Pod didn't have to become so stupidly good, though; Pod is reliant (Very heavily so) on ETB effects. All it would have taken is two or three more Torpor Orb/Torpor Bird in order to keep it in check...
Banning it is lazy game design.
pod was the reason some good fair creature decks couldn't compete which made the diversity of the meta less. It won way more than any other deck and only gets better as new creatures get printed. so do we ban all the creatures that make pod good or ban the problem? wizards did some thinking with this ban actually its you who's too lazy to use your head and see that it was a good decision....
Pod didn't have to become so stupidly good, though; Pod is reliant (Very heavily so) on ETB effects. All it would have taken is two or three more Torpor Orb/Torpor Bird in order to keep it in check...
Banning it is lazy game design.
pod was the reason some good fair creature decks couldn't compete which made the diversity of the meta less. It won way more than any other deck and only gets better as new creatures get printed. so do we ban all the creatures that make pod good or ban the problem? wizards did some thinking with this ban actually its you who's too lazy to use your head and see that it was a good decision....
Except you didn't read my post; Pod relies heavily on it's ETB effects. More Torpor effects wouldn't kill the deck, but they would balance it out; a 4/5 is still a good creature, but it's ONLY a good creature when you lose out on it's free Lightning Helix. A 3/2 -> 2/1 is good, but losing it's 4 life is also bad.
This was absolutely a lazy choice. Wizards needs to start testing for older formats before they release cards....
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Oath of the Gatewatch; the set that caused the competitive community to freak out over Basic Lands.
Pod was really restrictive in the format and had been the best deck in modern for a LONG time. The amount of butthurt over this is silly. Objectively pod probably should have been banned long ago. Everyone knew it would only be a matter of time before it was off. WOTC was eventually going to print enough creatures that made Pod an unstoppable beast.
I honestly believe the format is more open than its been in a while because of the ban. People who brew can be happy because there's a lot more variety that can happen. It could devolve into a midrange fest, but it doesn't have to.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Currently Playing:
Modern: UWUW TronUW
Legacy: WDeath N TaxesW CEldrazi C
If you couldn't tell I hate greedy blue decks.
I wonder if Wizards inherently dislikes the idea of blue being good in modern. Historically the color has been so strong in legacy and vintage, perhaps wizards really just wants to diversify Modern and Legacy archetypes? Could that be the reason for the ban on DIG?
the largest concern about the bans is that the ROCK style decks (BGx) will dominate the format again
This day is a historical day in modern's history. It's not only a banlist change, this reflects the whole philosophy wizards has towards modern.
They will never allow modern to become really powerful. But also, they will never allow it to be a self regulating format. They want to be able to keep control of its meta-game.
It may not be a bad decision from a game design point of view.
But I'm really saddened. I guess I must get into legacy.
And that right there is why I wont be interested in this format. If thats the direction wizards wants to go thats fine but count me out.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
SonofaBith - Wizards was so excited about making the packaging for Modern Masters 2 recyclable, they decided to make most of the rares and all but 1 of the UC's recycle-bin ready too. Convenient!
Pod didn't have to become so stupidly good, though; Pod is reliant (Very heavily so) on ETB effects. All it would have taken is two or three more Torpor Orb/Torpor Bird in order to keep it in check...
Banning it is lazy game design.
pod was the reason some good fair creature decks couldn't compete which made the diversity of the meta less. It won way more than any other deck and only gets better as new creatures get printed. so do we ban all the creatures that make pod good or ban the problem? wizards did some thinking with this ban actually its you who's too lazy to use your head and see that it was a good decision....
Except you didn't read my post; Pod relies heavily on it's ETB effects. More Torpor effects wouldn't kill the deck, but they would balance it out; a 4/5 is still a good creature, but it's ONLY a good creature when you lose out on it's free Lightning Helix. A 3/2 -> 2/1 is good, but losing it's 4 life is also bad.
This was absolutely a lazy choice. Wizards needs to start testing for older formats before they release cards....
Why would they spend valuable time, energy, and money on formats that make them a fraction of the money (compared to standard)? I am sure there is a cost/benefit table somewhere in the accounting department that spells out exactly how much time they should spend on modern for how much money it makes them, and they do that and not more. It isn't lazy, so much as it is a cost/benefit analysis. I suspect that now that they are releasing packs for modern they might spend a little more time on it, but certainly not much. From their perspective, it is probably much better to just work things out via the banned list.
Pod didn't have to become so stupidly good, though; Pod is reliant (Very heavily so) on ETB effects. All it would have taken is two or three more Torpor Orb/Torpor Bird in order to keep it in check...
Banning it is lazy game design.
pod was the reason some good fair creature decks couldn't compete which made the diversity of the meta less. It won way more than any other deck and only gets better as new creatures get printed. so do we ban all the creatures that make pod good or ban the problem? wizards did some thinking with this ban actually its you who's too lazy to use your head and see that it was a good decision....
Except you didn't read my post; Pod relies heavily on it's ETB effects. More Torpor effects wouldn't kill the deck, but they would balance it out; a 4/5 is still a good creature, but it's ONLY a good creature when you lose out on it's free Lightning Helix. A 3/2 -> 2/1 is good, but losing it's 4 life is also bad.
This was absolutely a lazy choice. Wizards needs to start testing for older formats before they release cards....
Torpor Orb/ Torpor Bird wouldnt kill Pod. Pod still has bigger creatures and will hit you when compared to the decks that run those answers. Making more cards have that effect further hurts creature based decks...which is the reason Pod was banned. Its not that pod couldn't be beat, its that nnot only was it hard but it was choking creature decks out of the meta
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Top Control: The only pure lockdown deck in Modern.
"We look for cards that are unlikely to add power to existing top decks, but instead add new strategies or augment decks that are not currently as successful...While taking such a card off the banned list has some risks, this is a good time to see what happens. Golgari Grave-Troll is no longer banned."
This is an interesting quote. They are coming out and saying that they won't unban any cards that could potentially make existing *top* decks more powerful. I wonder what they consider to be a *top* deck -- Everything that is Tier 1? Or everything that is Tier 2 and above?
Hopefully they consider the Tier 1 decks the *top* decks, or else we will probably never see any of the currently banned cards ever come off that list.
Overall, however, I can't agree with the doom and gloom that some people try to spread. There will be room for more archetypes than before now, who can even argue the opposite ? Pod players can still play a really strong Abzan Midrange game with just changing around a few cards. It's not the end of the world, people, and certainly not an attempt by Wizards to "kill Modern"(I'm sure someone has already claimed it is or someone will soon say so).
I wouldn't say your wrong but those few cards you say have price tags of 80$, 80$ and 200$... which means in some cases it would be cheaper to buy a new deck than convert pod
Pod didn't have to become so stupidly good, though; Pod is reliant (Very heavily so) on ETB effects. All it would have taken is two or three more Torpor Orb/Torpor Bird in order to keep it in check...
Banning it is lazy game design.
They recently printed Hushwing Gryff. It did nothing at all.
1) Gryff is colored, so can't be used in every deck.
2) It's 3 drop, a heavily contested slot in most decks.
3) Pod didn't really take over the spotlight until Delver did, and Gryff is a terrible card against Delver for more reasons than one.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Oath of the Gatewatch; the set that caused the competitive community to freak out over Basic Lands.
Wow. Just wow. I had this preminition a few days ago that I should probably buy some Lilianas and ordered a playset. I never could have guessef they'd make changes this ridiculous but I'm glad I'm prepared to welcome our new overlord if that's what this comes to.
Totally okay with all of the bannings, totally unsatisfied that not more cards got unbanned (probably because the bannings alone will throw Modern for quite a loop).
This was simply inevitable, no matter what all of the Pod players and Abzan color enthusiasts might say. Pod wasthe best deck in Modern, even with the beefed up Delver decks - it had the results to prove it, it had the metagame share to back it up and it was the deck that everybody had to come prepared to face in a bigger event.
Repeatedly tutoring and "vialing in" creatures is simply overpowered when Wizards just keeps printing strong creatures in every single set - and most likely will for the forseeable future. Pod as a deck got stronger with every new set, with (almost) every new powerful creature printed while other decks got what, 0-2 new cards per set, more often sideboard options or "sidegrades" rather than upgrades ? It was simply inevitable.
Treasure Cruise is banned - well, to be honest Delver really did push quite a few decks out of the format and the card is probably just too good compared to Modern's overall powerlevel. I personally would have prefered to let Treasure Cruise stay and raise the powerlevel with a bunch of unbannings, but Wizards went the safe route (for better or for worse) and within that safe route, this banning was necessary.
The banning of Dig Through Time is a little more suspect to me but I can kind of see the argument (or at least the fear) of Delver replacing Treasure Cruise with this card and staying on top, so the banning seems kind of reasonable to me.
Golgari Grave-Troll unbanned. This is the ultra safe unbanning that everybody was sure would happen someday and then do nothing because the card will most likely neither slot into any existing "tier" decks, nor will it push Dredge hard enough to be "a thing" in Modern.
What I'm really sad about is that we didn't see more unbannings. I really, really wanted to have Ancestral Vision unbanned to create some interesting deck building decisions and to potentially give Control a little shot in the arm to keep Combo in check.
I also really wanted Sword of the Meek unbanned because that Thopter Foundry combo really isn't strong enough to do much of anything in Modern, compared to the "insta win" combos that are already out there.
In general, I would have appreciated it more if Wizards took a harder look on what to unban instead of what to ban - expand Modern a little and let it breath.
Overall, however, I can't agree with the doom and gloom that some people try to spread. There will be room for more archetypes than before now, who can even argue the opposite ? Pod players can still play a really strong Abzan Midrange game with just changing around a few cards. It's not the end of the world, people, and certainly not an attempt by Wizards to "kill Modern"(I'm sure someone has already claimed it is or someone will soon say so).
I can kind of see the argument for Dig too, but the point is they banned it on an assumption. Preemptive bans have the flaw that they can be wrong because no one actually knows what will happen.
You can't test for multiple formats. That causes R&D to strip down the power level for standard, which in turn goes into modern and legacy. If a card isn't good in standard, its not going to work in modern nor legacy, therefore the card is just a card and becomes a stale meta. Since the decks rely on these old cards for their power level.
Pod didn't have to become so stupidly good, though; Pod is reliant (Very heavily so) on ETB effects. All it would have taken is two or three more Torpor Orb/Torpor Bird in order to keep it in check...
Banning it is lazy game design.
pod was the reason some good fair creature decks couldn't compete which made the diversity of the meta less. It won way more than any other deck and only gets better as new creatures get printed. so do we ban all the creatures that make pod good or ban the problem? wizards did some thinking with this ban actually its you who's too lazy to use your head and see that it was a good decision....
Except you didn't read my post; Pod relies heavily on it's ETB effects. More Torpor effects wouldn't kill the deck, but they would balance it out; a 4/5 is still a good creature, but it's ONLY a good creature when you lose out on it's free Lightning Helix. A 3/2 -> 2/1 is good, but losing it's 4 life is also bad.
This was absolutely a lazy choice. Wizards needs to start testing for older formats before they release cards....
The problem with "Torpor Orb effects" is that they must either cost 3 or less mana and fall prey to Abrupt Decay or they will suck because you can't cast them on time. Pod would simply (always) play 4x Abrupt Decay main deck and some efficient removal against those "Torpor Orb effects" in the board.
Pod can't search for Spells, and the TO effects don't have to be permanents.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Oath of the Gatewatch; the set that caused the competitive community to freak out over Basic Lands.
You can't test for multiple formats. That causes R&D to strip down the power level for standard, which in turn goes into modern and legacy. If a card isn't good in standard, its not going to work in modern nor legacy, therefore the card is just a card and becomes a stale meta. Since the decks rely on these old cards for their power level.
Treasure Cruise is just okay in Standard and Deathrite Shaman was almost a nonentity during its Standard tenure.
Pod didn't have to become so stupidly good, though; Pod is reliant (Very heavily so) on ETB effects. All it would have taken is two or three more Torpor Orb/Torpor Bird in order to keep it in check...
Banning it is lazy game design.
pod was the reason some good fair creature decks couldn't compete which made the diversity of the meta less. It won way more than any other deck and only gets better as new creatures get printed. so do we ban all the creatures that make pod good or ban the problem? wizards did some thinking with this ban actually its you who's too lazy to use your head and see that it was a good decision....
Except you didn't read my post; Pod relies heavily on it's ETB effects. More Torpor effects wouldn't kill the deck, but they would balance it out; a 4/5 is still a good creature, but it's ONLY a good creature when you lose out on it's free Lightning Helix. A 3/2 -> 2/1 is good, but losing it's 4 life is also bad.
This was absolutely a lazy choice. Wizards needs to start testing for older formats before they release cards....
yea because pod didnt run 4 abrupt decay main.... or thoughtsieze for that matter
Pod didn't have to become so stupidly good, though; Pod is reliant (Very heavily so) on ETB effects. All it would have taken is two or three more Torpor Orb/Torpor Bird in order to keep it in check...
Banning it is lazy game design.
pod was the reason some good fair creature decks couldn't compete which made the diversity of the meta less. It won way more than any other deck and only gets better as new creatures get printed. so do we ban all the creatures that make pod good or ban the problem? wizards did some thinking with this ban actually its you who's too lazy to use your head and see that it was a good decision....
Except you didn't read my post; Pod relies heavily on it's ETB effects. More Torpor effects wouldn't kill the deck, but they would balance it out; a 4/5 is still a good creature, but it's ONLY a good creature when you lose out on it's free Lightning Helix. A 3/2 -> 2/1 is good, but losing it's 4 life is also bad.
This was absolutely a lazy choice. Wizards needs to start testing for older formats before they release cards....
yea because pod didnt run 4 abrupt decay main.... or thoughtsieze for that matter
"Hey guys, stuff dies to removal!"
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Oath of the Gatewatch; the set that caused the competitive community to freak out over Basic Lands.
Perhaps, but the argument holds somewhat true with snapcaster, resto, siege rhino, voice.
Deathrite was a non-entity because of how its' abilities were almost not even relevant until the conley deck, which saw fringe play as well as how the format was not rotated around it. It could have seen more play if the set was after zendikar block.
TC in standard atm is almost a non entity due to no cantrips in the format.
My argument wasn't sufficient enough to back up. So i will hold it there.
You can only print so many Torpor Orb effects for Pod until you finally realize that being able to efficiently tutor and cheat a creature directly into play is extremely dangerous for a non-rotating format.
Shutting off the ETB effects only stops the value gained from utility creatures. It doesn't actually stop Pod decks from accessing their toolbox and finding different creatures to make your life miserable with.
pod was the reason some good fair creature decks couldn't compete which made the diversity of the meta less. It won way more than any other deck and only gets better as new creatures get printed. so do we ban all the creatures that make pod good or ban the problem? wizards did some thinking with this ban actually its you who's too lazy to use your head and see that it was a good decision....
decks playing:
none
Of course they will hate Modern. Manamorphose is still legal.
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
I lol'ed!
DECKS:
UB Faeries [Midrange/Tempo]
RWUGB Affinity[Aggro]
FAERIES TOO STRONK!!!1111
- Fae Prophecy, 201
5678Except you didn't read my post; Pod relies heavily on it's ETB effects. More Torpor effects wouldn't kill the deck, but they would balance it out; a 4/5 is still a good creature, but it's ONLY a good creature when you lose out on it's free Lightning Helix. A 3/2 -> 2/1 is good, but losing it's 4 life is also bad.
This was absolutely a lazy choice. Wizards needs to start testing for older formats before they release cards....
I honestly believe the format is more open than its been in a while because of the ban. People who brew can be happy because there's a lot more variety that can happen. It could devolve into a midrange fest, but it doesn't have to.
Modern:
UWUW TronUW
Legacy:
WDeath N TaxesW
CEldrazi C
If you couldn't tell I hate greedy blue decks.
Vintage
WWhite Trash
the largest concern about the bans is that the ROCK style decks (BGx) will dominate the format again
I mean cool I guess -_-
Modern is such a joke
And that right there is why I wont be interested in this format. If thats the direction wizards wants to go thats fine but count me out.
GW Rhys the Redeemed EDH
RUGAnimar, Soul of Elements EDH
WBRAlesha, Who Smiles at Death EDH
Why would they spend valuable time, energy, and money on formats that make them a fraction of the money (compared to standard)? I am sure there is a cost/benefit table somewhere in the accounting department that spells out exactly how much time they should spend on modern for how much money it makes them, and they do that and not more. It isn't lazy, so much as it is a cost/benefit analysis. I suspect that now that they are releasing packs for modern they might spend a little more time on it, but certainly not much. From their perspective, it is probably much better to just work things out via the banned list.
Personally, I am excited for the bans.
Torpor Orb/ Torpor Bird wouldnt kill Pod. Pod still has bigger creatures and will hit you when compared to the decks that run those answers. Making more cards have that effect further hurts creature based decks...which is the reason Pod was banned. Its not that pod couldn't be beat, its that nnot only was it hard but it was choking creature decks out of the meta
u/Anon_Amarth - Fun as a zero sum game: If my opponent is having none of it, then by extension I must be having all of it.
Current Top Control Decklist
Cockatrice: Spage
This is an interesting quote. They are coming out and saying that they won't unban any cards that could potentially make existing *top* decks more powerful. I wonder what they consider to be a *top* deck -- Everything that is Tier 1? Or everything that is Tier 2 and above?
Hopefully they consider the Tier 1 decks the *top* decks, or else we will probably never see any of the currently banned cards ever come off that list.
I wouldn't say your wrong but those few cards you say have price tags of 80$, 80$ and 200$... which means in some cases it would be cheaper to buy a new deck than convert pod
1) Gryff is colored, so can't be used in every deck.
2) It's 3 drop, a heavily contested slot in most decks.
3) Pod didn't really take over the spotlight until Delver did, and Gryff is a terrible card against Delver for more reasons than one.
'78 CB750F, '09 CBR600RR
I can kind of see the argument for Dig too, but the point is they banned it on an assumption. Preemptive bans have the flaw that they can be wrong because no one actually knows what will happen.
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
Pod can't search for Spells, and the TO effects don't have to be permanents.
yea because pod didnt run 4 abrupt decay main.... or thoughtsieze for that matter
decks playing:
none
"Hey guys, stuff dies to removal!"
Deathrite was a non-entity because of how its' abilities were almost not even relevant until the conley deck, which saw fringe play as well as how the format was not rotated around it. It could have seen more play if the set was after zendikar block.
TC in standard atm is almost a non entity due to no cantrips in the format.
My argument wasn't sufficient enough to back up. So i will hold it there.
Shutting off the ETB effects only stops the value gained from utility creatures. It doesn't actually stop Pod decks from accessing their toolbox and finding different creatures to make your life miserable with.