I think the danger is that you want to have 1 card in the deck thats objectively powerful on solitaire decks and can end the game quick against spell based combo decks. Not a bad suggestion though, people talked about that card to power out Grim Flayers in Junk
All my opponents board out their damage based removal spells against me, so it isn't unlikely that Huntmaster could go unchecked, but I would imagine the lifegain could actually be problem rather than advantage, right?
Absolutely not, at all, you're looking to play unfair and efficiently. Playing a 4/4 body that gains you life is not where you want to be. If you're splashing white, why on earth would you not just play Ranger of Eos and tutor for two massive bodies all costing 1 to 2 mana each?
@Spsiegel- I think he is talking about Gerry T. and Michael Majors' style of not splashing the white.
I'm still not sure why they decided to go that way, trying to grind against the other 3 color midrange decks is super hard without Ranger and Souls, and we saw both of the Death's Shadow decks fall to such decks in the top 8 this weekend. If we could find something that functions as well as Ranger and Souls in just Jund, that's obviously preferable, but we haven't found anything yet. Painful truths might be playable, but a draw spell doesn't actually kill them, whereas Ranger and Souls can. (and souls is great in some faster matchups like affinity and infect too)
I tried the Michael Majors versions with no white splash and I absolutely hated it, especially against the grindy fair matches. I really needed the souls to help grind, and not having Ranger of Eos felt noticeable in those grindy games too.
I did lock an Esper deck out of lands with Liliana the Last Hope, Fulminator and multiple K-Commands, definitely salty feelings going around
Can people post up their sideboards? Im curious as to what everyones testing.
Here's mine:
3 Lingering Souls
1 Ranger of Eos
1 Kataki
1 Eidolon of Rhetoric
2 Fulminator mage
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Ancient Grudge
1 Liliana Last hope
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Grafdigger's cage
1 Maelstrom Pulse
I still feel the deck needs an out to Leyline of Sanctity and top decked Blood Moons. Wispmares are ideas but cant beat blood moons. I get that Maelstrom Pulse is the out, but i'm trying to think of a good green creature like Reclamation Sage
The tech here is Back to Nature, maybe one or two copies. I find that the sideboard bullets are probably too slow to matter (as GerryT said)
My SB is something like
1 Ranger of Eos
3 Lingering Souls
3 Fulminator Mage
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Ancient Grudge
1 Liliana, Last Hope
1 Grafdigger's cage
2 Back to Nature
1 Kataki
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Standard GBGB AggroGB
Modern GBRWDeath's ShadowGBRW UBWRAffinityUBWR GRTitanshiftGR URBGrixis ControlURB
Legacy BUGTrue Name BUGBUG UBRGrixis DelverUBR BUGShardless BUGBUG BUGElvesBUG
3x Lingering Souls
1x Kataki
1x Eidolon of Rhetoric
3x Fatal Push
2x Surgical Extraction
1x Liliana the Last Hope
3x Fulminator Mage
1x Anger of the Gods
I've been playing a list closer to Sam Blacks than the other lists
I really think K-Command has been incredible as a 3 of in the deck, and 1x Abrupt Decay feels like a safety blanket. Since I have 3 K-Commands and a Kataki ancient grudge has not felt needed at all, I can't see bringing it in except against Lantern, Tron and Affinity
Wouldn't mind having a Grafdiggers Cage or Pulse instead, still testing
I'm still not sure what lists to go with, such as
3x Fatal Push in the MB (Which usually involves cutting the Abrupt Decay)
Ghor Rampager, 1x Temur or 2x Temur. I think 3x Tarfires look right, since it isn't quite lightning bolt
So far, I have never thought to myself, "I wish I had Rampager in the deck to tutor up". Still figuring out if cutting the Decay and 3rd Command is right for the 2nd and 3rd copy of Fatal Push in the MB. K-Command is slower, but it also furthers the grind plan, people discarding, and destroying people trying to meta-game with Chalices and whatnot.
So far in my testing I haven't been happy cutting Decay
The reason I haven't cut the 2nd copy of Temur is because it works wonderfully against decks that don't interact, maybe I should consider cutting it, replacing it with a fatal push, and use Rampager in Eos' spot instead so that I can tutor for that trample and evasion.
I'm not sure how I feel about the 3x K-Command and 3 Lillies in the MB that Justin Cohen was using, it looks clunky for a deck with 18 lands. Maybe I should try it though, since I'm obviously not liking the 3x Pushes in the maindeck
Also, i've been playing in the practice rooms on MTGO, it's frustrating seeing all these decks and budget decks playing obvious hate geared towards the deck
The tech here is Back to Nature, maybe one or two copies. I find that the sideboard bullets are probably too slow to matter (as GerryT said)
My SB is something like
1 Ranger of Eos
3 Lingering Souls
3 Fulminator Mage
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Ancient Grudge
1 Liliana, Last Hope
1 Grafdigger's cage
2 Back to Nature
1 Kataki
Ok, loving that sweet sweet tech, though its flexibility kills it a little.
Basically against combo leyline decks I think rec sage is too slow. You need to get to turn 4 before you can go for it and then nause will probably have killed you. Back to nature is just a flexible and cheap answer to all redundant enchantments.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Standard GBGB AggroGB
Modern GBRWDeath's ShadowGBRW UBWRAffinityUBWR GRTitanshiftGR URBGrixis ControlURB
Legacy BUGTrue Name BUGBUG UBRGrixis DelverUBR BUGShardless BUGBUG BUGElvesBUG
Obviously, both cards are great, and they both serve similar, yet very different, roles. What I would like to know is which lili is best main and which is better board? What is the preferred split? Why?
I'm still not sure why they decided to go that way, trying to grind against the other 3 color midrange decks is super hard without Ranger and Souls, and we saw both of the Death's Shadow decks fall to such decks in the top 8 this weekend. If we could find something that functions as well as Ranger and Souls in just Jund, that's obviously preferable, but we haven't found anything yet. Painful truths might be playable, but a draw spell doesn't actually kill them, whereas Ranger and Souls can. (and souls is great in some faster matchups like affinity and infect too)
You get more bodies and no lifegain.
I did lock an Esper deck out of lands with Liliana the Last Hope, Fulminator and multiple K-Commands, definitely salty feelings going around
Here's mine:
3 Lingering Souls
1 Ranger of Eos
1 Kataki
1 Eidolon of Rhetoric
2 Fulminator mage
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Ancient Grudge
1 Liliana Last hope
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Grafdigger's cage
1 Maelstrom Pulse
I still feel the deck needs an out to Leyline of Sanctity and top decked Blood Moons. Wispmares are ideas but cant beat blood moons. I get that Maelstrom Pulse is the out, but i'm trying to think of a good green creature like Reclamation Sage
Affinity
Legacy:
GBCombo Elves
EDH:
GEzuri, Renegade Leader's Elf Ball
Cube:
180 Peasant Micro Cube
My SB is something like
1 Ranger of Eos
3 Lingering Souls
3 Fulminator Mage
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Ancient Grudge
1 Liliana, Last Hope
1 Grafdigger's cage
2 Back to Nature
1 Kataki
GBGB AggroGB
Modern
GBRWDeath's ShadowGBRW
UBWRAffinityUBWR
GRTitanshiftGR
URBGrixis ControlURB
Legacy
BUGTrue Name BUGBUG
UBRGrixis DelverUBR
BUGShardless BUGBUG
BUGElvesBUG
If don't want to go the pulse route, why not Reg sage? You have 5 cards basically to find a desperate way to destroy the enchantment
It would be more flexible than back to nature imo.
1x Kataki
1x Eidolon of Rhetoric
3x Fatal Push
2x Surgical Extraction
1x Liliana the Last Hope
3x Fulminator Mage
1x Anger of the Gods
I've been playing a list closer to Sam Blacks than the other lists
I really think K-Command has been incredible as a 3 of in the deck, and 1x Abrupt Decay feels like a safety blanket. Since I have 3 K-Commands and a Kataki ancient grudge has not felt needed at all, I can't see bringing it in except against Lantern, Tron and Affinity
Wouldn't mind having a Grafdiggers Cage or Pulse instead, still testing
I'm still not sure what lists to go with, such as
3x Fatal Push in the MB (Which usually involves cutting the Abrupt Decay)
Ghor Rampager, 1x Temur or 2x Temur. I think 3x Tarfires look right, since it isn't quite lightning bolt
So far, I have never thought to myself, "I wish I had Rampager in the deck to tutor up". Still figuring out if cutting the Decay and 3rd Command is right for the 2nd and 3rd copy of Fatal Push in the MB. K-Command is slower, but it also furthers the grind plan, people discarding, and destroying people trying to meta-game with Chalices and whatnot.
So far in my testing I haven't been happy cutting Decay
The reason I haven't cut the 2nd copy of Temur is because it works wonderfully against decks that don't interact, maybe I should consider cutting it, replacing it with a fatal push, and use Rampager in Eos' spot instead so that I can tutor for that trample and evasion.
I'm not sure how I feel about the 3x K-Command and 3 Lillies in the MB that Justin Cohen was using, it looks clunky for a deck with 18 lands. Maybe I should try it though, since I'm obviously not liking the 3x Pushes in the maindeck
Follow the link for nice cheap clothing.
Playing:
Death's Shadow Jund
Played:
Kiki Chord, Zoo variants, Goblins, Burn
Ok, loving that sweet sweet tech, though its flexibility kills it a little.
Affinity
Legacy:
GBCombo Elves
EDH:
GEzuri, Renegade Leader's Elf Ball
Cube:
180 Peasant Micro Cube
GBGB AggroGB
Modern
GBRWDeath's ShadowGBRW
UBWRAffinityUBWR
GRTitanshiftGR
URBGrixis ControlURB
Legacy
BUGTrue Name BUGBUG
UBRGrixis DelverUBR
BUGShardless BUGBUG
BUGElvesBUG
Obviously, both cards are great, and they both serve similar, yet very different, roles. What I would like to know is which lili is best main and which is better board? What is the preferred split? Why?