0 mana 2 life draw a card is still available in the form of Street Wraith. If an existing deck cannot replace Probe with Wraith, it means that:
1) It was relying on the information to get an advantage, which infect and (especially) Shadow did to get their advantage and the main point of the card being banned. If your deck relied on this to survive instead of getting an advantage like the two top tier decks, then it's relying on something way too basic/unreliable to begin with. The only reason Shadow is taking a huge hit is because it relied on all similar cards (including said Wraith) so it doesn't have replacements since it's also using them (but like I said that's the intent).
2) It needed the spell cast/storm count. Collateral Damage to Storm and I feel for you, but I guess if there's anything R&D hates more than Dredge, it's Storm (there's a reason the scale is named after it and not Dredge).
1) Sort of, it made my narrow counterspells and removal playable, shoring up a weakness in the card pool rather than breaking anything
3) Got a sorcery in the yard for Goyf and delirium
4) Filled the graveyard for delve and Bedlam Reveler
5) Helped me flip Delver
6) Raised my blue spell count for Disrupting Shoal
Don't talk to me about unfair, I played the fairest deck next to Jund at my LGS, abd it got banned.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
When I hit my 3000 post mark, I'm gone for good.
Stay reasonable, be mindful of your expectations and don't feed the trolls.
the number of people complaining that "only BG/x is safe" astounds me.
right, cause tron got banned (eye was incidental and didn't stop it at all), affinity got banned, literally all control decks got a ban, burn got banned, merfolk got banned, etc. /s
there are tons of 'safe' options that are available to you.
Are you sure? Because the consensus around here seems to be that the first two decks you cite are broken and should not exist in Modern. I've heard numerous people say things like "This was a good ban! Hopefully next time we get Mox Opal and Tron lands." Because of the lack of objective reasons from Wizards, the next round of banmania is going to make me extremely nervous. I've heard Mox Opal, Tron Lands, Simian Spirit Guide, Valakut, all of which make sense on some level if you stretch "too much for free" and then I hear nonsense like Ancient Stirrings and Arcbound Ravager. I think the reasoning is silly, but then I think the reasoning for banning GGT is silly. So with the lack of information and the long list of things that various people want banned, it's not surprising people don't want to get caught holding onto decks in this environment. A surprise ban with sketchy reasoning -- even if the actual affects on the metagame are relatively innocuous -- should worry people. Especially combined with the banning of three cards in Standard (which they rightfully tend to avoid banning things from) Maybe ktknshnx is right and they have good reasons that they suck at articulating, but all I see is an announcement that things don't necessarily need to be putting up insane results to get a ban.
So what's "safe?" I have three decks built, I should be good, right? But two of those three decks are Affinity and Tron, decks that some Modern players don't want to exist in any form. And another is Burn. If Tron goes away, I don't feel very comfortable playing Burn and hoping to draw really well in Jund matchup after Jund matchup.
I know a lot of people pick on Standard as being battlecruiser or superfriends or uninteractive or whatever, and I can certainly see that, but the times I've played Standard I found it fun and engaging. The main issue is I don't have the time and money to do a lot of trading and buying all the time, so I play Modern, where I can buy a few cards at a time and build up a collection of cards that aren't rotating. More bans harms my ability to do that and takes away the main appeal of Modern. I'm not really salty about eating $20 on a set of Gitaxian Probes, but I think it's rational to be nervous going forward when I come to this forum and there's a lot of talk about "ban all the things!" and Wizards' actions suggest that they tend to agree.
Not gonna lie, I'm really, really stroppy about Gitaxian Probe.
I've been putting Suicide Bloo together over the last few months as a way out of the endless rotation of standard (build into a more expensive format! It never rotates!) and the loss of Probe and the intro of Fatal Push is really gonna hurt.
I've tried to turn the saltiness into productivity and I'm trying to think about where to take it next, but my friends aren't helping my mood by saying "Oh, just find something else you like and buy into that instead"
Yeah, cheers. I'll just root around the back of the sofa for ~£1000 and build Jund. It's not like I'm trying to save money for a house or have any other financial commitments or anything.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Modern: UR Storm G Stompy URSuicide Bloo
Commander: (Don't play as much as I'd like) UBPhenax, God of Deception
Bannings will never be based on value of cards. So no card is safe because "its so valuable, people would quit if it was banned".
Except maybe Lighting Bolt.
Tarmogoyf
Thats fair. lol. It would definitely push me out of the game. Though I dont see tarmogoyf getting banned while those huge eldrazi are allowed to roam Modern.
Not gonna lie, I'm really, really stroppy about Gitaxian Probe.
I've been putting Suicide Bloo together over the last few months as a way out of the endless rotation of standard (build into a more expensive format! It never rotates!) and the loss of Probe and the intro of Fatal Push is really gonna hurt.
I've tried to turn the saltiness into productivity and I'm trying to think about where to take it next, but my friends aren't helping my mood by saying "Oh, just find something else you like and buy into that instead"
Yeah, cheers. I'll just root around the back of the sofa for ~£1000 and build Jund. It's not like I'm trying to save money for a house or have any other financial commitments or anything.
As someone suggested, if you dont already use it, Street Wraith
Not gonna lie, I'm really, really stroppy about Gitaxian Probe.
I've been putting Suicide Bloo together over the last few months as a way out of the endless rotation of standard (build into a more expensive format! It never rotates!) and the loss of Probe and the intro of Fatal Push is really gonna hurt.
I've tried to turn the saltiness into productivity and I'm trying to think about where to take it next, but my friends aren't helping my mood by saying "Oh, just find something else you like and buy into that instead"
Yeah, cheers. I'll just root around the back of the sofa for ~£1000 and build Jund. It's not like I'm trying to save money for a house or have any other financial commitments or anything.
As someone suggested, if you dont already use it, Street Wraith
That's a fair shout, but I'll be missing the crucial prowess trigger.
I'm looking at Noxious Revival and Gut shot plus running more cantrips as alternatives.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Modern: UR Storm G Stompy URSuicide Bloo
Commander: (Don't play as much as I'd like) UBPhenax, God of Deception
What i'm having a hard time figuring out is what will happen in March, before MM17.
My initial guess is that there will be a big unban. I've never in my life advocated for unbanning powerful cards like Preordain,Stoneforge,BBE nor Jace. The problem is that this company will try to fight for their customers trust(again). This makes me believe they will unban a potential poster/pillar of the new Modern format.
1) Sort of, it made my narrow counterspells and removal playable, shoring up a weakness in the card pool rather than breaking anything
3) Got a sorcery in the yard for Goyf and delirium
4) Filled the graveyard for delve and Bedlam Reveler
5) Helped me flip Delver
6) Raised my blue spell count for Disrupting Shoal
Don't talk to me about unfair, I played the fairest deck next to Jund at my LGS, abd it got banned.
I didn't say it was unfair, I said it was all collateral. Sure, I didn't think of all the other scenarios that I lumped with Storm (which isn't a good target to lump onto, my apologies), but I think they wanted to neuter both Infect and Shadow at one go and there aren't a lot of 1-card options between the two. The card is just way too flexible there was no way to avoid collateral damage with its removal.
Technically Peek functionally does all the things that Probe does you listed. If a deck needed Peek to be able to be cast for 2 life instead of U then that's unfortunate, because two top tier decks were also using the free cost to their advantage.
Jace/SFM, there will be a huge, negative uproar, combo and aggro players will feel slighted and claim that midrange/fair players are being far too pandered
An SFM/Jace unban needs to be combined with a preordain if WOTC wants to avoid a large backlash
Unbanning Jace AND Preordain at the same time is incredibly dangerous, WOTC won't take the risk
Unbanning SFM alone would cause more people to say, "well, guess I'll buy jund and junk to be safe!"
So the logical march announcement will be: unbanning preordain
The next likely outcome, which I won't hold my breathe for and is unlikely: Preordain and SFM are now unbanned
the number of people complaining that "only BG/x is safe" astounds me.
right, cause tron got banned (eye was incidental and didn't stop it at all), affinity got banned, literally all control decks got a ban, burn got banned, merfolk got banned, etc. /s
there are tons of 'safe' options that are available to you.
Are you sure? Because the consensus around here seems to be that the first two decks you cite are broken and should not exist in Modern. I've heard numerous people say things like "This was a good ban! Hopefully next time we get Mox Opal and Tron lands." Because of the lack of objective reasons from Wizards, the next round of banmania is going to make me extremely nervous. I've heard Mox Opal, Tron Lands, Simian Spirit Guide, Valakut, all of which make sense on some level if you stretch "too much for free" and then I hear nonsense like Ancient Stirrings and Arcbound Ravager. I think the reasoning is silly, but then I think the reasoning for banning GGT is silly. So with the lack of information and the long list of things that various people want banned, it's not surprising people don't want to get caught holding onto decks in this environment. A surprise ban with sketchy reasoning -- even if the actual affects on the metagame are relatively innocuous -- should worry people. Especially combined with the banning of three cards in Standard (which they rightfully tend to avoid banning things from) Maybe ktknshnx is right and they have good reasons that they suck at articulating, but all I see is an announcement that things don't necessarily need to be putting up insane results to get a ban.
So what's "safe?" I have three decks built, I should be good, right? But two of those three decks are Affinity and Tron, decks that some Modern players don't want to exist in any form. And another is Burn. If Tron goes away, I don't feel very comfortable playing Burn and hoping to draw really well in Jund matchup after Jund matchup.
I know a lot of people pick on Standard as being battlecruiser or superfriends or uninteractive or whatever, and I can certainly see that, but the times I've played Standard I found it fun and engaging. The main issue is I don't have the time and money to do a lot of trading and buying all the time, so I play Modern, where I can buy a few cards at a time and build up a collection of cards that aren't rotating. More bans harms my ability to do that and takes away the main appeal of Modern. I'm not really salty about eating $20 on a set of Gitaxian Probes, but I think it's rational to be nervous going forward when I come to this forum and there's a lot of talk about "ban all the things!" and Wizards' actions suggest that they tend to agree.
Stirrings is not a stupid suggestion or an unlikely one
No offense, but you were way off the mark about WOTC's mindset and all of your posts in the other topic were pretty far off
I don't mean it an insult, or an attack on you, it's more that you seem HEAVILY biased towards the combo aspect, and you're out of touch with WOTC's rationale
Until preordain is unbanned, WOTC is clearly showing they don't want cantrips stronger than serum visions, they want serum visions to be the ultimate cantrip in modern
Stirrings digs how many cards deep? It helped enable the egregious Summer Bloom (not that it was the culprit)
It powers up Tron, Eldrazi and Lantern (which WOTC definitely has it out for, but will not take action without it spending considerable time in tier 1)
You are absolutely out of touch if you don't think there's merit in a stirrings ban
Please keep in mind, I am NOT advocating for a stirrings ban or demanding it, I am stating that it has a possibility and realistic chance of it
Second, I don't recall seeing a pro list that eschewed the Probes pre ban. If you're calling them poor to mediocre then I've no clue what to say in response.
Ari Lax played infect without probes from the start.
It's also a green black infect deck. It's also one pro player, so I guess you got me on the technicality aspect. Meanwhile, Turtenwald/Ross/Finkel/Budde/Silvestri/Svi/Huey/Duke/Cuneo all run a set of Probes.
These 2 bans, while logical, are the first collateral damage of TWIN ban.
Modern format is doomed. As soon as Frontier or whatever wizards create with the new frame MODERN is going to die.
Modern was initially conceived to play "legacy" cards without having to buy duals or wastelands of fow. It was an experiment, yes, but it could have been something more important than its today. In my city modern has died, people are leaving magic.
They don't test for modern, that's ok, but, with these 3 bans something very weird and deeply wrong is happening at wizards R&D.
We, the players, have the cards, they, wizards, ban them. When are we going to create a new format without wizards interference?
0Click to like this
It's really cute if you don't think Company, Jace and Fastlands/fetchlands won't receive bans
Frontier is a joke, and it's, "like modern, but affordable!" won't stay like that for long as demand increases
Standard has looked incredibly broken ever since baby Jace came around, I saw every deck playing him and 4 or 5 colors, company decks, and now Emerakul and Gideon decks
All formats have issues, stop crying doom and gloom
And Wizards will ban tron lands when the deck dominates Modern tournaments. Since Wizards wants interactive games and slowed-down games, I can totally see Wizards eviscerating Tron next.
WOTC has been adamant, especially recently to silence any notion of a Jace unban. SFM became the talk of unbans after it was a GP giveaway card. WOTC has also said numerous times that they want Serum Visions to be at the upper end of Modern cantrips and that their design philosophy going forward are cards at the power level of Anticipate.
I wish people would stop using their hopes and desires to justify what they want unbanned. In the Ancestral Vision unban it also took into account that they don't want Bloodbraid elf to be in modern together so please stop pushing that theory merely because you want it to happen.
The list looks like it will stay as it is for now.
I could see Splinter Twin returning at some point. There's also a case to be made for an off-color affinity land to give deck-builders something to try to include. I don't think something like Tree of Tales is going to do anything for affinity. It's just another card which loses to Stony, Shatterstorm, Creeping corrosion, etc, etc. BUT it might make it's way into other decks. It could make Thirst for knowledge more attractive for a midrange deck and there might be some synergy in green, who knows anyway it's not likely to happen but I'm struggling to see a "safe" card.
Jace would be huge issue for midrange decks while does very little against faster decks. He wouldn't do anything positive for Modern, not to mention he's power is above Modern.
Oh, I agree, I don't think Jace would do anything but be a new toy
Preordain and SFM are really the only targets I foresee.
SFM serves slowing aggro down while Preordain helps blue decks find an answer more consistently.
Preordain could power combo decks
and the thought of SFM scares WOTC
It's kinda a crappy place. I don't see SFM as dangerous anymore, regardless
WOTC has been adamant, especially recently to silence any notion of a Jace unban. SFM became the talk of unbans after it was a GP giveaway card. WOTC has also said numerous times that they want Serum Visions to be at the upper end of Modern cantrips and that their design philosophy going forward are cards at the power level of Anticipate.
I wish people would stop using their hopes and desires to justify what they want unbanned. In the Ancestral Vision unban it also took into account that they don't want Bloodbraid elf to be in modern together so please stop pushing that theory merely because you want it to happen.
The list looks like it will stay as it is for now.
I could see Splinter Twin returning at some point. There's also a case to be made for an off-color affinity land to give deck-builders something to try to include. I don't think something like Tree of Tales is going to do anything for affinity. It's just another card which loses to Stony, Shatterstorm, Creeping corrosion, etc, etc. BUT it might make it's way into other decks. It could make Thirst for knowledge more attractive for a midrange deck and there might be some synergy in green, who knows anyway it's not likely to happen but I'm struggling to see a "safe" card.
You see SFM as super unlikely, but Twin having access to lighting bolt, Fatal push, and Tasigur to avoid Fatal Push, with K-command and AV as a SB against GBx as the safer option? Twin's not coming off the list in 2017. I already said it before and I'll say it now, I would eat my foil jund deck on youtube if Twin was announced unbanned this year
So I'm recently back into the game and know a little bit about some of the older cards. Specifically the ones that were banned. I know that probe went into almost every tempo,control, delve deck out there. What did the troll fit in? I'm not too familiar with that card. Does it's banning have as big of an impact as a probe banning? It looks good but it seems like maybe snapcaster or LotV have a stronger following and can definitely change the game more drastically if played correctly and protected well enough and were maybe more deserving of a ban than a card I've heard very little about over the past year or so I've been back in the game.
well, my list of banned decks keeps growing, storm, eggs, bloom, twin, infect, death's shadow, bloo, pyro ascension and jeskai ascendancy. I guess it's my fault for not liking bg/x decks
Twin would have a feast against the predicted meta,
Grixis Twin with Tas, K-command, bolt, fatal push, AV (whether that would be in the mb or sb, I don't know, but it would drown out fair decks)
Blood moon for when naughty midrange decks surface, beating down Valakut and Tron. I think Eldrazi would be the only prey the deck would have
Grixis Twin would be far worse than you'd expect with all the changes now, guys
I would instantly drop my Jund/Junk deck and play a deck that can tempo you out fairly, with a backup combo, while now having the 2 best removals in the format, with remands to counter any mana intensive cards.
Grixis Twin now would be all the strengths of Jund and Junk without the struggle of ramp and some combo decks
I simply think Twin would be too powerful now, no matter how much Cfusion goes blue in the face
I know that the probe ban does look bad right now but wizards has said they don't want lots of cantrips in the format so that the games do not play out the same way. Git probe was allowing deck to be 56 cards + serum visions if desired. Therefore as many times as it was said i never truly believed that preordain was coming off. As far as i could see nothing had changed yet.
HOWEVER, they have now banned a broken card and it opens the door for another fair cantrip to enter. I know that this post will be unpopular but from wizards stated goal of keeping variance alive this ban opens the door for an unban that was previously off the table in the same way that AV was stranded while twin was roaming free.
WOTC has been adamant, especially recently to silence any notion of a Jace unban. SFM became the talk of unbans after it was a GP giveaway card. WOTC has also said numerous times that they want Serum Visions to be at the upper end of Modern cantrips and that their design philosophy going forward are cards at the power level of Anticipate.
I wish people would stop using their hopes and desires to justify what they want unbanned. In the Ancestral Vision unban it also took into account that they don't want Bloodbraid elf to be in modern together so please stop pushing that theory merely because you want it to happen.
The list looks like it will stay as it is for now.
I could see Splinter Twin returning at some point. There's also a case to be made for an off-color affinity land to give deck-builders something to try to include. I don't think something like Tree of Tales is going to do anything for affinity. It's just another card which loses to Stony, Shatterstorm, Creeping corrosion, etc, etc. BUT it might make it's way into other decks. It could make Thirst for knowledge more attractive for a midrange deck and there might be some synergy in green, who knows anyway it's not likely to happen but I'm struggling to see a "safe" card.
You see SFM as super unlikely, but Twin having access to lighting bolt, Fatal push, and Tasigur to avoid Fatal Push, with K-command and AV as a SB against GBx as the safer option? Twin's not coming off the list in 2017. I already said it before and I'll say it now, I would eat my foil jund deck on youtube if Twin was announced unbanned this year
No where in that post did I say SFM was "super unlikely" I also never gave any opinion on when Splinter Twin would be back. I definitely said nothing that implied it coming back in 2017. Please read before you reply! Thanks.
You stated in the other thread that because Aaron Forscythe said a while back SFM is in the ban graveyard that it had no chance, and Sheridan pointed out that the format changed drastically since then when he made that statement
So no, I can't call you on THIS post, but you definitely wrote it elsewhere
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
Except maybe Lighting Bolt.
RUG Temur Deprive Delver
BUG Sultai Deprive Delver
All we have is like, Thoughtseize and IOK? That needs to change
1) Sort of, it made my narrow counterspells and removal playable, shoring up a weakness in the card pool rather than breaking anything
3) Got a sorcery in the yard for Goyf and delirium
4) Filled the graveyard for delve and Bedlam Reveler
5) Helped me flip Delver
6) Raised my blue spell count for Disrupting Shoal
Don't talk to me about unfair, I played the fairest deck next to Jund at my LGS, abd it got banned.
Stay reasonable, be mindful of your expectations and don't feed the trolls.
Doomsdayin'
Tarmogoyf
I play Magic: the Gathering, not Magic: the Commandering.
Are you sure? Because the consensus around here seems to be that the first two decks you cite are broken and should not exist in Modern. I've heard numerous people say things like "This was a good ban! Hopefully next time we get Mox Opal and Tron lands." Because of the lack of objective reasons from Wizards, the next round of banmania is going to make me extremely nervous. I've heard Mox Opal, Tron Lands, Simian Spirit Guide, Valakut, all of which make sense on some level if you stretch "too much for free" and then I hear nonsense like Ancient Stirrings and Arcbound Ravager. I think the reasoning is silly, but then I think the reasoning for banning GGT is silly. So with the lack of information and the long list of things that various people want banned, it's not surprising people don't want to get caught holding onto decks in this environment. A surprise ban with sketchy reasoning -- even if the actual affects on the metagame are relatively innocuous -- should worry people. Especially combined with the banning of three cards in Standard (which they rightfully tend to avoid banning things from) Maybe ktknshnx is right and they have good reasons that they suck at articulating, but all I see is an announcement that things don't necessarily need to be putting up insane results to get a ban.
So what's "safe?" I have three decks built, I should be good, right? But two of those three decks are Affinity and Tron, decks that some Modern players don't want to exist in any form. And another is Burn. If Tron goes away, I don't feel very comfortable playing Burn and hoping to draw really well in Jund matchup after Jund matchup.
I know a lot of people pick on Standard as being battlecruiser or superfriends or uninteractive or whatever, and I can certainly see that, but the times I've played Standard I found it fun and engaging. The main issue is I don't have the time and money to do a lot of trading and buying all the time, so I play Modern, where I can buy a few cards at a time and build up a collection of cards that aren't rotating. More bans harms my ability to do that and takes away the main appeal of Modern. I'm not really salty about eating $20 on a set of Gitaxian Probes, but I think it's rational to be nervous going forward when I come to this forum and there's a lot of talk about "ban all the things!" and Wizards' actions suggest that they tend to agree.
I've been putting Suicide Bloo together over the last few months as a way out of the endless rotation of standard (build into a more expensive format! It never rotates!) and the loss of Probe and the intro of Fatal Push is really gonna hurt.
I've tried to turn the saltiness into productivity and I'm trying to think about where to take it next, but my friends aren't helping my mood by saying "Oh, just find something else you like and buy into that instead"
Yeah, cheers. I'll just root around the back of the sofa for ~£1000 and build Jund. It's not like I'm trying to save money for a house or have any other financial commitments or anything.
UR Storm
G Stompy
URSuicide Bloo
Commander: (Don't play as much as I'd like)
UBPhenax, God of Deception
Thats fair. lol. It would definitely push me out of the game. Though I dont see tarmogoyf getting banned while those huge eldrazi are allowed to roam Modern.
RUG Temur Deprive Delver
BUG Sultai Deprive Delver
As someone suggested, if you dont already use it, Street Wraith
RUG Temur Deprive Delver
BUG Sultai Deprive Delver
That's a fair shout, but I'll be missing the crucial prowess trigger.
I'm looking at Noxious Revival and Gut shot plus running more cantrips as alternatives.
UR Storm
G Stompy
URSuicide Bloo
Commander: (Don't play as much as I'd like)
UBPhenax, God of Deception
My initial guess is that there will be a big unban. I've never in my life advocated for unbanning powerful cards like Preordain,Stoneforge,BBE nor Jace. The problem is that this company will try to fight for their customers trust(again). This makes me believe they will unban a potential poster/pillar of the new Modern format.
My likely scenarios would be:
1)Unban Preordain
2)Unban Jace and Stoneforge Mystic
Scenario number 2 would make MM17 a crack fest.
I didn't say it was unfair, I said it was all collateral. Sure, I didn't think of all the other scenarios that I lumped with Storm (which isn't a good target to lump onto, my apologies), but I think they wanted to neuter both Infect and Shadow at one go and there aren't a lot of 1-card options between the two. The card is just way too flexible there was no way to avoid collateral damage with its removal.
Technically Peek functionally does all the things that Probe does you listed. If a deck needed Peek to be able to be cast for 2 life instead of U then that's unfortunate, because two top tier decks were also using the free cost to their advantage.
Jace/SFM, there will be a huge, negative uproar, combo and aggro players will feel slighted and claim that midrange/fair players are being far too pandered
An SFM/Jace unban needs to be combined with a preordain if WOTC wants to avoid a large backlash
Unbanning Jace AND Preordain at the same time is incredibly dangerous, WOTC won't take the risk
Unbanning SFM alone would cause more people to say, "well, guess I'll buy jund and junk to be safe!"
So the logical march announcement will be: unbanning preordain
The next likely outcome, which I won't hold my breathe for and is unlikely: Preordain and SFM are now unbanned
Stirrings is not a stupid suggestion or an unlikely one
No offense, but you were way off the mark about WOTC's mindset and all of your posts in the other topic were pretty far off
I don't mean it an insult, or an attack on you, it's more that you seem HEAVILY biased towards the combo aspect, and you're out of touch with WOTC's rationale
Until preordain is unbanned, WOTC is clearly showing they don't want cantrips stronger than serum visions, they want serum visions to be the ultimate cantrip in modern
Stirrings digs how many cards deep? It helped enable the egregious Summer Bloom (not that it was the culprit)
It powers up Tron, Eldrazi and Lantern (which WOTC definitely has it out for, but will not take action without it spending considerable time in tier 1)
You are absolutely out of touch if you don't think there's merit in a stirrings ban
Please keep in mind, I am NOT advocating for a stirrings ban or demanding it, I am stating that it has a possibility and realistic chance of it
It's also a green black infect deck. It's also one pro player, so I guess you got me on the technicality aspect. Meanwhile, Turtenwald/Ross/Finkel/Budde/Silvestri/Svi/Huey/Duke/Cuneo all run a set of Probes.
Look at the lists of PT FRF:
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/tournament/pro-tour-fate-reforged#online
Again, I'm calling out the statement that "poor to mediocre" players use Probe whereas it's the popular choice among lists the Pros have run.
Want to be a better Magic player? Read the rulings forum and check out the comprehensive rules!
It's really cute if you don't think Company, Jace and Fastlands/fetchlands won't receive bans
Frontier is a joke, and it's, "like modern, but affordable!" won't stay like that for long as demand increases
Standard has looked incredibly broken ever since baby Jace came around, I saw every deck playing him and 4 or 5 colors, company decks, and now Emerakul and Gideon decks
All formats have issues, stop crying doom and gloom
And Wizards will ban tron lands when the deck dominates Modern tournaments. Since Wizards wants interactive games and slowed-down games, I can totally see Wizards eviscerating Tron next.
I wish people would stop using their hopes and desires to justify what they want unbanned. In the Ancestral Vision unban it also took into account that they don't want Bloodbraid elf to be in modern together so please stop pushing that theory merely because you want it to happen.
The list looks like it will stay as it is for now.
I could see Splinter Twin returning at some point. There's also a case to be made for an off-color affinity land to give deck-builders something to try to include. I don't think something like Tree of Tales is going to do anything for affinity. It's just another card which loses to Stony, Shatterstorm, Creeping corrosion, etc, etc. BUT it might make it's way into other decks. It could make Thirst for knowledge more attractive for a midrange deck and there might be some synergy in green, who knows anyway it's not likely to happen but I'm struggling to see a "safe" card.
Oh, I agree, I don't think Jace would do anything but be a new toy
Preordain and SFM are really the only targets I foresee.
SFM serves slowing aggro down while Preordain helps blue decks find an answer more consistently.
Preordain could power combo decks
and the thought of SFM scares WOTC
It's kinda a crappy place. I don't see SFM as dangerous anymore, regardless
You see SFM as super unlikely, but Twin having access to lighting bolt, Fatal push, and Tasigur to avoid Fatal Push, with K-command and AV as a SB against GBx as the safer option? Twin's not coming off the list in 2017. I already said it before and I'll say it now, I would eat my foil jund deck on youtube if Twin was announced unbanned this year
Standard: lol no
Modern: BG/x, UR/x, Burn, Merfolk, Zoo, Storm
Legacy: Shardless BUG, Delver (BUG, RUG, Grixis), Landstill, Depths Combo, Merfolk
Vintage: Dark Times, BUG Fish, Merfolk
EDH: Teysa, Orzhov Scion / Krenko, Mob Boss / Stonebrow, Krosan Hero
Grixis Twin with Tas, K-command, bolt, fatal push, AV (whether that would be in the mb or sb, I don't know, but it would drown out fair decks)
Blood moon for when naughty midrange decks surface, beating down Valakut and Tron. I think Eldrazi would be the only prey the deck would have
Grixis Twin would be far worse than you'd expect with all the changes now, guys
I would instantly drop my Jund/Junk deck and play a deck that can tempo you out fairly, with a backup combo, while now having the 2 best removals in the format, with remands to counter any mana intensive cards.
Grixis Twin now would be all the strengths of Jund and Junk without the struggle of ramp and some combo decks
I simply think Twin would be too powerful now, no matter how much Cfusion goes blue in the face
HOWEVER, they have now banned a broken card and it opens the door for another fair cantrip to enter. I know that this post will be unpopular but from wizards stated goal of keeping variance alive this ban opens the door for an unban that was previously off the table in the same way that AV was stranded while twin was roaming free.
No where in that post did I say SFM was "super unlikely" I also never gave any opinion on when Splinter Twin would be back. I definitely said nothing that implied it coming back in 2017. Please read before you reply! Thanks.
So no, I can't call you on THIS post, but you definitely wrote it elsewhere