I'm on the fence about Teferi and Jace right now, some games they do work and other ones they are dead draws. I can't afford fetches or cryptic right now. I'd like to get a playset of serum visions to smooth my draws (I seem to get screwed or flooded quite a bit), but otherwise the deck has been doing well on cockatrice.
I most like to play this deck like draw go, but that means you have to cut the Augur of Bolas. As i'm playing the deck weekly, let me tell you that Snapcaster Mage is the only really needed creature in the deck. All others are nice but also reducing the deck's speed. (Ha-Ha! Speed :wahoo:)
Also Mystical Teachings is to expensive. Most of the time you cast it, you're seeking for an answer to a spot, but with 4 mana to spend, there's nearly no ability to cast the found answer the same turn. Forbidden Alchemy fits the same role in the deck, but also helps hitting the land drops. And Because you're not playing any fetchlands, you'll never draw a land that's thinning your library. That's the reason you also should play Forbidden Alchemy, because with the mana base you already have, it's easy for you to compense putting lands into your graveyard, if you need spells.
Then, the lack of mass removal is shocking me? Don't you play them due to your metagame? Volcanic Fallout is good, no questions, but if Damnation is to expensive for you i would at least add another single more mass removal (Anger of the Gods, Consume the Meek).
Additionally please play more counterspells. I know Cryptic Command is skyreaching at the moment, but at least a playset of mana leak should be played. If you don't want to clean your bank account for Cryptic Command there're also cheap redundant cards that use special modi of it: Lost in the Mist, Into the Roil.
I really agree with this, alchemy is really good. I cut electrolyze for it after the new unbans, hurts the affinity and Merfolk matches in some situations but the heaping load of consistency gets you out of so many situations and grants nearly unlimited reach. I'd rather stick with a consistent deck with alchemy as the glue than play teachings, it's too slow. At 4cmc is rather be playing snapcaster, damnation, or cc
If budget is a concern ditch the serum visions for think twice. Much cheaper. It doesn't let you dig but it's instant speed so you don't waste mana on your turn, always use it on their end step.
What's the consensus on tapping out turns 1 and 2 rather than holding up mana/countering spells? The reason I wanted to play serum visions alongside augur is to set up my hand for turns 3 and 4 which I think are key in hitting land drops and having answers to threats. I generally find that if I can resolve a T4 teachings without dying the next turn, then I am pretty solid for the rest of the game.
@kaelfros:
I'm playing electrolyze and volcanic fallout mainly to beat affinity. I usually side those out for anger against decks with bigger creatures. On a semi-related note: do you guys think black sun's zenith is a good alternative for damnation? Neither allows regeneration, and BSZ is better at killing kitchen finks while damnation is better at killing bigger stuff.
I played on a local event on sunday and went 4-0 pretty easily. Played against Kiki-Pod, Faeries, jund, Melira Pod. All games went 2-0 except Faeries which was 2-1 because G2 I got way to mana screwed, didn't hit 3rd land for 3 turns and then when I got my 3rd and 4rth he tec edged me and I couldn't find a 3rd blue source. G1 however was dominant by me and G3 was extremely close but cruel ultimatum into cruel ultimatum into snapcaster cruel ultimatum can't be dealt with.
Anyway, I have to say that: Slaughter Pact (which was a 1 of) was astonishingly good. The ability to tap out on my turn if I want to (for Jace or man land attack) without fearing a combo from them is just great for this deck. I might have a draw-go list overall but slaughter pact was game changing always. Shadow of Doubt was also an all star. It was dead only against faeries. I got to screw my jund opponent on lands and I managed to stop both pod decks from going off. I play 2 main board and I wouldn't consider cutting them. Anger of the Gods was not that impressive to be honest, damnations were enough and everytime I drew AotG, it ended up being a dead card. Jace, Architect of Thought was decent but he was mostly a "secure win" card rather than producing advantage. Unless I had slaughter pact up I didn't want to cast him turns 4-6 (which is when he is needed to produce a decent advantage). Baby Jace never came up so I cannot comment. Think Twice is nuts. Threads of Disloyalty was a one of in my SB and it is the best thing that ever happened to my SB. Because I play an almost 0 permanent list (well, only Jace, baby jace, 2 snappys) everyone removed their creature hate so I ended up borrowing ppls goyfs and oozes to win them.
I had a batterskull SB which ended up getting in to almost every MU so I might just bring it in mainboard.
Keranos, God of Storms Does look interesting. 5cmc is high though for a draw go deck, but it could help get lands necessary to cast Ultimatum, or just use as another finisher that also helps keep your hand full.
The problem is tapping out. After t4 sweep I don't have an issue with it so much, but if I do go that route I think I'm going to bring a single pact of negation and slaughter pact into the deck.
His effect is worth it, I think. And he comes down 3/4 turns before a cruel does as well. As with all things, he will need testing. I'm very tempted by his indestructible nature.
Edit: why isn't squelch being looked at in place of shadow of doubt?
The thing is if you include Keranos, why would you go the Cruel Control route? Wouldn't you simply cut the Cruel Ultimatum's and try to win with Keranos?
Being 100% honest, this sounds terrible. Keranos is perhaps a decent card for standard, and may be fringe modern playable, but there is absolutely no way it would be worth warping an entire archetype around.
If you're going to devote your entire deck to make one card good in modern, you really need that card to be much higher impact than keranos, instead of something that's just an incremental advantage engine like he is.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Find me online - I'm on Cockatrice * Tag - Badd B - Or on MTGO - Tag - Cbus05
So I have this idea, which might sound crazy but give me some feedback please. Currently I am running 2 jaces (baby and AoT). What if I would cut em both plus one more spell (probably an electrolyze) in order to play 2 bitterblossoms and 1 batterskull. What I lose is some card advantage/card selection. What I get however is the ability to have constant blockers against very aggressive strategies (which we need), the ability to simply re-equip my batterskull if they keep killing the germ instead of constant bouncing, the ability to generate board advantage on a deck which shouldn't do it and finally another winning condition. The lifeloss is very impactful but I would say that we could also slam it down later rather than T2 (depending on the MU ofc). What do you guys think? (also how cool would it be to name the deck cruel blossom? )
Has anyone tested spelltwine? I've often thought this deck was solid but just seen it lose too many times to itself trying to resolve its namesake spell--twine is much easier to cast, cheaper, gets you removal or card draw or a number of other things--maybe even gets a cruel out of your card and a bolt or something out of your opponents. I think with a little bit of looting in red and snapcaster you could do some nasty things with it.
What's the consensus on tapping out turns 1 and 2 rather than holding up mana/countering spells? The reason I wanted to play serum visions alongside augur is to set up my hand for turns 3 and 4 which I think are key in hitting land drops and having answers to threats. I generally find that if I can resolve a T4 teachings without dying the next turn, then I am pretty solid for the rest of the game.
@kaelfros:
I'm playing electrolyze and volcanic fallout mainly to beat affinity. I usually side those out for anger against decks with bigger creatures. On a semi-related note: do you guys think black sun's zenith is a good alternative for damnation? Neither allows regeneration, and BSZ is better at killing kitchen finks while damnation is better at killing bigger stuff.
Can we bring the discussion back to this? Keranos seems to have sidetracked the topic. I think it's way too weak for a 5-drop that bolts every other turn at the most.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
4 steam vents
4 watery grave
4 blood crypt
2 creeping Tar pit
2 lavaclaw reaches
1 dragonskull summit
1 drowned catacomb
2 sulfur falls
3 island
2 swamp
Instants (19)
2 Counterflux
1 echoing truth
2 electrolyze
1 far//away
4 lightning bolt
2 mana leak
2 mystical teachings
1 remand
1 suffer the past
1 terminate
1 think twice
1 volcanic fallout
4 augur of bolas
2 snapcaster mage
1 teferi, mage of zhalfir
Sorcery (9)
2 cruel ultimatum
1 dreadbore
4 inquisition of kozilek
Planeswalker
1 jace, architect of thought
1 illness in the ranks
1 consume the meek
3 rakdos charm
1 suffer the past
1 tribute to hunger
2 anger of the gods
2 slaughter games
2 sowing salt
1 stone rain
1 echoing truth
I'm on the fence about Teferi and Jace right now, some games they do work and other ones they are dead draws. I can't afford fetches or cryptic right now. I'd like to get a playset of serum visions to smooth my draws (I seem to get screwed or flooded quite a bit), but otherwise the deck has been doing well on cockatrice.
I really agree with this, alchemy is really good. I cut electrolyze for it after the new unbans, hurts the affinity and Merfolk matches in some situations but the heaping load of consistency gets you out of so many situations and grants nearly unlimited reach. I'd rather stick with a consistent deck with alchemy as the glue than play teachings, it's too slow. At 4cmc is rather be playing snapcaster, damnation, or cc
@kaelfros:
I'm playing electrolyze and volcanic fallout mainly to beat affinity. I usually side those out for anger against decks with bigger creatures. On a semi-related note: do you guys think black sun's zenith is a good alternative for damnation? Neither allows regeneration, and BSZ is better at killing kitchen finks while damnation is better at killing bigger stuff.
Anyway, I have to say that: Slaughter Pact (which was a 1 of) was astonishingly good. The ability to tap out on my turn if I want to (for Jace or man land attack) without fearing a combo from them is just great for this deck. I might have a draw-go list overall but slaughter pact was game changing always.
Shadow of Doubt was also an all star. It was dead only against faeries. I got to screw my jund opponent on lands and I managed to stop both pod decks from going off. I play 2 main board and I wouldn't consider cutting them.
Anger of the Gods was not that impressive to be honest, damnations were enough and everytime I drew AotG, it ended up being a dead card.
Jace, Architect of Thought was decent but he was mostly a "secure win" card rather than producing advantage. Unless I had slaughter pact up I didn't want to cast him turns 4-6 (which is when he is needed to produce a decent advantage). Baby Jace never came up so I cannot comment.
Think Twice is nuts.
Threads of Disloyalty was a one of in my SB and it is the best thing that ever happened to my SB. Because I play an almost 0 permanent list (well, only Jace, baby jace, 2 snappys) everyone removed their creature hate so I ended up borrowing ppls goyfs and oozes to win them.
I had a batterskull SB which ended up getting in to almost every MU so I might just bring it in mainboard.
UB Faeries (15-6-0)
UWR Control (10-5-1)/Kiki Control/Midrange/Harbinger
UBR Cruel Control (6-4-0)/Grixis Control/Delver/Blue Jund
UWB Control/Mentor
UW Miracles/Control (currently active, 14-2-0)
BW Eldrazi & Taxes
RW Burn (9-1-0)
I do (academic) research on video games and archaeology! You can check out my open access book here: https://www.sidestone.com/books/the-interactive-past
His effect is worth it, I think. And he comes down 3/4 turns before a cruel does as well. As with all things, he will need testing. I'm very tempted by his indestructible nature.
Edit: why isn't squelch being looked at in place of shadow of doubt?
Being 100% honest, this sounds terrible. Keranos is perhaps a decent card for standard, and may be fringe modern playable, but there is absolutely no way it would be worth warping an entire archetype around.
If you're going to devote your entire deck to make one card good in modern, you really need that card to be much higher impact than keranos, instead of something that's just an incremental advantage engine like he is.
UBRGrixis ControlUBR | URPhoenixUR | UWMiraclesUW |GBRJundGBR | UBFaeriesUB | UBWAd NauseumUBW |GBRWBlueless ShadowGBRW |
MTGA
UBRGrixis ControlUBR | UTempoU
UB Faeries (15-6-0)
UWR Control (10-5-1)/Kiki Control/Midrange/Harbinger
UBR Cruel Control (6-4-0)/Grixis Control/Delver/Blue Jund
UWB Control/Mentor
UW Miracles/Control (currently active, 14-2-0)
BW Eldrazi & Taxes
RW Burn (9-1-0)
I do (academic) research on video games and archaeology! You can check out my open access book here: https://www.sidestone.com/books/the-interactive-past
Can we bring the discussion back to this? Keranos seems to have sidetracked the topic. I think it's way too weak for a 5-drop that bolts every other turn at the most.