Hey guys, we just posted an article on our site inspired by this deck. While it's not exactly a deck tech, I thought you all might find it a fun read. It's basically a fictional lore based short story involving the strategy of Modern Junk. Hope you guys like it!
Hey guys, we just posted an article on our site inspired by this deck. While it's not exactly a deck tech, I thought you all might find it a fun read. It's basically a fictional lore based short story involving the strategy of Modern Junk. Hope you guys like it!
Oh yeah sorry about that, the upload date was set to the wrong day so I changed it, and doing so must have changed the link as well. Thanks for updating it!
I see these decks playing 3 dark confidant and 3 thoughtseize and my question is... how are they beating burn/zoo? I am seeing no kitchen finks in recent sideboards. In my opinion you need at least 3, and they're not bad in the mirror either. I'm guessing people are boarding in gideon for jund/junk/grixis instead of finks. And speaking of gideon, I would rather have thrun in it's place as it seems great in the mirror and against control. Or maybe I am underestimating gideon. What are people doing for burn/zoo/death shadow aggro? I'm gonna keep sideboarding finks for now
I got rid of Siege Rhino and the clunkier threats and stuck with a more efficient creature suite. I also upped the disruption package and added more removal but I may change the split between Inquisition and Thoughtseize in order to prevent too much loss of life. I am really considering dropping Gavony Township all together but I'll have to think on it for a while. I would like to add Noble Hierarch but I don't have them yet and I plan on waiting a few weeks until I get my playset.
24 lands, 2 of which are colorless. I figured I could drop to 22 if I had Noble Hierarch's but since I don't I'm working with what I have. I haven't had too many issues so far but I'm going to experiment with things and report back.
What are peoples thoughts on Bitterblossom in the current meta? Seems like a possible main deckable card with Abrupt Decay numbers going down and Fatal Push going up.
I see these decks playing 3 dark confidant and 3 thoughtseize and my question is... how are they beating burn/zoo?
Simply said: side them out after G1. Jund plays 4 Bob and up to 3 TS for a long time and hasn't had major problems. If you tweak your list accordingly, you can certainly include Bob in Junk.
On a more general note, another Noble list made a good finish. I think anyone who still believes Nobles are not the way to go in Junk right now makes a serious mistake. Have been on it since the unbannings, and people should really focus on those noble lists again. It allows us to potentially run Bobs, and cut down on Flayers if one wishes so. I personally am leaning towards a creature base like this:
That way you have full access to 24 non creature spells and have no need in running stuff like Nihil Spellbomb to support Flayers. On the other hand though, Nihil Spellbomb doesn't seem that bad right now given all that Death Shadow going around also.
Its just that normal grindier Junk lists will probably win against any Jund list, but thats about it. You still don't trump any Eldrazi deck and you are even slower against any big mana deck. Even if such a list is full of value, and even if you are the topdeck god, Big Mana and Eldrazi wreck you all day long. Going under the opponent is the best strategy in this environment. And due to Lingering Souls, I think you are still very well able to win against Jund. Therefore I can't find a good reason to not run Nobles.
Its the same with Death Shadow. In a nutshell Death Shadow Jund is just a Jund list with a much better ability to close the games down. It just goes under every Eldrazi and Big Mana deck and wins before they take over. Thats the reason why its so good right now. Its disruption combined with a fast clock. If you think about it, thats what we always say about any big mana matchup. We hope to disrupt them early and drop a Goyf turn 2 to start the clock. Its just the best thing available to us. Junk should follow that route and run Nobles for a better ability to go under the opponent. Those Noble list still are also able to grind, if necessary, its not that this turns the deck into a glass canon aggro deck, far from it.
I never found a turn 2 Souls a big deal, but--I mean, if all these lists are doing it and it's having results, what can I say.
Junk's doing better than Jund in this meta, Jund was nowhere to be seen in the Open
I think any GBx deck is not best positioned right now, but when it comes down to playing Junk anyway, I would go with this approach. Its the version which fits the meta best.
Uh, no, you're wrong, Death's Shadow is well positioned, I can race Titanshift decks and other combo decks
Tron can still be dicey, but it's definitely no longer the lopsided, dreaded matchup it was
You have most of the pieces already from Jund, Flyer, play the deck before making claims like that
Can you be any more abrasive? You're right Death Shadow is the way to go as its the goyf deck with the fastest clock but the really Death Shadow deck qualifies as much as a traditional BG/x deck as Eldrazi Tron qualifies as a G/x Tron deck, pretty sure Delver wasn't counting the new DS JUND lists in the ABZAN thread when he made that statement.
Uh, no, you're wrong, Death's Shadow is well positioned, I can race Titanshift decks and other combo decks
Tron can still be dicey, but it's definitely no longer the lopsided, dreaded matchup it was
You have most of the pieces already from Jund, Flyer, play the deck before making claims like that
Can you be any more abrasive? You're right Death Shadow is the way to go as its the goyf deck with the fastest clock but the really Death Shadow deck qualifies as much as a traditional BG/x deck as Eldrazi Tron qualifies as a G/x Tron deck, pretty sure Delver wasn't counting the new DS JUND lists in the ABZAN thread when he made that statement.
He said all GBx decks
I like Delver, and look how much work he put into the Jund thread, it doesn't mean I wouldn't call him out (and he's rightfully called me out on things).
Abzan reached second place this weekend though, and nearly took first to a really good matchup, and it was in the top 8 in Brisbane, GBx is in an alright place. This weekend was probably the worst I've seen Jund do in a while
Uh, no, you're wrong, Death's Shadow is well positioned, I can race Titanshift decks and other combo decks
Tron can still be dicey, but it's definitely no longer the lopsided, dreaded matchup it was
You have most of the pieces already from Jund, Flyer, play the deck before making claims like that
Yeah just like was stated, when I talked about GBx decks, I didn't mean death shadow. I think from my previous statement it should be clear that I don't think Death Shadow is bad. I just think this deck counts as own archetype of death shadow rather than a version of GBx deck (although colourwise for sure).
Its true Death Shadow is great now, can't argue with that (And also didn't say otherwise). My point was also not to say which deck is the best in this meta right now. I was talking Junk and Jund and their positioning and I think that both are not the best choices right now, given the better alternatives. Both are fine for sure, as we can see from the great Junk finish lately, but overall not the best still.
If I were to play Junk, and Junk only, I would go with Nobles. Thats what I said. Nothing more and nothing less
The thing about it is, magic is very much a copycat league like the NFL is. The Wildcat offense was a fad and everyone ran it. Same thing here where LSV runs Hiearch + Flayer. The pros do it so thats the "correct" build. This is where I disagree. Not to say Flayers and Hierarchs are bad. Like I said earlier, it will come down to personal preference and to say you should ONLY be running hierarchs and flayers is wrong. I still like Tasigur A LOT and I feel like if I had to choose between Tasigur + Gavony township + Gq or Flayers + Hierarchs, I would pick the former. Tasigur is still super good in the meta.
And the above situation isnt like the "dilemma" of do I run rhinos or flayers -> my solution run both. You cant run Tasigur and flayers together. Ive playtested a bunch of games and Tasigur and Grim flayer just feels so bad. Example would be you activate tasigur and your opponent brings back a card to turn off delirium. Or, when you delve tasigur, you want to rid the graveyard of bad cards (like discard). Yet, you need to leave a sorcery in the yard for delirium. Damned if you do, damned if you dont.
Overall I am glad that the flayer version is doing great. We havent had a finish like this from our deck in a while. However, just shutting the door on Tasigur and running Grim + Hierarch just because the pros do it might not be the best route, because IMO I like Tasigur more than Flayer. But again, it all goes down to personal preference.
I'm conflicted, the pros are running the nobles, and I'm not sure I can say it's wrong anymore.
If I take Junk to an FNM, I may try the exact 60 from 2nd place, but I'm not sure I'll prefer it. I'll give it a chance.
The Voice of resurgence should definitely come out of the deck for anyone running it, blue is in a depressed state, and those two slots need to be something else.
The thing about it is, magic is very much a copycat league like the NFL is. The Wildcat offense was a fad and everyone ran it. Same thing here where LSV runs Hiearch + Flayer. The pros do it so thats the "correct" build.
This is often true, but not exclusively. Junk has not been run by any major pro lately and still, mostly Hierarch lists do well. Results do speak for themselves after all. For me, not the pro counts, but the result. If we are talking about winning, not about personal preference, than I think Nobles is the answer. Personally, you can run what you want. But this is just simple data analysis of the recent results we have got. And I think there is nothing wrong with it.
And to say, personal preference is definitely a thing what has an impact on the success of a deck. The way I talked about it though, was not implementing the statement "run Nobles and Flayers" or "run Nobles and no Flayers". The fundamental and most important thing for me is to simply run Nobles and its basic configuration (non creature spells and lands). Whether to run Flayers or not, is up to personal preference.
Why not run Nobles and Tasigur alongside? I think, if you want to run Tasigur, then you can't run both Flayers or Bobs effectively anyway. Doesn't matter if there is Nobles or not. But Tasigur can go alongisde Nobles I think.
http://sylvanstudies.com/2017/02/19/sylvan-stories-modern-junk/
JundBGR
RW Blood MoonRW
Pauper
Delver U
Elves G
Control B
Commander
Edgar Markov BRW
Captain Sisay GW
Niv-Mizzet, Parun UR
Tymna and Ravos WB
That link didn't work, here's an updated one:
http://sylvanstudies.com/2017/02/25/sylvan-stories-modern-junk/
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/24-02-17-Bdx-abzan/
4 Dark Confidant
4 Grim Flayer
4 Tarmogoyf
3 Scavenging Ooze
Spells + Disruption
2 Abrupt Decay
1 Collective Brutality
1 Fatal Push
4 Thoughtseize
2 Inquisition of Kozilek
3 Liliana of the Veil
4 Lingering Souls
4 Path to Exile
2 Blooming Marsh
1 Plains
1 Marsh Flats
2 Shambling Vent
1 Stirring Wildwood
2 Overgrown Tomb
1 Temple Garden
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Windswept Heath
2 Swamp
1 Forest
2 Gavony Township
1 Godless Shrine
1 Abrupt Decay
1 Collective Brutality
2 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Elspeth, Sun's Champion
1 Obstinate Baloth
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Lost Legacy
2 Kitchen Finks
1 Sorin, Solemn Visitor
2 Yahenni's Expertise
2 Stony Silence
I got rid of Siege Rhino and the clunkier threats and stuck with a more efficient creature suite. I also upped the disruption package and added more removal but I may change the split between Inquisition and Thoughtseize in order to prevent too much loss of life. I am really considering dropping Gavony Township all together but I'll have to think on it for a while. I would like to add Noble Hierarch but I don't have them yet and I plan on waiting a few weeks until I get my playset.
URGifts StormUR
URBlue MoonUR
URKiln FiendUR
BURStormBUR
URGifts StormUR
URBlue MoonUR
URKiln FiendUR
BURStormBUR
Simply said: side them out after G1. Jund plays 4 Bob and up to 3 TS for a long time and hasn't had major problems. If you tweak your list accordingly, you can certainly include Bob in Junk.
On a more general note, another Noble list made a good finish. I think anyone who still believes Nobles are not the way to go in Junk right now makes a serious mistake. Have been on it since the unbannings, and people should really focus on those noble lists again. It allows us to potentially run Bobs, and cut down on Flayers if one wishes so. I personally am leaning towards a creature base like this:
3 Dark Confidant
4 Tarmogoyf
2 Scavenging Ooze
2 Siege Rhino
That way you have full access to 24 non creature spells and have no need in running stuff like Nihil Spellbomb to support Flayers. On the other hand though, Nihil Spellbomb doesn't seem that bad right now given all that Death Shadow going around also.
Its the same with Death Shadow. In a nutshell Death Shadow Jund is just a Jund list with a much better ability to close the games down. It just goes under every Eldrazi and Big Mana deck and wins before they take over. Thats the reason why its so good right now. Its disruption combined with a fast clock. If you think about it, thats what we always say about any big mana matchup. We hope to disrupt them early and drop a Goyf turn 2 to start the clock. Its just the best thing available to us. Junk should follow that route and run Nobles for a better ability to go under the opponent. Those Noble list still are also able to grind, if necessary, its not that this turns the deck into a glass canon aggro deck, far from it.
Junk's doing better than Jund in this meta, Jund was nowhere to be seen in the Open
I think any GBx deck is not best positioned right now, but when it comes down to playing Junk anyway, I would go with this approach. Its the version which fits the meta best.
Tron can still be dicey, but it's definitely no longer the lopsided, dreaded matchup it was
You have most of the pieces already from Jund, Flyer, play the deck before making claims like that
Can you be any more abrasive? You're right Death Shadow is the way to go as its the goyf deck with the fastest clock but the really Death Shadow deck qualifies as much as a traditional BG/x deck as Eldrazi Tron qualifies as a G/x Tron deck, pretty sure Delver wasn't counting the new DS JUND lists in the ABZAN thread when he made that statement.
He said all GBx decks
I like Delver, and look how much work he put into the Jund thread, it doesn't mean I wouldn't call him out (and he's rightfully called me out on things).
Abzan reached second place this weekend though, and nearly took first to a really good matchup, and it was in the top 8 in Brisbane, GBx is in an alright place. This weekend was probably the worst I've seen Jund do in a while
Yeah just like was stated, when I talked about GBx decks, I didn't mean death shadow. I think from my previous statement it should be clear that I don't think Death Shadow is bad. I just think this deck counts as own archetype of death shadow rather than a version of GBx deck (although colourwise for sure).
Its true Death Shadow is great now, can't argue with that (And also didn't say otherwise). My point was also not to say which deck is the best in this meta right now. I was talking Junk and Jund and their positioning and I think that both are not the best choices right now, given the better alternatives. Both are fine for sure, as we can see from the great Junk finish lately, but overall not the best still.
If I were to play Junk, and Junk only, I would go with Nobles. Thats what I said. Nothing more and nothing less
And the above situation isnt like the "dilemma" of do I run rhinos or flayers -> my solution run both. You cant run Tasigur and flayers together. Ive playtested a bunch of games and Tasigur and Grim flayer just feels so bad. Example would be you activate tasigur and your opponent brings back a card to turn off delirium. Or, when you delve tasigur, you want to rid the graveyard of bad cards (like discard). Yet, you need to leave a sorcery in the yard for delirium. Damned if you do, damned if you dont.
Overall I am glad that the flayer version is doing great. We havent had a finish like this from our deck in a while. However, just shutting the door on Tasigur and running Grim + Hierarch just because the pros do it might not be the best route, because IMO I like Tasigur more than Flayer. But again, it all goes down to personal preference.
If I take Junk to an FNM, I may try the exact 60 from 2nd place, but I'm not sure I'll prefer it. I'll give it a chance.
The Voice of resurgence should definitely come out of the deck for anyone running it, blue is in a depressed state, and those two slots need to be something else.
This is often true, but not exclusively. Junk has not been run by any major pro lately and still, mostly Hierarch lists do well. Results do speak for themselves after all. For me, not the pro counts, but the result. If we are talking about winning, not about personal preference, than I think Nobles is the answer. Personally, you can run what you want. But this is just simple data analysis of the recent results we have got. And I think there is nothing wrong with it.
And to say, personal preference is definitely a thing what has an impact on the success of a deck. The way I talked about it though, was not implementing the statement "run Nobles and Flayers" or "run Nobles and no Flayers". The fundamental and most important thing for me is to simply run Nobles and its basic configuration (non creature spells and lands). Whether to run Flayers or not, is up to personal preference.
Why not run Nobles and Tasigur alongside? I think, if you want to run Tasigur, then you can't run both Flayers or Bobs effectively anyway. Doesn't matter if there is Nobles or not. But Tasigur can go alongisde Nobles I think.