Hum... I received several comments stating that splashing for decay is a waste. I already got 1 foil, do you guys think I should keep them in my build or go UG only?
Original list:
11:15, restate my assumptions: 1. Mathematics is the language of nature. 2. Everything around us can be represented and understood through numbers. 3. If you graph these numbers, patterns emerge. Therefore: There are patterns everywhere in nature. - Maximillian Cohen.
I think essence warden shows up in my first game against zoo and eats a bolt after gaining 2-3 life. My second game against Zoo is really a bad game for me cause I absord 2 Volcanic Fallout wiping the board 2 times. But I try to salvage the game using 1 Yeva, Nature's Herald and a 1 summoner's Pact in my hand. Then a top deck bolt kills my hope for a top finish.
Have you considered 4x Obstinate Baloths in your sideboard since rdw and zoo dominates your meta?
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11:15, restate my assumptions: 1. Mathematics is the language of nature. 2. Everything around us can be represented and understood through numbers. 3. If you graph these numbers, patterns emerge. Therefore: There are patterns everywhere in nature. - Maximillian Cohen.
Have you considered 4x Obstinate Baloths in your sideboard since rdw and zoo dominates your meta?
Yeva, Nature's Herald is better than Obstinate Baloth. She's an elf and also a 4/4 for 4 cmc.. life gain from baloth sometimes can make a difference but the flash given by yeva to all your elf is sometimes much better. You can cast your tiny elf EOT to dodge sweeper. I don't know. Maybe I will try the baloth next time for a much better perspective.
I got a deck box custom made for my modern decks and my EDH deck. It turned out really amazing. I can't wait to fill it with Elves, Eggs and Other fun decks!
My father has a wood shop, I told him thst a nice deckbox would be awesome for Christmas... but I wouldn't count on it, he makes beds/wallunits/dinning tables/etc....
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11:15, restate my assumptions: 1. Mathematics is the language of nature. 2. Everything around us can be represented and understood through numbers. 3. If you graph these numbers, patterns emerge. Therefore: There are patterns everywhere in nature. - Maximillian Cohen.
I have tried Weird Harvest before, it's a good card if you are trying to amass elves but in my opinion is a poor mana to benefit ratio. Especially having to consider the real risk of getting Snapcasters into your opponent's hand, or whatever they may need, I think you are better served running Chord of Calling, which has a better return on mana investment and is more versatile to cast. (A better trick as well.)
I know Lead the stampede and Summoning Trap is not basically a tutor but they get you creature(s) when you need one so I consider them in this category.
3 cmc for Weird Harvest, you get 1 creature and giving your opponent 1 creature also. With Lead the stampede you get maximum of 5 creature and all this time I play LTS, I haven't got zeroed.
Giving your opponent a creature on your turn with Weird Harvest is a very risky move for me. But I didn't remove the fact that it can also win you games even with no cards in hand.
The downside of Harvest doesn't matter cause 90% or more of the time, you're casting it on the turn you're winning (same as Pact). That is the downside (turn restriction). The upsides of Harvest are you can tutor multiple times, and you can tutor for non-green finishers (like Emrakul). In any case, Ranger of Eos is better than Harvest.
I have always played with Weird Harvest in my version of the deck. It runs quite a few non-creature spells so Lead the Stampede doesn't produce enough creatures for the cost.
The learning curve of the card is steep. You really need to know what threats are possible in each decks you are facing. You don't want your opponent getting a free Snapcaster Mage or Orzhov Pontiff if you aren't confident in your ability to combo through those cards.
I've used it quite a few times to increase the number of creatures I have to feed to Regal Force:
Tap all of that for 9 mana and put 7 into Weird Harvest searching for two more Sentinels, Essence Warden, Heritage Druid, and Regal Force.
Use the last two mana to cast the two Sentinels, tap for 3
Cast the Warden and tap for 5 mana in pool.
Cast the Heritage Druid for 7 mana in the pool
Cast the Regal Force and draw 9 cards and 3 mana available
With summoner's pact you'd get the Regal Force in play and draw 5 cards with 2 mana left over. Sure the opponent now has 5 creatures in their hand, but you will now probably have grabbed your curio and some creatures to finish the combo.
My problem with weird harvest is its only usable in combo turn and requires a lot of mana to be effective. You cannot use it in grinding games or if the opponent is ahead of you in the board. I use summoners pact in grinding games. I think I get it from busMcrider, EOT Summoner's Pact into Yeva, Nature's Herald is a strong play. It can kill an aggressive creature. Just pay the upkeep as if that's the time you cast it. Now I don't just use Pact on combo turn. I use it to ambush people.
My problem with weird harvest is its only usable in combo turn and requires a lot of mana to be effective. You cannot use it in grinding games or if the opponent is ahead of you in the board.
I prefer to use it on a combo turn, but it definitely has uses outside of that. If you are playing against Tron or Zoo it is easy to search for combo pieces and go off the next turn. I don't care if they get a sick Wurmcoil Engine or three Wild Nacatl.
Playing Abrupt Decay on Pestermite while Splinter Twin is on the stack = lots of fun time.
I'll tweak the deck a bit to let it "BUG" for decays, thoughtseizes and illness in the ranks.
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11:15, restate my assumptions: 1. Mathematics is the language of nature. 2. Everything around us can be represented and understood through numbers. 3. If you graph these numbers, patterns emerge. Therefore: There are patterns everywhere in nature. - Maximillian Cohen.
I prefer to use it on a combo turn, but it definitely has uses outside of that. If you are playing against Tron or Zoo it is easy to search for combo pieces and go off the next turn. I don't care if they get a sick Wurmcoil Engine or three Wild Nacatl.
That make sense. Ok I'll test it. So base on your experience with Weird Harvest what deck we should be more careful with it. I only can think of 4 deck which you really have to be careful (Twin, Pod, RDW, Goryo). Do you have any more to add?
Please do, but you may find you like Summoner's Pact more than Weird Harvest. While they are both tutors, they play very differently and you've probably been making incremental tweaks to your deck to work better with Pact. The difference is similar to the Dig Through Time and Treasure Cruise.
With Harvest you a definitely looking to combo most the time. So I've tuned my deck more towards combo. Pact, leads to more tricks, like Yeva.
Below is my advice for decks with Weird Harvest.
Bolded decks I have played against opponents in real matches.
Affinity: This one can be awkward out of combo as they have the only deck with cheaper and more efficient creatures than Elves. Do not use Weird harvest outside of combo if they have an Inkmoth Nexus. They will just search for an Arcbound Ravager and Infect you the next turn.
The Rock: Played against Jund a few times, not GB the rock. I'm guessing that if you have enough mana to cast a large Weird Harvest you are already ahead. Go ahead and use it outside of a combo turn.
Twin: Any deck that runs Snapcaster Mage or Vendilion Clique can be tricky even on a combo turn. Twin is a hard match up for Elves and this is a place where sometimes I wish I had Pact instead of Harvest.
UWr Control: Again Snapcaster Mage exists, but if you can resolve a large harvest you should aim more for beat down as you can then put more threats on the board then they will have answers for.
Gr Tron: I always love Weird Harvest in this match up. It is so easy to get the combo pieces you need and even with all their mana, Tron can only cast 1 of the high cost creatures they searched for.
Jund: Same as the rock above. Feel free to cast a large Weird Harvest out of combo turn.
Burn/RDW: It used to be much easier to cast this out of combo turn, but now with Eidolon of the Great Revel I can't recommend you do that.
Scapeshift: Haven't played, but feels like it would be similar to UWr control. If you can somehow resolve the Weird Harvest, then cast it. This is another, where the instant speed of Pact would help you more.
For established I'll list the decks I've played against and which ones to watch out for outside of combo.
Merfolk: Only cast Weird Harvest on the combo turn if there is an Æther Vial with 2 counters on it.
BW Tokens: Cast Harvest as much as you want.
Death and Taxes: The only thing to watch out for here is a Aven Mindcensor. Otherwise I've had fun with their own Leonin Arbiter, making Weird Harvest the best search spell in the game.
GW Hatebears: Any deck with Linvala means you should only cast Harvest on your combo turn.
Bogles: Cast as often as you want. The last thing the Bogles player wants is more creatures.
Storm: I once played against a storm player that had 4 Goblin Electromancers in play. I combo-ed out the next turn, but it was fun to see him talk about how cheap his spells were.
Goryo: I haven't played against this, but I would agree with you that you'd definitely want to combo the turn you cast Weird Harvest.
Living End: This one can be a toss up. You'll give them plenty of cycling creatures to fill up their yard. But I've had a Curio and searched for the three combo pieces. At that point you can wait on them to cast their Violent Outburst and combo the next turn with the pieces in hand.
Hmm, that's an interesting idea, since it also finds land. But it would further lower the density of non-creatures in the deck. I guess if your goal is finding Curio you'll usually go infinite, so it's not as much of a problem. I wouldn't mind a couple juicy colorless targets alongside it. (Too bad Skullclamp's banned, eh?)
Funny I didn't find this thread until now. The makings of this deck (for me) started during the Innistrad/Return to Ravnica Standard Season. I ran a variation of this deck that had Master Biomancer in it, but the deck was lacking and didn't do very well. I came upon my build when I decided to make an elf deck capable of combating my friends elf deck (that he keep beating over the head with).
Unlike some of the other decks I've seen in this thread, my decks primary focus is ramping as fast as possible to put out huge threats like Craterhoof Behemoth and Pelakka Wurm, whilst thinning the deck and pumping my smaller creatures. The deck actually works pretty well on its own without the big guns, and can work as both an aggro and token deck.
Original list:
4x Arbor Elf
4x Elvish Visionary
4x Heritage Druid
4x Nettle Sentinel
4x Coiling Oracle
4x Essence Warden
2x Elvish Archdruid
2x Elvish Mystic
1x Craterhoof Behemoth
1x Regal Force
1x Ezuri, Renegade Leader
1x Wren's Run Packmaster
4x Beck//Call
3x Intruder Alarm
3x Abrupt Decay
Lands: 18
4x Forest
4x Breeding Pool
4x Misty Rainforest
4x Forbidden Orchard
2x Overgrown Tomb
4x Scavenging Ooze
4x Swan Song
4x Illness in the Ranks
2x Elvish Archdruid
1x Abrupt Decay
UG list:
4x Arbor Elf
4x Elvish Visionary
4x Heritage Druid
4x Nettle Sentinel
4x Coiling Oracle
4x Essence Warden
3x Elvish Archdruid
2x Elvish Mystic
1x Ezuri, Renegade Leader
1x Craterhoof Behemoth
1x Reclamation Sage
1x Regal Force
1x Wren's Run Packmaster
4x Beck//Call
4x Gitaxian Probe
2x Intruder Alarm
Lands: 16
5x Forest
4x Breeding Pool
4x Misty Rainforest
2x Windswept Heath
1x Island
4x Scavenging Ooze
4x Swan Song
4x Nature's Claim
2x Reclamation Sage
1x Elvish Archdruid
Standard: XDon't play.X
Legacy: BUReanimatorUB
Vintage: URBWGDBRU
Live streaming Casual Magic: the Gathering
Sundays at 7:00 PM Eastern Time / 4:00 PM Pacific Time
Follow along on Instagram (@kokoshomebrews) as I create casual tribal decks
and try to build around crazy combos, then play em on stream!
|| WBG || GW || GB || GWU ||
I play with 1-of Essence warden.
4 Forest
3 Windswept Heath
4 Wooded Foothills
2 Hinterland Harbor
2 Breeding Pool
1 Dryad Arbor
1 Pendelhaven
Creatures(28)
2 Elvish Mystic
4 arbor elf
3 elvish archdruid
4 elvish visionary
4 nettle sentinel
4 heritage druid
2 Wren's run packmaster
1 Essence Warden
1 Joraga Warcaller
1 Reclamation Sage
1 Yeva, Nature's Herald
1 Eternal Witness
1 CraterHoof Behemoth
4 Cloudstone Curio
2 Intruder Alarm
4 Summoner's Pact
2 Lead the Stampeed
3 Gitaxian Probe
4 Negate
4 Spell Pierce
2 Creeping Corrosion
1 Choke
1 Elderscale Wurm
3 Thorn of Amethist
I think essence warden shows up in my first game against zoo and eats a bolt after gaining 2-3 life. My second game against Zoo is really a bad game for me cause I absord 2 Volcanic Fallout wiping the board 2 times. But I try to salvage the game using 1 Yeva, Nature's Herald and a 1 summoner's Pact in my hand. Then a top deck bolt kills my hope for a top finish.
Standard: XDon't play.X
Legacy: BUReanimatorUB
Vintage: URBWGDBRU
Yeva, Nature's Herald is better than Obstinate Baloth. She's an elf and also a 4/4 for 4 cmc.. life gain from baloth sometimes can make a difference but the flash given by yeva to all your elf is sometimes much better. You can cast your tiny elf EOT to dodge sweeper. I don't know. Maybe I will try the baloth next time for a much better perspective.
Live streaming Casual Magic: the Gathering
Sundays at 7:00 PM Eastern Time / 4:00 PM Pacific Time
Follow along on Instagram (@kokoshomebrews) as I create casual tribal decks
and try to build around crazy combos, then play em on stream!
|| WBG || GW || GB || GWU ||
My father has a wood shop, I told him thst a nice deckbox would be awesome for Christmas... but I wouldn't count on it, he makes beds/wallunits/dinning tables/etc....
Standard: XDon't play.X
Legacy: BUReanimatorUB
Vintage: URBWGDBRU
Live streaming Casual Magic: the Gathering
Sundays at 7:00 PM Eastern Time / 4:00 PM Pacific Time
Follow along on Instagram (@kokoshomebrews) as I create casual tribal decks
and try to build around crazy combos, then play em on stream!
|| WBG || GW || GB || GWU ||
Edit: If you are having trouble hitting a critical mass of elves instead of just needing a tutor effect, I recommend Lead the Stampede, Regal Force, Garruk, Caller of Beasts.
Weird Harvest is in the bottom of my list in terms of tutor. I haven't even try to play it. No one comes close to Summoner's Pact.
Here's how I rate them.
1. Summoner's Pact
2. Chord of Calling
3. Lead the Stampede
4. Summoning Trap
5. Weird Harvest
I know Lead the stampede and Summoning Trap is not basically a tutor but they get you creature(s) when you need one so I consider them in this category.
3 cmc for Weird Harvest, you get 1 creature and giving your opponent 1 creature also. With Lead the stampede you get maximum of 5 creature and all this time I play LTS, I haven't got zeroed.
Giving your opponent a creature on your turn with Weird Harvest is a very risky move for me. But I didn't remove the fact that it can also win you games even with no cards in hand.
The learning curve of the card is steep. You really need to know what threats are possible in each decks you are facing. You don't want your opponent getting a free Snapcaster Mage or Orzhov Pontiff if you aren't confident in your ability to combo through those cards.
I've used it quite a few times to increase the number of creatures I have to feed to Regal Force:
With summoner's pact you'd get the Regal Force in play and draw 5 cards with 2 mana left over. Sure the opponent now has 5 creatures in their hand, but you will now probably have grabbed your curio and some creatures to finish the combo.
Playing Abrupt Decay on Pestermite while Splinter Twin is on the stack = lots of fun time.
I'll tweak the deck a bit to let it "BUG" for decays, thoughtseizes and illness in the ranks.
Standard: XDon't play.X
Legacy: BUReanimatorUB
Vintage: URBWGDBRU
That make sense. Ok I'll test it. So base on your experience with Weird Harvest what deck we should be more careful with it. I only can think of 4 deck which you really have to be careful (Twin, Pod, RDW, Goryo). Do you have any more to add?
With Harvest you a definitely looking to combo most the time. So I've tuned my deck more towards combo. Pact, leads to more tricks, like Yeva.
Below is my advice for decks with Weird Harvest.
Bolded decks I have played against opponents in real matches.
Affinity: This one can be awkward out of combo as they have the only deck with cheaper and more efficient creatures than Elves. Do not use Weird harvest outside of combo if they have an Inkmoth Nexus. They will just search for an Arcbound Ravager and Infect you the next turn.
The Rock: Played against Jund a few times, not GB the rock. I'm guessing that if you have enough mana to cast a large Weird Harvest you are already ahead. Go ahead and use it outside of a combo turn.
Twin: Any deck that runs Snapcaster Mage or Vendilion Clique can be tricky even on a combo turn. Twin is a hard match up for Elves and this is a place where sometimes I wish I had Pact instead of Harvest.
UWr Control: Again Snapcaster Mage exists, but if you can resolve a large harvest you should aim more for beat down as you can then put more threats on the board then they will have answers for.
Gr Tron: I always love Weird Harvest in this match up. It is so easy to get the combo pieces you need and even with all their mana, Tron can only cast 1 of the high cost creatures they searched for.
Melira Pod: Almost always combo turn only. If not you'll be facing Orzhov Pontiff, Linvala, Keeper of Silence, and Qasali Pridemage your next turn.
Jund: Same as the rock above. Feel free to cast a large Weird Harvest out of combo turn.
Burn/RDW: It used to be much easier to cast this out of combo turn, but now with Eidolon of the Great Revel I can't recommend you do that.
Scapeshift: Haven't played, but feels like it would be similar to UWr control. If you can somehow resolve the Weird Harvest, then cast it. This is another, where the instant speed of Pact would help you more.
For established I'll list the decks I've played against and which ones to watch out for outside of combo.
Merfolk: Only cast Weird Harvest on the combo turn if there is an Æther Vial with 2 counters on it.
BW Tokens: Cast Harvest as much as you want.
Death and Taxes: The only thing to watch out for here is a Aven Mindcensor. Otherwise I've had fun with their own Leonin Arbiter, making Weird Harvest the best search spell in the game.
GW Hatebears: Any deck with Linvala means you should only cast Harvest on your combo turn.
Bogles: Cast as often as you want. The last thing the Bogles player wants is more creatures.
Storm: I once played against a storm player that had 4 Goblin Electromancers in play. I combo-ed out the next turn, but it was fun to see him talk about how cheap his spells were.
Goryo: I haven't played against this, but I would agree with you that you'd definitely want to combo the turn you cast Weird Harvest.
Living End: This one can be a toss up. You'll give them plenty of cycling creatures to fill up their yard. But I've had a Curio and searched for the three combo pieces. At that point you can wait on them to cast their Violent Outburst and combo the next turn with the pieces in hand.
P.S. Tangleroot
4 Breeding Pool
4 Hinterland Harbor
12 Forest
CREATURES
4 Elvish Visionary
4 Elvish Archdruid
4 Copperhorn Scout
4 Arbor Elf
4 Pelakka Wurm
2 Craterhoof Behemoth
1 Garruk, Caller of Beasts
OTHER SPELLS
2 Simic Charm
4 Farseek
4 Lead the Stampede
1 Paralell Lives
4 Gilt-Leaf Ambush
2 Doubling Chant
2 Sundering Growth
4 Beast Within
2 Time to Feed
1 Ground Seal
2 Windstorm
4 Autumn's Veil
Unlike some of the other decks I've seen in this thread, my decks primary focus is ramping as fast as possible to put out huge threats like Craterhoof Behemoth and Pelakka Wurm, whilst thinning the deck and pumping my smaller creatures. The deck actually works pretty well on its own without the big guns, and can work as both an aggro and token deck.
And we get the interesting card, Shaman's Revelation, which has as it's (most important) text: 3GG, draw a card for each creature you control.
Is it possibly that could see play in Elves as an engine card? Or is Regal Force just better?