Putting to much into it? Putting the should to the wheel is how you make progress.
Speaking of progress, we (sliver decks) can also runn Birthing Pod. It will be a good way to progress ouer slivers forward.
Birthing Pod requires a chain. Most of the slivers are low costed. I guess it would be good for a toolbox but there is better cards for that than slivers IMO.
Putting to much into it? Putting the should to the wheel is how you make progress.
Speaking of progress, we (sliver decks) can also runn Birthing Pod. It will be a good way to progress ouer slivers forward.
sacrificing one sliver to get another sliver out is exactly the opposite of what slivers want to be doing as an archetype.
This is true, unless you're sacrificing a Sliver with an effect you can live without or if it's a double with a non cumulative ability. You'd keep Sinew and/or Predatory, but maybe you could pitch a second Galerider to get another bonus that stacks.
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RBurn UBRSac Land Tendrils UBRGOops, All Spells
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Putting to much into it? Putting the should to the wheel is how you make progress.
Speaking of progress, we (sliver decks) can also runn Birthing Pod. It will be a good way to progress ouer slivers forward.
sacrificing one sliver to get another sliver out is exactly the opposite of what slivers want to be doing as an archetype.
This is true, unless you're sacrificing a Sliver with an effect you can live without or if it's a double with a non cumulative ability. You'd keep Sinew and/or Predatory, but maybe you could pitch a second Galerider to get another bonus that stacks.
At the cost of 2 life, a creature, and 4 slots in a deck. That's not worth it IMO
It would depend on the build of course, putting Birthing Pod into the deck is clearly more of a control/midrange deck. Claiming that sacrefice slivers in order to find other slivers is very naive.
I am not shure if it is good enough to trade any of the 5cc for Megantic Sliver or Constricting Sliver is worth it. The five mana CC are just that good. But yeah: Birthing Pod backed by counter spells and removal, you bet it can work.
hi all! im a kiki pod pllayer but slivers allways been a nice deck that i want to become a tier 1 in modern! I'm sure Diffusion Sliver is the card we need, although is not a crystaline in most of cases it will do its job! i took the RancytheRancor core, which i think is something that can't miss in any sliver deck! i put my list here:
4/3x Mutavault
2/3x Soul Cavern
2x Sliver Hive
4x Reflecting Pool
4x Mana Confluence
4x Gemstone Mine
2x City of Brass
Now here it misses 4 cards, and i was thinking at different ones like: gemhide slivers (protection from blood moon, with that mana base, is allways good), path to exile (with evasions guys and leeching sliver i dont think is needed), ghor clan ravager (push the damage!!), boros charm (protection from mass removal, but double specific color is hard to cast), and and and... yea i know its crazy but i like it as a finisher, Sliver Hivelord ! the thing i like the most is 4x Ghor Clan Rampager OR 2x Gemhide Sliver and 2x Sliver Hivelord.
in side i'd put 4x Venom Sliver, against tarmo/aggro decks, 2x/4x Harmonic Sliver (i'd put 2x harmonic and other things like ancient grudge).
what do you think? i think it's a hella nic eboost with the new slivers
PS. other 4x nice cards i think it's Vapor Snag, dmg + tempo + lightning bolt are nice!
Putting to much into it? Putting the should to the wheel is how you make progress.
Speaking of progress, we (sliver decks) can also runn Birthing Pod. It will be a good way to progress ouer slivers forward.
sacrificing one sliver to get another sliver out is exactly the opposite of what slivers want to be doing as an archetype.
This is true, unless you're sacrificing a Sliver with an effect you can live without or if it's a double with a non cumulative ability. You'd keep Sinew and/or Predatory, but maybe you could pitch a second Galerider to get another bonus that stacks.
At the cost of 2 life, a creature, and 4 slots in a deck. That's not worth it IMO
Yeah, if you're committing four slots to Birthing Pod, then you're doing it wrong. Birthing Pod isn't the point of the deck, Birthing Pod is grease to a well running machine. You can transform noncumulative abilities with one that is, thus further multiplying your positive gains and eliminating pointless doubles.
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BInfect BWDeath & Taxes UBRAffinity
RBurn UBRSac Land Tendrils UBRGOops, All Spells
WUGPhelddagrif GGGOmnath, Locus of Mana BBBXiahou Dun, the One-Eyed RRRAshling, the Pilgrim BBWTeysa, Scion of Orzhov UUUTalrand, Sky Summoner UUBVela the Night-Clad GGBVhati il-Dal RUWRuhan of the Fomori
Frenetic Sliver Is a card I think should be tested out. Its 3 cmc, which isnt so great, but adds redondancy to it.
I also think this deck really wants things like spell pierce and thoughtseize
Edit: many of you might not remember or were in the days of counter slivers. Since diff. sliver wants the deck to be in a more tempo area of old, heres my take.
Frenetic Sliver Is a card I think should be tested out. Its 3 cmc, which isnt so great, but adds redondancy to it.
I also think this deck really wants things like spell pierce and thoughtseize
Edit: many of you might not remember or were in the days of counter slivers. Since diff. sliver wants the deck to be in a more tempo area of old, heres my take.
Nice brewing guys. I love all the options available for different builds of slivers. I am personally more partial towards a toolbox type build- I can see Chord of Calling and Birthing Pod being good in this type of build. Perhaps even Gifts Ungiven. Here are my thoughts on toolbox slivers:
Dormant Sliver is a great engine card. Other cards that work well with Dormant Sliver include Telekinetic Sliver and Psionic Sliver. Don't forget Dormant Sliver can be sacrificed by many of the Slivers so you can alpha strike. With Psionic Sliver you may not even need to, but I see it more as another way to disrupt the opponent.
I think Manaweft Sliver and Gemhide Sliver are vital to a toolbox slivers build. They provide redundancy and tons of acceleration. Another card in this vein is Springleaf Drum. These play well with Firewake Sliver, as do Telekinetic Sliver and Psionic Sliver.
There are very few flex slots to disrupt the opponent, so I would consider (in a toolbox build) just having the disruption come from the slivers themselves. I would rather dedicate nonsliver slots to engine cards like Springleaf Drum, Aether Vial, Birthing Pod, and Chord of Calling. A few highlights of "disruptive slivers" are Mindslash Sliver, Telekinetic Sliver, Necrotic Sliver, Harmonic Sliver, and Psionic Sliver. Also, Sliver Hivelord and Diffusion Sliver are disruption in a way.
Mindslash Sliver is a soft lock with Sliver Hive, provided you have 6 mana and the opponent is cardless.
I think Sliver Hive and Mutavault should not be underestimated, and will probably wind up as auto-4-ofs in every Sliver build.
For people working in a different direction, I think the shortlist for the best disruptive cards in Modern are Thoughtseize, Inquisition of Kozilek, Spell Pierce, Lightning Bolt, Path to Exile, Abrupt Decay, and Remand.
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I don't care if you're a moderator but you sir have said a very, very stupid thing.
Comes out of the gates pretty fast. Keeps drawing cards. It is a bit light with only Sinew sliver to lift it out of the army of 1/1. Only 8 hard counter spells, although I think it should "thread water" very good. Some play testing is requiered.
How do you imagine a deck using those cards would stack up to any of the current dominant control decks like American or Grixis? Both of those have much more efficient answers, card draw, and win conditions. Do you really think those cards can make a deck that can consistently win against any tier decks including Pod, Twin, American Control, Jund, Merfolk, Affinity, Hatebears, Zoo, Tron, Scapeshift, Storm, Infect, etc.? A few 4CMC durdling slivers does not make a control deck.
Playing this deck I think its not quite there yet still... but heres a good thing I picked up. Mana tithe is one of the best cards you can pack.
People would not expect a white counterspell. That's for sure
It's not all that uncommmon since everyone and their grandmother thinks they're some sort of genius for playing a white Force Spike when they're really just diluting their deck for unnecessary cuteness.
It feels like the most effective sliver builds are just a bit too similar to merfolk in both power level and playstyle. I don't really see the point of recreating the wheel.
However, there is one thing slivers has going for it that merfolk does not... ramp. If gemhide/manaweft can be leveraged to go over the top of merfolk in some way, it might be worth looking into. Whether that means ramping into Sliver Legion and Sliver Hivelord, or doing something a bit more off the wall like powering out a fat Genesis Wave, I can't say. But if the best we have is lords + turn sideways, that's pretty sad. And yes, I'm purposely disregarding Birthing Pod as a viable idea because it's just absurdly awful with this tribe. Slivers might be the actual worst tribe for BP.
I can't come up with anything very competitive myself, but here's a fun control build for the kitchen table.
Perhaps some clever person could make this concept into something competitive, but right now it just feels too slow and durdley for modern. Abusing the sacrifice effects is really the most intriguing thing for me though, so I'll probably continue to tweak this. If I ever come up with something approaching effective, I'll update ya'll.
current testing with this. just balls to wall agro has some crazy good hands. devote sb to combo. Caleb durward(sp?) built a legay deck almost same list and was able to win legacy games ez. modern is a weaker format with all the same options for combo matchup so I don't see how it would be hard to run it in modern
current testing with this. just balls to wall agro has some crazy good hands. devote sb to combo. Caleb durward(sp?) built a legay deck almost same list and was able to win legacy games ez. modern is a weaker format with all the same options for combo matchup so I don't see how it would be hard to run it in modern
How can you have a sideboard for combo when you only have 10 lands that can produce colored mana for sideboard cards, and only 5 lands for each color?
current testing with this. just balls to wall agro has some crazy good hands. devote sb to combo. Caleb durward(sp?) built a legay deck almost same list and was able to win legacy games ez. modern is a weaker format with all the same options for combo matchup so I don't see how it would be hard to run it in modern
How can you have a sideboard for combo when you only have 10 lands that can produce colored mana for sideboard cards, and only 5 lands for each color?
thalia, meddling mage, ethersworn canonist, teeg, mindbreak trap is what he used for the random combo decks.
harmonic would destroy any artifact/enchantment based deck.
with syphon main removing ancient ziggurat for CoB\MC would prob be ok
also frenzy sliver seems good as a three of since we have turn 1 galerider
I like Mirror Entity as a 3 of. It will be good a lot of the time and in particular with Aether Vial it can be devastating. Ticking up to three on vial dropping this then making your lords a base 4/4 can take someone from twenty to dead real quick.
current testing with this. just balls to wall agro has some crazy good hands. devote sb to combo. Caleb durward(sp?) built a legay deck almost same list and was able to win legacy games ez. modern is a weaker format with all the same options for combo matchup so I don't see how it would be hard to run it in modern
How can you have a sideboard for combo when you only have 10 lands that can produce colored mana for sideboard cards, and only 5 lands for each color?
thalia, meddling mage, ethersworn canonist, teeg, mindbreak trap is what he used for the random combo decks.
harmonic would destroy any artifact/enchantment based deck.
with syphon main removing ancient ziggurat for CoB\MC would prob be ok
also frenzy sliver seems good as a three of since we have turn 1 galerider
And how are you casting the nonsliver cards? You are only running 5 on color shocklands for each one and 4 Aether Vials. 9 sources is not enough to consistently cast thos, especially Meddling Mage and Gaddock Teeg
Would not the detahtouch sliver and doublestrike help in fights with more creatures? Rock, Jund and affinaty? (Although disenchant sliver would be really neat vs afinaty.)
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I have dyslexia, no I am not going to spell check for you, yes you have to live with the horrors of it.
No silly toolbox shenanigans, lords.dec and swing for 40 + 16 poison on turn 4 is much better. Diffusion Sliver should definitely be in there somewhere, probably instead of Sentinel Sliver, which is currently there to be able to swing and still tap for mana in main phase 2. Hilariously enough I actually think 22 lands 38 Slivers could work really well, since Vial is a terrible topdeck and 8 mana slivers make it redundant anyways. I found the WUBRG slivers to generally not be worth it, since Mutavault gets really in the way of casting them and Sliver Legion is overkill anyways (Hivelord could work as a sideboard card versus removal-heavy decks, however). Bonescythe Sliver is a much better drop-and-win curve-ender especially since he works so well with Virulent Sliver.
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Birthing Pod requires a chain. Most of the slivers are low costed. I guess it would be good for a toolbox but there is better cards for that than slivers IMO.
sacrificing one sliver to get another sliver out is exactly the opposite of what slivers want to be doing as an archetype.
This is true, unless you're sacrificing a Sliver with an effect you can live without or if it's a double with a non cumulative ability. You'd keep Sinew and/or Predatory, but maybe you could pitch a second Galerider to get another bonus that stacks.
B Infect
BW Death & Taxes
UBR Affinity
R Burn
UBR Sac Land Tendrils
UBRG Oops, All Spells
WUG Phelddagrif
GGG Omnath, Locus of Mana
BBB Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed
RRR Ashling, the Pilgrim
BBW Teysa, Scion of Orzhov
UUU Talrand, Sky Summoner
UUB Vela the Night-Clad
GGB Vhati il-Dal
RUW Ruhan of the Fomori
At the cost of 2 life, a creature, and 4 slots in a deck. That's not worth it IMO
Sliver Token -> Galerider Sliver or Striking Sliver and from there it just gets better. Dormant Sliver is very good with Birthing Pod. Mesmeric Sliver can even be a one of. Trading any 4cc for Might Sliver, Sliver Overlord or Sliver Legion does seem very good indeed.
I am not shure if it is good enough to trade any of the 5cc for Megantic Sliver or Constricting Sliver is worth it. The five mana CC are just that good. But yeah: Birthing Pod backed by counter spells and removal, you bet it can work.
4x Predatory Sliver
4x Sinew Sliver
4x Galerider Sliver
4x Phantasmal Image
4x Diffusion Sliver
4x Leeching Sliver
4x Aether Vial
4x Lightning Bolt
4/3x Mutavault
2/3x Soul Cavern
2x Sliver Hive
4x Reflecting Pool
4x Mana Confluence
4x Gemstone Mine
2x City of Brass
Now here it misses 4 cards, and i was thinking at different ones like: gemhide slivers (protection from blood moon, with that mana base, is allways good), path to exile (with evasions guys and leeching sliver i dont think is needed), ghor clan ravager (push the damage!!), boros charm (protection from mass removal, but double specific color is hard to cast), and and and... yea i know its crazy but i like it as a finisher, Sliver Hivelord ! the thing i like the most is 4x Ghor Clan Rampager OR 2x Gemhide Sliver and 2x Sliver Hivelord.
in side i'd put 4x Venom Sliver, against tarmo/aggro decks, 2x/4x Harmonic Sliver (i'd put 2x harmonic and other things like ancient grudge).
what do you think? i think it's a hella nic eboost with the new slivers
PS. other 4x nice cards i think it's Vapor Snag, dmg + tempo + lightning bolt are nice!
Yeah, if you're committing four slots to Birthing Pod, then you're doing it wrong. Birthing Pod isn't the point of the deck, Birthing Pod is grease to a well running machine. You can transform noncumulative abilities with one that is, thus further multiplying your positive gains and eliminating pointless doubles.
B Infect
BW Death & Taxes
UBR Affinity
R Burn
UBR Sac Land Tendrils
UBRG Oops, All Spells
WUG Phelddagrif
GGG Omnath, Locus of Mana
BBB Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed
RRR Ashling, the Pilgrim
BBW Teysa, Scion of Orzhov
UUU Talrand, Sky Summoner
UUB Vela the Night-Clad
GGB Vhati il-Dal
RUW Ruhan of the Fomori
I also think this deck really wants things like spell pierce and thoughtseize
Edit: many of you might not remember or were in the days of counter slivers. Since diff. sliver wants the deck to be in a more tempo area of old, heres my take.
1 Harmonic Sliver
4 Predatory Sliver
4 Sinew Sliver
2 Poultice Sliver/Steelform Sliver
4 Diffusion Sliver
2 Phantasmal Image
4 Path to Exile
4 Serum Visions
4 Spell Pierce
3 Swan Song
4 AEther Vial
3 Mutavault
1 Plains
4 Scalding Tarn
4 Misty Rainforest
2 Hallowed Fountain
2 Breeding Pool
1 Temple Garden
2 Sliver Hive
2 Faerie Macabre
1 Harmonic Sliver
1 Rest in Peace
1 Swan Song
4 Vapor Snag
4 Rune Snag
2 Remand
I think Frenetic Sliver is not needed anymore with the printing diffusion sliver.
As for the list, I love me some meathooks. I think remand would be better than the swan song in the main. Maybe some cavern of souls as well.
What is everybody's opinion on military intelligence out of M15? I feel like we need some card draw.
Dormant Sliver is a great engine card. Other cards that work well with Dormant Sliver include Telekinetic Sliver and Psionic Sliver. Don't forget Dormant Sliver can be sacrificed by many of the Slivers so you can alpha strike. With Psionic Sliver you may not even need to, but I see it more as another way to disrupt the opponent.
I think Manaweft Sliver and Gemhide Sliver are vital to a toolbox slivers build. They provide redundancy and tons of acceleration. Another card in this vein is Springleaf Drum. These play well with Firewake Sliver, as do Telekinetic Sliver and Psionic Sliver.
There are very few flex slots to disrupt the opponent, so I would consider (in a toolbox build) just having the disruption come from the slivers themselves. I would rather dedicate nonsliver slots to engine cards like Springleaf Drum, Aether Vial, Birthing Pod, and Chord of Calling. A few highlights of "disruptive slivers" are Mindslash Sliver, Telekinetic Sliver, Necrotic Sliver, Harmonic Sliver, and Psionic Sliver. Also, Sliver Hivelord and Diffusion Sliver are disruption in a way.
Mindslash Sliver is a soft lock with Sliver Hive, provided you have 6 mana and the opponent is cardless.
I think Sliver Hive and Mutavault should not be underestimated, and will probably wind up as auto-4-ofs in every Sliver build.
For people working in a different direction, I think the shortlist for the best disruptive cards in Modern are Thoughtseize, Inquisition of Kozilek, Spell Pierce, Lightning Bolt, Path to Exile, Abrupt Decay, and Remand.
4 Sidewinder Sliver
4 Galerider Sliver
4 Sinew Sliver
4 Diffusion Sliver
3 Sky Hussar
Spells
4 Æther Vial
4 Curiosity
2 Snapback
3 Remand
4 Cryptic Command
4 Disrupting Shoal
3 Sliver Hive
1 Reflecting Pool
2 Scalding Tarn
2 Marsh Flats
4 Hallowed Fountain
3 Adarkar Wastes
4 Island
1 Plains
Comes out of the gates pretty fast. Keeps drawing cards. It is a bit light with only Sinew sliver to lift it out of the army of 1/1. Only 8 hard counter spells, although I think it should "thread water" very good. Some play testing is requiered.
How do you imagine a deck using those cards would stack up to any of the current dominant control decks like American or Grixis? Both of those have much more efficient answers, card draw, and win conditions. Do you really think those cards can make a deck that can consistently win against any tier decks including Pod, Twin, American Control, Jund, Merfolk, Affinity, Hatebears, Zoo, Tron, Scapeshift, Storm, Infect, etc.? A few 4CMC durdling slivers does not make a control deck.
Just brainstorming a core:
Control Slivers
4x City of Brass
4x Sliver Hive
4x Cavern of Souls
4x Mutavault
1x Reflecting Pool
21 lands
4x Winged Sliver
1x Mindlash Sliver
4x Gemhide Sliver
4x Manaweft Sliver
4x Diffusion Sliver
1x Firewake Sliver
1x Harmonic Sliver
1x Necrotic Sliver
1x Telekinetic Sliver
1x Dormant Sliver
1x Psionic Sliver
1x Sliver Hivelord
1x Sliver Legion
25 slivers
4x Aether Vial
4x Birthing Pod
3x Chord of Calling
14 nonsliver spells
People would not expect a white counterspell. That's for sure
It's not all that uncommmon since everyone and their grandmother thinks they're some sort of genius for playing a white Force Spike when they're really just diluting their deck for unnecessary cuteness.
However, there is one thing slivers has going for it that merfolk does not... ramp. If gemhide/manaweft can be leveraged to go over the top of merfolk in some way, it might be worth looking into. Whether that means ramping into Sliver Legion and Sliver Hivelord, or doing something a bit more off the wall like powering out a fat Genesis Wave, I can't say. But if the best we have is lords + turn sideways, that's pretty sad. And yes, I'm purposely disregarding Birthing Pod as a viable idea because it's just absurdly awful with this tribe. Slivers might be the actual worst tribe for BP.
I can't come up with anything very competitive myself, but here's a fun control build for the kitchen table.
4 Mindlash Sliver
4 Manaweft Sliver
4 Basal Sliver
2 Firewake Sliver
4 Necrotic Sliver
4 Dormant Sliver
1 Sliver Legion
1 Sliver Hivelord
2 Grave Pact
2 Dark Prophecy
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Mana Confluence
2 City of Brass
3 Godless Shrine
4 Reflecting Pool
4 Sliver Hive
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
Perhaps some clever person could make this concept into something competitive, but right now it just feels too slow and durdley for modern. Abusing the sacrifice effects is really the most intriguing thing for me though, so I'll probably continue to tweak this. If I ever come up with something approaching effective, I'll update ya'll.
4 galerider sliver
4 sinew sliver
4 predatory sliver
4 leeching sliver
4 dilusion sliver
4 phantasmal image
4 syphon sliver
3 frenetic sliver/opaline sliver/firewalker sliver
4 sliver hive
4 cavern of souls
4 ancient ziggeraut
4 mutavault
5 shocklands
current testing with this. just balls to wall agro has some crazy good hands. devote sb to combo. Caleb durward(sp?) built a legay deck almost same list and was able to win legacy games ez. modern is a weaker format with all the same options for combo matchup so I don't see how it would be hard to run it in modern
How can you have a sideboard for combo when you only have 10 lands that can produce colored mana for sideboard cards, and only 5 lands for each color?
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
thalia, meddling mage, ethersworn canonist, teeg, mindbreak trap is what he used for the random combo decks.
harmonic would destroy any artifact/enchantment based deck.
with syphon main removing ancient ziggurat for CoB\MC would prob be ok
also frenzy sliver seems good as a three of since we have turn 1 galerider
And how are you casting the nonsliver cards? You are only running 5 on color shocklands for each one and 4 Aether Vials. 9 sources is not enough to consistently cast thos, especially Meddling Mage and Gaddock Teeg
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
4 Gemhide Sliver
4 Manaweft Sliver
4 Sinew Sliver
4 Muscle Sliver
4 Predatory Sliver
2 Striking Sliver
4 Virulent Sliver
4 Sentinel Sliver
4 Bonescythe Sliver
4 Mutavault
4 Ancient Ziggurat
4 Sliver Hive
4 Mana Confluence
2 Forest
No silly toolbox shenanigans, lords.dec and swing for 40 + 16 poison on turn 4 is much better. Diffusion Sliver should definitely be in there somewhere, probably instead of Sentinel Sliver, which is currently there to be able to swing and still tap for mana in main phase 2. Hilariously enough I actually think 22 lands 38 Slivers could work really well, since Vial is a terrible topdeck and 8 mana slivers make it redundant anyways. I found the WUBRG slivers to generally not be worth it, since Mutavault gets really in the way of casting them and Sliver Legion is overkill anyways (Hivelord could work as a sideboard card versus removal-heavy decks, however). Bonescythe Sliver is a much better drop-and-win curve-ender especially since he works so well with Virulent Sliver.