Hi,
just built this deck (with a list like #4037) . Yesterday I tried with a friend with panmeria (LOL): https://www.mtggoldfish.com/articles/budget-magic-96-39-tix-modern-pan-meria
I lost 0-3
One round lost because combo. Other 2 because damage.
I started my first turn with fetch -> blood cript -> thoughtseize : removed a Panharmonicon and go to 15 life
He put his second land and Knight of the White Orchid.
I put another fetch for a mountain for do bolt and kozilek and removed Flickerwisp. life 14.
He put land and wall of omens and drew.
I drew a lingering and was not able to cast because missing white! is the sacred foundry the first land to fetch?
In some way I was able to discard lingering with fathless and cast from graveyard.
He put felidar, bounced wall and drew.
His creatures had body 4, was not able to bolt or forked bolt.
When I was able to cast reveler, the board was full: wall, felidar, blade splicer with 2 golems so not able to attack neither to clean board. I usedthe bolts to kill some creature because his life was like 28 due to Lone Missionary.
I really missed my previous deck: R/W with 3 anger and 3 wrath
So maybe this deck is strong against tier1 decks (not tried yet ) but yesterday against this one I lost poorly.
We didn't use sideboard, wanted just to see if deck was working.
Do you have any advice?
Thanks
Interesting. I was considering Hazoret a few weeks ago... there's a lot to like about her indestructible hastey body and extra reach but she's really awkward in hands with Reveler. Options:
1) Cast Reveler first forcing you to pitch your curve-topping Hazoret
2) Cast Hazoret first, followed by Reveler -- drawing 3 can turn off Hazoret's "heckbent" ability
Interesting. I was considering Hazoret a few weeks ago... there's a lot to like about her indestructible hastey body and extra reach but she's really awkward in hands with Reveler. Options:
1) Cast Reveler first forcing you to pitch your curve-topping Hazoret
2) Cast Hazoret first, followed by Reveler -- drawing 3 can turn off Hazoret's "heckbent" ability
I like option 2. It will be fun to discard extra lands for 2 dmg.
Round 1: 2-0 against Elves
Round 2: 2-0 against Mono B Madness
Roudn 3: 2-0 against Elves
Round 4: 2-1 against Temur Breach
Round 5: 2-1 against Eldrazi Tron
Sideboarding for Elves:
- 2 IOK
- 1 BM
- 1 Souls
+ 2 EE
+ 1 CB
+ 1 Liliana, the Last Hope
Sideboarding against Mono B Madness:
-2 CB
-1 BM
+2 Rabblemaster
+1 LtLH
Deck felt great, matchups against Creature based decks are very easy, control manageable due to discard and Tron can be beaten with BM. Hazoret is just amazing, would totally run her again in my list. I did always win when she came down.
I managed to go 1-2 at an 8 man FNM, losing to one of my best matchups (Affinity), punting against Ponza, and then beating someone who flooded and then got screwed.
I'm not sure if it was just because I was playing badly or if it might have been an element of variance. I'm definitely not used to hand attack as a means of interaction and so my judgements on what to take are pretty sketchy.
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Well, I can saw a woman in two, but you won't wanna look in the box when I'm through.
I have been playing Storm for a while and am looking for another deck to switch to as the hate is getting too bad. I had been playing a variant of this some time before, and Bedlam Reveler and Fatal Push really make it look attractive again.
One thing I'm very curious about: Why are we playing 0 copies of Path to Exile? That seems like one of the best cards removal spells, and not playing any even in the board seems like a mistake. What's the rationale?
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Top 16 - 2012 Indiana State Championships Currently Playing: GBStandard - Golgari Safari MidrangeBG RBWModern - Mardu PyromancerWBR RLegacy - Good Old Fashioned BurnR
Getting back into playing Modern after winter break ended, I dont have the cards to do the Pyromancer build Im seeing pop up everywhere so I have to do a Midrange build. My lists in the past ran cards like Tidehollow Sculler, Squadron Hawk, Butcher of the Horde, and Thunderbreak Regent.
What other cards or strategies could I use since the Pyromancer strategy is a no go?
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Collecting Timbermare, hit me up if you have any for trade
I have been playing Storm for a while and am looking for another deck to switch to as the hate is getting too bad. I had been playing a variant of this some time before, and Bedlam Reveler and Fatal Push really make it look attractive again.
One thing I'm very curious about: Why are we playing 0 copies of Path to Exile? That seems like one of the best cards removal spells, and not playing any even in the board seems like a mistake. What's the rationale?
I think the reason why we see no path is because most lists are steadily moving away from white as a whole and focusing on red with a side of black. I also notice that the stock list runs Blood Moon in its 75. This demands that the deck somehow has a way to cast white spells thru a blood moon, which is the inclusion of a basic plains, and I don't see many people like that. Most lists depend on a combination of Fatal Push/Terminate/Dreadbore to get the job done.
I myself don't run blood moons mainly because I don't have the budget for them. In exchange, I tweaked my deck to run more white cards even including 3 paths in the main, along with varying numbers of Lightning Helix. In most of my games I find holding 2 mana open for terminate (and BR at that) feels clunky. The same goes for helix, hence the varying numbers of that card in my list.
One thing I'm very curious about: Why are we playing 0 copies of Path to Exile? That seems like one of the best cards removal spells, and not playing any even in the board seems like a mistake. What's the rationale?
Path and Bloodmoon are just very counterproductive. Additionally I think most people don't want to fetch-shock turn one for r/b and then fetch-shock turn 2 for r/w again. It is also a really awkward situation when you have one discard spell, one path and a lot of red spells in your starting hand. Which shockland do you fetch then? Discard into path hoping to get another red land? Discard into looting and just ignore the path in your hand?
You also want to be able to use your spells immediately when you have a pyromancer on board or if you are going to be to cast a reveler. Path and push need a target creature on board while burn spells just can hit opponents face.
I guess you can compare it to Jund. Jund wants b/g mana at the start (discard, goys, grimflayer, lilli). The red mana is only needed later on (k.command, huntmaster). We kinda do the same. We want r/g early on and later some white for lingering souls...
Path is very bad in this Tempo and attrition style of approach. Would never consider it, especially since we got access to Terminate. You want to dirupt the opponent and strand them on resources, Path works counterproductive here. In addition, white should almost certainly only be used to have Souls and white SB cards. Thats about it.
Thoughts on using a burst lightning instead of a forked bolt in the main? I like the instant speed and ability to kick it to finish off opponent if drawn late game. Forked bolt only seems better against small creature decks which we already have a good matchup. Either way I'm torn between these 2. Is there another burn option for this spot? Thanks.
Thoughts on using a burst lightning instead of a forked bolt in the main? I like the instant speed and ability to kick it to finish off opponent if drawn late game. Forked bolt only seems better against small creature decks which we already have a good matchup. Either way I'm torn between these 2. Is there another burn option for this spot? Thanks.
Burst Lightning is not as good as Forked Bolt. In the small creature matchups, Forked Bolt can eliminate two creatures, vs. Burst Lightning only going after one. Both can take down a two toughness creature as well, and both can go to face, but Forked Bolt is way better in that slot in Pyromancer decks for the first reason I stated above alone, even at sorcery speed. It also helps clear the way of pesky chump blockers from other "go wide" strategies, mana dorks or other small creatures for our tokens to swing in.
Since I can't do the Pyromancer build I'm going with a Midrange deck. This is based on how I used to run this deck, I feel it could be improved though. Problem is I can't really spend money to improve the deck and have to use what I already own. Here's what I'm thinking of running
3-1 tonight with the stock Selfeisek list. Only loss was to UW Control.
Don't really know how to board for that matchup, or if there are any specific cards we can run in the board for them.
Wear/Tear for Rest in Peace, Blood Moon to shut down their man-lands, board out 2 Lightning Helix and 2 Forked Bolt. Also one Terminate for one Kambal. The original Selfeisek version is weaker to UW than some updated lists, which have powerhouse creatures in the board to speed up the clock against combo and control, since this deck runs a lot slower than most decks.
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just built this deck (with a list like #4037) . Yesterday I tried with a friend with panmeria (LOL): https://www.mtggoldfish.com/articles/budget-magic-96-39-tix-modern-pan-meria
I lost 0-3
One round lost because combo. Other 2 because damage.
I started my first turn with fetch -> blood cript -> thoughtseize : removed a Panharmonicon and go to 15 life
He put his second land and Knight of the White Orchid.
I put another fetch for a mountain for do bolt and kozilek and removed Flickerwisp. life 14.
He put land and wall of omens and drew.
I drew a lingering and was not able to cast because missing white! is the sacred foundry the first land to fetch?
In some way I was able to discard lingering with fathless and cast from graveyard.
He put felidar, bounced wall and drew.
His creatures had body 4, was not able to bolt or forked bolt.
When I was able to cast reveler, the board was full: wall, felidar, blade splicer with 2 golems so not able to attack neither to clean board. I usedthe bolts to kill some creature because his life was like 28 due to Lone Missionary.
I really missed my previous deck: R/W with 3 anger and 3 wrath
So maybe this deck is strong against tier1 decks (not tried yet ) but yesterday against this one I lost poorly.
We didn't use sideboard, wanted just to see if deck was working.
Do you have any advice?
Thanks
1) Cast Reveler first forcing you to pitch your curve-topping Hazoret
2) Cast Hazoret first, followed by Reveler -- drawing 3 can turn off Hazoret's "heckbent" ability
I like option 2. It will be fun to discard extra lands for 2 dmg.
And a sideboard guide coming next week. I'll be trying out this updated list tonight and keeping the play tips from the article in mind
4 Bloodstained Mire
4 Marsh Flats
4 Blackcleave Cliffs
2 Blood Crypt
1 Sacred Foundry
3 Mountain
2 Swamp
Creatures [9]
4 Young Pyromancer
4 Bedlam Reveler
1 Hazoret, the Fervent
Noncreature Spells [31]
4 Inquisition of Kozilek
3 Thoughtseize
4 Faithless Looting
4 Lightning Bolt
1 Forked Bolt
2 Fatal Push
2 Terminate
2 Collective Brutality
1 Dradbore
3 Kolaghan's Command
4 Lingering Souls
1 Blood Moon
3 Nihil Spellbomb
1 Surgical Extraction
2 Blood Moon
1 Liliana of the Veil
1 Liliana, the Last Hope
1 Collective Brutality
1 Kambal, Consul of Allocation
2 Engineered Explosives
2 Goblin Rabblemaster
1 Wear // Tear
Round 1: 2-0 against Elves
Round 2: 2-0 against Mono B Madness
Roudn 3: 2-0 against Elves
Round 4: 2-1 against Temur Breach
Round 5: 2-1 against Eldrazi Tron
Sideboarding for Elves:
- 2 IOK
- 1 BM
- 1 Souls
+ 2 EE
+ 1 CB
+ 1 Liliana, the Last Hope
Sideboarding against Mono B Madness:
-2 CB
-1 BM
+2 Rabblemaster
+1 LtLH
Sideboarding against Temur Breach:
-1 Forked
-2 Push
-1 Dreadbore
-1 BM
+1 Surgical
+1 LoTV
+1 LtLH
+1 CB
+1 Spellbomb
Sideboarding against E-Tron:
-3 IOK
-2 CB
-1 Forked
+2 BM
+1 LoTV
+1 Wear // Tear
+2 Rabblemaster
Deck felt great, matchups against Creature based decks are very easy, control manageable due to discard and Tron can be beaten with BM. Hazoret is just amazing, would totally run her again in my list. I did always win when she came down.
I'm not sure if it was just because I was playing badly or if it might have been an element of variance. I'm definitely not used to hand attack as a means of interaction and so my judgements on what to take are pretty sketchy.
One thing I'm very curious about: Why are we playing 0 copies of Path to Exile? That seems like one of the best cards removal spells, and not playing any even in the board seems like a mistake. What's the rationale?
Currently Playing:
GBStandard - Golgari Safari MidrangeBG
RBWModern - Mardu PyromancerWBR
RLegacy - Good Old Fashioned BurnR
Clan Contest 3 Mafia - Mafia Co-MVP
What other cards or strategies could I use since the Pyromancer strategy is a no go?
I think the reason why we see no path is because most lists are steadily moving away from white as a whole and focusing on red with a side of black. I also notice that the stock list runs Blood Moon in its 75. This demands that the deck somehow has a way to cast white spells thru a blood moon, which is the inclusion of a basic plains, and I don't see many people like that. Most lists depend on a combination of Fatal Push/Terminate/Dreadbore to get the job done.
I myself don't run blood moons mainly because I don't have the budget for them. In exchange, I tweaked my deck to run more white cards even including 3 paths in the main, along with varying numbers of Lightning Helix. In most of my games I find holding 2 mana open for terminate (and BR at that) feels clunky. The same goes for helix, hence the varying numbers of that card in my list.
Hope that helps.
RBW Mardu Reveler
Commander:
UW Noyan Dar, Roil Shaper - One-Punch Griffin || UR Jhoira, Weatherlight Captain - Historic Tribal Superfriends
GR Omnath, Locus of Rage - Turbo Lands Spellslinger || WURBG Scion of the Ur-Dragon - Living Death Reanimator
BGonti, Lord of Luxury - Gonti's Midnight Party
Under Construction:
WGU Rubinia Soulsinger - Enchantress || RBGU Yidris, Maelstrom Wielder - Cascading Artifacts
RU Jhoira of the Ghitu - Dragonstorm Eldrazi || RU Mizzix of the Izmagnus - Spellslinger
WURBG The Ur-Dragon - Cloning for the Win || WGU Roon of the Hidden Realm - Creature Toolbox
RBGU Vial Smasher the Fierce Kydele, Chosen of Kruphix - Lots'a Combos || BW Ayli, Eternal Pilgrim - Reanimator Combo
WBGU Atraxa, Praetors' Voice - Modified Precon
BUR Nekusar, the Mindrazer || U Arcanis the Omnipotent - Artifact "Storm"
Path and Bloodmoon are just very counterproductive. Additionally I think most people don't want to fetch-shock turn one for r/b and then fetch-shock turn 2 for r/w again. It is also a really awkward situation when you have one discard spell, one path and a lot of red spells in your starting hand. Which shockland do you fetch then? Discard into path hoping to get another red land? Discard into looting and just ignore the path in your hand?
You also want to be able to use your spells immediately when you have a pyromancer on board or if you are going to be to cast a reveler. Path and push need a target creature on board while burn spells just can hit opponents face.
I guess you can compare it to Jund. Jund wants b/g mana at the start (discard, goys, grimflayer, lilli). The red mana is only needed later on (k.command, huntmaster). We kinda do the same. We want r/g early on and later some white for lingering souls...
Burst Lightning is not as good as Forked Bolt. In the small creature matchups, Forked Bolt can eliminate two creatures, vs. Burst Lightning only going after one. Both can take down a two toughness creature as well, and both can go to face, but Forked Bolt is way better in that slot in Pyromancer decks for the first reason I stated above alone, even at sorcery speed. It also helps clear the way of pesky chump blockers from other "go wide" strategies, mana dorks or other small creatures for our tokens to swing in.
2 Marsh Flats
2 Arid Mesa
2 Plains
2 Swamp
1 Mountain
1 Sacred Foundry
1 Godless Shrine
1 Blood Crypt
1 Needle Spires
1 Shambling Vent
1 Lavaclaw Reaches
1 Blackcleave Cliffs
1 Dragonskull Summit
1 Isolated Chapel
2 Dragonmaster Outcast
4 Squadron Hawk
4 Thunderbreak Regent
1 Stormbreath Dragon
1 Thundermaw Hellkite
1 Kolaghan, the Storm's Fury
1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
4 Inquisition of Kozilek
3 Lightning Bolt
4 Lingering Souls
3 Path to Exile
2 Fatal Push
1 Terminate
1 Dreadbore
1 Kolaghan's Command
1 Engineered Explosives
Obviously needs work and I want to keep the Dragon theme if at all possible.
Don't really know how to board for that matchup, or if there are any specific cards we can run in the board for them.
Wear/Tear for Rest in Peace, Blood Moon to shut down their man-lands, board out 2 Lightning Helix and 2 Forked Bolt. Also one Terminate for one Kambal. The original Selfeisek version is weaker to UW than some updated lists, which have powerhouse creatures in the board to speed up the clock against combo and control, since this deck runs a lot slower than most decks.