Well, most of the lists are built to have the biggest bodies for cheap and grow E1 with pretty much ever creature. I'm sure it would be ok, but he's best when built around.
Question for the rest of the thread, Should I run 2 rancor or 2 mutagenic growth?
I run 2 Rancor because of the amount of removal I can use Rancor as a constant threat and trample. I understand Mutagenic Growth has its uses and paying 2 life when no mana is out can save a creature from a Lightning Bolt but Rancor has been more effective for me. Dropping a Rancor off Burning-Tree Emissary with a R one drop like Goblin Guide or one the turn 1 drop gets you past chump blockers and more damage.
I'm trying to come up with a build using a white splash for boros charm and path, utilizing mostly haste creatures for maximum damage early. Then bolt and charm to finish them off. Charm can also protect against wraths and the Ghor-clan, charm combo is one of my favorites. I've played a lot of zoo and want to build something similar but faster. I've left out apes because I want all non land top decks to be able to swing, or chain into something that can. I haven't included a side board or land as I'm still working on those, any feedback is greatly appreciated!
Id suggest at least 2 more 1 cmc multicolor creature to make hackblade a littel more worth it. I dont know if nacatl is anygood until you shpw us land.
I'm not the biggest fan of Talara's batalion. It's big, but you have to have another green spell to cast it. Maybe drop that, and I'd get goblin guide in there as a 4 of. It's a lot better than loyalist.
So far, Eidolon of the Great Revel has been incredible in Burn/RDW for me, but those decks don't have a lot of reach and can just fail to get there some games. Not to mention as a personal preference I like permanent-based damage. Problematically, mono-red's creature suite has trouble pushing through Tarmogoyf and Kitchen Finks without 2-for-1'ing themselves. How does something like this look for a Gruul Aggro deck emphasizing Eidolon?
Copperline Gorge has worked really well for me. I have 15 ways to have a Mountain so Im not worried about the small odds I have that and Kird Ape turn 1 and most likely the first 2 turns id have a Mountain. Talara's Battalion has been a card I have wanted to be good and off Burning-Tree Emissary its just awesome but its not consistent enough. Ash Zealot and Stangleroot Geist are also cards I want to fit in here but they dont have good symmetry/cast off BTE. I have found Rip-Clan Crasher and more so Lightning Mauler as the perfect 2 drops off BTE as my style of play is hyper aggressive/Haste Zoo/Speed Zoo.
If you have Turn 1 Goblin Guide and Turn 2 BTE into Lightning Mauler is swinging for 6 on turn 2. Then on turn 3 pump creatures or remove blockers or drop Flinthoof Boar with Haste, just too many creatures too soon. Running this variation does have issue in the late game but most of my wins are in the first 3 to 4 turns.
Cut the rancor. Too much removal in the meta. Use either mutagenic growth, vines of vastwood instead. Find room for 4 ghorclan. Probably either storm blood or mauler
Good point on the rancor...thinking of either moving Vines of Vastwood to Main or just adding Mutagenic Growth and keeping the Vines in the SB. My initial build have 4 Ghor-Clans but decided to replace 2 with 2 Ram-Gangs since it helps evolving E1 and is good against persist creatures and shrinking bigger creatures(Goyf/Smiter) and plus it has Haste, and since you've brought up the removals in the meta I think having the full set of Ghor-Clan could be bad since they'll just respond with their removal when you Bloodrush.
Apologies if this has been discussed elsewhere, but has anybody tested altac bloodseeker? I'm curious if its power boost + haste is too conditional to make it viable in zoo.
Yes, blood rush carries that risk, just be less greedy than your opponent. I think i get 2 for oned maybe 1 outta 50 blood rushes. Learn the cues and whst can be in their hand and deck. Rancor can be blown out just as hard.
I didnt test blood seeker, but i wouldnt use it. 2 mana for 3 sometimes damage is pretty meh. Its frail otherwise, and your not bolting enough. Realisticly, youcan get more damage in for 2 mana with other cards.
@Lantern
Yeah I agree with you completely on Rancor though the Trample from Rancor sometimes helps, but i wouldn't say that Ram-Gang is that bad as a substitute for 2 Ghor-clans since there are times when the Rampagers just gets stuck in your hand when you get blown out by Anger of the Gods but with Ram-Gangs you can quickly recover the following turn since it has Haste.
@Dolono
As for the blood seekers, I think its too conditional. You'll have to have alot of removal in your deck for it to work and its bad against creature-light decks like Control/Combo, I'd still go with Lightning Maulers since it gives you that explosive turn once you chain it with BTE.
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Question for the rest of the thread, Should I run 2 rancor or 2 mutagenic growth?
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Playing:
Death's Shadow Jund
Played:
Kiki Chord, Zoo variants, Goblins, Burn
4x Burning-tree Emissary
4x experiment one
4x Ghor-clan rampager
4x goblin guide
3x Flinthoof boar
4x kird ape
2x Scavenging ooze
2x vexing devil
4x wild nacatl
2x boros charm
2x rancor
4x Lightning bolt
3x path to exile
lands
4x arid mesa
1x copperline gorge
1x plains
1x forest
2x mountain
1x sacred foundry
3x stomping ground
1x temple garden
4x verdant catacombs
3x burning-tree shaman
2x qasali pridemage
3x ancient grudge
1x path to exile
3x searing blaze
2x domri rade
1x pyroclasm
Alright, so this is the most recent version of the deck I'm at and possible sideboard thoughts. Any suggestions or thoughts?
Follow the link for nice cheap clothing.
Playing:
Death's Shadow Jund
Played:
Kiki Chord, Zoo variants, Goblins, Burn
Follow the link for nice cheap clothing.
Playing:
Death's Shadow Jund
Played:
Kiki Chord, Zoo variants, Goblins, Burn
4x Burning-tree Emissary
4x Jund Hackblade
4x Ghor-clan rampager
4x goblin guide
4x Flinthoof boar
4x Rakdos Cackler
2x Lightning Mauler
4x wild nacatl
other
4x boros charm
4x Lightning bolt
4x Path to Exile
Follow the link for nice cheap clothing.
Playing:
Death's Shadow Jund
Played:
Kiki Chord, Zoo variants, Goblins, Burn
Follow the link for nice cheap clothing.
Playing:
Death's Shadow Jund
Played:
Kiki Chord, Zoo variants, Goblins, Burn
I don't like beastmaster. It's bolt bait at 3 mana that does nothing on it's own really.
Follow the link for nice cheap clothing.
Playing:
Death's Shadow Jund
Played:
Kiki Chord, Zoo variants, Goblins, Burn
Follow the link for nice cheap clothing.
Playing:
Death's Shadow Jund
Played:
Kiki Chord, Zoo variants, Goblins, Burn
You could also put in 4 Scavenging Ooze.
Maindeck
4x Eidolon of the Great Revel
4x Ghor-Clan Rampager
4x Goblin Guide
1x Grim Lavamancer
4x Kird Ape
4x Tarmogoyf
4x Arid Mesa
8x Mountain
4x Scalding Tarn
4x Stomping Ground
4x Lightning Bolt
4x Searing Blaze
Sideboard
2x Burning-Tree Shaman
2x Combust
4x Destructive Revelry
1x Domri Rade
2x Molten Rain
1x Relic of Progenitus
1x Sowing Salt
1x Thrun, the Last Troll
Ash Zealot pairs well with Ghor-Clan Rampager, and combined with Eidolon gives us a critical mass of maindeckable Storm and Snapcaster Mage hate.
If you have Turn 1 Goblin Guide and Turn 2 BTE into Lightning Mauler is swinging for 6 on turn 2. Then on turn 3 pump creatures or remove blockers or drop Flinthoof Boar with Haste, just too many creatures too soon. Running this variation does have issue in the late game but most of my wins are in the first 3 to 4 turns.
4 Goblin Guide
4 Experiment One
4 Kird Ape
4 Burning-Tree Emissary
4 Lightning Mauler
3 Flinthoof Boar
2 Rip-Clan Crasher
4 Ghor-Clan Rampager
10 Spells
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Searing Blaze
4 Sudden Shock
2 Rancor
Lands
4 Arid Mesa
4 Copperline Gorge
3 Mountain
1 Forest
4 Scalding Tarn
4 Stomping Ground
4 Krosan Grip
4 Torpor Orb
3 Mindbreak Trap
2 Shattering Spree
2 Destructive Revelry
4 Stomping Grounds
4 Copperline Gorge
3 Arid Mesa
3 Scalding Tarn
2 Misty Rainforest
2 Mountains
2 Forest
(20 Lands)
4 Experiment One
4 Goblin Guide
4 Kird Ape
4 Flinthoof Boar
4 Lightning Mauler
4 Burning-Tree Emissary
2 Stormblood Berserker
2 Boggart Ram-Gang
2 Ghor-Clan Rampager
(30 Creatures)
2 Rancor
2 Pillar of Flame
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Dismember
(10 Other Spells)
Sideboard:
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Vines of Vastwood
2 Spellskite
2 Destructive Revelry
2 Domri Rade
3 Molten Rain
Sideboard Plans would be the following:
Pod Variants:
In: 2 Grafdigger's Cage, 1 Destructive Revelry
Out: 2 Rancor, 1 Lightning Mauler
UW/x Variants:
In: 2 Vines of Vastwood, 2 Domri Rade
Out: 2 Pillar of Flame, 2 Rancor
Rock Variants(GB/Jund/Junk):
In: 2 Vines of Vastwood, 1 Relic of Progenitus
Out: 2 Pillar of Flame, 1 Rancor
Twin Variants:
In: 2 Vines of Vastwood, 2 Spellskite/Destructive Revelry
Out: 2 Pillar of Flame, 2 Rancor
Storm:
In: 2 Relic of Progenitus
Out: 2 Dismember
Reanimator/Gifts Deck:
In: 2 Relic of Progenitus, 2 Grafdigger's Cage
Out: 2 Dismember, 2 Rancor
Scapeshift/Tron:
In: 3 Molten Rain, 2 Destructive Revelry(vs Tron)
Out: 2 Pillar of Flame, 2 Rancor, 1 Lightning Mauler
Thinking of swapping out Domri Rade for Wrap in Vapor, what do you guys think? Coz the 1 card that beats this deck is Anger of the Gods
"Personally I love high-riak, low-reqars gambles. Life's best with a decent amount of riak. And f*** reqars."
I didnt test blood seeker, but i wouldnt use it. 2 mana for 3 sometimes damage is pretty meh. Its frail otherwise, and your not bolting enough. Realisticly, youcan get more damage in for 2 mana with other cards.
Yeah I agree with you completely on Rancor though the Trample from Rancor sometimes helps, but i wouldn't say that Ram-Gang is that bad as a substitute for 2 Ghor-clans since there are times when the Rampagers just gets stuck in your hand when you get blown out by Anger of the Gods but with Ram-Gangs you can quickly recover the following turn since it has Haste.
@Dolono
As for the blood seekers, I think its too conditional. You'll have to have alot of removal in your deck for it to work and its bad against creature-light decks like Control/Combo, I'd still go with Lightning Maulers since it gives you that explosive turn once you chain it with BTE.