It seems that Chris has decided to be prepared for DS, Dredge and possibly Storm matchs with four copies of Faerie Macabe in the main deck. And I think that his thoughts made sense since he reached the final stage and also beat Ross Meriam's Dredge in semifanals (that fact made twitch chat very and very suprised but i am pretty sure Faeries did their job well in those games). Well, without 4 copies of Fulminator mage and only 1 beast within it is super hard to win agains decks like tron especially with relic and chalice opening on turn 1. In our local meta when i am playing agains Eldrazi tron i am always expecting the worst scenario like chalice or relic in play very early, but fulminators help me a lot to slow tron player and give me some time to find beast within. Lets be honest Chris won quaterfinal match against tron cos he was very lucky despite of relic and chalice on turn 1, but Todd Stevens didnt give him a chance. Anyway i really happy to see living end in top 8 and pretty sure that the deck will become more and more popular in the future.
Hey, guys. I really need your advise. Recetly i changed kari-zev expertise with 4th demonic dread and i felt that it was a right move. But suddenly our meta has bacome full of remands and now my living ends are usually in my hand and i can not play it (suspend is pretty slow and crazy). So, what do you think about having in main deck 8 cascade spells as well as 1 copy of expertise (for example, instead of 1 beast within)?
I've been experiencing the same thing, I think the best solution is to up the count of ricochet trap in the board and not combo off until you have one in hand. I'm currently going from 2 to 3. Depending on how the meta continues might go to 4.
I would say keep it 4 and 3 with cascade spells, and keep the kari, just shift your sb a little also just play more cautious.
I'd like to contribute my thoughts about LE with recent updates. My testing and results show, that it may be completely ok to abandon land destruction plan B for more intensive all-in plan A. New amonkhet creatures are that good! And Im talking mostly about Archfiend and Horror. Some ppl say, that cycling for 2 is too slow. But I say its nonsence. Because sequence of turn 1 cycler, turn 2 archfiend and turn 3 LE with 2-3 cyclers in hand will overcome anything an opponent may field after that. Also horror (better 2 of them) on field make combat math very hard for opponents.... Personally, I want minimum of 2 Archfiends in my deck, maybe 3. If you've resolved it agains any deck that uses creatures, you know its THAT good. And Arfiend and Horror together are almost unbeatable.
So when it comes to land destruction plan, I think it existed in the first place mainly because 2 things: one, fulminator is in our colours and two, lack of more playable cycling creatures. There are really very few matchups where I would rather spend my turn 3 to destroy 1 land instead of getting 2 turn clock on board. So Im ok shaving LD plan for more cyclers to have more consistent and stronger plan A. LD and fightning against non-creatures deck should be left to SB.
While i want show, that all creatures expept SSGs are cyclers now (Faerie is best surprise cycler when we are tapped out and have Arfiend/Horror on board ) which makes the deck more consistent, I want to discuss the Sideboard more. I feel I have more or less everything I need....but I also feel I should have at least 2 slots for LD against tron (either Fulminator or Blood moon). But maybe thats not true anymore, since this version can be a lot faster than before....
What do you think guys? What would you play with this maindeck and what you wouldnt?
Also, which matchups would you consider to be okay to have Lost legacy? Right now I can think only about storm and scapeshift..are there any more decks in the meta right now that would be hurt badly by it?
I'd like to contribute my thoughts about LE with recent updates. My testing and results show, that it may be completely ok to abandon land destruction plan B for more intensive all-in plan A. New amonkhet creatures are that good! And Im talking mostly about Archfiend and Horror. Some ppl say, that cycling for 2 is too slow. But I say its nonsence. Because sequence of turn 1 cycler, turn 2 archfiend and turn 3 LE with 2-3 cyclers in hand will overcome anything an opponent may field after that. Also horror (better 2 of them) on field make combat math very hard for opponents.... Personally, I want minimum of 2 Archfiends in my deck, maybe 3. If you've resolved it agains any deck that uses creatures, you know its THAT good. And Arfiend and Horror together are almost unbeatable.
So when it comes to land destruction plan, I think it existed in the first place mainly because 2 things: one, fulminator is in our colours and two, lack of more playable cycling creatures. There are really very few matchups where I would rather spend my turn 3 to destroy 1 land instead of getting 2 turn clock on board. So Im ok shaving LD plan for more cyclers to have more consistent and stronger plan A. LD and fightning against non-creatures deck should be left to SB.
While i want show, that all creatures expept SSGs are cyclers now (Faerie is best surprise cycler when we are tapped out and have Arfiend/Horror on board ) which makes the deck more consistent, I want to discuss the Sideboard more. I feel I have more or less everything I need....but I also feel I should have at least 2 slots for LD against tron (either Fulminator or Blood moon). But maybe thats not true anymore, since this version can be a lot faster than before....
What do you think guys? What would you play with this maindeck and what you wouldnt?
Also, which matchups would you consider to be okay to have Lost legacy? Right now I can think only about storm and scapeshift..are there any more decks in the meta right now that would be hurt badly by it?
Thanks!
I understand from your comment that you are new to this deck; welcome! Hope you enjoy it, I've found this deck to be the most deeply rewarding I've ever played in any card game period.
Allow me to say you're making the classic new living end player mistake. The games where you blow people out with 2-3 cyclers into living end and a bunch of damage are amazing. They feel awesome. That's gotta be the best thing the deck does... right?
Wrong. It's only a matter of time before you begin facing counters company decks or other midrange decks that can survive one living end. You'll find yourself losing these games. The LD was not added in because of a lack of cycling creatures. When the deck began in Extended, there were tons of evoke and cyclers that were good enough to play. The LD is in because getting 2-3 LD is arguably the strongest control mechanic in modern. I beat a dredge deck just this weekend because of the power of LD. Seriously, I understand if you really need to metagame against Death's Shadow and Dredge, but don't assume this deck is a straight combo deck. My play immensely improved once I thought of it as a flexible control deck, and the LD is an enormously important part of that.
Also, which matchups would you consider to be okay to have Lost legacy? Right now I can think only about storm and scapeshift..are there any more decks in the meta right now that would be hurt badly by it?
How about... Living End?
We haven't recently discussed the mirror match here, but that is one of the most skill intensive matches I've played ina tournament setting. Here's some things I learned:
- Obviously a landed Leyline puts you in a short term advantage (until they Beast it).
- Lost Legacy naming Living End puts you in charge of when graveyards come into play and who gets to act first.
- You almost never want to resolve Demonic Dread if you can avoid it. It puts you at a bad tempo advantage.
- Faeries in hand are obviously super effective.
- You have to constantly balance the number of creatures on the field and the number in the Graveyard. The one who has better balance and greater power between the two should win.
It may see that way but I play LE for 2 years now Before, I would agree with you, but now with Arfiend and Horror, I must dissagree....1 of those can beat anything post LE those decks you mention can get into play.
Also, Pulse always gives me 6 life, Boar and Spike feeder only 4. Gnaw to the bone can give you also 6 life turn 3 (and is also only instant of these 3) but you have to have perfect cycles turn 1 and 2. Sometimes that doesnt happen and against burn I dont wanna depend on my luck. And Pulse have added value with returning either land or cycler in your hand. Sure, in late game, flashback from Gnaw can get handy, but I think 1)against burn (which this card is for) you dont get late game and 2)if you flashback Gnaw for some value it means you have full grave and didnt LE...which means you lose anyway.
But after watching our lord and saviour's TWOO video, I will probably move Beast within to SB and get at least 3 Fulminators back in, because yeah, destroying lands is super fun!
Also, which matchups would you consider to be okay to have Lost legacy? Right now I can think only about storm and scapeshift..are there any more decks in the meta right now that would be hurt badly by it?
How about... Living End?
We haven't recently discussed the mirror match here, but that is one of the most skill intensive matches I've played ina tournament setting. Here's some things I learned:
- Obviously a landed Leyline puts you in a short term advantage (until they Beast it).
- Lost Legacy naming Living End puts you in charge of when graveyards come into play and who gets to act first.
- You almost never want to resolve Demonic Dread if you can avoid it. It puts you at a bad tempo advantage.
- Faeries in hand are obviously super effective.
- You have to constantly balance the number of creatures on the field and the number in the Graveyard. The one who has better balance and greater power between the two should win.
What are your tips for playing the mirror?
I use Crypt Incursion for the mirror, have two of them in the sideboard. Together with 3 Faeries in the maindeck.
My meta is also home to Dredge decks, so having 5 grave remover in the 75 helps.
I don't think we've hit that point. It's sitting at a little less than 3% of the total metagame both paper and online. In a blind environment like a GP or open, that number is probably even less given the higher stakes associated.
"wrath is no vice when inflicted upon the deserving"
for living end mirror sand bag those faerie macabre, a well timed use will swing the match a long way in your favor
I have thought about leylines, but I have one issue (aside from price) if you use leyline you need 4 of them to hit them in your opening hand. Drawing them later is usually dead card. So assuming I would have 4 leyline of sanctity and while we are at it, 4 leyline of the void (against mirror, dredge, storm) in my SB. How would the rest of you SB look? And what other matchups would you use leyline of sanctity in?
"wrath is no vice when inflicted upon the deserving"
for living end mirror sand bag those faerie macabre, a well timed use will swing the match a long way in your favor
I have thought about leylines, but I have one issue (aside from price) if you use leyline you need 4 of them to hit them in your opening hand. Drawing them later is usually dead card. So assuming I would have 4 leyline of sanctity and while we are at it, 4 leyline of the void (against mirror, dredge, storm) in my SB. How would the rest of you SB look? And what other matchups would you use leyline of sanctity in?
Thanks
It's hard to say what should go in a sideboard without seeing the list itself. A couple mainstays though are ingot chewers, shriekmaws, anger of the gods, and ricochet traps if you're scared of counterspells. There's other, more meta specific ones you can also choose from. Are there particular matchups you're scared of in your local meta?
surprisingly leyline of sanctity is useful against some decks.
storm can't just combo off and kill you with grapeshot for one, they need to cast empty the warrens but wiping board is not a problem for living end player.
it is also problematic for ad nauseam deck, since they need to destroy/bounce it before casting lightning storm.
it is also useful for deck with hand disruption (death's shadow variant, etc) to some extent.
for mirror and dredge you only need faerie macabre as i mention, taking out a few key card at instant speed is devastating for graveyard centric deck
slaughter games is good for any kind of combo decks. used to carry 2 in the sideboard but not many player play combo in my meta so i drop the count to 1. with collected counters on the rise (devoted druid + vizier of remedies combo) maybe i will up the count to 2 again.
you could always replace it for lost legacy but the cannot be countered clause is what makes slaughter games more appealing to me.
Regarding Storm and Leyline, remember that they can't target you with Gifts either. They can still Merchant Scroll for Echoing Truth, but that usually gives you like 2 turns.
PS: back in my time, the tech in the LE mirror was siding out the LE
I believe WoTC's new policy is to make sure that every color can enjoy the exciting gameplay mechanic of making undercosted dudes and then turning them sideways. Clearly the future of magic.
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Regarding Storm and Leyline, remember that they can't target you with Gifts either. They can still Merchant Scroll for Echoing Truth, but that usually gives you like 2 turns.
PS: back in my time, the tech in the LE mirror was siding out the LE
Or set up a gifts package involving past in flames and echoing truths.
So I only own 3 Fulminator Mages. I was thinking of running a beast within as Fuliminator mage #4. Also 19 or 20 lands? Also should I run 4 demonic dread or 3.
I've been experiencing the same thing, I think the best solution is to up the count of ricochet trap in the board and not combo off until you have one in hand. I'm currently going from 2 to 3. Depending on how the meta continues might go to 4.
I would say keep it 4 and 3 with cascade spells, and keep the kari, just shift your sb a little also just play more cautious.
WRBurnRW
URGifts StormRU
RGoblinsR
So when it comes to land destruction plan, I think it existed in the first place mainly because 2 things: one, fulminator is in our colours and two, lack of more playable cycling creatures. There are really very few matchups where I would rather spend my turn 3 to destroy 1 land instead of getting 2 turn clock on board. So Im ok shaving LD plan for more cyclers to have more consistent and stronger plan A. LD and fightning against non-creatures deck should be left to SB.
Here is my list now which I am testing:
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/666139#paper
While i want show, that all creatures expept SSGs are cyclers now (Faerie is best surprise cycler when we are tapped out and have Arfiend/Horror on board
What do you think guys? What would you play with this maindeck and what you wouldnt?
Also, which matchups would you consider to be okay to have Lost legacy? Right now I can think only about storm and scapeshift..are there any more decks in the meta right now that would be hurt badly by it?
Thanks!
I understand from your comment that you are new to this deck; welcome! Hope you enjoy it, I've found this deck to be the most deeply rewarding I've ever played in any card game period.
Allow me to say you're making the classic new living end player mistake. The games where you blow people out with 2-3 cyclers into living end and a bunch of damage are amazing. They feel awesome. That's gotta be the best thing the deck does... right?
Wrong. It's only a matter of time before you begin facing counters company decks or other midrange decks that can survive one living end. You'll find yourself losing these games. The LD was not added in because of a lack of cycling creatures. When the deck began in Extended, there were tons of evoke and cyclers that were good enough to play. The LD is in because getting 2-3 LD is arguably the strongest control mechanic in modern. I beat a dredge deck just this weekend because of the power of LD. Seriously, I understand if you really need to metagame against Death's Shadow and Dredge, but don't assume this deck is a straight combo deck. My play immensely improved once I thought of it as a flexible control deck, and the LD is an enormously important part of that.
Edit: also, don't play pulse of murasa. We have much better life gain in the form of Gnaw to the Bone, Brindle Boar, and Spike Feeder.
How about... Living End?
We haven't recently discussed the mirror match here, but that is one of the most skill intensive matches I've played ina tournament setting. Here's some things I learned:
- Obviously a landed Leyline puts you in a short term advantage (until they Beast it).
- Lost Legacy naming Living End puts you in charge of when graveyards come into play and who gets to act first.
- You almost never want to resolve Demonic Dread if you can avoid it. It puts you at a bad tempo advantage.
- Faeries in hand are obviously super effective.
- You have to constantly balance the number of creatures on the field and the number in the Graveyard. The one who has better balance and greater power between the two should win.
What are your tips for playing the mirror?
Also, Pulse always gives me 6 life, Boar and Spike feeder only 4. Gnaw to the bone can give you also 6 life turn 3 (and is also only instant of these 3) but you have to have perfect cycles turn 1 and 2. Sometimes that doesnt happen and against burn I dont wanna depend on my luck. And Pulse have added value with returning either land or cycler in your hand. Sure, in late game, flashback from Gnaw can get handy, but I think 1)against burn (which this card is for) you dont get late game and 2)if you flashback Gnaw for some value it means you have full grave and didnt LE...which means you lose anyway.
But after watching our lord and saviour's TWOO video, I will probably move Beast within to SB and get at least 3 Fulminators back in, because yeah, destroying lands is super fun!
for living end mirror sand bag those faerie macabre, a well timed use will swing the match a long way in your favor
I use Crypt Incursion for the mirror, have two of them in the sideboard. Together with 3 Faeries in the maindeck.
My meta is also home to Dredge decks, so having 5 grave remover in the 75 helps.
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I have thought about leylines, but I have one issue (aside from price) if you use leyline you need 4 of them to hit them in your opening hand. Drawing them later is usually dead card. So assuming I would have 4 leyline of sanctity and while we are at it, 4 leyline of the void (against mirror, dredge, storm) in my SB. How would the rest of you SB look? And what other matchups would you use leyline of sanctity in?
Thanks
It's hard to say what should go in a sideboard without seeing the list itself. A couple mainstays though are ingot chewers, shriekmaws, anger of the gods, and ricochet traps if you're scared of counterspells. There's other, more meta specific ones you can also choose from. Are there particular matchups you're scared of in your local meta?
storm can't just combo off and kill you with grapeshot for one, they need to cast empty the warrens but wiping board is not a problem for living end player.
it is also problematic for ad nauseam deck, since they need to destroy/bounce it before casting lightning storm.
it is also useful for deck with hand disruption (death's shadow variant, etc) to some extent.
for mirror and dredge you only need faerie macabre as i mention, taking out a few key card at instant speed is devastating for graveyard centric deck
my current sideboard:
4 leyline of sanctity
2 shriekmaw ( 2 in the mainboard)
2 anger of the gods
3 ingot chewer
1 slaughter games
1 krosan grip
2 ricochet trap
sideboard is configured against burn and aggro matchup becuase their number is staggeringly high in my local meta
you could always replace it for lost legacy but the cannot be countered clause is what makes slaughter games more appealing to me.
PS: back in my time, the tech in the LE mirror was siding out the LE
Or set up a gifts package involving past in flames and echoing truths.
you opponent cant cast gifts ungiven because you are not a legal target.
I loathe creatures! Praise Prison and Land Destruction!
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