Lets just say you have a Lotus Bloom suspended on the field, Reshape in hand, and a Conjurer's Bauble on the field. If you have no Blooms left in your deck can you sac the Bloom then while the Reshape trigger is on the stack Bauble the Bloom then use Reshape to find the Bloom?
Since sacrificing an artifact is part of the cost to play Reshape I feel like this would work but not sure.
Wait a sec, are you saying...
that you are casting reshape, and saccing lotus bloom as part of the cost, then baubling it back into the deck and letting the reshape resolve to fetch it out?
That works, but...
why would you do that? Just curious. It doesn't ramp, it doesn't trigger riddlesmith, and it doesn't increase the number of lotus blooms you'll have after sunrise. It doesn't seem to have a purpose, since saccing lotus bloom to get its mana is a part of ITS cost. A "can't have your cake and eat it too" situation if I've ever seen one ^^;
I guess I've been explaining it wrong about reshape targets. Chromatic star is useful to keep around longer than the other eggs that can turn sideways to get their draw. The truth is that flasks just tend to sit there after being recurred until you need to sunrise again. Then you sac them to their own ability. I'll have to ammend the primer to reflect this better.
Speaking of flask, I think I have the "fixing" interaction pretty pegged down, but maybe I should pose the question to a judge to really find out. I've done things like activate ghost quarter, sac it and an island, and then sac flask for it's ability in response to tap the other untapped islands for white, and then let ghost quarter resolve and tap them for blue.
*oh yeah, another fun interaction is using conjurer's bauble to put the island you sac to the ghost quarter back in the deck when you have no more island in the deck in order to trigger lotus cobra one extra time. Becomes the only play during double ghost quarter games where you've exhausted your islands early and have an excess of artifacts in your hand that you didn't have the mana to cast the last time you sunrised.
edit: just realized, you aren't reading conjurer's bauble wrong are you?
It says "up to 1 card from your graveyard" which means 0 OR 1 card. You can in fact just tap it to draw a card. Which is what i do with the other artifacts when I'm already fixed up- "U for U, whatevs".
Oops forgot about the bannings :/ but Gitaxian Probe has been working extremely well for me. Also I was originally asking about a suspended Lotus but I realized that a suspended card isn't counted as a permanent. I've also been running into a lot of problems with Laboratory Maniac getting Path-ed so Ive been testing other win-cons and Bitter Ordeal is looking very appealing to me.
Also if you self sacriface an Elsewhere Flask while a Ghost Quarter is in the graveyard if you bring the Quarter back does it get the basic land type too?
Also if you self sacriface an Elsewhere Flask while a Ghost Quarter is in the graveyard if you bring the Quarter back does it get the basic land type too?
See, that's kind of what I was saying doesn't happen. But hypothetically, you COULD sunrise with the flask sac ability on the stack!
Bitter Ordeal is a cute idea, and I think a bit easier to get rolling for Storm Count. Problem is if you're running both that and Grapeshot... suddenly you're keeping track of two different kinds of Storms... and heaven forbid if you're running Lotus Cobra and having to keep track of mana.
I like it, but there is already a ton of math involved here, which can cause play mistakes.
Good point. I think I might test it. Sounds like a very interesting plan seeing how often we're popping 10-12 eggs at a time. What do you think Blitz? You seem to have the best knollege with this deck... is it a viable option?
eh? You know how I feel about extraneous wincons =\
I think it would depend on the build and the meta. Sure it can be done, but which of the storm cards is going to net us the more consistent win percentage? I'm not sure as I don't do a lot of testing with storm wincons. You'll have to do some side by side comparison on ONE card different builds vs other builds with the same one card difference.
As a starting point, gravestorm is going to just love a version with excessive artifacts.
Grapeshot seems like it wants to see 6+ noxious revival effects and some mox opal.
Good points. I guess I'm dreading running the Spellbomb win condition because I can just see matches going to time and people wanting us to "play that out" hoping we'll screw up and fizz.
First of all, if matches go to time, you really have all the time you need, because you aren't going to be passing the turn until you win. But that's beyond the point. Grapeshot vs Bitter Ordeal is a difficult comparison. Grapeshot only counts spells you cast (which is much lower than artifacts you kill), but only takes 20 damage to win. Bitter Ordeal counts artifacts you kill, but takes 50 or so copies to kill. But hold on here, Disciple of the vault combines the best of both. it only takes 20 damage to kill, but counts artifacts going to graveyard. so in my opinion,
Disciple > Grapeshot > Bitter Ordeal. Grapeshot is above Bitter Ordeal just because i've noticed that once people figure out that we are playing combo, they always play their shocklands untapped, which lowers the life we have to remove to kill them.
is there now way he can make the first post of that thread the last post of this on? If not, that's really fine, we can just post a link to the other in each thread, and continue from here. Alternatively, we can go through and copy the whole thread (or at least the valuable, non-"i have no idea how this works") posts and paste them into the start of this thread in spoiler tags.
I'll skip on the mod tags here, since it's a bit of an explanation.
The reason I can't is because of the timestamps on the posts. If I merged the threads, it would merge and order them based on time and date of the post.
The only way I could get around that would be to find a post of Blitz Reloaded's that was older than "06-22-2011, 12:35 AM". If there was, I could use a little mod magic and make it work None exist, and it's certainly no fault of his.
I hope that explanation sheds some light on the matter. I wish I could fulfill your request, but I'm unable to.
What I will do is close the old thread so people do not get confused.
Thanks for making the new thread! Keep it up! Sorry for the sidetrack post.
Another kill condition that may be less time consuming Laboratory Maniac and flat out wins.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I like current block formats the most.
Its so limited to its power scale against other formats.
Block constructed should be a more competitive format like it was back in Champions or Ravnica.
Once you hit 0 cards in your library, you just win. You can demonstrate to the judge (or to your opponent in a casual game) that you have established a loop with pyrite spellbomb, lotus bloom, second sunrise, conjurer's bauble, and a ghost quarter or second lotus bloom, and just declare how much damage you deal (in multiples of 2, of course). It's the same with exarch/twin combo. You just show that you can do it, and declare how many copies you make. you don't need to stack all of the triggers/ The time consumption comes in getting your library empty. Not that laboratory maniac isn't a valid win condition, it just doesn't seem necessary. Every win condition we have wins once you have your library empty. Pyrite spellbomb is good because it can help you get to the end of your deck, and other wincons (disciple of the vault, grapeshot, bitter ordeal) are good because they can win even if you don't reach the end of your deck.
Yeah Grapeshot is much more difficult to make lethal than Bitter Ordeal since Grapeshot requires you to cast the spells you draw into. Without Lotus Cobra (which I do not) your mana can often times be stretched pretty thin and you might not have the mana to really cast those cards.
All right, here are the card choices. I put in some that people will inevitably start discussing like Emrakul, even though my testing shows that they are questionable at best.
Artifacts
Eggs Chromatic Star: It’s 1 cmc. It fixes your mana. It draws you a card when it gets sacced. It’s one of the best Reshape fodder rocks ever. Play 4.
Chromatic Sphere: It’s better in Vintage Eggs because of Yawgmoth’s Will and worse here because it won’t yield a card when we sac it to Reshape. 4 of these are still essential, though, as 1 cmc mana-fixing rocks will not be denied.
Conjurer’s Bauble: Shoving Edge of Autumns, Reshapes, and Noxious Revivals back into your library is good. You also don’t need mana to draw a card with this 1 cmc rock. This is also the key to the main Sunny Side Up kill—stuff a Second Sunrise into an empty library, draw it, pop a Pyrite Spellbomb, then cast Second Sunrise, getting everything back. This guy is the best egg in Riddlesmith builds, as you can shove discarded excess lands and stranded Lotus Blooms back into the deck.
Elsewhere Flask: Yes, it costs 2 mana. However, it immediately draws us a card and can sac itself for free, so it’s in our books. Remember that its draw effect is mandatory and immediate—thin out the lands in your deck in response, Noxious Revival a Second Sunrise in response, and sac these last, in case you nab a Reshape and need a target or you are close to having an empty library. Also remember that it turns your Ghost Quarters and nonbasic lands into basic lands, so that’s another reason to sac these last.
Ichor Wellspring: It’s much worse than Elsewhere Flask, as it can’t sac itself for free, but it’s an awesome Reshape target. Remember that the draw occurs before Reshape resolves.
Mana Accel Lotus Bloom: Suspending this first turn is fun. The turn this gets cast is the turn you should go off. Crack all your other eggs first, and then rip the petals off this flower when you’re just about to cast Second Sunrise. Alternately, Reshape acts as extra copies of Modern’s own Black Lotus, and the turn you Reshape into this is the turn you should go off.
Mox Opal: It’s one free mana of any colour when you need it most. The fact that it’s legendary hurts, though, as seconds are practically dead draws. Even if you sac the first to Reshape and play the second, they keep dying to the legend rule all the time afterwards. This card is better in Riddlesmith builds that treat seconds as the perfect discard fodder.
Locket of Yesterdays: With our cheap, easily cracked eggs, this modest 1 cmc artifact can give us serious mana savings. You may have to rearrange the order you smash your eggs with this card out, though.
Win Cons Pyrite Spellbomb: Get a Second Sunrise with Conjurer’s Bauble. Sac Lotus Bloom 1 for red mana. Sac Lotus Bloom 2 for white mana. Sac this with the red mana to ping your opponent. Cast Second Sunrise and get the Bauble, Spellbomb, and Blooms back. Repeat until your opponent dies. Killing Ethersworn Canonist is a plus, and it cantrips in a pinch.
Sunbeam Spellbomb: Does your opponent have a Leyline of Sanctity out? Then gain infinite life with this Spellbomb, then keep casting Noxious Revival targeting Noxious Revival until your opponent decks himself or herself (or deals with your constant infinite life and wins anyway). It also cantrips in a pinch and can give you a nice life buffer against aggro so you can keep cracking fetchlands or casting Noxious Revival without using mana.
Temple Bell: There’s a pretty convoluted combo involving Noxious Revivals and Reshapes that allows you to force your opponent to draw his or her deck (while you don’t) with this artifact. It’s an option, and it lets you (and your opponent) draw cards in the meantime.
Disruption Defense Grid: Making your opponent’s counterspells absurdly expensive is what this card does best. Beware of Spell Pierce, though, as your opponent just might be able to cast it if you were on the draw.
Aether Spellbomb: Kicking out Ethersworn Canonist, Meddling Mage, Knight of the Reliquary, and more is pretty good. Being an (expensive) cantrip and a Reshape target means this is never a dead draw. If you run creatures, this is also an excellent bodyguard.
Nihil Spellbomb: This is the perfect graveyard hate rock for us. It exiles our opponents’ graveyards only and it cantrips! Too bad it needs black mana to be fully effective.
Instants and Sorceries
Recursion Second Sunrise: The purpose of this deck is to break this card in half. It gives you immense card advantage as your artifacts, lands, and optional creatures and enchantments revive themselves. By looping this card, you can eventually draw you deck.
Open the Vaults: It can get you out of a giant hole if you fizzle. As Second Sunrises 5+, though, it’s subpar, as it doesn’t return lands and it is way more expensive.
Noxious Revival: This card’s sole duty is to put Second Sunrises from your graveyard on top of your library so you can draw them. Not actually needing green mana to cast this is awesome.
Reclaim: When four graveyard retrieval spells aren’t enough, this fifth spell will do in a pinch. The need for actual green mana hurts, though.
Tutoring Reshape: This card’s main purpose is to tutor for Lotus Bloom, thus basically giving this deck access to Black Lotus. Don’t forget that it can tutor for eggs, other mana accel, or disruption in a pinch.
Wargate: It’s got a very restrictive mana cost, but searching for Lotus Blooms, Ghost Quarters, and more is pretty unreal. It can even tutor for creatures and enchantments!
[CARD]
Spoils of the Vault[/CARD]: If you still have trouble finding Second Sunrise, you can cast this card and kick yourself in the ‘nards trying to get that wonderful instant. Stick more than one win con in your deck if you use this card, though, as you don’t want to exile your only way(s) of winning.
Cantrips Edge of Autumn: You don’t search for lands with this card. You cycle it by sacrificing lands. You’ll get those lands back with Second Sunrise, trust me.
Serum Visions: R.I.P. Ponder and Preordain. We knew ye well. Serum Visions is Preordain’s backwards brother who doesn’t dig nearly as well, but at least it shoves through dreck.
Sleight of Hand: Sleight of Hand is Preordain’s other backwards brother who forces you to shove one card to the bottom and the other card into your hand, and it never lets you see a third card. It’s one of the best cantrips left to us, though.
Manamorphose: Old versions of this deck used this card as a simple free (well, it’s 2 cmc, but it filters your mana) cantrip. We’ve got Elsewhere Flask on our side, though.
Gitaxian Probe: At least this free cantrip lets us stare at our opponent’s hand and check whether we can spare one more turn against Zoo or if we’re walking into a counterspell wall. The life loss may hurt, though.
Win Cons Grapeshot: It can smack your opponent for fairly high, to be sure, but getting 20 Storm with this card is near impossible unless you’ve gone through at least three quarters of your deck. It’s probably better against decks with suicidal land bases and Bob and worse against decks with life gain.
Bitter Ordeal: It can boot out your opponent’s entire deck, to be sure, but only after you’ve gone through at least three quarters of your deck. If you fizzle and cast this card, you’re only slicing out half your opponent’s deck at most. At least you get to snag their best cards (like most of their business spells).
Banefire: Only use in Lotus Cobra builds. At least you might need less mana than Emrakul demands from you (if your opponent is at 13 or less life, for example), but it might still not be necessary.
Removal Echoing Truth: Staring down Pithing Needles naming Pyrite Spellbomb and Sunbeam Spellbomb or Meddling Mages naming Second Sunrise and Noxious Revival? Bounce them all with this handy card!
Repeal: Bounce anything interrupting your plans and draw a card! (Smart players will activate Tormod’s Crypt in response, making this spell fizzle and ensuring your second Second Sunrise won’t do anything useful.)
Wipe Away: Ha ha, they can’t activate Tormod’s Crypt or Relic of Progenitus in response now! The 3 cmc is pretty steep, though.
Blasphemous Act: Stop Elves, and keep your life total safe! This stops weenie aggro for a while and keeps Goblin tokens from Storm decks from running you over before you can combo off.
Interruption Pact of Negation: Are they trying to counter your Second Sunrise? Stop those shenanigans for free! (You might not be able to pay the upkeep cost if you fizzle later, though.)
Silence: This card keeps those pesky blue mages from countering your other spells during your combo turn. The W mana cost hurts, though.
Mindbreak Trap: UR Storm may be faster than us, but we can stop their Grapeshots and Empty the Warrens with this free card. (Of course, if they somehow shove two Grapeshots in your face, you’re probably doomed.)
Creatures
Mana Accel Riddlesmith: Our goal in life is to cast artifact spells and keep digging for Second Sunrises (and Noxious Revivals). This guy will help us in that mission. Just cast eggs, draw cards, and discard lands and Lotus Blooms that get stranded in hand. Excess Mox Opals and other Riddlesmiths also make good discard fodder.
Lotus Cobra: With all the Ghost Quarters, basic lands, and fetchlands getting revived with Second Sunrise, this humble snake can give us a serious mana boost.
Etherium Sculptor: Making the majority of our eggs free is awesome and gives the deck a serious nitro boost. Being able to Reshape into him is a plus.
Win Cons Disciple of the Vault: Did your opponent Extirpate all the Pyrite Spellbombs from your deck? Kill your opponent by endlessly casting Second Sunrise and saccing your own Lotus Blooms and Conjurer’s Baubles instead! If you fizzle, you might also be able to throw a few artifacts at your opponent’s head and reap some benefits with this guy.
Laboratory Maniac: Who needs the infinite Pyrite Spellbomb kill when you’ve got Laboratory Maniac and a ton of ways to draw cards at instant speed, often for free? If they attempt to exile this guy in response, just Bauble an Edge of Autumn into your hand and cycle it. This also doesn’t target opponents, so you can dodge Leyline of Sanctity and Runed Halo with this win.
Emrakul, the Aeons Torn: Only use the Flying Spaghetti Monster in Lotus Cobra builds. Even then, it might not be necessary, but then again, it may save your butt if you’re accumulating mana and not cards.
Enchantments
Eggs Ior Ruin Expedition: It requires a bit of preparation beforehand, but drawing 2 cards per Second Sunrise off it is oh so sweet. (Remember, everything pops onto the battlefield at the same time with Second Sunrise, and then Landfall triggers go on the stack.) It has the same cmc as Elsewhere Flask, though, which hurts.
Disruption Blood Moon: Turning other decks’ mana bases into junk can stall them for just about forever. Please be aware that this neuters your Ghost Quarters and fetchlands, though, so it’s definitely a double-edged sword.
Lands
Coloured Mana Island: How do you expect to cast Reshape without blue mana? Besides, searching for endless supplies of these with Ghost Quarters is fun.
Forest: If you’re splashing for Lotus Cobra and Wargate, this is a must-have.
Plains: If you’re splashing for Wargate, this is a must-have. Otherwise, just crack Lotus Blooms to get white mana.
Swamp: If you’re splashing for Spoils of the Vault, this is a must-have.
Utility Ghost Quarter: In any other deck, all this does is turn opponents’ nonbasic lands into basic lands. In this deck, it turns our tapped lands into untapped basic lands. A few Second Sunrises later, we’ve got piles of lands and a thinned-out deck.
Misty Rainforest, Scalding Tarn, etc.: Otherwise known as fetchlands, these are awesome as spare (if bad) copies of Ghost Quarter that cost life, can’t destroy our tapped lands, and don’t tap for mana. You need the redundancy, though, and they are musts if you splash other colours.
Darksteel Citadel: If you’re that desperate for artifacts to sac to Reshape, be my guest. Otherwise, not producing coloured mana hurts, not being a basic land blows, and not dying to Ghost Quarter is even worse.
I think we need to go into more detail on what you should do on the turn you go off. (this can go on the main page)
By this point you've hopefully gotten a few eggs on the field along with a few ghost quarters and fetches. Here's the order:
1) cast reshape targeting... (in order of preference)
___1) Mox Opal (after tapping it for mana)
___2) Chromatic Star
___3) Elsewhere Flask
___4) Any other artifact
___and fetching, in order of preference
___1) Lotus bloom (if you have 1 or 0 currently)
___2) Chromatic Star or Elsewhere flask (if you have lots of extra mana)
___3) Conjurer's Bauble
___4) Chromatic Sphere
___5) Mox Opal (if you have another reshape in hand)
___6) Spellbomb or Elsewhere Flask
2) Crack ghost quarters and fetchlands
3) Crack eggs in the following order
___1) Chromatic Sphere
___2) Conjurer's Bauble, targeting...
______1) Noxious Revival
______2) Edge of Autumn
______3) Reshape
___3) Chromatic Star
___4) Aether, Pyrite Spellbomb
___5) Elsewhere Flask (only once you have the second sunrise in hand)
If at any point you draw another reshape, use it on the artifacts you have remaining in the above order.
4) Play second sunrise
5) Put elsewhere flask triggers on the stack
___1) respond by cracking ghost quarters and fetchlands
___2) respond by cracking conjurer's baubles and putting stuff on the bottom in the above order
___3) respond by using noxious revivals on second sunrises
6) repeat from the top, if possible.
Thoughts are of course welcome. Good job by the way Lectrys. Some thoughts on that:
Ichor wellspring is generally terrible. The fact that it can't sacrifice itself makes it not worth inclusion. that should probably be noted on its explanation.
Spoils of the vault is absurdly risky. Even if you play two win-cons, you might still exile both of them. I don't like it, but i guess it should be on there. Should be noted that it is not a regularly played card in the deck.
Also, in general, you should note which cards are generally sideboard cards and which are maindeck (for example, defense grid is almost entirely sideboard), but other than that, really great job.
I've been goldfishing all night and have adopted the Riddlesmith Locket plan. It was all too often that I was stuck with some integral pieces in hand without a way to get them out... Riddlesmith let me discard them and sunrise them back. Also, there were multiple time I drew into Cobras and they made me fizzle.
I do like Lab Maniac, but you have to discard him into the yard first, then win off of a Sunrise. Casting him is asking for a Path... Not that we can't trick away from it.
Nervous, but excited for next weekend! Can we get more decklists posted so we can contrast and compare?
Riddlesmith let me discard them and sunrise them back.
I do like Lab Maniac, but you have to discard him into the yard first, then win off of a Sunrise.
If you discard a card you don't get it back with Sunrise. Sunrise only deals with cards that were in play. Also I usually only use Maniac 2nd game when the opponent boards out a path thinking there are no creatures that need to be path-ed.
Two of those are banned. I recommend Probe, Serum Visions, and Sleight of Hand.
I ended up dropping down to just the Visions personally, but that might even change once I test Riddlesmith/Locket build.
Wait a sec, are you saying...
that you are casting reshape, and saccing lotus bloom as part of the cost, then baubling it back into the deck and letting the reshape resolve to fetch it out?
That works, but...
why would you do that? Just curious. It doesn't ramp, it doesn't trigger riddlesmith, and it doesn't increase the number of lotus blooms you'll have after sunrise. It doesn't seem to have a purpose, since saccing lotus bloom to get its mana is a part of ITS cost. A "can't have your cake and eat it too" situation if I've ever seen one ^^;
I guess I've been explaining it wrong about reshape targets. Chromatic star is useful to keep around longer than the other eggs that can turn sideways to get their draw. The truth is that flasks just tend to sit there after being recurred until you need to sunrise again. Then you sac them to their own ability. I'll have to ammend the primer to reflect this better.
Speaking of flask, I think I have the "fixing" interaction pretty pegged down, but maybe I should pose the question to a judge to really find out. I've done things like activate ghost quarter, sac it and an island, and then sac flask for it's ability in response to tap the other untapped islands for white, and then let ghost quarter resolve and tap them for blue.
*oh yeah, another fun interaction is using conjurer's bauble to put the island you sac to the ghost quarter back in the deck when you have no more island in the deck in order to trigger lotus cobra one extra time. Becomes the only play during double ghost quarter games where you've exhausted your islands early and have an excess of artifacts in your hand that you didn't have the mana to cast the last time you sunrised.
edit: just realized, you aren't reading conjurer's bauble wrong are you?
It says "up to 1 card from your graveyard" which means 0 OR 1 card. You can in fact just tap it to draw a card. Which is what i do with the other artifacts when I'm already fixed up- "U for U, whatevs".
http://officeofstrategicinfluence.com/spam/ <---- kills spam, fyi.
Also if you self sacriface an Elsewhere Flask while a Ghost Quarter is in the graveyard if you bring the Quarter back does it get the basic land type too?
RIP Eggs
My Trade Thread
See, that's kind of what I was saying doesn't happen. But hypothetically, you COULD sunrise with the flask sac ability on the stack!
http://officeofstrategicinfluence.com/spam/ <---- kills spam, fyi.
I like it, but there is already a ton of math involved here, which can cause play mistakes.
http://officeofstrategicinfluence.com/spam/ <---- kills spam, fyi.
I think it would depend on the build and the meta. Sure it can be done, but which of the storm cards is going to net us the more consistent win percentage? I'm not sure as I don't do a lot of testing with storm wincons. You'll have to do some side by side comparison on ONE card different builds vs other builds with the same one card difference.
As a starting point, gravestorm is going to just love a version with excessive artifacts.
Grapeshot seems like it wants to see 6+ noxious revival effects and some mox opal.
http://officeofstrategicinfluence.com/spam/ <---- kills spam, fyi.
Disciple > Grapeshot > Bitter Ordeal. Grapeshot is above Bitter Ordeal just because i've noticed that once people figure out that we are playing combo, they always play their shocklands untapped, which lowers the life we have to remove to kill them.
UR Storm WUBRG Sunnyside Up W Death+Taxes BR 7->0:60 Discard
EDH
GU Vig RWU Zedruu BR Olivia
Play Magic online free with GCCG!
Download it here -- (My Username is ShinkyP)
Trade Thread: Here!
I'll skip on the mod tags here, since it's a bit of an explanation.
The reason I can't is because of the timestamps on the posts. If I merged the threads, it would merge and order them based on time and date of the post.
The only way I could get around that would be to find a post of Blitz Reloaded's that was older than "06-22-2011, 12:35 AM". If there was, I could use a little mod magic and make it work None exist, and it's certainly no fault of his.
I hope that explanation sheds some light on the matter. I wish I could fulfill your request, but I'm unable to.
What I will do is close the old thread so people do not get confused.
Thanks for making the new thread! Keep it up! Sorry for the sidetrack post.
(Siggy adapted, DarkHunter1357 (deviantART))
UR Storm WUBRG Sunnyside Up W Death+Taxes BR 7->0:60 Discard
EDH
GU Vig RWU Zedruu BR Olivia
Play Magic online free with GCCG!
Download it here -- (My Username is ShinkyP)
Trade Thread: Here!
I like current block formats the most.
Its so limited to its power scale against other formats.
Block constructed should be a more competitive format like it was back in Champions or Ravnica.
Sig by DD Awie by CC
UR Storm WUBRG Sunnyside Up W Death+Taxes BR 7->0:60 Discard
EDH
GU Vig RWU Zedruu BR Olivia
Play Magic online free with GCCG!
Download it here -- (My Username is ShinkyP)
Trade Thread: Here!
RIP Eggs
My Trade Thread
Artifacts
Chromatic Star: It’s 1 cmc. It fixes your mana. It draws you a card when it gets sacced. It’s one of the best Reshape fodder rocks ever. Play 4.
Chromatic Sphere: It’s better in Vintage Eggs because of Yawgmoth’s Will and worse here because it won’t yield a card when we sac it to Reshape. 4 of these are still essential, though, as 1 cmc mana-fixing rocks will not be denied.
Conjurer’s Bauble: Shoving Edge of Autumns, Reshapes, and Noxious Revivals back into your library is good. You also don’t need mana to draw a card with this 1 cmc rock. This is also the key to the main Sunny Side Up kill—stuff a Second Sunrise into an empty library, draw it, pop a Pyrite Spellbomb, then cast Second Sunrise, getting everything back. This guy is the best egg in Riddlesmith builds, as you can shove discarded excess lands and stranded Lotus Blooms back into the deck.
Elsewhere Flask: Yes, it costs 2 mana. However, it immediately draws us a card and can sac itself for free, so it’s in our books. Remember that its draw effect is mandatory and immediate—thin out the lands in your deck in response, Noxious Revival a Second Sunrise in response, and sac these last, in case you nab a Reshape and need a target or you are close to having an empty library. Also remember that it turns your Ghost Quarters and nonbasic lands into basic lands, so that’s another reason to sac these last.
Ichor Wellspring: It’s much worse than Elsewhere Flask, as it can’t sac itself for free, but it’s an awesome Reshape target. Remember that the draw occurs before Reshape resolves.
Mana Accel
Lotus Bloom: Suspending this first turn is fun. The turn this gets cast is the turn you should go off. Crack all your other eggs first, and then rip the petals off this flower when you’re just about to cast Second Sunrise. Alternately, Reshape acts as extra copies of Modern’s own Black Lotus, and the turn you Reshape into this is the turn you should go off.
Mox Opal: It’s one free mana of any colour when you need it most. The fact that it’s legendary hurts, though, as seconds are practically dead draws. Even if you sac the first to Reshape and play the second, they keep dying to the legend rule all the time afterwards. This card is better in Riddlesmith builds that treat seconds as the perfect discard fodder.
Locket of Yesterdays: With our cheap, easily cracked eggs, this modest 1 cmc artifact can give us serious mana savings. You may have to rearrange the order you smash your eggs with this card out, though.
Win Cons
Pyrite Spellbomb: Get a Second Sunrise with Conjurer’s Bauble. Sac Lotus Bloom 1 for red mana. Sac Lotus Bloom 2 for white mana. Sac this with the red mana to ping your opponent. Cast Second Sunrise and get the Bauble, Spellbomb, and Blooms back. Repeat until your opponent dies. Killing Ethersworn Canonist is a plus, and it cantrips in a pinch.
Sunbeam Spellbomb: Does your opponent have a Leyline of Sanctity out? Then gain infinite life with this Spellbomb, then keep casting Noxious Revival targeting Noxious Revival until your opponent decks himself or herself (or deals with your constant infinite life and wins anyway). It also cantrips in a pinch and can give you a nice life buffer against aggro so you can keep cracking fetchlands or casting Noxious Revival without using mana.
Temple Bell: There’s a pretty convoluted combo involving Noxious Revivals and Reshapes that allows you to force your opponent to draw his or her deck (while you don’t) with this artifact. It’s an option, and it lets you (and your opponent) draw cards in the meantime.
Disruption
Defense Grid: Making your opponent’s counterspells absurdly expensive is what this card does best. Beware of Spell Pierce, though, as your opponent just might be able to cast it if you were on the draw.
Pithing Needle: Got Tormod’s Crypt problems? How about Relic of Progenitus or Nihil Spellbomb problems? Name those pesky rocks with this needle and you won’t worry about graveyard hate ever again!
Aether Spellbomb: Kicking out Ethersworn Canonist, Meddling Mage, Knight of the Reliquary, and more is pretty good. Being an (expensive) cantrip and a Reshape target means this is never a dead draw. If you run creatures, this is also an excellent bodyguard.
Nihil Spellbomb: This is the perfect graveyard hate rock for us. It exiles our opponents’ graveyards only and it cantrips! Too bad it needs black mana to be fully effective.
Second Sunrise: The purpose of this deck is to break this card in half. It gives you immense card advantage as your artifacts, lands, and optional creatures and enchantments revive themselves. By looping this card, you can eventually draw you deck.
Open the Vaults: It can get you out of a giant hole if you fizzle. As Second Sunrises 5+, though, it’s subpar, as it doesn’t return lands and it is way more expensive.
Noxious Revival: This card’s sole duty is to put Second Sunrises from your graveyard on top of your library so you can draw them. Not actually needing green mana to cast this is awesome.
Reclaim: When four graveyard retrieval spells aren’t enough, this fifth spell will do in a pinch. The need for actual green mana hurts, though.
Tutoring
Reshape: This card’s main purpose is to tutor for Lotus Bloom, thus basically giving this deck access to Black Lotus. Don’t forget that it can tutor for eggs, other mana accel, or disruption in a pinch.
Wargate: It’s got a very restrictive mana cost, but searching for Lotus Blooms, Ghost Quarters, and more is pretty unreal. It can even tutor for creatures and enchantments!
[CARD]
Spoils of the Vault[/CARD]: If you still have trouble finding Second Sunrise, you can cast this card and kick yourself in the ‘nards trying to get that wonderful instant. Stick more than one win con in your deck if you use this card, though, as you don’t want to exile your only way(s) of winning.
Cantrips
Edge of Autumn: You don’t search for lands with this card. You cycle it by sacrificing lands. You’ll get those lands back with Second Sunrise, trust me.
Serum Visions: R.I.P. Ponder and Preordain. We knew ye well. Serum Visions is Preordain’s backwards brother who doesn’t dig nearly as well, but at least it shoves through dreck.
Sleight of Hand: Sleight of Hand is Preordain’s other backwards brother who forces you to shove one card to the bottom and the other card into your hand, and it never lets you see a third card. It’s one of the best cantrips left to us, though.
Manamorphose: Old versions of this deck used this card as a simple free (well, it’s 2 cmc, but it filters your mana) cantrip. We’ve got Elsewhere Flask on our side, though.
Gitaxian Probe: At least this free cantrip lets us stare at our opponent’s hand and check whether we can spare one more turn against Zoo or if we’re walking into a counterspell wall. The life loss may hurt, though.
Win Cons
Grapeshot: It can smack your opponent for fairly high, to be sure, but getting 20 Storm with this card is near impossible unless you’ve gone through at least three quarters of your deck. It’s probably better against decks with suicidal land bases and Bob and worse against decks with life gain.
Bitter Ordeal: It can boot out your opponent’s entire deck, to be sure, but only after you’ve gone through at least three quarters of your deck. If you fizzle and cast this card, you’re only slicing out half your opponent’s deck at most. At least you get to snag their best cards (like most of their business spells).
Banefire: Only use in Lotus Cobra builds. At least you might need less mana than Emrakul demands from you (if your opponent is at 13 or less life, for example), but it might still not be necessary.
Removal
Echoing Truth: Staring down Pithing Needles naming Pyrite Spellbomb and Sunbeam Spellbomb or Meddling Mages naming Second Sunrise and Noxious Revival? Bounce them all with this handy card!
Repeal: Bounce anything interrupting your plans and draw a card! (Smart players will activate Tormod’s Crypt in response, making this spell fizzle and ensuring your second Second Sunrise won’t do anything useful.)
Wipe Away: Ha ha, they can’t activate Tormod’s Crypt or Relic of Progenitus in response now! The 3 cmc is pretty steep, though.
Blasphemous Act: Stop Elves, and keep your life total safe! This stops weenie aggro for a while and keeps Goblin tokens from Storm decks from running you over before you can combo off.
Interruption
Pact of Negation: Are they trying to counter your Second Sunrise? Stop those shenanigans for free! (You might not be able to pay the upkeep cost if you fizzle later, though.)
Silence: This card keeps those pesky blue mages from countering your other spells during your combo turn. The W mana cost hurts, though.
Mindbreak Trap: UR Storm may be faster than us, but we can stop their Grapeshots and Empty the Warrens with this free card. (Of course, if they somehow shove two Grapeshots in your face, you’re probably doomed.)
Riddlesmith: Our goal in life is to cast artifact spells and keep digging for Second Sunrises (and Noxious Revivals). This guy will help us in that mission. Just cast eggs, draw cards, and discard lands and Lotus Blooms that get stranded in hand. Excess Mox Opals and other Riddlesmiths also make good discard fodder.
Lotus Cobra: With all the Ghost Quarters, basic lands, and fetchlands getting revived with Second Sunrise, this humble snake can give us a serious mana boost.
Etherium Sculptor: Making the majority of our eggs free is awesome and gives the deck a serious nitro boost. Being able to Reshape into him is a plus.
Win Cons
Disciple of the Vault: Did your opponent Extirpate all the Pyrite Spellbombs from your deck? Kill your opponent by endlessly casting Second Sunrise and saccing your own Lotus Blooms and Conjurer’s Baubles instead! If you fizzle, you might also be able to throw a few artifacts at your opponent’s head and reap some benefits with this guy.
Laboratory Maniac: Who needs the infinite Pyrite Spellbomb kill when you’ve got Laboratory Maniac and a ton of ways to draw cards at instant speed, often for free? If they attempt to exile this guy in response, just Bauble an Edge of Autumn into your hand and cycle it. This also doesn’t target opponents, so you can dodge Leyline of Sanctity and Runed Halo with this win.
Emrakul, the Aeons Torn: Only use the Flying Spaghetti Monster in Lotus Cobra builds. Even then, it might not be necessary, but then again, it may save your butt if you’re accumulating mana and not cards.
Ior Ruin Expedition: It requires a bit of preparation beforehand, but drawing 2 cards per Second Sunrise off it is oh so sweet. (Remember, everything pops onto the battlefield at the same time with Second Sunrise, and then Landfall triggers go on the stack.) It has the same cmc as Elsewhere Flask, though, which hurts.
Disruption
Blood Moon: Turning other decks’ mana bases into junk can stall them for just about forever. Please be aware that this neuters your Ghost Quarters and fetchlands, though, so it’s definitely a double-edged sword.
Island: How do you expect to cast Reshape without blue mana? Besides, searching for endless supplies of these with Ghost Quarters is fun.
Forest: If you’re splashing for Lotus Cobra and Wargate, this is a must-have.
Plains: If you’re splashing for Wargate, this is a must-have. Otherwise, just crack Lotus Blooms to get white mana.
Swamp: If you’re splashing for Spoils of the Vault, this is a must-have.
Utility
Ghost Quarter: In any other deck, all this does is turn opponents’ nonbasic lands into basic lands. In this deck, it turns our tapped lands into untapped basic lands. A few Second Sunrises later, we’ve got piles of lands and a thinned-out deck.
Misty Rainforest, Scalding Tarn, etc.: Otherwise known as fetchlands, these are awesome as spare (if bad) copies of Ghost Quarter that cost life, can’t destroy our tapped lands, and don’t tap for mana. You need the redundancy, though, and they are musts if you splash other colours.
Darksteel Citadel: If you’re that desperate for artifacts to sac to Reshape, be my guest. Otherwise, not producing coloured mana hurts, not being a basic land blows, and not dying to Ghost Quarter is even worse.
By this point you've hopefully gotten a few eggs on the field along with a few ghost quarters and fetches. Here's the order:
1) cast reshape targeting... (in order of preference)
___1) Mox Opal (after tapping it for mana)
___2) Chromatic Star
___3) Elsewhere Flask
___4) Any other artifact
___and fetching, in order of preference
___1) Lotus bloom (if you have 1 or 0 currently)
___2) Chromatic Star or Elsewhere flask (if you have lots of extra mana)
___3) Conjurer's Bauble
___4) Chromatic Sphere
___5) Mox Opal (if you have another reshape in hand)
___6) Spellbomb or Elsewhere Flask
2) Crack ghost quarters and fetchlands
3) Crack eggs in the following order
___1) Chromatic Sphere
___2) Conjurer's Bauble, targeting...
______1) Noxious Revival
______2) Edge of Autumn
______3) Reshape
___3) Chromatic Star
___4) Aether, Pyrite Spellbomb
___5) Elsewhere Flask (only once you have the second sunrise in hand)
If at any point you draw another reshape, use it on the artifacts you have remaining in the above order.
4) Play second sunrise
5) Put elsewhere flask triggers on the stack
___1) respond by cracking ghost quarters and fetchlands
___2) respond by cracking conjurer's baubles and putting stuff on the bottom in the above order
___3) respond by using noxious revivals on second sunrises
6) repeat from the top, if possible.
Thoughts are of course welcome. Good job by the way Lectrys. Some thoughts on that:
Ichor wellspring is generally terrible. The fact that it can't sacrifice itself makes it not worth inclusion. that should probably be noted on its explanation.
Spoils of the vault is absurdly risky. Even if you play two win-cons, you might still exile both of them. I don't like it, but i guess it should be on there. Should be noted that it is not a regularly played card in the deck.
Also, in general, you should note which cards are generally sideboard cards and which are maindeck (for example, defense grid is almost entirely sideboard), but other than that, really great job.
UR Storm WUBRG Sunnyside Up W Death+Taxes BR 7->0:60 Discard
EDH
GU Vig RWU Zedruu BR Olivia
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I do like Lab Maniac, but you have to discard him into the yard first, then win off of a Sunrise. Casting him is asking for a Path... Not that we can't trick away from it.
Nervous, but excited for next weekend! Can we get more decklists posted so we can contrast and compare?
If you discard a card you don't get it back with Sunrise. Sunrise only deals with cards that were in play. Also I usually only use Maniac 2nd game when the opponent boards out a path thinking there are no creatures that need to be path-ed.
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Anyone else have comments on Lotus Cobra? I found drawing him to be generally frustrating and the mana generated by him to go unused many times.