"Much can be gained from the appearance of vulnerability."
—Ezuri, renegade leader
(Scars of Mirrodin: Blunt the Assault)
(Magic 2014 Core Set: Fog)
What is Turbo Fog?
Turbo Fog is a deck that believes that not losing is much more important than winning. By playing universal efficient draw (Turbo) and Fog-like effects this deck buys time to win in whatever method the builder chooses.
Why play Turbo Fog?
The most popular way to win a game of magic is by creature combat damage. Wouldn’t it be nice to have a deck that had a very good matchup against any deck with that plan A? Do you like to invalidate everything your opponent is doing? Do you enjoy drawing lots of cards? Do you want to see your entire deck every game? Want consistency like a burn deck but don’t want to race? Want a cheap deck?
This is that deck.
Why shouldn’t you play Turbo Fog?
This deck requires you to play fast or you will go to time.
If you don’t like decks that could play themselves and you want something risky and challenging, well we got the risky part down. This deck is very good against a metagame with lots of creatures/aggro stuff. The most difficult current matchups for this deck are Tron, Control and Burn (not necessarialy in that order).
If you like attacking your opponent, this is probably not for you.
Why did I make this Primer?
Turbo fog pops up in deck creation once or twice a year. Every time they will get yelled at that there is already a thread for Turbo Fog. Thing is these threads are pretty horrible with entirely negative advice and stale with one idea. Here is a chance for a thread that can grow beyond one person’s table top.
I have been keeping an eye on turbo fog since it was first viable in tenth edition and have seen its wax and wane in standard. Though it is considered unplayable in modern I believe that its exceptional matchups against aggro and ability to respond to other threats makes up for its bad matchups.
Typical Turbo Fog builds go W/U/x, "x" being black or green, and more recently Red. U/G variants have seen some play as well, and even mono W versions. That's why I'm separating all cards by colors and CMC here.
Most decks play something near 15/17 fogs, 10/13 Draw engines, 22/24 lands and the rest is filled with flex slots, typically win conditions, spot removal, board wipers, graveyard recursion (elixir of immortality for instance), Leyline of sanctity, etc.
Turbo The engines that power this deck.
Mikokoro, Center of the Sea - No initial investment required but requires mana every activation. Still it is a land that does what we want it to. If your manabase allows it, play a singleton at least since it's legendary.
Desolate lighthouse - More expensive to trigger as well as color restrictive, and it also discards us a card. It's not legendary and that may be relevant, but it's still not better than Mikokoro.
Sea gate wreckage - We're supposed to be drawing a plethora of cards each turn, so this one only would work on emergencies.
Geier reach sanitarium - It could have some potential as a nerfed version of Mikokoro, center of the sea, being playable as a second copy which wouldn't destroy the other one (legendary rule). But card filters are mostly useful late game only. :rate 2.5:
Dakra mystic – “Choices are rarely as simple as they seem”, the top deck manipulation is cool, but requires each activation. Also, really soft to removal.
Howling Mine-This is the primary draw effect as it's the only noncreature 2cmc on modern. Run 4 or you probably are not playing turbo fog.
Kami of the Crescent Moon -Only cost two but color intensive. Puts up an ok effort as a blocker but dies to bolt. Very rarely run, as we don't tend to run lots of creatures. Maybe as a sideboard alternative once your opponent realizes their creature removal is pointless here. Or even on a more creature-heavy build.
Fevered Visions- Possibly the most relevant card WOTC gave us in the last months/years. First, you get the first draw (just make sure you remember to make room on your hand for when the draw happens, otherwise you’ll be discarding EOT), second, it acts as a legit win condition which is not really hard to trigger (only 4 cards in hand). So it’s basically like putting an improved howling mine together with a less efficient (2 damage instead of 4) but more accessible (4 cards instead of 7) ebony owl netsuke.
A no-Brainer if you’re willing to splash red on your build, as it opens up a couple slots on your deck by filling the roles of draw engine/wincon at the same time.
Temple Bell- Typically a core card in some number on most versions as it colorless. Controlling when the draw happens is really useful at times.
Jace Beleren-Vulnerable to burn, don’t really care about creatures as we’re supposed to prevent damage anyway, sometimes you want to keep some fogs for yourself and keeping it alive is a cost some can't afford. Draws a card the turn it comes out, and it’s not really unusual to get to activate its ultimate, so it also works as a win condition. Gets better with Leyline of sanctity out as it won’t be hit by burn. Its second ability may be useful at times too. can be restrictive though.
Dictate of kruphix - As the double blue can be a bit tricky at times, the fact that it has flash can be determinant as you can keep some more mana open just in case until your opponent's end of turn. Basically a good choice against control decks, as if they want to counter it, they’ll be forced to do it on their own turn. Also, you get the first draw if casted on your opponent's EOT.
Monastery Siege – It’s not as efficient as other draw engines but the card filtering Is OK and it's one sided . Otherwise use it for protection, your opponent will realize casting that Abrupt Decay for 4 isn’t that appealing now, or that his/her burn spells aren’t as “hot” as before.
Rites of Flourishing- Draws card, and lets you play those lands cluttering up your hand. Accelerates you into being able to play more turbo and thus have more reliable future draws. This card is however very good for our opponents as it ramps them too. Core in green builds.
Phyrexian Arena One sided draw engine, but that 1 damage can be lethal, as we mostly survive at the edge of life. Also, that means we're not milling our opponent.
Abundance -While costing a full four to net you no physical card advantage it makes up for it in quality. It prevents you from being drawn out as it replaces your draw, as an added benefit. It is defiantly good enough to warrant consideration as a 1-2 of in a deck with green in it.
Jace, Memory Adept-Cost a full 5 but functions to speed up your win significantly.
Alhammarret's archive- Expensive, and unnecessary. Maybe better if you play some amount of life gain or something.
Angel's Grace-One is not Zero. This has Split Second, stops direct damage as well as creature damage, tricky combos such as Hive Mind plus pact of negation and the other future sight pacts, and only cost a single white mana. The problem is that it leaves you in bolt range on the next turn.
Kami of False Hope - He costs 1 and has great recursion capabilities. He can also be killed on your turn. He does beautiful things with Enduring Renewal, but can still be killed during your end step.
Children of Korlis- It works as some kind of fog, but you shouldn’t be losing life to have to activate him.
Angelsong-Acceptably priced and cycling can be used if flooded with fogs.
Dawn Charm- Fog that can also stop discard and burn spells. Flexibility is what makes it a core card.
Batwing Brume-This card can win you the game or bring you very close if you want to win with damage. Casting multiples can take your opponent 20 to Zero. Works best of your opponent does not know about it so hold it until you need to or can win with it. If you’re not playing black it just a 2CMC fog though. if playing black, if not.
Pollen Lullaby-Can function as two fogs occasionally, as well as scrying 1 and revealing your opponent potential next draw. I hear that is good.
Repel the abominable- Good as it prevents all sorts of damages, unless you're facing humans..
Safe Passage-Stops direct damage as well as creature damage. It doesn’t prevent your planeswalkers from being hurt though.
Riot Control-Same as Safe Passage, but it doesn’t prevent damage dealt to creatures. On the other hand, it can pull you out of the red zone depending on how many critters are there. Mostly an upgrade of Safe Passage on this deck as we don’t really care about damage dealt to our dudes.
Encircling fissure - Unefficient for what it does, and having a 2/2 isn't really a big deal.
Chronomantic escape – Overcosted, but if you get to chain 3 in different turns, creatures won’t attack you anymore. It also stops eldrazi’s annihilator. Having a free (upgraded) fog every 3 turns shouldn’t be that bad. Unfortunately, typically we can't afford to wait 3 turns.
Stonehorn Dignitary-Lets you know ahead of time that creature won’t be swinging, nifty interactions with blinking/creature effects. Costs 4 though.
Comeuppance - While is high on CMC, it has some serious flexibility. It doesn't only prevent any kind of damage, but it hurts back, making it a potential board wiper or even a win condition.
Haze Frog- The body could be useful, generally bad.
Darkness -It is another 1 CMC fog, that is a very important fact, specially against control, during counterspells wars.
Intimidation bolt - Really good if you're splashing red. Can get rid of some pesky critter and prevent them from attacking. A tad expensive though, but against certain decks totally worths it. It also prevents attack triggers such as annihilator or the new eldrazis ones'.
Win Conditions Because at times we actually need to win somehow.
This is the most passive and natural way for a Turbo Fog deck to win. Many of our cards are already drawing them closer to that last card. It has the innate problem that some decks are resilient to this attack plan.
There are two methods to go about this Actively or Passively.
If you decide to actively mill you are including cards specifically with the intent of reducing their library quicker. You can have some permanents to do that such as:
Altar of the brood – Can be casted as early as turn 1 and ANY permanent hitting the board triggers it. We don’t run lots of permanents but opponents typically do. Can speed the mill a bit. Might worth consideration.
Mesmeric Orb – This is a fantastic card that has the highest cards milled more per cost. It fits in with the deck nicely.
Sphinx's Tutelage - Possibly our best mill wincon right now as it synergises really well with the amount of cards we draw per turn, speeding up the mill.
Jace, Memory Adept - Functions as both draw and a way to win. Probably expensive though.
Jace Beleren - We don't always get to activate its ultimate, but when we do it can be lethal. If you can protect him from burn spells, it’s basically a sorcery speed temple bell with a potential finisher.
Psychic spiral- Getting all those fogs and permanents back to our deck AND milling our opponent sounds sweet. A tad expensive though.
Mind Funeral – Sometimes is a bit tricky, but can be a beast against decks with lots of fetches/manaramp.
If you choose to passively mill, letting them draw their entire deck, you will fill the slots you would on a win condition on more turbo/utility cards/fogs to make your plays more consistent. The primary problem with this method is time. You must be very familiar with how to play the deck and end your turns shortly after they begin. Nobody wants a tie.
This deck doesn’t really play much in the way of fair creatures, what it does is abuse its existing game plan of surviving to the very late game. Most versions go creatureless in order to blank the opponent’s removal, some others add creatures on game 2 as they have probably sided out they removal, and some play some manlands , which also help fix the manabase.
Luminarch Ascension -You can easily go many, many turns without taking damage. Once the Ascension is active 4/4 angles for 1W are pretty efficient and can easily clean up a game with no rush.
Assemble the legion- Just throw it there, and watch it grow until you outnumber your opponent. Then just proceed to win.
Celestial Colonnade-Conveniently a dual land and sits dormant until you are ready to use it. Evasion is key.
Creeping Tar Pit-Different colors than Colonnade, lower power but completely unblockable. Doesn't pass the bolt test though.
Faerie Conclave/ Inkmoth Nexus/ Blinkmoth Nexus-Very little mana required to activate but wins slower than even your native drawing power but can be there in case you need it, I recommend one of the previous options instead.
Emrakul, the aeons torn/Ulamog, the infinite gyre/Kozilek, butcher of truth - Some players run one of them as a singleton as they help getting the fogs/destroyed permanents back to the deck while discarded. Possibly the best option is to run the cheaper ones so you have higher chances of hardcasting it (not that it happens too often).
Psychosis Crawler – Its body relies on your hand size, which typically will be full, but the interesting part is that it deals damage anytime we draw a card, and we draw a lot.
Runeflare Trap - It's not really hard to pay its alternative mana cost, since we just need 2 draw engines to make that happen, if they play serum visions or sth it's even easier. Dealing 7 to 10 damage for R on our's opponent draw step is certainly fun and mostly unexpected.
Underworld dreams - A Psychosis Crawler without the body, which can be an advantage as decks don’t typically run as much enchantment removal as they do with creature removal. :symb::symb::symb: can be hard to pay though.
Nahiri, the harbinger - If you're splashing :symr:, turbo fog provides a nice shell for playing and protecting nahiri, and some builds already pack an eldrazi for reshuffling cards into the library, so Emrakul, the aeons torn is playable. Also her abilities fit really well with the theme of the deck, providing card filtering, destroying problematic stuff, or... well, casting an Emrakul/Ulamog/Kozilek or whatever you have in mind.
Ob Nixilis Reignited – Really cool planeswalker which is kind of a toolbox. Allows us to draw a card at the cost of 1 life, we can destroy one of those pesky creature/biggies that are bothering us, and finally, finish them with its ultimate.
Gideon Jura – Hey, they’ll be attacking him and not us. Really cool “bodyguard” which also can be used for creature removal and as a finisher.
Staff of nin – It functions as a turbo and as some slow wincon. Probably expensive for what it does though.
A deck that waits forever to do anything and sees its entire deck is the perfect home for combo, although few choose to win this way. Few combo cards do anything for you before they win you the game and can be easily disrupted. There are many, many combos you could run that would do nothing else for the deck(E.g. Mikaeus, the Unhallowed+ Triskelion ).
Mindslaver + Academy Ruins =This is practically a one card combo as it only needs to take up one nonland slot in your deck. Mindslaver itself acts as a very expensive fog, the fact that a combo piece is not a completely dead card is nothing to scoff at. Academy ruins can help bringing back destroyed/milled/discarded stuff like temple bell and howling mine.
Duskmantle guildmage +Mindcrank – Janky combo which happens to inflict infinite damage + infinite mill, and at best can be pulled off on turn 4. Still, you’ll need something to trigger it... and to protect it.
Some versions also run Maze’s end as a wincon, as well as playing the full array of lands needed to do so. Problem is the lands slow things down a turn, and a single Blood Moon can totally hose the deck. Also is kinda difficult to pull the right lands to activate the wincon. The upside is that you’ll have access to ANY spell you want as you’ll be playing 5 colors. Rites of flourishing may help speed up things a bit.
Other honorable mentions which mostly require dedicating some cards in order to become real threats include Azor’s elocutors (typically fragile), Darksteel reactor (slow) and Helix Pinnacle (slow).
Other Cards Stuff people actually include on their lists.
This deck is incredibly wide open with a large variety of playable cards and great variability of colors run, as such there are countless card that could potentially see play in a turbo fog deck. Here are a few of the common ones:
Isochron Scepter-Extraordinary power with equivalent fragility. Is best friends with Silence and counterspells.
Elixir of Immortality - A must in my opinion, at least as a singleton as it prevents you from drawing out, gets your fogs back to the deck and provides some life gain as well. Notice that as the turns go by, your deck will likely have less lands and permanents on it, so shuffling back the fogs will mean having higher chances of getting at least one on your draws. If you don't want to pay the mana cost or want something different, just play an eldrazi.
Forbidden Orchard – If you’re having issues with your manabase, consider this. Who cares about 1 million tokens, when you’re preventing the whole damage?
Jester’s Cap – Extraction spells can help us counter non-creature wincons, combo pieces, removal or anything that can screw us. This is possibly the best option if you’re not playing black.
Boseiju, who shelters all – Counterspell prevention. Be careful about this one as you’ll be losing life anyway.
Reliquary Tower - May have some potential, specially against control as they can outnumber our fogs with counterspells at times. Make sure you find a way to throw some cards back into your deck so you don't get auto-milled.
Negate/Mana Leak/ Dispel/ Swan song-If you are running blue, any variety of counterspells are well suited to this deck, in order to handle various threats and other counterspells. Another note on counterspells is not to counter anything that can easily be handled by your fogs. Use them to protect your spells and stop their non-combat damage win conditions. Notice that Swan Song gets better here as those birds shouldn’t be a trouble to us.
Snapcaster Mage-When flashing back a fog it ends up being over costed but in combined use with counterspells the versatility makes him worth it.
Cryptic Command-This card is good. Tapping down creatures stops combat at its source. Really versatile, and equally costly for our standards.
Wall of Omens - Traditionally great in control do help out this deck by preventing early damage and smoothing draws but are overall lack luster in actual performance.
Leyline of Sanctity - Stops almost everything fogs don’t. 4 copies is a must, at least on the sideboard.
Wrath of God and other wrath effects-These work really well against creature deck and can give you a turn to spend without having to cast a fog. Oblivion Ring Single target removable removal. Not much to add.
Beast Within-Exceptional removal, if you need it. Pay no mind to the 3/3.
Supreme verdict - Basically, a Day of judgement which can't be countered. Key against control decks. Narset Trascendent – Its first ability can help us get one more draw per turn. The second one is probably useless as rebound triggers at the beginning of our upkeep, the only exceptions I can think of are extraction spells and board wipers, but if you find an use for it, go ahead and try it. The last one might mean game for us. Detention Sphere - Typically better than oblivion ring, until you have to get rid of another detention sphere... Anguished unmaking – Really good removal if you went with :symb:, losing 3 life can be the difference between surviving a lightning bolt or not though.
As always this section relies on the metagame you’re into and the colors you play of course. Probably our worst matchups right now are Tron (any variant), Burn, and control (anything with counterspells) so you might consider that as a start.
Swan Song/negate/spell pierce/dispel/Remand/Mana leak, etc – Counterspells are always a good choice if you’re playing blue, in general terms. Our focus should be non-creature spells naturally, and trying to include hard-counters with low CMC for counterspell battles against control decks. Some decks play a high number of those, getting closer to an UW control list at times, nearly making it a transformational sideboard.
Leyline of Sanctity - Prevents burn, discard, direct damage, among others. If you’re not running 4 mainboard already, include them on the sideboard. Nevermore /Meddling mage – You can cast it on anything, combo pieces, planeswalkers, Eidolon of the great revel (which hoses us really bad), Cryptic Command , etc. The real deal is to know what to name. Pithing needle –Silver bullet mostly against planeswalkers, but can disrupt some other stuff as well like oblivion stone, engineered explosives, ratchet bomb, etc. Being colorless, and at the affordable price of 1CMC is key. Tormod’s crypt/Rest in peace/ Leyline of the void/ Relic of progenitus/grafdigger’s cage –Graveyard hate, Shut those Snapcaster Mages, prevent Emrakul’s shuffle ability by removing him so you can proceed to mill, get rid of any reanimator deck, etc. Some players play rest in peace as is more straight-forward and requires no activation, and some others go for one-sided options as relic of progenitus, which allows them to recur their fogs through elixir of immortality, emrakul, the aeons torn, etc. Elixir of Immortality, or old eldrazis (emrakul, the aeons torn, ulamog, the infinite gyre, kozilek, butcher of truth) – Use these to reshuffle all your stuff back to you library, avoiding auto-mill and letting you cast all your fogs back again. Extirpate/Surgical extraction/Memoricide/Praetor’s Grasp/Haunting echoes/Sadistic Sacrament/Cranial Extraction/Infinite Obliteration – If you’re playing black, don’t hesitate about including these combo disrupters/problematic cards’ wiper. They’re pretty much like a Nevermore but they can’t be hit by removal. If black isn’t what you’re into, then better try Jester’s Cap instead. Runed Halo– Stops damage from anything leyline of sanctity or the fogs don’t, such as Eidolon of the great revel, which is a top tier public enemy of this deck. Story circle – Pretty much like Runed Halo, but can get wider, depending on what you’re facing. Remember to save mana for it though. Detention Sphere/Oblivion ring – Silver bullets for troublesome permanents. Sphere is strictly better on most situations. Being removable is an issue at times. Timely reinforcements/Rest for the weary/Sanctimony/Dragon’s claw/ kor firewalker – Some players choose to gain life as an answer to fast decks such as burn. Those are just some common examples. Stony silence – The first card you want to include as artifact hate, it’s really needed on our Tron matchup as well, stopping their board wipers and eggs. Aura of silence – Another artifact inhibitor, which can eventually destroy one. It does the same to enchantments as well. Remember Eidolon of the great revel is an enchantment when facing burn. Bribery – This is our best bet against Tron. Survive until you can cast this, steal their Ulamog/Emrakul and give them a taste of their own medicine. It becomes less relevant against decks without biggies, but remember Nahiri, the harbinger decks are tier stuff now, as well as through the breach decks. Monastery Siege – Protects your stuff from removal and yourself from burn/discard, otherwise just filters your draws. Angel’s grace – useful against ad nauseam, and hive mind decks which fortunately aren’t that popular now with the ban of summer bloom. Suppression Field – A really wide option which can slow down a plethora of things like planeswalkers, artifacts, sac outlets, and even ad nauseam’s lightning storm. Don’t forget this applies to your own temple bells as well.
Eyes of the wisent – At fisrt glance, it seems helpful against control. If they counter your fogs/turbo engines, at least you get a 4/4 elemental. Vexing Shusher/Grand Abolisher – Again, control hate tech, we can’t play stuff like Defense Grid as it hurts us too. Those critters seem fine, but they are very vulnerable to removal. Teferi, mage of zhalfir – Another possible answer to control, overcosted, but the flash ability may make him castable EOT. Crypt incursion – You may want this card if you’re actively milling your opponent. Graveyard hate + lifegain? Oh yeah! Witchbane orb/Ivory mask/True Believer – Budget replacements for Leyline of sanctity.
Turn 1: Land
Turn 2: Draw. Land. Howling Mine
Turn 3: Draw. Draw. Land. Go.
Sounds bad? It is actually better than you would think. In this deck you don’t care about your life total unless it is zero so you use your first few turns as a buffer to soak up damage before you have to play fog like effects.
Just don't cast your fogs until you see your opponent can swing for lethal. Be careful about being on lightning bolt/burn spells range though.
Remember you're giving your opponent the chance to explore his whole deck (or a big part of it) as well thanks to the draw rocks, which may help him find his removal pieces or whatever they use for ruining us, so don't matter if your opponent is just swinging and swinging with his/her critters only to get lost in the fog with no results, don't take anything for granted and try to cast your wincons ASAP. You don't win the game until the other player's life is 0, or he can't draw a card when he's supposed to (or he gets 10 poison counters, or when a card says so, I know...).
Work in progress
The rule here seems to be "The odds for turbo fog to win are directly proportional to the number of creatures in the opponent's deck".
But let's take an in-depth look at it.
Affinity
Game 1: should be an easy deal, having to concern only about galvanic blast.
Games 2/3: still easy, but watch out for their removal, counterspells and chalice of the void.
MVPs: Any fog, but specially Dawn Charm can stop their burn. Repel the abominable does the same as well.
Burn
Bad matchup in general terms, let’s see.
Game 1: If you packed 4x Leyline of sanctity and got one on turn 0, you’ll realize it’s easier to win once you’ve blanked 19 of their cards. Creatures should be no issue, and they usually don’t pack mainboard removal. In this scenario, the only cards which really could hurt us are Eidolon of the great revel and atarka’s command, which you shouldn’t overlook at all.
Now, if you don’t get the turn 0 leyline, that’s when you drop a smoke bomb to the floor and run the hell outta there it’ll get really hard to win, dawn charm being our only real protection against spells. Repel the abominable could work as well, but keep in mind monastery swiftspear and grim lavamancer are humans.
Game 2/3: Those will depend on how much dedicated is your sideboard towards this matchup.
Some good card choices apart from Leyline of sanctity are runed halo, kor firewalker, and the aforementioned lifegain spells.
Stuff like deflecting palm and lightning helix might worth consideration if you’re splashing .
In addition to the stuff from game 1, be aware of their removal and skullcrack.
Jund
If something characterizes Jund, is that it has fair matchups against almost every deck, and we’re not the exception here.
In general terms your main worry should be finding a way to keep your draw engines alive, since they pack a lot of disruptive stuff.
Game 1: If you have a turn 0 leyline, that’ll blank their grim lavamancer, lightning bolt, inquisition of kozilek, thoughtseize, kolaghan’s command (actually it could kill a howling mine or a temple bell, but we’re disabling the burn/discard modes) and liliana of the veil’s ultimate, being something between 15 to 17 cards blanked at once with only one card, and keep in mind their terminate already has no use against us, becoming 18-20 useless cards in their hand. That’d certainly improve the matchup. So, the cards we should worry about are abrupt decay and maelstrom pulse. They typically play 2 of each mainboard, but that might be enough at times to cut our fog-flow and eventually win through combat damage. Especially maelstrom pulse can be troublesome if you played 2 or 3 copies of the same draw engine, so keep that in mind when you’re deciding what to play next.
Game 2/3: Those will get a tad harder, since they’ll be probably bringing more hate towards our draw engines. Bring out leyline If you’re not playing 4 mainboard already, and stuff to protect your stuff, like nevermore, monastery siege or counterspells.
Extraction spells like memoricide could be useful as well if you’re into :symb:.
MVPs: Leyline of Sanctity
Infect
If you don’t win this one, then you’ll probably have to reconsider your decklist… or playing magic.
Game 1: Easy deal, fog only lethal damage, keeping some mana opened from turn 3 onwards. The only cards to worry about are viridian corrupter and spell pierce, which are typically singleton.
Games 2/3: Pretty much the same, but also keep an eye on nature’s claim and dispel. Board out the leylines, and bring in runed halos, creature removal if you have any, and/or counterspells.
MVP: The whole deck is designed to play against this kind of stuff, so anything goes. Jeskai Harbinger
Merfolk
Dredge
Bant Eldrazi
Zooicide/Suicide Zoo
G/R Tron - G/x Tron
Grixis Control
Ad Nauseam
Death & Taxes
Abzan Midrange/Junk/BGw Souls/BG Rock
Zoo
Abzan Company
RG Eldrazi
Kiki Chord/Kiki Company/Kiki Evolution
Grixis Delver
RUG Scapeshift
G/W Auras a.k.a. Bogles Living End Mono Value Control a.k.a Azorius Titan
"Much can be gained from the appearance of vulnerability."
—Ezuri, renegade leader
(Scars of Mirrodin: Blunt the Assault)
(Magic 2014 Core Set: Fog)
What is Turbo Fog?
Turbo Fog is a deck that believes that not losing is much more important that winning. By playing universal efficient draw and Fog-like effects this deck buys time to win in whatever method the builder chooses.
Why play Turbo Fog?
The most popular way to win a game of magic is by creature combat damage. Wouldn’t it be nice to have a deck that had a very good matchup against any deck with that plan A? Do you like to invalidate everything your opponent is doing? Do you enjoy drawing lots of cards? Do you want to see your entire deck every game? Want consistency like a burn deck but don’t want to race? Want a cheap deck?
This is that deck.
Why shouldn’t you play Turbo Fog?
This deck requires you to play fast or you will go to time.
If you don’t like decks that could play themselves and you want something risky and challenging, well we got the risky part down. This deck is very good against a local metagame with lots of rouge decks and the cheaper meta decks. The two most difficult matchups for this deck are Melira Pod and Tron, so big tournaments are kind of out.
If you like attacking your opponent, this is not for you, if you attack, you are doing so once.
Why did I make this Primer?
Turbo fog pops up in deck creation once or twice a year. Every time they will get yelled at that there is already a thread for Turbo Fog. Thing is these threads are pretty horrible with entirely negative advice and stale with one idea. Here is a chance for a thread that can grow beyond one person’s table top.
I have been keeping an eye on turbo fog since it was first viable in tenth edition and have seen its wax and wane in standard. Though it is widely considered unplayable in modern I belive that its exceptional matchups against agro and ability to respond to other threats makes up for its bad matchups.
Turbo Howling Mine-This is the primary draw effect. Run 4 or you probably are not playing turbo fog. Abundance -While costing a full for to net you no physical card advantage it makes up for it in quality. It prevents you from being drawn out as it replaces your draw, as an added benefit. It is defiantly good enough to warrant consideration as a 1-2 of in a deck with green in it. Jace, Memory Adept-Cost a full 5 but functions to speed up your win significantly. Font of Mythos -Very good but cost 4. How many you run depends on your build. Kami of the Crescent Moon -Only cost two but color intensive. Puts up an ok effort as a blocker but dies to bolt. Very rarely run. Jace Beleren-Vulnerable but can function to draw only you cards and draws a card the turn he comes out. Temple Bell-Cost 3 but you control when the draw happens. Rites of Flourishing- Draws card, and lets you play those lands cluttering up your hand. Accelerates you into being able to play more turbo and thus have more reliable future draws. This card is however very good for our opponents. Mikokoro, Center of the Sea- No initial investment required but requires mana every activation. Still it is a land that does what we want it to.
Angelsong-Acceptably priced and cycling can be used if flooded with fogs. Dawn Charm- Fog that can also stop discard and burn spells. Ethereal Haze-Fogs that cost 1 are very important and this one stops Melira’s combo for a turn. Holy Day-Bread and butter most basic white fog. Angel's Grace-One is not Zero. This has Split Second, stops direct dasmage as well as creature and only cost a single white mana. The problem is that it leaves you in bolt range on the next turn. Pollen Lullaby-Can function as two fogs occasionally, I hear that is good. Riot Control-Cost a full three but can pull you out of the red zone. Safe Passage-Stops direct damage as well as creature damage, best universal prevention. Stonehorn Dignitary-Lets you know ahead of time that creature won’t be swinging, nifty interactions with blinking/creature effects. Cost 4 though. Reverence - If they can still win through it you shouldn’t rely on it. Children of Korlis-You shouldn’t be losing life to have to activate him. Kami of False Hope-Like the name implies he cost 1 and had great recursion capabilities. He can also be killed on your turn. He does beautiful things with Enduring Renewal, but can still be killed during your end step. Chant of Vitu-Ghazi, Endure , Harmless Assault, Chronomantic Escape, Blazing Archon, Knight-Captain of Eos-Cost way too much for the job they wind up doing.
Fog-Namesake of the deck, you surprisingly don’t have to run it. Tanglesap -Cost 2 and there are not very many creatures with trample to worry about coming up against. Blunt the Assault-Can bring you out of the red zone but cost a full 4. Terrifying Presence -If you don’t have a creature this is just bad. Moonmist -Pretty much a standard fog unless you have some interesting deck in your meta. Hindervines -No real reason to run this. Druid's Deliverance-It’s a fog. Defend the Hearth-It’s a fog Clinging Mists-It can function as two fogs. Chameleon -Overcosted fog. Haze Frog- The body could be useful, generally bad.
Batwing Brume-This card can win you the game or bring you very close if you want to win with damage. Casting multiples can take your opponent 20 to Zero. Works best of your opponent does not know about it so hold it until you need to or can win with it. Darkness -It is another 1 cost fog, that is a very important fact.
Ensnaring Bridge-Unfortunately this card has complete negative synergy with our deck. Jace, Architect of Thought-This is not enough protection to keep you alive. Snapcaster Mage-When flashing back a fog it ends up being over costed but in combined use with counterspells the versatility makes him worth it. Cryptic Command-This card is good. Tapping down creatures stops combat at its source. Evacuation-Stops the damage and makes them rebuild Wrath of God and other Destroy all creature effects-These work really well against creature deck and can give you a turn to spend without having to cast a fog.
Win Conditions
In this deck you have the option of three ways to win:
This is the most passive and natural way for a Turbo Fog deck to win. Many of our cards are already drawing them closer to that last card. It has the innate problem that some decks are resilient to this attack plan.
There are two methods to go about this Actively or Passively.
If you decide to actively mill you are including cards specifically with the intent of reducing their library quicker.
Mesmeric Orb-This is a fantastic card that has the highest cards milled more per cost. It fits in with the deck nicely. Archive Trap-Mills a full 13 cards for the low cost of 0. Works great wit Path to Exile Jace, Memory Adept-Functions as both draw and a way to win.
If you choose to passively mill, letting them draw their entire deck, you will fill the slots you would on a win condition on more turbo to make your plays more consistent. The primary problem with this method is time. You must be very familiar with how to play the deck and end your turns shortly after they begin. Nobody wants a tie.
This deck doesn’t really play much in the way of fair creatures, what it does is abuse its existing game plan of surviving to the very late game.
Luminarch Ascension -You can easily go many, many turns without taking damage. Once the Ascension is active 4/4 angles for 1W are pretty efficient and can easily clean up a game with no rush. Celestial Colonnade-Conveniently a duel land and sits dormant until you are ready to use it. Evasion is key. Creeping Tar Pit-Different colors than Colonnade, lower power but completely unblockable. Faerie Conclave/ Inkmoth Nexus/ Blinkmoth Nexus-Very little mana required to activate but wins slower than even your native drawing power but can be there in case you need it, I recommend one of the previous options instead.
A deck that waits forever to do anything and sees its entire deck is the perfect home for combo, although few choose to win this way. Few combo cards do anything for you before they win you the game and can be easily disrupted. There are many, many combos you could run that would do nothing else for the deck(E.g. Mikaeus, the Unhallowed+ Triskelion )
Probably the best combo for this deck is a Mindslaver lock
Mindslaver + Academy Ruins =This is practically a one card combo as it only needs to take up one nonland slot in your deck. Mindslaver itself acts as a very expensive fog, the fact that a combo piece is not a completely dead card is nothing to scoff at. If you so wish further utility with Academy Ruins can be built into the deck. Laboratory Maniac-If they don’t lose that turn you win. Typically considered fragile and unnecessary.
Other Cards
This deck is incredibly wide open with a large variety of playable cards and great variability of colors run, as such there are countless card that could potentially see play in a turbo fog deck. Here are a few of the common ones:
Isochron Scepter-Extraordinary power with equivalent fragility. Is best friends with Silence and counterspells. Mana Leak-If you are running blue any variety of counterspells are well suited to this deck, I mention Mana Leak specifically because it is the one you shouldn’t run. Your opponent will have mana. Another note on counterspells is not to counter anything that can easily be handled by your fogs. Use them to protect your spells and stop their alternate win conditions. Wall of Omens and Omenspeaker-These card that are traditionally great in control do help out this deck by preventing early damage and smoothing draws but are overall lack luster in actual performance. Beast Within-Exceptional removal, if you need it. Pay no mind to the 3/3. Elixir of Immortality -Prevents you from drawing out. Leyline of Sanctity -Stops most everything fogs don’t. Wheel of Sun and Moon-Mill prevention that had your deck end up with an very high percent of fogs to draw into. Time Warp-Lets you build and dig.
Turn 1: Land
Turn 2: Draw. Land. Howling Mine
Turn 3: Draw. Draw. Land. Go.
Sounds bad? It is actually better than you would think. In this deck you don’t care about your life total unless it is zero* so you use your first few turns as a buffer to soak up damage before you have to play fog like effects.
Use more expensive fogs first but hold back things that can prevent direct damage against deck that you know contain such. Always Use Angel’s Grace last, if you are running it.
Finally a topic for this! I've been thinking about this type of deck and why don't run a singleton of Gideon, Champion of Justice.
Very few cards can so singularly win like Gideon (that your opponents can't damage). Be wary of exactly how the fogs you are running read, some only protect you from damage. I will update the primer with him for sure. Speaking of Gideons, Gideon Jura was a powerhouse and staple of Zendikar era Turbo Fog and could still be great in a modern version since there are so few cards that could kill him outright.
Will the soon to come Dakra Mystic be good in this deck archetype?
I could definitely see a control build running the low cost Howling Mine and Kami of the Crescent Moon alongside this. The ability to start drawing cards so early would fit nicely in a creatured version of the deck.
Turbo Fog isn't really fun in Modern. You either will play in a meta with a lot of combo where the deck will be terrible, or you will play in a meta that is heavily creature based and you will always win. The problem with Modern turbo fog is it's a deck that isn't interactive at all, it requires very little decision making, but it takes a very long time to play out a game.
This is a definite problem but there are sideboard solutions. I have won games against tron by simply playing 6+ permanents a turn until they draw themselves out, it was the most difficult win I've ever had with this deck. Tron is by far the worst match-up, every other one can be effectively handles post board.
Turbo Fog isn't really fun in Modern. You either will play in a meta with a lot of combo where the deck will be terrible, or you will play in a meta that is heavily creature based and you will always win. The problem with Modern turbo fog is it's a deck that isn't interactive at all, it requires very little decision making, but it takes a very long time to play out a game.
Decks that are meta dependent are a completely viable option. Turbo Fog aims to win by turn ten and your turns play through very quickly, if you go to time it is on your opponent, which granted is a real risk.
I would ask that comments purely saying this deck is bad please add at least something constructive. People do play this deck, so lets try to give them advice.
Finally there's a dedicated thread for this so I can add my 2cents to the pool.
Let me just say two things right off the bat: 1) I've tested this IRL in a very competitive crowd, 2) I think the deck has the potential to be well positioned if someone can figure out the right build. Here's the decklist I've been testing for a few FNM's.
Before I get too into my wall of text, yes the Gifts sideboard is garbage. Take out the Gifts, Rites, and Iona and add in some number of Pithing Needle, Rest in Peace, and Negate. I tried something cute and it never worked. The other cards in the sideboard are great and I wouldn't change those numbers.
Modern is in a place currently where all decks aside from a select few win through the combat step. Twin, Zoo, Pod (to an extent), Affinity, Bogles, etc. There will undoubted be a reply saying "Yeah, but X, Y, and Z don't win through combat" and that's not quite the point. Turbo-Fog is a metagame deck. This deck faced some top notch players playing known archetypes: R/G Tron, Mono-Red, Tarmo-Twin, Bogle, B/G Rock (no Obliterators), and Bant midrange. Out of 7-8 rounds total I only won a single match, but I won a number of games. It's disheartening but really it came down to my inexperience with playing the deck. If my opponents were not already hating me personally for playing the deck, I would test more. Out of all of them, Tron and Mono-Red are the worst match ups. Both the base Green and base Blue varieties of Tron require lots of sideboard hate for Karn Liberated, Iona, Shield of Emeria, Platinum Angel and Emrakul, the Aeons Torn.
A little bit about the card choices that I feel are important. Hide // Seek (alternatively Memoricide) for the creature problems in R/G or U/W UrzaTron and Negate / Pithing Needle for Karn. The Leylines must be in play Game 2 versus Mono-Red and actually help a lot against G/B's targeted hand disruption and Liliana of the Veil (that ultimate DOES target, and I've had a Lily at 16 counters facing me). I feel very strongly that Swan Song is a 4-of in any Fog deck. The downside is negated entirely by default. Supreme Verdict and Timely Reinforcements act as buffers and resets. Ætherling was always bad, Jace ultimate was always nuts, and Snapcaster Mage is iffy but utilitarian (I would not play more than 2x). The Engineered Explosives in the board was almost entirely in anticipation for Chalice of the Void and Defense Grid.
I think if anyone wants to consider brewing Turbo-Fog they need to make their mind up on their win condition. The decklist I made is split between the mill/draw-them-out strategy and the attack them to 0 strategy. The Colonnades pulled their weight so even with a more Milling oriented deck I'd recommend keeping them in. The next time I pilot this, I'm going for Mill... Jace, Memory Adept is coming into the main over Jace Beleren and I'll add either another Temple Bell or the "Dictate of Kruphix". I think the deck type in general is lacking copies 4x-8x of Howling Mine. Temple Bell and the new Journey into Nyx card are great but slow. That extra 2-drop turbo piece is sorely missing to draw more Fogs or reaction pieces.
TL;DR - So far this deck is losing, but mainly because I'm bad at playing it. There's great potential if the "Draw Go" control shell is tweaked correctly. Play the deck in the right environment. Be aware that people will hate you outright and know when to use the frustration to your advantage in out-playing them.
Yay!!! Someone finally made a primer for my pet deck. I disagree with a comment above about how turbo is bad against combo. Turbo should be T1 in modern in my book. I play turbosmog and it has answers to everything but rouge builds and it's hella fun to play. I'm still trying different win cons. I still don't see what everyone's obsession with trying to play snapcaster. He makes every fog 2 mana more and we aren't rly in the business of chump blocking and since he would normally be the only creature in the deck, all their hate hits him. He's quite useless in turbo as you have so many 1 drop fogs. Also, this deck has plenty of answers to e markup in case someone rly thinks he's an issue. Obviously, those who are naysaying haven't done enough research into the modern card pool.
Ok... so i chose black over green bc i didn't really see green adding all that much since I personally don't want creatures outside of SB options. I also have a soft spot for darkness.... i mean it is the only black fog effect.
Splinter twin:
Usually try to hold up enough mana to fog game one and after a possible counter, use Brume for the win.
Sb: -2 LoS +1 Pithing Needle +1 Nevermore
I dont see LoS as usful and being able to use needle against kiki or the enchanted creature is nice while stopping the other from being cast with nevermore works too. mostly just fog and use Brume wisely
Tron:
G1 is always miserable bc once they hit karn, theres not much i can do. i can fog wurmcoil all day. Emrakul is hard g1 as well.
Sb(and this one is the fun one that i may not be siding correctly):
-2 LoS -1 Font -1 Dreams -1 Visions -3 Brume -2 Verdict +1 Needle +1 D-Sphere +2 O-Ring +1 Nevermore +2 Mage +1 Negate +2 Deprive/Remand
This is the match up i fear the most. My goal really is to stop Karn for the most part and just and draw into Dreams or mill them. O-ring/D-sphere and nevermore/Mage work for both emrakul and karn needle and counters are for karn
Burn:
Usually md LoS does it at some point along with lifegain from elixir and dawn charms 3rd ability.
Sb: - 3 brume - 2 verdict -1 darkness -1 visions +2 Deprive/remand +2 O-Ring +1 Needle +1 LoS +1 Nevermore
No need for visions to hurt me in this match up and not really enough creatures to need as many fogs. Counters stop some burn/Lavamancer (no not negate). O-ring and needle if i see lavamancer to stop him. Nevermore (probably not needed for this MU) to stop any of their spells. LoS is obvious.
Living End:
This can be rough sometimes depending on how many avalanche riders and Fulminators they hit early on and how many lands i hit early on. Otherwise, just fog for days
Sb: -3 LoS -1 Visions -1 Font + 1 Nevermore +2 Mage +2 Crypt
LoS isnt too special and the other two are kinda slow and one hurts us a little. Use nevermore/Mage to stop Living End from being cast. Crypt is obvious. after that, just fog til win
Pod:
Can be annoying with infinite life, but use LoS to avoid being targeted and fog and sorta see what happens and decide if the match is winnable. (again... hard with infinite life)
Sb (not too familiar with playing against this one): -2 Brume -2 Font -1 Visions -2 Verdict +2 Deprive +2 O-Ring +1 D-Sphere +1 Needle +1 Nevermore
Counters to try to stop infinite life. Ring and sphere to stop combos. Needle to stop Pod. Nevermore to stop all the above.
Scapeshift:
LoS usually does it.
Dont really have much for it in the Sb bc ive seen it like once.
UWR Control/midrange (not usually a problem for me but yeah... guess it could be bad; the few ppl ive played against playing this probably werent the most skill intensive):
This MU a lot of ppl tell me they have a hard time with. It can be difficult if they spell snare your T2 Howling Mine but you can normally stock pile fogs and play smart around their counters.
Sb: -2 Brume -1 Visions -1 Verdict +2 Crypt +1 Jace +1 Nevermore
Get rid of snapcaster targets, put a threat in to mill or make use counters, and stop them from playing a threat or stop cryptics
Affinity/Merfolk/Zoo/aggro:
Easiest for us bc we fog all day. Charm can be nice against zoo or red affinity to stop the Helix/Bolt or Galvanic Blast/Shrap blast
Sb: not rly too much (I did have one affinity matchup where he dropped a blood moon and i just simply waited to get enough mana to get enough mana to drop my sb'ed in ulamog and he conceded)
Jund: As awkward as this is, i havent played it... 0.o Dont ask me how but im sure it has made a difference since DrS has been banned. I havent been able to play since the banning of DrS and unbanning of BB
For those who noticed, i dont rly have a MU that i board in Ulamog. Hes sort of a filler but hes also in there in case i feel im playing someone with slaughter games or extirpate after destroying my elixir. Or if i play against a random mill opponent.
Like i said... I have been trying different versions and different win cons. Im not 100 on it yet, but i may go straight u/w and cut black but havent decided yet. If i cut black, id probably put jace md and add in the slaver lock. I kinda want a card that just straight up says "i win" when it hits the table but to me, a lot of the win cons ive tried take to long. Underworld Dreams (UD) takes too long sometimes due to triple black and Luminarch Ascension is cool and all and fits our deck, but it sorta gets destroyed g2 immediately and when they draw a ton, they are likely to hit more than one way to remove our 2nd and 3rd one. There is no real driving force that makes me want to go green. Black has possibilties and has sb options. As for now, its 221 am here so im goin to bed. Feel free to ask away or criticize. Realize ive played turbo since 9th edition. Ive played it heavily. Im by no means the best but ive sure as hell played it a ton and have had some fun and have some experience with it. Ive tried it with silence and Megrim/lilianas caress combo. Ive tried it as bant, esper, b/w, rgw, rug, and uwr. Red was for intimidation bolt and one of the chandras (whichever did 10 dmg) along side ajani vengent and ive tried ajani goldmane. Ive tried it with gideon jura and gideon, champion of justice. Ive played it with beleren, adept, and architect. I tried it with Garruk primal hunter. I tried it recently in standard but i hate standard so i dismantled it since im almost 1000% sure ill never play standard again. I have it proxied up as an angus mackenzie turbofog group-hug edh deck even. haha
I *did* say that pretty much everyone at my store hated me for playing the deck. I have to wait a while for them to forget before bringing it back with a new sideboard and tweaked main deck... probably after the release of JTN. The good news is that my meta has shifted towards U/R Young-Delver and there's only one U/W Tron and one Melira Pod deck left. Should allow for a couple wins if I don't bugger it up again.
I'd say drop the hoofprints and since you're running blue trade out *** for Supreme Verdict and once JiN releases, maybe trade out font for the cheaper blue enchantment. Also, any sb? I also might put story circle into the SB for something else... maybe with removing hoofprints and circle, you can throw in the rule of law/netsuke win con. I think it would be weak to the same removal they would bring in for luminarch. That's the only down fall.
I like spiral but im still personally not sold on green. I love RoF but I hate letting them hit additional land drops. I want to test a different wincon in my list bc sadly UD is too slow and triple black can once in awhile be an issue. Sadly most of the win cons for this deck are enchantments or artifacts which means sbing into a different wincon can be tricky. In your list, the only card for green that intrigues me is voidslime. I personally think mikokoro isn't worth it. How has your list done for you against top tier decks?
Long time TurboFog player, there are some issues I'm seeing with this deck. First, I love TurboFog and have been trying to play it in Modern since Modern was introduced as a format. Excuse my terrible deck names, all the lists will be found at the bottom of the post. When I was first getting into Modern, I was playing my Fogdrazi list in Standard. So, the natural thing to do was to try and port it to Modern. What I ended up with was my Farming list. It ended up almost being a direct port with some direct upgrades (DoJ -> ***, Tanglesnap -> Holy Day, etc). It performed okay as the meta was heavily saturated by Tron decks. All I had to do was Beast Within key lands to stall them, then play Memoricide to neuter Emrakul. Once the eldrazi was gone, I could fog their wurms all day. However, the meta shifted and the rise of Jund began. At the time, I had taken a break from Turbo Fog, but decided to give it another go. I don't remember too well my thought process during this time or specific deck lists, but I do remember running up against certain archetypes that were difficult to play against. Burn killed me. Often, I'd lose game 1 unless I found a Leyline fast enough to stabilize. In game 2 I'd mulligan till I had an opening Leyline, but they'd side in enchantment removal (as running Leyline of Sanctity was a fairly common strat) and I'd help them draw it. To deal with this, I dropped a few fogs for couple Safe Passage which I later updated to Riot Control. TylerStegman is very confident in TurboFog's abilities, yet he didn't play against the archetype that singlehandedly killed TurboFog for me. Jund is TurboFog's hard counter. In its heyday, when it dominated the Top8 spots and ran DRS, TurboFog COULD NOT win. You play a Rite of Flourishing, they gain massive tempo by drawing an extra card, playing an extra land, then Abrupt Decaying it so you wasted your turn. Try to Fog their Tarmogoyf? DRS eats it EOT and deals unpreventable damage to you. Manage to deal with DRS? Bolt to the dome. The entire Jund playlist was exactly what we didn't want to play against. For the several months that Jund ruled, I moved onto other decks and let TurboFog fall to the wayside. Since DRS's banning, I haven't tried rebuilding TurboFog. The discussion here is encouraging, but I don't think TurboFog will be the same as it was in early Modern or other formats. The fact that so many decks in the format have access to artifact and enchantment removal early on, and even more so thanks to Theros, means that it is very easy to break us turn 1, which is our favored game. Because Fog only halts creature based attacks, they still have their turn to operate, which means that they have a pretty big window of opportunity to throw a wrench at our plans. However, one "fog" decklist has popped up that addresses this issue and looks very promising. Time Traveler's Mill, Takin' Turns, or my favorite name for it, TurboTime, is TurboFog's spiritual successor. It plays almost identically to TurboFog but is far more consistent and far less interactive. I don't want to derail discussion from this thread, but I think that deck is the next stage of evolution for this archetype. It's already 4-0'd a few MTGO dailies, which is more than TurboFog has done recently. Just worth considering. Anyway, I look forward to seeing what you guys come up with and would love to see TurboFog enter the limelight once again. Again I desire to drink my opponents tears and watch them rage as they lose a 30 minute G1 and are forced to draw a long G2, allowing us to advance in the bracket. I plan to give TylerStegman's list a try as it looks more suited to address the current meta than my old lists.
There are so many ways to beat burn. I'm confident that the deck can beat burn. First off, being a burn player, the deck has died and and lost its flare. On top of that, most burn lists will have 4 ways to deal with leyline. Then they have to deal with elixir continuously gaining you life which most burn decks has but it's an odds of them having everything type of thing. If burn was played heavier, I would listen to your argument about it more but it's not... so sb/md haven't been tweaked for that. It's more made for what actual sees a lot of play. Secondly, Idt anyone who has played turbofog long enough to know how to run it has brought it to a big event. This would be your reasoning for not placing and in the beginning of modern, burn was played more heavily. I think once turbo has a good list and a way to win faster than it currently does, there's no reason the deck shouldn't be able to hang with the best of them as long as the pilot is competent. My issue is that there isn't really a way turbo wins on the spot. And you can use the "everyone runs hate" argument, but then why play magic? Oh this creature sucks bc it dies to removal... oh that deck sucks because it's win con get destroyed by removal... come on... it's a matter of luck to some extent and there's always ways to get around that excuse imho.
And you can use the "everyone runs hate" argument, but then why play magic? Oh this creature sucks bc it dies to removal... oh that deck sucks because it's win con get destroyed by removal... come on... it's a matter of luck to some extent and there's always ways to get around that excuse imho.
I think you missed the point of what I said and I'm not sure if I'm doing a good job of explaining it. The deck NEEDS Howling Mine effects to function, they're necessary. If we don't get them, we will lose 99% of the time. The format has very easy access to artifact and enchantment removal and many decks run some form of it in mainboard. Any time we play a Mine effect, they will gain tempo by simply destroying it, which is different from the "dies to removal" argument since the Howling Mines aren't our win con, they're our bread and butter. Now, this argument wouldn't be a big deal if the deck could win quickly or become hard to interact with, but frankly, we give the opponent tons of extra draws to help them find the pieces they need to kill our draw engine and the time they need to actual do it. I know you said your issue is that the deck doesn't win on the spot, and I agree, but I'd go a step farther and say that the deck isn't viable until that happens.
Well I guess where you're from ppl like to do that but in the 4 or 5 Yrs of playing this deck, 1 person has destroyed a font of Mythos and one person has countered a Howling mine. Other wise, they leave them alone bc they gain sooooooooooo much from them. I've never rly had any problems with ppl not letting the draw effects stick. I had multiple games in the past where my opponent and I were drawing 13 cards each turn. And with ways to shuffle them back in, it's not hard to find them again and we have plenty of ways to draw into multiples and I run enough fogs plus verdict that I have time to find one if it isn't in my opening hand
Thats the interesting thing about TurboFog, it will randomly just win. The new Time Warp deck is interesting but fairly easy to hate out. Especially when you start fighting against Choke out of the sideboard + discard and SExtractions. I think there will always be a place for TurboFog but you just have to find the right win conditions and metagame. As it is right now, I am not sure if the meta really demands a deck like this or ... really needs something like this. But if I were to play the deck, I have run this in the past and it has always been a total animal when no one is prepared for it, I ran something along these lines:
Very simple but incredibly effective. The problem is that it just takes SO LONG to win a game, but you can lock the hell out of them. I do agree that they will rarely kill your draw effects but it does happen. And in the case that they do ... you are just basically playing the old Snow-White deck which is not that bad in itself. Twin and Pod are not ideal matchups nor is Tron so ... I don't see this being a major contender. Its a cool deck but honestly I think I would rather just play the Time Warp deck for time purposes, it at least has the capabilities of winning on turns 4-6 even though it is easily disrupted. I just thought I would throw in my .02
The win con really is what stops this deck. I agree it takes a lil long to win. I'm thinking about switching to w/u/g and even though it gives the opponent a lot of advantage, adding rites of flourishing to run the slaver lock and hit 10 lands faster but I feel it will just get countered. I'm wondering if running aloctors and something like graves would work and just win with the filibuster counters. Haha. Idk. I haven't liked Ascension as the win con and it's probably the fastest win con. I'm still testing win cons still. I still think my favorite win con is running silence and Megrim/lilianas caress
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—Ezuri, renegade leader
(Magic 2014 Core Set: Fog)
What is Turbo Fog?
Turbo Fog is a deck that believes that not losing is much more important than winning. By playing universal efficient draw (Turbo) and Fog-like effects this deck buys time to win in whatever method the builder chooses.
Why play Turbo Fog?
The most popular way to win a game of magic is by creature combat damage. Wouldn’t it be nice to have a deck that had a very good matchup against any deck with that plan A? Do you like to invalidate everything your opponent is doing? Do you enjoy drawing lots of cards? Do you want to see your entire deck every game? Want consistency like a burn deck but don’t want to race? Want a cheap deck?
This is that deck.
Why shouldn’t you play Turbo Fog?
This deck requires you to play fast or you will go to time.
If you don’t like decks that could play themselves and you want something risky and challenging, well we got the risky part down. This deck is very good against a metagame with lots of creatures/aggro stuff. The most difficult current matchups for this deck are Tron, Control and Burn (not necessarialy in that order).
If you like attacking your opponent, this is probably not for you.
Why did I make this Primer?
Turbo fog pops up in deck creation once or twice a year. Every time they will get yelled at that there is already a thread for Turbo Fog. Thing is these threads are pretty horrible with entirely negative advice and stale with one idea. Here is a chance for a thread that can grow beyond one person’s table top.
I have been keeping an eye on turbo fog since it was first viable in tenth edition and have seen its wax and wane in standard. Though it is considered unplayable in modern I believe that its exceptional matchups against aggro and ability to respond to other threats makes up for its bad matchups.
Typical Turbo Fog builds go W/U/x, "x" being black or green, and more recently Red. U/G variants have seen some play as well, and even mono W versions. That's why I'm separating all cards by colors and CMC here.
Most decks play something near 15/17 fogs, 10/13 Draw engines, 22/24 lands and the rest is filled with flex slots, typically win conditions, spot removal, board wipers, graveyard recursion (elixir of immortality for instance), Leyline of sanctity, etc.
Turbo The engines that power this deck.
Mikokoro, Center of the Sea - No initial investment required but requires mana every activation. Still it is a land that does what we want it to. If your manabase allows it, play a singleton at least since it's legendary.
Desolate lighthouse - More expensive to trigger as well as color restrictive, and it also discards us a card. It's not legendary and that may be relevant, but it's still not better than Mikokoro.
Sea gate wreckage - We're supposed to be drawing a plethora of cards each turn, so this one only would work on emergencies.
Geier reach sanitarium - It could have some potential as a nerfed version of Mikokoro, center of the sea, being playable as a second copy which wouldn't destroy the other one (legendary rule). But card filters are mostly useful late game only. :rate 2.5:
Dakra mystic – “Choices are rarely as simple as they seem”, the top deck manipulation is cool, but requires each activation. Also, really soft to removal.
Howling Mine-This is the primary draw effect as it's the only noncreature 2cmc on modern. Run 4 or you probably are not playing turbo fog.
Kami of the Crescent Moon -Only cost two but color intensive. Puts up an ok effort as a blocker but dies to bolt. Very rarely run, as we don't tend to run lots of creatures. Maybe as a sideboard alternative once your opponent realizes their creature removal is pointless here. Or even on a more creature-heavy build.
Fevered Visions- Possibly the most relevant card WOTC gave us in the last months/years. First, you get the first draw (just make sure you remember to make room on your hand for when the draw happens, otherwise you’ll be discarding EOT), second, it acts as a legit win condition which is not really hard to trigger (only 4 cards in hand). So it’s basically like putting an improved howling mine together with a less efficient (2 damage instead of 4) but more accessible (4 cards instead of 7) ebony owl netsuke.
A no-Brainer if you’re willing to splash red on your build, as it opens up a couple slots on your deck by filling the roles of draw engine/wincon at the same time.
Temple Bell- Typically a core card in some number on most versions as it colorless. Controlling when the draw happens is really useful at times.
Jace Beleren-Vulnerable to burn, don’t really care about creatures as we’re supposed to prevent damage anyway, sometimes you want to keep some fogs for yourself and keeping it alive is a cost some can't afford. Draws a card the turn it comes out, and it’s not really unusual to get to activate its ultimate, so it also works as a win condition. Gets better with Leyline of sanctity out as it won’t be hit by burn. Its second ability may be useful at times too. can be restrictive though.
Dictate of kruphix - As the double blue can be a bit tricky at times, the fact that it has flash can be determinant as you can keep some more mana open just in case until your opponent's end of turn. Basically a good choice against control decks, as if they want to counter it, they’ll be forced to do it on their own turn. Also, you get the first draw if casted on your opponent's EOT.
Monastery Siege – It’s not as efficient as other draw engines but the card filtering Is OK and it's one sided . Otherwise use it for protection, your opponent will realize casting that Abrupt Decay for 4 isn’t that appealing now, or that his/her burn spells aren’t as “hot” as before.
Rites of Flourishing- Draws card, and lets you play those lands cluttering up your hand. Accelerates you into being able to play more turbo and thus have more reliable future draws. This card is however very good for our opponents as it ramps them too. Core in green builds.
Phyrexian Arena One sided draw engine, but that 1 damage can be lethal, as we mostly survive at the edge of life. Also, that means we're not milling our opponent.
Font of Mythos -It's like 2 howling mines in one card, proportionally. But that also means a single Destructive Revelry hits 2 howling mines now.
Abundance -While costing a full four to net you no physical card advantage it makes up for it in quality. It prevents you from being drawn out as it replaces your draw, as an added benefit. It is defiantly good enough to warrant consideration as a 1-2 of in a deck with green in it.
Jace, Memory Adept-Cost a full 5 but functions to speed up your win significantly.
Alhammarret's archive- Expensive, and unnecessary. Maybe better if you play some amount of life gain or something.
Oracle's Insight, Otherworld Atlas, Righteous Authority, Seer's Sundial, Staff of Nin , Teferi's Puzzle Box, Mindmoil, Mindstorm Crown , Immortal Coil, Archmage Ascension
I have seen each of these cards in assorted turbo Fog lists. While this is a cheap deck please do not run every junk rare in your binder because it reads draw.
Fogs What keeps us in the game.
Ethereal Haze-Strictly better than the other 1cmc fogs as it prevents ALL damage dealt by creatures, not only combat damage.
Holy Day-Bread and butter most basic white fog.
Angel's Grace-One is not Zero. This has Split Second, stops direct damage as well as creature damage, tricky combos such as Hive Mind plus pact of negation and the other future sight pacts, and only cost a single white mana. The problem is that it leaves you in bolt range on the next turn.
Kami of False Hope - He costs 1 and has great recursion capabilities. He can also be killed on your turn. He does beautiful things with Enduring Renewal, but can still be killed during your end step.
Children of Korlis- It works as some kind of fog, but you shouldn’t be losing life to have to activate him.
Angelsong-Acceptably priced and cycling can be used if flooded with fogs.
Dawn Charm- Fog that can also stop discard and burn spells. Flexibility is what makes it a core card.
Batwing Brume-This card can win you the game or bring you very close if you want to win with damage. Casting multiples can take your opponent 20 to Zero. Works best of your opponent does not know about it so hold it until you need to or can win with it. If you’re not playing black it just a 2CMC fog though. if playing black, if not.
Pollen Lullaby-Can function as two fogs occasionally, as well as scrying 1 and revealing your opponent potential next draw. I hear that is good.
Repel the abominable- Good as it prevents all sorts of damages, unless you're facing humans..
Safe Passage-Stops direct damage as well as creature damage. It doesn’t prevent your planeswalkers from being hurt though.
Riot Control-Same as Safe Passage, but it doesn’t prevent damage dealt to creatures. On the other hand, it can pull you out of the red zone depending on how many critters are there. Mostly an upgrade of Safe Passage on this deck as we don’t really care about damage dealt to our dudes.
Encircling fissure - Unefficient for what it does, and having a 2/2 isn't really a big deal.
Chronomantic escape – Overcosted, but if you get to chain 3 in different turns, creatures won’t attack you anymore. It also stops eldrazi’s annihilator. Having a free (upgraded) fog every 3 turns shouldn’t be that bad. Unfortunately, typically we can't afford to wait 3 turns.
Stonehorn Dignitary-Lets you know ahead of time that creature won’t be swinging, nifty interactions with blinking/creature effects. Costs 4 though.
Comeuppance - While is high on CMC, it has some serious flexibility. It doesn't only prevent any kind of damage, but it hurts back, making it a potential board wiper or even a win condition.
Reverence - If they can still win through it you shouldn’t rely on it.
Chant of Vitu-Ghazi, Endure , Harmless Assault, Blazing Archon, Knight-Captain of Eos, channel harm -Cost way too much for the job they wind up doing.
Fog-Namesake of the deck, you don’t have to run it if you’re not playing green though.
Respite- Probably the best green 2CMC fog we can get on green due to lifegain, unless they reprint moment's peace or tangle .
Druid's Deliverance-It’s a fog.
Defend the Hearth-It’s a fog
Tanglesap - Beware of trample dudes.
Terrifying Presence -If you don’t have a creature this is just bad.
Moonmist -Pretty much a standard fog unless you have some interesting deck in your meta.
Blunt the Assault-Can bring you out of the red zone but cost a full 4.
Hindervines -No real reason to run this.
Clinging Mists-It can eventually function as two fogs.
Hunter's Ambush- Unless you're playing some green folks, this just sucks.
Revealing wind - Yet another green overcosted fog which does nothing else for us.
Vine snare- See above.
Chameleon blur -Overcosted fog.
Haze Frog- The body could be useful, generally bad.
Darkness -It is another 1 CMC fog, that is a very important fact, specially against control, during counterspells wars.
Intimidation bolt - Really good if you're splashing red. Can get rid of some pesky critter and prevent them from attacking. A tad expensive though, but against certain decks totally worths it. It also prevents attack triggers such as annihilator or the new eldrazis ones'.
This is the most passive and natural way for a Turbo Fog deck to win. Many of our cards are already drawing them closer to that last card. It has the innate problem that some decks are resilient to this attack plan.
There are two methods to go about this Actively or Passively.
If you decide to actively mill you are including cards specifically with the intent of reducing their library quicker. You can have some permanents to do that such as:
Altar of the brood – Can be casted as early as turn 1 and ANY permanent hitting the board triggers it. We don’t run lots of permanents but opponents typically do. Can speed the mill a bit. Might worth consideration.
Mesmeric Orb – This is a fantastic card that has the highest cards milled more per cost. It fits in with the deck nicely.
Grindclock – Kinda slow, but can grow over time.
Sphinx's Tutelage - Possibly our best mill wincon right now as it synergises really well with the amount of cards we draw per turn, speeding up the mill.
Jace, Memory Adept - Functions as both draw and a way to win. Probably expensive though.
Jace Beleren - We don't always get to activate its ultimate, but when we do it can be lethal. If you can protect him from burn spells, it’s basically a sorcery speed temple bell with a potential finisher.
Or the typical U/B Mill sorceries/instants.
Archive Trap-Mills a full 13 cards for the low cost of 0. Works great wit Path to Exile, fetchlands, ghost quarter, etc.
Glimpse the unthinkable - One of the most efficient mill spells right now.
Psychic spiral- Getting all those fogs and permanents back to our deck AND milling our opponent sounds sweet. A tad expensive though.
Mind Funeral – Sometimes is a bit tricky, but can be a beast against decks with lots of fetches/manaramp.
This deck doesn’t really play much in the way of fair creatures, what it does is abuse its existing game plan of surviving to the very late game. Most versions go creatureless in order to blank the opponent’s removal, some others add creatures on game 2 as they have probably sided out they removal, and some play some manlands , which also help fix the manabase.
Luminarch Ascension -You can easily go many, many turns without taking damage. Once the Ascension is active 4/4 angles for 1W are pretty efficient and can easily clean up a game with no rush.
Assemble the legion- Just throw it there, and watch it grow until you outnumber your opponent. Then just proceed to win.
Celestial Colonnade-Conveniently a dual land and sits dormant until you are ready to use it. Evasion is key.
Creeping Tar Pit-Different colors than Colonnade, lower power but completely unblockable. Doesn't pass the bolt test though.
Faerie Conclave/ Inkmoth Nexus/ Blinkmoth Nexus-Very little mana required to activate but wins slower than even your native drawing power but can be there in case you need it, I recommend one of the previous options instead.
Emrakul, the aeons torn/Ulamog, the infinite gyre/Kozilek, butcher of truth - Some players run one of them as a singleton as they help getting the fogs/destroyed permanents back to the deck while discarded. Possibly the best option is to run the cheaper ones so you have higher chances of hardcasting it (not that it happens too often).
Psychosis Crawler – Its body relies on your hand size, which typically will be full, but the interesting part is that it deals damage anytime we draw a card, and we draw a lot.
Ebony owl netsuke – It isn’t really hard to trigger, but it probably gets better with bounce spells like boomerang, vapor snag, remand or unsubstantiate.
Runeflare Trap - It's not really hard to pay its alternative mana cost, since we just need 2 draw engines to make that happen, if they play serum visions or sth it's even easier. Dealing 7 to 10 damage for R on our's opponent draw step is certainly fun and mostly unexpected.
Underworld dreams - A Psychosis Crawler without the body, which can be an advantage as decks don’t typically run as much enchantment removal as they do with creature removal. :symb::symb::symb: can be hard to pay though.
Nahiri, the harbinger - If you're splashing :symr:, turbo fog provides a nice shell for playing and protecting nahiri, and some builds already pack an eldrazi for reshuffling cards into the library, so Emrakul, the aeons torn is playable. Also her abilities fit really well with the theme of the deck, providing card filtering, destroying problematic stuff, or... well, casting an Emrakul/Ulamog/Kozilek or whatever you have in mind.
Ob Nixilis Reignited – Really cool planeswalker which is kind of a toolbox. Allows us to draw a card at the cost of 1 life, we can destroy one of those pesky creature/biggies that are bothering us, and finally, finish them with its ultimate.
Gideon Jura – Hey, they’ll be attacking him and not us. Really cool “bodyguard” which also can be used for creature removal and as a finisher.
Staff of nin – It functions as a turbo and as some slow wincon. Probably expensive for what it does though.
Those planeswalkers are probably the ones that have more synergy with the deck. Some players choose to run some others instead, as Elspeth, sun’s champion, Kiora, the crashing wave, etc.
A deck that waits forever to do anything and sees its entire deck is the perfect home for combo, although few choose to win this way. Few combo cards do anything for you before they win you the game and can be easily disrupted. There are many, many combos you could run that would do nothing else for the deck(E.g. Mikaeus, the Unhallowed+ Triskelion ).
Mindslaver + Academy Ruins =This is practically a one card combo as it only needs to take up one nonland slot in your deck. Mindslaver itself acts as a very expensive fog, the fact that a combo piece is not a completely dead card is nothing to scoff at. Academy ruins can help bringing back destroyed/milled/discarded stuff like temple bell and howling mine.
Duskmantle guildmage +Mindcrank – Janky combo which happens to inflict infinite damage + infinite mill, and at best can be pulled off on turn 4. Still, you’ll need something to trigger it... and to protect it.
Some versions also run Maze’s end as a wincon, as well as playing the full array of lands needed to do so. Problem is the lands slow things down a turn, and a single Blood Moon can totally hose the deck. Also is kinda difficult to pull the right lands to activate the wincon. The upside is that you’ll have access to ANY spell you want as you’ll be playing 5 colors. Rites of flourishing may help speed up things a bit.
Other honorable mentions which mostly require dedicating some cards in order to become real threats include Azor’s elocutors (typically fragile), Darksteel reactor (slow) and Helix Pinnacle (slow).
Other Cards Stuff people actually include on their lists.
This deck is incredibly wide open with a large variety of playable cards and great variability of colors run, as such there are countless card that could potentially see play in a turbo fog deck. Here are a few of the common ones:
Isochron Scepter-Extraordinary power with equivalent fragility. Is best friends with Silence and counterspells.
Elixir of Immortality - A must in my opinion, at least as a singleton as it prevents you from drawing out, gets your fogs back to the deck and provides some life gain as well. Notice that as the turns go by, your deck will likely have less lands and permanents on it, so shuffling back the fogs will mean having higher chances of getting at least one on your draws. If you don't want to pay the mana cost or want something different, just play an eldrazi.
Forbidden Orchard – If you’re having issues with your manabase, consider this. Who cares about 1 million tokens, when you’re preventing the whole damage?
Jester’s Cap – Extraction spells can help us counter non-creature wincons, combo pieces, removal or anything that can screw us. This is possibly the best option if you’re not playing black.
Boseiju, who shelters all – Counterspell prevention. Be careful about this one as you’ll be losing life anyway.
Reliquary Tower - May have some potential, specially against control as they can outnumber our fogs with counterspells at times. Make sure you find a way to throw some cards back into your deck so you don't get auto-milled.
Academy ruins – Helps you bring back your Howling mines from the graveyard. Also some versions use it along with Mindslaver for combo.
Negate/Mana Leak/ Dispel/ Swan song-If you are running blue, any variety of counterspells are well suited to this deck, in order to handle various threats and other counterspells. Another note on counterspells is not to counter anything that can easily be handled by your fogs. Use them to protect your spells and stop their non-combat damage win conditions. Notice that Swan Song gets better here as those birds shouldn’t be a trouble to us.
Snapcaster Mage-When flashing back a fog it ends up being over costed but in combined use with counterspells the versatility makes him worth it.
Cryptic Command-This card is good. Tapping down creatures stops combat at its source. Really versatile, and equally costly for our standards.
Evacuation/Aetherspouts, etc - Blue wraths get even more interesting with runeflare trap, megrim, ebony owl netsuke or anything that punishes your opponent for having lots of cards in hand.
Wall of Omens - Traditionally great in control do help out this deck by preventing early damage and smoothing draws but are overall lack luster in actual performance.
Leyline of Sanctity - Stops almost everything fogs don’t. 4 copies is a must, at least on the sideboard.
Wheel of Sun and Moon – See Elixir of Immortality . Otherwise, it can be used as graveyard hate tech.
Wrath of God and other wrath effects-These work really well against creature deck and can give you a turn to spend without having to cast a fog.
Oblivion Ring Single target removable removal. Not much to add.
Beast Within-Exceptional removal, if you need it. Pay no mind to the 3/3.
Supreme verdict - Basically, a Day of judgement which can't be countered. Key against control decks.
Narset Trascendent – Its first ability can help us get one more draw per turn. The second one is probably useless as rebound triggers at the beginning of our upkeep, the only exceptions I can think of are extraction spells and board wipers, but if you find an use for it, go ahead and try it. The last one might mean game for us.
Detention Sphere - Typically better than oblivion ring, until you have to get rid of another detention sphere...
Anguished unmaking – Really good removal if you went with :symb:, losing 3 life can be the difference between surviving a lightning bolt or not though.
As always this section relies on the metagame you’re into and the colors you play of course. Probably our worst matchups right now are Tron (any variant), Burn, and control (anything with counterspells) so you might consider that as a start.
Swan Song/negate/spell pierce/dispel/Remand/Mana leak, etc – Counterspells are always a good choice if you’re playing blue, in general terms. Our focus should be non-creature spells naturally, and trying to include hard-counters with low CMC for counterspell battles against control decks. Some decks play a high number of those, getting closer to an UW control list at times, nearly making it a transformational sideboard.
Leyline of Sanctity - Prevents burn, discard, direct damage, among others. If you’re not running 4 mainboard already, include them on the sideboard.
Nevermore /Meddling mage – You can cast it on anything, combo pieces, planeswalkers, Eidolon of the great revel (which hoses us really bad), Cryptic Command , etc. The real deal is to know what to name.
Pithing needle –Silver bullet mostly against planeswalkers, but can disrupt some other stuff as well like oblivion stone, engineered explosives, ratchet bomb, etc. Being colorless, and at the affordable price of 1CMC is key.
Tormod’s crypt/Rest in peace/ Leyline of the void/ Relic of progenitus/grafdigger’s cage –Graveyard hate, Shut those Snapcaster Mages, prevent Emrakul’s shuffle ability by removing him so you can proceed to mill, get rid of any reanimator deck, etc. Some players play rest in peace as is more straight-forward and requires no activation, and some others go for one-sided options as relic of progenitus, which allows them to recur their fogs through elixir of immortality, emrakul, the aeons torn, etc.
Elixir of Immortality, or old eldrazis (emrakul, the aeons torn, ulamog, the infinite gyre, kozilek, butcher of truth) – Use these to reshuffle all your stuff back to you library, avoiding auto-mill and letting you cast all your fogs back again.
Extirpate/Surgical extraction/Memoricide/Praetor’s Grasp/Haunting echoes/Sadistic Sacrament/Cranial Extraction/Infinite Obliteration – If you’re playing black, don’t hesitate about including these combo disrupters/problematic cards’ wiper. They’re pretty much like a Nevermore but they can’t be hit by removal. If black isn’t what you’re into, then better try Jester’s Cap instead.
Runed Halo– Stops damage from anything leyline of sanctity or the fogs don’t, such as Eidolon of the great revel, which is a top tier public enemy of this deck.
Story circle – Pretty much like Runed Halo, but can get wider, depending on what you’re facing. Remember to save mana for it though.
Detention Sphere/Oblivion ring – Silver bullets for troublesome permanents. Sphere is strictly better on most situations. Being removable is an issue at times.
Timely reinforcements/Rest for the weary/Sanctimony/Dragon’s claw/ kor firewalker – Some players choose to gain life as an answer to fast decks such as burn. Those are just some common examples.
Stony silence – The first card you want to include as artifact hate, it’s really needed on our Tron matchup as well, stopping their board wipers and eggs.
Aura of silence – Another artifact inhibitor, which can eventually destroy one. It does the same to enchantments as well. Remember Eidolon of the great revel is an enchantment when facing burn.
Bribery – This is our best bet against Tron. Survive until you can cast this, steal their Ulamog/Emrakul and give them a taste of their own medicine. It becomes less relevant against decks without biggies, but remember Nahiri, the harbinger decks are tier stuff now, as well as through the breach decks.
Monastery Siege – Protects your stuff from removal and yourself from burn/discard, otherwise just filters your draws.
Angel’s grace – useful against ad nauseam, and hive mind decks which fortunately aren’t that popular now with the ban of summer bloom.
Suppression Field – A really wide option which can slow down a plethora of things like planeswalkers, artifacts, sac outlets, and even ad nauseam’s lightning storm. Don’t forget this applies to your own temple bells as well.
Eyes of the wisent – At fisrt glance, it seems helpful against control. If they counter your fogs/turbo engines, at least you get a 4/4 elemental.
Vexing Shusher/Grand Abolisher – Again, control hate tech, we can’t play stuff like Defense Grid as it hurts us too. Those critters seem fine, but they are very vulnerable to removal.
Teferi, mage of zhalfir – Another possible answer to control, overcosted, but the flash ability may make him castable EOT.
Crypt incursion – You may want this card if you’re actively milling your opponent. Graveyard hate + lifegain? Oh yeah!
Witchbane orb/Ivory mask/True Believer – Budget replacements for Leyline of sanctity.
Turn 1: Land
Turn 2: Draw. Land. Howling Mine
Turn 3: Draw. Draw. Land. Go.
Sounds bad? It is actually better than you would think. In this deck you don’t care about your life total unless it is zero so you use your first few turns as a buffer to soak up damage before you have to play fog like effects.
Just don't cast your fogs until you see your opponent can swing for lethal. Be careful about being on lightning bolt/burn spells range though.
Remember you're giving your opponent the chance to explore his whole deck (or a big part of it) as well thanks to the draw rocks, which may help him find his removal pieces or whatever they use for ruining us, so don't matter if your opponent is just swinging and swinging with his/her critters only to get lost in the fog with no results, don't take anything for granted and try to cast your wincons ASAP. You don't win the game until the other player's life is 0, or he can't draw a card when he's supposed to (or he gets 10 poison counters, or when a card says so, I know...).
The rule here seems to be "The odds for turbo fog to win are directly proportional to the number of creatures in the opponent's deck".
But let's take an in-depth look at it.
Affinity
Game 1: should be an easy deal, having to concern only about galvanic blast.
Games 2/3: still easy, but watch out for their removal, counterspells and chalice of the void.
MVPs: Any fog, but specially Dawn Charm can stop their burn. Repel the abominable does the same as well.
Burn
Bad matchup in general terms, let’s see.
Game 1: If you packed 4x Leyline of sanctity and got one on turn 0, you’ll realize it’s easier to win once you’ve blanked 19 of their cards. Creatures should be no issue, and they usually don’t pack mainboard removal. In this scenario, the only cards which really could hurt us are Eidolon of the great revel and atarka’s command, which you shouldn’t overlook at all.
Now, if you don’t get the turn 0 leyline, that’s when you drop a smoke bomb to the floor and run the hell outta there it’ll get really hard to win, dawn charm being our only real protection against spells. Repel the abominable could work as well, but keep in mind monastery swiftspear and grim lavamancer are humans.
Game 2/3: Those will depend on how much dedicated is your sideboard towards this matchup.
Some good card choices apart from Leyline of sanctity are runed halo, kor firewalker, and the aforementioned lifegain spells.
Stuff like deflecting palm and lightning helix might worth consideration if you’re splashing .
In addition to the stuff from game 1, be aware of their removal and skullcrack.
MVPs: Leyline of sanctity and Dawn Charm
Jund
If something characterizes Jund, is that it has fair matchups against almost every deck, and we’re not the exception here.
In general terms your main worry should be finding a way to keep your draw engines alive, since they pack a lot of disruptive stuff.
Game 1: If you have a turn 0 leyline, that’ll blank their grim lavamancer, lightning bolt, inquisition of kozilek, thoughtseize, kolaghan’s command (actually it could kill a howling mine or a temple bell, but we’re disabling the burn/discard modes) and liliana of the veil’s ultimate, being something between 15 to 17 cards blanked at once with only one card, and keep in mind their terminate already has no use against us, becoming 18-20 useless cards in their hand. That’d certainly improve the matchup. So, the cards we should worry about are abrupt decay and maelstrom pulse. They typically play 2 of each mainboard, but that might be enough at times to cut our fog-flow and eventually win through combat damage. Especially maelstrom pulse can be troublesome if you played 2 or 3 copies of the same draw engine, so keep that in mind when you’re deciding what to play next.
Game 2/3: Those will get a tad harder, since they’ll be probably bringing more hate towards our draw engines. Bring out leyline If you’re not playing 4 mainboard already, and stuff to protect your stuff, like nevermore, monastery siege or counterspells.
Extraction spells like memoricide could be useful as well if you’re into :symb:.
MVPs: Leyline of Sanctity
Infect
If you don’t win this one, then you’ll probably have to reconsider your decklist… or playing magic.
Game 1: Easy deal, fog only lethal damage, keeping some mana opened from turn 3 onwards. The only cards to worry about are viridian corrupter and spell pierce, which are typically singleton.
Games 2/3: Pretty much the same, but also keep an eye on nature’s claim and dispel. Board out the leylines, and bring in runed halos, creature removal if you have any, and/or counterspells.
MVP: The whole deck is designed to play against this kind of stuff, so anything goes.
Jeskai Harbinger
Merfolk
Dredge
Bant Eldrazi
Zooicide/Suicide Zoo
G/R Tron - G/x Tron
Grixis Control
Ad Nauseam
Death & Taxes
Abzan Midrange/Junk/BGw Souls/BG Rock
Zoo
Abzan Company
RG Eldrazi
Kiki Chord/Kiki Company/Kiki Evolution
Grixis Delver
RUG Scapeshift
G/W Auras a.k.a. Bogles
Living End
Mono Value Control a.k.a Azorius Titan
UWR Control
MartyrProc
Lantern Control
BW Tokens
Dredgevine
Mono G Devotion
Goblins
Suicide Zoo
Mono U Tron
8 Rack
UWR Control
UB/x Faeries
Assault Loam
Loam Pox
UWR Midrange
UWR Control
UB Tezzeret control
GW Hatebears
Skred Red
Temur/Tarmo (RUG) Twin
Abzan Liege/Wilted Abzan/Liege Rhino
Time Walk
RG Breach
Esper Draw-Go
Grishoalbrand/Griselbrand Reanimator/Goryo's Vengeance
WUR Delver
Ascendancy Storm/UR Storm
Possibility Storm Combo
Stompy
Azorius Midrange
4C Gifts
UWR Jeskai Ascendency Combo/Control
BW Midrange "Deadguy Ale"
Sultai Control
Soul Sisters
Restore Balance
Cruel Control
UW Tron
UB Tron
RW Norin
UR Delver
Monkey Grow (RUG Delver)
UBx Mill
UR Blood Moon/Shackles Control
Esper Midrange
Bant Company
UWR Twin
Decklists
To be added as they are submitted.
Updated 4/7/14
6x Forest
4x Sunpetal Grove
2x Mikokoro, Center of the Sea
8x Plains
4x Temple Garden
Draw
4x Font of Mythos
4x Howling Mine
4x Temple Bell
2x Abundance
4x Rites of Flourishing
4x Angel's Grace
4x Fog
4x Holy Day
2x Pollen Lullaby
4x Safe Passage
4x Faerie Macabre
3x Heroes' Reunion
4x Leyline of Sanctity
4x Relic of Progenitus
Updated 10/12/15
4 Ethereal Haze
1 Holy Day
2 Dawn Charm
4 Safe Passage
4 Riot Control
Turbo
4 Howling Mine
3 Dictate of Kruphix
4 Rites of Flourishing
2 Temple Bell
Wincon/utility:
1 Jester's Cap
3 Leyline of Sanctity
4 Sphinx's Tutelage
3 Ghost Quarter
1 Boseiju, Who Shelters All
4 Glacial Fortress
2 Sunpetal Grove
3 Hinterland Harbor
1 Forest
5 Island
5 Plains
4 Rest in Peace
4 Angel's Grace
3 Nevermore
2 Jester's Cap
1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
1 Leyline of Sanctity
—Ezuri, renegade leader
(Magic 2014 Core Set: Fog)
What is Turbo Fog?
Turbo Fog is a deck that believes that not losing is much more important that winning. By playing universal efficient draw and Fog-like effects this deck buys time to win in whatever method the builder chooses.
Why play Turbo Fog?
The most popular way to win a game of magic is by creature combat damage. Wouldn’t it be nice to have a deck that had a very good matchup against any deck with that plan A? Do you like to invalidate everything your opponent is doing? Do you enjoy drawing lots of cards? Do you want to see your entire deck every game? Want consistency like a burn deck but don’t want to race? Want a cheap deck?
This is that deck.
Why shouldn’t you play Turbo Fog?
This deck requires you to play fast or you will go to time.
If you don’t like decks that could play themselves and you want something risky and challenging, well we got the risky part down. This deck is very good against a local metagame with lots of rouge decks and the cheaper meta decks. The two most difficult matchups for this deck are Melira Pod and Tron, so big tournaments are kind of out.
If you like attacking your opponent, this is not for you, if you attack, you are doing so once.
Why did I make this Primer?
Turbo fog pops up in deck creation once or twice a year. Every time they will get yelled at that there is already a thread for Turbo Fog. Thing is these threads are pretty horrible with entirely negative advice and stale with one idea. Here is a chance for a thread that can grow beyond one person’s table top.
I have been keeping an eye on turbo fog since it was first viable in tenth edition and have seen its wax and wane in standard. Though it is widely considered unplayable in modern I belive that its exceptional matchups against agro and ability to respond to other threats makes up for its bad matchups.
Turbo
Howling Mine-This is the primary draw effect. Run 4 or you probably are not playing turbo fog.
Abundance -While costing a full for to net you no physical card advantage it makes up for it in quality. It prevents you from being drawn out as it replaces your draw, as an added benefit. It is defiantly good enough to warrant consideration as a 1-2 of in a deck with green in it.
Jace, Memory Adept-Cost a full 5 but functions to speed up your win significantly.
Font of Mythos -Very good but cost 4. How many you run depends on your build.
Kami of the Crescent Moon -Only cost two but color intensive. Puts up an ok effort as a blocker but dies to bolt. Very rarely run.
Jace Beleren-Vulnerable but can function to draw only you cards and draws a card the turn he comes out.
Temple Bell-Cost 3 but you control when the draw happens.
Rites of Flourishing- Draws card, and lets you play those lands cluttering up your hand. Accelerates you into being able to play more turbo and thus have more reliable future draws. This card is however very good for our opponents.
Mikokoro, Center of the Sea- No initial investment required but requires mana every activation. Still it is a land that does what we want it to.
I have seen each of these cards in assorted turbo Fog lists. While this is a cheap deck please do not run every junk rare in your binder because it reads draw.
Fogs
Angelsong-Acceptably priced and cycling can be used if flooded with fogs.
Dawn Charm- Fog that can also stop discard and burn spells.
Ethereal Haze-Fogs that cost 1 are very important and this one stops Melira’s combo for a turn.
Holy Day-Bread and butter most basic white fog.
Angel's Grace-One is not Zero. This has Split Second, stops direct dasmage as well as creature and only cost a single white mana. The problem is that it leaves you in bolt range on the next turn.
Pollen Lullaby-Can function as two fogs occasionally, I hear that is good.
Riot Control-Cost a full three but can pull you out of the red zone.
Safe Passage-Stops direct damage as well as creature damage, best universal prevention.
Stonehorn Dignitary-Lets you know ahead of time that creature won’t be swinging, nifty interactions with blinking/creature effects. Cost 4 though.
Reverence - If they can still win through it you shouldn’t rely on it.
Children of Korlis-You shouldn’t be losing life to have to activate him.
Kami of False Hope-Like the name implies he cost 1 and had great recursion capabilities. He can also be killed on your turn. He does beautiful things with Enduring Renewal, but can still be killed during your end step.
Chant of Vitu-Ghazi, Endure , Harmless Assault, Chronomantic Escape, Blazing Archon, Knight-Captain of Eos-Cost way too much for the job they wind up doing.
Fog-Namesake of the deck, you surprisingly don’t have to run it.
Tanglesap -Cost 2 and there are not very many creatures with trample to worry about coming up against.
Blunt the Assault-Can bring you out of the red zone but cost a full 4.
Terrifying Presence -If you don’t have a creature this is just bad.
Moonmist -Pretty much a standard fog unless you have some interesting deck in your meta.
Hindervines -No real reason to run this.
Druid's Deliverance-It’s a fog.
Defend the Hearth-It’s a fog
Clinging Mists-It can function as two fogs.
Chameleon -Overcosted fog.
Haze Frog- The body could be useful, generally bad.
Batwing Brume-This card can win you the game or bring you very close if you want to win with damage. Casting multiples can take your opponent 20 to Zero. Works best of your opponent does not know about it so hold it until you need to or can win with it.
Darkness -It is another 1 cost fog, that is a very important fact.
Ensnaring Bridge-Unfortunately this card has complete negative synergy with our deck.
Jace, Architect of Thought-This is not enough protection to keep you alive.
Snapcaster Mage-When flashing back a fog it ends up being over costed but in combined use with counterspells the versatility makes him worth it.
Cryptic Command-This card is good. Tapping down creatures stops combat at its source.
Evacuation-Stops the damage and makes them rebuild
Wrath of God and other Destroy all creature effects-These work really well against creature deck and can give you a turn to spend without having to cast a fog.
Win Conditions
In this deck you have the option of three ways to win:
This is the most passive and natural way for a Turbo Fog deck to win. Many of our cards are already drawing them closer to that last card. It has the innate problem that some decks are resilient to this attack plan.
There are two methods to go about this Actively or Passively.
If you decide to actively mill you are including cards specifically with the intent of reducing their library quicker.
Mesmeric Orb-This is a fantastic card that has the highest cards milled more per cost. It fits in with the deck nicely.
Archive Trap-Mills a full 13 cards for the low cost of 0. Works great wit Path to Exile
Jace, Memory Adept-Functions as both draw and a way to win.
If you choose to passively mill, letting them draw their entire deck, you will fill the slots you would on a win condition on more turbo to make your plays more consistent. The primary problem with this method is time. You must be very familiar with how to play the deck and end your turns shortly after they begin. Nobody wants a tie.
This deck doesn’t really play much in the way of fair creatures, what it does is abuse its existing game plan of surviving to the very late game.
Luminarch Ascension -You can easily go many, many turns without taking damage. Once the Ascension is active 4/4 angles for 1W are pretty efficient and can easily clean up a game with no rush.
Celestial Colonnade-Conveniently a duel land and sits dormant until you are ready to use it. Evasion is key.
Creeping Tar Pit-Different colors than Colonnade, lower power but completely unblockable.
Faerie Conclave/ Inkmoth Nexus/ Blinkmoth Nexus-Very little mana required to activate but wins slower than even your native drawing power but can be there in case you need it, I recommend one of the previous options instead.
A deck that waits forever to do anything and sees its entire deck is the perfect home for combo, although few choose to win this way. Few combo cards do anything for you before they win you the game and can be easily disrupted. There are many, many combos you could run that would do nothing else for the deck(E.g. Mikaeus, the Unhallowed+ Triskelion )
Probably the best combo for this deck is a Mindslaver lock
Mindslaver + Academy Ruins =This is practically a one card combo as it only needs to take up one nonland slot in your deck. Mindslaver itself acts as a very expensive fog, the fact that a combo piece is not a completely dead card is nothing to scoff at. If you so wish further utility with Academy Ruins can be built into the deck.
Laboratory Maniac-If they don’t lose that turn you win. Typically considered fragile and unnecessary.
Other Cards
This deck is incredibly wide open with a large variety of playable cards and great variability of colors run, as such there are countless card that could potentially see play in a turbo fog deck. Here are a few of the common ones:
Isochron Scepter-Extraordinary power with equivalent fragility. Is best friends with Silence and counterspells.
Mana Leak-If you are running blue any variety of counterspells are well suited to this deck, I mention Mana Leak specifically because it is the one you shouldn’t run. Your opponent will have mana. Another note on counterspells is not to counter anything that can easily be handled by your fogs. Use them to protect your spells and stop their alternate win conditions.
Wall of Omens and Omenspeaker-These card that are traditionally great in control do help out this deck by preventing early damage and smoothing draws but are overall lack luster in actual performance.
Beast Within-Exceptional removal, if you need it. Pay no mind to the 3/3.
Elixir of Immortality -Prevents you from drawing out.
Leyline of Sanctity -Stops most everything fogs don’t.
Wheel of Sun and Moon-Mill prevention that had your deck end up with an very high percent of fogs to draw into.
Time Warp-Lets you build and dig.
Turn 1: Land
Turn 2: Draw. Land. Howling Mine
Turn 3: Draw. Draw. Land. Go.
Sounds bad? It is actually better than you would think. In this deck you don’t care about your life total unless it is zero* so you use your first few turns as a buffer to soak up damage before you have to play fog like effects.
Use more expensive fogs first but hold back things that can prevent direct damage against deck that you know contain such. Always Use Angel’s Grace last, if you are running it.
*You still have to be wary of Lightning Bolts.
There are many decks in the format to write about, more analysis coming soon.
Decklists
To be added as they are submitted.
Updated 4/7/14
6x Forest
4x Sunpetal Grove
2x Mikokoro, Center of the Sea
8x Plains
4x Temple Garden
Draw
4x Font of Mythos
4x Howling Mine
4x Temple Bell
2x Abundance
4x Rites of Flourishing
4x Angel's Grace
4x Fog
4x Holy Day
2x Pollen Lullaby
4x Safe Passage
4x Faerie Macabre
3x Heroes' Reunion
4x Leyline of Sanctity
4x Relic of Progenitus
Very few cards can so singularly win like Gideon (that your opponents can't damage). Be wary of exactly how the fogs you are running read, some only protect you from damage. I will update the primer with him for sure. Speaking of Gideons, Gideon Jura was a powerhouse and staple of Zendikar era Turbo Fog and could still be great in a modern version since there are so few cards that could kill him outright.
I could definitely see a control build running the low cost Howling Mine and Kami of the Crescent Moon alongside this. The ability to start drawing cards so early would fit nicely in a creatured version of the deck.
http://www.wizards.com/Magic/Magazine/Article.aspx?x=mtg/daily/sf/294
Modern: Top Control -- UWx Titan -- Loam Pox -- Footsteps Hulk
Legacy: Doomsday -- Death and Taxes -- UR Stasis -- Sylvan Plug
Pauper: UB Teachings -- UR Nivix Control
UBRKess, Dissident MageUBR - Controlling Dissidents
GRhonas the IndomitableG - Indomitable Four Drops
WUBOloro, Ageless AsceticWUB - Loot & Renanimate
This is a definite problem but there are sideboard solutions. I have won games against tron by simply playing 6+ permanents a turn until they draw themselves out, it was the most difficult win I've ever had with this deck. Tron is by far the worst match-up, every other one can be effectively handles post board.
Decks that are meta dependent are a completely viable option. Turbo Fog aims to win by turn ten and your turns play through very quickly, if you go to time it is on your opponent, which granted is a real risk.
I would ask that comments purely saying this deck is bad please add at least something constructive. People do play this deck, so lets try to give them advice.
It sounds pretty good.
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
Let me just say two things right off the bat: 1) I've tested this IRL in a very competitive crowd, 2) I think the deck has the potential to be well positioned if someone can figure out the right build. Here's the decklist I've been testing for a few FNM's.
1 Academy Ruins
3 Celestial Colonnade
4 Ghost Quarter
1 Glacial Fortress
2 Godless Shrine
4 Hallowed Fountain
2 Island
4 Marsh Flats
1 Watery Grave
2 Plains
CREATURES - 2
1 Ætherling
1 Snapcaster Mage
1 Batwing Brume
4 Dawn Charm
1 Elixir of Immortality
4 Ethereal Haze
4 Holy Day
4 Howling Mine
3 Jace Beleren
4 Supreme Verdict
4 Swan Song
2 Temple Bell
3 Timely Reinforcements
3 Engineered Explosives
4 Gifts Ungiven
2 Hide // Seek
1 Iona, Shield of Emeria
4 Leyline of Sanctity
1 Unburial Rites
Before I get too into my wall of text, yes the Gifts sideboard is garbage. Take out the Gifts, Rites, and Iona and add in some number of Pithing Needle, Rest in Peace, and Negate. I tried something cute and it never worked. The other cards in the sideboard are great and I wouldn't change those numbers.
Modern is in a place currently where all decks aside from a select few win through the combat step. Twin, Zoo, Pod (to an extent), Affinity, Bogles, etc. There will undoubted be a reply saying "Yeah, but X, Y, and Z don't win through combat" and that's not quite the point. Turbo-Fog is a metagame deck. This deck faced some top notch players playing known archetypes: R/G Tron, Mono-Red, Tarmo-Twin, Bogle, B/G Rock (no Obliterators), and Bant midrange. Out of 7-8 rounds total I only won a single match, but I won a number of games. It's disheartening but really it came down to my inexperience with playing the deck. If my opponents were not already hating me personally for playing the deck, I would test more. Out of all of them, Tron and Mono-Red are the worst match ups. Both the base Green and base Blue varieties of Tron require lots of sideboard hate for Karn Liberated, Iona, Shield of Emeria, Platinum Angel and Emrakul, the Aeons Torn.
A little bit about the card choices that I feel are important. Hide // Seek (alternatively Memoricide) for the creature problems in R/G or U/W UrzaTron and Negate / Pithing Needle for Karn. The Leylines must be in play Game 2 versus Mono-Red and actually help a lot against G/B's targeted hand disruption and Liliana of the Veil (that ultimate DOES target, and I've had a Lily at 16 counters facing me). I feel very strongly that Swan Song is a 4-of in any Fog deck. The downside is negated entirely by default. Supreme Verdict and Timely Reinforcements act as buffers and resets. Ætherling was always bad, Jace ultimate was always nuts, and Snapcaster Mage is iffy but utilitarian (I would not play more than 2x). The Engineered Explosives in the board was almost entirely in anticipation for Chalice of the Void and Defense Grid.
I think if anyone wants to consider brewing Turbo-Fog they need to make their mind up on their win condition. The decklist I made is split between the mill/draw-them-out strategy and the attack them to 0 strategy. The Colonnades pulled their weight so even with a more Milling oriented deck I'd recommend keeping them in. The next time I pilot this, I'm going for Mill... Jace, Memory Adept is coming into the main over Jace Beleren and I'll add either another Temple Bell or the "Dictate of Kruphix". I think the deck type in general is lacking copies 4x-8x of Howling Mine. Temple Bell and the new Journey into Nyx card are great but slow. That extra 2-drop turbo piece is sorely missing to draw more Fogs or reaction pieces.
TL;DR - So far this deck is losing, but mainly because I'm bad at playing it. There's great potential if the "Draw Go" control shell is tweaked correctly. Play the deck in the right environment. Be aware that people will hate you outright and know when to use the frustration to your advantage in out-playing them.
I'll post my list tonight after I get off work and explain my choices and list and SB. Won't be til around 12:30 though.
edit:
heres my list...
2x Hallowed Fountain
3x Glacial Fortress
1x Godless Shrine
2x Isolated Chapel
1x Watery Grave
2x Drowned Catacomb
3x Plains
3x Swamp
2x Island
4x Holy Day
4x Ethereal Haze
4x Darkness
3x Dawn Charm
3x Batwing Brume
2x Supreme Verdict
4x Howling Mine
3x Temple Bell
2x Font of Mythos
1x Spiteful Visions
2x Elixir of Immortality
2x Underworld Dreams
1x Negate
2x Meddling Mage
1x Nevermore
2x Oblivion Ring
1x Detention Sphere
2x Tormod's Crypt
1x Ulamog, The Infinite Gyre
1x Leyline of Sanctity
1x Jace, Memory Adept
1x Pithing Needle
Ok... so i chose black over green bc i didn't really see green adding all that much since I personally don't want creatures outside of SB options. I also have a soft spot for darkness.... i mean it is the only black fog effect.
Splinter twin:
Usually try to hold up enough mana to fog game one and after a possible counter, use Brume for the win.
Sb: -2 LoS +1 Pithing Needle +1 Nevermore
I dont see LoS as usful and being able to use needle against kiki or the enchanted creature is nice while stopping the other from being cast with nevermore works too. mostly just fog and use Brume wisely
Tron:
G1 is always miserable bc once they hit karn, theres not much i can do. i can fog wurmcoil all day. Emrakul is hard g1 as well.
Sb(and this one is the fun one that i may not be siding correctly):
-2 LoS -1 Font -1 Dreams -1 Visions -3 Brume -2 Verdict +1 Needle +1 D-Sphere +2 O-Ring +1 Nevermore +2 Mage +1 Negate +2 Deprive/Remand
This is the match up i fear the most. My goal really is to stop Karn for the most part and just and draw into Dreams or mill them. O-ring/D-sphere and nevermore/Mage work for both emrakul and karn needle and counters are for karn
Burn:
Usually md LoS does it at some point along with lifegain from elixir and dawn charms 3rd ability.
Sb: - 3 brume - 2 verdict -1 darkness -1 visions +2 Deprive/remand +2 O-Ring +1 Needle +1 LoS +1 Nevermore
No need for visions to hurt me in this match up and not really enough creatures to need as many fogs. Counters stop some burn/Lavamancer (no not negate). O-ring and needle if i see lavamancer to stop him. Nevermore (probably not needed for this MU) to stop any of their spells. LoS is obvious.
Living End:
This can be rough sometimes depending on how many avalanche riders and Fulminators they hit early on and how many lands i hit early on. Otherwise, just fog for days
Sb: -3 LoS -1 Visions -1 Font + 1 Nevermore +2 Mage +2 Crypt
LoS isnt too special and the other two are kinda slow and one hurts us a little. Use nevermore/Mage to stop Living End from being cast. Crypt is obvious. after that, just fog til win
Pod:
Can be annoying with infinite life, but use LoS to avoid being targeted and fog and sorta see what happens and decide if the match is winnable. (again... hard with infinite life)
Sb (not too familiar with playing against this one): -2 Brume -2 Font -1 Visions -2 Verdict +2 Deprive +2 O-Ring +1 D-Sphere +1 Needle +1 Nevermore
Counters to try to stop infinite life. Ring and sphere to stop combos. Needle to stop Pod. Nevermore to stop all the above.
Scapeshift:
LoS usually does it.
Dont really have much for it in the Sb bc ive seen it like once.
UWR Control/midrange (not usually a problem for me but yeah... guess it could be bad; the few ppl ive played against playing this probably werent the most skill intensive):
This MU a lot of ppl tell me they have a hard time with. It can be difficult if they spell snare your T2 Howling Mine but you can normally stock pile fogs and play smart around their counters.
Sb: -2 Brume -1 Visions -1 Verdict +2 Crypt +1 Jace +1 Nevermore
Get rid of snapcaster targets, put a threat in to mill or make use counters, and stop them from playing a threat or stop cryptics
Affinity/Merfolk/Zoo/aggro:
Easiest for us bc we fog all day. Charm can be nice against zoo or red affinity to stop the Helix/Bolt or Galvanic Blast/Shrap blast
Sb: not rly too much (I did have one affinity matchup where he dropped a blood moon and i just simply waited to get enough mana to get enough mana to drop my sb'ed in ulamog and he conceded)
Jund: As awkward as this is, i havent played it... 0.o Dont ask me how but im sure it has made a difference since DrS has been banned. I havent been able to play since the banning of DrS and unbanning of BB
For those who noticed, i dont rly have a MU that i board in Ulamog. Hes sort of a filler but hes also in there in case i feel im playing someone with slaughter games or extirpate after destroying my elixir. Or if i play against a random mill opponent.
Like i said... I have been trying different versions and different win cons. Im not 100 on it yet, but i may go straight u/w and cut black but havent decided yet. If i cut black, id probably put jace md and add in the slaver lock. I kinda want a card that just straight up says "i win" when it hits the table but to me, a lot of the win cons ive tried take to long. Underworld Dreams (UD) takes too long sometimes due to triple black and Luminarch Ascension is cool and all and fits our deck, but it sorta gets destroyed g2 immediately and when they draw a ton, they are likely to hit more than one way to remove our 2nd and 3rd one. There is no real driving force that makes me want to go green. Black has possibilties and has sb options. As for now, its 221 am here so im goin to bed. Feel free to ask away or criticize. Realize ive played turbo since 9th edition. Ive played it heavily. Im by no means the best but ive sure as hell played it a ton and have had some fun and have some experience with it. Ive tried it with silence and Megrim/lilianas caress combo. Ive tried it as bant, esper, b/w, rgw, rug, and uwr. Red was for intimidation bolt and one of the chandras (whichever did 10 dmg) along side ajani vengent and ive tried ajani goldmane. Ive tried it with gideon jura and gideon, champion of justice. Ive played it with beleren, adept, and architect. I tried it with Garruk primal hunter. I tried it recently in standard but i hate standard so i dismantled it since im almost 1000% sure ill never play standard again. I have it proxied up as an angus mackenzie turbofog group-hug edh deck even. haha
Where you at? Lol. Need to update primer with match ups
Where you at? Lol. Need to update primer with match ups
4 Fog
3 Safe Passage
4 Tanglesap
2 Blunt the Assault
1 Gideon Jura
Mines (10)
4 Rites of Flourishing
3 Temple Bell
3 Jace Beleren
2 Beast Within
3 Into the Roil
1 Phyrexian Rebirth
2 Day of Judgment
Other (7)
1 Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre
4 Archive Trap
2 Leyline of Sanctity
Land (21)
1 Celestial Colonnade
2 Forest (246)
2 Glacial Fortress
3 Island (234)
4 Khalni Garden
3 Misty Rainforest
2 Plains (230)
3 Seachrome Coast
1 Sunpetal Grove
4 Fog
4 Holy Day
4 Ethereal Haze
Mines (10)
4 Howling Mine
4 Rites of Flourishing
2 Temple Bell
Disruption (13)
4 Beast Within
2 Maelstrom Pulse
4 Memoricide
1 Phyrexian Rebirth
2 Wrath of God
1 Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre
2 Leyline of Sanctity
Land (22)
4 Forest (246)
7 Plains (230)
4 Sunpetal Grove
3 Swamp (238)
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Darkness
2 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Griselbrand
2 Leyline of Sanctity
4 Nature's Claim
2 Torpor Orb
I think you missed the point of what I said and I'm not sure if I'm doing a good job of explaining it. The deck NEEDS Howling Mine effects to function, they're necessary. If we don't get them, we will lose 99% of the time. The format has very easy access to artifact and enchantment removal and many decks run some form of it in mainboard. Any time we play a Mine effect, they will gain tempo by simply destroying it, which is different from the "dies to removal" argument since the Howling Mines aren't our win con, they're our bread and butter. Now, this argument wouldn't be a big deal if the deck could win quickly or become hard to interact with, but frankly, we give the opponent tons of extra draws to help them find the pieces they need to kill our draw engine and the time they need to actual do it. I know you said your issue is that the deck doesn't win on the spot, and I agree, but I'd go a step farther and say that the deck isn't viable until that happens.
4x Howling Mine
4x Temple Bell
4x Jester's Scepter
4x Martyr of Sands
2x Kami of False Hope
2x Proclamation of Rebirth
4x Leyline of Sanctity
3x Wrath of God
3x Chronomantic Escape (this card has been absurdly good)
4x Dawn Charm
2x Meta Slots generally Pollen Lullaby
20x Snow-Covered Plains
4x Scrying Sheets
Very simple but incredibly effective. The problem is that it just takes SO LONG to win a game, but you can lock the hell out of them. I do agree that they will rarely kill your draw effects but it does happen. And in the case that they do ... you are just basically playing the old Snow-White deck which is not that bad in itself. Twin and Pod are not ideal matchups nor is Tron so ... I don't see this being a major contender. Its a cool deck but honestly I think I would rather just play the Time Warp deck for time purposes, it at least has the capabilities of winning on turns 4-6 even though it is easily disrupted. I just thought I would throw in my .02