Hey Khainn, let us know how the FNM goes. I've seen some lists with Grim Lavamancer in them, and I am curious how well they perform. I plan on attending a PPTQ on Saturday and the lava man is one of the cards I've been considering.
It'll be the first time I run him main, but it seems just about every deck has some targets for him. Even BG/x does now with Jund more popular and Dark Confidant run in Jund, but not in Junk.
In case your wondering, I have lots of slow grind cards in the board because of match ups like Junk and Jund becoming popular. The metagame is shifting to midrange grind battles and I want to be prepared for it. Let me know which (2) of these (3) cards I should run in my sideboard. Jace, Architect of Thought, Sphinx's Revelation, or Keranos, God of Storms. Or, if you have a better midrange grind card in mind, also let me know. I might make room for 3 of these types of cards but I'm not sure yet.
Given those options I'd run Jace and Sphinx's Revelation. I'm not a fan of Keranos against BGx since he can rarely kill any creatures and is often just Bolting the opponent which is pretty slow. However, I would play Gideon Jura and/or Elspeth Knight-Errant over those. Those cards are insane against BGx, especially Jund. Gideon can just sit there removing creatures and Elspeth can't be profitably dealt with by BGx except by Maelstrom Pulse, Lingering Souls tokens, or Olivia Voldaren. With your deck I would probably lean towards Elspeth since it is sweet with Geist of Saint Traft and Gideon gets a lot better with hard counterspells or discard backing him up so he doesn't die to Path or Terminate when you attack with him.
Thanks for the input. I actually forgot about Gideon, but I do agree he is in a great spot right now. I wouldn't hate 1 Elspeth main board actually. She's only "bad" against infect and affinity really, but as a one-of I don't think it matters as bad. What card do you suggest removing from my sideboard for Gideon?
This is the deck I'm running, I took the basic Geist build and instead of Thundermaw and Batterskull I put in Dragonlord Ojutai and Keranos. Ojutai I put in because its one of my favourite cards and I feel like it can be used as a strong win con if you keep hitting and can protect it, why I also added a School at Water's Edge. Debating adding in some Cryptic Commands to help protect Ojutai. Minamo also is nice for the Legendary Creatures we have that can help us out if we need to sack one as a blocker. If its late enough and we have Shinka we can untap and give first strike to kill the threat coming at as. Is the deck perfect, probably not but its what I want to run and what I'm having fun with, at least in testing with my GF.
Okay so my lost that I played for FNM did not do so well. I 0-2 dropped, my matchups were Merfolk and Elves. I felt like I should have won both matches, and didn't make many bad decisions, except a mulligan that I didnt take against Merfolk. Grim Lavancer, the card in testing, underperformed. Even though I was vs2 matchups that Grim Lavamancer shines in, my graveyard only enough cards for 1 MAYBE 2 activations before I had to chunp or trade with an elf. That being said, It is a 2 for one against aggro decks, sometimes a 3 for 1, but makes your snapcaster mages 2/1 flash creatures with no ability. If you need a 2 for one, I suggest Electrolyze, or Forked Bolt, or Cryptic Command even. Those cards are actually good with Snapcaster, and better against the whole field than Grim. In conclusion, I don't think me going 0-2 meams Geist is not viable, It is just a matter of varience. The games where I had reasonable 6-7 Card hands I crushed Merlfolk and Elves, but I mulled to 5 twice and kept a bad 6 one game as well.
One problem I had against these fast aggro decks is that once I 1 for 1d a thousand times vs all their creatures, sometimes UWR can kind of fizzle out. We need more 2 for 1s. Thats why I think black is a great splash because Tasigur Lingering Souls, and Kolahhans Command are all great 2 for 1s
The UWRb list I have been toying with. Looks like a lot of fun, and very good. Its weaknesses are Blood Moon, Fulminater Mage, and Molten Rain. I suppose Burn is not a favorable matchup with this mana-base, but we could make it a good matchup after board if expecting to play against it a lot. Also, sometimes Turn 3 Geist and a helix or 2 is all it takes to beat burn Game 1. Leave comments/suggestions please.
No representation in the SCG open or invitational top 32s. What does it take for this archetype to get a foothold back in the meta? Do changes need to be made that strengthen key matchups but weaken others?
It's kind of depressing that, now I finally have UWr complete after two years of slowly building it, it isn't good anymore. Meanwhile the merfolk thread, the deck I've been playing for those two years is celebrating because of multiple placements
However I am looking forward for Origins, with Prowess and scry now being evergreen and in UR, I expect to see some good tempo creatures soon.
It's kind of depressing that, now I finally have UWr complete after two years of slowly building it, it isn't good anymore. Meanwhile the merfolk thread, the deck I've been playing for those two years is celebrating because of multiple placements
However I am looking forward for Origins, with Prowess and scry now being evergreen and in UR, I expect to see some good tempo creatures soon.
The deck might not be tier 1, but "isn't good" implies bad, which it certainly is not.
The deck may not be on a Tier one list, but who cares?! Do you enjoy the deck? Then play it the ***** out of it. Learn to tweak/tune the list and maximize your play as much as possible and you will win games. My MW% on MTGO right now with different variations of Jeskai Geist is 60%!
It's easy to get caught in the trap of feeling like you've committed to a bad deck because you don't see anyone else playing it. You go to an event not fully prepared, don't do well, feel defeated and say "damn, this deck just isn't good anymore." And without realizing it you've sabotaged yourself. More importantly you've sabotaged your ability to enjoy the game, and enjoy a deck that you took the time to build.
Your skill, practice, and mental state are going to matter much more than whatever tier the deck you're playing falls into.
On paper, it doesn't look great. They can have some nutty draws that leave us feeling fairly helpless. However, I feel like this matchup is one of the best examples of us being a "tempo" deck. Remand and Mana Leak are huge in the early game, and an early Geist/Clique is usually enough of a clock with counter back-up to tempo them out game one. Post-board, things get a little better with Counterflux, Dispel and Wear/Tear.
Also, this is where I really think maindeck Cryptic Command shines. A maindeckable counterspell is already decent, but the fact that sometimes you can interfere with their Pact plays by bouncing their Karoo lands can be a huge tempo swing or even just win the game outright by making them unable to pay.
As to GreatNate's point, I'm with him all the way. I spent a long time playing other decks looking for a deck to commit to in Modern and I really like UWR Geist. Even though we're not shredding the standings, I don't think it's for lack of tools or powerful cards. This deck is at its best when it evolves with the meta, and we have to evolve as players alongside our deck.
On paper, it doesn't look great. They can have some nutty draws that leave us feeling fairly helpless. However, I feel like this matchup is one of the best examples of us being a "tempo" deck. Remand and Mana Leak are huge in the early game, and an early Geist/Clique is usually enough of a clock with counter back-up to tempo them out game one. Post-board, things get a little better with Counterflux, Dispel and Wear/Tear.
Also, this is where I really think maindeck Cryptic Command shines. A maindeckable counterspell is already decent, but the fact that sometimes you can interfere with their Pact plays by bouncing their Karoo lands can be a huge tempo swing or even just win the game outright by making them unable to pay.
As to GreatNate's point, I'm with him all the way. I spent a long time playing other decks looking for a deck to commit to in Modern and I really like UWR Geist. Even though we're not shredding the standings, I don't think it's for lack of tools or powerful cards. This deck is at its best when it evolves with the meta, and we have to evolve as players alongside our deck.
I'm still on the no cryptics version, but I've been tinkering with some of the older style hybrids builds. What is your list?
I 110% agree with GreatNate. Bearscape, the deck is still competitive and a lot of fun. I played two PPTQs this weekend and made it to the semifinals of one and the quarterfinals of the other. They were each 40-50 people. I could have probably played some games better in the rounds I lost. I've improved my results after playing with this deck more and more. In Modern, the thing to remember is that there is no real "best" deck. Even Abzan, which was at the top for quite some time, is starting to decrease in popularity. UWr midrange also has (in my opinion) a good matchup against Twin decks, which are very popular right now. Tweaking the deck to adjust to the local meta is going to help put up good results. At what levels are you playing? Unless you want to be highly competitive at the pro tour level or put up consistent GP top 8's, this deck is totally worth playing.
I'll post a decklist and some brief notes on my match ups when I get a chance... GreatNate I really want to thank you--I learned a lot from your videos and various deck lists that helped me get to this point.
The list I used for the two PPTQs I've attended is below. What are people doing to deal with Collected Company? I had a lot of trouble dealing with Collected Company decks (0-2 against them), and I am wondering how to change the main and sideboard. I'm considering a second Vendilion Clique main and maybe a second Anger of the Gods sideboard (to deal with Finks/Voice better). This is a rough matchup. I'm considering dropping the Forked Bolt for the second clique. That does make the matchup against Burn/Affinity worse, though. I'm thinking of taking out the Supreme Verdict for the second Anger of the Gods sideboard. That is worse against some other creature-heavy decks with X/4+'s, like Merfolk once it gets rolling. Also, Merfolk was pretty tough for me (0-1)--once they get the Aether Vials going, swarming the board with Merfolk lords, it gets rough.
If anyone's interested in more details, I can pass along more info on my matchups.
I think the counterspell suite is great. Spell Snare hits hugely relevant targets in almost all matchups, and the extra hard counters (Mana Leak) are useful in fighting off Collected Company and aggro decks. (We're not going to out-tempo Collected Company with Remands if we can't get our Geists through.)
Potential cuts:
Thundermaw Hellkite--Lingering Souls isn't seeing as much play as a month ago
Forked Bolt--same reasoning--also tends to go dead late and in certain matchups such as Twin/Zoo with X/3+'s/Collected Company with Finks/Voice
Potential additions:
Vendilion Clique--does well against everything except Burn and Lingering Souls decks. It seems like Lingering Souls are on the decline.
Elspeth Knight Errant, Ajani Vengeant, Keranos, or Gideon--I can't figure out what to replace Thundermaw with. I end up boarding out T-Maw in almost all of my matchups, and something else would be useful. I have used Keranos in the past, but he can be really slow. I'd really only like to replace T-Maw, not Batterskull. I still like Batterskull against any deck not playing Kolaghan's Command (still a lot of the meta).
Timely Reinforcements--this might be a replacement for Kor Firewalkers. They could be more broadly useful, like against Affinity, Zoo, Merfolk, and Collected Company decks.
Graveyard hate? Could be useful against Collected Company decks running Eternal Witness?
I'd also prefer not to add Cryptic Commands. They feel a little slow, but maybe other people haven't had the same experience? GuardianJohn, have they been working out for you?
If I were tuning to beat Company, I'd start by addressing my mainboard soft counters. Controlling the creatures they cast isn't an issue with our removal suite. Where things fall apart is when they resolve Company. I'd be swapping Snare for Pierce and upping my Leak count. Insofar, I'd be holding those to disrupt their Company's and Chords.
Sideboard, a couple Anger of the Gods is good, as it's a beating for them.
Forked Bolt is nice to take care of their army of 0/1s. As is Electrolyze, though a bit late.
Ghost Quarters and Tectonic Edges are good to deal with Gavony.
If I were tuning to beat Company, I'd start by addressing my mainboard soft counters. Controlling the creatures they cast isn't an issue with our removal suite. Where things fall apart is when they resolve Company. I'd be swapping Snare for Pierce and upping my Leak count. Insofar, I'd be holding those to disrupt their Company's and Chords.
Sideboard, a couple Anger of the Gods is good, as it's a beating for them.
Forked Bolt is nice to take care of their army of 0/1s. As is Electrolyze, though a bit late.
Ghost Quarters and Tectonic Edges are good to deal with Gavony.
I wouldn't run pierce. Dispel is a lot better. Also, if you run Staticaster, I'd rather run Pyroclasms, so that's a consideration. I do like more Leaks in general though.
What about Deprive? A lot of Grixis and UR Delver decks are starting to play that card. Our land count is probably high enough and we usually don't need it until a little later in the game.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
It'll be the first time I run him main, but it seems just about every deck has some targets for him. Even BG/x does now with Jund more popular and Dark Confidant run in Jund, but not in Junk.
Not sure. Maybe the Jace or Revelation (or both)?
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
2x Arid Mesa
4x Celestial Colonnade
4x Flooded Strand
1x Ghost Quarter
1x Hallowed Fountain
2x Island
1x Minamo, School at Water's Edge
1x Mountain
1x Plains
1x Sacred Foundry
2x Scalding Tarn
1x Shinka, the Bloodsoaked Keep
2x Steam Vents
2x Sulfur Falls
1x Dragonlord Ojutai
4x Geist of Saint Traft
1x Keranos, God of Storms
4x Restoration Angel
4x Snapcaster Mage
2x Vendilion Clique
Instant (18)
2x Electrolyze
4x Lightning Bolt
4x Lightning Helix
4x Path to Exile
4x Remand
Sorcery (1)
1x Forked Bolt
1x Celestial Purge
2x Counterflux
2x Engineered Explosives
3x Kor Firewalker
1x Negate
2x Rest in Peace
2x Valorous Stance
2x Wear / Tear
RGTron
WRBurn (updating)
UMerfolk (Testing and Finishing)
UWR Jeskai Midrange (Planning stages)
Congrats on a good result. Where was this? Did the Kitchen finks work in this deck? Can you give a resumé of the match against junk you won.
UWRUWR Delver/Lynx TempoUWR-------UWRUWR Midrange GeistUWR-------UWRUWR Nahiri ControlUWR-------UWRUWR SaheeliUWR
BGRJund / Jund ShadowBGR-------BGWAbzan / Abzan ShadowBGW
Commander (Leviathan/MTGO): UWGeist of Saint TraftUW
4 Scalding Tarn
3 Flooded Strand
2 Polluted Delta
1 Arid Mesa
2 Hallowed Fountain
1 Steam Vents
1 Sacred Foundry
1 Blood Crypt
1 Godless Shrine
2 Island
1 Mountain
1 Plains
2 Ghost Quarter
4 Celestial Colonnade
4 Snapcaster Mage
4 Geist of Saint Traft
3 Restoration Angel
2 Tasigur, the Golden Fang
Spells
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Lightning Helix
4 Path to Exile
4 Remand
3 Lingering Souls
2 Kolaghan's Command
1 Wear / Tear
1 Spellskite
1 Celestial Purge
1 Kor Firewalker
1 Crackling Doom
1 Jace, Architect of Thought
1 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
1 Gideon Jura
1 Supreme Verdict
1 Wrath of God
1 Negate
1 Dispel
1 Counterflux
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Relic of Progenitus
http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/deckshow.php?&t[C1]=28&start_date=6/6/2015&end_date=06/07/2015&start=1&finish=32&event_ID=47&city=Columbus&state=OH&limit=59
http://www.starcitygames.com/events/coverage/71_or_better_modern_decklists.html
No representation in the SCG open or invitational top 32s. What does it take for this archetype to get a foothold back in the meta? Do changes need to be made that strengthen key matchups but weaken others?
UWRUWR Delver/Lynx TempoUWR-------UWRUWR Midrange GeistUWR-------UWRUWR Nahiri ControlUWR-------UWRUWR SaheeliUWR
BGRJund / Jund ShadowBGR-------BGWAbzan / Abzan ShadowBGW
Commander (Leviathan/MTGO): UWGeist of Saint TraftUW
However I am looking forward for Origins, with Prowess and scry now being evergreen and in UR, I expect to see some good tempo creatures soon.
The deck might not be tier 1, but "isn't good" implies bad, which it certainly is not.
The deck may not be on a Tier one list, but who cares?! Do you enjoy the deck? Then play it the ***** out of it. Learn to tweak/tune the list and maximize your play as much as possible and you will win games. My MW% on MTGO right now with different variations of Jeskai Geist is 60%!
It's easy to get caught in the trap of feeling like you've committed to a bad deck because you don't see anyone else playing it. You go to an event not fully prepared, don't do well, feel defeated and say "damn, this deck just isn't good anymore." And without realizing it you've sabotaged yourself. More importantly you've sabotaged your ability to enjoy the game, and enjoy a deck that you took the time to build.
Your skill, practice, and mental state are going to matter much more than whatever tier the deck you're playing falls into.
Also, this is where I really think maindeck Cryptic Command shines. A maindeckable counterspell is already decent, but the fact that sometimes you can interfere with their Pact plays by bouncing their Karoo lands can be a huge tempo swing or even just win the game outright by making them unable to pay.
As to GreatNate's point, I'm with him all the way. I spent a long time playing other decks looking for a deck to commit to in Modern and I really like UWR Geist. Even though we're not shredding the standings, I don't think it's for lack of tools or powerful cards. This deck is at its best when it evolves with the meta, and we have to evolve as players alongside our deck.
I'm still on the no cryptics version, but I've been tinkering with some of the older style hybrids builds. What is your list?
I'll post a decklist and some brief notes on my match ups when I get a chance... GreatNate I really want to thank you--I learned a lot from your videos and various deck lists that helped me get to this point.
4 Snapcaster Mage
4 Geist of Saint Traft
2 Vendilion Clique
2 Restoration Angel
Spells
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Electrolyze
4 Path to Exile
4 Lightning Helix
4 Mana Leak
2 Remand
1 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
2 Cryptic Command
4 Celestial Colonnade
4 Scalding Tarn
4 Flooded Strand
1 Hallowed Fountain
2 Steam Vents
2 Ghost Quarter
2 Island
1 Plains
2 Sulfur Falls
1 Sacred Foundry
1 Eiganjo Castle
1 Mountain
2 Counterflux
1 Dispel
2 Kor Firewalker
1 Spellskite
1 Celestial Purge
2 Wear // Tear
2 Engineered Explosives
2 Rest in Peace
1 Stormbreath Dragon
1 Negate
If anyone's interested in more details, I can pass along more info on my matchups.
3x Scalding Tarn
2x Arid Mesa
4x Celestial Colonnade
2x Tectonic Edge
1x Eiganjo Castle
2x Sulfur Falls
2x Steam Vents
1x Hallowed Fountain
1x Sacred Foundry
2x Island
1x Plains
1x Mountain
4x Geist of Saint Traft
1x Vendilion Clique
3x Restoration Angel
1x Thundermaw Hellkite
1x Forked Bolt
4x Lightning Bolt
4x Path to Exile
4x Lightning Helix
2x Electrolyze
2x Spell Snare
2x Mana Leak
3x Remand
2x Engineered Explosives
1x Anger of the Gods
1x Supreme Verdict
1x Stony Silence
1x Negate
2x Counterflux
2x Wear // Tear
1x Celestial Purge
1x Sower of Temptation
2x Kor Firewalker
1x Batterskull
I think the counterspell suite is great. Spell Snare hits hugely relevant targets in almost all matchups, and the extra hard counters (Mana Leak) are useful in fighting off Collected Company and aggro decks. (We're not going to out-tempo Collected Company with Remands if we can't get our Geists through.)
Potential cuts:
Thundermaw Hellkite--Lingering Souls isn't seeing as much play as a month ago
Forked Bolt--same reasoning--also tends to go dead late and in certain matchups such as Twin/Zoo with X/3+'s/Collected Company with Finks/Voice
Potential additions:
Vendilion Clique--does well against everything except Burn and Lingering Souls decks. It seems like Lingering Souls are on the decline.
Elspeth Knight Errant, Ajani Vengeant, Keranos, or Gideon--I can't figure out what to replace Thundermaw with. I end up boarding out T-Maw in almost all of my matchups, and something else would be useful. I have used Keranos in the past, but he can be really slow. I'd really only like to replace T-Maw, not Batterskull. I still like Batterskull against any deck not playing Kolaghan's Command (still a lot of the meta).
Timely Reinforcements--this might be a replacement for Kor Firewalkers. They could be more broadly useful, like against Affinity, Zoo, Merfolk, and Collected Company decks.
Graveyard hate? Could be useful against Collected Company decks running Eternal Witness?
I'd also prefer not to add Cryptic Commands. They feel a little slow, but maybe other people haven't had the same experience? GuardianJohn, have they been working out for you?
Thoughts?
Sideboard, a couple Anger of the Gods is good, as it's a beating for them.
Forked Bolt is nice to take care of their army of 0/1s. As is Electrolyze, though a bit late.
Ghost Quarters and Tectonic Edges are good to deal with Gavony.
Modern: R Skred -- WBG Melira Co -- URW Nahiri Control
Legacy: R Mono Red Burn -- UWB Stoneblade
Commander: R Krenko, Mob Boss -- WUBRG Scion of the Ur-Dragon -- WUBRG Maze’s End
Other: R No Rares Red (Standard) -- URC Izzet Tron (Pauper)
I wouldn't run pierce. Dispel is a lot better. Also, if you run Staticaster, I'd rather run Pyroclasms, so that's a consideration. I do like more Leaks in general though.