Fulminator Mage + Kolaghan's Command = just mean against Tron. Catching the odd Expedition Map with a Kommand Shatter is also deeply satisfying.
Does anyone care about Crib Swap ? Fills the Tribal role and takes out practically any creature we don't like. MB White isn't great, but neither is Ulamog/Smasher/etcetc.
Cmc 3 is way too much, yeah. On a general note, dsj lists which we also came up with seem to be most successful recently, that seems great. For reference, the list I am talking about looks like this:
I was thinking of the harder matchups, such as Burn, and wondering why we don't run Phyrexian Unlife. One of the hardest parts is managing your life total. At 3 mana, it's still relevant and since a lot of decks don't run a lot of enchantment removal, it essentially reads as gain 10 life. Furthermore the poison counters don't start until after you've gone to 0 life, so at worst you gain a couple turns.
Hey,
I´m currently prepping for GP Copenhagen and after going back and forth between DSJ and Grixis I decided to stick with what I have more practice with (which aparently still isn't close to enough judging from my performances so far ... :D)
I´d like to run my Decklist and Sideboard plan by you for suggestions and comments.
Some notes on the Sideboard:
I´m thinking of swapping either Eidolon or 1 Fulminator for an additional graveyard hate card.
The Terminate might also become a Fatal Push again.
The current sideboard plan:
Affinity:
+1 Ancient Grudge
+1 Terminate
+1 Anger of the Gods
+3 Lingering Souls
-4 Thoughtseize
-2 Liliana of the Veil
Eldrazi Tron:
+3 Fulminator Mage
+1 Terminate
+1 Ancient Grudge
-2 Tarfire
-3 Inquisition of Kozilek
Storm:
+1 Eidolon of Rethoric
+2 Nihil Spellbomb
+2 Collective Brutality
-2 Liliana of the Veil
-1 Liliana, the last Hope
-2 Kolaghan's Command
Death's Shadow Jund:
+2 Nihil Spellbomb
+1 Terminate
+1 Ranger of Eos
+3 Lingering Souls
Knightfall (not sure about grave hate here):
+1 Ranger of Eos
+1 Terminate
+1 Anger of the Gods
-1 Liliana, the last Hope
-2 Kolaghan's Command
Dredge:
+1 Anger of the Gods
+2 Nihil Spellbomb
+3 Lingering Souls
-2 Kolaghan's Command
-2 Abrubt Decay
-1 Liliana of the Veil
Grixis Death's Shadow:
+1 Terminate
+1 Ranger of Eos
+3 Lingering SOuls
+2 Nihil Spellbomb
-2 Temur Battle Rage
-2 Tarfire
-1 Liliana the last Hope
-1 Fatal Push
-1 Inquisition of Kozilek
Abzan:
+1 Ranger of Eos
+3 Lingering Souls
+1 Terminate
-2 Temur Battle Rage
-2 Tarfire
-1 Inquisition of Kozilek
Abzan Company:
+1 Terminate
+1 Anger of the Gods
-2 Kolaghan's Command
anything that sticks out as awfully wrong?
Looks good to me, except don't cut grindy cards like kcommand or Liliana, the last hope in grindy matchups like the mirror or grixis ds. Cut some IOK instead, which are bad topdecks. Both these cards provide recursion which is very valuable here.
Have we discussed the potential of Grim Flayer enough? This list features two Grim Flayers and piled through a whole field of difficult matches. It also played a single spicy Dismember.
Hasn't been under too much discussion yet. But the option is certainly written in the primer. I feel the card might be a good option in an interactive meta to have more threats. But overall though, flayer wasn't that successful in DSJ from what I have seen. That's probably the reason why it has not been highly considered overall.
So I have a question. Why does everyone seem to run 3 Fulminator without question. I know it's effective against Tron and Eldrazi Tron and it has applications in the Burn match-up but in my experience its too slow. I would much rather use those three slots in the board to make all my other match-ups better. Please let me know what you all think and whether I'm right or just being a scrub who doesn't run Fulminator. Thanks!
So I have a question. Why does everyone seem to run 3 Fulminator without question. I know it's effective against Tron and Eldrazi Tron and it has applications in the Burn match-up but in my experience its too slow. I would much rather use those three slots in the board to make all my other match-ups better. Please let me know what you all think and whether I'm right or just being a scrub who doesn't run Fulminator. Thanks!
Generally, you are right. Fulminator on its own is really clunky and sometimes too slow. But the thing is, its just mandatory in a meta where Big Mana is present in such a proportion, that completely neglecting it is just wrong. You can't do that. Fulminator is a card that just works best for its purpose compared to other cards available. There is no card like Wasteland in Modern, we have to make the best out of it, therefore running Fulminator is mandatory, unless you are blessed with an low Big Mana crowded meta.
The positive thing about Fulminator is that you can search it via Traverse, which makes it better in that regard. I think just because of that its absolutely worth it to run him. I do have to say, I won some Tron matchups (and Valakut) simply because of a timely Fulminator in the past. It was slow, clunky, and did not feel amazing, but it worked. And that's what matters.
So I have a question. Why does everyone seem to run 3 Fulminator without question. I know it's effective against Tron and Eldrazi Tron and it has applications in the Burn match-up but in my experience its too slow. I would much rather use those three slots in the board to make all my other match-ups better. Please let me know what you all think and whether I'm right or just being a scrub who doesn't run Fulminator. Thanks!
I like 1 Ghost Quarter and 2 Fulminators in the side. The qhost quarter can be played early from a traverse.
While this is true, I don't think you can afford sacrificing landdrops in our tight manabase when thinking about our colour intensive cards. GQ works way better in control/midrange strategies that have plenty of lands available. We don't. So I am not a fan of GQ in DSJ.
While this is true, I don't think you can afford sacrificing landdrops in our tight manabase when thinking about our colour intensive cards. GQ works way better in control/midrange strategies that have plenty of lands available. We don't. So I am not a fan of GQ in DSJ.
Against tron you can just play the quarter as your 19th land. It won't probably stay on board for long. And the land count, as well as many other things with this deck, isn't carved in stone, so replacing another land after side will probably work fine too. You saw it yourself in MCM Frankfurt, the most successfull list running only 16 lands.
Side:
1x Ranger
2x Nihil Spellbomb
1x Surgical
2x Ancient Grudge
2x Collective Brutality
1x Kozilek's Return
2x Liliana L
3x Souls
1x Maelstrom Pulse
Thoughts are appreciated. I've liked the no ghor clan and the no basic forest for a while now. Blood moon is tough if they get it out without me thoughtseizing it away but other than that it feels better to not have the liability of the basic forest. The two Lili split is great bc Veil is just more effective against more decks and can save me in a pinch. In my sideboard I've dedicated a lot of spots to beating affinity bc honestly I feel that its one of this deck's worst match ups and usually some of the most experienced players play affinity due to it's long life time in the game. I have 3 graveyard hate spells, some sweepers, and the extra disruption. I so far have had no problem beating Breach with this configuration. I have only come across one BG Tron deck and I found my success with trying to kill him as fast as possible while disrupting his hand. With all the ways the have at their disposal to get tron online I find that as long as they don't draw a second Ugin the match is yours. If the meta was to be taken over by Tron decks for some reason and I needed to put three fulminator in the board I would like to know what you all would change. Thanks!
Finally recently aquired my third and fourth bauble for Tezzerator, which made me finally realize I have all the cards for DS now. So my question to you guys is I have an odd local meta and I am not 100% sure what version is best. We have zero DS players in town so I would like to anger some people.
My local meta that shows up regularly
1-2 Tron decks (everyone is tired of losing to tron)
1-2 Burn decks
1-3 Grixis Delver
1-2 Elves
Then there is lots of people who bring different decks being:
Jeskai Control (kiki/resto)
Dredge
Living End
Lantern
Bant Company
Jund
Bunch of random decks and you never really know what is going to be there. So out of your guys professional opinion what do you think is best? Straight jund? Splash white? Splash Blue? or play Grixis Shadow.
Side:
1x Ranger
2x Nihil Spellbomb
1x Surgical
2x Ancient Grudge
2x Collective Brutality
1x Kozilek's Return
2x Liliana L
3x Souls
1x Maelstrom Pulse
Thoughts are appreciated. I've liked the no ghor clan and the no basic forest for a while now. Blood moon is tough if they get it out without me thoughtseizing it away but other than that it feels better to not have the liability of the basic forest. The two Lili split is great bc Veil is just more effective against more decks and can save me in a pinch. In my sideboard I've dedicated a lot of spots to beating affinity bc honestly I feel that its one of this deck's worst match ups and usually some of the most experienced players play affinity due to it's long life time in the game. I have 3 graveyard hate spells, some sweepers, and the extra disruption. I so far have had no problem beating Breach with this configuration. I have only come across one BG Tron deck and I found my success with trying to kill him as fast as possible while disrupting his hand. With all the ways the have at their disposal to get tron online I find that as long as they don't draw a second Ugin the match is yours. If the meta was to be taken over by Tron decks for some reason and I needed to put three fulminator in the board I would like to know what you all would change. Thanks!
Its fine not to run Fulminator if, and only if, your meta allows it. If there are not many Tron decks around and your meta is crowded with Affinity then for sure drop the Fulminators. If you go to an larger event with an unknown meta, I would not do this though. So keep that in mind. Affinity certainly feels tough, I agree with running Kozilek's Return and 4 Pushes maindeck due to this. TBR is the key card here in my experience. You might want to include an extra copy for this matchups if you want.
Folks i cant win against RW/Jeskai control decks any tips? :'(
Jeskai does seem like a tough matchup, but usually, discard is absolutely crucial in these matchups. Try to not go for a long game and utilize your Lingering Souls go-wide strategy to make their removal worse. Discard into a fast goyf or DS is needed here I think.
Finally recently aquired my third and fourth bauble for Tezzerator, which made me finally realize I have all the cards for DS now. So my question to you guys is I have an odd local meta and I am not 100% sure what version is best. We have zero DS players in town so I would like to anger some people.
My local meta that shows up regularly
1-2 Tron decks (everyone is tired of losing to tron)
1-2 Burn decks
1-3 Grixis Delver
1-2 Elves
Then there is lots of people who bring different decks being:
Jeskai Control (kiki/resto)
Dredge
Living End
Lantern
Bant Company
Jund
Bunch of random decks and you never really know what is going to be there. So out of your guys professional opinion what do you think is best? Straight jund? Splash white? Splash Blue? or play Grixis Shadow.
I would definitely advise going for Jund Death Shadow if you want a death shadow deck. Temur Battle Rage is the single most needed card against Elves and Tron. Therefore I would advise against Grixis. I would then go for the white splash, as Souls help with interactive matchups (Grixis Delver, Jund, Control) and white provide some anti combo hate (ethersworn Canonist) for Living End for example.
Keep in mind though, Elves, Tron and Control all are quite tough matchups. Delver is about 50/50 I would argue, and so is burn.
Alright Thanks for the heads up. I will try tranditional Jund Death Shadow splash white build. I realize there is some rough matchups, but I will give it a try.
Follow the link for nice cheap clothing.
Playing:
Death's Shadow Jund
Played:
Kiki Chord, Zoo variants, Goblins, Burn
Does anyone care about Crib Swap ? Fills the Tribal role and takes out practically any creature we don't like. MB White isn't great, but neither is Ulamog/Smasher/etcetc.
Follow the link for nice cheap clothing.
Playing:
Death's Shadow Jund
Played:
Kiki Chord, Zoo variants, Goblins, Burn
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Bloodstained Mire
2 Wooded Foothills
2 Marsh Flats
1 Overgrown Tomb
1 Blood Crypt
1 Godless Shrine
1 Stomping Ground
1 Swamp
1 Forest
Creatures (12)
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Death's Shadow
4 Street Wraith
4 Mishra's Bauble
4 Traverse the Ulvenwald
4 Inquisition of Kozilek
4 Thoughtseize
3 Fatal push
2 Tarfire
2 Abrupt decay
2 Temur Battle Rage
2 Liliana, the Last Hope
1 Liliana of the Veil
2 Kolaghan's Command
3 Lingering Souls
3 Fulminator Mage
1 Ranger of Eos
1 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Terminate
1 Nihil Spellbomb
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Anger of the Gods
2 Ancient Grudge
The Sideboard is of course flexible.
Looks good to me, except don't cut grindy cards like kcommand or Liliana, the last hope in grindy matchups like the mirror or grixis ds. Cut some IOK instead, which are bad topdecks. Both these cards provide recursion which is very valuable here.
Hasn't been under too much discussion yet. But the option is certainly written in the primer. I feel the card might be a good option in an interactive meta to have more threats. But overall though, flayer wasn't that successful in DSJ from what I have seen. That's probably the reason why it has not been highly considered overall.
Follow the link for nice cheap clothing.
Playing:
Death's Shadow Jund
Played:
Kiki Chord, Zoo variants, Goblins, Burn
Generally, you are right. Fulminator on its own is really clunky and sometimes too slow. But the thing is, its just mandatory in a meta where Big Mana is present in such a proportion, that completely neglecting it is just wrong. You can't do that. Fulminator is a card that just works best for its purpose compared to other cards available. There is no card like Wasteland in Modern, we have to make the best out of it, therefore running Fulminator is mandatory, unless you are blessed with an low Big Mana crowded meta.
The positive thing about Fulminator is that you can search it via Traverse, which makes it better in that regard. I think just because of that its absolutely worth it to run him. I do have to say, I won some Tron matchups (and Valakut) simply because of a timely Fulminator in the past. It was slow, clunky, and did not feel amazing, but it worked. And that's what matters.
I like 1 Ghost Quarter and 2 Fulminators in the side. The qhost quarter can be played early from a traverse.
UWRUWR Delver/Lynx TempoUWR-------UWRUWR Midrange GeistUWR-------UWRUWR Nahiri ControlUWR-------UWRUWR SaheeliUWR
BGRJund / Jund ShadowBGR-------BGWAbzan / Abzan ShadowBGW
Commander (Leviathan/MTGO): UWGeist of Saint TraftUW
Against tron you can just play the quarter as your 19th land. It won't probably stay on board for long. And the land count, as well as many other things with this deck, isn't carved in stone, so replacing another land after side will probably work fine too. You saw it yourself in MCM Frankfurt, the most successfull list running only 16 lands.
UWRUWR Delver/Lynx TempoUWR-------UWRUWR Midrange GeistUWR-------UWRUWR Nahiri ControlUWR-------UWRUWR SaheeliUWR
BGRJund / Jund ShadowBGR-------BGWAbzan / Abzan ShadowBGW
Commander (Leviathan/MTGO): UWGeist of Saint TraftUW
In my opinion, this is a mistake. Our landbase is greedy and tight enough to cut any more lands.
4x:
Death's Shadow
Goyf
Wraith
4x:
Bauble
Push
Inquisition
Thoughtseize
Traverse
2x:
Tarfire
Decay
Battlerage
Command
Lili V
4x:
Bloodstained
Verdant
Polluted
2x Overgrown
1x Blood Crypt
1x Stomping Ground
1x Godlesss Shrine
1x Swamp
Side:
1x Ranger
2x Nihil Spellbomb
1x Surgical
2x Ancient Grudge
2x Collective Brutality
1x Kozilek's Return
2x Liliana L
3x Souls
1x Maelstrom Pulse
Thoughts are appreciated. I've liked the no ghor clan and the no basic forest for a while now. Blood moon is tough if they get it out without me thoughtseizing it away but other than that it feels better to not have the liability of the basic forest. The two Lili split is great bc Veil is just more effective against more decks and can save me in a pinch. In my sideboard I've dedicated a lot of spots to beating affinity bc honestly I feel that its one of this deck's worst match ups and usually some of the most experienced players play affinity due to it's long life time in the game. I have 3 graveyard hate spells, some sweepers, and the extra disruption. I so far have had no problem beating Breach with this configuration. I have only come across one BG Tron deck and I found my success with trying to kill him as fast as possible while disrupting his hand. With all the ways the have at their disposal to get tron online I find that as long as they don't draw a second Ugin the match is yours. If the meta was to be taken over by Tron decks for some reason and I needed to put three fulminator in the board I would like to know what you all would change. Thanks!
My local meta that shows up regularly
1-2 Tron decks (everyone is tired of losing to tron)
1-2 Burn decks
1-3 Grixis Delver
1-2 Elves
Then there is lots of people who bring different decks being:
Jeskai Control (kiki/resto)
Dredge
Living End
Lantern
Bant Company
Jund
Bunch of random decks and you never really know what is going to be there. So out of your guys professional opinion what do you think is best? Straight jund? Splash white? Splash Blue? or play Grixis Shadow.
GRTitan ScapeshiftGR
UBRGrishoalbrandUBR
WRGNaya CompanyWRG
UREldrazi AggroUR
UMerfolkU
WRNorinWR
Its fine not to run Fulminator if, and only if, your meta allows it. If there are not many Tron decks around and your meta is crowded with Affinity then for sure drop the Fulminators. If you go to an larger event with an unknown meta, I would not do this though. So keep that in mind. Affinity certainly feels tough, I agree with running Kozilek's Return and 4 Pushes maindeck due to this. TBR is the key card here in my experience. You might want to include an extra copy for this matchups if you want.
Jeskai does seem like a tough matchup, but usually, discard is absolutely crucial in these matchups. Try to not go for a long game and utilize your Lingering Souls go-wide strategy to make their removal worse. Discard into a fast goyf or DS is needed here I think.
I would definitely advise going for Jund Death Shadow if you want a death shadow deck. Temur Battle Rage is the single most needed card against Elves and Tron. Therefore I would advise against Grixis. I would then go for the white splash, as Souls help with interactive matchups (Grixis Delver, Jund, Control) and white provide some anti combo hate (ethersworn Canonist) for Living End for example.
Keep in mind though, Elves, Tron and Control all are quite tough matchups. Delver is about 50/50 I would argue, and so is burn.
GRTitan ScapeshiftGR
UBRGrishoalbrandUBR
WRGNaya CompanyWRG
UREldrazi AggroUR
UMerfolkU
WRNorinWR