I cut the Kitchen Finks because I think at two copies it wouldn't consistently show up enough for what I wanted it to do, which is be an early game lifegainer/blocker and I was struggling to add a third. I essentially split the slots into a third Ooze, and a second Liliana, the Last Hope. I really like having six Lillys for Goyf, and this Liliana can do a great Eternal Witness impression if the game goes long. With the new planeswalker rules coming up, I feel it's safe to do this.
Aside from that, I have a single Engineered Explosives in the board to be a sometimes-third Flaying Tendrils and also an artifact board wipe, because I know my pure artifact destruction is low. I hope the EE and the last Abrupt Decay will make up for it.
I'd cut the twilight mire and 3rd overgrown tomb for a another swamp and a forest to reduce the pain and have less awkward lands (twilight with 3 tap lands and 3 colorless lands is not at its best)
I run a collective brutality main and only 2 decay because I rather have more protection/discard for my creatures that take over the game instead of removal for a random creature. Also, every mod if good vs top decks right now (Discard vs Scapeshift, Drain vs Burn, -2/-2 on aggressive decks like Abzan company to keep the tempo) With 4 push, 2 decay and 2 pulse, you got your back covered.
Scavening ooze is a little too much in my point of view. In decks where he's essential for his lifegain is OK with 3, but this 2 color deck (especially if you have a collective brutality main) doesn't require all that much. Great utility, but bad in numbers so I would cut it to 2.
A very important card that you might have missed is Go for the throat. This is one of the few answers we have to big creatures. You'll have a hard time vs EldraTron without at least 2 copies of this + a 3rd Thoughtseize.
6 Plainswalkers is a lot, but I kinda like it since they are hard to remove for certain decks.
You can add Creeping corrosion to the sideboard for more artifact hate as well.
Hmm...how important would you say Eternal Witness is? I definitely see its value, but maybe more removal is just better? It can also be hard to cast, and very graveyard dependent.
Hmm...how important would you say Eternal Witness is? I definitely see its value, but maybe more removal is just better? It can also be hard to cast, and very graveyard dependent.
I think one is fine in a pure GB shell - the 3 drop spot is pretty crowded so I wouldn't want more. I've never had room for it in abzan / jund lists.
Hey everyone, I'm new to playing the Abzan archtype in Modern. So the question that's been on my mind is how does Abzan fare better against Eldrazi Tron? Or even Tron in general? I feel like it is our worst matchup and we autolose game 1 at the very least. I always found it's better to be more proactive, but that requires a lucky curve. Are there any tips to making the matchup better for us, or at least more bearable? Cause outside of using Fulminator Mage or Stony Silence, I don't see a way to beat this deck?
Also, how good is the Fulminator/Surgical Extraction package against them? Worth sideboarding in?
Been having more success with my GB build. Just went 4-0 with it last night, and about to take it for another outing today with a couple changes. I'm going to change the Kalitas's to Garruk Relentless, as another way to enable Delirium, and add another Walking Ballista as it has been absolutely fantastic. Kalitas has been good, but I think this will be even better. Here's the current list:
Hi all, what do you think about playing both dark confident(4) and grim flayer(3) in the same list? I'm a new junk player and I find dark conf really powerfull
I would suggest against it, they want very different enablers.
Hi all, what do you think about playing both dark confident(4) and grim flayer(3) in the same list? I'm a new junk player and I find dark conf really powerfull
I've been testing out a 4-2 dark/grim split in BG and I have been loving the results so far! Grim teamed up with Dark on the field can really smooth out those draws.
Have been on grim flayer since march, recently replace it with bob and go back on grim flayer after 2 months of dark conf.
In actuel meta (eldrazi, valakut, storm, DS, affinity) you need body and card selection more than card advantage most of the time.
That's also why recent lists plays tireless tracker, it provides body and a bit of card advantage we can need in some MU where bob shines
I see a lot of lists playing one Tasigur, the Golden Fang. Isn't this anti-synergy? Is it being played just to have a decent creature that avoids Fatal Push?
Sorry, I'm fairly new to Abzan, just trying to get some information
There's a lot of reasons to like Tasigur, he's been a consideration in B/G/x since his release. In fact, he was a staple in Jund lists throughout 2015, which saw a format similar to the current one. I think he works even better in current Abzan lists because Grim Flayer can help to provide delve fuel, and if you're connecting with him you can "rig" your Tasigur by rearranging the cards that will be milled for Tasigur's ability. I'm not running him right now because my meta has more Collected Company decks than anything else, and the Knightfall players are running Reflector Mage in their sideboards, which is not great for Tasigur.
Like most questions about specific flex slot choices, the answer comes down to what you expect to play against and what you want to play against it with. Abzan has a lot of ways to solve problems across it's three colors, and not everyone solves them the same way.
Anyone see the Abzan list that win the mtgo modern ptq this weekend?
Interesting list.
5 Abzan lists finished 7-2 or better and all included 3 grim flayers and about 2 siege rhinos. Most of the successful lists recently have been similar.
One list even included 2 garruk wilspeakers. Is this better than Gideon?
Is this the best build at the moment?
Would love to hear everyone's thoughts.
I've been running the list (trend started by Fallleaf with his 8-0 a few weeks back). Seems strong, I like how threat-dense it is. Tracker has been on and off for me, but mostly on. 2 might be too many for the maindeck, but they shine in the grind matches. Everything else is pretty stock. I don't really want to play Bob right now cause of Burn and Valakut, and Flayer has proven his value over time.
Garruk is an interesting add. His tickup allows you to play him and then protect him with a flashbacked Lingering Souls, leading into a 16 damage aerial swing the following turn, barring disruption. Cranking out tokens has always been decent, but not entirely sure about his overall value within this shell.
The only thing that jumps out as unusual is Rhonas, how was he? And I'd say the spellbomb vs brutality depends on how much graveyard interaction you think you'll need. I don't think you can really go wrong either way, but I do like Brutality alongside Grim Flayer because it can help enable delirium.
I really like rhonas.becouse its hard to remove and lingering tokens 3/1 trample was nice.few times 6/5 7/6 goif with trample won games. Overall really impresed with it. I won one game against tokens just becouse i drew rhonas and activate ability on goyf and attack one spirit couldnt stop goyf
You could also just run a Rancor; gives you not only trample but another type to feed the tarmogeese if it happens to hit the gy.
I'd cut the twilight mire and 3rd overgrown tomb for a another swamp and a forest to reduce the pain and have less awkward lands (twilight with 3 tap lands and 3 colorless lands is not at its best)
I run a collective brutality main and only 2 decay because I rather have more protection/discard for my creatures that take over the game instead of removal for a random creature. Also, every mod if good vs top decks right now (Discard vs Scapeshift, Drain vs Burn, -2/-2 on aggressive decks like Abzan company to keep the tempo) With 4 push, 2 decay and 2 pulse, you got your back covered.
Scavening ooze is a little too much in my point of view. In decks where he's essential for his lifegain is OK with 3, but this 2 color deck (especially if you have a collective brutality main) doesn't require all that much. Great utility, but bad in numbers so I would cut it to 2.
A very important card that you might have missed is Go for the throat. This is one of the few answers we have to big creatures. You'll have a hard time vs EldraTron without at least 2 copies of this + a 3rd Thoughtseize.
6 Plainswalkers is a lot, but I kinda like it since they are hard to remove for certain decks.
You can add Creeping corrosion to the sideboard for more artifact hate as well.
BGW - Abzan
Legacy
BG - BG Lands
Mardu Burn
Monogreen Stompy
Legacy
Burn
Pauper
Dimir Flicker
Monowhite Tokens
I think one is fine in a pure GB shell - the 3 drop spot is pretty crowded so I wouldn't want more. I've never had room for it in abzan / jund lists.
Also, how good is the Fulminator/Surgical Extraction package against them? Worth sideboarding in?
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Marsh Flats
3 Overgrown Tomb
4 Blooming Marsh
1 Twilight Mire
2 Swamp
2 Forest
1 Treetop Village
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
Creatures 19
2 Walking Ballista
3 Noble Hierarch
4 Grim Flayer
4 Tarmogoyf
2 Fulminator Mage
2 Glissa, the Traitor
2 Ishkanah, Grafwidow
1 Slaughter Pact
3 Thoughtseize
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
2 Fatal Push
2 Abrupt Decay
1 Murderous Cut
Planeswalker 5
3 Liliana of the Veil
2 Garruk Relentless
Artifact 2
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Nihil Spellbomb
Enchantment 1
1 Rancor
2 Ghost Quarter
1 Scavenging Ooze
2 Collective Brutality
2 Seal of Primordium
2 Kitchen Finks
1 Liliana, the Last Hope
2 Flaying Tendrils
2 Faerie Macabre
1 Dark Betrayal
Abzan Traverse / Traverse Shadow / UR Kiki
I would suggest against it, they want very different enablers.
I've been testing out a 4-2 dark/grim split in BG and I have been loving the results so far! Grim teamed up with Dark on the field can really smooth out those draws.
In actuel meta (eldrazi, valakut, storm, DS, affinity) you need body and card selection more than card advantage most of the time.
That's also why recent lists plays tireless tracker, it provides body and a bit of card advantage we can need in some MU where bob shines
Sorry, I'm fairly new to Abzan, just trying to get some information
Like most questions about specific flex slot choices, the answer comes down to what you expect to play against and what you want to play against it with. Abzan has a lot of ways to solve problems across it's three colors, and not everyone solves them the same way.
Interesting list.
5 Abzan lists finished 7-2 or better and all included 3 grim flayers and about 2 siege rhinos. Most of the successful lists recently have been similar.
One list even included 2 garruk wilspeakers. Is this better than Gideon?
Is this the best build at the moment?
Would love to hear everyone's thoughts.
Garruk is an interesting add. His tickup allows you to play him and then protect him with a flashbacked Lingering Souls, leading into a 16 damage aerial swing the following turn, barring disruption. Cranking out tokens has always been decent, but not entirely sure about his overall value within this shell.
One-Eyed Black | Orzhov Combo | Ooze Reanimator | Mindwheeling Pain
You could also just run a Rancor; gives you not only trample but another type to feed the tarmogeese if it happens to hit the gy.
Evil Presence seems sweet against Tron, I might try these in the sideboard. Not sure if Ghost Quarter is better or worse.