Death's Shadow is good for the format, but it seems like an easy target for bans. Not only is it 12%+ of the metagame, it has "supplanted" other black strategies (traditional Jund, etc). It's too easy to take the Splinter Twin ban explanation and just replace it with Death's Shadow.
But Death's Shadow was just printed in Modern Masters. Banning it a month after release looks really bad, so I think Street Wraith is a more likely target. It's similar to Gitaxian Probe, and there's an argument for just banning all zero mana cantrips.
I'm closely watching Amonkhet spoilers. The set was designed before the rise of Death's Shadow. Another card similar to Street Wraith could make the deck even better and cause Wizards to act preemptively.
Death's Shadow is good for the format, but it seems like an easy target for bans. Not only is it 12%+ of the metagame, it has "supplanted" other black strategies (traditional Jund, etc). It's too easy to take the Splinter Twin ban explanation and just replace it with Death's Shadow.
But Death's Shadow was just printed in Modern Masters. Banning it a month after release looks really bad, so I think Street Wraith is a more likely target. It's similar to Gitaxian Probe, and there's an argument for just banning all zero mana cantrips.
I'm closely watching Amonkhet spoilers. The set was designed before the rise of Death's Shadow. Another card similar to Street Wraith could make the deck even better and cause Wizards to act preemptively.
The same thing happened with Twin though. Twin was printed in MM15 and then banned 3 months later - so don't lean too much on that. I'm hoping that WoTC went down the 'control route' with cycling this time around so that nothing busted gets printed for Death's Shadow. I also advocate for unbanning BBE - unbanning BBE would give people a serious reason to consider traditional Jund builds over Death's Shadow builds. BBE by no means deserves to be on that banlist.
I also think that unbanning SFM might incentivize Abzan/Esper players to move away from the Abzan/Esper DS builds. It's all about providing options for people, not eliminating them.
Death's Shadow is good for the format, but it seems like an easy target for bans. Not only is it 12%+ of the metagame, it has "supplanted" other black strategies (traditional Jund, etc). It's too easy to take the Splinter Twin ban explanation and just replace it with Death's Shadow.
But Death's Shadow was just printed in Modern Masters. Banning it a month after release looks really bad, so I think Street Wraith is a more likely target. It's similar to Gitaxian Probe, and there's an argument for just banning all zero mana cantrips.
I'm closely watching Amonkhet spoilers. The set was designed before the rise of Death's Shadow. Another card similar to Street Wraith could make the deck even better and cause Wizards to act preemptively.
The same thing happened with Twin though. Twin was printed in MM15 and then banned 3 months later - so don't lean too much on that. I'm hoping that WoTC went down the 'control route' with cycling this time around so that nothing busted gets printed for Death's Shadow. I also advocate for unbanning BBE - unbanning BBE would give people a serious reason to consider traditional Jund builds over Death's Shadow builds. BBE by no means deserves to be on that banlist.
I also think that unbanning SFM might incentivize Abzan/Esper players to move away from the Abzan/Esper DS builds. It's all about providing options for people, not eliminating them.
Modern Masters 2015 was released May 2015. Splinter Twin was banned January 2016, 8 months later. I agree it isn't a long time, but it's still a lot longer than just a month.
So what do people expect for the next B&R announcement? Didn't Aaron mention that he was specifically going to address the state of blue-based control in modern? If so, do you think this would be accompanied by an unban, or do you think he'll hint at spells coming down the pipeline that might help this archetype?
I personally want Preordain. I need a good cantrip in this format, but I'm not selfish enough to ask for Ponder.
Right now I predict that they ban Shadow and unban nothing, it seems to be what they like to do. What I would LIKE to see is Preordain and BBE unbanned, then i would like a really good counterspell in this set or the next, then i would like Wizards to leave this format alone until at least the winter set (are they doing that? i can't find the release schedule past Hour?) if they think we are doing good and want to unban something else, and to stay away from any further bans unless something becomes truly and stupidly broken. I do not mean Treasure Delver, or pod, or Twin, or DRS Jund none of them was truly broken, I mean something like Eldrazi Winter again. Preordain is probably the card i most want
I agree with everything you're saying, except for Pod and Treasure Cruise Delver not being too good for Modern. I'm *****ting myself in expectations that they'll ban Death's Shadow if it sits at 12%+ for the next 3 months. My unbans would be BBE, SFM and Preordain.
I played against both of them, I was never in a situation that i thought was hopeless. No matter the toys it got, Pod was still an absolute punching bag for Tron, and Cruise Delver had a rough time with that deck as well. once that was established, Tron is easy enough to beat with other decks. I didn't see either deck as any worse than Affinity which is still fine, or Twin, which if not for the PT would still be in the format. When I refer to something as too powerful for Modern, I mean a minimum of a huge reduction in diversity over a much longer period of time than Delver or Pod were top dog for, in general I mean a deck that is 'play this or the anti-this' with no reason to play something else, the last one I can think of was full power Eldrazi, and even against that I had a pretty good record with Tron (but it did need to go, wish Temple had eaten the ban instead). the other thing people forget about Pod was that it became so popular because it beat Delver over the head most of the time. After Cruise was banned, Pod was also gone, they didn't see if one dead deck was enough, and the other Delve spell (blanking on the name) never DID anything major in Modern, it was banned without a chance. I didn't play Delver or Pod, but i did nearly quit Modern, that situation couldn't have been handled any worse if that had been the goal. If Wizards isn't going to test for Modern even a little bit, it would at least be nice if they had someone who really knows the format having a voice in ban discussions, they show no understanding of the format
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Project Booster Fun makes it less fun to open a booster.
And CoCo decks where very popular with players, but like anything its own success fueled its mounting desire to just see it rotate out.
Popular with the people who played it. It was an extremely powerful creature focused deck that defeated anything matched up against it.
Of course, your comment could be used for literally any deck. "Esper Dragons was very popular with players, but like anything its own success made people dislike it."
So what do people expect for the next B&R announcement? Didn't Aaron mention that he was specifically going to address the state of blue-based control in modern? If so, do you think this would be accompanied by an unban, or do you think he'll hint at spells coming down the pipeline that might help this archetype?
I personally want Preordain. I need a good cantrip in this format, but I'm not selfish enough to ask for Ponder.
Ponder is never getting unbanned. Preordain won't come off either, with the excuse (as spsiegel1987 noted) is that Grixis Shadow is preying on top decks.
Yes my comment could be applied to most any competitive deck, which was kind of the point as the other poster was implying that it was some hated deck which also can be applied to any deck.
i feel like faeries doing well might be a sign of blue getting better. this might hinder any change that a banlist update would fix because "there is no issue"...although we still need another push in the right direction. It might be another situation of no changes at best, at worst we have a banning of something in the death's shadow decks that puts blue back down a peg due to the lack of a predator in the metagame cycle. I think if innovative thinking prevails we might see a corrective unban that gives blue control more matchups to prey upon, but I doubt it. If they do ban something from death's shadow Im guessing that the looming ban of something from big mana would eventually be next. But with the current state of modern I think they hope to keep printing good cards that help out...which I prefer (our perspective of wizards is that they are just too scared to take risks in standard, but frequent checks of the banlist in standard and modern might change that).
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Decks I have in my bag of tricks- Needless to say, someone who wants to play will probably have a deck UB/x Faeries UR Storm XURWB Affinity G Elves UW control
I played against both of them, I was never in a situation that i thought was hopeless. No matter the toys it got, Pod was still an absolute punching bag for Tron, and Cruise Delver had a rough time with that deck as well. once that was established, Tron is easy enough to beat with other decks. I didn't see either deck as any worse than Affinity which is still fine, or Twin, which if not for the PT would still be in the format. When I refer to something as too powerful for Modern, I mean a minimum of a huge reduction in diversity over a much longer period of time than Delver or Pod were top dog for, in general I mean a deck that is 'play this or the anti-this' with no reason to play something else, the last one I can think of was full power Eldrazi, and even against that I had a pretty good record with Tron (but it did need to go, wish Temple had eaten the ban instead). the other thing people forget about Pod was that it became so popular because it beat Delver over the head most of the time. After Cruise was banned, Pod was also gone, they didn't see if one dead deck was enough, and the other Delve spell (blanking on the name) never DID anything major in Modern, it was banned without a chance. I didn't play Delver or Pod, but i did nearly quit Modern, that situation couldn't have been handled any worse if that had been the goal. If Wizards isn't going to test for Modern even a little bit, it would at least be nice if they had someone who really knows the format having a voice in ban discussions, they show no understanding of the format
Looking back, they never should have banned Pod and Twin. They took all the skill intensive/interactive decks out of the format. The decks were fun to play with and against. I really miss those decks. Modern still doesn't feel like modern without those 2 decks.
When I refer to something as too powerful for Modern, I mean a minimum of a huge reduction in diversity over a much longer period of time than Delver or Pod were top dog for, in general I mean a deck that is 'play this or the anti-this' with no reason to play something else, the last one I can think of was full power Eldrazi
Well, that's the only deck in the history of Modern that did that to the format. It completely broke the format in half. Other decks have heavily bent the format, though, the most notable being DRS + BBE Jund, Pod, and TC Delver. I wasn't playing at the beginning of the format, so I can't speak for the early bans, but those are the only decks in my playing time that clearly needed nerfing, besides Eldrazi. Twin and Dredge I think were borderline and could have gone either way, and although I think the Probe ban has been a net positive, it wasn't really aimed at one particular deck.
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Modern UBR Grixis Shadow UBR UR Izzet Phoenix UR UW UW Control UW GB GB Rock GB
Commander BG Meren of Clan Nel Toth BG BGUW Atraxa, Praetor's Voice BGUW
Looking back, they never should have banned Pod and Twin. They took all the skill intensive/interactive decks out of the format. The decks were fun to play with and against. I really miss those decks. Modern still doesn't feel like modern without those 2 decks.
I think Twin they could still bring back if they do something like ban Exarch. Pod, though, is more problematic. I don't remember the card, but there was something printed recently that someone realized goes infinite with Birthing Pod on like turn 3 or something.
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Modern UBR Grixis Shadow UBR UR Izzet Phoenix UR UW UW Control UW GB GB Rock GB
Commander BG Meren of Clan Nel Toth BG BGUW Atraxa, Praetor's Voice BGUW
1. Eldrazi with Eye of Ugin was undisputedly the strongest deck that Modern has ever had and you'll be hard pressed to find anyone who disagrees if they're being honest with themselves. You can still play it in No Banned List Modern and still hang with the Mental Misstep and Skullclamp decks. It's that strong.
2. Pod and Treasure Cruise needed to be banned, although they could have waited 1 more announcement for Pod. Perhaps more proof that it needed a ban would happen. Treasure Cruise is just a busted card. Take it from someone who plays turn 2-3 decks in Modern and whose favorite card of all time is Ancestral Recall. Treasure Cruise is arguable better because it's tougher to counter and you can play 4. I was upset that Birthing Pod was banned too soon, but Siege Rhino pushed that deck too much and it simply was the best "fair" deck that had game vs. anything.
3. Deathrite Shaman could have been banned an announcement later in my opinion. I know decks became Ajundi and GB DRS/Tec Edge, but I don't feel that we had enough time to adjust. I could certainly be wrong here.
4. Twin was a good banning in the long run. In the short run, it was terrible and set a new precedent that Modern players hadn't seen before. Summer Bloom just needed to be banned because its natural predator in Twin was going to be gone. And yes, a few people had 2-3 Amulet of Vigor in play on turn 1 on camera. Yes.
5. Golgari Grave-Troll needed to be banned. It was an excellent banning that didn't kill the deck by any stretch of the imagination. It just slowed down a deck that felt nearly Tier 0 to me. It honestly felt Tier 0.75 if there is such a thing. Gitaxian Probe is a terrible ban aimed at hurting Become Immense decks, which it did. But Become Immense could have been banned instead. I could be convinced that Probe is a solid banning because Death's Shadow would be that much more powerful. But that's it.
6. Banning Death's Shadow now is not necessary. More time is needed and a few unbans are also needed. Mishra's Bauble being banned would be stupid and Street Wraith would be nearly as stupid. Bauble is one of those bans that could convince me to quit Modern; that's how idiotic it would be. The only person I saw who suggested this was someone who didn't own them and didn't want to pay for them. That's it.
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Legacy - Sneak Show, BR Reanimator, Miracles, UW Stoneblade
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/ Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander - Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build) (dead format for me)
Death's Shadow is good for the format, but it seems like an easy target for bans. Not only is it 12%+ of the metagame, it has "supplanted" other black strategies (traditional Jund, etc). It's too easy to take the Splinter Twin ban explanation and just replace it with Death's Shadow.
But Death's Shadow was just printed in Modern Masters. Banning it a month after release looks really bad, so I think Street Wraith is a more likely target. It's similar to Gitaxian Probe, and there's an argument for just banning all zero mana cantrips.
I'm closely watching Amonkhet spoilers. The set was designed before the rise of Death's Shadow. Another card similar to Street Wraith could make the deck even better and cause Wizards to act preemptively.
The same thing happened with Twin though. Twin was printed in MM15 and then banned 3 months later - so don't lean too much on that. I'm hoping that WoTC went down the 'control route' with cycling this time around so that nothing busted gets printed for Death's Shadow. I also advocate for unbanning BBE - unbanning BBE would give people a serious reason to consider traditional Jund builds over Death's Shadow builds. BBE by no means deserves to be on that banlist.
I also think that unbanning SFM might incentivize Abzan/Esper players to move away from the Abzan/Esper DS builds. It's all about providing options for people, not eliminating them.
Modern Masters 2015 was released May 2015. Splinter Twin was banned January 2016, 8 months later. I agree it isn't a long time, but it's still a lot longer than just a month.
Long enough to have people spend more than $1,000 building up a deck that was supposedly "safe."
Wizards has no regards for any deck and can ban anything for any reason. It's been the norm in Modern for years and has been shown from recent Standard announcements that they don't even really need solid justifications anymore. No deck is safe. Whether or not I think Wizards will actually go through with banning something out of Death's Shadow decks, almost all of their past actions tell us it's not only possible, but highly likely.
You summed it up pretty well. While I still believe it'd be absurd for WoTC to even consider a ban, aimed at nerfing DS decks, this early in the deck's lifecycle, it'd be amusing to watch them ban DS itself for the sole reason that it just saw a re-print. Yes, there's already the precedent case of Twin's ban post-MM15, but that's why I think they'd target a support card and not DS itself; just to save face and avoid the embarrassment.
So they went out and did a slightly worse Miscalculation.
1U
Instant
Counter target spell unless its controller pays {1}.
Cycling U
Is it just me or they really tried to not make it good? I doubt it will see play but counters in general are lacking in quality... What do you guys think?
I think it is bad and they should feel bad for making such a card. It is a matter of fact, I think at least, that they DON'T want any form of unconditional counters below 3 mana.
Now they showed that 1 mana by the opponent is the cost for counter all on 2 mana. I don't think even flipping Rune Snag could make it in today's STD. It saddens me a ton but I have 0 hopes that a good counter will be printed in the foreseeable future. Blue based control decks will only be buffed via unban (JTMS or Preordain) or via non-blue cards that slot into existing control strategies (i.e. K. Command, Tasigur etc).
They are not going to ban anything from the Shadow decks in the next upcoming announcement, it's way the hell too soon. Dredge was dominating far more for much longer before they banned GGT. While there's a lot of flavors of Shadow, modern is booming right now, with tons of variety and interactive matches. I haven't loved modern this much since Twin was around, it's not just solitaire decks dominating the tables.
POD is never, ever getting unbanned. Rhino broke the deck, and it legit constricts printing creatures.
Treasure cruise/DTT is absurd
Eye of Ugin in Eldrazi was a legacy power level deck in modern
DRS is never seeing the light of day in modern
I have zero hope in WOTC and expect a no change, but I still am pushing for a dual SFM/Preordain unban. Have you guys been seeing the UW Control decks popping up to prey on Shadow and other midrange decks? You think players wouldn't love an SFM to keep the meta honest? If UW Control becomes a thing, people aren't going to flock to Shadow in droves, which means combo/ramp and aggro get a shot as well.
Hell, man, you could unban BBE for Temur/Mardu/Jund to become real decks, and unban Twin in the process that would have so much prey for it it wouldn't even be funny
Of course WOTC would never do such a thing, but I honestly think the meta could afford it with the way it's looking right now.
They are not going to ban anything from the Shadow decks in the next upcoming announcement, it's way the hell too soon. Dredge was dominating far more for much longer before they banned GGT. While there's a lot of flavors of Shadow, modern is booming right now, with tons of variety and interactive matches. I haven't loved modern this much since Twin was around, it's not just solitaire decks dominating the tables.
POD is never, ever getting unbanned. Rhino broke the deck, and it legit constricts printing creatures.
Treasure cruise/DTT is absurd
Eye of Ugin in Eldrazi was a legacy power level deck in modern
DRS is never seeing the light of day in modern
I have zero hope in WOTC and expect a no change, but I still am pushing for a dual SFM/Preordain unban. Have you guys been seeing the UW Control decks popping up to prey on Shadow and other midrange decks? You think players wouldn't love an SFM to keep the meta honest? If UW Control becomes a thing, people aren't going to flock to Shadow in droves, which means combo/ramp and aggro get a shot as well.
Hell, man, you could unban BBE for Temur/Mardu/Jund to become real decks, and unban Twin in the process that would have so much prey for it it wouldn't even be funny
Of course WOTC would never do such a thing, but I honestly think the meta could afford it with the way it's looking right now.
While I doubt that Wizards will ever unban it, what proof do you have that Dig Through Time is broken in Modern?
This again? DTT is broken in Modern to the extent that you can dig anywhere between 15% and 20% of your deck at any given point and pick the two best cards you need, at instant speed. It is too strong of card draw for UU. At that point, if we had to choose which card were to be unbanned, Id prefer Preordain.
This again? DTT is broken in Modern to the extent that you can dig anywhere between 15% and 20% of your deck at any given point and pick the two best cards you need, at instant speed. It is too strong of card draw for UU. At that point, if we had to choose which card were to be unbanned, Id prefer Preordain.
Digging 15-20% of your deck, end of turn, instant speed, for 2 cards sounds not broken to you? Ok.
The card would have absolutely been used after TC
Dig would have been used more after Cruise, but I doubt that it would have been broken. It couldn't be played in Burn since it requires too much blue mana, it wouldn't work that well in UR Delver as a Cruise replacement since finding 2 cards for 2 mana in the top 7 is far worse than drawing 3 cards for 1 mana when you are simply trying to simply play a lot of spells, it wouldn't work well in Grixis Delver since most of Grixis Delver's big threats use delve, and it wouldn't fit into Infect since Infect prefers Become Immense. The only decks that Dig would make significantly better are RUG Scapeshift, Blue Death's Shadow decks, Esper and Jeskai Control, and Jeskai and RUG Delver, all of which are decks that would be good for the format, as well as Storm and Ad Nauseum (which Dig would make more consistent, but probably not much faster). What would Dig break? Don't just say that it is too strong because it is an amazing card. Of course it is an amazing card. So is Tarmogoyf. So is Lightning Bolt. So is Fatal Push. So is Snapcaster Mage. So is Path to Exile. So is Death's Shadow. So is Arcbound Ravager. So are the Tron lands. So is Cranial Plating. So is Eldrazi Temple. Modern is filled with amazing cards, but that doesn't necessarily make them broken. So, how specifically would Dig break the format?
So they went out and did a slightly worse Miscalculation.
1U
Instant
Counter target spell unless its controller pays {1}.
Cycling U
Is it just me or they really tried to not make it good? I doubt it will see play but counters in general are lacking in quality... What do you guys think?
Almost certainly not good enough for Modern, but apparently 'so good' for Standard (along with Essence Scatter - great vs Vehicles and Embalm!) that WotC felt the need to create Prowling Serpopod!? Disappointing to see another mechanic that could be great for a Modern-playable counterspell go to waste (Revolt: n.a.; Cycling: this). We'll see if anything else comes up in Amonkhet (which I doubt) or Hour of Devastation (based on trends, doubtful).
* * *
On the other hand, Pull from Tomorrow seems like a pretty strong draw spell, especially for Grixis/Sultai/etc. control-ish shells. With the discard, it's the same mana cost per card as Sphinx's Revelation, but is one less mana total, and helps with graveyard synergies (Delve, Delirium, Tarmogoyf) -- and you often have to discard with a large Sphinx's Revelation at the end of turn anyway. I'm not sure whether Grixis Control (for example) would want this card over Ancestral Vision, but it seems like a strong contender, at least.
So they went out and did a slightly worse Miscalculation.
1U
Instant
Counter target spell unless its controller pays {1}.
Cycling U
Is it just me or they really tried to not make it good? I doubt it will see play but counters in general are lacking in quality... What do you guys think?
Almost certainly not good enough for Modern, but apparently 'so good' for Standard (along with Essence Scatter - great vs Vehicles and Embalm!) that WotC felt the need to create Prowling Serpopod!? Disappointing to see another mechanic that could be great for a Modern-playable counterspell go to waste (Revolt: n.a.; Cycling: this). We'll see if anything else comes up in Amonkhet (which I doubt) or Hour of Devastation (based on trends, doubtful).
To be fair, while I also wish that we had gotten a stronger counterspell, Censor will hopefully be good with Drake Haven in Standard.
But Death's Shadow was just printed in Modern Masters. Banning it a month after release looks really bad, so I think Street Wraith is a more likely target. It's similar to Gitaxian Probe, and there's an argument for just banning all zero mana cantrips.
I'm closely watching Amonkhet spoilers. The set was designed before the rise of Death's Shadow. Another card similar to Street Wraith could make the deck even better and cause Wizards to act preemptively.
The same thing happened with Twin though. Twin was printed in MM15 and then banned 3 months later - so don't lean too much on that. I'm hoping that WoTC went down the 'control route' with cycling this time around so that nothing busted gets printed for Death's Shadow. I also advocate for unbanning BBE - unbanning BBE would give people a serious reason to consider traditional Jund builds over Death's Shadow builds. BBE by no means deserves to be on that banlist.
I also think that unbanning SFM might incentivize Abzan/Esper players to move away from the Abzan/Esper DS builds. It's all about providing options for people, not eliminating them.
Modern Masters 2015 was released May 2015. Splinter Twin was banned January 2016, 8 months later. I agree it isn't a long time, but it's still a lot longer than just a month.
I played against both of them, I was never in a situation that i thought was hopeless. No matter the toys it got, Pod was still an absolute punching bag for Tron, and Cruise Delver had a rough time with that deck as well. once that was established, Tron is easy enough to beat with other decks. I didn't see either deck as any worse than Affinity which is still fine, or Twin, which if not for the PT would still be in the format. When I refer to something as too powerful for Modern, I mean a minimum of a huge reduction in diversity over a much longer period of time than Delver or Pod were top dog for, in general I mean a deck that is 'play this or the anti-this' with no reason to play something else, the last one I can think of was full power Eldrazi, and even against that I had a pretty good record with Tron (but it did need to go, wish Temple had eaten the ban instead). the other thing people forget about Pod was that it became so popular because it beat Delver over the head most of the time. After Cruise was banned, Pod was also gone, they didn't see if one dead deck was enough, and the other Delve spell (blanking on the name) never DID anything major in Modern, it was banned without a chance. I didn't play Delver or Pod, but i did nearly quit Modern, that situation couldn't have been handled any worse if that had been the goal. If Wizards isn't going to test for Modern even a little bit, it would at least be nice if they had someone who really knows the format having a voice in ban discussions, they show no understanding of the format
Yes my comment could be applied to most any competitive deck, which was kind of the point as the other poster was implying that it was some hated deck which also can be applied to any deck.
UB/x Faeries
UR Storm
XURWB Affinity
G Elves
UW control
Looking back, they never should have banned Pod and Twin. They took all the skill intensive/interactive decks out of the format. The decks were fun to play with and against. I really miss those decks. Modern still doesn't feel like modern without those 2 decks.
Well, that's the only deck in the history of Modern that did that to the format. It completely broke the format in half. Other decks have heavily bent the format, though, the most notable being DRS + BBE Jund, Pod, and TC Delver. I wasn't playing at the beginning of the format, so I can't speak for the early bans, but those are the only decks in my playing time that clearly needed nerfing, besides Eldrazi. Twin and Dredge I think were borderline and could have gone either way, and although I think the Probe ban has been a net positive, it wasn't really aimed at one particular deck.
UBR Grixis Shadow UBR
UR Izzet Phoenix UR
UW UW Control UW
GB GB Rock GB
Commander
BG Meren of Clan Nel Toth BG
BGUW Atraxa, Praetor's Voice BGUW
I think Twin they could still bring back if they do something like ban Exarch. Pod, though, is more problematic. I don't remember the card, but there was something printed recently that someone realized goes infinite with Birthing Pod on like turn 3 or something.
UBR Grixis Shadow UBR
UR Izzet Phoenix UR
UW UW Control UW
GB GB Rock GB
Commander
BG Meren of Clan Nel Toth BG
BGUW Atraxa, Praetor's Voice BGUW
2. Pod and Treasure Cruise needed to be banned, although they could have waited 1 more announcement for Pod. Perhaps more proof that it needed a ban would happen. Treasure Cruise is just a busted card. Take it from someone who plays turn 2-3 decks in Modern and whose favorite card of all time is Ancestral Recall. Treasure Cruise is arguable better because it's tougher to counter and you can play 4. I was upset that Birthing Pod was banned too soon, but Siege Rhino pushed that deck too much and it simply was the best "fair" deck that had game vs. anything.
3. Deathrite Shaman could have been banned an announcement later in my opinion. I know decks became Ajundi and GB DRS/Tec Edge, but I don't feel that we had enough time to adjust. I could certainly be wrong here.
4. Twin was a good banning in the long run. In the short run, it was terrible and set a new precedent that Modern players hadn't seen before. Summer Bloom just needed to be banned because its natural predator in Twin was going to be gone. And yes, a few people had 2-3 Amulet of Vigor in play on turn 1 on camera. Yes.
5. Golgari Grave-Troll needed to be banned. It was an excellent banning that didn't kill the deck by any stretch of the imagination. It just slowed down a deck that felt nearly Tier 0 to me. It honestly felt Tier 0.75 if there is such a thing. Gitaxian Probe is a terrible ban aimed at hurting Become Immense decks, which it did. But Become Immense could have been banned instead. I could be convinced that Probe is a solid banning because Death's Shadow would be that much more powerful. But that's it.
6. Banning Death's Shadow now is not necessary. More time is needed and a few unbans are also needed. Mishra's Bauble being banned would be stupid and Street Wraith would be nearly as stupid. Bauble is one of those bans that could convince me to quit Modern; that's how idiotic it would be. The only person I saw who suggested this was someone who didn't own them and didn't want to pay for them. That's it.
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/
Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander -
Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build)(dead format for me)Long enough to have people spend more than $1,000 building up a deck that was supposedly "safe."
Wizards has no regards for any deck and can ban anything for any reason. It's been the norm in Modern for years and has been shown from recent Standard announcements that they don't even really need solid justifications anymore. No deck is safe. Whether or not I think Wizards will actually go through with banning something out of Death's Shadow decks, almost all of their past actions tell us it's not only possible, but highly likely.
UR ....... WUBR ........... WB ............. RGW ........ UBR ....... WUB .... BGU
Spells / Blink & Combo / Token Grind / Dino Tribal / Draw Cards / Zombies / Reanimate
It's crazy that people are talking about bans in DSx decks like the deck has been kicking ass and taking names for a solid year or something.
Link to Discord server where anybody from MTGS can keep up with thread topics while everything is being sorted out with the new site.
Now they showed that 1 mana by the opponent is the cost for counter all on 2 mana. I don't think even flipping Rune Snag could make it in today's STD. It saddens me a ton but I have 0 hopes that a good counter will be printed in the foreseeable future. Blue based control decks will only be buffed via unban (JTMS or Preordain) or via non-blue cards that slot into existing control strategies (i.e. K. Command, Tasigur etc).
UB Faeries (15-6-0)
UWR Control (10-5-1)/Kiki Control/Midrange/Harbinger
UBR Cruel Control (6-4-0)/Grixis Control/Delver/Blue Jund
UWB Control/Mentor
UW Miracles/Control (currently active, 14-2-0)
BW Eldrazi & Taxes
RW Burn (9-1-0)
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POD is never, ever getting unbanned. Rhino broke the deck, and it legit constricts printing creatures.
Treasure cruise/DTT is absurd
Eye of Ugin in Eldrazi was a legacy power level deck in modern
DRS is never seeing the light of day in modern
I have zero hope in WOTC and expect a no change, but I still am pushing for a dual SFM/Preordain unban. Have you guys been seeing the UW Control decks popping up to prey on Shadow and other midrange decks? You think players wouldn't love an SFM to keep the meta honest? If UW Control becomes a thing, people aren't going to flock to Shadow in droves, which means combo/ramp and aggro get a shot as well.
Hell, man, you could unban BBE for Temur/Mardu/Jund to become real decks, and unban Twin in the process that would have so much prey for it it wouldn't even be funny
Of course WOTC would never do such a thing, but I honestly think the meta could afford it with the way it's looking right now.
While I doubt that Wizards will ever unban it, what proof do you have that Dig Through Time is broken in Modern?
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
RUG Temur Deprive Delver
BUG Sultai Deprive Delver
The card would have absolutely been used after TC
I hope for no bans, I think that the meta feels quite healthy right now, and even if a UW build has to be narrow to work, that's fine to me.
I don't even want to play control, I'm a combo/tempo guy and I can't change that, but I want control to exist, and I want it viable.
That worse miscalculation is an affront btw. The design for limited/standard garbage we get is what will kill this game.
Spirits
Dig would have been used more after Cruise, but I doubt that it would have been broken. It couldn't be played in Burn since it requires too much blue mana, it wouldn't work that well in UR Delver as a Cruise replacement since finding 2 cards for 2 mana in the top 7 is far worse than drawing 3 cards for 1 mana when you are simply trying to simply play a lot of spells, it wouldn't work well in Grixis Delver since most of Grixis Delver's big threats use delve, and it wouldn't fit into Infect since Infect prefers Become Immense. The only decks that Dig would make significantly better are RUG Scapeshift, Blue Death's Shadow decks, Esper and Jeskai Control, and Jeskai and RUG Delver, all of which are decks that would be good for the format, as well as Storm and Ad Nauseum (which Dig would make more consistent, but probably not much faster). What would Dig break? Don't just say that it is too strong because it is an amazing card. Of course it is an amazing card. So is Tarmogoyf. So is Lightning Bolt. So is Fatal Push. So is Snapcaster Mage. So is Path to Exile. So is Death's Shadow. So is Arcbound Ravager. So are the Tron lands. So is Cranial Plating. So is Eldrazi Temple. Modern is filled with amazing cards, but that doesn't necessarily make them broken. So, how specifically would Dig break the format?
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
Almost certainly not good enough for Modern, but apparently 'so good' for Standard (along with Essence Scatter - great vs Vehicles and Embalm!) that WotC felt the need to create Prowling Serpopod!? Disappointing to see another mechanic that could be great for a Modern-playable counterspell go to waste (Revolt: n.a.; Cycling: this). We'll see if anything else comes up in Amonkhet (which I doubt) or Hour of Devastation (based on trends, doubtful).
* * *
On the other hand, Pull from Tomorrow seems like a pretty strong draw spell, especially for Grixis/Sultai/etc. control-ish shells. With the discard, it's the same mana cost per card as Sphinx's Revelation, but is one less mana total, and helps with graveyard synergies (Delve, Delirium, Tarmogoyf) -- and you often have to discard with a large Sphinx's Revelation at the end of turn anyway. I'm not sure whether Grixis Control (for example) would want this card over Ancestral Vision, but it seems like a strong contender, at least.
If it does stay at that point, it probably will get hit with a ban. IIRC, that is the meta share that BGx had when DRS was banned.
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
To be fair, while I also wish that we had gotten a stronger counterspell, Censor will hopefully be good with Drake Haven in Standard.
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.