Went 2-1 at FNM with this brew which is more about death and less about taxes. Was lots of fun to play, and vialing in a 4/4 epochrasite always catches people off guard!
Went 2-1 at FNM with this brew which is more about death and less about taxes. Was lots of fun to play, and vialing in a 4/4 epochrasite always catches people off guard!
So how's the new king of cat doing (Read Brimaz). In T2 environment every white or white black deck bring 4 (even the price is @$40 crazy huh for T2 env and even the cat is legendary). Is the card is going to be better than Hero of Bladehold ? or the card is going to be must have card in MD for DnT Modern ?
Well any opinion ?
From my point of view the card price is outrageous (to highh and not worth it) and not a must have card in MD in DnT Modern
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Modern
------
Boros/Naya/Mardu Burn Abzan Rhino non Noble Hierach not active Jund Tarmoless not active
DnT White
Living End Jund Restore Balance Non Borderpost/ Borderpost not active U/W Titan Control not active Mardu Nahiri/Control not active
I think the general feeling on that card is that it could go in our deck, but it isn't necessary or super game changing for us. Sure a 3/4 with viligance and the token making is a just bananas, but does it do enough on hating our opponent's deck or slow him down. The other three drops we have can either hate our opponents resources ie flickerwisp or force them to make a tough decision. ie Blade Splicer. So idk if it is worth it.
But if I'm wrong, cool. Then we have another option for the super crowded three drop spot.
So how's the new king of cat doing (Read Brimaz). In T2 environment every white or white black deck bring 4 (even the price is @$40 crazy huh for T2 env and even the cat is legendary). Is the card is going to be better than Hero of Bladehold ? or the card is going to be must have card in MD for DnT Modern ?
Well any opinion ?
From my point of view the card price is outrageous (to highh and not worth it) and not a must have card in MD in DnT Modern
I can't test it until it hits MTGO, but I actually have very high hopes for it.
Well, first...you will not see me convincing you not to run Masks. I am one of the last hold-outs for the card and I love it. Second, I long ago stopped running Avenger because while it may be a really efficient turn two play off a Vial, most of the time it is just a french vanilla beater and I don't think that fits with my idea of the deck. Lastly, Grand Abolisher has always been a grand disappointment for me. It seems like it would answer problems the deck has, but for the decks it does affect it really hits them hard so it dies REALLY fast. I tried running it in all manner of decks in the first year or so of Modern and it just never paid off. I found that Ethersworn Canonist lasted longer and had a greater affect on my opponent's game.
Oh, and one more thing...23 land- live it, learn it, love it. Many players of this deck have tried to vary from that number and all of the successful ones (that place well in verfiable tournaments) run 23 land. A lot of people in this thread disagree with how concervative I am about this archetype, but the one thing that we almost all agree on is 23 land.
Hey everyone, I've sorta read through this thread to get an idea as to what my deck should look like. After a fair amount of consideration and gathering cards, I settled on the following. I'm not attached to anything in this list and I'm open to suggestions
Hey everyone, I've sorta read through this thread to get an idea as to what my deck should look like. After a fair amount of consideration and gathering cards, I settled on the following. I'm not attached to anything in this list and I'm open to suggestions
That's a pretty standard MD for the most part. A lot of us have stopped running Student, even though there is no really good 1 cmc alternative. Also, since you are running exarch you might want some more flicker effects so 2-3 Restoration Angel would be good. You SB is a bit of a mess, and you are putting FAR too many slots in your 75 to swords. Disenchant is better than Revoke Existence, and I just don't see a good reason to side in Heliod.
How this deck came to be:
I spent a few months testing the usual aggro D&T decks found in this thread and found a few problems with it. I felt that if you don't draw an Aether Vial the deck becomes awkward. The land destruction plan can't really be executed because that would deprive you of your own lands to cast your drops. Many times, I can't even find the 3rd land drop to cast a Mindcensor. This is unlike the Legacy D&T deck which I also love because in Legacy, all you need to do to execute your aggro plan is 2 lands - Stoneforge Mystic into equipment, done. We don't have SFM in Modern, and thus require other, much less efficient means to close the game.
After lots of test games vs Melira and Kiki Pod, Twin, Jund and Scapeshift with various aggro D&T versions, I realized that the anti-search plan isn't great on its own. A deck like Pod frequently has great creatures to block ours (Voice of Resurgence, Kitchen Finks, Loxodon Smiter) and because we don't have that much removal, don't have that much reach, and our creatures being so small, we can't exactly race either. Scapeshift packs 4 Obstinate Baloths which do the same kind of wall-like effect. Jund has big Goyfs. Sometimes, any one of those creatures becomes a huge problem for the deck as we pack too little removal, temporary or permanent, to deal with them.
So I started thinking... which creature would go over the top of all these, and win any creature race when the game slows down and stalls. Baneslayer Angel! So I added more lands, tested it against my friend's Melira Pod for a few hours, and to my surprise, I didn't lose any more to that Pod deck.
After a few more weeks of tweaking and testing, I read up on GW hatebears and found a very similar deck to mine that played 4 Baneslayer Angel too that top 8 an event (can't remember which). It also had maindeck Spellskite, Crucible of Worlds and Linvala, which i'm currently testing out (and is listed in the deck above).
So far, i've had a pretty good matchup against pre-Deathrite Shaman-ban Jund and Pod with the deck. I've also tested a few matches against Affinity and it's about 50/50 (Flickerwisp'ing away the Cranial Plating and doing it again and again with Restoration Angel and other Flickerwisps was crucial in game 1). Then when you land the Baneslayer Angel, it's all over. I tested a few matches against Scapeshift too and the games were usually close and came down to who drew better.
I'm currently testing some new additions to the deck, Cavern of Souls (which will normally name Angel), Crucible of Worlds and Spellskite. So far, the worst performer has been Crucible as without Knight of the Reliquary around to tutor up Tec Edges/Ghost Quarters, the combo is unreliable. When it does work though, it's hilariously fun. Before I added Crucible in, the slot was taken up by an additional Plains, and that may be better.
The sideboard I guess is pretty standard and self-explanatory except for a few so I guess i'll explain those.
Wrath of God - This came up in a discussion with an opponent today at an event where he noticed that my deck could actually play Wrath of God. There's a tendency for opponents to overcommit against this deck, and that's when a Wrath will turn the tide, and I can then spit out my hand or land the Baneslayer. I have yet to put in any testing time with Wrath in the side, but I will be doing so shortly.
Brave the Elements - Many tier 1 decks pack damage based board wipes (Firespout, Pyroclasm, Anger of the Gods) and this card will stop them. Also, I board in against other creature decks as an alpha-strike enabler. Usually, you can name a color and effectively have all your creatures become unblockable, winning the game.
I'll be testing this deck more and also testing more copies of Linvala maindeck, it really shores up our matchups against Twin and Pod. I'll also be testing Honor of the Pure soon, as I expect the meta to hate Faeries heavily and people will be packing loads of Izzet Staticasters, Orzhov Pontiff, Electrolyze, etc.
I hope someone would also test out this deck and provide some feedback and we can improve this midrangey version of D&T together.
I've watched heretix play this list a lot and have played against him and would recommend this list. It's pretty good against a large swath of decks and the 4 baneslayers are actually very good.
Well, first...you will not see me convincing you not to run Masks. I am one of the last hold-outs for the card and I love it. Second, I long ago stopped running Avenger because while it may be a really efficient turn two play off a Vial, most of the time it is just a french vanilla beater and I don't think that fits with my idea of the deck. Lastly, Grand Abolisher has always been a grand disappointment for me. It seems like it would answer problems the deck has, but for the decks it does affect it really hits them hard so it dies REALLY fast. I tried running it in all manner of decks in the first year or so of Modern and it just never paid off. I found that Ethersworn Canonist lasted longer and had a greater affect on my opponent's game.
Oh, and one more thing...23 land- live it, learn it, love it. Many players of this deck have tried to vary from that number and all of the successful ones (that place well in verfiable tournaments) run 23 land. A lot of people in this thread disagree with how concervative I am about this archetype, but the one thing that we almost all agree on is 23 land.
Grand Abolisher is strong against Faeries since they barely run any removal.
Hey everyone, I've sorta read through this thread to get an idea as to what my deck should look like. After a fair amount of consideration and gathering cards, I settled on the following. I'm not attached to anything in this list and I'm open to suggestions
That's a pretty standard MD for the most part. A lot of us have stopped running Student, even though there is no really good 1 cmc alternative. Also, since you are running exarch you might want some more flicker effects so 2-3 Restoration Angel would be good. You SB is a bit of a mess, and you are putting FAR too many slots in your 75 to swords. Disenchant is better than Revoke Existence, and I just don't see a good reason to side in Heliod.
Thank you for the input. I believe there are two restos in the maindeck and I just forgot to list them. Do you, or anyone else have any suggestions for what to do with the sideboard?
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"Life's all economics. Don't be disillusioned. If it's a sellers' market, then pay the price." -Unknown
Currently Playing:
Standard:
NOTHING
Modern:
Mono W Death and Taxes
Affinity
Legacy:
Manaless Dredge
Commander:
Derevi, Empyrial Tactician
Generation 9: The first time you see this, copy and paste it into your sig and add 1 to the generation. Social experiment
kataki tax yourself a lot. I know it because I have tested it, and I don't like to pay for my golems and vials.
Good point, but it's only in against Affinity and is effectively a 2 mana board wipe against them. I can't think of any other matchup where Kataki goes in.
I have tested Ethersworn Canonist, it's quite good against blue decks in general. If they are reduced to only one burn or counterspell per turn, it is very easy to play around them. It is of course great against Storm and Goryo's Vengeance if that's in your meta. But I think 2 is too much.
I totally agree regarding having protection against Firespout and gang. My choice for now is Brave the Elements. For the builds that splash red, the obvious pick is Boros Charm.
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Modern:
Bant | U Tron | GW Hatebears | Death and Taxes | Scapeshift | UW Tron | UW Midrange
I'll keep Grand Abolisher for now, since I don't have Canonist at the moment. Other than that, I removed Serra Avenger for another Plains and probably a fourth Thalia.
how are people feeling about Spirit of the Labyrinth? too fragile? too narrow? i know people are testing it in legacy for brainstorm/JtMS hate..... i think it might be relevant against decks like heartbeat combo or storm or anything relying too hard on cantrips, also poops on horizon canopy but that seems kinda fringe. im considering trying it because i opened a few and was wondering what the general consensus was rather than just try to cram n jam him
how are people feeling about Spirit of the Labyrinth? too fragile? too narrow? i know people are testing it in legacy for brainstorm/JtMS hate..... i think it might be relevant against decks like heartbeat combo or storm or anything relying too hard on cantrips, also poops on horizon canopy but that seems kinda fringe. im considering trying it because i opened a few and was wondering what the general consensus was rather than just try to cram n jam him
I tested Sprit of the Labyrinth for awhile, and found it lackluster. The stats are incredible, a 2 mana 3/1 with text is so good. But unfortunately, it's too narrow a card in Modern, unlike in Legacy.
Here are the cards it affects in the Modern meta, off the top of my head:
Faithless Looting
Griselbrand
Izzet Charm (using the loot mode)
Serum Visions
Gitaxian Probe
Manamorphose
Ninja of the Deep Hours
Against the decks which it matters (Storm, Goryo's, Ninja Bear Delver), it is stellar. But these decks are way too uncommonly played to deserve even 1 slot in the sideboard when there are far more commonly played decks which deserve that slot. Note that Spirit doesn't stop cards that simply reveal off the top of the library like Ad Nauseum or the Cascade spells of Living End.
Unless Goryo's, Storm or even Ninja Bear Delver is a commonly played deck in your meta, I wouldn't play Spirit.
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Modern:
Bant | U Tron | GW Hatebears | Death and Taxes | Scapeshift | UW Tron | UW Midrange
@Heretix or Sasky
You do realize we have mirran crusader for green and black creature with double strike and with 1WW cc (better than BSA that 3WW cc) ?
I Love BSA as creature and her abilites but I still disagree with her cc that is 3WW. It's make DnT a LongGame deck not a midgame deck
Well any argue is open
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Modern
------
Boros/Naya/Mardu Burn Abzan Rhino non Noble Hierach not active Jund Tarmoless not active
DnT White
Living End Jund Restore Balance Non Borderpost/ Borderpost not active U/W Titan Control not active Mardu Nahiri/Control not active
how are people feeling about Spirit of the Labyrinth? too fragile? too narrow? i know people are testing it in legacy for brainstorm/JtMS hate..... i think it might be relevant against decks like heartbeat combo or storm or anything relying too hard on cantrips, also poops on horizon canopy but that seems kinda fringe. im considering trying it because i opened a few and was wondering what the general consensus was rather than just try to cram n jam him
I tested Sprit of the Labyrinth for awhile, and found it lackluster. The stats are incredible, a 2 mana 3/1 with text is so good. But unfortunately, it's too narrow a card in Modern, unlike in Legacy.
Here are the cards it affects in the Modern meta, off the top of my head:
Faithless Looting
Griselbrand
Izzet Charm (using the loot mode)
Serum Visions
Gitaxian Probe
Manamorphose
Ninja of the Deep Hours
Against the decks which it matters (Storm, Goryo's, Ninja Bear Delver), it is stellar. But these decks are way too uncommonly played to deserve even 1 slot in the sideboard when there are far more commonly played decks which deserve that slot. Note that Spirit doesn't stop cards that simply reveal off the top of the library like Ad Nauseum or the Cascade spells of Living End.
Unless Goryo's, Storm or even Ninja Bear Delver is a commonly played deck in your meta, I wouldn't play Spirit.
how are people feeling about Spirit of the Labyrinth? too fragile? too narrow? i know people are testing it in legacy for brainstorm/JtMS hate..... i think it might be relevant against decks like heartbeat combo or storm or anything relying too hard on cantrips, also poops on horizon canopy but that seems kinda fringe. im considering trying it because i opened a few and was wondering what the general consensus was rather than just try to cram n jam him
I tested Sprit of the Labyrinth for awhile, and found it lackluster. The stats are incredible, a 2 mana 3/1 with text is so good. But unfortunately, it's too narrow a card in Modern, unlike in Legacy.
Here are the cards it affects in the Modern meta, off the top of my head:
Faithless Looting
Griselbrand
Izzet Charm (using the loot mode)
Serum Visions
Gitaxian Probe
Manamorphose
Ninja of the Deep Hours
Against the decks which it matters (Storm, Goryo's, Ninja Bear Delver), it is stellar. But these decks are way too uncommonly played to deserve even 1 slot in the sideboard when there are far more commonly played decks which deserve that slot. Note that Spirit doesn't stop cards that simply reveal off the top of the library like Ad Nauseum or the Cascade spells of Living End.
Unless Goryo's, Storm or even Ninja Bear Delver is a commonly played deck in your meta, I wouldn't play Spirit.
Derp, yep, forgot that one! On the other hand, UWR Geist is kinda the preferred UWR build these days and they don't run Sphinx's Revelation at all. UWR Control runs it.
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Modern:
Bant | U Tron | GW Hatebears | Death and Taxes | Scapeshift | UW Tron | UW Midrange
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Went 2-1 at FNM with this brew which is more about death and less about taxes. Was lots of fun to play, and vialing in a 4/4 epochrasite always catches people off guard!
8 Plains
4 Sacred Foundry
4 Clifftop Retreat
4 Ghost Quarter
Creature
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Leonin Arbiter
4 Epochrasite
4 Wall of Omens
3 Kitchen Finks
4 Flickerwisp
4 Restoration Angel
4 Akroma, Angel of Fury
4 Aether Vial
Instants
4 Path to Exile
Enchantments
2 Oblivion Ring
1 Chalice of the Void
2 Thorn of Amethyst
2 Pyroclasm
2 Disenchant
2 Rest in Peace
2 Leyline of Sanctity
4 Mirran Crusader
Went 2-1 at FNM with this brew which is more about death and less about taxes. Was lots of fun to play, and vialing in a 4/4 epochrasite always catches people off guard!
8 Plains
4 Sacred Foundry
4 Clifftop Retreat
4 Ghost Quarter
Creature
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Leonin Arbiter
4 Epochrasite
4 Wall of Omens
3 Kitchen Finks
4 Flickerwisp
4 Restoration Angel
4 Akroma, Angel of Fury
4 Aether Vial
Instants
4 Path to Exile
Enchantments
2 Oblivion Ring
1 Chalice of the Void
2 Thorn of Amethyst
2 Pyroclasm
2 Disenchant
2 Rest in Peace
2 Leyline of Sanctity
4 Mirran Crusader
Well any opinion ?
From my point of view the card price is outrageous (to highh and not worth it) and not a must have card in MD in DnT Modern
------
Boros/Naya/Mardu Burn
Abzan Rhino non Noble Hierachnot activeJund Tarmolessnot activeDnT White
Living End Jund
Restore Balance Non Borderpost/ Borderpostnot activeU/W Titan Controlnot activeMardu Nahiri/Controlnot activeBut if I'm wrong, cool. Then we have another option for the super crowded three drop spot.
Reprint Opt for Modern!!
FREE DIG THOROUGH TIME!
PLAY MORE ROUGE DECKS!
Any feedback is welcome. I plan to test it live within a couple of weeks.
4 Leonin Arbiter
2 Serra Avenger
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Flickerwisp
4 Kitchen Finks
3 Grand Abolisher
3 Blade Splicer
3 Aven mindcensor
2 Restoration angel
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
2 Mask of Memory
Lands (22)
1 Eiganjo Castle
3 Tectonic Edge
4 Ghost Quarter
14 Plains
3 Kor Firewalker
3 Leonin Relic-Warder
3 Kataki, War's Wage
3 Rest in Peace
2 Pithing needle
1 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
Oh, and one more thing...23 land- live it, learn it, love it. Many players of this deck have tried to vary from that number and all of the successful ones (that place well in verfiable tournaments) run 23 land. A lot of people in this thread disagree with how concervative I am about this archetype, but the one thing that we almost all agree on is 23 land.
Reprint Opt for Modern!!
FREE DIG THOROUGH TIME!
PLAY MORE ROUGE DECKS!
3 Student of Warfare
3 Inquisitor Exarch
4 Leonin Arbiter
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Flickerwisp
4 Blade Splicer
3 Kitchen Finks
2 Aven Mindcensor
4 AEther Vial
1 Sword of Light and Shadow
Instants/Sorceries:
4 Path to Exile
Lands:
4 Ghost Quarter
2 Tectonic Edge
1 Mutavault
4 Horizon Canopy
12 Plains
2 Kataki, War's Wage
2 Ethersworn Canonist
3 Revoke Existence
3 Rest in Peace
1 Sword of War and Peace
1 Sword of Feast and Famine
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Kitchen Finks
1 Heliod, God of the Sun
Currently Playing:
Standard:
NOTHING
Modern:
Mono W Death and Taxes
Affinity
Legacy:
Manaless Dredge
Commander:
Derevi, Empyrial Tactician
Generation 9: The first time you see this, copy and paste it into your sig and add 1 to the generation. Social experiment
That's a pretty standard MD for the most part. A lot of us have stopped running Student, even though there is no really good 1 cmc alternative. Also, since you are running exarch you might want some more flicker effects so 2-3 Restoration Angel would be good. You SB is a bit of a mess, and you are putting FAR too many slots in your 75 to swords. Disenchant is better than Revoke Existence, and I just don't see a good reason to side in Heliod.
Reprint Opt for Modern!!
FREE DIG THOROUGH TIME!
PLAY MORE ROUGE DECKS!
I've watched heretix play this list a lot and have played against him and would recommend this list. It's pretty good against a large swath of decks and the 4 baneslayers are actually very good.
I would also recommend cutting the crucible.
Modern: Jund Legacy: RUG Delver EDH: Captain Sisay
Grand Abolisher is strong against Faeries since they barely run any removal.
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
Reprint Opt for Modern!!
FREE DIG THOROUGH TIME!
PLAY MORE ROUGE DECKS!
Thank you for the input. I believe there are two restos in the maindeck and I just forgot to list them. Do you, or anyone else have any suggestions for what to do with the sideboard?
Currently Playing:
Standard:
NOTHING
Modern:
Mono W Death and Taxes
Affinity
Legacy:
Manaless Dredge
Commander:
Derevi, Empyrial Tactician
Generation 9: The first time you see this, copy and paste it into your sig and add 1 to the generation. Social experiment
Good point, but it's only in against Affinity and is effectively a 2 mana board wipe against them. I can't think of any other matchup where Kataki goes in.
I have tested Ethersworn Canonist, it's quite good against blue decks in general. If they are reduced to only one burn or counterspell per turn, it is very easy to play around them. It is of course great against Storm and Goryo's Vengeance if that's in your meta. But I think 2 is too much.
I totally agree regarding having protection against Firespout and gang. My choice for now is Brave the Elements. For the builds that splash red, the obvious pick is Boros Charm.
Bant | U Tron | GW Hatebears | Death and Taxes | Scapeshift | UW Tron | UW Midrange
I'll keep Grand Abolisher for now, since I don't have Canonist at the moment. Other than that, I removed Serra Avenger for another Plains and probably a fourth Thalia.
I tested Sprit of the Labyrinth for awhile, and found it lackluster. The stats are incredible, a 2 mana 3/1 with text is so good. But unfortunately, it's too narrow a card in Modern, unlike in Legacy.
Here are the cards it affects in the Modern meta, off the top of my head:
Faithless Looting
Griselbrand
Izzet Charm (using the loot mode)
Serum Visions
Gitaxian Probe
Manamorphose
Ninja of the Deep Hours
Against the decks which it matters (Storm, Goryo's, Ninja Bear Delver), it is stellar. But these decks are way too uncommonly played to deserve even 1 slot in the sideboard when there are far more commonly played decks which deserve that slot. Note that Spirit doesn't stop cards that simply reveal off the top of the library like Ad Nauseum or the Cascade spells of Living End.
Unless Goryo's, Storm or even Ninja Bear Delver is a commonly played deck in your meta, I wouldn't play Spirit.
Bant | U Tron | GW Hatebears | Death and Taxes | Scapeshift | UW Tron | UW Midrange
You do realize we have mirran crusader for green and black creature with double strike and with 1WW cc (better than BSA that 3WW cc) ?
I Love BSA as creature and her abilites but I still disagree with her cc that is 3WW. It's make DnT a LongGame deck not a midgame deck
Well any argue is open
------
Boros/Naya/Mardu Burn
Abzan Rhino non Noble Hierachnot activeJund Tarmolessnot activeDnT White
Living End Jund
Restore Balance Non Borderpost/ Borderpostnot activeU/W Titan Controlnot activeMardu Nahiri/Controlnot activeYou are forgetting Sphinx's Revelation.
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
Derp, yep, forgot that one! On the other hand, UWR Geist is kinda the preferred UWR build these days and they don't run Sphinx's Revelation at all. UWR Control runs it.
Bant | U Tron | GW Hatebears | Death and Taxes | Scapeshift | UW Tron | UW Midrange