You've forgotten WHY URzatron was so good in Rav/Kam Standard; Wildfire. Against Zoo/Gruul, you Repeal, Remand, Electrolyze their dorks, cantripping into Tron. Then you'd drop a Keiga or a Simic Sky Swallower and Wildfire the board. You swing for 4 turns while they can't do anything but watch.
I made a version like this on MTGO and haven't lost yet. I'm not sure how it will fair against the more popular decks (since Modern seems to be all over the place). I'm just wondering what yous guys's take on a Wildfire version would be
You've forgotten WHY URzatron was so good in Rav/Kam Standard; Wildfire. Against Zoo/Gruul, you Repeal, Remand, Electrolyze their dorks, cantripping into Tron. Then you'd drop a Keiga or a Simic Sky Swallower and Wildfire the board. You swing for 4 turns while they can't do anything but watch.
I made a version like this on MTGO and haven't lost yet. I'm not sure how it will fair against the more popular decks (since Modern seems to be all over the place). I'm just wondering what yous guys's take on a Wildfire version would be
Have you played in any dailies with it or are you just talking about the tournament practice room?
Thoughts on Izzet Charm? I feel it plugs a lot of holes by acting as digging and an answer spell all in one card. Instant speed is awesome and it only costs two mana. The only downside is the slightly color-intensive mana cost, but having something cost only two different colors of mana should be something this deck can stomach.
It's pretty colour-intensive. Don't expect to be able to reliably cast it on Turn 2, and I can't even rely on it on Turn 3. It's sort of like Electrolyze, except that card doesn't come with expectations that it should be castable on Turn 2.
Good question! But the answer is it depends. RG Tron is faster. But Izzet Tron has other tools such as through the breach, remand, draw spells and a better SB(thx to U). UR Tron is more resilient, imho while RG Tron is more consistent in terms of T3 dominance.
On another subject, what do you think about including Karn in the list?
So honestly how does this version of Tron do against all the lovely Jund variants
It's hard, we have some SB options and can win (especially with BBE banned). Basically, you either win fast with a good draw or try to play some control and work around them with removal and card draw to recompose your hand.
Larry Swasey (the guy who built Geist of Saint Win) is playing with the deck and streaming right now: http://www.twitch.tv/krazykirby
The only problem I see with the deck right now is: UW and RG are "better" 'cause they are more consistent/resilient. Given that, people are packing Tron hate and we, the less consistent build, are hit harder by it. Otherwise, still a good and fun deck.
So, I played four games last night and went 2-2, beating UWR Midrange and BW tokens and losing to Storm and BW tokens.
The tokens matchup is OK given I'm playing 4 Pyroclasm. In the match I lost, first game my opp had two Thoughtseize and took out two clasms, third game I never drew one.
Pyroclasm is also very good against UWR "Geist of Saint Win". I managed to win the third game even after two Tectonic Edges and a Stony Silence disabling my Signets. Repeal is really good right now to deal with all these pesky enchantments/artifacts out there.
One of the games against UWR was really long, I breached Ulamog and he kept playing. Then I hardcasted Ulamog, who ate a Path to Exile. Then, finally, I was able to hardcast Emrakul (via Eye of Ugin) and this is why the Tron is needed (otherwise plain UR Breach would be better).
I talked a bit with Jarvis Yu, the guy who PTQ'ed last year with this deck and he told me it's too slow for the current meta, but if I wanted to play I should play 4 Pyroclasm, Electrolyze and Remand (and no Gifts), also saying the Bolt isn't the best fit. So I went with his advice and removed Lightning Bolt for some more Electrolyze and Thirst for Knowledge.
I really need to replace Shivan Reef with Steam Vents or Sulfur Falls. I lost a game at 1 life with Breach and Emrakul, but only Reef as a red source (the guy was eating my lands with Edges and Sowing Salt).
The deck is pretty resilient to LD. All we need is hitting five mana (Signets help a lot) and draw/cantrip until finding Emrakul and Breach. The Tron is a late game B plan. This is the reason I'm thinking about cutting Expedition Map to just 2 or 3 copies. I removed one for games 2 and 3 of most of my matches and all went fine.
For the SB, here's what I'm thinking about right now:
3 Ratchet Bomb (tokens may be a problem even with clasms)
4 Faerie Macabre (GY hate that doesn't sit on the table waiting for removal/bounce)
4 Torpor Orb (Twin and some other combos)
4 Dispel (helps a lot against control)
So, a SB with less options but really focused in some problematic matchups. Shadow of Doubt is also a nice option here.
I'm yet to face Eggs, don't know how good/bad the matchup is.
I'll also try Izzet Charms instead of Thirst for Knowledge to see what happens.
The reason Breach + Emrakul is slow is because it's incredibly inconsistent, and the rest of the deck does literally nothing except hope to draw into a bad combo. Annex hits turn 3 with a signet, and you can build the rest of the deck into a real UR control deck since you don't have to burn 8-16 slots on crap.
FatBatman has the right idea with his decklist, though it would be a lot better without the 8 eggs taking up tons of space.
Yeah, UR Tron with Breach is effectively a "combo" deck. I wouldn't say it have 16 slots of crap. You're using cantrips to delay the game and dig into the pieces. I never played a game where my opp survived a breached Emrakul.
But I agree the deck isn't consistent. Gifts "ensures" that consistency, but then again we don't run white to ensure survival up to the point we're able to Gifts into all the needed pieces. With all the cantrips and card draw, I end up with Breach + Eldrazi almost all games. Anyway, I play the deck mostly for fun.
Lost 0-2 to Monoblue Tron. Game 1 I had clear advantage, except I had two Breaches in my hand and never drew Emrakul nor Eye of Ugin/Tolaria West/Expedition Map. Game two I was smashed and Mindslaved. His Tectnonic Edge was key here, I'm thinking about using one myself if the manabase supports it.
Won 2-1 against Huntmaster Jund. Three pretty close games. First one I hardcasted Emrakul for the win. Game two, double IoK on turns 1 and 2 taking two Pyroclasms (pretty good in this matchup) and I fell behind. Game 3 began with double IoK again, getting a Signet first and nothing after that (I had Emrakul and just lands), then I drew into one more Signet and Breach FTW.
I'm testing the list with just 3 Expedition Map, 2 Thirst for Knowledge and 2 Electrolyze, adding 4 Condescend. The idea is test if Condescend's Scry 2 helps me filter things out of the way and get to Breach/Emrakul faster.
why is it that we don't see many G/U Tron decks around?
Because no one's managed to come up with a good list yet. All the G/U lands cause pain and it's as slow as/slower than R/G.
Also, I'm pretty sure UR Tron's basically dead at this point, right? Isn't any reason you'd want to run Through the Breach better off in Glass Cannon Griselbrand, where you still run Breaches and Emrakuls, but also Griselbrands and Goryos?
I definitely see good UG and UR versions possible. I still casually play UR with Breach and it's good.
The issue is that the meta is really hard for "traditional" Tron decks right now (which includes MonoU). You either do something "unfair" like R/G does or play some kind of combo, 'cause the rest of the field if full of goodstuff 3/4 color decks that can interact and deal with anything "fair" or slow paced. That's why Control also has a hard time currently.
I definitely see good UG and UR versions possible. I still casually play UR with Breach and it's good.
The issue is that the meta is really hard for "traditional" Tron decks right now (which includes MonoU). You either do something "unfair" like R/G does or play some kind of combo, 'cause the rest of the field if full of goodstuff 3/4 color decks that can interact and deal with anything "fair" or slow paced. That's why Control also has a hard time currently.
R/G Tron is the original Tron. And the meta's pretty cutthroat, but that doesn't look like its going to change anytime soon. Maybe if mono-U attempted some leaks? Tempo like Remand isn't that amazing when it still gives them the win the following turn.
I've been constantly changing things up in the build,I've even thought about primeval titan.
First of all, don't run 3 Emrakul. Without Breach, the most you need is 1. When you need it, you tutor for it after tutoring for Eye.
Second of all, run 1 All Is Dust max. It's good, but with Affinity and Twin (which O-Stone is good/decent but Dust dead) around, you really don't want to risk the dead weight.
Consider switching up the mana base. 4 Breeding Pools is a lot of damage to take for simply untapped lands. Consider Yavimaya Coast and Misty Rainforest with basics.
Finally, consider some Prophetic Prisms. I've found them pretty good in RG Tron, and you need the fixing far more here.
R/G Tron is the original Tron. And the meta's pretty cutthroat, but that doesn't look like its going to change anytime soon. Maybe if mono-U attempted some leaks? Tempo like Remand isn't that amazing when it still gives them the win the following turn.
First of all, don't run 3 Emrakul. Without Breach, the most you need is 1. When you need it, you tutor for it after tutoring for Eye.
Second of all, run 1 All Is Dust max. It's good, but with Affinity and Twin (which O-Stone is good/decent but Dust dead) around, you really don't want to risk the dead weight.
Consider switching up the mana base. 4 Breeding Pools is a lot of damage to take for simply untapped lands. Consider Yavimaya Coast and Misty Rainforest with basics.
Finally, consider some Prophetic Prisms. I've found them pretty good in RG Tron, and you need the fixing far more here.
thank you for the Prophetic Prism suggestion,i will surely add it to my list.and Yavimaya Coast has been a land i've been thinking off adding in place of the Breeding pools.But i have a question.wouldn't 4 city of brass be better? or are they limited to only one in modern decks? i have added Chromatic Lantern (although i might add another if i run 3 colors)for major mana fixing,i can even through in Breath and be fine.although i also have smmoning trap,thus is why i run 3 Emrakuls.had 2 at first,but found it slower to get him out.even with the eye to help.but my favorite strategy in here is my Karn win condition.-14 on turn 5 with Emrakul exiled do to his +4 a turn before.yeah.And i have to thanks Explore for that.letting me drop the 3rd Urza Land on turn 2.
I have very little knowledge of past events and such,im very new at competative playing.and specially to Modern.i just have to go out and test this deck in person.but i have yet to own all the cards needed for this.it's stll under-construction.
Private Mod Note
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Many Thanks to Rivenor for the Stunning Sig and Ace5301 for the Amazing Avatar.
thank you for the Prophetic Prism suggestion,i will surely add it to my list.and Yavimaya Coast has been a land i've been thinking off adding in place of the Breeding pools.But i have a question.wouldn't 4 city of brass be better? or are they limited to only one in modern decks? i have added Chromatic Lantern (although i might add another if i run 3 colors)for major mana fixing,i can even through in Breath and be fine.although i also have smmoning trap,thus is why i run 3 Emrakuls.had 2 at first,but found it slower to get him out.even with the eye to help.but my favorite strategy in here is my Karn win condition.-14 on turn 5 with Emrakul exiled do to his +4 a turn before.yeah.And i have to thanks Explore for that.letting me drop the 3rd Urza Land on turn 2.
I have very little knowledge of past events and such,im very new at competative playing.and specially to Modern.i just have to go out and test this deck in person.but i have yet to own all the cards needed for this.it's stll under-construction.
If you're controlling the field with Karn, a restart shouldn't be necessary. Eye -> Emrakul -> cast should be game. In fact, exiling Emrakul with Karn is dangerous, because it lets them Pulse Karn to put you at a disadvantage. You should be focusing on winning with the advantage Karn provides, not relying on restarts to win. It's not as reliable.
Chromatic Lantern is too slow, and the land ability interacts poorly with Tron pieces. The amount of time you're expecting to go for just isn't realistic. Decks are far too fast. Splashing red for breach isn't worth it when you can just spend that effort ramping into a legitimate Emrakul. You're already racing the clock because you're hurting yourself with your lands, and you're forgoing the Clasms of RG Tron.
Summoning Trap is also too unreliable. If you want to cheat dudes, go for Glass Cannon Griselbrand when you can do it reliably; cheating out stuff with Breach should NOT be your plan, especially if red isn't in your colors. Tron relies on the reliable threat of a T3 Karn/Wurmcoil to be fast enough; Breaching and Trapping is unreliable and gives you bad draws with multiple Emrakuls.
City of Brass is bad because tapping it will damage you no matter what. If you don't need colored mana, Yavimaya Coast won't deal you damage.
I made a version like this on MTGO and haven't lost yet. I'm not sure how it will fair against the more popular decks (since Modern seems to be all over the place). I'm just wondering what yous guys's take on a Wildfire version would be
Have you played in any dailies with it or are you just talking about the tournament practice room?
I'd rather play stuff like Spell Pierce or Condescend if you need the answer.
Good question! But the answer is it depends. RG Tron is faster. But Izzet Tron has other tools such as through the breach, remand, draw spells and a better SB(thx to U). UR Tron is more resilient, imho while RG Tron is more consistent in terms of T3 dominance.
On another subject, what do you think about including Karn in the list?
WU Resto Blade
RUG Tron
BUG Infect
WBG Melira Pod
WBRG White Jund
I had to stop playing for some months but now I'm back.
Are you guys still playing the deck?
What cards we got from Return to Ravnica? I saw Izzet Charm, but I'm not sure if fits here.
It's hard, we have some SB options and can win (especially with BBE banned). Basically, you either win fast with a good draw or try to play some control and work around them with removal and card draw to recompose your hand.
I updated the Primer with possible SB additions (Counterflux and Aura Barbs) and a mention of Izzet Charm.
Larry Swasey (the guy who built Geist of Saint Win) is playing with the deck and streaming right now: http://www.twitch.tv/krazykirby
The only problem I see with the deck right now is: UW and RG are "better" 'cause they are more consistent/resilient. Given that, people are packing Tron hate and we, the less consistent build, are hit harder by it. Otherwise, still a good and fun deck.
The tokens matchup is OK given I'm playing 4 Pyroclasm. In the match I lost, first game my opp had two Thoughtseize and took out two clasms, third game I never drew one.
Pyroclasm is also very good against UWR "Geist of Saint Win". I managed to win the third game even after two Tectonic Edges and a Stony Silence disabling my Signets. Repeal is really good right now to deal with all these pesky enchantments/artifacts out there.
One of the games against UWR was really long, I breached Ulamog and he kept playing. Then I hardcasted Ulamog, who ate a Path to Exile. Then, finally, I was able to hardcast Emrakul (via Eye of Ugin) and this is why the Tron is needed (otherwise plain UR Breach would be better).
I talked a bit with Jarvis Yu, the guy who PTQ'ed last year with this deck and he told me it's too slow for the current meta, but if I wanted to play I should play 4 Pyroclasm, Electrolyze and Remand (and no Gifts), also saying the Bolt isn't the best fit. So I went with his advice and removed Lightning Bolt for some more Electrolyze and Thirst for Knowledge.
Here's the current build:
4 Urza's Tower
4 Urza's Mine
3 Island
2 Shivan Reef
2 Steam Vents
1 Tolaria West
4 Scalding Tarn
1 Eye of Ugin
1 Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre
4 Izzet Signet
4 Expedition Map
4 Pyroclasm
4 Remand
4 Through the Breach
4 Repeal
4 Electrolyze
3 Thirst for Knowledge
I really need to replace Shivan Reef with Steam Vents or Sulfur Falls. I lost a game at 1 life with Breach and Emrakul, but only Reef as a red source (the guy was eating my lands with Edges and Sowing Salt).
The deck is pretty resilient to LD. All we need is hitting five mana (Signets help a lot) and draw/cantrip until finding Emrakul and Breach. The Tron is a late game B plan. This is the reason I'm thinking about cutting Expedition Map to just 2 or 3 copies. I removed one for games 2 and 3 of most of my matches and all went fine.
For the SB, here's what I'm thinking about right now:
3 Ratchet Bomb (tokens may be a problem even with clasms)
4 Faerie Macabre (GY hate that doesn't sit on the table waiting for removal/bounce)
4 Torpor Orb (Twin and some other combos)
4 Dispel (helps a lot against control)
So, a SB with less options but really focused in some problematic matchups. Shadow of Doubt is also a nice option here.
I'm yet to face Eggs, don't know how good/bad the matchup is.
I'll also try Izzet Charms instead of Thirst for Knowledge to see what happens.
Unfortunately, I think it's not viable in Modern. If Breach + Emrakul is "slow", imagine Annex.
FatBatman has the right idea with his decklist, though it would be a lot better without the 8 eggs taking up tons of space.
But I agree the deck isn't consistent. Gifts "ensures" that consistency, but then again we don't run white to ensure survival up to the point we're able to Gifts into all the needed pieces. With all the cantrips and card draw, I end up with Breach + Eldrazi almost all games. Anyway, I play the deck mostly for fun.
I just saw a monoblue Tron deck that looks very interesting, it won a Modern Premier on MTGO: http://www.wizards.com/Magic/Digital/MagicOnlineTourn.aspx?x=mtg/digital/magiconline/tourn/4965298
Lost 0-2 to Monoblue Tron. Game 1 I had clear advantage, except I had two Breaches in my hand and never drew Emrakul nor Eye of Ugin/Tolaria West/Expedition Map. Game two I was smashed and Mindslaved. His Tectnonic Edge was key here, I'm thinking about using one myself if the manabase supports it.
Won 2-1 against Huntmaster Jund. Three pretty close games. First one I hardcasted Emrakul for the win. Game two, double IoK on turns 1 and 2 taking two Pyroclasms (pretty good in this matchup) and I fell behind. Game 3 began with double IoK again, getting a Signet first and nothing after that (I had Emrakul and just lands), then I drew into one more Signet and Breach FTW.
I'm testing the list with just 3 Expedition Map, 2 Thirst for Knowledge and 2 Electrolyze, adding 4 Condescend. The idea is test if Condescend's Scry 2 helps me filter things out of the way and get to Breach/Emrakul faster.
Many Thanks to Rivenor for the Stunning Sig and Ace5301 for the Amazing Avatar.
Because no one's managed to come up with a good list yet. All the G/U lands cause pain and it's as slow as/slower than R/G.
Also, I'm pretty sure UR Tron's basically dead at this point, right? Isn't any reason you'd want to run Through the Breach better off in Glass Cannon Griselbrand, where you still run Breaches and Emrakuls, but also Griselbrands and Goryos?
GX Tron XG
UR Phoenix RU
GG Freyalise High Tide GG
UR Parun Counterspells RU
BB Yawgmoth Token Storm BB
WB Pestilence BW
The issue is that the meta is really hard for "traditional" Tron decks right now (which includes MonoU). You either do something "unfair" like R/G does or play some kind of combo, 'cause the rest of the field if full of goodstuff 3/4 color decks that can interact and deal with anything "fair" or slow paced. That's why Control also has a hard time currently.
4 Urza's Mine
4 Urza's Power Plant
4 Urza's Tower
4 Breeding Pool
2 Forest
1 Eye of Ugin
1 City of Brass
1 Academy Ruins
1 Tolaria West
Cards Creatures:
3 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
3 Wurmcoil Engine
Other Spells:
4 Karn Liberated
2 Chromatic Sphere
4 Chromatic Star
3 Expedition Map
1 Oblivion Stone
2 All Is Dust
2 Ancient Stirrings
4 Explore
4 Sylvan Scrying
2 Thirst for Knowledge
2 Remand
1 Mindslaver
1 Chromatic Lantern
2 Phyrexian Metamorph
1 Relic of Progenitus
2 Spellskite
2 Gitaxian Probe
2 Summoning Trap
2 Pithing Needle
1 Wurmcoil Engine
2 Hurkyl's Recall
1 Remand
I've been constantly changing things up in the build,I've even thought about primeval titan.
Many Thanks to Rivenor for the Stunning Sig and Ace5301 for the Amazing Avatar.
R/G Tron is the original Tron. And the meta's pretty cutthroat, but that doesn't look like its going to change anytime soon. Maybe if mono-U attempted some leaks? Tempo like Remand isn't that amazing when it still gives them the win the following turn.
First of all, don't run 3 Emrakul. Without Breach, the most you need is 1. When you need it, you tutor for it after tutoring for Eye.
Second of all, run 1 All Is Dust max. It's good, but with Affinity and Twin (which O-Stone is good/decent but Dust dead) around, you really don't want to risk the dead weight.
Consider switching up the mana base. 4 Breeding Pools is a lot of damage to take for simply untapped lands. Consider Yavimaya Coast and Misty Rainforest with basics.
Finally, consider some Prophetic Prisms. I've found them pretty good in RG Tron, and you need the fixing far more here.
GX Tron XG
UR Phoenix RU
GG Freyalise High Tide GG
UR Parun Counterspells RU
BB Yawgmoth Token Storm BB
WB Pestilence BW
Was referencing the most successful versions of Standard and Extended from some years ago, mainly MonoU, UG and UR.
Then the original (and most successful) Tron variant was actually mono-green TNN Tron from post-Affinity MIR/KAM Standard
It was considered THE deck to beat.
GX Tron XG
UR Phoenix RU
GG Freyalise High Tide GG
UR Parun Counterspells RU
BB Yawgmoth Token Storm BB
WB Pestilence BW
thank you for the Prophetic Prism suggestion,i will surely add it to my list.and Yavimaya Coast has been a land i've been thinking off adding in place of the Breeding pools.But i have a question.wouldn't 4 city of brass be better? or are they limited to only one in modern decks? i have added Chromatic Lantern (although i might add another if i run 3 colors)for major mana fixing,i can even through in Breath and be fine.although i also have smmoning trap,thus is why i run 3 Emrakuls.had 2 at first,but found it slower to get him out.even with the eye to help.but my favorite strategy in here is my Karn win condition.-14 on turn 5 with Emrakul exiled do to his +4 a turn before.yeah.And i have to thanks Explore for that.letting me drop the 3rd Urza Land on turn 2.
I have very little knowledge of past events and such,im very new at competative playing.and specially to Modern.i just have to go out and test this deck in person.but i have yet to own all the cards needed for this.it's stll under-construction.
Many Thanks to Rivenor for the Stunning Sig and Ace5301 for the Amazing Avatar.
If you're controlling the field with Karn, a restart shouldn't be necessary. Eye -> Emrakul -> cast should be game. In fact, exiling Emrakul with Karn is dangerous, because it lets them Pulse Karn to put you at a disadvantage. You should be focusing on winning with the advantage Karn provides, not relying on restarts to win. It's not as reliable.
Chromatic Lantern is too slow, and the land ability interacts poorly with Tron pieces. The amount of time you're expecting to go for just isn't realistic. Decks are far too fast. Splashing red for breach isn't worth it when you can just spend that effort ramping into a legitimate Emrakul. You're already racing the clock because you're hurting yourself with your lands, and you're forgoing the Clasms of RG Tron.
Summoning Trap is also too unreliable. If you want to cheat dudes, go for Glass Cannon Griselbrand when you can do it reliably; cheating out stuff with Breach should NOT be your plan, especially if red isn't in your colors. Tron relies on the reliable threat of a T3 Karn/Wurmcoil to be fast enough; Breaching and Trapping is unreliable and gives you bad draws with multiple Emrakuls.
City of Brass is bad because tapping it will damage you no matter what. If you don't need colored mana, Yavimaya Coast won't deal you damage.
GX Tron XG
UR Phoenix RU
GG Freyalise High Tide GG
UR Parun Counterspells RU
BB Yawgmoth Token Storm BB
WB Pestilence BW