Long time stalker of this thread and it's previous iteration.
Proxied a combo version of this deck with a friend a few months ago and gave it a bit of a test. I ended up with the following list which I've almost put together in cardboard to play locally:
I originally tried mono blue with Thassa in the main as a finisher. Even though she scrys every turn it turned out to be too much of a dead draw and I was finding burn match-ups unwinnable even postboard.
Splashing white really seems to be the way to go even without running any white cards in the main. Celestial colonnade give the deck a way to finish off decks that run Emrakul without making them draw their entire deck in one go and the sideboard options are orders of magnitude better than what blue offers.
The fetches without shocks is because I NEVER want to pay life or have ETB tapped lands. I never need more than one white mana a turn and I only have 2 lands that don't tap for blue so it's never cause problems. The odds of drawing a land with no islands/fetches that has a keepable number of lands is miniscule.
I feel one of the Jaces could be a howling mine but he has the advantage of just providing me cards in some matchups. He does die but I'm happy to let him take one for the team.
The side board was put together with burn as the primary fear. COP red will put the brakes on them unless they have Skullcrack or Destructive Revelry, which hopefully you can snare or cryptic. You can't beat everything but if they don't have the answer they are generally locked out.
Porphyry Nodes is strong vs any deck that doesn't swarm you by turn 3 or plays only a few creatures at a time. Hits boggles, merfolk, infect and is one of the few ways to deal with a resolved Geist of Saint Traft.
Panoptic Mirror seemed like a good idea out of the board vs Abrupt Decay/Thoughtseize since they usually only have one Maelstrom Pulse which just trades one for one. If they don't it wins on the spot. However now with Kolaghan's Command floating around now it may be too much of a liability.
Soulfire Grand Master has a similar live the dream possibility whilst also being effective vs burn and aggro. It can trade with a goblin guide or eidelon and gain life, eat a bolt or win you the game if when you hit 9-10 mana all without giving them cards. It's not the best at anything it does but it is versatile.
I like Rest for the Weary over a third Timely Reinforcements as it can be played on second turn (not competing with dictate mana and usually avoiding skullcrack), be played EOT whilst leaving counter mana up and give you an extra turn against decks that laugh at soldier tokens ie. merfolk or amulet.
chalupa, i think you should consider using the new 1/1 fairy that draws a card if there's another one in the game
i think that card is ABSURDLY good, remember that the turtles in time used some that were 1/1 fly and nothing else, this one cycles through itself and can be used to power spellstutter
It's not strong enough. It only draws cards if you have the exact same fairie already in play. Faerie Miscreant is definitely better than Zephyr Sprite, but I wouldn't consider either good enough to play here.
btw, your list is awesome, day's undoing place(if played) is right in the place of mines and in the tempo version, why not using 4?
Thank you! Space and necessity limitations are the main reason for some of the odd numbers here. The nice thing about this list is that, on every pass, it drops more cards on the table and thins the deck, increasing the chance of hitting what you want. The downside is that it's pretty cluttered and is missing a lot of the cards I want in there. I think, ultimately, Mistbind Clique and possibly even Spellstutter Sprite are a neat, but unnecessary bit of redundancy that can probably be cut.
ah, your curve is so smooth that i think disrupting shoals could be used, disrupting shoals allied with day's undoing is perfect, you get an absurd amount of tempo for a high amount of value, but undoing fixes that problem, if using shoals, then 4 day's undoing is the best idea
also quicken or serum visions can be used as jokers in the deck, both of those cards slow you a lot, so they can be dumped out of the hand in order to protect one of your creatures, also they can be cycled in to search for a cmc you don't have to use your shoal on, also they back up the quicken-undoing thig
Disrupting Shoal was one of the first things Thenarus brought up, and I'd like to include both it and Gigadrowse as they disrupt a large number of decks, but space is the main limiting factor. We need counters and Remand is incredibly strong when paired with Day's Undoing, but I'm not sure how I feel about sacrificing the second two-drop counter slot to Disrupting Shoal. It's potentially great here, but also potentially dead. As for why no fourth Day's Undoing, with cards dropping on every pass, it's not completely necessary, but in the grand scheme of things, it's a possibility if I can make the slots. I've also considered cutting creatures almost completely and resting the deck on the back of a few Utility Creatures and Manlands, not unlike Farf's new list. That opens design space for more of the cards I want in the main.
Long time stalker of this thread and it's previous iteration.
Proxied a combo version of this deck with a friend a few months ago and gave it a bit of a test. I ended up with the following list which I've almost put together in cardboard to play locally:
I originally tried mono blue with Thassa in the main as a finisher. Even though she scrys every turn it turned out to be too much of a dead draw and I was finding burn match-ups unwinnable even postboard.
Thassa is a mixed bag. She's more of an extra reach card than a core card. You build your deck, than add it if you have extra space for it.
Splashing white really seems to be the way to go even without running any white cards in the main. Celestial colonnade give the deck a way to finish off decks that run Emrakul without making them draw their entire deck in one go and the sideboard options are orders of magnitude better than what blue offers.
Splashing W opens a lot of doors while closing very few. Colonnade is great, but the cost to activate is brutal. Then again, with the exception of Mutavault and Inkmoth Nexus, Manlands in this deck are usually more for the final swing than the build up along the way.
Also it's worth noting that a resolved Emrakul means you've lost with this deck. There are a lot of ways on paper to "beat" this, but we have no real means of addressing it.
The fetches without shocks is because I NEVER want to pay life or have ETB tapped lands. I never need more than one white mana a turn and I only have 2 lands that don't tap for blue so it's never cause problems. The odds of drawing a land with no islands/fetches that has a keepable number of lands is miniscule.
As long as it works out for you, stick with it! I prefer to keep up the flexibility as much as I can, but when I splash W, it's for a lot more maindeck mayhem like Path to Exile and Narset, so I need more W sources.
I feel one of the Jaces could be a howling mine but he has the advantage of just providing me cards in some matchups. He does die but I'm happy to let him take one for the team.
COP red will put the brakes on them unless they have Skullcrack or Destructive Revelry, which hopefully you can snare or cryptic. You can't beat everything but if they don't have the answer they are generally locked out.
The problem is it also puts the brakes on you since you have to dump mana into it. Cards like Kor Firewalker and Chalice of the Void tend to be fire and forget.
Porphyry Nodes is strong vs any deck that doesn't swarm you by turn 3 or plays only a few creatures at a time. Hits boggles, merfolk, infect and is one of the few ways to deal with a resolved Geist of Saint Traft.
In a creatureless deck, why only one? Two to three makes more sense than any other creature hate.
Panoptic Mirror seemed like a good idea out of the board vs Abrupt Decay/Thoughtseize since they usually only have one Maelstrom Pulse which just trades one for one. If they don't it wins on the spot. However now with Kolaghan's Command floating around now it may be too much of a liability.
Anything that competes with Time Warp for resources and doesn't win on the spot is bad. In the UG decks that are swimming in mana, it can work, but here it's just too expensive.
Soulfire Grand Master has a similar live the dream possibility whilst also being effective vs burn and aggro. It can trade with a goblin guide or eidelon and gain life, eat a bolt or win you the game if when you hit 9-10 mana all without giving them cards. It's not the best at anything it does but it is versatile.
If you're going to go this route, it's better in the maindeck and built around. There have been lists that have placed with this strategy, but it's a huge mana investment that's very hard to reach.
I like Rest for the Weary over a third Timely Reinforcements as it can be played on second turn (not competing with dictate mana and usually avoiding skullcrack), be played EOT whilst leaving counter mana up and give you an extra turn against decks that laugh at soldier tokens ie. merfolk or amulet.
“Modern has provided us a non-rotating format that is far more accessible than Legacy or Vintage, but still retains many of the qualities that people enjoy in those formats—such as a more stable metagame, the ability to play and tweak the same deck week after week, and simply a much more powerful card pool than Standard.”
- Sam Stoddard, “Developing Modern” (June 21, 2013) (by means of Sheridan Lardner, "Fixing Modern: Defining Format Mission (March 16, 2016))
Disrupting Shoal is tech I've been trying to throw in here since I found the thread! Problem is, it's often dead :-(
I wish there were a few more 4-drops to include in the deck as a NUTS play would be a T3 Dictate, followed by a Shoal at 4 to kill Coco, Rhino, Gifts, MoW, Cryptic or Twin. Maybe it's too narrow a target to think about, but that particular combo will probably win that game in question.
Sounds nice, but "if wishes were fishes" right? The only 4-drops I can think of are Narset, Jace Aot, Jace LGP, and Cryptic. None of which I would idly throw away, except in that nuts play.
With Kolaghan's Command flying around as probably the most efficient B/R spell in modern, I'm going to stay even further away from Mine than ever before. Every T1 list except Tron now has easy access to some type of early artifact removal. For the time being, I'm only paper testing Dictates and Jaces.
With regards to Quicken: I like it, I'm gonna test it (cheap in paper and online so why not?) but I think it's best in Snapcaster lists. I'd have to paper proxy snappy since I'll need a lawyer or doctor boyfriend/sugar daddy to afford a playset of those suckers.
As an aside, I'm testing replacing Elixir of Immortality with Relic of Progenitus in G2 since a lot of T1 loves Delve, Flashback, and Tarmy. I guess it's just a worse Scooze but it might make Days Undoing even more one sided.
NINJA EDIT:
Here's a quick mockup of ideas thrown around on this page of the thread
This one is more tuned to the Grixis/Combo Meta since our BGx is already fine. The Super Friends I use in paper are gone but I slipped in Ghost Quarter since it's fine against manlands and Tronz
This is the list of the Uw version that I'm testing. It's still a work in progress, but I would like to know your opinion. One thing I know is that I should add a couple of land.
Having played it alongside Time Warp and Walk the Aeons, I can confirm that Dragonlord Ojutai is, sadly, not what you're looking for. It stalls the combo an extra turn, which is bad for us. It's more of an either/or situation.
With all the graveyard hate being played to address CoCo Junk and Grishoalbrand right now, I'd go for Mana Leak over Rune Snag.
“Modern has provided us a non-rotating format that is far more accessible than Legacy or Vintage, but still retains many of the qualities that people enjoy in those formats—such as a more stable metagame, the ability to play and tweak the same deck week after week, and simply a much more powerful card pool than Standard.”
- Sam Stoddard, “Developing Modern” (June 21, 2013) (by means of Sheridan Lardner, "Fixing Modern: Defining Format Mission (March 16, 2016))
Disrupting Shoal is tech I've been trying to throw in here since I found the thread! Problem is, it's often dead :-(
I wish there were a few more 4-drops to include in the deck as a NUTS play would be a T3 Dictate, followed by a Shoal at 4 to kill Coco, Rhino, Gifts, MoW, Cryptic or Twin. Maybe it's too narrow a target to think about, but that particular combo will probably win that game in question.
Sounds nice, but "if wishes were fishes" right? The only 4-drops I can think of are Narset, Jace Aot, Jace LGP, and Cryptic. None of which I would idly throw away, except in that nuts play.
With Kolaghan's Command flying around as probably the most efficient B/R spell in modern, I'm going to stay even further away from Mine than ever before. Every T1 list except Tron now has easy access to some type of early artifact removal. For the time being, I'm only paper testing Dictates and Jaces.
With regards to Quicken: I like it, I'm gonna test it (cheap in paper and online so why not?) but I think it's best in Snapcaster lists. I'd have to paper proxy snappy since I'll need a lawyer or doctor boyfriend/sugar daddy to afford a playset of those suckers.
As an aside, I'm testing replacing Elixir of Immortality with Relic of Progenitus in G2 since a lot of T1 loves Delve, Flashback, and Tarmy. I guess it's just a worse Scooze but it might make Days Undoing even more one sided.
This one is more tuned to the Grixis/Combo Meta since our BGx is already fine. The Super Friends I use in paper are gone but I slipped in Ghost Quarter since it's fine against manlands and Tronz
There are some significant problems with this list:
Disrupting Shoal is a highly circumstantial card at its absolute best. With such a high concentration of non-blue cards, it can be a completely dead card in-hand. The only way I would ever consider playing it is in a deck completely composed of blue cards.
Twelve of the maindeck cards are one-drops. You cannot play Chalice of the Void in this deck.
Celestial Colonnade is only good for the final swing. That means you're trying to win on the back of the damage provided solely by the two Snapcaster Mages.
I appreciate the idea, but these are ideas that are finely tuned to work a certain way. Taking a little from each results in a pile that doesn't work.
“Modern has provided us a non-rotating format that is far more accessible than Legacy or Vintage, but still retains many of the qualities that people enjoy in those formats—such as a more stable metagame, the ability to play and tweak the same deck week after week, and simply a much more powerful card pool than Standard.”
- Sam Stoddard, “Developing Modern” (June 21, 2013) (by means of Sheridan Lardner, "Fixing Modern: Defining Format Mission (March 16, 2016))
First of all something I forgot to mention in my earlier post: a HUGE thank you to Chalupacabra for all the love and time he has put into this primer. It's a work of art and hid dedication has brought many, including myself to this deck.
Just took the combo version out for a spin for my first few real games of modern!
Deck was a blast to play even though I am still missing a few cards.
Game 1:
Everything went well, turn 3 and 4 dictate into combo off while he played 2 serum visions for the game.
Sided out a snare and a path for 2 x mines.
Game 2:
Kept island, glacial , jace, dictate, serum visions, cryptic and time warp on the draw.
He thoughtsiezed away serum visions, named cryptic with meddling mage and cliqued away the Jace.
I landed a Porphyry Nodes followed by a dictate.
He got me down to 1 life with a snapcaster after Porphyry Nodes went bust.
Managed to gigadrowse his blue and go off, milling with Jace.
1-0
Game 1:
Kept serum visions, spell snare, dictate, 2 x islands and a glacial fortess on the play.
I remanded a grisly salvage at the end of my third turn and snare it when he tried to recast it on his turn.
Played a dictate on his next end step after he played a lotleth troll.
Next turn he cast 2 birds of paradise, brought back a vengevine and hit me for 8 after discarding 2 stinkweed imps to his troll.
I went off on the next turn.
Sideboarded in a path, 2 mines, boomerang and a celestial purge for a Jace, 3 remands and a gigadrowse.
Game 2:
He fetched and played a hedron crab.
I cast a serum visions and he followed up with another hedron crab and a gravecrawler.
He followed up with a lotleth troll and another gravecrawler, hitting me to 18. I EOT dictate.
I missed my next 2 land drops and had a cryptic stranded in hand whilst he beat me down over the next 2 turns with 3 vengevines.
Game 3:
I led with land go, he dropped a birds of paradise.
Played a land and boomeranged his land hoping to slow him down (turns out he kept a one lander).
He played 2 hedron crabs to mill himself. I played a mine which he followed by a lotleth troll discarding 2 stinkweed imps.
I played a Jace drawing myself a card.
He then double dredged getting the ravens crime he was looking for and mind twisted me over the next 2 turns with it and life from the loam.
1-1
Game 1:
We both cantripped and played lands slowly for 5 turns till he tried to jam a tasigur. I remanded, he crypticed tapping himself out. Flashed in a dictate, miracled a temporal mastery, played a Jace and went off.
Game 2:
Had a dictate, it got thoughtsiezed.
Played an early mine, he Kologhan's commanded it.
Played a Jace, It got eaten by a gurmag angler.
I held it off for a few turns but got beaten down in the end.
Game 3:
Went long until I tapped him down with a gigadrowse and went off. Unfortunately I couldn't win before Time was called and didn't get there with Jace.
I put this down to me not having practiced much with the deck, in future I should be able to go off close out with enough speed this becomes less of an issue.
1-1-1
This guy watched my previous match so he was wise to what was up.
Game 1:
He had twin with counter backup on turn 5 while I did nothing.
Sideboard: brought in dispel, 2 mines, boomerang, path and negate for 2 remands and 3 snares.
Game 2:
He tried to snap bolt me to death but I drew a path. I had 2 mines and a dictate going and drew into the gigadrowse I needed to go off.
Game 3:
I managed to get an early Jace up to 11 before he played a grim lavamancer to keep it under control.
Managed to land a dictate later the following turn when he tapped out to use desolate lighthouse. I harassed him by trying to bounce a land in each of his end steps, succeeding twice and a fresh mine had him discarding multiple cards a turn.
On my turn I had him tapped down to 2 mana to my 5 but didn't pull the trigger with a warp, I lost pretty quickly after this to a series of bolts and snapcasters.
I haven't managed to acquire the lifegain part of my sideboard yet and a ran a path maindeck since I only have 3 Cryptics. I can seem myself maybe moving to paths 2 main and cutting a spell snare in the future.
I brought the mines in a lot, but this was due to not seeing any true aggro and I luckily managed to dodge burn.
I enjoyed having access to the boomerang but I can't see what I could cut from the board for it.
Hopefully with practice I can go off fast enough that time is less of an issue, and take more wins next time!
First of all something I forgot to mention in my earlier post: a HUGE thank you to Chalupacabra for all the love and time he has put into this primer. It's a work of art and hid dedication has brought many, including myself to this deck.
Thank you! I have a little too much affection for this deck. I'm trying to balance this more recently by spacing myself away from it so I can come back at it with fresh eyes. I think it's potentially potent, but it needs better speed or better tempo/control. I still think UW and UWB have merit but, if we can make it work, UU is where we want to be.
"If we can make it work" is important though, as this deck is really, really slow and needs a shot in the arm to make it Tier 2.
23 lands with 2 CiPT seems edgy Chuba. Definately grateful that everybody agreed on the Quicken.
Also brewing a bit around relatively soon, still hung from Roskilde Festival, but I think I will even test Quicken as a 4 of. Seems way too mighty.
It's a first pass with a Day's Undoing-centric deck. After cursory testing, I'd probably drop the Spellstutter Sprites for Disrupting Shoal, and the Mistbind Cliques for...something else. It needs more consistency. That list is also based off of a misread of Day's Undoing that fails to account for the fact that, if you cast it on your turn, Day's Undoing is Exiled, so it obviously needs to be revisited.
As for the 23 lands, it works just fine in initial testing, but the deck needs a lot of tuning to be even an FNM consideration. The first Time Attack lists played 23 lands, but the first change to the deck was to up the land count to 24. Then again, no Walk the Aeons means less land is required. It may be as far out as Battle for Zendikar before regular play is an option for me. Hopefully not, but the new job and upcoming move are putting heavy demands on my time.
Part of me thinks that Farf has the right idea with combo focus and minimal manlands, and part of me thinks that a UWTime Attack variant or some kind of powerhouse Superfriends twist is the right move. I honestly don't know. I do know that we need to be generating advantage, no matter which route we go, and that we can't just throw Day's Undoing into our deck and expect it to not cause all the same issues that Dictate of Kruphix does. We're still giving our opponents cards, and Burn, Affinity, and Delver (and other fast decks) will do more with that than we will.
We also need maximum synergy in this deck. The best lists we've played in the past were the ones where every card played pushed you towards your goal. Having no dead plays is important in a deck like this, whether playing Combo-Tempo, Combo-Control, or All-In-Combo.
Done some more testing with my Uw list, now with 23 land. I really enjoy Day's undoing, It shines against delve based deck and with a relic or two on board it became even better filtering the graveyards. Too bad relic is sideboard only.
I was also thinking, what about monastery mentor? Once we start to taking turn it gives a fast clock and, if we can't take any more turn, it give us some token to protect ourselves.
There's no reason Relic has to be sideboard only, just find a way to make it work. If it's optimal in your 60, play it there.
“Modern has provided us a non-rotating format that is far more accessible than Legacy or Vintage, but still retains many of the qualities that people enjoy in those formats—such as a more stable metagame, the ability to play and tweak the same deck week after week, and simply a much more powerful card pool than Standard.”
- Sam Stoddard, “Developing Modern” (June 21, 2013) (by means of Sheridan Lardner, "Fixing Modern: Defining Format Mission (March 16, 2016))
What is our thoughts on Delay? Seems allright for the Combo-Versions.
tried it out a bit - it feels a bit like remand, but you dont have to worry about it next turn, you do however not draw that spicy extra card. Never been a fan of remand no matter how good it actually is. think it depends alot on what it is you want to counter, and also whether you need that ekstra card.
Delay in the maindeck? No. Delay as a sideboard card against Delver/Affinity decks running Day's Undoing? Oh hell yes.
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“Modern has provided us a non-rotating format that is far more accessible than Legacy or Vintage, but still retains many of the qualities that people enjoy in those formats—such as a more stable metagame, the ability to play and tweak the same deck week after week, and simply a much more powerful card pool than Standard.”
- Sam Stoddard, “Developing Modern” (June 21, 2013) (by means of Sheridan Lardner, "Fixing Modern: Defining Format Mission (March 16, 2016))
Do we want Rule of Law or similar effects to make Day's Undoing work out? I've been thinking of revisiting my old tactic of excessively bouncing lands and non-ETB threats in order to make Day's Undoing work out. In my more casual/friendly build of the deck, I use a playset of Boomerang and Wipe Away to make mine effects nearly worthless for the opponent.
Those would be even better when played with Narset.
Edit:
To clarify: I'm currently running this particular suite of disruption
Between Remand and the 12 land removal instants, by the time I decide to cast a Day's Undoing it will essentially restart the game, only I'm sitting on 4+ lands while my opponent is starting at T1, on the draw. That's the plan anyways. It's not that I'm trying to break the thing, I'm trying to make it work in TimeWarp.
Additionally, in my build that uses cheezy amounts of bounce, Time Stop could quite feasibly replace my 3-4xWalk the Aeons, effectively becoming bounce spells 13-16 if I play it after the draw step and before the main phase. Haven't tested that particular card yet, but we'll see. I'm just hoping BloomTitan gets nerfed in the Banlist update so I don't still have to account for it. The whole bounce strategy is admittedly pretty crappy against aggro and burn as they'll probably outpace me eventually. That's what the sideboard is for I guess!
I'm not liking this idea as the purpose to playing Day's Undoing is to burn through your hand and reload it. If anything, Rule of Law is something you'd use against the card.
As always, your mileage may vary.
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“Modern has provided us a non-rotating format that is far more accessible than Legacy or Vintage, but still retains many of the qualities that people enjoy in those formats—such as a more stable metagame, the ability to play and tweak the same deck week after week, and simply a much more powerful card pool than Standard.”
- Sam Stoddard, “Developing Modern” (June 21, 2013) (by means of Sheridan Lardner, "Fixing Modern: Defining Format Mission (March 16, 2016))
When it comes to modern, if a card MUST be played at the same time as another card or it doesn't really work, and both cards are lackluster on their own... It's probably not worth playing.
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Current Decks:
Modern
Modern Warp / UR Control / UR Storm / Naya Breachshift / ElectroBalance
Legacy
Solidarity / Lands / Sneak and Show / Grixis Delver / Reanimator / Belcher / Storm / Dredge
Of course this was for casual, so I used the Seat of the Synods. My version used the Savor the Moments basically as ramp. I still have this actually. I might make some changes and try to make my entry into Modern.
this list won 148 player event : http://manadeprived.com/mdss-toronto-wrap-up/ since its a event (relatively) close to me, it got me interrested in the deck. What do you think of the decklist.
Standard:GWRU 4C Collected Company Modern:GUWRB Bloom Titan Legacy:BUG SHARDLESS BUG
EDH : GR BORBORYGMOS ENRAGED GU PRIME SPEAKER ZEGENA UWR ZEDRUU THE GREATHEARTED UBR MISHRA ARTIFICER PRODIGY B SHEOLDRED WHISPERING ONE R ASHLING THE PILGRIM
@Sporefrogzz I tried the exact decklist as the other dude. now i will make some changes for sure. Academy Ruins seem sweet, the random Ghost Quarter did not help me really much today to be honest. i could almost have been a Radiant Fountain, and would have done more work. i will definitely add the 2 non-island islands. if i find them(they seem hard to find atm, Oboro in particular.)
Exhaustion seem sweet, thought i'm not sure about it yet.
Gigadrowse split seem fine to me atm. the card was ok, but not completely stellar to deserve 4 MD slot.
the deck definitely need more mine effect as i said. but not more than 8 total. Thassa herself is almost an mine effect. Jace Beleren also. so may be 2 extra. I think i will play Howling Mine itself. i don't want a guy that can die.
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Played today at a PPTQ. i watched the video of Frank Lepore with this deck just before the event to understand the lines of play. i did only 3-3, i won against Cruel Control (good matchup) Mono U Tron (good matchup) Jund (not bad)... and lost to AdNauseum(bad match up), Burn(not very good match up) and Splinter Twin(???)
on the Adnauseum deck (with Angel Grace and cie) i didn't know they could win instant speed, so i was kinda surprise. but i don't think its a good matchup to begin with.
Burn is hard, i find Spell Pierce in the SB barely playable for this style of deck. even in that match up. try to counter a bolt on 3 land, its weird. Next time i will play some Dispel. I want more hard counter. It also protect the first Gain turn you play vs Control. I don't understand Spell Pierce in this deck, every time i had it in my hand, i was feeling like dispel or spell snare would have 100% better in this deck. please enlighten me on we spell pierce is good.
splinter twin, i was too greedy (i always forgot the Pestermite tap a land) i need to practice more this match up in general.
Cruel is a piece of cake. they are too slow, have a lot of dead card (kill spells...) and we have more counterspell than them. Oddly enough i was playing Dictate at the end of my turn when he was tapped out for an anticipate. i had no other choice.
Jund is not that hard we have a bunch of tempo play and our hands are pretty resilient to discard spell. Everything Draw Counter or Gain Turn. Watch out for choke. he got me game 2.
Mono U tron is like a bad control deck vs us. they have only a couple of counterspell and their wincon are also slow and need to attack. they dont play Karn and no Big Fancy Eldrazi. Only slow Wurmcoil Engine and Big coulourless creatures that you can Gigadrose or cryptic bounce.
Thassa was awesome all day for me. Its a quick clock. and helps toward the win. My Jund player quickly understood that Dictate was very important to make the deck work and was playing Abrupt Decay on them ASAP. SO i might add some howling mine in MD or SB. May be like 1-2. or may be a second Jace Beleren somewhere. I feel like a 4th Cryptic wouldn't hurt either. I didn't SB in Lab Maniac. Honestly, Thassa is already really hard to deal with in modern and i have Jace Beleren as a back up. (and Elixir.) i can't see a spot where i would wish it in my deck.
Overall i fell like with a bit more preparation (toward my plays vs splinter twin notably.) i can make this deck work. I think i can modify the SB to reflect my style of play. this deck is great. and fun. except for our opponents.
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Kakwann, Lvl 39 Sorcerer
Currently Playing
Standard:GWRU 4C Collected Company Modern:GUWRB Bloom Titan Legacy:BUG SHARDLESS BUG
EDH : GR BORBORYGMOS ENRAGED GU PRIME SPEAKER ZEGENA UWR ZEDRUU THE GREATHEARTED UBR MISHRA ARTIFICER PRODIGY B SHEOLDRED WHISPERING ONE R ASHLING THE PILGRIM
just to update my last month with this deck
i`ve been testing 12 mines by adding 2 kamis and trying temporal mastery rather than using snaps, also 1 matrix in the deck, that approach is good for the meta now, we`re facing less friendly junks and more junds, which have turned into a tough match because of those kolaghan commands, so adding more mines is crucial, sadly kami dies easily vs both jund and grixis, so i think it isn`t optimal, maybe adding some temple bells is the best approach, but i like kamis because they are good blockers and are another cheap mine effect so it makes it easier to go off and summoning them in the middle of the combo
matrix is awesome, but they`re not good with bells and creatures, also i prefered snaps over temporal masteries, so i think i`ll go back to 2 commands and 2 snaps
i`m preparing for the GP Porto Alegre, which will happen in the beginning of october, i still don`t have a clue about what`s the best way to change the deck vs the actual meta, let`s see what happens, maybe AV is unbanned(let`s hope)
also i made drastic changes in the sideboard, i added 4 swan songs, 1 flash freeze, it`s better vs burn, boil and choke, which is highly present right now
i think ill remove clique, remand and will add 2 kamis in my original list
ah, also i`m testing gitaxian probes, they help a lot when facing bg and grixis
i think our deck is weak right now, but lets see what happens, if AV is unbanned we`ll be a tier deck for sure
hey guys, I haven't been playing much lately but I've finally got hold of a playset of cryptic command. so I was thinking, since i already use green for kiora, the crashing wave and explore in my build, do you reckon it would be worth it running eternal witness?
Private Mod Note
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Huey, Dewey and Louie are always dressed in RUG. it is CLEARLY going to be the wedges block Pioneer: WURFaerie fires BRGDragons ModernBGElves WRBurn UR Fires Turns URGift Storm UG Twiddle Storm
this list won 148 player event : http://manadeprived.com/mdss-toronto-wrap-up/ since its a event (relatively) close to me, it got me interrested in the deck. What do you think of the decklist.
I've seen these more 'classic' lists win events and get posted here pretty often. My big concern is, how the hell is a list like this supposed to beat Burn, Infect, or Affinity? The whole reason I splash colors in my build is better access to efficient 1-2cmc interaction. I understand that Temporal Mastery is actually quite dope in the early game and frequently wins games because of it. It also makes use of the Serum Visions that basically all variants run anyways.
To the posters running Howling Mine, how are you beating Kolaghan's??? That card is a staple in BRx lists nowadays and is frequently main decked.
Finally, I want to recommend Jace TLGP over Beleren. It still gives the UU to turn on Thassa, dodges Decay and IoK, and can even bounce all while giving better card selection.
Kolaghan's Command... if they don't see an artifact game 1, i'm pretty sure they SB it out. it's not really effective vs us. But if you play 4 Mine, i can see it being a problem.
i don't think you can beat Infect. Affinity... there is a reason there is 3 Hurkyl's Recall in the SB. Burn is beatable but Eidolon must never resolve.
IMO, this deck is basicly a mono U splinter twin deck that need a mine-effect in play and at least 5 mana to start combo-off. its just a worse combo deck. but its a tons of fun to play. you dodge a lot of hate. and majority of people don't expect it at all. Being Mono U have its strength and its weakness but i don't think you absolutely need to splash to make the deck playable.
@doc.brown if you splash green you dont want to play Eternal Witness cause au double G.
Standard:GWRU 4C Collected Company Modern:GUWRB Bloom Titan Legacy:BUG SHARDLESS BUG
EDH : GR BORBORYGMOS ENRAGED GU PRIME SPEAKER ZEGENA UWR ZEDRUU THE GREATHEARTED UBR MISHRA ARTIFICER PRODIGY B SHEOLDRED WHISPERING ONE R ASHLING THE PILGRIM
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Proxied a combo version of this deck with a friend a few months ago and gave it a bit of a test. I ended up with the following list which I've almost put together in cardboard to play locally:
1 Plains
4 Flooded Strand
1 Celestial Colonnade
4 Glacial Fortress
1 Mikokoro, Center of the Sea
1 Minamo, School at Water's Edge
4 Cryptic Command
3 Remand
3 Gigadrowse
3 Spell Snare
4 Dictate of Kruphix
2 Jace Beleren
1 Elixir of Immortality
4 Temporal Mastery
4 Time Warp
3 Walk the Aeons
1 Dispel
2 Howling Mine
1 Hurkyl's Recall
1 Panoptic Mirror
1 Path to Exile
1 Porphyry Nodes
1 Rest for the Weary
1 Soulfire Grand Master
2 Stony Silence
2 Timely Reinforcements
I originally tried mono blue with Thassa in the main as a finisher. Even though she scrys every turn it turned out to be too much of a dead draw and I was finding burn match-ups unwinnable even postboard.
Splashing white really seems to be the way to go even without running any white cards in the main. Celestial colonnade give the deck a way to finish off decks that run Emrakul without making them draw their entire deck in one go and the sideboard options are orders of magnitude better than what blue offers.
The fetches without shocks is because I NEVER want to pay life or have ETB tapped lands. I never need more than one white mana a turn and I only have 2 lands that don't tap for blue so it's never cause problems. The odds of drawing a land with no islands/fetches that has a keepable number of lands is miniscule.
I feel one of the Jaces could be a howling mine but he has the advantage of just providing me cards in some matchups. He does die but I'm happy to let him take one for the team.
The side board was put together with burn as the primary fear.
COP red will put the brakes on them unless they have Skullcrack or Destructive Revelry, which hopefully you can snare or cryptic. You can't beat everything but if they don't have the answer they are generally locked out.
Howling Mine comes in against anything slow and grindy or that plays Abrupt Decay
Porphyry Nodes is strong vs any deck that doesn't swarm you by turn 3 or plays only a few creatures at a time. Hits boggles, merfolk, infect and is one of the few ways to deal with a resolved Geist of Saint Traft.
Panoptic Mirror seemed like a good idea out of the board vs Abrupt Decay/Thoughtseize since they usually only have one Maelstrom Pulse which just trades one for one. If they don't it wins on the spot. However now with Kolaghan's Command floating around now it may be too much of a liability.
Soulfire Grand Master has a similar live the dream possibility whilst also being effective vs burn and aggro. It can trade with a goblin guide or eidelon and gain life, eat a bolt or win you the game if when you hit 9-10 mana all without giving them cards. It's not the best at anything it does but it is versatile.
I like Rest for the Weary over a third Timely Reinforcements as it can be played on second turn (not competing with dictate mana and usually avoiding skullcrack), be played EOT whilst leaving counter mana up and give you an extra turn against decks that laugh at soldier tokens ie. merfolk or amulet.
Also it's worth noting that a resolved Emrakul means you've lost with this deck. There are a lot of ways on paper to "beat" this, but we have no real means of addressing it. As long as it works out for you, stick with it! I prefer to keep up the flexibility as much as I can, but when I splash W, it's for a lot more maindeck mayhem like Path to Exile and Narset, so I need more W sources. The value of this is not to be underestimated.
- Sam Stoddard, “Developing Modern” (June 21, 2013) (by means of Sheridan Lardner, "Fixing Modern: Defining Format Mission (March 16, 2016))
How to Use Spoiler Tags
Starting Over: The Origins of the Mulligan Rule
Practical Approach to Slow Play
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 2: SWARM and TOOLBOX
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 3
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 4
These videos are by MTG Salvation Moderator Lantern!
Introduction to Tempo
Controlling Tempo
Elements of Tempo
Roadblocks to Tempo
How Not To Build A Deck - Tempo
Learn How To Sideboard, Dammit!
Mulligan's Island
The Art of the Mulligan
The Art of the Mulligan: Eight Case Studies
Fundamentals: The Mulligan
Some Mulligan Exercises
A Mulligan Is Worth Three Cards
The Mulligan Debate
Common Sense: The Art of the Mulligan
Who's The Beatdown?
3 Caves of Koilos
3 Eldrazi Temple
2 Fetid Heath
3 Godless Shrine
4 Ghost Quarter
3 Plains
3 Shambling Vent
2 Tectonic Edge
Artifacts (4):
4 Æther Vial
4 Path to Exile
Creatures (29):
3 Aven Mindcensor
3 Eldrazi Displacer
3 Fiend Hunter
4 Flickerwisp
4 Serra Avenger
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Thought-Knot Seer
3 Tidehollow Sculler
3 Wasteland Strangler
3 Chalice of the Void
2 Dismember
2 Oblivion Ring
2 Rest in Peace
3 Stony Silence
3 Surgical Extraction
3 Flooded Strand
6 Island
3 Polluted Delta
3 Steam Vents
3 Sulfur Falls
Creatures (16):
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Snapcaster Mage
4 Stormchaser Mage
2 Gut Shot
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Mutagenic Growth
3 Spell Pierce
3 Twisted Image
3 Vapor Snag
Sorceries (8):
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Serum Visions
2 Ancient Grudge
2 Blood Moon
2 Dispel
1 Forked Bolt
1 Hurkyl's Recall
1 Repeal
2 Roast
1 Spell Snare
2 Spellskite
1 Vapor Snag
4 Bloodstained Mire
1 Clifftop Retreat
1 Copperline Gorge
5 Mountain
3 Sacred Foundry
2 Stomping Ground
4 Wooded Foothills
Creatures (14):
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
4 Goblin Guide
2 Grim Lavamancer
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Atarka's Command
4 Boros Charm
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Lightning Helix
3 Searing Blaze
Sorceries (8):
4 Lava Spike
4 Rift Bolt
2 Deflecting Palm
4 Destructive Revelry
2 Kor Firewalker
2 Path to Exile
2 Rending Volley
3 Skullcrack
19 Forest
3 Treetop Village
Creatures (24):
4 Avatar of the Resolute
4 Dryad Militant
2 Dungrove Elder
4 Experiment One
4 Leatherback Baloth
2 Scavenging Ooze
4 Strangleroot Geist
4 Rancor
Instants (10):
3 Aspect of Hydra
4 Vines of Vastwood
3 Dismember
2 Choke
2 Gut Shot
2 Deglamer
2 Feed the Clan
2 Oxidize
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Skylasher
1 Unravel the Æther
I wish there were a few more 4-drops to include in the deck as a NUTS play would be a T3 Dictate, followed by a Shoal at 4 to kill Coco, Rhino, Gifts, MoW, Cryptic or Twin. Maybe it's too narrow a target to think about, but that particular combo will probably win that game in question.
Sounds nice, but "if wishes were fishes" right? The only 4-drops I can think of are Narset, Jace Aot, Jace LGP, and Cryptic. None of which I would idly throw away, except in that nuts play.With Kolaghan's Command flying around as probably the most efficient B/R spell in modern, I'm going to stay even further away from Mine than ever before. Every T1 list except Tron now has easy access to some type of early artifact removal. For the time being, I'm only paper testing Dictates and Jaces.
With regards to Quicken: I like it, I'm gonna test it (cheap in paper and online so why not?) but I think it's best in Snapcaster lists. I'd have to paper proxy snappy since I'll need a lawyer or doctor boyfriend/sugar daddy to afford a playset of those suckers.
As an aside, I'm testing replacing Elixir of Immortality with Relic of Progenitus in G2 since a lot of T1 loves Delve, Flashback, and Tarmy. I guess it's just a worse Scooze but it might make Days Undoing even more one sided.
NINJA EDIT:
Here's a quick mockup of ideas thrown around on this page of the thread
3 Spellskite
2 Elixir of Immortality
2 Path to Exile
4 Gigadrowse
4 Quicken
1 Martial Coup
2 Disrupting Shoal
2 Remand
2 Dictate of Kruphix
2 Day's Undoing
3 Exhaustion
4 Time Warp
3 Walk the Aeons
1 Mikokoro, Center of the Sea
1 Mystic Gate
1 Plains
2 Ghost Quarter
2 Hallowed Fountain
3 Celestial Colonnade
3 Flooded Strand
10 Island
2 Relic of Progenitus
1 Auriok Champion
1 Rest in Peace
3 Hurkyl's Recall
4 Leyline of Sanctity
This one is more tuned to the Grixis/Combo Meta since our BGx is already fine. The Super Friends I use in paper are gone but I slipped in Ghost Quarter since it's fine against manlands and Tronz
Here's what caught my eye
- Sam Stoddard, “Developing Modern” (June 21, 2013) (by means of Sheridan Lardner, "Fixing Modern: Defining Format Mission (March 16, 2016))
How to Use Spoiler Tags
Starting Over: The Origins of the Mulligan Rule
Practical Approach to Slow Play
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 2: SWARM and TOOLBOX
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 3
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 4
These videos are by MTG Salvation Moderator Lantern!
Introduction to Tempo
Controlling Tempo
Elements of Tempo
Roadblocks to Tempo
How Not To Build A Deck - Tempo
Learn How To Sideboard, Dammit!
Mulligan's Island
The Art of the Mulligan
The Art of the Mulligan: Eight Case Studies
Fundamentals: The Mulligan
Some Mulligan Exercises
A Mulligan Is Worth Three Cards
The Mulligan Debate
Common Sense: The Art of the Mulligan
Who's The Beatdown?
3 Caves of Koilos
3 Eldrazi Temple
2 Fetid Heath
3 Godless Shrine
4 Ghost Quarter
3 Plains
3 Shambling Vent
2 Tectonic Edge
Artifacts (4):
4 Æther Vial
4 Path to Exile
Creatures (29):
3 Aven Mindcensor
3 Eldrazi Displacer
3 Fiend Hunter
4 Flickerwisp
4 Serra Avenger
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Thought-Knot Seer
3 Tidehollow Sculler
3 Wasteland Strangler
3 Chalice of the Void
2 Dismember
2 Oblivion Ring
2 Rest in Peace
3 Stony Silence
3 Surgical Extraction
3 Flooded Strand
6 Island
3 Polluted Delta
3 Steam Vents
3 Sulfur Falls
Creatures (16):
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Snapcaster Mage
4 Stormchaser Mage
2 Gut Shot
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Mutagenic Growth
3 Spell Pierce
3 Twisted Image
3 Vapor Snag
Sorceries (8):
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Serum Visions
2 Ancient Grudge
2 Blood Moon
2 Dispel
1 Forked Bolt
1 Hurkyl's Recall
1 Repeal
2 Roast
1 Spell Snare
2 Spellskite
1 Vapor Snag
4 Bloodstained Mire
1 Clifftop Retreat
1 Copperline Gorge
5 Mountain
3 Sacred Foundry
2 Stomping Ground
4 Wooded Foothills
Creatures (14):
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
4 Goblin Guide
2 Grim Lavamancer
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Atarka's Command
4 Boros Charm
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Lightning Helix
3 Searing Blaze
Sorceries (8):
4 Lava Spike
4 Rift Bolt
2 Deflecting Palm
4 Destructive Revelry
2 Kor Firewalker
2 Path to Exile
2 Rending Volley
3 Skullcrack
19 Forest
3 Treetop Village
Creatures (24):
4 Avatar of the Resolute
4 Dryad Militant
2 Dungrove Elder
4 Experiment One
4 Leatherback Baloth
2 Scavenging Ooze
4 Strangleroot Geist
4 Rancor
Instants (10):
3 Aspect of Hydra
4 Vines of Vastwood
3 Dismember
2 Choke
2 Gut Shot
2 Deglamer
2 Feed the Clan
2 Oxidize
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Skylasher
1 Unravel the Æther
- Sam Stoddard, “Developing Modern” (June 21, 2013) (by means of Sheridan Lardner, "Fixing Modern: Defining Format Mission (March 16, 2016))
How to Use Spoiler Tags
Starting Over: The Origins of the Mulligan Rule
Practical Approach to Slow Play
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 2: SWARM and TOOLBOX
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 3
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 4
These videos are by MTG Salvation Moderator Lantern!
Introduction to Tempo
Controlling Tempo
Elements of Tempo
Roadblocks to Tempo
How Not To Build A Deck - Tempo
Learn How To Sideboard, Dammit!
Mulligan's Island
The Art of the Mulligan
The Art of the Mulligan: Eight Case Studies
Fundamentals: The Mulligan
Some Mulligan Exercises
A Mulligan Is Worth Three Cards
The Mulligan Debate
Common Sense: The Art of the Mulligan
Who's The Beatdown?
3 Caves of Koilos
3 Eldrazi Temple
2 Fetid Heath
3 Godless Shrine
4 Ghost Quarter
3 Plains
3 Shambling Vent
2 Tectonic Edge
Artifacts (4):
4 Æther Vial
4 Path to Exile
Creatures (29):
3 Aven Mindcensor
3 Eldrazi Displacer
3 Fiend Hunter
4 Flickerwisp
4 Serra Avenger
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Thought-Knot Seer
3 Tidehollow Sculler
3 Wasteland Strangler
3 Chalice of the Void
2 Dismember
2 Oblivion Ring
2 Rest in Peace
3 Stony Silence
3 Surgical Extraction
3 Flooded Strand
6 Island
3 Polluted Delta
3 Steam Vents
3 Sulfur Falls
Creatures (16):
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Snapcaster Mage
4 Stormchaser Mage
2 Gut Shot
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Mutagenic Growth
3 Spell Pierce
3 Twisted Image
3 Vapor Snag
Sorceries (8):
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Serum Visions
2 Ancient Grudge
2 Blood Moon
2 Dispel
1 Forked Bolt
1 Hurkyl's Recall
1 Repeal
2 Roast
1 Spell Snare
2 Spellskite
1 Vapor Snag
4 Bloodstained Mire
1 Clifftop Retreat
1 Copperline Gorge
5 Mountain
3 Sacred Foundry
2 Stomping Ground
4 Wooded Foothills
Creatures (14):
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
4 Goblin Guide
2 Grim Lavamancer
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Atarka's Command
4 Boros Charm
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Lightning Helix
3 Searing Blaze
Sorceries (8):
4 Lava Spike
4 Rift Bolt
2 Deflecting Palm
4 Destructive Revelry
2 Kor Firewalker
2 Path to Exile
2 Rending Volley
3 Skullcrack
19 Forest
3 Treetop Village
Creatures (24):
4 Avatar of the Resolute
4 Dryad Militant
2 Dungrove Elder
4 Experiment One
4 Leatherback Baloth
2 Scavenging Ooze
4 Strangleroot Geist
4 Rancor
Instants (10):
3 Aspect of Hydra
4 Vines of Vastwood
3 Dismember
2 Choke
2 Gut Shot
2 Deglamer
2 Feed the Clan
2 Oxidize
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Skylasher
1 Unravel the Æther
Just took the combo version out for a spin for my first few real games of modern!
Deck was a blast to play even though I am still missing a few cards.
Game 1:
Everything went well, turn 3 and 4 dictate into combo off while he played 2 serum visions for the game.
Sided out a snare and a path for 2 x mines.
Game 2:
Kept island, glacial , jace, dictate, serum visions, cryptic and time warp on the draw.
He thoughtsiezed away serum visions, named cryptic with meddling mage and cliqued away the Jace.
I landed a Porphyry Nodes followed by a dictate.
He got me down to 1 life with a snapcaster after Porphyry Nodes went bust.
Managed to gigadrowse his blue and go off, milling with Jace.
1-0
Game 1:
Kept serum visions, spell snare, dictate, 2 x islands and a glacial fortess on the play.
I remanded a grisly salvage at the end of my third turn and snare it when he tried to recast it on his turn.
Played a dictate on his next end step after he played a lotleth troll.
Next turn he cast 2 birds of paradise, brought back a vengevine and hit me for 8 after discarding 2 stinkweed imps to his troll.
I went off on the next turn.
Sideboarded in a path, 2 mines, boomerang and a celestial purge for a Jace, 3 remands and a gigadrowse.
Game 2:
He fetched and played a hedron crab.
I cast a serum visions and he followed up with another hedron crab and a gravecrawler.
He followed up with a lotleth troll and another gravecrawler, hitting me to 18. I EOT dictate.
I missed my next 2 land drops and had a cryptic stranded in hand whilst he beat me down over the next 2 turns with 3 vengevines.
Game 3:
I led with land go, he dropped a birds of paradise.
Played a land and boomeranged his land hoping to slow him down (turns out he kept a one lander).
He played 2 hedron crabs to mill himself. I played a mine which he followed by a lotleth troll discarding 2 stinkweed imps.
I played a Jace drawing myself a card.
He then double dredged getting the ravens crime he was looking for and mind twisted me over the next 2 turns with it and life from the loam.
1-1
Game 1:
We both cantripped and played lands slowly for 5 turns till he tried to jam a tasigur. I remanded, he crypticed tapping himself out. Flashed in a dictate, miracled a temporal mastery, played a Jace and went off.
Game 2:
Had a dictate, it got thoughtsiezed.
Played an early mine, he Kologhan's commanded it.
Played a Jace, It got eaten by a gurmag angler.
I held it off for a few turns but got beaten down in the end.
Game 3:
Went long until I tapped him down with a gigadrowse and went off. Unfortunately I couldn't win before Time was called and didn't get there with Jace.
I put this down to me not having practiced much with the deck, in future I should be able to go off close out with enough speed this becomes less of an issue.
1-1-1
This guy watched my previous match so he was wise to what was up.
Game 1:
He had twin with counter backup on turn 5 while I did nothing.
Sideboard: brought in dispel, 2 mines, boomerang, path and negate for 2 remands and 3 snares.
Game 2:
He tried to snap bolt me to death but I drew a path. I had 2 mines and a dictate going and drew into the gigadrowse I needed to go off.
Game 3:
I managed to get an early Jace up to 11 before he played a grim lavamancer to keep it under control.
Managed to land a dictate later the following turn when he tapped out to use desolate lighthouse. I harassed him by trying to bounce a land in each of his end steps, succeeding twice and a fresh mine had him discarding multiple cards a turn.
On my turn I had him tapped down to 2 mana to my 5 but didn't pull the trigger with a warp, I lost pretty quickly after this to a series of bolts and snapcasters.
End result 1-1-2
1 Plains
3 Flooded Strand
1 Celestial Colonnade
4 Glacial Fortress
1 Mikokoro, Center of the Sea
1 Path to Exile
3 Cryptic Command
3 Remand
3 Gigadrowse
3 Spell Snare
4 Dictate of Kruphix
2 Jace Beleren
1 Elixir of Immortality
4 Serum Visions
4 Time Warp
3 Walk the Aeons
1 Boomerang
1 Celestial Purge
1 Dispel
2 Exhaustion
2 Howling Mine
2 Hurkyl's Recall
1 Negate
1 Path to Exile
1 Porphyry Nodes
1 Soulfire Grand Master
1 Stony Silence
I haven't managed to acquire the lifegain part of my sideboard yet and a ran a path maindeck since I only have 3 Cryptics. I can seem myself maybe moving to paths 2 main and cutting a spell snare in the future.
I brought the mines in a lot, but this was due to not seeing any true aggro and I luckily managed to dodge burn.
I enjoyed having access to the boomerang but I can't see what I could cut from the board for it.
Hopefully with practice I can go off fast enough that time is less of an issue, and take more wins next time!
"If we can make it work" is important though, as this deck is really, really slow and needs a shot in the arm to make it Tier 2. It's a first pass with a Day's Undoing-centric deck. After cursory testing, I'd probably drop the Spellstutter Sprites for Disrupting Shoal, and the Mistbind Cliques for...something else. It needs more consistency. That list is also based off of a misread of Day's Undoing that fails to account for the fact that, if you cast it on your turn, Day's Undoing is Exiled, so it obviously needs to be revisited.
As for the 23 lands, it works just fine in initial testing, but the deck needs a lot of tuning to be even an FNM consideration. The first Time Attack lists played 23 lands, but the first change to the deck was to up the land count to 24. Then again, no Walk the Aeons means less land is required. It may be as far out as Battle for Zendikar before regular play is an option for me. Hopefully not, but the new job and upcoming move are putting heavy demands on my time.
Part of me thinks that Farf has the right idea with combo focus and minimal manlands, and part of me thinks that a UW Time Attack variant or some kind of powerhouse Superfriends twist is the right move. I honestly don't know. I do know that we need to be generating advantage, no matter which route we go, and that we can't just throw Day's Undoing into our deck and expect it to not cause all the same issues that Dictate of Kruphix does. We're still giving our opponents cards, and Burn, Affinity, and Delver (and other fast decks) will do more with that than we will.
We also need maximum synergy in this deck. The best lists we've played in the past were the ones where every card played pushed you towards your goal. Having no dead plays is important in a deck like this, whether playing Combo-Tempo, Combo-Control, or All-In-Combo. There's no reason Relic has to be sideboard only, just find a way to make it work. If it's optimal in your 60, play it there.
Edit:
2 Celestial Colonnade
2 Creeping Tar Pit
4 Flooded Strand
1 Glacial Fortress
4 Hallowed Fountain
5 Island
2 Plains
2 Polluted Delta
1 Sunken Ruins
2 Watery Grave
Planeswalkers (3):
1 Ashiok, Nightmare Weaver
2 Narset Transcendent
3 Monastery Siege
Instants (18):
3 Gigadrowse
3 Quicken
2 Spell Snare
3 Disrupting Shoal
3 Remand
4 Cryptic Command
Sorceries (11):
4 Day's Undoing
3 Exhaustion
4 Time Warp
2 Engineered Explosives
3 Spell Pierce
3 Vapor Snag
2 Hurkyl's Recall
3 Spellskite
2 Supreme Verdict
2 Celestial Colonnade
4 Flooded Strand
1 Glacial Fortress
4 Hallowed Fountain
4 Island
4 Mutavault
1 Mystic Gate
2 Plains
2 Polluted Delta
Creatures (11):
3 Snapcaster Mage
4 Spellstutter Sprite
1 Geist of Saint Traft
1 Vendilion Clique
2 Restoration Angel
2 Gigadrowse
3 Path to Exile
3 Quicken
2 Spell Snare
3 Remand
4 Cryptic Command
Sorceries (8):
4 Day's Undoing
4 Time Warp
2 Engineered Explosives
3 Spell Pierce
3 Vapor Snag
2 Hurkyl's Recall
3 Spellskite
2 Supreme Verdict
- Sam Stoddard, “Developing Modern” (June 21, 2013) (by means of Sheridan Lardner, "Fixing Modern: Defining Format Mission (March 16, 2016))
How to Use Spoiler Tags
Starting Over: The Origins of the Mulligan Rule
Practical Approach to Slow Play
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 2: SWARM and TOOLBOX
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 3
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 4
These videos are by MTG Salvation Moderator Lantern!
Introduction to Tempo
Controlling Tempo
Elements of Tempo
Roadblocks to Tempo
How Not To Build A Deck - Tempo
Learn How To Sideboard, Dammit!
Mulligan's Island
The Art of the Mulligan
The Art of the Mulligan: Eight Case Studies
Fundamentals: The Mulligan
Some Mulligan Exercises
A Mulligan Is Worth Three Cards
The Mulligan Debate
Common Sense: The Art of the Mulligan
Who's The Beatdown?
3 Caves of Koilos
3 Eldrazi Temple
2 Fetid Heath
3 Godless Shrine
4 Ghost Quarter
3 Plains
3 Shambling Vent
2 Tectonic Edge
Artifacts (4):
4 Æther Vial
4 Path to Exile
Creatures (29):
3 Aven Mindcensor
3 Eldrazi Displacer
3 Fiend Hunter
4 Flickerwisp
4 Serra Avenger
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Thought-Knot Seer
3 Tidehollow Sculler
3 Wasteland Strangler
3 Chalice of the Void
2 Dismember
2 Oblivion Ring
2 Rest in Peace
3 Stony Silence
3 Surgical Extraction
3 Flooded Strand
6 Island
3 Polluted Delta
3 Steam Vents
3 Sulfur Falls
Creatures (16):
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Snapcaster Mage
4 Stormchaser Mage
2 Gut Shot
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Mutagenic Growth
3 Spell Pierce
3 Twisted Image
3 Vapor Snag
Sorceries (8):
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Serum Visions
2 Ancient Grudge
2 Blood Moon
2 Dispel
1 Forked Bolt
1 Hurkyl's Recall
1 Repeal
2 Roast
1 Spell Snare
2 Spellskite
1 Vapor Snag
4 Bloodstained Mire
1 Clifftop Retreat
1 Copperline Gorge
5 Mountain
3 Sacred Foundry
2 Stomping Ground
4 Wooded Foothills
Creatures (14):
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
4 Goblin Guide
2 Grim Lavamancer
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Atarka's Command
4 Boros Charm
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Lightning Helix
3 Searing Blaze
Sorceries (8):
4 Lava Spike
4 Rift Bolt
2 Deflecting Palm
4 Destructive Revelry
2 Kor Firewalker
2 Path to Exile
2 Rending Volley
3 Skullcrack
19 Forest
3 Treetop Village
Creatures (24):
4 Avatar of the Resolute
4 Dryad Militant
2 Dungrove Elder
4 Experiment One
4 Leatherback Baloth
2 Scavenging Ooze
4 Strangleroot Geist
4 Rancor
Instants (10):
3 Aspect of Hydra
4 Vines of Vastwood
3 Dismember
2 Choke
2 Gut Shot
2 Deglamer
2 Feed the Clan
2 Oxidize
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Skylasher
1 Unravel the Æther
tried it out a bit - it feels a bit like remand, but you dont have to worry about it next turn, you do however not draw that spicy extra card. Never been a fan of remand no matter how good it actually is. think it depends alot on what it is you want to counter, and also whether you need that ekstra card.
- Sam Stoddard, “Developing Modern” (June 21, 2013) (by means of Sheridan Lardner, "Fixing Modern: Defining Format Mission (March 16, 2016))
How to Use Spoiler Tags
Starting Over: The Origins of the Mulligan Rule
Practical Approach to Slow Play
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 2: SWARM and TOOLBOX
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 3
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 4
These videos are by MTG Salvation Moderator Lantern!
Introduction to Tempo
Controlling Tempo
Elements of Tempo
Roadblocks to Tempo
How Not To Build A Deck - Tempo
Learn How To Sideboard, Dammit!
Mulligan's Island
The Art of the Mulligan
The Art of the Mulligan: Eight Case Studies
Fundamentals: The Mulligan
Some Mulligan Exercises
A Mulligan Is Worth Three Cards
The Mulligan Debate
Common Sense: The Art of the Mulligan
Who's The Beatdown?
3 Caves of Koilos
3 Eldrazi Temple
2 Fetid Heath
3 Godless Shrine
4 Ghost Quarter
3 Plains
3 Shambling Vent
2 Tectonic Edge
Artifacts (4):
4 Æther Vial
4 Path to Exile
Creatures (29):
3 Aven Mindcensor
3 Eldrazi Displacer
3 Fiend Hunter
4 Flickerwisp
4 Serra Avenger
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Thought-Knot Seer
3 Tidehollow Sculler
3 Wasteland Strangler
3 Chalice of the Void
2 Dismember
2 Oblivion Ring
2 Rest in Peace
3 Stony Silence
3 Surgical Extraction
3 Flooded Strand
6 Island
3 Polluted Delta
3 Steam Vents
3 Sulfur Falls
Creatures (16):
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Snapcaster Mage
4 Stormchaser Mage
2 Gut Shot
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Mutagenic Growth
3 Spell Pierce
3 Twisted Image
3 Vapor Snag
Sorceries (8):
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Serum Visions
2 Ancient Grudge
2 Blood Moon
2 Dispel
1 Forked Bolt
1 Hurkyl's Recall
1 Repeal
2 Roast
1 Spell Snare
2 Spellskite
1 Vapor Snag
4 Bloodstained Mire
1 Clifftop Retreat
1 Copperline Gorge
5 Mountain
3 Sacred Foundry
2 Stomping Ground
4 Wooded Foothills
Creatures (14):
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
4 Goblin Guide
2 Grim Lavamancer
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Atarka's Command
4 Boros Charm
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Lightning Helix
3 Searing Blaze
Sorceries (8):
4 Lava Spike
4 Rift Bolt
2 Deflecting Palm
4 Destructive Revelry
2 Kor Firewalker
2 Path to Exile
2 Rending Volley
3 Skullcrack
19 Forest
3 Treetop Village
Creatures (24):
4 Avatar of the Resolute
4 Dryad Militant
2 Dungrove Elder
4 Experiment One
4 Leatherback Baloth
2 Scavenging Ooze
4 Strangleroot Geist
4 Rancor
Instants (10):
3 Aspect of Hydra
4 Vines of Vastwood
3 Dismember
2 Choke
2 Gut Shot
2 Deglamer
2 Feed the Clan
2 Oxidize
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Skylasher
1 Unravel the Æther
Those would be even better when played with Narset.
Edit:
To clarify: I'm currently running this particular suite of disruption
4x Wipe Away
4x Cryptic Command
3x Remand
2x Path to Exile
1x Spell Snare
2x Disrupting Shoal
Between Remand and the 12 land removal instants, by the time I decide to cast a Day's Undoing it will essentially restart the game, only I'm sitting on 4+ lands while my opponent is starting at T1, on the draw. That's the plan anyways. It's not that I'm trying to break the thing, I'm trying to make it work in TimeWarp.
Additionally, in my build that uses cheezy amounts of bounce, Time Stop could quite feasibly replace my 3-4xWalk the Aeons, effectively becoming bounce spells 13-16 if I play it after the draw step and before the main phase. Haven't tested that particular card yet, but we'll see. I'm just hoping BloomTitan gets nerfed in the Banlist update so I don't still have to account for it. The whole bounce strategy is admittedly pretty crappy against aggro and burn as they'll probably outpace me eventually. That's what the sideboard is for I guess!
As always, your mileage may vary.
- Sam Stoddard, “Developing Modern” (June 21, 2013) (by means of Sheridan Lardner, "Fixing Modern: Defining Format Mission (March 16, 2016))
How to Use Spoiler Tags
Starting Over: The Origins of the Mulligan Rule
Practical Approach to Slow Play
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 2: SWARM and TOOLBOX
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 3
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 4
These videos are by MTG Salvation Moderator Lantern!
Introduction to Tempo
Controlling Tempo
Elements of Tempo
Roadblocks to Tempo
How Not To Build A Deck - Tempo
Learn How To Sideboard, Dammit!
Mulligan's Island
The Art of the Mulligan
The Art of the Mulligan: Eight Case Studies
Fundamentals: The Mulligan
Some Mulligan Exercises
A Mulligan Is Worth Three Cards
The Mulligan Debate
Common Sense: The Art of the Mulligan
Who's The Beatdown?
3 Caves of Koilos
3 Eldrazi Temple
2 Fetid Heath
3 Godless Shrine
4 Ghost Quarter
3 Plains
3 Shambling Vent
2 Tectonic Edge
Artifacts (4):
4 Æther Vial
4 Path to Exile
Creatures (29):
3 Aven Mindcensor
3 Eldrazi Displacer
3 Fiend Hunter
4 Flickerwisp
4 Serra Avenger
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Thought-Knot Seer
3 Tidehollow Sculler
3 Wasteland Strangler
3 Chalice of the Void
2 Dismember
2 Oblivion Ring
2 Rest in Peace
3 Stony Silence
3 Surgical Extraction
3 Flooded Strand
6 Island
3 Polluted Delta
3 Steam Vents
3 Sulfur Falls
Creatures (16):
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Snapcaster Mage
4 Stormchaser Mage
2 Gut Shot
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Mutagenic Growth
3 Spell Pierce
3 Twisted Image
3 Vapor Snag
Sorceries (8):
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Serum Visions
2 Ancient Grudge
2 Blood Moon
2 Dispel
1 Forked Bolt
1 Hurkyl's Recall
1 Repeal
2 Roast
1 Spell Snare
2 Spellskite
1 Vapor Snag
4 Bloodstained Mire
1 Clifftop Retreat
1 Copperline Gorge
5 Mountain
3 Sacred Foundry
2 Stomping Ground
4 Wooded Foothills
Creatures (14):
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
4 Goblin Guide
2 Grim Lavamancer
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Atarka's Command
4 Boros Charm
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Lightning Helix
3 Searing Blaze
Sorceries (8):
4 Lava Spike
4 Rift Bolt
2 Deflecting Palm
4 Destructive Revelry
2 Kor Firewalker
2 Path to Exile
2 Rending Volley
3 Skullcrack
19 Forest
3 Treetop Village
Creatures (24):
4 Avatar of the Resolute
4 Dryad Militant
2 Dungrove Elder
4 Experiment One
4 Leatherback Baloth
2 Scavenging Ooze
4 Strangleroot Geist
4 Rancor
Instants (10):
3 Aspect of Hydra
4 Vines of Vastwood
3 Dismember
2 Choke
2 Gut Shot
2 Deglamer
2 Feed the Clan
2 Oxidize
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Skylasher
1 Unravel the Æther
Modern Warp / UR Control / UR Storm / Naya Breachshift / ElectroBalance
Solidarity / Lands / Sneak and Show / Grixis Delver / Reanimator / Belcher / Storm / Dredge
17x Island
4x Seat of the Synod
4x Reliquary Tower
Creatures
2x Sphinx of Jwar Isle
4x Time Warp
4x Savor the Moment
2x Time Stretch
2x Walk the Aeons
4x Howling Mine
4x Mind Stone
4x Pact of Negation
4x Echoing Truth
4x Thirst for Knowledge
1x Elixir of Immortality
Of course this was for casual, so I used the Seat of the Synods. My version used the Savor the Moments basically as ramp. I still have this actually. I might make some changes and try to make my entry into Modern.
1 Ghost Quarter
22 Island
1 Mikokoro, Center of the Sea
Creatures (1)
1 Thassa, God of the Sea
Enchantement (4)
4 Dictate of Kruphix
Artifact (1)
1 Elixir of Immortality
Planeswalker (1)
1 Jace Beleren
Instant (13)
2 Gigadrowse
3 Telling Time
1 Spell Snare
4 Remand
3 Cryptic Command
4 Temporal Mastery
4 Time Warp
4 Walk the Aeons
4 Serum Visions
1 Aetherize
2 Gigadrowse
3 Hurkyl’s Recall
1 Laboratory Maniac
3 Spell Pierce
1 Spell Snare
2 Swan Song
2 Wipe Away
Standard: GWRU 4C Collected Company
Modern: GUWRB Bloom Titan
Legacy: BUG SHARDLESS BUG
EDH :
GR BORBORYGMOS ENRAGED
GU PRIME SPEAKER ZEGENA
UWR ZEDRUU THE GREATHEARTED
UBR MISHRA ARTIFICER PRODIGY
B SHEOLDRED WHISPERING ONE
R ASHLING THE PILGRIM
Exhaustion seem sweet, thought i'm not sure about it yet.
Gigadrowse split seem fine to me atm. the card was ok, but not completely stellar to deserve 4 MD slot.
the deck definitely need more mine effect as i said. but not more than 8 total. Thassa herself is almost an mine effect. Jace Beleren also. so may be 2 extra. I think i will play Howling Mine itself. i don't want a guy that can die.
------------------------------
Played today at a PPTQ. i watched the video of Frank Lepore with this deck just before the event to understand the lines of play. i did only 3-3, i won against Cruel Control (good matchup) Mono U Tron (good matchup) Jund (not bad)... and lost to AdNauseum(bad match up), Burn(not very good match up) and Splinter Twin(???)
on the Adnauseum deck (with Angel Grace and cie) i didn't know they could win instant speed, so i was kinda surprise. but i don't think its a good matchup to begin with.
Burn is hard, i find Spell Pierce in the SB barely playable for this style of deck. even in that match up. try to counter a bolt on 3 land, its weird. Next time i will play some Dispel. I want more hard counter. It also protect the first Gain turn you play vs Control. I don't understand Spell Pierce in this deck, every time i had it in my hand, i was feeling like dispel or spell snare would have 100% better in this deck. please enlighten me on we spell pierce is good.
splinter twin, i was too greedy (i always forgot the Pestermite tap a land) i need to practice more this match up in general.
Cruel is a piece of cake. they are too slow, have a lot of dead card (kill spells...) and we have more counterspell than them. Oddly enough i was playing Dictate at the end of my turn when he was tapped out for an anticipate. i had no other choice.
Jund is not that hard we have a bunch of tempo play and our hands are pretty resilient to discard spell. Everything Draw Counter or Gain Turn. Watch out for choke. he got me game 2.
Mono U tron is like a bad control deck vs us. they have only a couple of counterspell and their wincon are also slow and need to attack. they dont play Karn and no Big Fancy Eldrazi. Only slow Wurmcoil Engine and Big coulourless creatures that you can Gigadrose or cryptic bounce.
Thassa was awesome all day for me. Its a quick clock. and helps toward the win. My Jund player quickly understood that Dictate was very important to make the deck work and was playing Abrupt Decay on them ASAP. SO i might add some howling mine in MD or SB. May be like 1-2. or may be a second Jace Beleren somewhere. I feel like a 4th Cryptic wouldn't hurt either. I didn't SB in Lab Maniac. Honestly, Thassa is already really hard to deal with in modern and i have Jace Beleren as a back up. (and Elixir.) i can't see a spot where i would wish it in my deck.
Overall i fell like with a bit more preparation (toward my plays vs splinter twin notably.) i can make this deck work. I think i can modify the SB to reflect my style of play. this deck is great. and fun. except for our opponents.
Standard: GWRU 4C Collected Company
Modern: GUWRB Bloom Titan
Legacy: BUG SHARDLESS BUG
EDH :
GR BORBORYGMOS ENRAGED
GU PRIME SPEAKER ZEGENA
UWR ZEDRUU THE GREATHEARTED
UBR MISHRA ARTIFICER PRODIGY
B SHEOLDRED WHISPERING ONE
R ASHLING THE PILGRIM
i`ve been testing 12 mines by adding 2 kamis and trying temporal mastery rather than using snaps, also 1 matrix in the deck, that approach is good for the meta now, we`re facing less friendly junks and more junds, which have turned into a tough match because of those kolaghan commands, so adding more mines is crucial, sadly kami dies easily vs both jund and grixis, so i think it isn`t optimal, maybe adding some temple bells is the best approach, but i like kamis because they are good blockers and are another cheap mine effect so it makes it easier to go off and summoning them in the middle of the combo
matrix is awesome, but they`re not good with bells and creatures, also i prefered snaps over temporal masteries, so i think i`ll go back to 2 commands and 2 snaps
i`m preparing for the GP Porto Alegre, which will happen in the beginning of october, i still don`t have a clue about what`s the best way to change the deck vs the actual meta, let`s see what happens, maybe AV is unbanned(let`s hope)
also i made drastic changes in the sideboard, i added 4 swan songs, 1 flash freeze, it`s better vs burn, boil and choke, which is highly present right now
i think ill remove clique, remand and will add 2 kamis in my original list
ah, also i`m testing gitaxian probes, they help a lot when facing bg and grixis
i think our deck is weak right now, but lets see what happens, if AV is unbanned we`ll be a tier deck for sure
Pioneer: WURFaerie fires BRGDragons
ModernBGElves WRBurn UR Fires Turns URGift Storm UG Twiddle Storm
I've seen these more 'classic' lists win events and get posted here pretty often. My big concern is, how the hell is a list like this supposed to beat Burn, Infect, or Affinity? The whole reason I splash colors in my build is better access to efficient 1-2cmc interaction. I understand that Temporal Mastery is actually quite dope in the early game and frequently wins games because of it. It also makes use of the Serum Visions that basically all variants run anyways.
To the posters running Howling Mine, how are you beating Kolaghan's??? That card is a staple in BRx lists nowadays and is frequently main decked.
Finally, I want to recommend Jace TLGP over Beleren. It still gives the UU to turn on Thassa, dodges Decay and IoK, and can even bounce all while giving better card selection.
it will be a freezing day in hell when i run Jace, the Living Guildpact in a deck. i will run Jace, Architect of Thought ANYTIME before that.
Kolaghan's Command... if they don't see an artifact game 1, i'm pretty sure they SB it out. it's not really effective vs us. But if you play 4 Mine, i can see it being a problem.
i don't think you can beat Infect. Affinity... there is a reason there is 3 Hurkyl's Recall in the SB. Burn is beatable but Eidolon must never resolve.
IMO, this deck is basicly a mono U splinter twin deck that need a mine-effect in play and at least 5 mana to start combo-off. its just a worse combo deck. but its a tons of fun to play. you dodge a lot of hate. and majority of people don't expect it at all. Being Mono U have its strength and its weakness but i don't think you absolutely need to splash to make the deck playable.
@doc.brown if you splash green you dont want to play Eternal Witness cause au double G.
Standard: GWRU 4C Collected Company
Modern: GUWRB Bloom Titan
Legacy: BUG SHARDLESS BUG
EDH :
GR BORBORYGMOS ENRAGED
GU PRIME SPEAKER ZEGENA
UWR ZEDRUU THE GREATHEARTED
UBR MISHRA ARTIFICER PRODIGY
B SHEOLDRED WHISPERING ONE
R ASHLING THE PILGRIM