What do you guys think of Nissa, Vital Force in the sideboard? I've been running 1 in the sideboard for any blood moon and control matches. Only played her once against UWR control. I ended up drawing 6 additional cards that game. Anyone else tried her?
I agree about tireless tracker most likely being better. Also, I think it was 2 pages ago that we discussed Nissa. I believe most of us agreed her plus one was too dangerous to warrant using.
What about Nissa, Vastwood See? She keeps the lands coming, especially basic Forest against Blood Moon. 2/2 is a reasonable body that needs to be answered. And if she flips, she can take over the game. Not an amazing card but could be a good 1-of against control or grindy decks.
I don't find myself disadvantaged against comtrol or grindy decks enough to want to dedicate sideboard slots to them. I just bring in my baloths as more threats.
Depends on the Blood Moon deck. If you're playing against decks that side them in, then Nature's Claims and Reclamation Sage (to pact for) are good since you'll likely only need to 1-for-1. If you're playing against decks that play the full 4, you'll have to lean off Scapeshift+Valakut and play more of a "I'm going to midrange you out of the game" and focus on casting larger creatures (Titan, Baloth, and keep a few more in your board). You might also want to play 4 basic Forest in your manabase, as it opens up your options under Blood Moon and you'll have a more reasonable chance to draw one.
Hi everyone, sorry for the double post but I have an announcement. We're starting the process to update this deck's Primer. It looks like Rain is no longer an active user and some sections of the primer are either out of date or were never put in.
I have a primer I've been working on for a while that was meant as a blog post but I'd like to contribute it here, where I think it will be more useful. I ask this forum to please review the sections and comment on the Google Doc. I'm looking for additional input on the tips, FAQs, matchup section. Keep in mind that the intent is to keep a similar format to what we have. I'm also opening the Doc up to the Reddit community.
If you make a comment, keep in mind that it might/might not be incorporated and I might contact you to discuss it further. My intent is for this to be a large community effort and in the end, we have something we're all happy with.
EDIT: I intend on leaving this up for comment until 5/13/2017.
Natures claim in the sideboard. Bring it in along with all of your extra threats. A reclamation Sage can be searched off of Summoner's Pact giving you a few extra outs. Against blue moon, I bring in 3 Obstinate Baloth, 2 Nature's Claim, 1 thrun, 1 inferno Titan.
I'm frustrated with the deck right now. I went 4-1 and 3-2 in leagues yesterday, which netted me some tix. However, 2 of the games I lost were simply because the deck imploded. I lost a game against a jank Abzan Evolution deck where I had turns 2&3 ramp and then drew 8 lands in a row with no payoff card in hand... I lost against BW Eldrazi Taxes with an opening hand of 3 lands, 2 Explore, 1 Farseek. He had turn 2 Arbiter, and my 3rd land was a fetch, then I proceeded to go 7 more draw steps without a land. He had zero pressure other than the Arbiter, so ANYTHING would have won me the game. So frustrating to lose not because you got outplayed or because your deck is worse but only because your deck did not give you anything. I know this happens with every deck, but I feel it's worse with Titan Shift.
I don't know how I can improve this. My maindeck is already mono-green, so I don't waste slots for removal but rather 3 Courser and 4 Relic. I should have a steady stream of lands off the top and good topdecks!
I had similar bad luck this weekend. I went 3-2 at a weekly modern event. I lost to grixis delver and Elves of all things. Both matches were because I ripped nothing but lands for around 8 turns.
Also, if you see a land that can tap for white and an rather vial turn one, or a B/W painland, run out your fetches asap if you don't have removal for the Arbiter. Otherwise it'll wreck your day.
I had similar bad luck this weekend. I went 3-2 at a weekly modern event. I lost to grixis delver and Elves of all things. Both matches were because I ripped nothing but lands for around 8 turns.
Also, if you see a land that can tap for white and an rather vial turn one, or a B/W painland, run out your fetches asap if you don't have removal for the Arbiter. Otherwise it'll wreck your day.
Oh I knew the Arbiter was coming, I just couldn't do anything about it. I went turn 1 fetch, turn 2 basic into Explore into another fetch. He GQ'd my land and I never found another to let me search...
I'm frustrated with the deck right now. I went 4-1 and 3-2 in leagues yesterday, which netted me some tix. However, 2 of the games I lost were simply because the deck imploded. I lost a game against a jank Abzan Evolution deck where I had turns 2&3 ramp and then drew 8 lands in a row with no payoff card in hand... I lost against BW Eldrazi Taxes with an opening hand of 3 lands, 2 Explore, 1 Farseek. He had turn 2 Arbiter, and my 3rd land was a fetch, then I proceeded to go 7 more draw steps without a land. He had zero pressure other than the Arbiter, so ANYTHING would have won me the game. So frustrating to lose not because you got outplayed or because your deck is worse but only because your deck did not give you anything. I know this happens with every deck, but I feel it's worse with Titan Shift.
I don't know how I can improve this. My maindeck is already mono-green, so I don't waste slots for removal but rather 3 Courser and 4 Relic. I should have a steady stream of lands off the top and good topdecks!
I don't know what you're looking for here. It sounds like you won 7 games and lost 3, where two of those were to variance. No matter how much you change your maindeck around, any configuration you have will be suspect to drawing lands or spells for 5 turns because that is how the game is. You should focus on the things you can improve on like if you kept an optimal opening hand knowing what you know now (i.e. if I draw nothing but lands/spells, is this a keepable 7 against this deck?).
nookularboy: That's a good point. I'm just salty that I missed my 2nd-ever 5-0 by losing to a jank build due to bad luck! As a good exercise, and to get some crowd feedback, I'll watch my replays and post my keep/mulligan hands to see if others agree.
I am more accustomed to playing decks with a ton of cantrips, like Suicide Bloo, where variance still happens but is much more manageable since you control the top of your deck more. That's why I like the 3 Courser and 4 Relic maindeck to give me a little of that, plus the sideboard Harmonize.
Looking back on the game against BW Eldrazi Taxes, I could have played it differently. Instead of playing turn 2 Explore, I could have played untapped land and left up 2 mana in case of GQ. Then, I could play turn 3 fetch and have the mana to pop it to give me 3 lands and keep me in the game. That play is MUCH slower and worse against a turn 3 TKS, but it would have kept me in the game as it actually played out. In the dark, I don't know that I can afford to play that slowly or that I can assume he'll have turn 2 Arbiter with turn 3 GQ.
Glad I could help. Let us know how you do, and good luck!
Hey Spike! Just following up here from my event last week. I went 3 rounds w/ the same list I posted prior. Final results were 1-1-1, still learning the deck and how to play my match-ups I suppose! Still haven't figured out what hands are keeps and mulls.
Also, this is what my SB looked like for the event:
Match 1: Lantern (draw)
Game 1: He gets the lock - I think I make the mistake here of not scooping (I had 4 valakuts and eventually was able to cast an omen though, so any land drops were 4 bolts, so I figured I had a chance still).
Game 2: I get there with enough ramp and scapeshift - I board out Courser of 2x Kruphix, 2x Explores, 1x farseek, bringing in 3x Relics, 1x Rec Sage, and 1x Natures Claim.
Game 3: We get to time and have to draw Feels like I would have gotten there though.
Match 2: Bant Knightfall (2-1, W)
G1 - he just overwhelms me with a fast start (hierarchs into constant streams of threats, quellers, and coco's)
G2 - In: 3 angers, 3 relics. Out: 2 courser, 2 Explore, 1 Omen, 1 Farseek (maybe should have been 2x farseek?. I hold up relic, constantly using it EoT, remove his dudes, and I eventually get there with Scapeshift.
G3 - he keeps a really sketchy hand - 3 dorks, 1 land. He opens with land, bird, go. I push the bird, he misses his 2nd land drop but eventually starts drawing them, but its too late at that point. I ramp into Titan and use valakut triggers to wipe his board for the win.
Match 3: Cheerios (0-2, L)
This match up seems terrible! Opinions here welcome!
G1 - he fizzles, I push his Paladin, doesn't matter since he drew 10+ cards, he plays another paladin, goes off for the win.
G2 - In: 3x Collective Brutality, Out: 2x Explore, 1x Farseek. I mulligan (1 lander) and am afraid to go down to 5, but feel like I should have mulled the hand away. Hand consisted of 2 Titans, 3 lands, 1 Collective Brutality. Game starts, I T2 Brutality and whiff on it. His hand had 3 Paladins, lands, and equipment. I draw Titan #3. He goes off on T3 or 4 for the win.
Looking back, I could have won the lantern match up if I just scooped the first game once the lock came on, giving me more time ultimately in game 3. Not sure about my SB decisions against the Bant Knightfall deck - relics and anger seems good, but maybe I should have cut the 3 omens and thrown in the 3 brutalities as well? The final match of the day just seemed super unfavorable, not sure what I could have done there other than perhaps try 2x Slaughter Games in the board for future combo matches.
Deciding if I want to play this or Eldrazi Tron in the upcoming GP at Vegas. I've got many more games under my belt with E.T, but the consistency of the deck just feels way off sometimes. Consistency in this deck's game play is what drew me to it, as this deck seems pretty resilient to mulls. Thoughts on deck choice?
Glad I could help. Let us know how you do, and good luck!
Deciding if I want to play this or Eldrazi Tron in the upcoming GP at Vegas. I've got many more games under my belt with E.T, but the consistency of the deck just feels way off sometimes. Consistency in this deck's game play is what drew me to it, as this deck seems pretty resilient to mulls. Thoughts on deck choice?
Thanks!
Can't speak to the meta, but for a GP you want to play what you feel more comfortable with. Day 1 is just so long and the more you can make auto-pilot decisions, the more energy you can devote towards the more difficult ones. You have roughly a month between now and then, so you should be able to get a lot of reps in with the deck if you choose to go with it.
I understand that no deck is FREE of variance, but many decks have more ways of minimizing it. Your data on Titan Shift vs RUG vs Jund is very interesting and exactly what I am feeling with the deck. I'm curious where you came up with those numbers. Are they from your own testing or compiled from somewhere? How many matches do you have with each deck?
I also understand that I got lucky some of the games with my topdecks, then equally unlucky other times. That high variance is what is so frustrating to me. You are never OBLIGED to win against anyone, even an incredibly great matchup, but I believe it's OK to be unhappy if you lose against a very good matchup.
How do you really sculpt your plays with Titan Shift? For example, on the draw against an unknown opponent with the following hand:
Stomping Ground
Valakut
Wooded Foothills
Search for Tomorrow
Farseek
Courser
Primeval Titan
This is a fantastic opening hand, so you keep. Your opponent plays turn 1 discard and you lose Search. Barring any more acceleration off the top, you play turn 2 Farseek for Stomping Ground or Cinder Glade, turn 3 Courser, turn 5 Primeval. If you have other ramp, you probably play that turn 3 instead of Courser to enable turn 4 Primeval. They will likely kill the Primeval, and you are left with Courser (maybe) and a bunch of lands, relying on the top of your deck to give you something to answer whatever they are doing or win you the game outright. How can you sequence these cards any differently or more efficiently to minimize variance?
A few key considerations I have found with RG Titan Shift (in particular, mono-green maindeck) that make big impacts on the game:
1) When to fetch Stomping Ground vs Forest for turn 1 Search.
2) Holding Farseek in hand either as a Lightning Bolt or a potential Bolt if you draw Valakut.
3) Properly using Courser and shuffle effects to find lands or good action on the top.
4) When to play turn 3 Courser or turn 3 ramp.
5) When to play turn 2 Farseek vs STE. Normally it seems better to play Farseek so STE can chump-block a bigger threat in later turns. This is the opposite against Living End when you can use their namesake to get multiple uses out of STE.
6) Not pulling TOO many mountains from the deck in order to keep Scapeshift live.
7) In sideboard games, when to use your removal (example: I wasted a Bolt on a turn 1 Signal Pest and then lost to Blinkmoth+Cranial)
Automatic plays:
1) Turn 1 Search
2) Turn 2 Farseek, STE, Explore
3) Jam Primeval (either hard-cast or searched with Pact) when you have 6 lands unless playing around countermagic
4) Scapeshift + 7 lands unless playing around countermagic
That doesn't seem like a whole lot of things I can do control to become a better player and reduce variance. Do you have other examples?
What is "RUG Scapeshift" by the way? Is that RUGb BtL or something else?
I am really liking the sideboard Harmonize against grindy discard matchups. I won a game yesterday against Mardu Midrange where they made me discard my Farseek then played Liliana. I found turn 3 STE to ping Liliana. Harmonize kept me enough cards in hand that I could land a turn 5 Titan to kill her and take over. Once you get to 8 mana against a countermagic deck, you can often safely cast Harmonize because can't tap out to counter it for fear of dying to Scapeshift.
Glad I could help. Let us know how you do, and good luck!
Hey Spike! Just following up here from my event last week. I went 3 rounds w/ the same list I posted prior. Final results were 1-1-1, still learning the deck and how to play my match-ups I suppose! Still haven't figured out what hands are keeps and mulls.
Also, this is what my SB looked like for the event:
Match 1: Lantern (draw)
Game 1: He gets the lock - I think I make the mistake here of not scooping (I had 4 valakuts and eventually was able to cast an omen though, so any land drops were 4 bolts, so I figured I had a chance still).
Game 2: I get there with enough ramp and scapeshift - I board out Courser of 2x Kruphix, 2x Explores, 1x farseek, bringing in 3x Relics, 1x Rec Sage, and 1x Natures Claim.
Game 3: We get to time and have to draw Feels like I would have gotten there though.
Match 2: Bant Knightfall (2-1, W)
G1 - he just overwhelms me with a fast start (hierarchs into constant streams of threats, quellers, and coco's)
G2 - In: 3 angers, 3 relics. Out: 2 courser, 2 Explore, 1 Omen, 1 Farseek (maybe should have been 2x farseek?. I hold up relic, constantly using it EoT, remove his dudes, and I eventually get there with Scapeshift.
G3 - he keeps a really sketchy hand - 3 dorks, 1 land. He opens with land, bird, go. I push the bird, he misses his 2nd land drop but eventually starts drawing them, but its too late at that point. I ramp into Titan and use valakut triggers to wipe his board for the win.
Match 3: Cheerios (0-2, L)
This match up seems terrible! Opinions here welcome!
G1 - he fizzles, I push his Paladin, doesn't matter since he drew 10+ cards, he plays another paladin, goes off for the win.
G2 - In: 3x Collective Brutality, Out: 2x Explore, 1x Farseek. I mulligan (1 lander) and am afraid to go down to 5, but feel like I should have mulled the hand away. Hand consisted of 2 Titans, 3 lands, 1 Collective Brutality. Game starts, I T2 Brutality and whiff on it. His hand had 3 Paladins, lands, and equipment. I draw Titan #3. He goes off on T3 or 4 for the win.
Looking back, I could have won the lantern match up if I just scooped the first game once the lock came on, giving me more time ultimately in game 3. Not sure about my SB decisions against the Bant Knightfall deck - relics and anger seems good, but maybe I should have cut the 3 omens and thrown in the 3 brutalities as well? The final match of the day just seemed super unfavorable, not sure what I could have done there other than perhaps try 2x Slaughter Games in the board for future combo matches.
Deciding if I want to play this or Eldrazi Tron in the upcoming GP at Vegas. I've got many more games under my belt with E.T, but the consistency of the deck just feels way off sometimes. Consistency in this deck's game play is what drew me to it, as this deck seems pretty resilient to mulls. Thoughts on deck choice?
Thanks!
In that game one against Lantern, you need to count your winconditions that are live in your deck and compare it to the number of millstones they have. If it ever seems likely that they can keep you off wincons for a while, scoop. Not scooping to Lantern is how you go 0-1-1 and lose the match or 2-1 and win. Additionally, as a judge, I call slow play on Lantern opponents a lot. Recognize quickly what you can do, and do it. Don't dilly dally around on your turn thinking before you pass. Once they have locked you out and start milling you aggressively, turns should take about 4-5 seconds per turn. I used to play against Lantern constantly when I played elves and when I started recognizing how the matchup works and playing fast, I never drew a game again. It seems like the same can be done with this deck. Know what your winning draws are and if they give you anything else, run it out and pass.
As for deck choice, you have time to get used to this one. It is very consistent and resilient to mulligans, but it takes skill and reps to choose your mulligans and sequencing. I lost a match to Elves (my list actually that I was lending someone) which is supposed to be a bye because I fetched the wrong land on upkeep with SfT and then missequenced my fetches and ramp spells that turn keeping me from ramping into a much better chance of Sweltering Suns into Titan the next turn. That just goes to show that while the game plan is very simple, sequencing can be hard.
Choose the deck you have more fun with, because that will help you keep your energy up day one. Then once you decide it, get in a bunch of reps over the next month.
I understand that no deck is FREE of variance, but many decks have more ways of minimizing it. Your data on Titan Shift vs RUG vs Jund is very interesting and exactly what I am feeling with the deck. I'm curious where you came up with those numbers. Are they from your own testing or compiled from somewhere? How many matches do you have with each deck?
I also understand that I got lucky some of the games with my topdecks, then equally unlucky other times. That high variance is what is so frustrating to me. You are never OBLIGED to win against anyone, even an incredibly great matchup, but I believe it's OK to be unhappy if you lose against a very good matchup.
How do you really sculpt your plays with Titan Shift? For example, on the draw against an unknown opponent with the following hand:
Stomping Ground
Valakut
Wooded Foothills
Search for Tomorrow
Farseek
Courser
Primeval Titan
This is a fantastic opening hand, so you keep. Your opponent plays turn 1 discard and you lose Search. Barring any more acceleration off the top, you play turn 2 Farseek for Stomping Ground or Cinder Glade, turn 3 Courser, turn 5 Primeval. If you have other ramp, you probably play that turn 3 instead of Courser to enable turn 4 Primeval. They will likely kill the Primeval, and you are left with Courser (maybe) and a bunch of lands, relying on the top of your deck to give you something to answer whatever they are doing or win you the game outright. How can you sequence these cards any differently or more efficiently to minimize variance?
A few key considerations I have found with RG Titan Shift (in particular, mono-green maindeck) that make big impacts on the game:
1) When to fetch Stomping Ground vs Forest for turn 1 Search.
2) Holding Farseek in hand either as a Lightning Bolt or a potential Bolt if you draw Valakut.
3) Properly using Courser and shuffle effects to find lands or good action on the top.
4) When to play turn 3 Courser or turn 3 ramp.
5) When to play turn 2 Farseek vs STE. Normally it seems better to play Farseek so STE can chump-block a bigger threat in later turns. This is the opposite against Living End when you can use their namesake to get multiple uses out of STE.
6) Not pulling TOO many mountains from the deck in order to keep Scapeshift live.
7) In sideboard games, when to use your removal (example: I wasted a Bolt on a turn 1 Signal Pest and then lost to Blinkmoth+Cranial)
Automatic plays:
1) Turn 1 Search
2) Turn 2 Farseek, STE, Explore
3) Jam Primeval (either hard-cast or searched with Pact) when you have 6 lands unless playing around countermagic
4) Scapeshift + 7 lands unless playing around countermagic
That doesn't seem like a whole lot of things I can do control to become a better player and reduce variance. Do you have other examples?
What is "RUG Scapeshift" by the way? Is that RUGb BtL or something else?
I am really liking the sideboard Harmonize against grindy discard matchups. I won a game yesterday against Mardu Midrange where they made me discard my Farseek then played Liliana. I found turn 3 STE to ping Liliana. Harmonize kept me enough cards in hand that I could land a turn 5 Titan to kill her and take over. Once you get to 8 mana against a countermagic deck, you can often safely cast Harmonize because can't tap out to counter it for fear of dying to Scapeshift.
This deck is crazy low variance, it has 4 cards. Lands, Ramp, Disruption, and Winconcs. Mono green maindeck really skips disruption since Relic redraws, and Primal Command searches a wincon. But no deck in magic doesn't lose when it goes 7 turns in a row without drawing something to kill the opponent. I have scrubbed out of two Amonkhet drafts in a row by drawing straight lands until I hit 12 lands and lost. I even flooded out with Elves last week and that list only runs 19 lands. If you get a lot of experience with the deck, you see what line can possibly win, and play to that out. Like that match I described where I lost to elves, my out was draw Sweltering Suns, cast it, cast Titan in hand. So, I was supposed to carefully fetch my lands and tap my mana to let me play all of the ramp spells in hand and forget the Fatal Push I had. But I was tired and not paying attention so I missed it.
Past those type of lines, learning how to mulligan is important. Take for example the hand you described on the draw. The key in that matchup with getting your Titan killed, is to set up a win with it. It might not kill the opponent by attacking, but you can set up a win with its trigger. Use your foothills and ramp spells to get mountains, and have titan get you to 5 mountains 2 valakut if possible. If you can swing it, 5 mountains 3 valakut is better. That lets you have almost all of your topdecks, and Courser of Kruphix very live into the midgame. That is a game that you can win, and that's what you have to set up.
As far as some sequencing things you mention, Explore is actually best on turn 3 when you can go Explore into another ramp spell or Courser instead of just dropping a land on two. As for not pulling too many mountains, unless you have valakuts in play, don't get more than 5 mountains in play. That keeps as many hits in your deck as possible for mid-lategame valakut plays, and ensures Scapeshift is live.
And RUG scapeshift generally refers to any scapeshift list (usually without any Titans) that tries to control the game with Remands and Cryptic Commands until Scapeshift or bolt snap bolt wins. This includes the Bring to Light lists splashing Black or White.
Lejoon - I appreciate the thought process you put into the matchup matrix, but I have to challenge your numbers. RG or Jund Titan Shift are both doing well in paper and Online tournaments, but BtL has not put up any numbers in forever. I find it hard to believe that RUG is a "better" deck according to your numbers...
Spike - I agree that the deck only has 4 cards. However, the variance comes from the lack of ability to control your draws, and the fact that MANY of your cards do nothing to affect the board. You have 23 non-Valakut lands, 14 ramp spells, and 0-3 Omens. That's upwards of 40 cards that do nothing until you win. Yes, every deck can flood out. Last FNM, I had 11 of my 18 lands out of my Jund DS deck and had only drawn about 6 spells. Sometimes it happens.
Your point about always playing to your outs is 100% valid and a good idea for every player to keep in mind in every game they play. One of my favorite League wins was a few years ago when I was playing some janky UWx control deck. I don't remember the exact scenario, but I remember that my only chance of winning the game was to find a Wrath, so I sequenced every decision to make that happen, including taking a lot more damage in a few attacks to devote all resources to finding Wrath. I eventually topdecked it the turn before I died and then went on to win the game. I wish I had kept that replay!
With Titan Shift, I feel like the decisions are pretty straightforward with little room for in-game decisions to affect the outcome. Play lands, ramp, chump-then-sac STE, get basic Forests if you suspect Blood Moon or Mountains to get Valakut online, then draw Titan/Pact/Scapeshift. I have made mistakes similar to what you described, where Search got a Mountain instead of Forest which prevented me from double-accelerating, and that cost me the game when I was 1 land short for Scapeshift.
I guess what I'm saying is that I feel like Titan Shift is more reliant on setting up the best winning line and hoping it works compared to other decks that have a lot more interaction. That's what I mean when I say "high variance".
Lejoon - I appreciate the thought process you put into the matchup matrix, but I have to challenge your numbers. RG or Jund Titan Shift are both doing well in paper and Online tournaments, but BtL has not put up any numbers in forever. I find it hard to believe that RUG is a "better" deck according to your numbers...
Spike - I agree that the deck only has 4 cards. However, the variance comes from the lack of ability to control your draws, and the fact that MANY of your cards do nothing to affect the board. You have 23 non-Valakut lands, 14 ramp spells, and 0-3 Omens. That's upwards of 40 cards that do nothing until you win. Yes, every deck can flood out. Last FNM, I had 11 of my 18 lands out of my Jund DS deck and had only drawn about 6 spells. Sometimes it happens.
Your point about always playing to your outs is 100% valid and a good idea for every player to keep in mind in every game they play. One of my favorite League wins was a few years ago when I was playing some janky UWx control deck. I don't remember the exact scenario, but I remember that my only chance of winning the game was to find a Wrath, so I sequenced every decision to make that happen, including taking a lot more damage in a few attacks to devote all resources to finding Wrath. I eventually topdecked it the turn before I died and then went on to win the game. I wish I had kept that replay!
With Titan Shift, I feel like the decisions are pretty straightforward with little room for in-game decisions to affect the outcome. Play lands, ramp, chump-then-sac STE, get basic Forests if you suspect Blood Moon or Mountains to get Valakut online, then draw Titan/Pact/Scapeshift. I have made mistakes similar to what you described, where Search got a Mountain instead of Forest which prevented me from double-accelerating, and that cost me the game when I was 1 land short for Scapeshift.
I guess what I'm saying is that I feel like Titan Shift is more reliant on setting up the best winning line and hoping it works compared to other decks that have a lot more interaction. That's what I mean when I say "high variance".
Of those 23 non valakut lands, only 4 don't trigger valakut. Drawing a mountain or a fetchland is winning in the late game. And if you want to be able to manipulate the deck more, try some Oath of Nissa. I tried it out in the past, and it wasn't great. But with the deck running courser and sometimes Chandra or a few more creatures mainboard, it has more hits and might be decent.
Modern
Modern
Fetch-Shock-Blog
Moderator of /r/Scapeshift
I have a primer I've been working on for a while that was meant as a blog post but I'd like to contribute it here, where I think it will be more useful. I ask this forum to please review the sections and comment on the Google Doc. I'm looking for additional input on the tips, FAQs, matchup section. Keep in mind that the intent is to keep a similar format to what we have. I'm also opening the Doc up to the Reddit community.
Link to Google Doc
If you make a comment, keep in mind that it might/might not be incorporated and I might contact you to discuss it further. My intent is for this to be a large community effort and in the end, we have something we're all happy with.
EDIT: I intend on leaving this up for comment until 5/13/2017.
Fetch-Shock-Blog
Moderator of /r/Scapeshift
Modern
I don't know how I can improve this. My maindeck is already mono-green, so I don't waste slots for removal but rather 3 Courser and 4 Relic. I should have a steady stream of lands off the top and good topdecks!
Also, if you see a land that can tap for white and an rather vial turn one, or a B/W painland, run out your fetches asap if you don't have removal for the Arbiter. Otherwise it'll wreck your day.
Modern
Oh I knew the Arbiter was coming, I just couldn't do anything about it. I went turn 1 fetch, turn 2 basic into Explore into another fetch. He GQ'd my land and I never found another to let me search...
Modern
I don't know what you're looking for here. It sounds like you won 7 games and lost 3, where two of those were to variance. No matter how much you change your maindeck around, any configuration you have will be suspect to drawing lands or spells for 5 turns because that is how the game is. You should focus on the things you can improve on like if you kept an optimal opening hand knowing what you know now (i.e. if I draw nothing but lands/spells, is this a keepable 7 against this deck?).
Fetch-Shock-Blog
Moderator of /r/Scapeshift
nookularboy: That's a good point. I'm just salty that I missed my 2nd-ever 5-0 by losing to a jank build due to bad luck! As a good exercise, and to get some crowd feedback, I'll watch my replays and post my keep/mulligan hands to see if others agree.
I am more accustomed to playing decks with a ton of cantrips, like Suicide Bloo, where variance still happens but is much more manageable since you control the top of your deck more. That's why I like the 3 Courser and 4 Relic maindeck to give me a little of that, plus the sideboard Harmonize.
Looking back on the game against BW Eldrazi Taxes, I could have played it differently. Instead of playing turn 2 Explore, I could have played untapped land and left up 2 mana in case of GQ. Then, I could play turn 3 fetch and have the mana to pop it to give me 3 lands and keep me in the game. That play is MUCH slower and worse against a turn 3 TKS, but it would have kept me in the game as it actually played out. In the dark, I don't know that I can afford to play that slowly or that I can assume he'll have turn 2 Arbiter with turn 3 GQ.
Hey Spike! Just following up here from my event last week. I went 3 rounds w/ the same list I posted prior. Final results were 1-1-1, still learning the deck and how to play my match-ups I suppose! Still haven't figured out what hands are keeps and mulls.
Also, this is what my SB looked like for the event:
3x Collective Brutality
3x Relic of Progenitus
3x Obstinate Baloth
1x Reclamation Sage
1x Nature's Claim
1x Chandra, Torch of Defiance
Quick match recap:
Match 1: Lantern (draw)
Game 1: He gets the lock - I think I make the mistake here of not scooping (I had 4 valakuts and eventually was able to cast an omen though, so any land drops were 4 bolts, so I figured I had a chance still).
Game 2: I get there with enough ramp and scapeshift - I board out Courser of 2x Kruphix, 2x Explores, 1x farseek, bringing in 3x Relics, 1x Rec Sage, and 1x Natures Claim.
Game 3: We get to time and have to draw
Match 2: Bant Knightfall (2-1, W)
G1 - he just overwhelms me with a fast start (hierarchs into constant streams of threats, quellers, and coco's)
G2 - In: 3 angers, 3 relics. Out: 2 courser, 2 Explore, 1 Omen, 1 Farseek (maybe should have been 2x farseek?. I hold up relic, constantly using it EoT, remove his dudes, and I eventually get there with Scapeshift.
G3 - he keeps a really sketchy hand - 3 dorks, 1 land. He opens with land, bird, go. I push the bird, he misses his 2nd land drop but eventually starts drawing them, but its too late at that point. I ramp into Titan and use valakut triggers to wipe his board for the win.
Match 3: Cheerios (0-2, L)
This match up seems terrible! Opinions here welcome!
G1 - he fizzles, I push his Paladin, doesn't matter since he drew 10+ cards, he plays another paladin, goes off for the win.
G2 - In: 3x Collective Brutality, Out: 2x Explore, 1x Farseek. I mulligan (1 lander) and am afraid to go down to 5, but feel like I should have mulled the hand away. Hand consisted of 2 Titans, 3 lands, 1 Collective Brutality. Game starts, I T2 Brutality and whiff on it. His hand had 3 Paladins, lands, and equipment. I draw Titan #3. He goes off on T3 or 4 for the win.
Looking back, I could have won the lantern match up if I just scooped the first game once the lock came on, giving me more time ultimately in game 3. Not sure about my SB decisions against the Bant Knightfall deck - relics and anger seems good, but maybe I should have cut the 3 omens and thrown in the 3 brutalities as well? The final match of the day just seemed super unfavorable, not sure what I could have done there other than perhaps try 2x Slaughter Games in the board for future combo matches.
Deciding if I want to play this or Eldrazi Tron in the upcoming GP at Vegas. I've got many more games under my belt with E.T, but the consistency of the deck just feels way off sometimes. Consistency in this deck's game play is what drew me to it, as this deck seems pretty resilient to mulls. Thoughts on deck choice?
Thanks!
Can't speak to the meta, but for a GP you want to play what you feel more comfortable with. Day 1 is just so long and the more you can make auto-pilot decisions, the more energy you can devote towards the more difficult ones. You have roughly a month between now and then, so you should be able to get a lot of reps in with the deck if you choose to go with it.
Fetch-Shock-Blog
Moderator of /r/Scapeshift
I also understand that I got lucky some of the games with my topdecks, then equally unlucky other times. That high variance is what is so frustrating to me. You are never OBLIGED to win against anyone, even an incredibly great matchup, but I believe it's OK to be unhappy if you lose against a very good matchup.
How do you really sculpt your plays with Titan Shift? For example, on the draw against an unknown opponent with the following hand:
Stomping Ground
Valakut
Wooded Foothills
Search for Tomorrow
Farseek
Courser
Primeval Titan
This is a fantastic opening hand, so you keep. Your opponent plays turn 1 discard and you lose Search. Barring any more acceleration off the top, you play turn 2 Farseek for Stomping Ground or Cinder Glade, turn 3 Courser, turn 5 Primeval. If you have other ramp, you probably play that turn 3 instead of Courser to enable turn 4 Primeval. They will likely kill the Primeval, and you are left with Courser (maybe) and a bunch of lands, relying on the top of your deck to give you something to answer whatever they are doing or win you the game outright. How can you sequence these cards any differently or more efficiently to minimize variance?
A few key considerations I have found with RG Titan Shift (in particular, mono-green maindeck) that make big impacts on the game:
1) When to fetch Stomping Ground vs Forest for turn 1 Search.
2) Holding Farseek in hand either as a Lightning Bolt or a potential Bolt if you draw Valakut.
3) Properly using Courser and shuffle effects to find lands or good action on the top.
4) When to play turn 3 Courser or turn 3 ramp.
5) When to play turn 2 Farseek vs STE. Normally it seems better to play Farseek so STE can chump-block a bigger threat in later turns. This is the opposite against Living End when you can use their namesake to get multiple uses out of STE.
6) Not pulling TOO many mountains from the deck in order to keep Scapeshift live.
7) In sideboard games, when to use your removal (example: I wasted a Bolt on a turn 1 Signal Pest and then lost to Blinkmoth+Cranial)
Automatic plays:
1) Turn 1 Search
2) Turn 2 Farseek, STE, Explore
3) Jam Primeval (either hard-cast or searched with Pact) when you have 6 lands unless playing around countermagic
4) Scapeshift + 7 lands unless playing around countermagic
That doesn't seem like a whole lot of things I can do control to become a better player and reduce variance. Do you have other examples?
What is "RUG Scapeshift" by the way? Is that RUGb BtL or something else?
I am really liking the sideboard Harmonize against grindy discard matchups. I won a game yesterday against Mardu Midrange where they made me discard my Farseek then played Liliana. I found turn 3 STE to ping Liliana. Harmonize kept me enough cards in hand that I could land a turn 5 Titan to kill her and take over. Once you get to 8 mana against a countermagic deck, you can often safely cast Harmonize because can't tap out to counter it for fear of dying to Scapeshift.
In that game one against Lantern, you need to count your winconditions that are live in your deck and compare it to the number of millstones they have. If it ever seems likely that they can keep you off wincons for a while, scoop. Not scooping to Lantern is how you go 0-1-1 and lose the match or 2-1 and win. Additionally, as a judge, I call slow play on Lantern opponents a lot. Recognize quickly what you can do, and do it. Don't dilly dally around on your turn thinking before you pass. Once they have locked you out and start milling you aggressively, turns should take about 4-5 seconds per turn. I used to play against Lantern constantly when I played elves and when I started recognizing how the matchup works and playing fast, I never drew a game again. It seems like the same can be done with this deck. Know what your winning draws are and if they give you anything else, run it out and pass.
As for deck choice, you have time to get used to this one. It is very consistent and resilient to mulligans, but it takes skill and reps to choose your mulligans and sequencing. I lost a match to Elves (my list actually that I was lending someone) which is supposed to be a bye because I fetched the wrong land on upkeep with SfT and then missequenced my fetches and ramp spells that turn keeping me from ramping into a much better chance of Sweltering Suns into Titan the next turn. That just goes to show that while the game plan is very simple, sequencing can be hard.
Choose the deck you have more fun with, because that will help you keep your energy up day one. Then once you decide it, get in a bunch of reps over the next month.
This deck is crazy low variance, it has 4 cards. Lands, Ramp, Disruption, and Winconcs. Mono green maindeck really skips disruption since Relic redraws, and Primal Command searches a wincon. But no deck in magic doesn't lose when it goes 7 turns in a row without drawing something to kill the opponent. I have scrubbed out of two Amonkhet drafts in a row by drawing straight lands until I hit 12 lands and lost. I even flooded out with Elves last week and that list only runs 19 lands. If you get a lot of experience with the deck, you see what line can possibly win, and play to that out. Like that match I described where I lost to elves, my out was draw Sweltering Suns, cast it, cast Titan in hand. So, I was supposed to carefully fetch my lands and tap my mana to let me play all of the ramp spells in hand and forget the Fatal Push I had. But I was tired and not paying attention so I missed it.
Past those type of lines, learning how to mulligan is important. Take for example the hand you described on the draw. The key in that matchup with getting your Titan killed, is to set up a win with it. It might not kill the opponent by attacking, but you can set up a win with its trigger. Use your foothills and ramp spells to get mountains, and have titan get you to 5 mountains 2 valakut if possible. If you can swing it, 5 mountains 3 valakut is better. That lets you have almost all of your topdecks, and Courser of Kruphix very live into the midgame. That is a game that you can win, and that's what you have to set up.
As far as some sequencing things you mention, Explore is actually best on turn 3 when you can go Explore into another ramp spell or Courser instead of just dropping a land on two. As for not pulling too many mountains, unless you have valakuts in play, don't get more than 5 mountains in play. That keeps as many hits in your deck as possible for mid-lategame valakut plays, and ensures Scapeshift is live.
And RUG scapeshift generally refers to any scapeshift list (usually without any Titans) that tries to control the game with Remands and Cryptic Commands until Scapeshift or bolt snap bolt wins. This includes the Bring to Light lists splashing Black or White.
Modern
Spike - I agree that the deck only has 4 cards. However, the variance comes from the lack of ability to control your draws, and the fact that MANY of your cards do nothing to affect the board. You have 23 non-Valakut lands, 14 ramp spells, and 0-3 Omens. That's upwards of 40 cards that do nothing until you win. Yes, every deck can flood out. Last FNM, I had 11 of my 18 lands out of my Jund DS deck and had only drawn about 6 spells. Sometimes it happens.
Your point about always playing to your outs is 100% valid and a good idea for every player to keep in mind in every game they play. One of my favorite League wins was a few years ago when I was playing some janky UWx control deck. I don't remember the exact scenario, but I remember that my only chance of winning the game was to find a Wrath, so I sequenced every decision to make that happen, including taking a lot more damage in a few attacks to devote all resources to finding Wrath. I eventually topdecked it the turn before I died and then went on to win the game. I wish I had kept that replay!
With Titan Shift, I feel like the decisions are pretty straightforward with little room for in-game decisions to affect the outcome. Play lands, ramp, chump-then-sac STE, get basic Forests if you suspect Blood Moon or Mountains to get Valakut online, then draw Titan/Pact/Scapeshift. I have made mistakes similar to what you described, where Search got a Mountain instead of Forest which prevented me from double-accelerating, and that cost me the game when I was 1 land short for Scapeshift.
I guess what I'm saying is that I feel like Titan Shift is more reliant on setting up the best winning line and hoping it works compared to other decks that have a lot more interaction. That's what I mean when I say "high variance".
Of those 23 non valakut lands, only 4 don't trigger valakut. Drawing a mountain or a fetchland is winning in the late game. And if you want to be able to manipulate the deck more, try some Oath of Nissa. I tried it out in the past, and it wasn't great. But with the deck running courser and sometimes Chandra or a few more creatures mainboard, it has more hits and might be decent.
Modern