Not being able to Snap-Stub ever feels weird to me, I must say. But I guess the Forest must be worth it with all the Blood Moons going around these days?
Also note that a copy of the t8 list (74/75) tied for the second most points in modern at the PT (Gerry was first with Mardu, then a Traverse Shadow list, a UW Control list, and an Etron list tied for second).
Hostage Taker was a great call for that metagame. It seems great against Humans, in particular, which is usually a rough matchup. The extra spot removal in the SB also seems like a concession to this. I'm kind of liking shaving a Traverse too, at least in the 5c lists that don't want to run Tarfire. I'm not so sure about the Snapcaster without 2 blue sources, or the Forest. I could maybe get behind Snappy if we had a second blue source though. Or the forest if we cut Snappy.
Another list they showed was playing 3 Manamorphose, which is a cute way to enable Traverse with an instant when the removal doesn't have targets. And is Blood Moon / other forms of mana denial protection. And you get to draw your Shadows and TBRs that much more often. There are downsides, of course, but it's interesting. 3 might be too many, but the first version I try will have 4. I'm guessing 1-2 is more likely to be right, if not 0.
Edit: thinking about Hostage Taker a little more, it permanently nails Bridge against Lantern, even through Welding Jar. Against Mardu, if you nail a Bedlam Reveler with it and get to untap, or just have a million mana, it's a massive swing. The most awkward thing about it is that it isn't good against the control decks, and normally you'd like your haymaker to be good there.
Why no graveyard hate or land destruction in the sideboard in that top8 list? I was still trying to decide if Fulminator or Ghost Quarter was better against tron.
Why no graveyard hate or land destruction in the sideboard in that top8 list? I was still trying to decide if Fulminator or Ghost Quarter was better against tron.
Because blue allows you to fight the big mana decks with countermagic instead. No graveyard hate was more of a metagame call, but it turned out to be pretty good. The main place you miss gy hate once you have countermagic in the deck is vs. stuff like Dredge that leans very hard on the graveyard and is otherwise very hard to interact with.
Why no graveyard hate or land destruction in the sideboard in that top8 list? I was still trying to decide if Fulminator or Ghost Quarter was better against tron.
Because blue allows you to fight the big mana decks with countermagic instead.
I'm currently amazed by Grim Flayer as an additional threat. It usually turns on Delirium on just one hit and gives the deck some great card filtering. I've been considering swapping one Traverse for another Flayer, since I hate to have multiple Traverses on my opening hand.
I'm currently amazed by Grim Flayer as an additional threat. It usually turns on Delirium on just one hit and gives the deck some great card filtering. I've been considering swapping one Traverse for another Flayer, since I hate to have multiple Traverses on my opening hand.
My favorite part about Flayer is the value TBRs you get with him sometimes, usually game 1 against decks where TBR is normally bad. Definitely not the best part about the card, but it always makes me a little giddy.
Andrew Baeckstrom's list has no rhyme or reason to me.. Manamorphosex3 without kiln fiend, MD Rampager, MD Ranger of Eos, 2 bolts in the SB(?!?!). Maybe someone smarter than I can explain to me..
Although I must say that I dig the SB Grim Lavamancers.
So, It's just something I've been thinking about but what do you think on going the full set of stubs MD with a Watery Grave + Breeding Pool ?
The idea came up as I felt that i feel the deck plays a smooth tempo-oriented game with a midrange backup on Liliana and Traverse, we disrupt our opponent with what I call "universal answers" on discard, land a threat (either a huge goyf or shadow) and try to beat up the opponent before he recovers. Therefore, we need something to protect our threats and Stubborn Denial, which is already used as a 3-of with a 4th on most sideboards is the perfect answer.
I believe adding the 4th stub would help us close out the game even further since we don't have snappys to flashback it or strong card filtering outside of bauble + fetch. Also, it's a card that answers 90% of the problematic cards that DS decks have to deal with, specially when backed up by discard spells.
I am not sure on what I'd cut for it but What are your thoughts on a 4th Stubborn Denial MD ?
Andrew Baeckstrom's list has no rhyme or reason to me.. Manamorphosex3 without kiln fiend, MD Rampager, MD Ranger of Eos, 2 bolts in the SB(?!?!). Maybe someone smarter than I can explain to me..
Although I must say that I dig the SB Grim Lavamancers.
Instants can sometimes be the most difficult card type to get into the graveyard when it comes to enabling delirium due to the fact that all our instants need specific targets before we can cast them. Manamorphose can be cast at any time, doesn't cost us any mana and offers an additional way to burn through our deck.
I think it's a very interesting card, I just wouldn't feel too happy cutting Decays for it. Maindeck Ghor-Clan and Ranger are a bit more perplexing to me... but I also do like that Grim Lavamancer in the sb.
Been testing a singleton Forest in the maindeck and a Surgical Extraction in the side. Both were good to me today, went 3-1 at the LGS losing to Abzan (as if there's any other way), but I still put up a decent fight. Love this deck to death.
Hey guys, awesome to see how well our deck performed at PT RIX making Top 8.
I recently recorded a modern league and ran 4-1 with Reid Dukes Abzan Death's Shadow list from GP San Antonio which felt really well positioned against the current meta.
Check out the decktech and gameplay here https://youtu.be/POQ0ZgxQ_Pw
Any questions or suggestions about the deck please hit us up in the comments!
Andrew Baeckstrom's list has no rhyme or reason to me.. Manamorphosex3 without kiln fiend, MD Rampager, MD Ranger of Eos, 2 bolts in the SB(?!?!). Maybe someone smarter than I can explain to me..
Although I must say that I dig the SB Grim Lavamancers.
Instants can sometimes be the most difficult card type to get into the graveyard when it comes to enabling delirium due to the fact that all our instants need specific targets before we can cast them. Manamorphose can be cast at any time, doesn't cost us any mana and offers an additional way to burn through our deck.
I think it's a very interesting card, I just wouldn't feel too happy cutting Decays for it. Maindeck Ghor-Clan and Ranger are a bit more perplexing to me... but I also do like that Grim Lavamancer in the sb.
Been testing a singleton Forest in the maindeck and a Surgical Extraction in the side. Both were good to me today, went 3-1 at the LGS losing to Abzan (as if there's any other way), but I still put up a decent fight. Love this deck to death.
yea i get that. but at that point we just go back to tarfire right?
Andrew Baeckstrom's list has no rhyme or reason to me.. Manamorphosex3 without kiln fiend, MD Rampager, MD Ranger of Eos, 2 bolts in the SB(?!?!). Maybe someone smarter than I can explain to me..
Although I must say that I dig the SB Grim Lavamancers.
Instants can sometimes be the most difficult card type to get into the graveyard when it comes to enabling delirium due to the fact that all our instants need specific targets before we can cast them. Manamorphose can be cast at any time, doesn't cost us any mana and offers an additional way to burn through our deck.
I think it's a very interesting card, I just wouldn't feel too happy cutting Decays for it. Maindeck Ghor-Clan and Ranger are a bit more perplexing to me... but I also do like that Grim Lavamancer in the sb.
Been testing a singleton Forest in the maindeck and a Surgical Extraction in the side. Both were good to me today, went 3-1 at the LGS losing to Abzan (as if there's any other way), but I still put up a decent fight. Love this deck to death.
yea i get that. but at that point we just go back to tarfire right?
Not necessarily, Tarfire isn't free and it doesn't cycle through your deck.
What do you guys think of Delay instead of Disdainful Stroke (lists that played additional counters in sb from PT played Delay instead of DS)?
I'm liking the idea, it's definitely more versatile and somewhat helps our Burn matchup. Also hits Oblivion Stone / Matter Reshaper and other problematic cards in big mana decks that DS wouldn't be able to hit.
Andrew Baeckstrom's list has no rhyme or reason to me.. Manamorphosex3 without kiln fiend, MD Rampager, MD Ranger of Eos, 2 bolts in the SB(?!?!). Maybe someone smarter than I can explain to me..
Although I must say that I dig the SB Grim Lavamancers.
Instants can sometimes be the most difficult card type to get into the graveyard when it comes to enabling delirium due to the fact that all our instants need specific targets before we can cast them. Manamorphose can be cast at any time, doesn't cost us any mana and offers an additional way to burn through our deck.
I think it's a very interesting card, I just wouldn't feel too happy cutting Decays for it. Maindeck Ghor-Clan and Ranger are a bit more perplexing to me... but I also do like that Grim Lavamancer in the sb.
Been testing a singleton Forest in the maindeck and a Surgical Extraction in the side. Both were good to me today, went 3-1 at the LGS losing to Abzan (as if there's any other way), but I still put up a decent fight. Love this deck to death.
Is the Baecktron deck the one you love or do you just mean Traverse Shadow in general?
I tried playing a few practice games on mtgo with the Ghor Clan and Ranger maindeck---and it felt clunky.
The manamorphose seems strange to me. I get it's a card draw and nice to cast when we get our Shrine blown up, but it feels like a cantrip you don't want to use until several turns later, which can clunk the hand up
The PT showed that Traverse/5C is possibly the better deck, but now I'm so unsure what version to proceed with
There's the blue splash, there's the version without lingering souls
I have no clue what version of this deck to play, I never can decide when there isn't a general consensus on decks.
The grim lavamancer seems awesome in the side though.
For the people who are confused or unsure about manamorphose, here are the things it does:
1) Fixes your mana, in particular in the face of a Blood Moon, but also if your key colored source gets blown up.
2) Is an instant for Delirium, especially when your removal spells don't have targets.
3) Makes your deck smaller so you draw the good cards more often. And by good cards, I mean Shadow and TBR.
4) It allows you to get tricky with which spells you're representing and which spells you can actually cast. Every now and then an opponent will think they're safe from TBR because you don't have a red source, then.... whammo.
5) It allows you to fetch for Breeding Pool + Blood Crypt in the early turns, yet still spend a key turn casting 2 black spells. And, in general, it smooths out a fairly unruly manabase.
It's not without downsides of course. It's an awkward topdeck because you can choose the wrong colors of mana. It makes you flood out a bit more (though you can cut a land when you add them). It makes sequencing awkward sometimes. It makes you weaker to Thalia. Etc.
But combined, 1)-5) is a lot of upside. Definitely makes it worth trying. The thing that initially got me excited was 1), but 5) is probably more important.
How small do we want this deck? If I were to go the Manamorphose route, then I may cut white entirely. I think Architects of Will would be a reasonable addtion to the deck in place of Grim Flayer to shrink the deck further. So, we would be looking at:
4 x Street Wraith
4 x Mishra's Bauble
2-3 x Manamorphose
3-4 Traverse the Uvenwald
1-2 Architects of the Will
12 Fetches
I really like the feel of such a narrow deck. It also synergizes so well with the Grim Lavamancer plan in beating arguably the strongest deck in the format (Lantern Control). The more cards that thin the deck and make it harder for Lantern to interact the better our plan becomes. I will be testing a list for the next few weeks that will be cutting White for the streamline 4cDS plan of t3/4 kills. Love the craftiness of Delay; very spicy...
I am most in line with Spooly's : 5) It allows you to fetch for Breeding Pool + Blood Crypt in the early turns, yet still spend a key turn casting 2 black spells. And, in general, it smooths out a fairly unruly manabase.
IMO if you fill up the deck with too many cantripping cards and reduce the amount of actual threats, you will more often loose to yourself by spending too much time cantriping to actually finding a threat. Thats the same problem Grixis DS has from time to time. I dont like the idea of cutting Flayers for that reason.
https://magic.wizards.com/en/events/coverage/ptrix/tournament-results-and-decklists
Not being able to Snap-Stub ever feels weird to me, I must say. But I guess the Forest must be worth it with all the Blood Moons going around these days?
Abzan Traverse / Traverse Shadow / UR Kiki
Hostage Taker was a great call for that metagame. It seems great against Humans, in particular, which is usually a rough matchup. The extra spot removal in the SB also seems like a concession to this. I'm kind of liking shaving a Traverse too, at least in the 5c lists that don't want to run Tarfire. I'm not so sure about the Snapcaster without 2 blue sources, or the Forest. I could maybe get behind Snappy if we had a second blue source though. Or the forest if we cut Snappy.
Another list they showed was playing 3 Manamorphose, which is a cute way to enable Traverse with an instant when the removal doesn't have targets. And is Blood Moon / other forms of mana denial protection. And you get to draw your Shadows and TBRs that much more often. There are downsides, of course, but it's interesting. 3 might be too many, but the first version I try will have 4. I'm guessing 1-2 is more likely to be right, if not 0.
Edit: thinking about Hostage Taker a little more, it permanently nails Bridge against Lantern, even through Welding Jar. Against Mardu, if you nail a Bedlam Reveler with it and get to untap, or just have a million mana, it's a massive swing. The most awkward thing about it is that it isn't good against the control decks, and normally you'd like your haymaker to be good there.
Because blue allows you to fight the big mana decks with countermagic instead. No graveyard hate was more of a metagame call, but it turned out to be pretty good. The main place you miss gy hate once you have countermagic in the deck is vs. stuff like Dredge that leans very hard on the graveyard and is otherwise very hard to interact with.
And TBR just wins the race usually.
Abzan Traverse / Traverse Shadow / UR Kiki
My favorite part about Flayer is the value TBRs you get with him sometimes, usually game 1 against decks where TBR is normally bad. Definitely not the best part about the card, but it always makes me a little giddy.
Although I must say that I dig the SB Grim Lavamancers.
https://magic.wizards.com/en/events/coverage/ptrix/24-26-point-decklists-2018-02-03
The idea came up as I felt that i feel the deck plays a smooth tempo-oriented game with a midrange backup on Liliana and Traverse, we disrupt our opponent with what I call "universal answers" on discard, land a threat (either a huge goyf or shadow) and try to beat up the opponent before he recovers. Therefore, we need something to protect our threats and Stubborn Denial, which is already used as a 3-of with a 4th on most sideboards is the perfect answer.
I believe adding the 4th stub would help us close out the game even further since we don't have snappys to flashback it or strong card filtering outside of bauble + fetch. Also, it's a card that answers 90% of the problematic cards that DS decks have to deal with, specially when backed up by discard spells.
I am not sure on what I'd cut for it but What are your thoughts on a 4th Stubborn Denial MD ?
Instants can sometimes be the most difficult card type to get into the graveyard when it comes to enabling delirium due to the fact that all our instants need specific targets before we can cast them. Manamorphose can be cast at any time, doesn't cost us any mana and offers an additional way to burn through our deck.
I think it's a very interesting card, I just wouldn't feel too happy cutting Decays for it. Maindeck Ghor-Clan and Ranger are a bit more perplexing to me... but I also do like that Grim Lavamancer in the sb.
Been testing a singleton Forest in the maindeck and a Surgical Extraction in the side. Both were good to me today, went 3-1 at the LGS losing to Abzan (as if there's any other way), but I still put up a decent fight. Love this deck to death.
Abzan Traverse / Traverse Shadow / UR Kiki
I recently recorded a modern league and ran 4-1 with Reid Dukes Abzan Death's Shadow list from GP San Antonio which felt really well positioned against the current meta.
Check out the decktech and gameplay here https://youtu.be/POQ0ZgxQ_Pw
Any questions or suggestions about the deck please hit us up in the comments!
Not necessarily, Tarfire isn't free and it doesn't cycle through your deck.
I'm liking the idea, it's definitely more versatile and somewhat helps our Burn matchup. Also hits Oblivion Stone / Matter Reshaper and other problematic cards in big mana decks that DS wouldn't be able to hit.
Abzan Traverse / Traverse Shadow / UR Kiki
Is the Baecktron deck the one you love or do you just mean Traverse Shadow in general?
I tried playing a few practice games on mtgo with the Ghor Clan and Ranger maindeck---and it felt clunky.
The manamorphose seems strange to me. I get it's a card draw and nice to cast when we get our Shrine blown up, but it feels like a cantrip you don't want to use until several turns later, which can clunk the hand up
The PT showed that Traverse/5C is possibly the better deck, but now I'm so unsure what version to proceed with
There's the blue splash, there's the version without lingering souls
I have no clue what version of this deck to play, I never can decide when there isn't a general consensus on decks.
The grim lavamancer seems awesome in the side though.
1) Fixes your mana, in particular in the face of a Blood Moon, but also if your key colored source gets blown up.
2) Is an instant for Delirium, especially when your removal spells don't have targets.
3) Makes your deck smaller so you draw the good cards more often. And by good cards, I mean Shadow and TBR.
4) It allows you to get tricky with which spells you're representing and which spells you can actually cast. Every now and then an opponent will think they're safe from TBR because you don't have a red source, then.... whammo.
5) It allows you to fetch for Breeding Pool + Blood Crypt in the early turns, yet still spend a key turn casting 2 black spells. And, in general, it smooths out a fairly unruly manabase.
It's not without downsides of course. It's an awkward topdeck because you can choose the wrong colors of mana. It makes you flood out a bit more (though you can cut a land when you add them). It makes sequencing awkward sometimes. It makes you weaker to Thalia. Etc.
But combined, 1)-5) is a lot of upside. Definitely makes it worth trying. The thing that initially got me excited was 1), but 5) is probably more important.
4 x Street Wraith
4 x Mishra's Bauble
2-3 x Manamorphose
3-4 Traverse the Uvenwald
1-2 Architects of the Will
12 Fetches
I really like the feel of such a narrow deck. It also synergizes so well with the Grim Lavamancer plan in beating arguably the strongest deck in the format (Lantern Control). The more cards that thin the deck and make it harder for Lantern to interact the better our plan becomes. I will be testing a list for the next few weeks that will be cutting White for the streamline 4cDS plan of t3/4 kills. Love the craftiness of Delay; very spicy...