I was def wrong about him and props to whoever started using him. I also have a small ToN toolbox and have limited the control elements. I want to be aggressive and proactive.
I was def wrong about him and props to whoever started using him.
By "him", do you mean Traft, Rhox War Monk, or what? Traft is an enormous beater on an empty board, vexes spot removal-heavy decks by being Hexproof, and forces other aggro decks to lose their mojo by leaving behind a blocker every turn. RWM, thanks to the Lifelink and the large butt, is very good against RDW and Zoo and decent against aggro and that might be it.
Also, you might want to stick Thalia, Guardian of Thraben in the sideboard as supplementary control and combo hate. Making board wipes, Splinter Twin, Dispel, and every single UR Storm spell cost 1 mana more can be everything. Plus, Time of Need gets her, and she holds off buggers like Bloodbraid Elf all day.
Has anyone considered Remand over mana leak? It seems like it would be really good in this deck as in many cases we only need to hold of there removal or fat creature from hitting and it would replace itself.
It seems better than mana leak to some extent, but i have yet to see any bant decks run it over leak. Anyone care to explain?
Noticed you arn’t playing Vendillion Clique. He’s one of my personal MVPs but for all I know, stuck in the middle of nowhere, the meta could be evolving away from him. Have you missed him? Otherwise out lists look very similar.
Also how do you find having various swords? I think the steelshapers gift (SSG) package may be better when running different swords, how often do you find yourself wanting a different sword? Would you consider cutting one for a SSG? Would give you functionally two copies of 2 for the 1st sword.
I really like your list tho. It’s pretty streamline. Clique just seems like an insane sword carrier though.
I love Clique it is sooo good in this meta and flying is super relevant when running swords. i just started running SSG and i really have liked it better than drawing the sword every time it gives me options and when i side in snappys it is flashbackable as well.
Noticed you arn’t playing Vendillion Clique. He’s one of my personal MVPs but for all I know, stuck in the middle of nowhere, the meta could be evolving away from him. Have you missed him? Otherwise out lists look very similar.
Also how do you find having various swords? I think the steelshapers gift (SSG) package may be better when running different swords, how often do you find yourself wanting a different sword? Would you consider cutting one for a SSG? Would give you functionally two copies of 2 for the 1st sword.
I really like your list tho. It’s pretty streamline. Clique just seems like an insane sword carrier though.
Clique finds its way in and out of my list, but I never seem to miss it when I drop it. It has the ability to strip combo pieces like a champ and carry a sword etc, etc.. I just don't know. I'm rarely (virtually never) finding myself in a position where I have 3 untapped mana early enough to count, really, and if I do, then I'm gambling that Clique is going to do any substantial damage to my opponent's hand. If she doesn't, then at best I have a 3/1 flier. On the flipside, I can leave 1-2 untapped and just hold onto a counter or a path. Could be stronger in a truly competitive environment, where I have little experience.
As for the swords, I did run 2 steelshaper's gift for a while along with two swords (sofaf and sofai), and I am actually struggling to recall why I cut them. Looking back on it, I think I pulled them right before I put up this list to bump up to 23 creatures for testing.. I am still open to the flexibility of having them in.
The more I play this deck, the more I feel that spell pierce is the only counter I really even care to have. It's doing everything I typically need, and pte takes care of the guys.
Another card that is always in and out of my list is Bant Charm. It's incredibly versatile. Haven't really decided what to do with it, yet.
I posted my PTQ top 8 list in the old thread, but it obviously hasn't been posted over. Anyway, continued to play my Heavy aggro version today in a tournament, and split the first prize after going unbeaten (3-0-2 in Swiss, then 2 wins in top 8).
I dumped mana leak a while back- I never want to play in in the early game, whilst I'm trying to pressure with my 3 drops, then Elspeth (I still run 4, she's a total boss).
Late game it's just too weak. For now, Mystic Snake replaced it- hard counter, emergency blocker and it laughs at Splinter twin's Dispel suite.
The Troll and Worship idea seems like great sideboard tech, I think I'll add both to deal with Twin and Affinity. Troll Ascetic is strong anyway- I bring him in over Mirran Crusader if Crusader lacks relevant protections.
I am happy you mentioned Mystic Snake; one of my very favorite cards. Until now, I hadn't seen anyone running it outside of UG counter-aggro, but I'd like to find a place for it.
If you feel at all comfortable posting your current list, would be quite helpful to take a look at it!
I assume the rest of your manabase is pretty in-line with most lists we've seen, but the 4 manlands is a notable departure. Those along with Mystic Snake appear to be the biggest changes you've made compared to the "typical" build. I think it's safe to say at this point that 8 mana-dorks is gonna be pretty standard moving forward. Definitely an aggro-heavy version with 25 creatures. Do you also run Moorland Haunt and Celestial Colonnade, or have the 4 manlands cropped them out of your list?
Looks like I was wrong as wrong can be about the WB Martyr deck. 13-0 at the GP. We definitely will need something against this going forward. Inquisition and life gain are tough for us.
How about Linvala, Keeper of Silence? I've been trying it out against the Splinter MU and it seems like it would be decent at shuting down any Martyr tricks.
with the bottom half in the board. Thoughts on Linvala mainboard? I mean her body is always relevant even if her ability is not and flying is good with swords.
Clique mb is for combo, I usually never want to see it otherwise. The other one comes in g2.
Mangara of Corondor is for trouble permanents and makes g1 against Tron and ramp tip nicely in my favor.
Rafiq and Geist are standard finishers.
Thalia is for UR Storm. I prefer this over Clique but g2 I use them all.
Gaddock Teeg is for Tron, Teachings, Gifts, etc.
Kataki is a house against Affinity if he sticks for a turn. I run 2 just in case they manage to untap with removal in hand.
Linvala is for SplinterTwin and Martyr and is sometimes a one of against Merfolk.
This should help people with design and building sideboards. Also you can expect the Aggro-loam list from the GP to see a huge spike in popularity. GY hate should prob. take up 1-2 slots in every sideboard for the time being.
Clique mb is for combo, I usually never want to see it otherwise. The other one comes in g2.
Mangara of Corondor is for trouble permanents and makes g1 against Tron and ramp tip nicely in my favor.
Rafiq and Geist are standard finishers.
Thalia is for UR Storm. I prefer this over Clique but g2 I use them all.
Gaddock Teeg is for Tron, Teachings, Gifts, etc.
Kataki is a house against Affinity if he sticks for a turn. I run 2 just in case they manage to untap with removal in hand.
Linvala is for SplinterTwin and Martyr and is sometimes a one of against Merfolk.
My main issue with Time of NEed is that you telegraph every one of your plays. It lets better players play around them, etc. Also it adds a net 1G to every one of your targets.
Honestly I love the Time of Need stuff, but it just seems too cute. It's obviously much slower and more predictable. The power behind bant is in the resillience of its creature-base. I think Worship is an interesting card choice..
Here's something that might work.. Hexproof Bant anyone?
I was def wrong about him and props to whoever started using him. I also have a small ToN toolbox and have limited the control elements. I want to be aggressive and proactive.
4 Noble Hierarch
2 Birds of Paradise
3 Lotus Cobra
Beaters
3 Mirran Crusader
3 Geist of Saint Graft
3 Rhox War Monk
Legendary Creatures
1 Thrun, the Last Troll
1 Rafiq of the Many
1 Linvala, Keeper of Silence
1 Kira, Great Glass Spinner
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Steelshaper's gift
2 Time of Need
2 Elspeth, Knight-errant
Artifacts
1 Sword of war and peace
1 Sword of feast and famine
1 behemoth sledge
Land
1 Hallowed Fountain
1 Breeding Pool
4 Misty rainforest
3 razorverge thicket
3 seachrome coast
3 tectonic edge
2 horizon canopy
1 flooded grove
1 treetop village
1 island
1 plains
1 forest
By "him", do you mean Traft, Rhox War Monk, or what? Traft is an enormous beater on an empty board, vexes spot removal-heavy decks by being Hexproof, and forces other aggro decks to lose their mojo by leaving behind a blocker every turn. RWM, thanks to the Lifelink and the large butt, is very good against RDW and Zoo and decent against aggro and that might be it.
Also, you might want to stick Thalia, Guardian of Thraben in the sideboard as supplementary control and combo hate. Making board wipes, Splinter Twin, Dispel, and every single UR Storm spell cost 1 mana more can be everything. Plus, Time of Need gets her, and she holds off buggers like Bloodbraid Elf all day.
It seems better than mana leak to some extent, but i have yet to see any bant decks run it over leak. Anyone care to explain?
Modern:
UWThe End ForetoldUW
and thanks for the Thalia suggestion! I like!
1 Temple Garden
2 Breeding Pool
1 Forest
1 Island
1 Plains
4 Misty Rainforest
3 Verdant Catacombs
2 Marsh Flats
1 Celestial Colonnade
1 Moorland Haunt
2 Horizon Canopy
1 Eiganjo Castle
1 Tectonic Edge
4 Birds of Paradise
3 Qasali Pridemage
3 Geist of Saint Traft
2 Mirran Crusader
3 Troll Ascetic
2 Kitchen Finks
2 Thrun, the Last Troll
2 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
2 Worship
1 Steelshaper's Gift
3 Path to Exile
4 Spell Pierce
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Sword of War and Peace
2 Obstinate Baloth
1 Surgical Extraction
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Great Sable Stag
3 Creeping Corrosion
1 Krosan Grip
3 Mindbreak Trap
1 Leyline of Sanctity
Current list updated 2/22
CG
Noticed you arn’t playing Vendillion Clique. He’s one of my personal MVPs but for all I know, stuck in the middle of nowhere, the meta could be evolving away from him. Have you missed him? Otherwise out lists look very similar.
Also how do you find having various swords? I think the steelshapers gift (SSG) package may be better when running different swords, how often do you find yourself wanting a different sword? Would you consider cutting one for a SSG? Would give you functionally two copies of 2 for the 1st sword.
I really like your list tho. It’s pretty streamline. Clique just seems like an insane sword carrier though.
Modern:
UWThe End ForetoldUW
Clique finds its way in and out of my list, but I never seem to miss it when I drop it. It has the ability to strip combo pieces like a champ and carry a sword etc, etc.. I just don't know. I'm rarely (virtually never) finding myself in a position where I have 3 untapped mana early enough to count, really, and if I do, then I'm gambling that Clique is going to do any substantial damage to my opponent's hand. If she doesn't, then at best I have a 3/1 flier. On the flipside, I can leave 1-2 untapped and just hold onto a counter or a path. Could be stronger in a truly competitive environment, where I have little experience.
As for the swords, I did run 2 steelshaper's gift for a while along with two swords (sofaf and sofai), and I am actually struggling to recall why I cut them. Looking back on it, I think I pulled them right before I put up this list to bump up to 23 creatures for testing.. I am still open to the flexibility of having them in.
The more I play this deck, the more I feel that spell pierce is the only counter I really even care to have. It's doing everything I typically need, and pte takes care of the guys.
Another card that is always in and out of my list is Bant Charm. It's incredibly versatile. Haven't really decided what to do with it, yet.
CG
I am happy you mentioned Mystic Snake; one of my very favorite cards. Until now, I hadn't seen anyone running it outside of UG counter-aggro, but I'd like to find a place for it.
If you feel at all comfortable posting your current list, would be quite helpful to take a look at it!
CG
I assume the rest of your manabase is pretty in-line with most lists we've seen, but the 4 manlands is a notable departure. Those along with Mystic Snake appear to be the biggest changes you've made compared to the "typical" build. I think it's safe to say at this point that 8 mana-dorks is gonna be pretty standard moving forward. Definitely an aggro-heavy version with 25 creatures. Do you also run Moorland Haunt and Celestial Colonnade, or have the 4 manlands cropped them out of your list?
CG
CG
but what else?? Even s/b tech needs to do more
I agree on WaP. with crusader you can do work.
2x time of need
1x thrun, the last troll
2x Rafiq of the many
3x Geist of Saint traft
1x Gaddock Teeg
1x gaddock teeg
1x thalia, guardian of
1x Linvala, keeper of silence
1x eight-and-a-half tails
with the bottom half in the board. Thoughts on Linvala mainboard? I mean her body is always relevant even if her ability is not and flying is good with swords.
3x Time of Need
Creature (23):
1x Vendilion Clique
1x Mangara of Corondor
1x Rafiq of the Many
1x Geist of Saint Traft
1x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
1x Vendilion Clique
1x Gaddock Teeg
2x Kataki, War's Wage
2x Linvala, Keeper of Silence
Clique mb is for combo, I usually never want to see it otherwise. The other one comes in g2.
Mangara of Corondor is for trouble permanents and makes g1 against Tron and ramp tip nicely in my favor.
Rafiq and Geist are standard finishers.
Thalia is for UR Storm. I prefer this over Clique but g2 I use them all.
Gaddock Teeg is for Tron, Teachings, Gifts, etc.
Kataki is a house against Affinity if he sticks for a turn. I run 2 just in case they manage to untap with removal in hand.
Linvala is for SplinterTwin and Martyr and is sometimes a one of against Merfolk.
Meleria Pod: 76 (17.9%)
Jund: 63 (14.9%)
UW/UB/UR Tron: 49 (11.6%)
3-4c Delver: (w/ or w/o Scepter): 35 (8.3%)
Affinity: 35 (8.3%)
UR Storm: 33 (7.8%)
Caw-Blade: 33 (7.8%)
Red w/ or w/o B Burn: 29 (6.8%)
UR Twin: 23 (5.4%)
Martyr: 14 (3.3%)
Boros: 14 (3.3%)
Geist Bant: 6 (1.4%)
Merfolk: 6 (1.4%)
Mono-U Fae: 6 (1.4%)
Teachings: 5 (1.2%)
Total: 424
Aggro Control U/x: 86 (20%)
Hyper Aggro R/x: 43 (10%)
Control: 54 (12.7%)
Combo {Macro}: 132 (31.3%) [99(23.3%) creature based]
Outliers:
Jund: 63 (14.9%)
Affinity: 35 (8.3%)
Martyr: 14 (3.3%)
This should help people with design and building sideboards. Also you can expect the Aggro-loam list from the GP to see a huge spike in popularity. GY hate should prob. take up 1-2 slots in every sideboard for the time being.
My main issue with Time of NEed is that you telegraph every one of your plays. It lets better players play around them, etc. Also it adds a net 1G to every one of your targets.
Here's something that might work.. Hexproof Bant anyone?
4 Birds of Paradise
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Qasali Pridemage
3 Invisible Stalker
4 Troll Ascetic
3 Geist of Saint Traft
2 Thrun, the Last Troll
Planeswalkers (2):
2 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
Artifacts (2):
2 Sword of War and Peace
Enchantments (5):
1 Moldervine Cloak
2 Worship
2 Angelic Destiny
Instants (4):
4 Path to Exile
4 Misty Rainforest
3 Verdant Catacombs
1 Temple Garden
1 Breeding Pool
1 Hallowed Fountain
1 Eiganjo Castle
1 Okina, Temple to the Grandfathers
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Moorland Haunt
1 Treetop Village
4 Forest
2 Plains
2 Island
4 Spell Pierce
2 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
1 Seal of Primordium
3 Kitchen Finks
3 Creeping Corrosion
2 Obstinate Baloth
Draft My Cube!