Can't play it on turn 2, you need colorless mana. So you can cast it with 2 eldrazi temple but without kozilek turn 1. This is the reason to run maybe 3 of it instead of 4
That being said yes. My brain isn't working as I just got home.
The fact it's a 4/4 is blowing my mind. Avoids so much removal minus ... Flame Slash, Path, Terminate, Dismember, Slaughter Pact, GFTT, Galvanic Blast, and others I am probably forgetting MD.
The new seer is very good but I still think I prefer the power of Lingering Souls + 1 CMC discard.
I mean... he is very similar to Vendilion Clique, except in the grind match ups he is probably not the top deck you want. If you dont clip anything they draw when he dies. Your playing him T2 At best. T2 is possible but not often.
Interesting interaction, you can cast this guy, with his etb on the stack, flicker him, and you'll get to take 2 cards with 1 being after your opponent draws, so you can see it. Seems useful.
Fact is the deck before had only 14 creatures, with only 4 costing 3 ( without special lands ) and then we had a hole since the 5 cmc herder. Now we have more 3cmc creatures ( strangler, displacer ) and more important, we fill the hole between them and herder. All these cards are in general much better then souls; souls was to stop creatures deck and gain time against aggro. What about some 3/3 or a 4/4 at turn 2 or 3? Now we are not gaining time, we are smashing their creatures if they want to attack. I would play eventually 3 timely reinforcements sb for life+tokens
I understand that, but, idk, the value of Lingering Souls is just HUGE. There is no card spoiled until now with that value for 3 mana. I'll be trying the split i posted a few comments above, the split of 4 Inquisition of Kozilek and 2 Thought-Knot Seer. This way we still get the value of all of then.
The new cards are very, very good, but they will not make us faster than Affinity or Infect. I do not think cutting Lingering Souls will prove to be wise.
The second I saw thought-knot seer, I immediately thought "hey, it's skullers long lost eldrazi spirit ancestor." They do get card advantage if they kill it, but I don't think that's a bad price to pay to get rid of something from their hand.
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1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
This also could be an option! Anyway, this all need some testing; maybe eldrazi displacer will not be that good and it can leave his place to souls, who knows. I only know that I'm pretty excited for all these options being open
Agree with this, i don't see Eldrazi Displacer in this Midrange version anymore, he's good, but there is already better options.
Thought-Knot Seer definitely seems amazing in the monoblack list. I'm currently packing 8 1cmc discard spells, and it'd be nice to be able to trim a few while still maintaining disruption.
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The preorder price on reality smasher is $5 usd a card...
This is going to get pricey if the trend continues with the seer.
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1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I think Thought Knot Seer and some of the other new ones make an even stronger case to go into mono black because I think it makes Sea Gate Wreckage an INCREDIBLY strong late game option but your mana base can't be spread too thin. I end up hellbent a lot with this deck so to be able to fetch INFINITE card advantage of map is completely bonkers AND it taps for one of the 'colors' we need.
Have any of you ever played mono black control? It does an EXCEPTIONAL job of controlling the game, it just has a problem ending it. This deck is able to do both and THAT is where I think the power of this deck is. We can Jund people out as hard as any deck in the format and eventually just win with an Ulamog. NO deck has anything close to that variation of power and threats. Honestly, the sky is the limit for power here.
White's sideboard options are fine, but all of the options I have available in black do a great job too. Sure, we don't have stony silence, but we do have Languish, Damnation, Night of Souls Betrayal, etc. The only thing I'm ever really scared of is a deck going super wide on me and black has plenty of ways to deal with that. With a robust discard/removal suite we're able to take care of pretty much everything else.
The new cards are very, very good, but they will not make us faster than Affinity or Infect. I do not think cutting Lingering Souls will prove to be wise.
Oh yeah.... You just reminded me how it stop manlands from these deck... Now all my reasoning must be revalueted ahahah sorry mate
Maybe the Mono-B version with 4 Ghost Quarter and 4 Expedition Map will prove stronger relative to BW for these matches after the release, since it has non-flying answers to Inkmoth Nexus. It will still have the usual problems with Vault Skirge and his buddies, though.
Wow, lots of new cards to consider. I've been playing BW, but I'm thinking of trying out a mostly colorless build with black and just a small white splash for displacer. Displacer coming down turn 2/3 if there is no target for strangler is key. Also, the ability can just grind out opponents and give you something to do with your mana if you stall out. I don't think the mana is quite right yet, but here is where I'm at. Also, I'm interested in trying out chalice of the void against burn/infect/affinity. I currently have 10-1 drops in the main, but it's easy to shave all or most for better SB options to support chalice. In theory I like chalice as a proactive answer before dropping bombs turns 3-5.
The new cards are very, very good, but they will not make us faster than Affinity or Infect. I do not think cutting Lingering Souls will prove to be wise.
A few thoughts about the new cards.
Thought-Knot Seer is definitely a strong card and is a much better top deck later in the game than Thoughtseize. However, I have issue with removing thoughtseize from the deck. Thoughtseize is an answer for Karn among other threats. Getting rid of those cards early and putting them into the yard for Surgical Extraction is important I think.
Reality Smasher blows my mind. He is so pushed, but is not a 4x. He kind of reminds me of the Fish in Grixis. I don't think I want 4, but 2 in the 75 sounds good. But if we play him I think we need 1-2 Caverns as well. Once he hits the board he is just broken as a 2-for-1 machine. I think he is also important to get rid of opposing Lily, Karn or any other walkers. At the same time I don't think he helps our game plan at all. He doesn't beat tron, and he is too slow against burn and does nothing against scapeshift. I just don't know it improves our game at all.
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Current Decks
Modern
No idea because my favorite decks keep getting banned or having the rules changed against them
The best answer we got in mono-black against spontaneous fliers would be something like Night of souls' betrayal, as it would outright kill inkmoth nexus and force token decks with fliers to have at least an anthem effect in play. Against tokens I'd rather play illness in the ranks, though.
The other option is to play Profit // Loss and focus on playing the Loss side. It hits their side only and gives all their creatures -1/-1, and is an instant.
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1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Chump Blocking i guess, I think that is the plan for lingering. I think i'll just build the mono B version. White was good for Path, but its another colour, Black can do a lot of what white can for this deck. Thoughtseize/Ghost Q + Surgical fixes a few decks
Wish I would have caught on before I saw it play over the weekend.
Sad
Wonder if these cards will drop?
Considering a lot of them are in standard rotation at the moment... I think that might be a while.
I'm going all in on paper, though. I've already got the most expensive pieces, so that just leaves all the preorder shinaniganry and hoping we are getting a good deal.
Private Mod Note
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Anyways should we include a basic waste with respect to Blood Moon?
I don't think so. Even the mono black deck is tight on lands, there are so many good options. I don't think you want to waste a map to find it and there is no other way to search it up outside of GQ on yourself. Blight herder still casts your <> spells through a blood moon.
I love this idea.
C Kozilek C
GB Gitrog GB
G Titania G
WU Brago WU
GB MerenGB
Duel Commander Decks
UR Keranos UR
BRG Jund BRG
GR Tron GR GW Tron GW
C Eldrazi Tron (SB) C
BG Lantern Control BG
UW Control (SB) UW
That being said yes. My brain isn't working as I just got home.
The fact it's a 4/4 is blowing my mind. Avoids so much removal minus ... Flame Slash, Path, Terminate, Dismember, Slaughter Pact, GFTT, Galvanic Blast, and others I am probably forgetting MD.
I mean... he is very similar to Vendilion Clique, except in the grind match ups he is probably not the top deck you want. If you dont clip anything they draw when he dies. Your playing him T2 At best. T2 is possible but not often.
I don't know...needs a playtest.
I understand that, but, idk, the value of Lingering Souls is just HUGE. There is no card spoiled until now with that value for 3 mana. I'll be trying the split i posted a few comments above, the split of 4 Inquisition of Kozilek and 2 Thought-Knot Seer. This way we still get the value of all of then.
GXTronGX
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1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Agree with this, i don't see Eldrazi Displacer in this Midrange version anymore, he's good, but there is already better options.
GXTronGX
RWxBurnRWx
GXTronGX
RWxBurnRWx
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This is going to get pricey if the trend continues with the seer.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Look at rare prices for Battle. It's terrible ... if you can wait they will go down.
Have any of you ever played mono black control? It does an EXCEPTIONAL job of controlling the game, it just has a problem ending it. This deck is able to do both and THAT is where I think the power of this deck is. We can Jund people out as hard as any deck in the format and eventually just win with an Ulamog. NO deck has anything close to that variation of power and threats. Honestly, the sky is the limit for power here.
White's sideboard options are fine, but all of the options I have available in black do a great job too. Sure, we don't have stony silence, but we do have Languish, Damnation, Night of Souls Betrayal, etc. The only thing I'm ever really scared of is a deck going super wide on me and black has plenty of ways to deal with that. With a robust discard/removal suite we're able to take care of pretty much everything else.
4 Relic of Progenitus
2 Surgical Extraction
4 Inquisition of Kozilek
2 Dismember
1 Slaughter Pact
2 Doom Blade
3 Wasteland Strangler
3 Eldrazi Displacer
4 Thought-Knot Seer
4 Blight Herder
4 Oblivion Sower
1 Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger
1 Kozilek, the Great Distortion
4 Eldrazi Temple
3 Eye of Ugin
4 Caves of Koilos
3 Ghost Quarter
4 Cavern of Souls
3 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4 Swamp
3 Flaying Tendrils
4 Chalice of the Void
2 Duress
2 Cranial Extraction
2 Ruin Processor
1 Crucible of Worlds
1 Spellskite
What does that solve at all?
A few thoughts about the new cards.
Thought-Knot Seer is definitely a strong card and is a much better top deck later in the game than Thoughtseize. However, I have issue with removing thoughtseize from the deck. Thoughtseize is an answer for Karn among other threats. Getting rid of those cards early and putting them into the yard for Surgical Extraction is important I think.
Reality Smasher blows my mind. He is so pushed, but is not a 4x. He kind of reminds me of the Fish in Grixis. I don't think I want 4, but 2 in the 75 sounds good. But if we play him I think we need 1-2 Caverns as well. Once he hits the board he is just broken as a 2-for-1 machine. I think he is also important to get rid of opposing Lily, Karn or any other walkers. At the same time I don't think he helps our game plan at all. He doesn't beat tron, and he is too slow against burn and does nothing against scapeshift. I just don't know it improves our game at all.
The other option is to play Profit // Loss and focus on playing the Loss side. It hits their side only and gives all their creatures -1/-1, and is an instant.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Legacy: Dark Depths, Pox, Eldrazi Agro
Vintage: Dark Depths, Grey Orge
Pauper: Faerie Ninja
7pt Highlander: BW Combo
EDH: Horobi, (t)Toshiro, (t)Isamaru
Wish I would have caught on before I saw it play over the weekend.
Sad
Wonder if these cards will drop?
2x Thought-Knot Seer
4x Blight Herder
4x Oblivion Sower
1x Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger
3x Wasteland Strangler
1x Go for the Throat
4x Path to Exile
4x Inquisition of Kozilek
4x Lingering Souls
1x Thoughtseize
4x Relic of Progenitus
4x Eldrazi Temple
3x Eye of Ugin
2x Ghost Quarter
2x Godless Shrine
1x Isolated Chapel
3x Marsh Flats
2x Plains
1x Shambling Vent
2x Swamp
2x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1x Vault of the Archangel
1x Windswept Heath
2x Disenchant
2x Thoughtseize
1x Languish
2x Ruin Processor
2x Spellskite
2x Stony Silence
2x Surgical Extraction
A mix of offensive and control, which I think it's pretty reasonable without cutting souls.
Anyways should we include a basic waste with respect to Blood Moon?
Modern : Huh?
EDH : UBGW Thrasios / Tymna Combo UBGW // GRW Mayael Big Stuff GRW // GU Edric Timewalkers GU
Considering a lot of them are in standard rotation at the moment... I think that might be a while.
I'm going all in on paper, though. I've already got the most expensive pieces, so that just leaves all the preorder shinaniganry and hoping we are getting a good deal.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I don't think so. Even the mono black deck is tight on lands, there are so many good options. I don't think you want to waste a map to find it and there is no other way to search it up outside of GQ on yourself. Blight herder still casts your <> spells through a blood moon.