I've been stalking this decklist for a while but keep coming back to the same question
Why all the soul wardens?
I understand that originally the deck came from a soul sisters shell and then started abusing norin to earn extra triggers. However, many versions I see people running have stopped playing serra's ascendant or ajani's pridemate, two of the main ways to capitalize on all the lifegain. Lifegain is not by itself the strongest of mechanics. Are the wardens that good by themselves? Why not instead run more things to trigger ETB effects (mogg war-marshall etc.) or continue playing the ascendants/pridemates?
If you don't play soul sisters, then what is Norin triggering? Just Champion, Chamber and Purphoros?
Sisters are easy-to-cast 1-drops. They don't provide a lot of advantage, but it snowballs as the game goes on. You gain 1 life here and there, and soon enough you find that you've gained enough to blank 3 of your opponent's attack phases.
Furthermore with the new unbans, you can bet lots of people are going to try Faeries or Tokens or Zoo. Sisters are good against those decks.
Bottom line is, if you're not playing Sisters, you have to play 8 other cards that trigger off ETB. And are preferably 1-drops.
I will be joining in the mass testing of BB as well. This seems like an auto include in any RWBx lists for norin, and a smart choice to accompany our Sister contingent. We are like a mash up of Soul Sisters, Zoo, and Tokens. Bitterblossom simply helps us in all of those matchups as well, providing blockers for the ascendant (previously not easy to do), maintain steady triggers/blockers against zoo, and stop those blasted spirit tokens vs tokens. This card has been on my want list to return for Norin specifically (this and Skullclamp, but the clamp will never come back any time soon). I will have a new RWB list posted and the testing results and individual card observations. I will be using my Norin the Artist list as a baseline (the blood artist/suture priest base). My testing will be sporadic on this though, as I'm working on this and the RGW and R lists, Eternal Ruse aggro variant (Hydras and flash enablers), and Suicide Zuberas (thought of some new testing ideas).
*Edit*
Here's my current RWB list and the observations so far:
Bitterblossom is a definite enabler and as soon as 1 sister is on board, is a free flyer each turn. I utilized some tech from my zubera deck to help with clinching games. Killing Wave and an on board, unanswered Blood Artist, is often a minimum of 5 life hit to them. If you happen to have them low enough, wave for 0 and sac your board. Plunge into Darkness can help dig out what we need without too much hassle. Immortal Servitude is some testing tech, but I may drop this in place of something else. Pyrrhic Revival should be a 1 of only. If you have a decent graveyard, this could 1-shot them for crazy amounts depending on board set-up.
I was able to get some testing vs. UB Fae (obv...) and held my ground well until getting land flooded game and having to work around 2 snares and a SSS/Mutavault. Lost to a Cryptic counter to my patrician's scorn to take down my BB.
Also got some testing vs. hatebears. If they don't answer the BB and a sister/artist, they can't keep up. Highlight of one of the matches...2 BB's and artist on board for turns, trading my tokens to fodder ping them down into wave for 3 where they miscounted and kept a creature (2 actually) and if they hadn't kept anything, they would have been hit for 10 by artist and had 3 life left and a Voice token with me spiking over 20 w/ 2 BB's online. Didn't need Torpor orb hate on G2 as i just swung in w/ 2 sisters and Bob for multiple turns, bringing in my bolts and paths from the SB taking down any blocks till they couldn't handle a wave/artist for 3.
This is a variant of an old deck I ran back in Time Spiral. I'm not sure why Enduring Renewal doesn't get much discussion. The banning of DRS is a big opening to graveyard recursion. Once you get a Wild Cantor, you have infinite recursion which translates into infinite life, infinite Mir tokens, or infinite Purphoros damage. ER combos very well with Proclamation of Rebirth.
Played this list to a 3-2 finish in a local event tonight, placing 8/22. Seeing as the deck was finished earlier in the afternoon and this was the first modern event that I've played, I can't be too broken up over it.
Very brief rundown of how the rounds went, because I didn't take notes. I also don't remember most of the sideboard decisions, largely because the board was thrown together with what I had on hand when I left. I know I pulled Genesis Chambers a few times, otherwise it was useless removal or one apiece of Warden/Attendant. Because I don't recall the exact changes I made, I'm not going to detail them. Assume I brought the cards in if they're mentioned, obviously.
Round 1: Splinter Twin
Game 1, opened with CotP, followed by CotP, then beat down from there. He didn't really play anything beyond a couple filtering spells, so I wasn't positive on what he was playing.
Game 2, I had slower opening. I think it involved a Warden followed by a Pridemate. Either way, I could pressure him somewhat. Got greedy around turn 5 and tapped out for Purphoros while he had an Exarch on the table, and got lucky that he didn't drop Kiki and win. Played two consecutive Needles on Kiki and Exarch the following turn, and he had nothing.
1-0 (2-0)
Round 2: Fish
Game 1, this entire round was bad. Kept two lands, two Bolts, a Path, and a Warden, then never saw another land or any kind of threat and got overrun by lords.
Game 2, I had the opposite problem. Got a Warden, followed with Confidant, then drew about 6 lands in a row. Spellskite on his end blanked the Bolts. Hit a second Confidant right before dying, and I was about to draw into triple Cavern.
1-1 (2-2)
Round 3: Ub Mill
Game 1, started with Warden into Pridemate, then hit Genesis Chamber and Norin. Pridemate got huge, and I eventually used a Ranger to grab Loyalist and ran over his remaining chumps.
Game 2, had another CotP into CotP start, followed by Norin. He couldn't keep up.
2-1 (4-2)
Round 4: Through the Breach/Goryo's Vengeance
Game 1, put a little pressure on him, then he Breached in an Emrakul and ate my board minus Norin.
Game 2, kept a starting hand with RiP and a couple other two drops, but only one land. Played Warden, hit the second land the next turn, dropped RiP, dropped Pridemate, then got mostly wiped by Engineered Explosives. He Goryo'd back Gristlebrand and Fury of the Horde'd me out.
2-2 (4-4)
Round 5: Scapeshift
Game 1, yet another CotP into CotP start, and get him before he can do much aside from ramp.
Game 2, start out a little slower, with Warden and Norin. I eventually ground him out with Purphoros, Kher Keep, and Norin, ending with the wonderful play of dropping a second Norin (blinking the first), then sending a Bolt to the dome to blink new Norin and deal exactly lethal when both Norins came back in.
3-2 (6-4)
Sorry about the vague report, but I figure something is better than nothing. Thoughts overall are that my board was pretty awful, which was expected. Mostly unknown meta, kind of thrown together. I'm planning on pulling the Persecutions for sure, because those were the flimsiest spots to begin with. Additional Paths and maybe an O-Ring might make their way there, otherwise it's likely to be more Needles or RiP. Hide//Seek will probably become Wear//Tear, but I have to pick them up first. I might also try and shove some Thoughtseize in there to shore up the combo matchup, but I'm not at all set on that, especially given the relatively light black base here. The rest of it I was pretty happy with.
In the maindeck, I was happy with how things worked out. Lavamancer didn't really see any good matchups tonight, but that was luck of the draw. Bob was fantastic whenever I saw him, and I'm very tempted to try and find room for a fourth. To address the concerns from some people a couple pages back in this thread about Bob alongside four drops, the average cmc of my list including lands is somewhere just a hair under 1. He's not causing significantly more damage than a Phyrexian Arena and has a lot of upsides. Kher Keep started out as a singleton, but I liked it so much when goldfishing that I upped it to two, and I didn't ever feel a color crunch because of it. I felt good about the numbers of all the major cards.
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[Pr]Jaya | Estrid | A rotating cast of decks built out of my box.
You played JESUS?!?! I heard none of his guys stay in the graveyard, and once you think you have him beat he ALWAYS comes back to win within three turns. I like...WORSHIP him.
For those running black, have you tried running Skirsdag High Priest? He's human, and there are bound to be lots of guys around that you can tap to use his ability. He is also very good against Pod decks, which seem to be doing well right now.
For those running black, have you tried running Skirsdag High Priest? He's human, and there are bound to be lots of guys around that you can tap to use his ability. He is also very good against Pod decks, which seem to be doing well right now.
It's a trap. I've tried it but it never works in time to be effective. You're better off with Bitterblossom in the slot that you're using for them. I've either had the Priests and couldn't use them or had the priests when I could and they get shot down, and only a handful of times were they even worthwhile, and in those games I usually already had the upper hand.
2. I noticed that a lot of Soul Sister decks are running Spear of Heliod, which seems really good for us because it is an anthem that hits all of our white creatures and tokens simultaneously and gives us additional removal. Has anyone tested it out?
2. I noticed that a lot of Soul Sister decks are running Spear of Heliod, which seems really good for us because it is an anthem that hits all of our white creatures and tokens simultaneously and gives us additional removal. Has anyone tested it out?
1. Proclamation is the normal go to for this deck. However, Immortal hits the 2+ drops, so it really is a matter of utility, usability and colors. I run it in the RWB Artist version because it recurs what I need, but I may end up cutting it for something else as I've taken to Pyhrric Revival as the go to recursion for that list.
2. I don't really like Anthem effects, especially with the words Legendary Enchantment Artifact tied to them, as now it gets hit by more removal and poses no real benefit for running multiples.
3. Angel of Jubilation...anthem on wings...for 1WWW...not really worth the cost. The only major benefit is the subtext, but the cost is what seems to be prohibitive, not to mention it shuts down our Blasting Station, Plunge/Artist combo (not killing wave though!), and any Fling strategies. As I tend to run either RWG or RWB, I will not be testing it out any time soon, so maybe some others may have better input than I.
Suppression Field seems like a better choice to me than Angel of Jubilation. It doesn't shut Pod down hard like the Angel, but you can play it earlier. Angel can be too late if they have a good draw. And Suppression Field is also much better against Fetchlands, Planeswalkers, Living End, Affinity, Splinter Twin and probably a few other things I can't think of now.
The only things Suppression Field affects in your deck are Purphoros, Proclamation and Relic (if you board in both at the same time of course).
Captain of the Mists has great synergy with Norin and Genesis Chamber. With Norin in play you can use the ability twice during your turn and once at the end of your opponent's turn provided you have the mana for it. It can tap down lands, tap Genesis Chamber on the opponent's turn or at the end of your turn, tap down an important permanent (i.e. Tarmogoyf, Birthing Pod at the beginning of an opponent's turn, Deceiver Exarch in response to Splinter Twin, man lands, any creature equipped with Cranial Plating at the beginning of the attack phase, etc). The negative is that it dies to all the removal in the format, which is a big one.
Ephara, God of the Polis seems really powerful with Norin as well. Bob and Phyrexian Arena are very powerful cards, and having Ephara and Norin on the field simultaneously makes them look relatively fair and balanced in comparison. Given how creature centric the deck is Ephara seems like she'd be really really good. She would probably help the match-up against URx control decks, and unlike Purphoros, God of the Forge there is actually a chance that she could become a creature.
Blue also could give us Trusted Advisor (Poor man's Norin Jr. in my opinion), Meddling Mage (to improve the combo match-ups), and Snapcaster Mage (not sure about this because the deck seems so creature centric, but must be considered because he 1. Is powerful 2. Is blue 3. Is human 4. Is one of the few cards that can trigger Ephara at the beginning of our turn.)
Obviously all of those cards can't be included without going an entirely new direction with the deck, but I think that we have enough synergy going on with Ephara and blue humans that it makes blue part of the conservation and worth exploring.
So I chose 3 copies of Trusted Advisor because they can produce repeated additional ETBs like Norin. These work well with the 8 ETB blue creatures that have flash. The 8 flashers can all provide the ETB trigger on an opponent's upkeep so we can draw an additional card with Ephara, God of the Polis at the beginning of our upkeep. Even if you don't draw other blue creatures he basically triggers all ETBs on the battlefield for one mana a turn. He also blocks opponent's Myr tokens like a champ and won't get blown out by Electrolyze. Any thoughts on this list?
Captain of the Mists has great synergy with Norin and Genesis Chamber. With Norin in play you can use the ability twice during your turn and once at the end of your opponent's turn provided you have the mana for it. It can tap down lands, tap Genesis Chamber on the opponent's turn or at the end of your turn, tap down an important permanent (i.e. Tarmogoyf, Birthing Pod at the beginning of an opponent's turn, Deceiver Exarch in response to Splinter Twin, man lands, any creature equipped with Cranial Plating at the beginning of the attack phase, etc). The negative is that it dies to all the removal in the format, which is a big one.
Ephara, God of the Polis seems really powerful with Norin as well. Bob and Phyrexian Arena are very powerful cards, and having Ephara and Norin on the field simultaneously makes them look relatively fair and balanced in comparison. Given how creature centric the deck is Ephara seems like she'd be really really good. She would probably help the match-up against URx control decks, and unlike Purphoros, God of the Forge there is actually a chance that she could become a creature.
Blue also could give us Trusted Advisor (Poor man's Norin Jr. in my opinion), Meddling Mage (to improve the combo match-ups), and Snapcaster Mage (not sure about this because the deck seems so creature centric, but must be considered because he 1. Is powerful 2. Is blue 3. Is human 4. Is one of the few cards that can trigger Ephara at the beginning of our turn.)
Obviously all of those cards can't be included without going an entirely new direction with the deck, but I think that we have enough synergy going on with Ephara and blue humans that it makes blue part of the conservation and worth exploring.
So I chose 3 copies of Trusted Advisor because they can produce repeated additional ETBs like Norin. These work well with the 8 ETB blue creatures that have flash. The 8 flashers can all provide the ETB trigger on an opponent's upkeep so we can draw an additional card with Ephara, God of the Polis at the beginning of our upkeep. Even if you don't draw other blue creatures he basically triggers all ETBs on the battlefield for one mana a turn. He also blocks opponent's Myr tokens like a champ and won't get blown out by Electrolyze. Any thoughts on this list?
I do like the ingenuity of this list, and I did miss out on the Trusted Advisor. Although it is a slight toss up between him and Glitterfang. I would likely cut Venser to 2 and drop a land for 2 Purphoros for reasons stated below.
One thing I'd like to mention...the biggest reason why I believe we are running Purphoros is because we want him not to be a creature (Path to Exile is widely played), followed by the Indestructibility with the ETB effects. Firebreathing is just a bonus and a mana dump.
When I tried blue, I tried cards like Mistblade Shinobi and Sage of Epityr. For reference - an unblocked mistblade with one in hand = a blue mana dump to mass produce ETB triggers.
One of the best things about Norin is the low reliance on drawing lands (40-60% of the deck are only 1cc and with adding the 2cc drops, there's ~80% of the deck covered), and I never have seen a need for more than 21 lands, even with my normally 62 card decks.
1)The first reason is that Trusted Advisor triggers Champion of the Parish while Glitterfang does not. I feel like one of this deck's strengths is that it features what I think is the most powerful one drop creature in modern, Champion of the Parish, when built around properly. Being out of reach of Lightning Bolt by the end of turn two is pretty insane. Wild Nacatl can't even match that.
2) Glitterfang's usefulness outside of triggering ETB's becomes rather limited after a Genesis Chamber hits the table. 1/1 Myr blockers become an issue, while Advisor can actually chump block 1/1 creatures.
3) Electrolyze is a card that often leads to blowouts against Soul Sister decks. Having more 1 drops that dodge that problem card will improve the URx match-up.
4) The third reason and probably the biggest reason in my opinion that Trusted Advisor is better than Glitterfang is that soul sisters at their very core are creatures that play a control/midrange game. They attempt to control the game by controlling life totals. Sure the deck can take on the aggro beatdown role with Champion or Ajani's Pridemate when the opportunity presents itself, but I also think that we have to recognize that while these have a certain synergy together there is also a lack of synergy between the type of strategies that these creatures support. Glitterfang is useless outside of triggering ETBs and maybe doing a point of damage when the board is clear. I think that is one of this deck's biggest problems, which is why people went away from a pure RW strategy in order to splash black for more midrange/control based cards like Bitterblossom, Dark Confidant, and Blasting Station. The blue splash with Trusted Advisor and co allows us to shift the focus back to controlling the game by allowing us to play blue creatures that control the game through ETB effects.
So now we get to have access to many of the best creatures that play the midrange/control game like Snapcaster Mage, Venser, Shaper Savant, and Vendilion Clique and we get to bounce one of them back to our hand at the beginning of our upkeep.
And that brings us to the big reason for playing Ephara, God of the Polis. Ephara, is not good in a lot of aggro strategies because she doesn't do anything when she hits the field. Ephara is also not good in a lot of control decks because control decks tend to run relatively few creatures. She suffers from the same problem that Garruk, Caller of Beasts suffers from, which is creature centric decks tend not to play control based strategies. That is what makes this deck unique, in my opinion. The only deck that I can think of that attempts a similar strategy is Pod, and we all know how good Pod is.
So I was thinking about it and I have another idea to try out with Norin. I am curious to see how well people think it could work. Since I began exploring the idea of a blue splash a new card has come to my attention:
And then the other question is what applications can Intruder Alarm have specifically with Norin? Would all creatures basically having vigilance help us or the opponent more?
That one is apt to bite you in the butt, to be honest. It's true that it allows you to go infinite, but it also makes most creatures decks that much better. Unless you can win then and there (basically meaning purphoros on the battlefield) it seems win-more.
Just thought I'd share that delightful quote with my fellow Norin enthusiasts.
I've been stalking this decklist for a while but keep coming back to the same question
Why all the soul wardens?
I understand that originally the deck came from a soul sisters shell and then started abusing norin to earn extra triggers. However, many versions I see people running have stopped playing serra's ascendant or ajani's pridemate, two of the main ways to capitalize on all the lifegain. Lifegain is not by itself the strongest of mechanics. Are the wardens that good by themselves? Why not instead run more things to trigger ETB effects (mogg war-marshall etc.) or continue playing the ascendants/pridemates?
I'm pretty sure I'm missing something...
Sisters are easy-to-cast 1-drops. They don't provide a lot of advantage, but it snowballs as the game goes on. You gain 1 life here and there, and soon enough you find that you've gained enough to blank 3 of your opponent's attack phases.
Furthermore with the new unbans, you can bet lots of people are going to try Faeries or Tokens or Zoo. Sisters are good against those decks.
Bottom line is, if you're not playing Sisters, you have to play 8 other cards that trigger off ETB. And are preferably 1-drops.
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Big Johnny.
*Edit*
Here's my current RWB list and the observations so far:
3x Norin the Wary
3x Dark Confidant
3x Soul Warden
3x Soul's Attendant
3x Suture Priest
4x Blood Artist
Artifacts:
4x Genesis Chamber
2x Blasting Station
Enchantments:
2x Purphoros, God of the Forge
3x Bitterblossom
Instants/Sorceries:
1x Immortal Servitude
2x Killing Wave
2x Plunge into Darkness
2x Rakdos Charm
2x Boros Charm
1x Hide // Seek
2x Thoughtseize
1x Pyrrhic Revival
1x Kher Keep
2x Arid Mesa
2x Marsh Flats
3x Sacred Foundry
3x Blood Crypt
3x Godless Shrine
2x Plains
2x Swamp
1x Mountain
2x Patrician's Scorn
2x Shattering Spree
3x Path to Exile
2x Lightning Bolt
2x Hide // Seek
2x Thoughtseize
2x Inquisition of Kozilek
Bitterblossom is a definite enabler and as soon as 1 sister is on board, is a free flyer each turn. I utilized some tech from my zubera deck to help with clinching games. Killing Wave and an on board, unanswered Blood Artist, is often a minimum of 5 life hit to them. If you happen to have them low enough, wave for 0 and sac your board. Plunge into Darkness can help dig out what we need without too much hassle. Immortal Servitude is some testing tech, but I may drop this in place of something else. Pyrrhic Revival should be a 1 of only. If you have a decent graveyard, this could 1-shot them for crazy amounts depending on board set-up.
I was able to get some testing vs. UB Fae (obv...) and held my ground well until getting land flooded game and having to work around 2 snares and a SSS/Mutavault. Lost to a Cryptic counter to my patrician's scorn to take down my BB.
Also got some testing vs. hatebears. If they don't answer the BB and a sister/artist, they can't keep up. Highlight of one of the matches...2 BB's and artist on board for turns, trading my tokens to fodder ping them down into wave for 3 where they miscounted and kept a creature (2 actually) and if they hadn't kept anything, they would have been hit for 10 by artist and had 3 life left and a Voice token with me spiking over 20 w/ 2 BB's online. Didn't need Torpor orb hate on G2 as i just swung in w/ 2 sisters and Bob for multiple turns, bringing in my bolts and paths from the SB taking down any blocks till they couldn't handle a wave/artist for 3.
GW/R Enchantress (Legacy) R/WG
RW/G/ Norin The Champion/Norin the Artist (Modern) B//WR
GU Eternal Bouncing Command (Modern) UG
WUBRG Wish On A Stick (Modern) GRBUW
4 Wild Cantor
3 Mogg Fanatic
3 Soul Warden
3 Soul's Attendant
2 Mentor of the Meek
2 Purphoros, God of the Forge
4 Lightning Helix
4 Enduring Renewal
4 Proclamation of Rebirth
3 Path to Exile
3 Boros Garrison
2 Temple of Triumph
4 Sacred Foundry
1 Kher Keep
1 Pendelhaven
3 Arid Mesa
4 Mountain
4 Plains
This is a variant of an old deck I ran back in Time Spiral. I'm not sure why Enduring Renewal doesn't get much discussion. The banning of DRS is a big opening to graveyard recursion. Once you get a Wild Cantor, you have infinite recursion which translates into infinite life, infinite Mir tokens, or infinite Purphoros damage. ER combos very well with Proclamation of Rebirth.
3 Marsh Flats
2 Sacred Foundry
1 Godless Shrine
1 Blood Crypt
4 Cavern of Souls
2 Kher Keep
4 Plains
1 Mountain
1 Swamp
4 Champion of the Parish
3 Norin the Wary
4 Soul Warden
4 Soul's Attendant
1 Grim Lavamancer
1 Legion Loyalist
3 Ajani's Pridemate
3 Dark Confidant
2 Purphoros, God of the Forge
2 Ranger of Eos
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Path to Exile
3 Zealous Persecution
3 Hide//Seek
3 Kataki, War's Wage
2 Pithing Needle
2 Rest in Peace
2 Blood Moon
Very brief rundown of how the rounds went, because I didn't take notes. I also don't remember most of the sideboard decisions, largely because the board was thrown together with what I had on hand when I left. I know I pulled Genesis Chambers a few times, otherwise it was useless removal or one apiece of Warden/Attendant. Because I don't recall the exact changes I made, I'm not going to detail them. Assume I brought the cards in if they're mentioned, obviously.
Round 1: Splinter Twin
Game 1, opened with CotP, followed by CotP, then beat down from there. He didn't really play anything beyond a couple filtering spells, so I wasn't positive on what he was playing.
Game 2, I had slower opening. I think it involved a Warden followed by a Pridemate. Either way, I could pressure him somewhat. Got greedy around turn 5 and tapped out for Purphoros while he had an Exarch on the table, and got lucky that he didn't drop Kiki and win. Played two consecutive Needles on Kiki and Exarch the following turn, and he had nothing.
1-0 (2-0)
Round 2: Fish
Game 1, this entire round was bad. Kept two lands, two Bolts, a Path, and a Warden, then never saw another land or any kind of threat and got overrun by lords.
Game 2, I had the opposite problem. Got a Warden, followed with Confidant, then drew about 6 lands in a row. Spellskite on his end blanked the Bolts. Hit a second Confidant right before dying, and I was about to draw into triple Cavern.
1-1 (2-2)
Round 3: Ub Mill
Game 1, started with Warden into Pridemate, then hit Genesis Chamber and Norin. Pridemate got huge, and I eventually used a Ranger to grab Loyalist and ran over his remaining chumps.
Game 2, had another CotP into CotP start, followed by Norin. He couldn't keep up.
2-1 (4-2)
Round 4: Through the Breach/Goryo's Vengeance
Game 1, put a little pressure on him, then he Breached in an Emrakul and ate my board minus Norin.
Game 2, kept a starting hand with RiP and a couple other two drops, but only one land. Played Warden, hit the second land the next turn, dropped RiP, dropped Pridemate, then got mostly wiped by Engineered Explosives. He Goryo'd back Gristlebrand and Fury of the Horde'd me out.
2-2 (4-4)
Round 5: Scapeshift
Game 1, yet another CotP into CotP start, and get him before he can do much aside from ramp.
Game 2, start out a little slower, with Warden and Norin. I eventually ground him out with Purphoros, Kher Keep, and Norin, ending with the wonderful play of dropping a second Norin (blinking the first), then sending a Bolt to the dome to blink new Norin and deal exactly lethal when both Norins came back in.
3-2 (6-4)
Sorry about the vague report, but I figure something is better than nothing. Thoughts overall are that my board was pretty awful, which was expected. Mostly unknown meta, kind of thrown together. I'm planning on pulling the Persecutions for sure, because those were the flimsiest spots to begin with. Additional Paths and maybe an O-Ring might make their way there, otherwise it's likely to be more Needles or RiP. Hide//Seek will probably become Wear//Tear, but I have to pick them up first. I might also try and shove some Thoughtseize in there to shore up the combo matchup, but I'm not at all set on that, especially given the relatively light black base here. The rest of it I was pretty happy with.
In the maindeck, I was happy with how things worked out. Lavamancer didn't really see any good matchups tonight, but that was luck of the draw. Bob was fantastic whenever I saw him, and I'm very tempted to try and find room for a fourth. To address the concerns from some people a couple pages back in this thread about Bob alongside four drops, the average cmc of my list including lands is somewhere just a hair under 1. He's not causing significantly more damage than a Phyrexian Arena and has a lot of upsides. Kher Keep started out as a singleton, but I liked it so much when goldfishing that I upped it to two, and I didn't ever feel a color crunch because of it. I felt good about the numbers of all the major cards.
*edit : sorry i didn't read the latest decklist posts already include it.
My 180 Modern Bordered Only Cube
It's a trap. I've tried it but it never works in time to be effective. You're better off with Bitterblossom in the slot that you're using for them. I've either had the Priests and couldn't use them or had the priests when I could and they get shot down, and only a handful of times were they even worthwhile, and in those games I usually already had the upper hand.
GW/R Enchantress (Legacy) R/WG
RW/G/ Norin The Champion/Norin the Artist (Modern) B//WR
GU Eternal Bouncing Command (Modern) UG
WUBRG Wish On A Stick (Modern) GRBUW
1. Immortal Servitude vs. Proclamation of Rebirth, which is better or is running a split between the two a good idea?
2. I noticed that a lot of Soul Sister decks are running Spear of Heliod, which seems really good for us because it is an anthem that hits all of our white creatures and tokens simultaneously and gives us additional removal. Has anyone tested it out?
3. Angel of Jubilation can also accomplish the same thing as Spear of Heliod, being an anthem for all of our creatures, while also bringing some nice hate to decks that run cards like Pod, Abrupt Decay, Dismember, Gitaxian Probe, Shrapnel Blast, Viscera Seer, Arcbound Ravager, Fulminator Mage, Fetchlands (so a good budget option for a non-fetch build and I think I am going to try this as a pseudo Blood Moon type of effect in a straight up R/W non-fetch build), Griselbrand, and probably some other cards I am not thinking of. It also would protect Genesis Chamber from Qasali Pridemage in the Pod match up as well which seems relevant. Has anyone tested Angel of Jubilation?
1. Proclamation is the normal go to for this deck. However, Immortal hits the 2+ drops, so it really is a matter of utility, usability and colors. I run it in the RWB Artist version because it recurs what I need, but I may end up cutting it for something else as I've taken to Pyhrric Revival as the go to recursion for that list.
2. I don't really like Anthem effects, especially with the words Legendary Enchantment Artifact tied to them, as now it gets hit by more removal and poses no real benefit for running multiples.
3. Angel of Jubilation...anthem on wings...for 1WWW...not really worth the cost. The only major benefit is the subtext, but the cost is what seems to be prohibitive, not to mention it shuts down our Blasting Station, Plunge/Artist combo (not killing wave though!), and any Fling strategies. As I tend to run either RWG or RWB, I will not be testing it out any time soon, so maybe some others may have better input than I.
GW/R Enchantress (Legacy) R/WG
RW/G/ Norin The Champion/Norin the Artist (Modern) B//WR
GU Eternal Bouncing Command (Modern) UG
WUBRG Wish On A Stick (Modern) GRBUW
4 Soul Warden
4 Soul's Attendant
4 Norin the Wary
4 Ajani's Pridemate
3 Mentor of the Meek
2 Purphoros, God of the Forge
4 Path to Exile
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Genesis Chamber
3 Proclamation of Rebirth
4 Clifftop Retreat
4 Battlefield Forge
6 Plains
2 Mountain
4 Blood Moon
3 Angel of Jubilation
3 Stony Silence
2 Relic of Progenitus
3 Oblivion Ring
So since I am going cheap on the mana base with two colors, I figured I'd go the Blood Moon route in the sideboard. Oblivion Ring is for Torpor Orb and/or Planeswalkers. Angel of Jubilation is for Pod.
Any thoughts on my list?
The only things Suppression Field affects in your deck are Purphoros, Proclamation and Relic (if you board in both at the same time of course).
Captain of the Mists has great synergy with Norin and Genesis Chamber. With Norin in play you can use the ability twice during your turn and once at the end of your opponent's turn provided you have the mana for it. It can tap down lands, tap Genesis Chamber on the opponent's turn or at the end of your turn, tap down an important permanent (i.e. Tarmogoyf, Birthing Pod at the beginning of an opponent's turn, Deceiver Exarch in response to Splinter Twin, man lands, any creature equipped with Cranial Plating at the beginning of the attack phase, etc). The negative is that it dies to all the removal in the format, which is a big one.
Ephara, God of the Polis seems really powerful with Norin as well. Bob and Phyrexian Arena are very powerful cards, and having Ephara and Norin on the field simultaneously makes them look relatively fair and balanced in comparison. Given how creature centric the deck is Ephara seems like she'd be really really good. She would probably help the match-up against URx control decks, and unlike Purphoros, God of the Forge there is actually a chance that she could become a creature.
Blue also could give us Trusted Advisor (Poor man's Norin Jr. in my opinion), Meddling Mage (to improve the combo match-ups), and Snapcaster Mage (not sure about this because the deck seems so creature centric, but must be considered because he 1. Is powerful 2. Is blue 3. Is human 4. Is one of the few cards that can trigger Ephara at the beginning of our turn.)
Obviously all of those cards can't be included without going an entirely new direction with the deck, but I think that we have enough synergy going on with Ephara and blue humans that it makes blue part of the conservation and worth exploring.
I'll take a stab at a RWU list:
3 Norin the Wary
3 Soul's Attendant
3 Soul Warden
3 Trusted Advisor
2 Snapcaster Mage
2 Captain of the Mists
2 Vendilion Clique
3 Venser, Shaper Savant
4 Path to Exile
4 Genesis Chamber
2 Ephara, God of the Polis
So I chose 3 copies of Trusted Advisor because they can produce repeated additional ETBs like Norin. These work well with the 8 ETB blue creatures that have flash. The 8 flashers can all provide the ETB trigger on an opponent's upkeep so we can draw an additional card with Ephara, God of the Polis at the beginning of our upkeep. Even if you don't draw other blue creatures he basically triggers all ETBs on the battlefield for one mana a turn. He also blocks opponent's Myr tokens like a champ and won't get blown out by Electrolyze. Any thoughts on this list?
I do like the ingenuity of this list, and I did miss out on the Trusted Advisor. Although it is a slight toss up between him and Glitterfang. I would likely cut Venser to 2 and drop a land for 2 Purphoros for reasons stated below.
One thing I'd like to mention...the biggest reason why I believe we are running Purphoros is because we want him not to be a creature (Path to Exile is widely played), followed by the Indestructibility with the ETB effects. Firebreathing is just a bonus and a mana dump.
When I tried blue, I tried cards like Mistblade Shinobi and Sage of Epityr. For reference - an unblocked mistblade with one in hand = a blue mana dump to mass produce ETB triggers.
One of the best things about Norin is the low reliance on drawing lands (40-60% of the deck are only 1cc and with adding the 2cc drops, there's ~80% of the deck covered), and I never have seen a need for more than 21 lands, even with my normally 62 card decks.
GW/R Enchantress (Legacy) R/WG
RW/G/ Norin The Champion/Norin the Artist (Modern) B//WR
GU Eternal Bouncing Command (Modern) UG
WUBRG Wish On A Stick (Modern) GRBUW
1)The first reason is that Trusted Advisor triggers Champion of the Parish while Glitterfang does not. I feel like one of this deck's strengths is that it features what I think is the most powerful one drop creature in modern, Champion of the Parish, when built around properly. Being out of reach of Lightning Bolt by the end of turn two is pretty insane. Wild Nacatl can't even match that.
2) Glitterfang's usefulness outside of triggering ETB's becomes rather limited after a Genesis Chamber hits the table. 1/1 Myr blockers become an issue, while Advisor can actually chump block 1/1 creatures.
3) Electrolyze is a card that often leads to blowouts against Soul Sister decks. Having more 1 drops that dodge that problem card will improve the URx match-up.
4) The third reason and probably the biggest reason in my opinion that Trusted Advisor is better than Glitterfang is that soul sisters at their very core are creatures that play a control/midrange game. They attempt to control the game by controlling life totals. Sure the deck can take on the aggro beatdown role with Champion or Ajani's Pridemate when the opportunity presents itself, but I also think that we have to recognize that while these have a certain synergy together there is also a lack of synergy between the type of strategies that these creatures support. Glitterfang is useless outside of triggering ETBs and maybe doing a point of damage when the board is clear. I think that is one of this deck's biggest problems, which is why people went away from a pure RW strategy in order to splash black for more midrange/control based cards like Bitterblossom, Dark Confidant, and Blasting Station. The blue splash with Trusted Advisor and co allows us to shift the focus back to controlling the game by allowing us to play blue creatures that control the game through ETB effects.
So now we get to have access to many of the best creatures that play the midrange/control game like Snapcaster Mage, Venser, Shaper Savant, and Vendilion Clique and we get to bounce one of them back to our hand at the beginning of our upkeep.
And that brings us to the big reason for playing Ephara, God of the Polis. Ephara, is not good in a lot of aggro strategies because she doesn't do anything when she hits the field. Ephara is also not good in a lot of control decks because control decks tend to run relatively few creatures. She suffers from the same problem that Garruk, Caller of Beasts suffers from, which is creature centric decks tend not to play control based strategies. That is what makes this deck unique, in my opinion. The only deck that I can think of that attempts a similar strategy is Pod, and we all know how good Pod is.
So the obvious cards to combo off with Intruder Alarm are Thraben Doomsayer, Krenko, Mob Boss, Elemental Mastery, Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker, and Splinter Twin. Is there a way to keep the Norin shell, but put a twist on it such that comboing off for infinite life gain and infinite damage is a secondary win condition?
And then the other question is what applications can Intruder Alarm have specifically with Norin? Would all creatures basically having vigilance help us or the opponent more?
Credit to DolZero for this awesome sig!