think I'd prefer a card that affects the board or the opponent's plan (Karn does both).
Hey I've been following this deck for a while.
My meta is mostly burn, aggro and some company decks. Also some jund decks as well.
I have about 90% of the cards, only can't afford karn's right now.
Do you think a version of this deck could work without Karns?
Maybe Endbringer and some extra world breaker and ugin, the spirit dragoninstead?
Opinions?
Thanks!
Anyone?
No Karn is kind of brutal. The huge benefit is that at exactly 7 colorless mana he is your turn 3 go to play. If you are behind he can stabilize the board and if you are at parity or ahead he can close the game.
That being said what you are looking for in a replacement is a way to stabilize on t3 that is hard to interact with. Ugin the Spirit dragon can take up one or two karn slots as his minus will wipe up the board in a jiffy. The other two I would probably run the 4th wurmcoil and maybe another World Breaker.
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Personally, I think you'd be better off with something like this http://www.tcdecks.net/deck.php?id=24513&iddeck=192358
Retired
Legacy:
GRUB Lands
Modern:
U Tron
RG Tron
RG Ponza
im not a fan of GB, I rather play GW. I switch GR or GW depending on the meta (aggro vs controllish/bigger threats).
so yeah as mentioned, either GOYF or TKS, but TKS still needs 4 mana and under blood moon sucks.
Tron variants
Eldrazi variants
Burn
Infect
Living End
Bloodwalkers
RG Ponza
LEGACY
Turbo Depths
Big Eldrazi
The thing is, i am talking "too slow" in terms of "I have turn 3 tron". In these scenarios it doesn't matter if the card costs 4 or 5 mana and i feel like the one extra mana is well worth the small upside in storm. If you don't have turn 3 Tron against burn you're probably going to die anyway.
Basically the only scenario when Witchbane Orb is better is when you want to card an O-Stone in the same turn but that's kind of a nonbo and super slow with Witchbane/OoW anyway.
BRGJundGRB
GCTronCG
WBRMardu PyromancerRBW
Legacy:
GElvesG
i board in 3 warping wail for ramp and scapeshift. then i have 2 needles for sakura tribe elder.
you must be mindful of your keep.. you need a turn 3-4 karn, turn 4-5 world breaker\ulamog else you lose
Tron variants
Eldrazi variants
Burn
Infect
Living End
Bloodwalkers
RG Ponza
LEGACY
Turbo Depths
Big Eldrazi
BRGJundGRB
GCTronCG
WBRMardu PyromancerRBW
Legacy:
GElvesG
With Tron, an interesting situation can happen, particularly against Burn. Say you hand has at least one each of Chromatic Sphere/Star and Nature's Claim, and that your board is currently only lands. With Orbs of Warding, there is no possible line that allows you to Claim it in response to a D-Rev at end of turn. With Witchbane Orb, you can tap Tower and one of Mine or Power Plant to drop both artifacts, then still have the remaining Tron land to pop Sphere/Star for green and hit it whenever you need. Even if the Claim isn't in your hand, if it's the top card of your library, you're set.
As a matter of fact, there are all sorts of places where this subtle difference in mana can really help you pull back or ahead on turn three. Against Burn, you could also drop WBO, Sphere/Star, and then crack for red and Pyroclasm. If you're up against TitanShift, you could drop and crack Map (or mana egg to Sylvan Scrying) to secure a second tower to guarantee Ulamog can drop on turn four if you see him. Against Ad Nauseam, you could do a variation on the first example, instead using Claim to take out their Phyrexian Unlife or Pentad Prism.
The only other card that is solid against all of those match-ups you might consider playing in GR is Thought-Knot Seer. Sure, we can never land it as quickly as anything with Eldrazi Temple, but it's still an amazing answer and threat package that curves well in this deck.
Thanks in beforehand! (Off topic, is this a real saying? Its one in my native language so I kinda used it without thinking, lol)
1) I'm missing two cards main, what would be good here?
2) What cards could I use in my sideboard?
2 Ugin, the Spirit Dragon
3 Wurmcoil Engine
2 World Breaker
2 Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger
3 Oblivion Stone
4 Chromatic Star
4 Chromatic Sphere
4 Expedition Map
4 Ancient Stirrings
4 Sylvan Scrying
4 Urza's Mine
4 Urza's Tower
1 Sea Gate Wreckage
1 Sanctum of Ugin
1 Ghost Quarter
4 forest
Not much love for beast within but I guess the CMC is high and it doesn't pair so well with Karn
Retired
Legacy:
GRUB Lands
Modern:
U Tron
RG Tron
RG Ponza
My meta is mostly burn, aggro and some company decks. Also some jund decks as well.
I have about 90% of the cards, only can't afford karn's right now.
Do you think a version of this deck could work without Karns?
Maybe Endbringer and some extra world breaker and ugin, the spirit dragoninstead?
Opinions?
Thanks!
If you're seeing a lot of Affinity, Sudden Shock isn't bad, but it's only decent there, and against Fulminator Mage (at least the first time) and Infect (which is pretty scarce anymore). I'd rather have something more versatile there, like the fourth Claim, or Seals of Primordium. Even Engineered Explosives can do solid work instead there. I see that you have four Pyroclasm main and two Kozilek's Return side...that's probably overkill on the red sweepers. Cut down to four total in your 75, and prioritize more versatile cards that can also interact early, like Explosives or Walking Ballista.
Have you tested Kozilek, TGD much? Recently I've found a lot of luck off the back of the original Kozilek, but I'll admit that's more for fun than anything. A second copy of Ulamog, TCH might be better, or even Emrakul, TPE if you find yourself up against decks you can really punish by taking their turn.
The deck is a lot of fun, and powerful. Make sure you have your lines down for uphill matches, like Burn, Storm, and Ad Nauseam. Good luck to you!
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/other-formats/mtgo-pauper/developing/647850-primer-angler-delver
Modern: Sultai Death's Shadow
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/modern/deck-creation-modern/773885-sultai-deaths-shadow-bug-aggro]
Legacy: Snake&Show
http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?27217-Deck-Sneak-and-Show
Discuss my Cube @ MTGsalvation:
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=207309
If it's a large tournament, or you have no idea of the meta for the LGS you're playing, GB w/Brutality Main has a slight edge - Brutality is the most flexible of the MB splash cards you can run, and it's never really dead.
But all splashes are close, with valid Pros and Cons for all of them. I'd pick the one you're more confortable with and go with it, familiarity with the list matters a lot in modern.
Towards the Shadow MU (and other blue decks with Ceremonious Rejection) I remembered a card that was played in Sideboards years ago - Autumn's Veil. Those are back in my SB right now as a 2-of, and already proved valuable. Just having a green mana left when casting a big spell is enough to get your opponent in trouble, and playing 4 Groves right now is self-explaining in the Shadow era.
Greetings!
I expect the meta to be mostly eldrazi tron, affinity, valakut, Ux control and some GDS and CoCo decks, maybe a storm could show up.
I tested some games with black and brutality was ok, rarely great, but basically never dead. When I played against elves I wished I was playing the red version, but was really happy to play the black version against blue moon
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/other-formats/mtgo-pauper/developing/647850-primer-angler-delver
Modern: Sultai Death's Shadow
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/modern/deck-creation-modern/773885-sultai-deaths-shadow-bug-aggro]
Legacy: Snake&Show
http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?27217-Deck-Sneak-and-Show
Discuss my Cube @ MTGsalvation:
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=207309
Gr definitely has the best mana base. The pyroclasms have a huge variance between the different MUs. I'd like to have a more versatile spell, something like earthquake but that also hits affinities flyers.
EDIT: What a shame Subterranean Tremors isn't modern legal...
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/other-formats/mtgo-pauper/developing/647850-primer-angler-delver
Modern: Sultai Death's Shadow
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/modern/deck-creation-modern/773885-sultai-deaths-shadow-bug-aggro]
Legacy: Snake&Show
http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?27217-Deck-Sneak-and-Show
Discuss my Cube @ MTGsalvation:
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=207309
If you want more versatility MB with Red, you should consider running Lightning Bolt MB and moving the sweepers to the SB. The list that made Top 8 on the latest SCG Classic was running a setup like this.
http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=116402
If you want a "bigger" sweeper you can also consider Firespout, which hits /3 creatures.
Anyone?
I couldn't imagine playing Tron without Karn daddy as it's often the best card in the deck with Tron online. But if I had to then I agree that World Breaker would get at least 1-2 of Karn's slots. Depending on meta the other's I might fill with TKS if combo-heavy, and with walking ballista otherwise. Endbringer is a good card but I think I'd prefer a card that affects the board or the opponent's plan (Karn does both).
No Karn is kind of brutal. The huge benefit is that at exactly 7 colorless mana he is your turn 3 go to play. If you are behind he can stabilize the board and if you are at parity or ahead he can close the game.
That being said what you are looking for in a replacement is a way to stabilize on t3 that is hard to interact with. Ugin the Spirit dragon can take up one or two karn slots as his minus will wipe up the board in a jiffy. The other two I would probably run the 4th wurmcoil and maybe another World Breaker.