@Endurrr Is the Marsh Flats over the third Tarn a budget thing, or is it a deliberate choice to even out the balance of lands fetching for Island vs. Swamp? Honest question from a potential newcomer, not trying to harp on budget stuff.
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When I hit my 3000 post mark, I'm gone for good.
Stay reasonable, be mindful of your expectations and don't feed the trolls.
@Endurrr Is the Marsh Flats over the third Tarn a budget thing, or is it a deliberate choice to even out the balance of lands fetching for Island vs. Swamp? Honest question from a potential newcomer, not trying to harp on budget stuff.
It's kinda both. I could buy the last tarn, but I've been content with the marsh flats so I would rather not spend the $70~ on another tarn. And if I want to fetch a basic against blood moon, I usually want my swamp first, which marsh flats is nice for. Otherwise it makes no real difference.
Modern:UBRDeath's ShadowUBR, CEldrazi StompyC,WUBRGSliversWUBRG, UBRGTraverse ShadowUBRG,RUGtempo pileRUG Pauper:UdelverU they slaughtered my deck i miss gush and daze..
Hey all, still lurking here after my 6-3 Open finish last month with the deck. After taking a short break, I want to start grinding the deck a bit more again. I've noticed a few changes recently with some of the higher placing decks, namely:
-Changing land configuration from 12 fetches and 6 fetchable lands to 11 fetches and 7 fetchable lands (minus a Scalding Tarn and plus a second Blood Crypt - is this to help cast Anger more easily?)
-Running 2 Anger of the Gods sideboard (before was zero or only occasionally)
-Running 2 Liliana, the Last Hope sideboard (before was a 1-of)
-Dropping Collective Brutality from the sideboard (was an auto 2-of inclusion)
-Dropping Surgical Extraction in sideboard (was a fairly regular 1-of)
There's some other changes I've noticed recently (a lot more 4-of Angler; 3 Bolt and 2 Stubborn Denial, 2 Fatal Push) but those topics and trends have been discussed at length in the forum. Just curious what you guys think about the above.
Hey all, still lurking here after my 6-3 Open finish last month with the deck. After taking a short break, I want to start grinding the deck a bit more again. I've noticed a few changes recently with some of the higher placing decks, namely:
-Changing land configuration from 12 fetches and 6 fetchable lands to 11 fetches and 7 fetchable lands (minus a Scalding Tarn and plus a second Blood Crypt - is this to help cast Anger more easily?)
-Running 2 Anger of the Gods sideboard (before was zero or only occasionally)
-Running 2 Liliana, the Last Hope sideboard (before was a 1-of)
-Dropping Collective Brutality from the sideboard (was an auto 2-of inclusion)
-Dropping Surgical Extraction in sideboard (was a fairly regular 1-of)
There's some other changes I've noticed recently (a lot more 4-of Angler; 3 Bolt and 2 Stubborn Denial, 2 Fatal Push) but those topics and trends have been discussed at length in the forum. Just curious what you guys think about the above.
Yes the mana base has changed to accomodate a more red heavy list in general (main deck bolts but also sideboard anger, young pyro, grim lavamancer, etc)
Anger is currently being run over kozilek's return because the 3 damage is far more relevant vs humans. The exile clause is also very helpful against hollow one
Last hope has been proving herself as one of the premier grindy options we have and she's been incredibly useful and many players (myself included) have gone up to 2 copies.
Collective brutality was previously needed for burn but there's been a bit less burn in the meta (replaced by creature based aggro) and brutality has been very underwhelming in other matchups. Having a 2 mana duress that doesn't take walkers, artifacts or enchantments isn't very good and the -2/-2 ability isn't as good as having a repeated effect from grim lavamancer for removal.
I don't think surgical was ever a regular card in shadow because it's usually best against combo where we're largely favoured anyway. Leylines or spellbombs have been the graveyard hate of choice for a long time and that's for those that run any yard hate at all. Most lists don't bother
Hey all, still lurking here after my 6-3 Open finish last month with the deck. After taking a short break, I want to start grinding the deck a bit more again. I've noticed a few changes recently with some of the higher placing decks, namely:
-Changing land configuration from 12 fetches and 6 fetchable lands to 11 fetches and 7 fetchable lands (minus a Scalding Tarn and plus a second Blood Crypt - is this to help cast Anger more easily?)
-Running 2 Anger of the Gods sideboard (before was zero or only occasionally)
-Running 2 Liliana, the Last Hope sideboard (before was a 1-of)
-Dropping Collective Brutality from the sideboard (was an auto 2-of inclusion)
-Dropping Surgical Extraction in sideboard (was a fairly regular 1-of)
There's some other changes I've noticed recently (a lot more 4-of Angler; 3 Bolt and 2 Stubborn Denial, 2 Fatal Push) but those topics and trends have been discussed at length in the forum. Just curious what you guys think about the above.
I've been on the 11 fetch and 7 mana producing land split for a while. I also play 2 faithless looting which really helps mitigate the flooding that can occur at 18 lands in this deck.
Liliana, the last hope is solid, but I'm not convinced it is the best thing we can be doing. It has utility in a lot of matches, but I feel like it is a really slow card which goes against our usual gameplan of some disruption backed by a fast clock. I've been sticking to 1 copy in my sideboard.
Collective Brutality has always been a very narrow card that was only really good against burn, infect, and coco decks. People see that it has a few relevant modes and assume it's awesome, but for 2 mana it's not what I want to be casting. I'd play 0 or 1 copies in the side depending on how much burn you expect to see.
Surgical Extraction and Nihil Spellbomb are meta dependent cards that I wouldn't play every week unless I expected a lot of storm, dredge, re-animator, or other graveyard dependent decks to show up. Again, like collective brutality these cards are pretty narrow in application and people assume they are good in more match-ups than they actually are.
Just my 2 cents on the items above, and for what it's worth I ended up 6-3 at SCG regionals this weekend playing my more aggressive build (2 battle rage, 3 bolt, 4 mishra's bauble and 5 delve threats). I ran into a bunch of blue control decks (2X UW, 2X UWR, and RUG shift) and no humans or hollow one throughout the day which was a bit of a surprise, but overall the deck felt good.
I'm kinda new to GDS (at least as a player, haha). I spent most of 2017 playing Traverse (Jund) Shadow, I'll try the U version now
Since I don't have much experience, can you share how do you think a "standard" sideboard looks like? In this thread some people seem to advocate dropping GY hate entirely, and I don't know if Temur Battle Rage is viable as a sideboard card. I've looked for some decklists, but all of their sideboards seem to be very different.
What I have sleeved until the moment is:
- 2 Collective brutality (a lot of burn is still present in my meta..)
- 2 Ceremonious rejection (I'm tempted to go up to 3, it is a high impact card)
- 2 Nihil spellbomb
- 2 Izzet staticaster
- 1 Anger of the gods
- 1 Engineered explosives
- 1 Stubborn denial (other 3 are in the main)
- 1 Liliana, the last Hope
- 1 Liliana of the Veil
- 1 Temur battle rage (1 maindeck)
- 1 Lightning bolt
I know it looks messy, that's why I'm looking for some advice to build the sideboard. Thanks!
If you didn´t hear this episode of the GAM Podcast(http://www.starcitygames.com/articles/37205_The-GAM-Podcast-The-New-Best-Deck-In-Modern.html) maybe you want to.
They talk mostly Jeskai being the new kid on the block and everything Modern. But they touch on GDS a little bit and i think they hit the nail on the head. GDS became somewhat lackluster when TBR became the way to go. They also talk about Stubborn Denial being medium-bad in this Modern.
PS:Just giving out the info to start walking in a direction that benefits us as GDS players(it's my only deck!). Not bashing it.
I agree, just need to innovate or switch up your sideboard for the change. Adding lingering souls, pyromancers, or maybe bone picker(questionable though) might be a good idea right now just to help with the aggro heavy decks. If only baleful strix was in modern, oooh boy.
I’ve not had the best of luck as of late since my shop consists of tier 1, tier 3 and home brews. All of which are too hard to account for. The spread is so wide you can beat some known matches and lose to a lot of the random unknown ones. Only reason I still play GDS is because its my best deck vs Tron currently and that is the primary deck being played.
My next best deck is fish but there are a few affinity players and well that one is miserable.
Commander GUR Maelstrom Wanderer BWU Sydri, Galvanic Genius BGB Meren of Clan Nel Toth WGW Nazahn, Revered Bladesmith RRR Feldon of the Third Path WWW Heliod, God of the Sun
The second option would be going more all in for a quicker kill, maybe by adding more potential threats like Kiln Fiend for clunky and grindy cards. Does this make the Jeskai/Humans MU better? Probably yes, probably no.
My only issue with adding Kiln Fiend is what do you cut for it? Cutting Angler/Tasigur seems bad since unlike Kiln Fiend they don't die to Bolt, which is seeing more play now due to Humans. Cutting instants/sorceries seems bad since you need them to pump Kiln Fiend. I guess you cut Street Wraith, but that also makes Death's Shadow smaller, which kind of goes against the making the deck faster plan.
The second option would be going more all in for a quicker kill, maybe by adding more potential threats like Kiln Fiend for clunky and grindy cards. Does this make the Jeskai/Humans MU better? Probably yes, probably no.
monastery swiftspear, enigma drake, delver of secrets or thing in the ice could be other options if we are trying to be more agressive. the main problem with delver and swiftspear is they die to bolt just like kiln fiend, thing is a complete nonbo with our delve creatures, and enigma drake is just a little bit too expensive for our deck.
then again, maybe the best way for us to be more aggressive would probably be to go up two 6-7 delve creatures and add a couple free spells like gut shot or mishra's bauble, and go up to 4 faithless looting or even tome scour to fill our yard enough to be able to have this many delve creatures.
or maybe our deck is just fine where it is now. I'm honestly not sure. I guess only time will tell.
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Modern:UBRDeath's ShadowUBR, CEldrazi StompyC,WUBRGSliversWUBRG, UBRGTraverse ShadowUBRG,RUGtempo pileRUG Pauper:UdelverU they slaughtered my deck i miss gush and daze..
Thing in the Ice bouncing our own delve creature seems like bad times. Monastery Swiftspear and Delver don't really play well with Death's Shadow as they force you to play threat first and disruption second, while Death's Shadow (both the creature and the deck) wants the opposite.
Also, why are traverse lists always on 8 discards and gds on 6. If it's because they are more all in on the kill quick plan, maybe we should consider doing the same now?
My guess would be a combination of no access to Stubborn Denial, and (more importantly) discard grows Goyf but Grixis' second threat needs Thought Scour instead of the extra two Inquisitions.
Hey guys Long time lurker here and player of GDS. Ive played the deck for over a year and I think even with the unbannings and metagame shifts the deck is still good. Ive played many varitations of the lists and found that they were okay but sometimes lacked consistency so ive revereted to the original list with afew changes as the deck evolved. I'm going to a tournament this weekend and would like any insight into card choices and sideboard plans.
Hey guys, it's been a while. I haven't played much magic in the last few months so GP Vegas was the first time I finally got to play. I didn't really like GDS' place in the meta but it's the only decent deck I have so I played it and I think I did alright for myself. I'm pretty tired so I'm just going to write a super mega condensed report of my matches.
R1 - Beat Bogles
45 mins later
R2 - Beat RG Shift
2 hours later
R3 - Beat Hollow One
R4 - Beat Mardu Pyromancer
R5 - Beat UWR Control
R6 - Lost to Mardu Pyromancer
R7 - Lost to Eldrazi Tron
I know Etron is a good matchup but game 2 I kept a hand with a decent hand with some cantrips. I had to fade the chalice for 1 turn but couldn't. Game 3 he kept a hand of: Mine, Mine, Map, Ratchet Bomb, TKS, Ballista, Smasher and Wurmcoil. I seized the Map, countered the ratched bomb but he naturally drew tron. Can't do anything about that lol.
R8 - Lost to Mardu Pyromancer
So yeah now I can tell the story of the time I went 5-0 and didn't make 2 of a GP haha. But all bad beats aside the deck did a lot better than I expected it to and I had a blast playing it. The event itself was pretty scuffed and we did have to wait an extra 3-4ish hours to actually finish the day but I won't get anymore into that than I need to.
My list was pretty much Dylan Donnegan's but swapped the Disdainful Stroke for a Collective Brutality because I expected more burn and tried adding back in a Tasigur for 4th angler. That one was a mistake just play 4 anglers even if you don't run baubles and serums.
Other takeaways:
Temur Battle Rage was an absolute monster all weekend. I had a couple bolt myself TBR you instakills that were reminiscent of Splinter Twin. Highly considering adding a 3rd to the side.
Welcome back Lightning Bolt, it's been a while. A card that can double as a giant growth or removal spell is A+ in my book.
Hardcasting Street Wraith is always fun. I got to cast it around 5 times this weekend and it was awesome.
Young Pyromancer is also a great sideboard card. Wish I had more room to add a 3rd.
Good old 40 card friedman also played the deck and actually topped which is awesome. Not a fan of baubles, never really was but hey different strokes for different folks. Abrade seems really, really well positioned right now and I think I might just swap out my 2 angers for those. Really good call on him for that. His lower land count and lack of Serums (and lack of YP but it makes sense for him to not have any since he's running bauble) have me concerned for his UWR matchups but I saw him take one down anyway.
Despite everything I didn't like about his list, Faithless Looting really intrigues me. I thought about playing this card for a while (I played 2 sleights for quite some time but sleight can't help if you're already flooding) and it seems like it can help shore up some of the consistency issues this deck has. Since it is DA you can't run too many, but it can help so much if flooding or need to find a threat. This deck just treads so much water when it can't actually find the threat to close out the game. That's where Traverse shadow has the edge on us. I'll try and give it a shot though. I just have no idea what to cut to try them out and I'm not going to 17 land or cutting Kommand out of the main.
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Modern URBSome variant of Death's Shadow URB Grixis Control (Chapin Version) JFM Storm / Treasure Cruise Delver / Splinter Twin / Infect
My friends told me to play a couple of these before this weekend but it seemed like too much of a meme. Looking at how Ben look at shadow, maybe the inclusion of Spellskite could end up being beneficial. Acts as a stubborn denial half the time and lets us really set up the Shadow kills from nowhere.
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Modern URBSome variant of Death's Shadow URB Grixis Control (Chapin Version) JFM Storm / Treasure Cruise Delver / Splinter Twin / Infect
My friends told me to play a couple of these before this weekend but it seemed like too much of a meme. Looking at how Ben look at shadow, maybe the inclusion of Spellskite could end up being beneficial. Acts as a stubborn denial half the time and lets us really set up the Shadow kills from nowhere.
My friends told me to play a couple of these before this weekend but it seemed like too much of a meme. Looking at how Ben look at shadow, maybe the inclusion of Spellskite could end up being beneficial. Acts as a stubborn denial half the time and lets us really set up the Shadow kills from nowhere.
Oh, the damage you could do with a bolt and a battle rage.
This interaction actually happened 3 times that weekend. Turning bolt into Become Immense felt incredible. Since the deck's strength against bad matchups is being able to steal games from battle rage, I just thought why not try and go more all in while also having a little bit of protecttion.
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Modern URBSome variant of Death's Shadow URB Grixis Control (Chapin Version) JFM Storm / Treasure Cruise Delver / Splinter Twin / Infect
Stay reasonable, be mindful of your expectations and don't feed the trolls.
Doomsdayin'
...but it won't do anything most of the time because you won't be able to cast it. I'm convinced JTMS isn't even a viable option in GDS sideboards.
Abzan Traverse / Traverse Shadow / UR Kiki
It's kinda both. I could buy the last tarn, but I've been content with the marsh flats so I would rather not spend the $70~ on another tarn. And if I want to fetch a basic against blood moon, I usually want my swamp first, which marsh flats is nice for. Otherwise it makes no real difference.
Pauper: UdelverUthey slaughtered my deckTurn 6 Karn > Turn 2 Phage
-Changing land configuration from 12 fetches and 6 fetchable lands to 11 fetches and 7 fetchable lands (minus a Scalding Tarn and plus a second Blood Crypt - is this to help cast Anger more easily?)
-Running 2 Anger of the Gods sideboard (before was zero or only occasionally)
-Running 2 Liliana, the Last Hope sideboard (before was a 1-of)
-Dropping Collective Brutality from the sideboard (was an auto 2-of inclusion)
-Dropping Surgical Extraction in sideboard (was a fairly regular 1-of)
There's some other changes I've noticed recently (a lot more 4-of Angler; 3 Bolt and 2 Stubborn Denial, 2 Fatal Push) but those topics and trends have been discussed at length in the forum. Just curious what you guys think about the above.
Yes the mana base has changed to accomodate a more red heavy list in general (main deck bolts but also sideboard anger, young pyro, grim lavamancer, etc)
Anger is currently being run over kozilek's return because the 3 damage is far more relevant vs humans. The exile clause is also very helpful against hollow one
Last hope has been proving herself as one of the premier grindy options we have and she's been incredibly useful and many players (myself included) have gone up to 2 copies.
Collective brutality was previously needed for burn but there's been a bit less burn in the meta (replaced by creature based aggro) and brutality has been very underwhelming in other matchups. Having a 2 mana duress that doesn't take walkers, artifacts or enchantments isn't very good and the -2/-2 ability isn't as good as having a repeated effect from grim lavamancer for removal.
I don't think surgical was ever a regular card in shadow because it's usually best against combo where we're largely favoured anyway. Leylines or spellbombs have been the graveyard hate of choice for a long time and that's for those that run any yard hate at all. Most lists don't bother
I've been on the 11 fetch and 7 mana producing land split for a while. I also play 2 faithless looting which really helps mitigate the flooding that can occur at 18 lands in this deck.
I tried 2 copies of anger of the gods in my sideboard at SCG regionals this weekend. They were OK, but I'm not sure what the best combination of anti-creature sideboard cards like grim lavamancer, pyroclasm, izzet staticaster, and engineered explosives is. I guess it changes week to week as the meta shifts around.
Liliana, the last hope is solid, but I'm not convinced it is the best thing we can be doing. It has utility in a lot of matches, but I feel like it is a really slow card which goes against our usual gameplan of some disruption backed by a fast clock. I've been sticking to 1 copy in my sideboard.
Collective Brutality has always been a very narrow card that was only really good against burn, infect, and coco decks. People see that it has a few relevant modes and assume it's awesome, but for 2 mana it's not what I want to be casting. I'd play 0 or 1 copies in the side depending on how much burn you expect to see.
Surgical Extraction and Nihil Spellbomb are meta dependent cards that I wouldn't play every week unless I expected a lot of storm, dredge, re-animator, or other graveyard dependent decks to show up. Again, like collective brutality these cards are pretty narrow in application and people assume they are good in more match-ups than they actually are.
Just my 2 cents on the items above, and for what it's worth I ended up 6-3 at SCG regionals this weekend playing my more aggressive build (2 battle rage, 3 bolt, 4 mishra's bauble and 5 delve threats). I ran into a bunch of blue control decks (2X UW, 2X UWR, and RUG shift) and no humans or hollow one throughout the day which was a bit of a surprise, but overall the deck felt good.
I'm kinda new to GDS (at least as a player, haha). I spent most of 2017 playing Traverse (Jund) Shadow, I'll try the U version now
Since I don't have much experience, can you share how do you think a "standard" sideboard looks like? In this thread some people seem to advocate dropping GY hate entirely, and I don't know if Temur Battle Rage is viable as a sideboard card. I've looked for some decklists, but all of their sideboards seem to be very different.
What I have sleeved until the moment is:
- 2 Collective brutality (a lot of burn is still present in my meta..)
- 2 Ceremonious rejection (I'm tempted to go up to 3, it is a high impact card)
- 2 Nihil spellbomb
- 2 Izzet staticaster
- 1 Anger of the gods
- 1 Engineered explosives
- 1 Stubborn denial (other 3 are in the main)
- 1 Liliana, the last Hope
- 1 Liliana of the Veil
- 1 Temur battle rage (1 maindeck)
- 1 Lightning bolt
I know it looks messy, that's why I'm looking for some advice to build the sideboard. Thanks!
They talk mostly Jeskai being the new kid on the block and everything Modern. But they touch on GDS a little bit and i think they hit the nail on the head. GDS became somewhat lackluster when TBR became the way to go. They also talk about Stubborn Denial being medium-bad in this Modern.
PS:Just giving out the info to start walking in a direction that benefits us as GDS players(it's my only deck!). Not bashing it.
I’ve not had the best of luck as of late since my shop consists of tier 1, tier 3 and home brews. All of which are too hard to account for. The spread is so wide you can beat some known matches and lose to a lot of the random unknown ones. Only reason I still play GDS is because its my best deck vs Tron currently and that is the primary deck being played.
My next best deck is fish but there are a few affinity players and well that one is miserable.
GURB Grixis/Jund Shadow
RBG Dredge
xUx U Ballista Tron
Commander
GUR Maelstrom Wanderer
BWU Sydri, Galvanic Genius
BGB Meren of Clan Nel Toth
WGW Nazahn, Revered Bladesmith
RRR Feldon of the Third Path
WWW Heliod, God of the Sun
My only issue with adding Kiln Fiend is what do you cut for it? Cutting Angler/Tasigur seems bad since unlike Kiln Fiend they don't die to Bolt, which is seeing more play now due to Humans. Cutting instants/sorceries seems bad since you need them to pump Kiln Fiend. I guess you cut Street Wraith, but that also makes Death's Shadow smaller, which kind of goes against the making the deck faster plan.
monastery swiftspear, enigma drake, delver of secrets or thing in the ice could be other options if we are trying to be more agressive. the main problem with delver and swiftspear is they die to bolt just like kiln fiend, thing is a complete nonbo with our delve creatures, and enigma drake is just a little bit too expensive for our deck.
then again, maybe the best way for us to be more aggressive would probably be to go up two 6-7 delve creatures and add a couple free spells like gut shot or mishra's bauble, and go up to 4 faithless looting or even tome scour to fill our yard enough to be able to have this many delve creatures.
or maybe our deck is just fine where it is now. I'm honestly not sure. I guess only time will tell.
Pauper: UdelverUthey slaughtered my deckTurn 6 Karn > Turn 2 Phage
My guess would be a combination of no access to Stubborn Denial, and (more importantly) discard grows Goyf but Grixis' second threat needs Thought Scour instead of the extra two Inquisitions.
R1 - Beat Bogles
45 mins later
R2 - Beat RG Shift
2 hours later
R3 - Beat Hollow One
R4 - Beat Mardu Pyromancer
R5 - Beat UWR Control
R6 - Lost to Mardu Pyromancer
R7 - Lost to Eldrazi Tron
I know Etron is a good matchup but game 2 I kept a hand with a decent hand with some cantrips. I had to fade the chalice for 1 turn but couldn't. Game 3 he kept a hand of: Mine, Mine, Map, Ratchet Bomb, TKS, Ballista, Smasher and Wurmcoil. I seized the Map, countered the ratched bomb but he naturally drew tron. Can't do anything about that lol.
R8 - Lost to Mardu Pyromancer
So yeah now I can tell the story of the time I went 5-0 and didn't make 2 of a GP haha. But all bad beats aside the deck did a lot better than I expected it to and I had a blast playing it. The event itself was pretty scuffed and we did have to wait an extra 3-4ish hours to actually finish the day but I won't get anymore into that than I need to.
My list was pretty much Dylan Donnegan's but swapped the Disdainful Stroke for a Collective Brutality because I expected more burn and tried adding back in a Tasigur for 4th angler. That one was a mistake just play 4 anglers even if you don't run baubles and serums.
Other takeaways:
URB Some variant of Death's Shadow
URB Grixis Control (Chapin Version)
JFM Storm / Treasure Cruise Delver / Splinter Twin / InfectCommander/EDH
This pile of cards when I feel like it
Death's Shadow discord link
URB Some variant of Death's Shadow
URB Grixis Control (Chapin Version)
JFM Storm / Treasure Cruise Delver / Splinter Twin / InfectCommander/EDH
This pile of cards when I feel like it
Death's Shadow discord link
Oh, the damage you could do with a bolt and a battle rage.
URB Some variant of Death's Shadow
URB Grixis Control (Chapin Version)
JFM Storm / Treasure Cruise Delver / Splinter Twin / InfectCommander/EDH
This pile of cards when I feel like it
Death's Shadow discord link