Ive been using counterbore lately and am very pleased, as for tron,spreading seas is my card of choice recently,I MB two since I am commandless and have two sb.
how many lands do you run? a 5 cmc counter is quite a stretch for this deck. Also, doesn't having 2 enchantments squeeze your instant/sorcery count and delver flip %?
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BGW Elves BGW|BW Tokens BW|WBR Sword&ShieldWBR|BUG DelverBUG|UWR Kiki UWR | UR Storm UR
Nice results. I'm starting to like Remand in this deck. I've played a few games this past week where it was badass, especially with Remand - Snap Remand.
Since my background is in Twin, Remand has been my best friend for a long time. I love the card, I love the tempo advantage, and I have a really hard time giving it up, especially with all the weaknesses that Leak has in the late game. Plus, having foil original Ravnica copies doesn't help me wanting to cut it either.
Yeah I saw, you had a very beautiful deck! Especially jealous of the foil Ravnica remands.
I take it that the main reason you're on Grixis Delver now is because now it's the only deck in the format that allows you to even play Tarns/Snaps/Remands?
Young pyromancer is our worst creature against tron. You really can't beat tron without turn 1 delver/ turn 2 delve fattie or having very good luck. I still don't understand that some people like blood moon in our deck. The manabase is just not built to support it. Molten rain/Fulminator mage also doesn't seem a good solution and I'm right now I'm playing crumble in the sideboard(not enough results yet), but it seems very slow on the draw. I just think we have no reliable way to beat tron, even post-board. I think we just have to play the tempo game, hoping to draw a lot of leaks / countersqualls and finish them fast.
Hello, here's my reasoning for things.
Peezy is the worst of our anti tron creatures, true, but I still think it's right to include him. We only have 8 delver + delve guys and while we do need to mulligan to threats, we can't afford too many potential mulligans just to dig for a delver, so I like having a few extra threats around as extra pressure (and itsee better than snapcaster as an early threat lol). An extra gurmaug is possible, but he's already risky in this matchup as they run relics, and too many v cliques can be also be a problem. (For reference, my current creature count is 4 delvers, 4 snapcasters, 3 tasigur, 1 gurmaug, and 1 clique.)
I like blood moon because it works best with that tempo plan youve described, and that tempo plan is how to win. We can't really hate out tron without committing a huge amount of the sideboard, but BM gives us a 2-of slot that works with the plan of threats and hold up counterspells (and is also good against bant eldrazi and annoying for scapeshift). We're not a deck really built for BM, true, but we have a lot of fetches, and we usually only need two islands and 1 swamp under a BM to operate a near full capacity. It's just more awkward for them than it is for us.
Yeah, I mean, I let htem in post-board also, but YP is not usually going to close the game agains tron alone. I agree of what you said about BM, but when I was playing with BM in the sideboard(long ago) many times I find it awkward to cast since it would let me incapable to cast some spells. I play 10 fetchs so usually I can fetch basics, that's not really a problem. But sometimes you open hands that just doesn't work if you fetch basics. Also BM doesn't flip delver (that's also a minor thing to consider). But anyway, as I said I don't think there's a card in the modern pool that is the final solution to tron. BM didn't work for me, but neither did molten rain.
Your list looks good and streamlined. How did you liked your split between 1x Peezy and 1x Clique? I'm running 2x Peezys currently but I'm considering the split too.
I personally would cut 2x Terminates for 2x Fatal Push. I think hardremoval is better in the sideboard than Push.
I still don't get why peaple are running Painful Truths. You have 3 sideboard slots for grinding in 1x Pia & Kiran and 2x Truths.
Why don't you run 3x Ancestral Vision? You don't need a playset of them because the games where you side them in go long and topdecked AVs are not that bad.
I wouldn't run a playset because I don't want to draw multiples but 3 or even 2 is perfectly fine.
The life- and tempoloss of truths is also relevant because you want to be the control against GBx.
What are your thoughts?
In more controlling post board match ups I prefer Painful Truths over AV, most often you only need to cast it once and if you need to cast it twice you can snap it back. The life loss isn't as much of a issue either because you are likely siding in more Collective Brutalities and can regain 2 of the 3 loss on the escalate. AV is only great if your casting it in your first two turns, most often we are not siding into a Cryptic Command deck which would actually help with making later game AV more likely to even get cast I mean T5 drawing AV means you need to get T10 to see it resolve that is a long time T5 drawing Painful Truths is much better top deck against Abzan, Jund, or Uxx control. Life totals are less important against the grindy mid-range attrition/control style decks, it normally comes down to top decks and Painful Truths pulls you out ahead in the top deck wars. Painful Truths is only really bad in those match ups in the exact same ways that AV would be which is when you draw mostly land off of it, but given Grixis Delver has such a low land count you are far more likely to 2-3 spells or creatures and pull ahead.
The tempo loss is true of AV also, its less of a investment for sure but going U for a card that takes 5 turns to pay off against a BRU for immediate return on investment and most likely having mana still open to either put down a creature or answer a card of your opponents is just more impactful.
Not to mention you would devoting 3 SB slots against 1 SB. I think if you are going a more transformational SB plan over all with Cryptic Commands perhaps even Desolate Light house then AV would make more sense, given that most people are SBing more of a 2-4 card swap out to sure up other match ups dedicating 3 slots to a Turn 5 draw 3 if you have it in the opener doesn't make much sense unless your supporting the ability to get to the late game more.
Nice results. I'm starting to like Remand in this deck. I've played a few games this past week where it was badass, especially with Remand - Snap Remand.
Since my background is in Twin, Remand has been my best friend for a long time. I love the card, I love the tempo advantage, and I have a really hard time giving it up, especially with all the weaknesses that Leak has in the late game. Plus, having foil original Ravnica copies doesn't help me wanting to cut it either.
Yeah I saw, you had a very beautiful deck! Especially jealous of the foil Ravnica remands.
I take it that the main reason you're on Grixis Delver now is because now it's the only deck in the format that allows you to even play Tarns/Snaps/Remands?
Thank you! Keeping an eye out on eBay or tcg player means you can nab good deals on LP and MP copies from time to time. To be honest, many people are very harsh on their grading and I have seen some "MP" cards that look almost as good as some listed as "NM." eBay is great because many sellers include actual pictures of cards so I can judge quality from there, so you can often get away with cheaper prices on generous wear grading.
More or less a good explanation why I play Delver. I have definitely grown to enjoy it this past year, but I very much miss the instant speed flash game I used to play. But 1 mana threats mean I can still leave up mana for other things, which is cool. While I seem to constantly argue for Delver to be an aggro deck, I like that it can play multiple roles at different stages in a game and in different matchups. It's a fun and versitile deck that I very much enjoy, I just wish it was a little more robust and had the tools to be solidly in Tier 1.
My trip down the foil rabbit hole began with full art Lightning Bolts because I convinced myself I'd probably never play a deck that doesn't have 4 bolts. Slowly built up foils for Grixis Twin (Yep.... ), then lucked into a good deal on foil Delvers. I love snap-bolt, and I firmly believe Grixis Delver is the best snap-bolt deck (and very fun), so I spent the past year picking up foil pieces here and there along the way.
Whoever has been playing around with tar pit and cryptic main, how's it been performing? I'm considering trying it out but I'm not sure if I'd be playing worse grixis control at that point.
Whoever has been playing around with tar pit and cryptic main, how's it been performing? I'm considering trying it out but I'm not sure if I'd be playing worse grixis control at that point.
I personally can't stand Cryptic Command in this deck because I don't like 4 drops that cost UUU in this kind of deck, but I could see slower controlish builds wanting it. In moving to a 20th land after losing Probe, I like using Tar Pit. Coming in tapped isn't the end of the world most of the time, especially since I'm used to running 19 lands to begin with. In the late game, crashing in for 3 unblockable every turn during a top deck war seems better than hoping to dig for answers/threats with Desolate Lighthouse in most cases. Plus, producing U and B is more useful than making 1.
I beat Affinity and some strange variant of Tron with the 3 original Eldrazi Titans, lost a very close game to jund and drew in the final match with Bant Knightfall. All i have to say is that Fatal Push is amazing!
For affinity Fatal Push and Kolaghan's Command were the MVP. Being able to remove his robots multiple times and take his Etched Champion off of Metalcraft is damn good. For Tron Countersquall made all the difference. Jund was my favorite match of the night. We were on an equal pace but in the end he was able to edge out the win. With Bant Knightfall we had gone to time and my anxiety got the best of me and a few misplays cost me the game. Overall Fatal Push is great and I love it in a matchup like Tron because it's an easy piece to side out for a more effective spell. I feel that for the moment my mainboard is solid but my sideboard needs a couple tweaks.
I beat Affinity and some strange variant of Tron with the 3 original Eldrazi Titans, lost a very close game to jund and drew in the final match with Bant Knightfall. All i have to say is that Fatal Push is amazing!
For affinity Fatal Push and Kolaghan's Command were the MVP. Being able to remove his robots multiple times and take his Etched Champion off of Metalcraft is damn good. For Tron Countersquall made all the difference. Jund was my favorite match of the night. We were on an equal pace but in the end he was able to edge out the win. With Bant Knightfall we had gone to time and my anxiety got the best of me and a few misplays cost me the game. Overall Fatal Push is great and I love it in a matchup like Tron because it's an easy piece to side out for a more effective spell. I feel that for the moment my mainboard is solid but my sideboard needs a couple tweaks.
Three fatal push and one terminate seems really bad. I've only been playing fatal push for a few nights but I'm already cutting back from three to two and staying at three terminates. The conditionality of it has been a huge liability.
Three fatal push and one terminate seems really bad. I've only been playing fatal push for a few nights but I'm already cutting back from three to two and staying at three terminates. The conditionality of it has been a huge liability.
All I can say for now is that i like having a 3-1 push/terminate split at the moment. It was great but of course I'll adjust numbers the more games I play.
more than 1/2 their deck is geared to achieve tron lands included. How about considering atking their threats? Their threats are around the count of 10 ish. thats roughly the count of 2 draws for a 4 turn game.
how many lands do you run? a 5 cmc counter is quite a stretch for this deck. Also, doesn't having 2 enchantments squeeze your instant/sorcery count and delver flip %?
BGW Elves BGW|BW Tokens BW|WBR Sword&ShieldWBR|BUG DelverBUG|UWR Kiki UWR | UR Storm UR
URBURB
Yeah I saw, you had a very beautiful deck! Especially jealous of the foil Ravnica remands.
I take it that the main reason you're on Grixis Delver now is because now it's the only deck in the format that allows you to even play Tarns/Snaps/Remands?
Play better
Delver can be pretty fast, so unless you're playing against a control deck you should have no issue running out of time.
Yeah, I mean, I let htem in post-board also, but YP is not usually going to close the game agains tron alone. I agree of what you said about BM, but when I was playing with BM in the sideboard(long ago) many times I find it awkward to cast since it would let me incapable to cast some spells. I play 10 fetchs so usually I can fetch basics, that's not really a problem. But sometimes you open hands that just doesn't work if you fetch basics. Also BM doesn't flip delver (that's also a minor thing to consider). But anyway, as I said I don't think there's a card in the modern pool that is the final solution to tron. BM didn't work for me, but neither did molten rain.
RBGW Suicide Zoo
Legacy
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In more controlling post board match ups I prefer Painful Truths over AV, most often you only need to cast it once and if you need to cast it twice you can snap it back. The life loss isn't as much of a issue either because you are likely siding in more Collective Brutalities and can regain 2 of the 3 loss on the escalate. AV is only great if your casting it in your first two turns, most often we are not siding into a Cryptic Command deck which would actually help with making later game AV more likely to even get cast I mean T5 drawing AV means you need to get T10 to see it resolve that is a long time T5 drawing Painful Truths is much better top deck against Abzan, Jund, or Uxx control. Life totals are less important against the grindy mid-range attrition/control style decks, it normally comes down to top decks and Painful Truths pulls you out ahead in the top deck wars. Painful Truths is only really bad in those match ups in the exact same ways that AV would be which is when you draw mostly land off of it, but given Grixis Delver has such a low land count you are far more likely to 2-3 spells or creatures and pull ahead.
The tempo loss is true of AV also, its less of a investment for sure but going U for a card that takes 5 turns to pay off against a BRU for immediate return on investment and most likely having mana still open to either put down a creature or answer a card of your opponents is just more impactful.
Not to mention you would devoting 3 SB slots against 1 SB. I think if you are going a more transformational SB plan over all with Cryptic Commands perhaps even Desolate Light house then AV would make more sense, given that most people are SBing more of a 2-4 card swap out to sure up other match ups dedicating 3 slots to a Turn 5 draw 3 if you have it in the opener doesn't make much sense unless your supporting the ability to get to the late game more.
Thank you! Keeping an eye out on eBay or tcg player means you can nab good deals on LP and MP copies from time to time. To be honest, many people are very harsh on their grading and I have seen some "MP" cards that look almost as good as some listed as "NM." eBay is great because many sellers include actual pictures of cards so I can judge quality from there, so you can often get away with cheaper prices on generous wear grading.
More or less a good explanation why I play Delver. I have definitely grown to enjoy it this past year, but I very much miss the instant speed flash game I used to play. But 1 mana threats mean I can still leave up mana for other things, which is cool. While I seem to constantly argue for Delver to be an aggro deck, I like that it can play multiple roles at different stages in a game and in different matchups. It's a fun and versitile deck that I very much enjoy, I just wish it was a little more robust and had the tools to be solidly in Tier 1.
My trip down the foil rabbit hole began with full art Lightning Bolts because I convinced myself I'd probably never play a deck that doesn't have 4 bolts. Slowly built up foils for Grixis Twin (Yep.... ), then lucked into a good deal on foil Delvers. I love snap-bolt, and I firmly believe Grixis Delver is the best snap-bolt deck (and very fun), so I spent the past year picking up foil pieces here and there along the way.
UR ....... WUBR ........... WB ............. RGW ........ UBR ....... WUB .... BGU
Spells / Blink & Combo / Token Grind / Dino Tribal / Draw Cards / Zombies / Reanimate
there is no limit per se. but u can be called out for delaying/slow play. Especially if you won round 1.
BGW Elves BGW|BW Tokens BW|WBR Sword&ShieldWBR|BUG DelverBUG|UWR Kiki UWR | UR Storm UR
I personally can't stand Cryptic Command in this deck because I don't like 4 drops that cost UUU in this kind of deck, but I could see slower controlish builds wanting it. In moving to a 20th land after losing Probe, I like using Tar Pit. Coming in tapped isn't the end of the world most of the time, especially since I'm used to running 19 lands to begin with. In the late game, crashing in for 3 unblockable every turn during a top deck war seems better than hoping to dig for answers/threats with Desolate Lighthouse in most cases. Plus, producing U and B is more useful than making 1.
UR ....... WUBR ........... WB ............. RGW ........ UBR ....... WUB .... BGU
Spells / Blink & Combo / Token Grind / Dino Tribal / Draw Cards / Zombies / Reanimate
4 Delver of secrets
4 Snapcaster Mage
3 Tasigur, the golden fang
1 Gurmag Angler
2 Young Pyromancer
Spells
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Serum Vision
3 Fatal Push
4 Thought Scour
3 Spell Snare
2 Mana Leak
1 Dispel
2 Collective Brutality
2 Kolaghan's Command
1 Electrolyze
1 Terminate
4 Scalding Tarn
4 Polluted Delta
2 Steam Vents
1 Watery Grave
1 Blood Crypt
2 Spirebluff Canal
1 Darkslick Shore
2 Island
1 Swamp
1 Mountain
3 Countersquall
1 Dispel
1 Ancestral Vision
1 Anger of the Gods
1 Shattering Spree
1 Thoughtseize
1 Painful Truths
1 Murderous Cut
1 Izzet Staticaster
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Batterskull
2 Spellskite
I beat Affinity and some strange variant of Tron with the 3 original Eldrazi Titans, lost a very close game to jund and drew in the final match with Bant Knightfall. All i have to say is that Fatal Push is amazing!
For affinity Fatal Push and Kolaghan's Command were the MVP. Being able to remove his robots multiple times and take his Etched Champion off of Metalcraft is damn good. For Tron Countersquall made all the difference. Jund was my favorite match of the night. We were on an equal pace but in the end he was able to edge out the win. With Bant Knightfall we had gone to time and my anxiety got the best of me and a few misplays cost me the game. Overall Fatal Push is great and I love it in a matchup like Tron because it's an easy piece to side out for a more effective spell. I feel that for the moment my mainboard is solid but my sideboard needs a couple tweaks.
Your logic is not like our earth logic.
Frenzy-Affinity-Ghost Quarter-Rock-Tokens- RGWPhyrexian Zoo- WVial KnightsStandard:
BW Knights(Rotated)Pioneer: RW Knights - BW Rally Zombies - UW Heroes
Commander:WUG
Jenara, Asura of War- WGSigarda, Host of HeronsCasualties of economicsLegacy: Good-night, sweet prince. Mono-R Burn
Three fatal push and one terminate seems really bad. I've only been playing fatal push for a few nights but I'm already cutting back from three to two and staying at three terminates. The conditionality of it has been a huge liability.
What is this earth you speak of?
All I can say for now is that i like having a 3-1 push/terminate split at the moment. It was great but of course I'll adjust numbers the more games I play.
Probably not, it's very difficult to play delver decks without Snapcaster Mage