The problem with playing burn is that you almost can't get started against them. T1 they're attacking into us and we certainly aren't blocking them. T2 they're typically playing Searing Blaze which absolutely wrecks our T1 or T2 play. I would imagine if they didn't have Searing Blaze they would Bolt whichever creature most puts us off our gameplan of producing mana, except maybe to kill an Essence Warden. Even if you bring in a Spellskite it is basically is just a blocker. Burn plays so many cards now that ONLY target player that the first spell it eats is also the one that kills it b/c it blocked any of Burn's creatures, and it costs us two life for the redirection, so typically Spellskite typically reads as "prevent 3 damage". While it may prevent 3 damage, it also puts us off our gameplan of producing mana, and by the time you can Chord for it, the game is already pretty much over. Our T3 plays don't actually do anything without other elves on the battlefield, and they're the only creatures that are even protected by Pendelhaven. Scavenging Ooze again, either comes in with no ramp and thus can only eat one or two creatures in a game that is already almost over, or it comes in with ramp and nothing to eat.
Don't even get me started on Eidolon of the Great Revel. If they play that they can let us combo out and basically kill ourselves.
Short story long is G1 is almost a guaranteed loss, and when you bring in Essence Warden in you are putting yourself off your normal game plan of producing a ramp to win, and essentially just delay the game. Typically you only get one activation off the Warden before it gets killed. Again this is all from playing without Collected Company, and playing 3 Lead the Stampede and 1 Craterhoof Behemoth in it's place. Collected Company should allow us to progress our plan a bit more, but the fact that it still is almost certainly a T4 play against Burn means that it's going to be almost an all or nothing shot since Burn has the tools to beat us consistently T4-T5, T6 at worst.
I don't know that Leyline of Vitality does more for us versus Burn or not, but it seems like the fact it is harder to remove would give us enough life gain to at least get to a point where combo-ing out is a possibility...but that is dependent upon getting one in the opening hand.
Grim outlook I know, but it is what is.
I know my list is a little different from most, so it's not always a huge help, but I've found a few cards in particular to be strong against Burn:
1. Primal Command - I play one main board and currently 1 sideboard. This actually may be a good option at least in the board for "The List" posted on Destroyermaker's Article today (due to the list containing one Eternal Witness). The Line of "gain 7 life, tutor for Witness, gain 7 life, tutor for Ezuri..." is back breaking to burn.
2. Genesis Wave is pretty much unstoppable for Burn. By turns 3-4 (especially with Nykthos) you can pour 6+ permanents on to the board and pretty much just "go off". Once they have to start worrying about either killing your elves or hitting you; your golden.
3. Leyline of Vitality - This is currently in my board; and I've like it against burn...I do agree with some, however, that it may not be enough (it's also fairly "specialized" and can't be used against many other opponents). My deck also focuses on devotion a little more (so that is a bigger bonus for me personally) as well as ETB abuse (via Cloudstone and Temur Sabertooth) so I may get a little more mileage out of it than other elf decks...I have personally had situations where I had two Leyline's in play and it completely nullified Eidolon of the Great Revel...so there is use for such cards in some cases. I do see what people are saying, however, in that those are "fringe" cases. It's a great card in the right decks; but I don't think it is a universal answer to burn for all elf decks.
4. Spellskite - I've actually enjoyed this card in burn. Unless they have two burn spells, they're not getting about half of their spells through...now I actually play blue mana (so each one doesn't cost me 2 life always) which can be a big difference. It's also a great way to block their creatures while at the same time protecting some of your more important combo pieces. I'm surprised this didn't perform better for you. I do see what you are saying (that it goes against your game plan) and I HATE slowing the game down at all; but it's super tough to both hate on the opponent AND stay within your plan with all cards...and Spellskite is SOOOOO good in so many match ups in Modern that it is going to be in the board anyways
To be honest, Primal Command is far and away the best card in my deck for it; but that's not a "traditional" elf card now (although it was in Matt Nass's 2010 Extended deck that won GP Oakland....). Genesis Wave is pretty much game over against any deck that can't counter it; so that's not really a "burn specific" card (it's just really good against them because it allows you to pour tons on the board without triggering Eidolon for each permanent...and hitting Garruk, Eternal Witness, or Purphoros pretty much ends the game for them). But again, that's not always an option for some elf decks. You really want to gain "chunks" of life (as this works like a 2-for-1 against them if the life is 6 or more)...I'll try to think of some more good options in that regard. I'm sure there is something that can help shore up your burn match ups with your list; and we won't stop working until we've found them!
EDIT
Found another option. I've been playing a Chalice of the Void + Cavern of Souls package in my board recently (in place of Leyline and a Pact) that has been GREAT against burn (and infect, and Amulet and many others). I know we've talked about it in the past; but Cavern turns off the Global nature of Chalice in elf decks...this may be a good way to side against burn that they aren't necessarily prepared for.
The big negative is that you pretty much have to run four chanlices and at least three Caverns (and best if you run 4); so you're taking up a HUGE chunk of your board. The good news is that the package is good against a pretty good size of the current meta (Burn, Affinity, Amulet, Infect, Merfolk, etc.) and Cavern ensures that "control" decks (which also include Twin and Scapeshift) have a much tougher time against you. I'm finding some success with this (and it is very likely my board may change to incorporate it after thorough testing...). Hope this helps!
Good stuff here. I'm new so some of this could even just be not knowing how I should be setting up my turns against Burn. My experience has been Searing Blaze or Lightning Bolt/Helix my mana dork T2. T2 cast another elf, only to not be able to put enough velocity together to even scare my opponent before they finished me off. Again I do think Collected Company will help with this.
I like the idea of Primal Command here...just a little worried that by the time I get to the mana for it I'll just be Skullcracked anyway. Chalice at 2 I presume could be pretty nasty against them. I like the synergy w/Cavern in this deck.
Spellskite is so so good, and in so many matchups, and I'm not saying it is even bad in the Burn matchup, just that in a mono green deck (I understand that you were splashing) that is trying to go off ASAP it actually isn't as great as it is in other matchups. Burn only runs roughly 12 cards that target creatures or players, and they get to choose when to cast them, so they don't cast those until they run out of target player only cards, or you've set the Skite in front of their creature. Even then they point the damage at you so you have to pay 2 to redirect it just to kill your own creature.
Talk to me about how you're getting to cast Genesis Wave for 4 creatures? I agree on the Nettle Sentinel block, but that is the only creature that profitably blocks any of Burn's creatures. I haven't gotten past T6 against Burn yet...so maybe I've just had a poor string of luck.
I'm sorry it took a little while to respond.
Sometimes, the advice I give is based on my particular deck (which plays a little different from other decks). This is one of those examples. Basically, where a traditional deck would go:
1. Traditional deck has access to 6 mana (although they can play another or more elves to boost Elvish Archdruid's ability)
2. My deck has access to 13 mana without playing/casting anything else.
1. Assuming the traditional deck casts another 1-drop elf (so it reaches 4 devotion); it has access to 7 mana
2. Without casting anything else, my deck has access to 18 mana.
Obviously, depending on what you cast, you can effectively have more mana (as Nykthos and Elvish Archdruid will "count" elves and green mana symbols). The best case scenario is to just "go infinite" on turn 3 (but I'm pretty sure both decks can do this). This example is meant to show why every once and a while my suggestions may seem a little different. If I was playing burn and had a Genesis Wave, I could cast it at the beginning of turn three for X=15 and pretty much 100% of the time win. That's what I meant by saying casting a Wave for X=6+...I will make sure to think of some other ideas that don't pertain to my version of elves (as it's more helpful that way).
But I do see what you are saying about Spellskite not always being effective against burn...I'll try to see if I can think of some other options.
* P.S. I will post some preliminary testing from "The List" asap. It's an impressive deck. I won't go too far into it now, but hopefully I can provide some useful information. *
Excellent, that explains it, and I do appreciate you taking the time to break it down. I'm definitely more in the aggro build. Not quite Destroyermakers build, but very similar and I'll probably try his out as it seems to give a little of both. I'm new to Elves in Modern, typically been a BGx player, but I started playing TL Elves w/Ezuri and it was a blast, and so I wanted to put a Modern build together and it seems to be a good time to be starting with it.
I'm also a big fan of the Chalice of the Void sideboard plan versus burn...at least as 3 of in the sideboard. For the more aggro style decks you're only running something like 8, plus or minus 2, two drops. So if you can get a Chalice down for X=2 you shut down a LARGE swath of Burn's deck, you we can block their creatures for days with our high creature count, while also playing into the power 3 drops we need. Chalice has application versus other decks as well, though I'm not confident any other matchup is going to be as quite as effective in matchups where we have to drop it as X=1. While we potentially could hit both Chalice and Cavern of Souls it's no guarantee. So while I love it in the burn matchup, I'm not certain how legitimate of an actual sideboard card it would be.
I agree. The Chalice package is certainly something that is VERY specific to a deck. I'm still in "testing mode" with the Chalice package with this build (it worked in one of my prior builds, but was awful in another; so it's a fickle tool). It did make me think of how weak Elf builds are to Chalice (if it becomes a popular sideboard card again with the rise of Grixis Delver, Burn, Affinity, Infect or other such decks)...so you absolutely want to have your Caverns, Leyline of Lifeforce, and/or Gaea's Herald cards at the ready
It is a very different playstyle than Destoryermaker's deck. It's basically the difference between Aggro Elves and Combo Elves...I know it technically has an infinite combo in it; and plays very similar to a combo deck (in the sense that your first few turns are more of a "set up" for a big turn); but that is just how elves decks play. It is certainly on the Aggro side of things where mine is Combo (as far as elves decks go). I like to fill up the board quickly but it's more to go infinite or overrun Garruk Wildspeaker. The more I play them, I find they are more similar than I thought...but the most interesting difference has been that my instant-speed tools are utilized more as "tricks" where Collected Elves uses instant speed more as a pseudo-haste ability (casting Collected Company and Chord on the opponents turn quite often). It makes for a very interesting difference in play. I'm used to "baiting" things on my turn, being pretty darn aggressive because of the excess mana and draw, looking ahead to what I am going to draw into a few draws down the line, etc.; where with Collected Elves I'm more concerned with having the right amount of mana for the correct Chord, thinking about correct attacks for lethal when/if I have Ezuri the next turn, etc. So as similar as they are, they do play differently; so if Aggro decks suit your playstyle better you should most certainly play Collected Elves. I've found playing a deck that fits your playstyle is as important in Modern as the power of the deck is).
Good luck with your deck! Collected Elves is a great one!
I've updated the Devotion list in the primer and I'll be trying it out when I can.
Awesome! Thank you. I hope you enjoy playing it. I can't imagine maintaining a site, multiple primers, writing articles, AND brewing decks like Collected Company Elves (which by the way I have been testing...and I would say it is the most consistent elves deck I've played. Truly a great deck! I wouldn't be surprised if it will end up being what is consider the "Modern Elves" shell for the foreseeable future.
Also, I am in agreement with you that Craterhoof is probably not necessary in the main board. I think a lot of people test pretty much only "game one" scenarios; so they end up diluting their decks to try to beat everything with their game one deck (when you really want to have a plan and do it well game one). Collected Company Elves tries to get to Ezuri (either the infinite combo or just raw ramp power) in game one; and it does it quickly and consistently. I don't think it would necessarily hurt the deck in a majority of situations to add a Craterhoof; but it's just not necessary (as it can't be hit off Collected Company; so you'd really just have another Ezuri). I'll continue testing and let you know what I find.
I'd love to hear your thoughts on the Devotion list if you do find time to play a few games with it. Let me know if you think
a. 4x Nykthos is overkill (i.e. if I only need three).
b. If a flex spot is even needed (or if 19 / 60 land count is fine). If not, would you go 18 lands and another card or 19 lands and 61 total? I know it sounds so minute; but it's something I just haven't completely settled on.
c. Or course, any other cards you think should be in there, etc.
---
P.S. A question arose on the last page about both beating Burn and beating Eidolon of the Great Revel; and I completely forgot a card that I noticed while testing against burn tonight...Kessig Wolf Run...
I won two games against Burn just attacking right through an Eidolon with a Trampling elf. Granted, this works better in decks with Nykthos in them; but even Aggro lists can play Nykthos quite well. I apologize for not thinking of this originally. If you're already splashing red; this is a great answer.
Thanks man. That's encouraging. I've definitely found it to be very consistent in goldfishing, particularly in comparison to 8Rack (my main deck at the moment). It's refreshing.
Well writing is my livelihood and I love Magic, so, it's not too strenuous for me. I am giving up my Stompy primer though (or trying to at least), but that's more because I don't enjoy the deck much (too linear for my tastes). And I've given up on the 8Rack primer (though I am still the author for now).
Yes, Hoof is probably not necessary. I don't doubt it will win the game in some situations Ezuri couldn't, but I think that will be less than the situations where we'd want an Ezuri off a Company and see Hoof instead. But yeah, testing needed I suppose. The 11 mana argument is valid because we have the option to put him into play off Chord without activating him (and we often will do this at the end of our opponent's turn), whereas Hoof always costs 11 off Chord.
I will of course share thoughts. Minute I love; I'm obsessed with perfecting decks, and will do so for months or even years until satisfied.
So as I've mentioned several times I am new to Elves. There are lots of interactions, and sequences involved and help speed up my assimilation of this archetype I'm going to ask a few questions that have probably been asked before. Please answer from the perspective of a more aggro style build, as seen below. I'm sure a lot of the opening sequences when related to the elves themselves are the same in both aggro and combo. Thank you for any feedback...I know I'm asking quite a bit.
What is the ideal opening sequence and thus ideal opening hand? (Pretty sure it involves 2 Nettle Sentinel and a Heritage Druid, but what other pieces do we want?)
What are the key things to look for on hands you mulligan?
Do these decks mulligan well? or should you keep more marginal hands?
How should I be approaching my matchups. Am I supposed to be just throwing as much of my hand down as possible every turn? Or am I supposed to be holding back until I have a group of cards in my hands that offer a good potential of "going off". I know that this is matchup dependent, and experience is king, but again I'm new and I'm sure some generalizations can be made in regards to playing versus AGGRO, MIDRANGE, CONTROL, COMBO.
What are the "key" interactions to know for someone new to the deck? (ex - Nettle Sentinel, Nettle Sentinel, Heritage Druid can essentially cast you through all the elves in your hand due to the Nettle Sentinel's untapping, and Heritage Druid's ability to tap the new summoning sick creature as well.) While I have learned that one there are others I may not be aware of or could be overlooking.
3. Elves mulligans very well.
4. Hoof has haste but doesn't give your creatures haste.
5. Dump your hand against decks without wrath; don't dump your hand against decks with wrath.
3. Elves mulligans very well.
4. Hoof has haste but doesn't give your creatures haste.
5. Dump your hand against decks without wrath; don't dump your hand against decks with wrath.
-1 Lead +1 Chord/Shaman
4. Yeah, totally misremembered that, and I can totally see why it is possibly/probably not necessary then.
So as I've mentioned several times I am new to Elves. There are lots of interactions, and sequences involved and help speed up my assimilation of this archetype I'm going to ask a few questions that have probably been asked before. Please answer from the perspective of a more aggro style build, as seen below. I'm sure a lot of the opening sequences when related to the elves themselves are the same in both aggro and combo. Thank you for any feedback...I know I'm asking quite a bit.
What is the ideal opening sequence and thus ideal opening hand? (Pretty sure it involves 2 Nettle Sentinel and a Heritage Druid, but what other pieces do we want?)
What are the key things to look for on hands you mulligan?
Do these decks mulligan well? or should you keep more marginal hands?
How should I be approaching my matchups. Am I supposed to be just throwing as much of my hand down as possible every turn? Or am I supposed to be holding back until I have a group of cards in my hands that offer a good potential of "going off". I know that this is matchup dependent, and experience is king, but again I'm new and I'm sure some generalizations can be made in regards to playing versus AGGRO, MIDRANGE, CONTROL, COMBO.
What are the "key" interactions to know for someone new to the deck? (ex - Nettle Sentinel, Nettle Sentinel, Heritage Druid can essentially cast you through all the elves in your hand due to the Nettle Sentinel's untapping, and Heritage Druid's ability to tap the new summoning sick creature as well.) While I have learned that one there are others I may not be aware of or could be overlooking.
Not a problem at all. Actually, one of the absolute best parts about Forums like this is to be able to soak up a bunch of knowledge to learn from the experiences of other to get a "learning curve". And there is nothing many of us like more than helping someone explore the archetype we love (in this case Elves). I'll try to answer what I can; and I will seperate my answers to both Aggro and Combo (where those answers differ). To answer your questions (to the best of my knowledge/ability):
1. There are actually a couple great opening sequences:
a. For Aggro versions, you can never really go wrong with:
- Turn 1 - Land into Mana Dork, Turn 2 - Land into Elvish Archdruid. From here you have enough mana to really do pretty much anything you want. It is fragile in the sense that the opponent can kill the Archdruid; but that still eats up a removal spell.
- Turn 1 - Land into Heritage Druid, Turn 2 - Land into 2x Nettle Sentinel. From here you tap all three, cast an elf, untap the Sentinels, tap all three elves, cast another elf. This is what makes the Nettle/Heritage combo awesome! Because nearly every creature/elf is 3-CMC or less, you can basically play your whole hand in many cases. As long as the opponent doesn't have some form of mass removal; you often have a chance to win by turn three (it's best if you can get an Archdruid in play on turn two because he helps trigger Ezuri without having to tap multiple elves that you may want to attack with. Obviously, the combo versions with Cloudstone Curio prefer to cast it on turn 2 in this combo (because it allows them to cast a single card to "go infinite" on turn 3.
2. While the "God Hand" has 2x Nettle Sentinel and 1x Heritage Druid (and usually 2x Forest/land and an Ezuri); you are really generally OK with (a) at least one land (obviously), (b) a turn one play (mana dork), and an Ezuri or tutor/draw card. You're most likely going to draw in to more lands and "support cards" (as 75% of the deck is made up of these two); so as long as you have a good start and a win-con potential in hand; you should be good in most games. Against most decks you'll probably want to "ramp" spells (because opponents will normally destroy the first one you play...everyone's told to "bolt the dork" but it's not 100% necessary to keep the hand. The deck mulligans well, so if you have a hand of all mana dorks, 5 lands and a Chord, etc.; ship it!
**For Combo/Devotion decks, the opening sequences are a little different as the combo of Arbor Elf and Utopia Sprawl is crazy (especially with a Garruk Wildspeaker on T2); but both decks can "go infinite" by turn 3 with two Nettle Sentinels and a Heritage Druid. While you can technically get infinite mana by turn 2 (on the draw); it's not really what you want to do (as you can't do anything with the mana until the next turn). The combo/devotion deck can "go infinite" in multiple ways by turn 3 (depending on if you hit a Nykthos, an Arbor Elf, etc.) but I won't bore everyone with those here.**
3. As stated above, the decks tend to mulligan pretty well as there is a lot of redundancy in the Aggro version and a ton of cheap card draw in the combo versions to ensure you tend to can spend all of your mana efficiently each turn even on a mulligan. It can be a little difficult when you keep a hand of 2x Land, 2x Elvish Mystic, a Devoted Druid, and an Ezuri and then the opponent Thoughtseize's you and takes your Ezuri (as there is a chance you spend the next four turns drawing more mana elves/lands); but with 4 Visionaries, 3 Chords, 4 Collected Company, and 2 more Ezuri; you most likely will get to an Ezuri within a few turns.
4. A simple answer to your question is yes Craterhoof Behemoth has always been one of the best win-cons for Elves decks ever. The big reason is the one you hit on the nail...HASTE. It pumps everyone immediately and has haste himself. It is difficult to cast of Chord (which is generally why decks playing Craterhoof have opted for Summoner's Pact in the past). This deck needs the Chords though due to the power of Spellskite. We had discussed it a little; but I honestly think you aren't making a mistake by adding a Craterhoof to the aggro deck. There are some games you will win simply because you top deck it and/or have it. It's just not entirely necessary in game one (as it doesn't have synergy with Chord of Calling or Collected Company. It's really down to your preference. Many people love having Craterhoof available as it can just steal games (and many worry that having only effectively a single win con is not enough). I would still play one in the board (just in case the opponent plays some kine of mass exile effect (like Slaughter Games) and removes Ezuri, etc.) if I didn't play one main. Like I said though; you're fine putting in the main board as well from the get go. You just don't HAVE to.
5. A vast majority of decks you are going to want to play very proactively (aggressively). The main power in elf decks comes from the overwhelming/snowballing effect the deck can create extremely quickly. Destroyermaker pretty much put it perfectly for the aggro versions of the deck. If the opponent has access to wrath effects (generally this will be Supreme Verdict, Anger of the Gods, Zealous Persecution (in token decks), Bile Blight, Engineered Explosives, Pyroclasm, Ugin/Tron Wrath (there's a couple)_
To break it down by "General" archetype; very generally you will want to play aggressively against Aggro and Combo while "holding back" a little against Control and Midrange. Some midrange decks (like Abzan) however, tend to be pretty good matchups for us and you tend to want to play a little more agressively; so there are certainly
exceptions to the above. I would say when in doubt, play aggressively and try to overwhelm the opponent. This (a) puts pressure on the opponent so they can't play exactly like they want and (b) lets you take advantage of the synergy among your cards. Also, make sure you pay attention to the opponent's mana. Sometimes they may have the number of mana they need, but not the colors.
**In the Combo/Devotion version; you pretty much always want to pour out your hand out quickly. There are few games where you don't want to do so (sometimes vs. Tron on turn 2 if they have red mana you may want to wait a turn to play elves if you can't get to Heritage druid "tap 3" ability...etc.) Because the deck draws so many cards, the more you play, the more you draw, the greater potential for both "infinite loops" as well as "draw loops". The devotion/combo version is less worried about wrath due to it's use of enchantments and Cloudstone Curio (i.e. Abundant Growth Loops will refill your hand, you can cast a Genesis Wave following a wrath to refil the board, etc.) Wrath like Engineered Ezplosives, however can be effective. Again, I won't waste a ton of time on it oustide of saying that generally you will want to play more aggressively with the Devotion/Combo version than you do the Aggro version.**
6. Some of the interesting interactions seen in many elf decks include:
Aggro Versions
a) The obvious Nettle Sentinel + Nettle Sentinel + Heritage Druid ( and in Combo versions + Cloudstone Curio)
b) Ezuri, Renegade Leader + Devoted Druid + Devoted Druid + G. This leads to infinitely large elves and infinite mana as you can tap each Druid, untap them, tap them again, and with the addition of one other mana; the "buff" they get form Ezuri is larger than the -1/-1 counter which in turn allows them to tap/untap wtice without dying. This leads to 6 mana, which is enough to trigger Ezuri again AND nets 1 mana.
c) Elvish Archdruid + 1-drop elves. With a non-summoning sick Elvish Archdruid in play; each 1-drop becomes effectively "free"; so traditionally you are going to want to cast them prior to taping your Archdruid.
d) Devoted Druid + Chord of Calling - You can tap Devoted Druid as "Convoke mana" and then turn around an untap it with it's ability. This can be useful in later game scenarios where you want to Chord for an Ezuri and have enough mana to trigger him the same turn (as the Devoted Druid can attack at that point, or if you have two can "go infinite".
e) Eternal Witness + Collected Company - Kind of straight forward, but you can cast CC, grab a Witness, and use Witness's ability to recur the CC. If you have enough mana you can go ahead and cast it again!
f. If you play a Dryad Arbor, you can Chord for with three mana or by tapping three creatures and/or you can choose it via Collected Company. This essentially lets you play an extra land that turn. It's very rarely useful (which is why you don't see Dryad Arbor in many builds); but it can be a useful card with Craterhoof, Pendlehaven, and especially in Beck/Call and/or Intruder Alarm versions.
g. A Commonly forgot ability (hopefully forgot by your opponents ) is Ezuri's regenerate ability. Against aggro decks, it's very useful to help you declare blocks and regenerate at instant speed.
Cloudstone Combo Versions
a) Obviously the above infinite combo of Nettle, Nettle, Heritage + Cloudstone Curio. With a 1-drop elf you have infinite mana. With Elvish Visionary you have infinite draws.
b) With either of the above you have infinite Enter the Battlefield (and Leave the Battlefield) triggers. This allows you abuse cards like Purphoros, God of the Forge, Impact Tremors, Siege Outpost, Eidolon of the Blossoms, Elvish Archdruid, and many others (basically anything that triggers with a creature/enchantment entering the battlefield/being cast).
c) Abundant Growth + 1-drop enchantment + Cloudstone Curio. This loop allows you to draw cards at the cost of GG (if the other enchantment is a Utopia Sprawl) or just G if the second enchantment is another Abundant Growth. Of course, you can do so as well with Purpphoros, Siege Outpost, etc.; but they are far more expensive to "loop". It gets exceedingly crazy with a copy of Eidolon of the Blossoms in play. I had this as my flex spot for some time and there is every possibility it will be there to stay in many metas.
d) Garruk Wildspeaker and Nykthos - Obviously this is straight forward as well. Often times, Garruk will untap a Forest enchanted with one or more Utopia Sprawls AND a Nykthos, to re-trigger the Nykthos all by himself. This becomes especially useful if you hit a Garruk, Nykthos, or both off of a Genesis Wave, if you hit a Garruk during a "draw loop" (as you can then untap and generate tons more mana to continue looping), and/or grab one via Eternal Witness.
e) Fetch Land + Abundant Growth + Eternal Witness - You can enchant a fetch land with an Abundant Growth to either not take the damage, or to have the option to tap it, sac it, cast Eternal Witness, and grab back the Abundant Growth. While this may be a small interaction; it is nice early game if you have nothing else to do with you Witness (and ends up being a lot of card advantage)
f) Primal Command/ Eternal Witness - this also is a somewhat well known combo; but basically you can tutor up Eternal Witness with Command, and recur the Command. There are several options; but with Cloudstone Curio, you can continue to bounce Eternal Witness, gaining infinite life and putting all of the opponent's lands on top of their library.
g) Temur Sabertooth + Nettle Sentinel + Nettle Sentinel + Heritage Druid = This will net you infinite ETB/LTB triggers as well. Tap all three elves, use two mana to "bounce" the Heritage Druid, use the remaining one to cast it. The more I talk about these, the more I wish Gilt-Leaf Archdruid only cost 4-mana! Such a fun card.
There are couple more with other elves, sideboard cards, and of course a full set of interactions for Beck/Call and Intruder Alarm versions of elf decks (I would love to hear more about them from players of that style on here...the Dryad Arbor and Forgotten Orchard interactions are especially fun.
Hopefully this is helpful. It's by no means a complete source of information; but it is a good amount of the important interactions, etc. I am going to to try to put together a little "testing recap" for the Aggro deck similar to what I have done with my Devotion/Combo version (I haven't posted it yet because I didn't want to muddle the conversation of the Aggro deck presented in the Modern Nexus...many aggro players need to try out the deck without being confused with testing results/discussion about a deck that plays a little differently in certain match ups). Let me know if you have any other questions. GREAT LUCK! Your deck looks great. You put your own spin on it; but it still looks super competitive and super consistent!
Thanks guys! Now that Collected Company is out on MTGO I plan to put in some tracked rounds.
I have to admit I did not "get" Purphoros or Eidolon of Blossoms in your build until I read your break down...and now it seems brilliant.
Haha! Yeah, it is certainly a list that looks really odd on paper. In all honesty, even in play it takes a few dozen games to get the feel for it It's the deck I'm most proud of. I really appreciate the kind words.
That's awesome that your playing on MTGO. That helps the visibility of the deck a ton. The deck looks good. Good luck!
One other question I have. I see a lot of talk about how our deck/sideboard shouldn't be filled w/reactive cards, but when I look at the Legacy lists they have plenty of Abrupt Decay/Thoughtseize etc. I'm wondering why we think this is a bad idea in modern?
Got 5 matches in online this morning so far, Tourney Practice Room. Probably not a whole lot more for today being Easter. I played with the list below. Oddly enough I ran into almost all combo decks going 4-1. Twice I played a Devotion/Through the Breach Emrakul deck which I won 2-1 vs in the first match and later lost 0-2 when G1 they hit T3 Breach into Emrakul, and I just really didn't have the right pieces Game 2.
Beyond that, I played a Green Devotion w/Tooth and Nail and Emrakul (lots of Emrakul this morning), a Mardu Aristocrats, and a Naya Soul Sisters deck. Again 4-1 in matches and 8-4 in games. My big takeaway was the Devoted Druid combo w/ Ezuri, Renegade Leader is the real deal. I won no fewer than 4 games off infinite mana/pumps. Against Aristocrats I was able to do this before the turn they sac'd everything to drain me out. Versus Soul Sisters I was able to do this to pump over their insane lifegain totals. Fauna Shaman is also really good, and I may put a second in the side. I still really like Craterhoof just to give me an alternate win con, but maybe I keep that in the side for matchups that an alternate wincon matters and otherwise run the second Shaman main. I also could consider Eternal Witness in the side for the second shaman, but Eternal Witnessing a Collected Company back into your hand is just as good as advertised.
One other question I have. I see a lot of talk about how our deck/sideboard shouldn't be filled w/reactive cards, but when I look at the Legacy lists they have plenty of Abrupt Decay/Thoughtseize etc. I'm wondering why we think this is a bad idea in modern?
By reactive I mean things we have to hold up mana for, for things that may or may not happen, like Wrap in Vigor. We don't have to hold up mana for Decay or TS, and they are almost always useful. Also the Legacy meta is very different and makes those cards necessary - not so much Modern.
I play a list very similar to TCG requiem, except I have 4 cloudstone curio. Temur sabertooth has been utilized mostly in my flex spot. How do people feel about Temur sabertooth? I know CurdBros utilizes one, I personally have really liked the card and think it well deserves its spot as a one of MB.
I play a list very similar to TCG requiem, except I have 4 cloudstone curio. Temur sabertooth has been utilized mostly in my flex spot. How do people feel about Temur sabertooth? I know CurdBros utilizes one, I personally have really liked the card and think it well deserves its spot as a one of MB.
To me it seems great in the combo version but less so in the aggro builds.
Yes I can record some footage. .. how do you want me to get it to you? I've got an FLV recorder.
I play a list very similar to TCG requiem, except I have 4 cloudstone curio. Temur sabertooth has been utilized mostly in my flex spot. How do people feel about Temur sabertooth? I know CurdBros utilizes one, I personally have really liked the card and think it well deserves its spot as a one of MB.
To me it seems great in the combo version but less so in the aggro builds.
Yes I can record some footage. .. how do you want me to get it to you? I've got an FLV recorder.
I agree. It is great in combo versions; but probably less so in Aggro-Versions.
In a deck where you can abuse ETB effects and where you have a TON of mana (as just bouncing an Elvish Visionary to draw a card costs 4-mana) it is a great card. That, and it can protect any creature(s) you want while also acting as a Cloudstone Curio number five (if the opponent can somehow remove your Curios (it takes an additional Nettle Sentinel; but it definitely happens).
Tap two druids for two mana, untap both, tap for two more; tap another mana source for a fifth mana, use Ezuri’s pump ability. Druids are now 3/4; tap/untap Druids for 6 mana, making them 1/2; use Ezuri’s pump ability, making them 4/5, etc. You net mana each time, letting you go infinite. That sufficient?
Feel free to critique this in any way you'd like. I know I got a bit sloppy at the end of the night. I can wear a headphonew/mic for sound if the sound is to bad. If you see any misplay trends please let me know. Again I'm still very new to the deck.
Can someone explain to me step-by-step the Ezuri-Devoted Druid-Devoted Druid combo? Want to make sure I have it down before tomorrow.
Sure thing. I love doing these write ups.
First have two unsick Devoted Druids. Also, they for the example below they have no -1/-1 counters on them. If yours do have counters just add one extra G for each counter to start.
For the combo you'll also need one extra mana.
Battlefield: 2xDevoted Druid, Ezuri, Renegade Leader
Stack: Empty
Druid Stats: 0/2, 0 -1/-1 counters
Mana Pool: G
Start by tapping both druids for Mana and activating their untap ability.
Loop: Take note of the game state below. If your opponent is not aware of the combo be sure they see and understand what state the game is in after the overrun resolves. Resolve the Overrun ability.
Battlefield: T2xDevoted Druid, Ezuri
Stack: Ezuri Overrun
Druid Stats: -1/1, 4 -1/-1 counters
Mana Pool: G
Let the overrun resolve and note the game state to your opponent if they aren't familiar with the loop like you did above.
Battlefield: T2xDevoted Druid, Ezuri
Stack: Empty
Druid Stats: 2/4, 4 -1/-1 counters
Mana Pool: G
You now have the same state except for 3 more -1/-1 counters on the druids and one extra mana in your pool.
Repeat that loop until you have a sufficiently large amount of mana. 5,000xG and 15,000 -1/-1 counters on the druids. The overrun negates the counters so you'll still have 2/4 Druids. Now with that 5,000G you can activate Ezuri 1,000 times. The Druids will now be 3002/3004 trampling monsters until the end of the turn.
Shortcuts in Magic
Also if you are performing a combo like this it would be good to brush up on the Magic shortcut rules. The short version is your opponent cannot refuse a shortcut. So you won't have to go through the loop 15 or 15,000 times. You only need describe it and then list how many times you will go through the loop. Destroyermaker linked the rules in the primer and I've put them here too.
Rough mic. You may have better luck enabling the 'force mic to mono' option in audio options. Sounds like your mic is just not very good though, so that will only help so much.
Footage is not bad but should be 1080p and shouldn't capture your taskbar. Assuming you have a 1080p monitor, go Options > Video > Custom > 1920 x 1080 (or whatever your native resolution is) > Res Downscale None. For the taskbar issue, right click Monitor Capture > properties > sub region > select the MTGO window.
I agree. The Chalice package is certainly something that is VERY specific to a deck. I'm still in "testing mode" with the Chalice package with this build (it worked in one of my prior builds, but was awful in another; so it's a fickle tool). It did make me think of how weak Elf builds are to Chalice (if it becomes a popular sideboard card again with the rise of Grixis Delver, Burn, Affinity, Infect or other such decks)...so you absolutely want to have your Caverns, Leyline of Lifeforce, and/or Gaea's Herald cards at the ready
It is a very different playstyle than Destoryermaker's deck. It's basically the difference between Aggro Elves and Combo Elves...I know it technically has an infinite combo in it; and plays very similar to a combo deck (in the sense that your first few turns are more of a "set up" for a big turn); but that is just how elves decks play. It is certainly on the Aggro side of things where mine is Combo (as far as elves decks go). I like to fill up the board quickly but it's more to go infinite or overrun Garruk Wildspeaker. The more I play them, I find they are more similar than I thought...but the most interesting difference has been that my instant-speed tools are utilized more as "tricks" where Collected Elves uses instant speed more as a pseudo-haste ability (casting Collected Company and Chord on the opponents turn quite often). It makes for a very interesting difference in play. I'm used to "baiting" things on my turn, being pretty darn aggressive because of the excess mana and draw, looking ahead to what I am going to draw into a few draws down the line, etc.; where with Collected Elves I'm more concerned with having the right amount of mana for the correct Chord, thinking about correct attacks for lethal when/if I have Ezuri the next turn, etc. So as similar as they are, they do play differently; so if Aggro decks suit your playstyle better you should most certainly play Collected Elves. I've found playing a deck that fits your playstyle is as important in Modern as the power of the deck is).
Good luck with your deck! Collected Elves is a great one!
Awesome! Thank you. I hope you enjoy playing it. I can't imagine maintaining a site, multiple primers, writing articles, AND brewing decks like Collected Company Elves (which by the way I have been testing...and I would say it is the most consistent elves deck I've played. Truly a great deck! I wouldn't be surprised if it will end up being what is consider the "Modern Elves" shell for the foreseeable future.
Also, I am in agreement with you that Craterhoof is probably not necessary in the main board. I think a lot of people test pretty much only "game one" scenarios; so they end up diluting their decks to try to beat everything with their game one deck (when you really want to have a plan and do it well game one). Collected Company Elves tries to get to Ezuri (either the infinite combo or just raw ramp power) in game one; and it does it quickly and consistently. I don't think it would necessarily hurt the deck in a majority of situations to add a Craterhoof; but it's just not necessary (as it can't be hit off Collected Company; so you'd really just have another Ezuri). I'll continue testing and let you know what I find.
I'd love to hear your thoughts on the Devotion list if you do find time to play a few games with it. Let me know if you think
a. 4x Nykthos is overkill (i.e. if I only need three).
b. If a flex spot is even needed (or if 19 / 60 land count is fine). If not, would you go 18 lands and another card or 19 lands and 61 total? I know it sounds so minute; but it's something I just haven't completely settled on.
c. Or course, any other cards you think should be in there, etc.
---
P.S. A question arose on the last page about both beating Burn and beating Eidolon of the Great Revel; and I completely forgot a card that I noticed while testing against burn tonight...Kessig Wolf Run...
I won two games against Burn just attacking right through an Eidolon with a Trampling elf. Granted, this works better in decks with Nykthos in them; but even Aggro lists can play Nykthos quite well. I apologize for not thinking of this originally. If you're already splashing red; this is a great answer.
Well writing is my livelihood and I love Magic, so, it's not too strenuous for me. I am giving up my Stompy primer though (or trying to at least), but that's more because I don't enjoy the deck much (too linear for my tastes). And I've given up on the 8Rack primer (though I am still the author for now).
Yes, Hoof is probably not necessary. I don't doubt it will win the game in some situations Ezuri couldn't, but I think that will be less than the situations where we'd want an Ezuri off a Company and see Hoof instead. But yeah, testing needed I suppose. The 11 mana argument is valid because we have the option to put him into play off Chord without activating him (and we often will do this at the end of our opponent's turn), whereas Hoof always costs 11 off Chord.
I will of course share thoughts. Minute I love; I'm obsessed with perfecting decks, and will do so for months or even years until satisfied.
4 Elvish Mystic
4 Llanowar Elves
4 Heritage Druid
4 Nettle Sentinel
3 Devoted Druid
4 Elvish Visionary
4 Elvish Archdruid
3 Ezuri, Renegade Leader
1 Fauna Shaman
1 Eternal Witness
1 Spellskite
1 Craterhoof Behemoth
1 Lead the Stampede
4 Collected Company
3 Chord of Calling
Lands (18)
12 Forest
3 Cavern of Souls
2 Nykthos
1 Pendelhaven
3 Essence Warden
3 Leyline of Vitality
1 Spellskite
3 Scavenging Ooze
2 Fracturing Gust
3 Reclamation Sage
4. Hoof has haste but doesn't give your creatures haste.
5. Dump your hand against decks without wrath; don't dump your hand against decks with wrath.
-1 Lead +1 Chord/Shaman
4. Yeah, totally misremembered that, and I can totally see why it is possibly/probably not necessary then.
Not a problem at all. Actually, one of the absolute best parts about Forums like this is to be able to soak up a bunch of knowledge to learn from the experiences of other to get a "learning curve". And there is nothing many of us like more than helping someone explore the archetype we love (in this case Elves). I'll try to answer what I can; and I will seperate my answers to both Aggro and Combo (where those answers differ). To answer your questions (to the best of my knowledge/ability):
1. There are actually a couple great opening sequences:
a. For Aggro versions, you can never really go wrong with:
- Turn 1 - Land into Mana Dork, Turn 2 - Land into Elvish Archdruid. From here you have enough mana to really do pretty much anything you want. It is fragile in the sense that the opponent can kill the Archdruid; but that still eats up a removal spell.
- Turn 1 - Land into Heritage Druid, Turn 2 - Land into 2x Nettle Sentinel. From here you tap all three, cast an elf, untap the Sentinels, tap all three elves, cast another elf. This is what makes the Nettle/Heritage combo awesome! Because nearly every creature/elf is 3-CMC or less, you can basically play your whole hand in many cases. As long as the opponent doesn't have some form of mass removal; you often have a chance to win by turn three (it's best if you can get an Archdruid in play on turn two because he helps trigger Ezuri without having to tap multiple elves that you may want to attack with. Obviously, the combo versions with Cloudstone Curio prefer to cast it on turn 2 in this combo (because it allows them to cast a single card to "go infinite" on turn 3.
2. While the "God Hand" has 2x Nettle Sentinel and 1x Heritage Druid (and usually 2x Forest/land and an Ezuri); you are really generally OK with (a) at least one land (obviously), (b) a turn one play (mana dork), and an Ezuri or tutor/draw card. You're most likely going to draw in to more lands and "support cards" (as 75% of the deck is made up of these two); so as long as you have a good start and a win-con potential in hand; you should be good in most games. Against most decks you'll probably want to "ramp" spells (because opponents will normally destroy the first one you play...everyone's told to "bolt the dork" but it's not 100% necessary to keep the hand. The deck mulligans well, so if you have a hand of all mana dorks, 5 lands and a Chord, etc.; ship it!
**For Combo/Devotion decks, the opening sequences are a little different as the combo of Arbor Elf and Utopia Sprawl is crazy (especially with a Garruk Wildspeaker on T2); but both decks can "go infinite" by turn 3 with two Nettle Sentinels and a Heritage Druid. While you can technically get infinite mana by turn 2 (on the draw); it's not really what you want to do (as you can't do anything with the mana until the next turn). The combo/devotion deck can "go infinite" in multiple ways by turn 3 (depending on if you hit a Nykthos, an Arbor Elf, etc.) but I won't bore everyone with those here.**
3. As stated above, the decks tend to mulligan pretty well as there is a lot of redundancy in the Aggro version and a ton of cheap card draw in the combo versions to ensure you tend to can spend all of your mana efficiently each turn even on a mulligan. It can be a little difficult when you keep a hand of 2x Land, 2x Elvish Mystic, a Devoted Druid, and an Ezuri and then the opponent Thoughtseize's you and takes your Ezuri (as there is a chance you spend the next four turns drawing more mana elves/lands); but with 4 Visionaries, 3 Chords, 4 Collected Company, and 2 more Ezuri; you most likely will get to an Ezuri within a few turns.
4. A simple answer to your question is yes Craterhoof Behemoth has always been one of the best win-cons for Elves decks ever. The big reason is the one you hit on the nail...HASTE. It pumps everyone immediately and has haste himself. It is difficult to cast of Chord (which is generally why decks playing Craterhoof have opted for Summoner's Pact in the past). This deck needs the Chords though due to the power of Spellskite. We had discussed it a little; but I honestly think you aren't making a mistake by adding a Craterhoof to the aggro deck. There are some games you will win simply because you top deck it and/or have it. It's just not entirely necessary in game one (as it doesn't have synergy with Chord of Calling or Collected Company. It's really down to your preference. Many people love having Craterhoof available as it can just steal games (and many worry that having only effectively a single win con is not enough). I would still play one in the board (just in case the opponent plays some kine of mass exile effect (like Slaughter Games) and removes Ezuri, etc.) if I didn't play one main. Like I said though; you're fine putting in the main board as well from the get go. You just don't HAVE to.
5. A vast majority of decks you are going to want to play very proactively (aggressively). The main power in elf decks comes from the overwhelming/snowballing effect the deck can create extremely quickly. Destroyermaker pretty much put it perfectly for the aggro versions of the deck. If the opponent has access to wrath effects (generally this will be Supreme Verdict, Anger of the Gods, Zealous Persecution (in token decks), Bile Blight, Engineered Explosives, Pyroclasm, Ugin/Tron Wrath (there's a couple)_
To break it down by "General" archetype; very generally you will want to play aggressively against Aggro and Combo while "holding back" a little against Control and Midrange. Some midrange decks (like Abzan) however, tend to be pretty good matchups for us and you tend to want to play a little more agressively; so there are certainly
exceptions to the above. I would say when in doubt, play aggressively and try to overwhelm the opponent. This (a) puts pressure on the opponent so they can't play exactly like they want and (b) lets you take advantage of the synergy among your cards. Also, make sure you pay attention to the opponent's mana. Sometimes they may have the number of mana they need, but not the colors.
**In the Combo/Devotion version; you pretty much always want to pour out your hand out quickly. There are few games where you don't want to do so (sometimes vs. Tron on turn 2 if they have red mana you may want to wait a turn to play elves if you can't get to Heritage druid "tap 3" ability...etc.) Because the deck draws so many cards, the more you play, the more you draw, the greater potential for both "infinite loops" as well as "draw loops". The devotion/combo version is less worried about wrath due to it's use of enchantments and Cloudstone Curio (i.e. Abundant Growth Loops will refill your hand, you can cast a Genesis Wave following a wrath to refil the board, etc.) Wrath like Engineered Ezplosives, however can be effective. Again, I won't waste a ton of time on it oustide of saying that generally you will want to play more aggressively with the Devotion/Combo version than you do the Aggro version.**
6. Some of the interesting interactions seen in many elf decks include:
Aggro Versions
a) The obvious Nettle Sentinel + Nettle Sentinel + Heritage Druid ( and in Combo versions + Cloudstone Curio)
b) Ezuri, Renegade Leader + Devoted Druid + Devoted Druid + G. This leads to infinitely large elves and infinite mana as you can tap each Druid, untap them, tap them again, and with the addition of one other mana; the "buff" they get form Ezuri is larger than the -1/-1 counter which in turn allows them to tap/untap wtice without dying. This leads to 6 mana, which is enough to trigger Ezuri again AND nets 1 mana.
c) Elvish Archdruid + 1-drop elves. With a non-summoning sick Elvish Archdruid in play; each 1-drop becomes effectively "free"; so traditionally you are going to want to cast them prior to taping your Archdruid.
d) Devoted Druid + Chord of Calling - You can tap Devoted Druid as "Convoke mana" and then turn around an untap it with it's ability. This can be useful in later game scenarios where you want to Chord for an Ezuri and have enough mana to trigger him the same turn (as the Devoted Druid can attack at that point, or if you have two can "go infinite".
e) Eternal Witness + Collected Company - Kind of straight forward, but you can cast CC, grab a Witness, and use Witness's ability to recur the CC. If you have enough mana you can go ahead and cast it again!
f. If you play a Dryad Arbor, you can Chord for with three mana or by tapping three creatures and/or you can choose it via Collected Company. This essentially lets you play an extra land that turn. It's very rarely useful (which is why you don't see Dryad Arbor in many builds); but it can be a useful card with Craterhoof, Pendlehaven, and especially in Beck/Call and/or Intruder Alarm versions.
g. A Commonly forgot ability (hopefully forgot by your opponents ) is Ezuri's regenerate ability. Against aggro decks, it's very useful to help you declare blocks and regenerate at instant speed.
Cloudstone Combo Versions
a) Obviously the above infinite combo of Nettle, Nettle, Heritage + Cloudstone Curio. With a 1-drop elf you have infinite mana. With Elvish Visionary you have infinite draws.
b) With either of the above you have infinite Enter the Battlefield (and Leave the Battlefield) triggers. This allows you abuse cards like Purphoros, God of the Forge, Impact Tremors, Siege Outpost, Eidolon of the Blossoms, Elvish Archdruid, and many others (basically anything that triggers with a creature/enchantment entering the battlefield/being cast).
c) Abundant Growth + 1-drop enchantment + Cloudstone Curio. This loop allows you to draw cards at the cost of GG (if the other enchantment is a Utopia Sprawl) or just G if the second enchantment is another Abundant Growth. Of course, you can do so as well with Purpphoros, Siege Outpost, etc.; but they are far more expensive to "loop". It gets exceedingly crazy with a copy of Eidolon of the Blossoms in play. I had this as my flex spot for some time and there is every possibility it will be there to stay in many metas.
d) Garruk Wildspeaker and Nykthos - Obviously this is straight forward as well. Often times, Garruk will untap a Forest enchanted with one or more Utopia Sprawls AND a Nykthos, to re-trigger the Nykthos all by himself. This becomes especially useful if you hit a Garruk, Nykthos, or both off of a Genesis Wave, if you hit a Garruk during a "draw loop" (as you can then untap and generate tons more mana to continue looping), and/or grab one via Eternal Witness.
e) Fetch Land + Abundant Growth + Eternal Witness - You can enchant a fetch land with an Abundant Growth to either not take the damage, or to have the option to tap it, sac it, cast Eternal Witness, and grab back the Abundant Growth. While this may be a small interaction; it is nice early game if you have nothing else to do with you Witness (and ends up being a lot of card advantage)
f) Primal Command/ Eternal Witness - this also is a somewhat well known combo; but basically you can tutor up Eternal Witness with Command, and recur the Command. There are several options; but with Cloudstone Curio, you can continue to bounce Eternal Witness, gaining infinite life and putting all of the opponent's lands on top of their library.
g) Temur Sabertooth + Nettle Sentinel + Nettle Sentinel + Heritage Druid = This will net you infinite ETB/LTB triggers as well. Tap all three elves, use two mana to "bounce" the Heritage Druid, use the remaining one to cast it. The more I talk about these, the more I wish Gilt-Leaf Archdruid only cost 4-mana! Such a fun card.
There are couple more with other elves, sideboard cards, and of course a full set of interactions for Beck/Call and Intruder Alarm versions of elf decks (I would love to hear more about them from players of that style on here...the Dryad Arbor and Forgotten Orchard interactions are especially fun.
Hopefully this is helpful. It's by no means a complete source of information; but it is a good amount of the important interactions, etc. I am going to to try to put together a little "testing recap" for the Aggro deck similar to what I have done with my Devotion/Combo version (I haven't posted it yet because I didn't want to muddle the conversation of the Aggro deck presented in the Modern Nexus...many aggro players need to try out the deck without being confused with testing results/discussion about a deck that plays a little differently in certain match ups). Let me know if you have any other questions. GREAT LUCK! Your deck looks great. You put your own spin on it; but it still looks super competitive and super consistent!
I have to admit I did not "get" Purphoros or Eidolon of Blossoms in your build until I read your break down...and now it seems brilliant.
Haha! Yeah, it is certainly a list that looks really odd on paper. In all honesty, even in play it takes a few dozen games to get the feel for it It's the deck I'm most proud of. I really appreciate the kind words.
That's awesome that your playing on MTGO. That helps the visibility of the deck a ton. The deck looks good. Good luck!
Beyond that, I played a Green Devotion w/Tooth and Nail and Emrakul (lots of Emrakul this morning), a Mardu Aristocrats, and a Naya Soul Sisters deck. Again 4-1 in matches and 8-4 in games. My big takeaway was the Devoted Druid combo w/ Ezuri, Renegade Leader is the real deal. I won no fewer than 4 games off infinite mana/pumps. Against Aristocrats I was able to do this before the turn they sac'd everything to drain me out. Versus Soul Sisters I was able to do this to pump over their insane lifegain totals. Fauna Shaman is also really good, and I may put a second in the side. I still really like Craterhoof just to give me an alternate win con, but maybe I keep that in the side for matchups that an alternate wincon matters and otherwise run the second Shaman main. I also could consider Eternal Witness in the side for the second shaman, but Eternal Witnessing a Collected Company back into your hand is just as good as advertised.
So much fun!!!
4 Elvish Mystic
4 Llanowar Elves
4 Heritage Druid
4 Nettle Sentinel
4 Devoted Druid
4 Elvish Visionary
4 Elvish Archdruid
3 Ezuri, Renegade Leader
1 Fauna Shaman
1 Eternal Witness
1 Spellskite
1 Craterhoof Behemoth
4 Collected Company
3 Chord of Calling
Lands (18)
12 Forest
3 Cavern of Souls
2 Nykthos
1 Pendelhaven
2 Essence Warden
1 Bow of Nylea
3 Leyline of Vitality
1 Spellskite
3 Scavenging Ooze
2 Fracturing Gust
3 Reclamation Sage
By reactive I mean things we have to hold up mana for, for things that may or may not happen, like Wrap in Vigor. We don't have to hold up mana for Decay or TS, and they are almost always useful. Also the Legacy meta is very different and makes those cards necessary - not so much Modern.
To me it seems great in the combo version but less so in the aggro builds.
Yes I can record some footage. .. how do you want me to get it to you? I've got an FLV recorder.
YouTube would be great man c:
In a deck where you can abuse ETB effects and where you have a TON of mana (as just bouncing an Elvish Visionary to draw a card costs 4-mana) it is a great card. That, and it can protect any creature(s) you want while also acting as a Cloudstone Curio number five (if the opponent can somehow remove your Curios (it takes an additional Nettle Sentinel; but it definitely happens).
Legacy:
combo elves
Modern:
White Rock (41-24-4 in matches. Beginning 10/14/14. Last updated 1/2/15)
List:
4 Dark Confidant
3 Siege Rhino
1 Thrun, The Last Troll
Spells - 20
4 Inquisition of Kozilek
3 Thoughtseize
4 abrupt decay
2 maelstrom pulse
1 slaughter pact
1 path to exile
1 Disfigure
1 damnation
3 lingering souls
NCP - 4
3 Liliana of the Veil
1 Bow of Nylea
4 verdant Catacombs
2 marsh flats
2 windswept heath
2 Swamp
1 Forest
1 Plains
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
3 overgrown tomb
1 godless shrine
1 temple garden
1 Treetop Village
2 stirring wildwood
2 Tectonic Edge
4 Leyline of Sanctity
1 Thrun, the last troll
2 Duress
1 Creeping Corrosion
2 Stony Silence
2 Nihil Spellbomb
1 Back to nature
1 Utter End
1 Golgari Charm
Collected Elves Primer - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5L5B3ItkP-8
Collected Elves vs Burn - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IOUWeheyin4
Collected Elves vs Mono U Tron - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aARHiOMVCQ0
Collected Elves vs Stompy - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cnccQ-lt9XQ
Feel free to critique this in any way you'd like. I know I got a bit sloppy at the end of the night. I can wear a headphonew/mic for sound if the sound is to bad. If you see any misplay trends please let me know. Again I'm still very new to the deck.
First have two unsick Devoted Druids. Also, they for the example below they have no -1/-1 counters on them. If yours do have counters just add one extra G for each counter to start.
For the combo you'll also need one extra mana. Start by tapping both druids for Mana and activating their untap ability. You'll now have two tapped druids that are -1/1s and three green mana. Let the untaps resolve. Now tap the two druids for mana bringing your total to 5. Use all 5 of that in Ezuri's second ability. Loop: Take note of the game state below. If your opponent is not aware of the combo be sure they see and understand what state the game is in after the overrun resolves. Resolve the Overrun ability. With the druids no longer having 1 toughness activate their untap ability and let it resolve. Tap both druids for mana and activate their untap ability. Let the druids untap and tap them again for mana. Activate their untap ability one more time. Let the untap resolve and tap them for even more mana. Now activate the overrun ability of Ezuri. Let the overrun resolve and note the game state to your opponent if they aren't familiar with the loop like you did above. You now have the same state except for 3 more -1/-1 counters on the druids and one extra mana in your pool.
Repeat that loop until you have a sufficiently large amount of mana. 5,000xG and 15,000 -1/-1 counters on the druids. The overrun negates the counters so you'll still have 2/4 Druids. Now with that 5,000G you can activate Ezuri 1,000 times. The Druids will now be 3002/3004 trampling monsters until the end of the turn.
Shortcuts in Magic
Also if you are performing a combo like this it would be good to brush up on the Magic shortcut rules. The short version is your opponent cannot refuse a shortcut. So you won't have to go through the loop 15 or 15,000 times. You only need describe it and then list how many times you will go through the loop. Destroyermaker linked the rules in the primer and I've put them here too.
Footage is not bad but should be 1080p and shouldn't capture your taskbar. Assuming you have a 1080p monitor, go Options > Video > Custom > 1920 x 1080 (or whatever your native resolution is) > Res Downscale None. For the taskbar issue, right click Monitor Capture > properties > sub region > select the MTGO window.
Here's the article, which includes video footage of the Ezuri/Devoted Druid version, along with impressions: http://modernnexus.com/video-testing-collected-company-elves
CurdBros, you were right: Nykthos is sick here.
Updated list:
4 Elvish Mystic
4 Llanowar Elves
4 Heritage Druid
4 Nettle Sentinel
4 Devoted Druid
4 Elvish Visionary
4 Elvish Archdruid
3 Ezuri, Renegade Leader
2 Fauna Shaman
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Spellskite
4 Collected Company
3 Chord of Calling
Lands
11 Forest
3 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
3 Cavern of Souls
1 Pendelhaven
4 Essence Warden
1 Scattershot Archer
1 Spellskite
3 Scavenging Ooze
2 Choke
4 Reclamation Sage
Anybody want to lend me 1x Ooze, 2x Skite, 3x Caverns, 1x Pendelhaven or any amount of those for a bit so I can do some dailies?