I recently lost a match to Jund where I was on the draw on the third game and he had turn 3 Liliana. That Liliana totally won the game by itself, it forced me into topdeck mode while my opponent had a nice clock with a big Tarmogoyf plus Bolts, and I just never happened to draw any win conditions at the right time, I drew some earlier but I had to discard them to Liliana. I've been thinking of ways to play around an early Liliana, such as Harmonize in the sideboard. Any thoughts on this?
Honestly, I have found that bringing in Obstinate baloth is about the best against liliana. Its really hard for them to keep her alive or kill you if they play their turn two Goyf, attack on three, then play her and activate discard letting you get it in for free. I have noticed they will often do the lili before attacks though incase they need to block and I have even had players side them out in game three.
Although, if you want to get really cute, Wilt-Leaf Liege will do a similar effect of killing lilliana and at the same time pumps your STE's.
edit: also, @FoodChainGoblins, there is another thread here for RG Breach. They can probably help you a lot more than we can.
It's probably the same as Summer Bloom was, just ok. You're doing the exact same thing, but you don't make your kill any quicker. Azusa was good in Bloom Titan because you actually had extra lands to play.
In this deck, IMO Explore is the better card because you're cantripping and getting a land out of your hand. Most of the time it just says "1G: Draw a card" when you're in topdeck mode.
I wouldn't cut explores. They are there as a ramp early game an a cantrip later game. Our win conditions are narrow, scapeshift and Titans, that we have to maximize drawing them since we are light on card advantage/selection. I find that Explore does exactly what we need, ramping early and helping to dig later so to smooth out our draws when we are in top deck mode. At seven mana, we don't need to ramp anymore, but to find that last Scapeshift to win. Combo decks are that way, where we need smooth draws to find the piece for the win. I have four Explores and I play one for ramp anytime I can over other two mana ramp spells.
The GDD has been really good for those wondering. I don't think I will keep pursuing this.
On Obstinate Baloth,
I would recommend this card very much. It occupies a sideboard slot that we desperately need. It is life gain against aggressive decks and burn, it is a drop off of a Liliana up tick and it is a 4/4 body against lightning bolt midrange or blue based control decks. I find that upping the thread count against blue based decks has helped me keep my titan safe from Path or just bash in for 4 a turn. It is surprising how many blue players have a hard time dealing with 4/4 body on turn three. Countering it will open up to a late game Scapeshift, pathing it will leave Titan alive etc. I have three in my sideboard and I like it a lot.
Went 6-2 in total for GP Toronto side events, single eliminations. Ran 2 Relic of Progenitus in the flex slots. My first loss was to Eggs where I didn't have Summoner's Pact in my 75 and had Commune with Lava instead, which deemed to be a turn too slow vs Eggs. I immediately picked up the Pacts and played again. The second loss was vs Breach-Shift. I would win game 3, but lost due to forgotten Pact trigger (mistake learned the hard way). I made sure to remember the next flight and won 3 in a row in that. The MD Relic has been very suppressing against most decks I played against(Jund, Living End,Abzan) except for three of my match-ups (Breach-Shift, Soul Sisters, and no-goyf Zoo).
So I have been playing this deck for about 4 months and I've had a lot of luck with it and I've been very unlucky. I feel like this deck has really good match ups and really bad match ups there isn't really much work in between. The other night I played against I feel some of the worse match ups for this deck Affinity, Infect, Megatron, Ad Nauseam (feels unwinnable) and Burn. What are some of your opinions on how to interact with these match ups? My sideboard consists of the following, is there cards I should add or get rid of? Any comments would be a huge help.
So I have been playing this deck for about 4 months and I've had a lot of luck with it and I've been very unlucky. I feel like this deck has really good match ups and really bad match ups there isn't really much work in between. The other night I played against I feel some of the worse match ups for this deck Affinity, Infect, Megatron, Ad Nauseam (feels unwinnable) and Burn. What are some of your opinions on how to interact with these match ups? My sideboard consists of the following, is there cards I should add or get rid of? Any comments would be a huge help.
if you do not have GDD in your deck then feed the clan should be a 3 baloth. the Pyrclasm's should be anger of the gods instead to exile things like kitchen finks and voice of resurgence.
The two ancient grudge are redundant with the three Destructive Revely.
What the hell is Megatron? Also what does your MD look like?
You can probably beat the slow hands of Ad Nauseam, but the consensus is that its a bad MU (in the same way that Infect is unwinnable for them). Your artifact hate can help here to blow up the mana rocks. I'm not a huge fan of Chalice. It seems like you need to have 4 in order to have a decent shot of having it in your opening hand for an X=0 (Affinity)
I've been able to test and play against Infect more than a few times, so here is my takeaway: If you expect a lot of Infect, you have to SB for it specifically. With infect, on average their kill is T4 (which the possibility of blowing it sooner) and ours, at a minimum, is turn 4. That turns it in their favor. Some people opted to have 3x Melira in the SB to buy a turn or two. If you are on the play, work towards your T4 combo. If on the draw, work towards some interaction (with Bolts or getting a Valakut online to shoot down an infecter, maybe with KHE). I think you break this only when you've drawn into a potent SB card, which for this deck would be Melira then Sudden Shock/Spellskite (Twisted Image and Wild Defiance do still show up post-SB).
The GDD has been really good for those wondering. I don't think I will keep pursuing this.
snip
When you say you aren't going to continue pursuing this, do you mean you are cutting it or that you are convinced it will stay in the deck so you aren't debating it anymore?
I haven't been able to test as much this week as I did last weekend, but the GDD has still been really good. Will definitely keep it in for a bit.
Megatron is when tron uses doubling season to get a lot of loyalty counters on ugin and then plop down a bunch of permanents which basically is GG at that point. I had someone the other night do that to me turn 4 it was devastating. I will look into more hate for my infect match ups, I don't verse them often but a melira and maybe another spellskite or Chalices could do the trick.
The GDD has been really good for those wondering. I don't think I will keep pursuing this.
snip
When you say you aren't going to continue pursuing this, do you mean you are cutting it or that you are convinced it will stay in the deck so you aren't debating it anymore?
I haven't been able to test as much this week as I did last weekend, but the GDD has still been really good. Will definitely keep it in for a bit.
Woops! I meant that I will keep pursuing this. I apologize, I don't know what happened there.
@eylengendary
I run two in the main. I have a decklist up a couple of pages back where I crushed a Monday Night Magic if you want to see.
@generalaudience
My sideboard is geared towards the hyper aggressive matchups so that I can crush them after the first game. Control and midrange haven't been a problem for me even with my mainboard so I think it is important for our decks to be geared towards crushing the small, hyper aggressive decks.
Megatron is when tron uses doubling season to get a lot of loyalty counters on ugin and then plop down a bunch of permanents.
hahaha, thats golden. I've never heard of that. I feel like that probably won't happen that often on turn 4 as you need T3 Tron, Doubling Season (getting a green somehow) -> Land, Ugin. If its built like a normal tron deck, your DRs and Grudges should be fine.
As a GR Tron player, I've never heard of that plan. It sounds terrible. You can't find Doubling Season off of Ancient Stirrings so you'd have to play 4 and then you'd have to play 4 Ugins to have any shot of assembling it before turn 6. You'd have to take out stuff like oblivion stones and ulamog.
Though being able to ultimate karn the turn I play him sounds kind of fun.
You'd get the green by cycling an egg, btw. Not that far fetched. Expecting to have all that in your hand with any kind of consistency, on the other hand....
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Well, I went 1-3 at an event last night. All of my losses were either me punting the game or just the bad end of variance. I have played against all of those players and decks before and generally do very well. For now, I think I will stick to the Goblin Dark-Dwellers build. I also think maxing out on Explore and Farseek when playing GDD is probably better than running Khalni Hearts.
That being said, I drew all three of my Khalni hearts in Game one against 8-whack goblins (the only match I actually won) and was able to kill him in response to a goblin grenade.
In Match two, against RUG scapeshift, I handily won the first game, and had the win in hand for the second game if I had played Prime Time instead of Inferno Titan but forgot that I had two untracked fetch lands to win with so decided to go for inferno Titan instead. He showed me his only counter was negate, then untapped and won.
After that, I just drew really poorly and made a few bad decisions.
tron is a match up i've had trouble with as well. my sideboard i'm running 1 crumble to dust and 3 molten rain.
molten rain does well for racing them to a turn 3 play.
I Molten rains a good choice as well if your on the goblin dark-dweller plan as well.
@theotherguy,
chalice of the void has been doing well for me when fighting infect and ad nauseum. not sure why its getting dissed.
I saw another list running 4 sudden shock in the maindeck over 4 lightning bolt that way it had a unanswerable silver bullets game 1 against, Melira Company Combo, Affinity, and infect!
First off , your bringing in 7 cards. What are you taking out?
The relics should definitely come in , enchantment removal is alright. Crumble if you have it , fine. This seems like a pretty even matchup. I mean t0 Leyline happens, but overall this doesn't. Are you running khalni hearts? Summoners Pact or Commune? List would be helpful.
Also kinda crazy we are t2 status. whoot
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Honestly, I have found that bringing in Obstinate baloth is about the best against liliana. Its really hard for them to keep her alive or kill you if they play their turn two Goyf, attack on three, then play her and activate discard letting you get it in for free. I have noticed they will often do the lili before attacks though incase they need to block and I have even had players side them out in game three.
Although, if you want to get really cute, Wilt-Leaf Liege will do a similar effect of killing lilliana and at the same time pumps your STE's.
edit: also, @FoodChainGoblins, there is another thread here for RG Breach. They can probably help you a lot more than we can.
Marath, Will of the Wild Tokens!! / Karrthus, Tyrant of Jund Dragons! / Muzzio, Visionary Architect / Brago, King Eternal / Daretti, Scrap Savant / Narset, Enlightened Master / Alesha, Who Smiles at Death / Bruna, Light of Alabaster / Marchesa, the Black Rose / Iroas, God of Victory / Freyalise, Llanowar's Fury / Omnath, Locus of rage / Titania, Protector of Argoth / Kozilek, the Great Distortion
Modern
Elves / Titanshift / Merfolk
Just one question what do you think about Azusa, Lost but Seeking in the maindeck instead of 1 Explore or 1 Cultivate?
Infect
Mardu
Jund
Tron
Dredge
In this deck, IMO Explore is the better card because you're cantripping and getting a land out of your hand. Most of the time it just says "1G: Draw a card" when you're in topdeck mode.
Fetch-Shock-Blog
Moderator of /r/Scapeshift
I wouldn't cut explores. They are there as a ramp early game an a cantrip later game. Our win conditions are narrow, scapeshift and Titans, that we have to maximize drawing them since we are light on card advantage/selection. I find that Explore does exactly what we need, ramping early and helping to dig later so to smooth out our draws when we are in top deck mode. At seven mana, we don't need to ramp anymore, but to find that last Scapeshift to win. Combo decks are that way, where we need smooth draws to find the piece for the win. I have four Explores and I play one for ramp anytime I can over other two mana ramp spells.
The GDD has been really good for those wondering. I don't think I will keep pursuing this.
On Obstinate Baloth,
I would recommend this card very much. It occupies a sideboard slot that we desperately need. It is life gain against aggressive decks and burn, it is a drop off of a Liliana up tick and it is a 4/4 body against lightning bolt midrange or blue based control decks. I find that upping the thread count against blue based decks has helped me keep my titan safe from Path or just bash in for 4 a turn. It is surprising how many blue players have a hard time dealing with 4/4 body on turn three. Countering it will open up to a late game Scapeshift, pathing it will leave Titan alive etc. I have three in my sideboard and I like it a lot.
BGElvesBG and BUGNissa ElvesBUG Faithful Elfer since May 1st, 2015
Results: SCG IQ Top 8, Monthly Modern Masters Top 4
So I have been playing this deck for about 4 months and I've had a lot of luck with it and I've been very unlucky. I feel like this deck has really good match ups and really bad match ups there isn't really much work in between. The other night I played against I feel some of the worse match ups for this deck Affinity, Infect, Megatron, Ad Nauseam (feels unwinnable) and Burn. What are some of your opinions on how to interact with these match ups? My sideboard consists of the following, is there cards I should add or get rid of? Any comments would be a huge help.
3 Destructive Revelry
2 Obstinate Baloth
2 Chalice of the Void
2 Ancient Grudge
2 Pyroclasm
2 Relic of Progenitus
1 Spellskite
1 Feed the Clan
if you do not have GDD in your deck then feed the clan should be a 3 baloth. the Pyrclasm's should be anger of the gods instead to exile things like kitchen finks and voice of resurgence.
The two ancient grudge are redundant with the three Destructive Revely.
You can probably beat the slow hands of Ad Nauseam, but the consensus is that its a bad MU (in the same way that Infect is unwinnable for them). Your artifact hate can help here to blow up the mana rocks. I'm not a huge fan of Chalice. It seems like you need to have 4 in order to have a decent shot of having it in your opening hand for an X=0 (Affinity)
I've been able to test and play against Infect more than a few times, so here is my takeaway: If you expect a lot of Infect, you have to SB for it specifically. With infect, on average their kill is T4 (which the possibility of blowing it sooner) and ours, at a minimum, is turn 4. That turns it in their favor. Some people opted to have 3x Melira in the SB to buy a turn or two. If you are on the play, work towards your T4 combo. If on the draw, work towards some interaction (with Bolts or getting a Valakut online to shoot down an infecter, maybe with KHE). I think you break this only when you've drawn into a potent SB card, which for this deck would be Melira then Sudden Shock/Spellskite (Twisted Image and Wild Defiance do still show up post-SB).
Fetch-Shock-Blog
Moderator of /r/Scapeshift
When you say you aren't going to continue pursuing this, do you mean you are cutting it or that you are convinced it will stay in the deck so you aren't debating it anymore?
I haven't been able to test as much this week as I did last weekend, but the GDD has still been really good. Will definitely keep it in for a bit.
Marath, Will of the Wild Tokens!! / Karrthus, Tyrant of Jund Dragons! / Muzzio, Visionary Architect / Brago, King Eternal / Daretti, Scrap Savant / Narset, Enlightened Master / Alesha, Who Smiles at Death / Bruna, Light of Alabaster / Marchesa, the Black Rose / Iroas, God of Victory / Freyalise, Llanowar's Fury / Omnath, Locus of rage / Titania, Protector of Argoth / Kozilek, the Great Distortion
Modern
Elves / Titanshift / Merfolk
Megatron is when tron uses doubling season to get a lot of loyalty counters on ugin and then plop down a bunch of permanents which basically is GG at that point. I had someone the other night do that to me turn 4 it was devastating. I will look into more hate for my infect match ups, I don't verse them often but a melira and maybe another spellskite or Chalices could do the trick.
Woops! I meant that I will keep pursuing this. I apologize, I don't know what happened there.
@eylengendary
I run two in the main. I have a decklist up a couple of pages back where I crushed a Monday Night Magic if you want to see.
@generalaudience
My sideboard is geared towards the hyper aggressive matchups so that I can crush them after the first game. Control and midrange haven't been a problem for me even with my mainboard so I think it is important for our decks to be geared towards crushing the small, hyper aggressive decks.
BGElvesBG and BUGNissa ElvesBUG Faithful Elfer since May 1st, 2015
Results: SCG IQ Top 8, Monthly Modern Masters Top 4
hahaha, thats golden. I've never heard of that. I feel like that probably won't happen that often on turn 4 as you need T3 Tron, Doubling Season (getting a green somehow) -> Land, Ugin. If its built like a normal tron deck, your DRs and Grudges should be fine.
Fetch-Shock-Blog
Moderator of /r/Scapeshift
Though being able to ultimate karn the turn I play him sounds kind of fun.
You'd get the green by cycling an egg, btw. Not that far fetched. Expecting to have all that in your hand with any kind of consistency, on the other hand....
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UBRBLACK ROSE COMMANDERUBR
WURGBTrades - Looking for ABU Duals, Fetches, Ect. Have Liliana otV, Snapcaster Mages, Chrod of Calling, Alters!WURGB
Commander
Omnath, Locus of Mana
GWBUR Genju of The Realms RUBWG
That being said, I drew all three of my Khalni hearts in Game one against 8-whack goblins (the only match I actually won) and was able to kill him in response to a goblin grenade.
In Match two, against RUG scapeshift, I handily won the first game, and had the win in hand for the second game if I had played Prime Time instead of Inferno Titan but forgot that I had two untracked fetch lands to win with so decided to go for inferno Titan instead. He showed me his only counter was negate, then untapped and won.
After that, I just drew really poorly and made a few bad decisions.
Marath, Will of the Wild Tokens!! / Karrthus, Tyrant of Jund Dragons! / Muzzio, Visionary Architect / Brago, King Eternal / Daretti, Scrap Savant / Narset, Enlightened Master / Alesha, Who Smiles at Death / Bruna, Light of Alabaster / Marchesa, the Black Rose / Iroas, God of Victory / Freyalise, Llanowar's Fury / Omnath, Locus of rage / Titania, Protector of Argoth / Kozilek, the Great Distortion
Modern
Elves / Titanshift / Merfolk
molten rain does well for racing them to a turn 3 play.
I Molten rains a good choice as well if your on the goblin dark-dweller plan as well.
@theotherguy,
chalice of the void has been doing well for me when fighting infect and ad nauseum. not sure why its getting dissed.
I saw another list running 4 sudden shock in the maindeck over 4 lightning bolt that way it had a unanswerable silver bullets game 1 against, Melira Company Combo, Affinity, and infect!
The relics should definitely come in , enchantment removal is alright. Crumble if you have it , fine. This seems like a pretty even matchup. I mean t0 Leyline happens, but overall this doesn't. Are you running khalni hearts? Summoners Pact or Commune? List would be helpful.
Also kinda crazy we are t2 status. whoot