Can't say a lot about human since nobody picked-up the deck in my meta/playgroup.
Tron is a bad match-up. It's not unwinnable but if it's a big part of your meta, it can be a good idea to switch deck. I personally play burn when this happens in my meta. If you're obstinated on playing the deck, here's a couple cards that will be helpfull in evening the match-up: Ghost Quarter + Surgical extraction/Extirpate to try to break their urza land combo, Stony Silence to Stops Expedition map, Oblivion Stone and the likes, Pithing Needle/Anguished Unmaking/Oblivion ring to deal with planeswalkers (Especially Ugin).
Jeskai control is usually pretty manageable. We have a lot of discard and sweepers are pretty much the only real problems and you usually see them only in game 2/3.
Raise the alarm will help you race tron and burn while Bitterblossom greatly help against any control/slower decks and not so much against aggro/fast decks. You can do a 2/2 or 2/3 split between Bitter/alarm, or a full playset of RtA. You really don't need bitter if you're starting.
Tested Start // Finish for a good five month. it's "mehokayish"... Play no more than one if any. Can't really talk about Legion's landing has I have yet to test it.
Fantastic against burn and death shadow. It Can block creatures without dying and dodge popular removal like bolt and push. It's also a nice cushion If you're playing Bitterblossom
- I basically have the modern event deck pieces as well as some more cards I got meanwhile. What are the pieces of the standard lists that I should get first?
Upgrade the landbase first. I know it's the boring responsible adult answer to give, but it's the best thing to do really. A playset of Concealed courtyard is a good start if fetches/shockland are too pricy. Shambling vent is also pretty good and most list I see play at least a pair. Shefet Dunes is also worth trying at one or two copies and it's dirt cheap.
Hey guys, it's been quite a while since I last visited this thread.
Couple of things I am unsure about:
- Is the deck good in a death's shadow / Humans / Tron / Jeskai Control / Burn meta?
- What version do would you prefer in such a meta and why? (Bitterblossom vs Raise the Alarm)
- Are Start // Finish and Legion's Landing actually good?
- Are Auriok Champions worth it?
- I basically have the modern event deck pieces as well as some more cards I got meanwhile. What are the pieces of the standard lists that I should get first?
Thanks and a Happy New Year to you guys.
A few of the W fetches from Khans would be a good investment. Marsh Flats are the best thing, but one should play three or four more W fetches anyway and the Khans fetches are much easier on the wallet.
I have 5c humans and tokens. A friend and I played the match a few times and it feels pretty hopeless for tokens. We have to have the perfect hand to get there because they are way faster than us. Honestly, I think jeskai is the only tier 1 deck In the meta we have decent game against right now.
Hey everyone! I have been wondering about using Bontu's Last Reckoning as a sideboard replacement for Wrath of God, against decks like Humans, Soul Sisters, Elves, Maybe Collected Company decks? I've found that, at least against Elves, it's really close when it comes to reaching 4 mana before they overrun me, and I thought the downside won't be that significant when you can wipe 5 elves off the board. This is all theoretical, since I sadly don't play that often and I'm unable to try it out myself. Does anyone have experience with this?
As one of the resident RtA aggro tokens enthusiasts I can weigh in on the legion’s landing question.
I’ve been using it for upwards of 70 games now and it’s an incredible card in the RtA shell. I like it so much I run 4 despite it being legendary it’s that good but I can see an argument to run 3 max.
It seals the burn matchup almost every time it’s played and leans into a fast clock meaning that some of the matchups that BW tokens might traditionally struggle with actually aren’t that bad (storm for example).
Going LL into RtA and swinging to transform on turn 3 is really nice. That gives you access to 4 mana turn 3. I win most games on the play where I curve LL - RtA - Spectral & disruption and then anthem/Walker and swing turn 4. This shell has a turn 4 win even through some disruption.
It also doesn’t suffer too terribly from “bad topdeck” status like a lot of one drops too since it’s still relevant later for giving a lifelink token and you can often transform it the turn you play it lategame.
The activated ability of the land is nice and gives you some free long-game utility but pales in comparison to what bitterblossom can offer so bare in mind that a LL&RtA shell doesn’t enjoy the long game as much as the BB shell against control decks.
As someone who is going to swap to the more aggressive shell, what does your spell list look like? I have some ideas on how to proceed, but since you've been playing it I figure you would know exactly how to do things.
What do you sideboard or run in the sideboard against abzan company?
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
pucatrade
big receipts
alpha mox emerald
beta time walk
4 goyfs received
3 liliana of the veil
4 karn liberated
3 force of will
4 grove of the burnwillows
snapcaster mage
3 horizon canopy
2 full art damnation
What do you sideboard or run in the sideboard against abzan company?
Isn't Grafdigger's Cage the top remedy for Collected Company? I'm not sure it's good for many other match-ups but one plays what one must for his environment.
Hello, I would like opinions on my list, the idea is to be more agrro, i don't have bitterblossom https://deckstats.net/decks/74507/843334-agroo-tokens-v2
Questions;
2-3 Sorin?
Trangress help vs Tron and valakut?
Maybe -1 Spectral -1 start / finish?
As someone who is going to swap to the more aggressive shell, what does your spell list look like? I have some ideas on how to proceed, but since you've been playing it I figure you would know exactly how to do things.
After a lot of shifting around and playing both online and at my LGS I've settled on this:
which leaves you with a flex spot that I'm not entirely decided on what to fill with. I've tried various things in this slot, the obvious one being Sorin, Solemn Visitor but I actually don't find him that useful, only really being effective in matchups where the lifelink is relevant. Also, only being able to produce tokens on a minus loyalty ability is an unfortunate drawback on a deck based on momentum like this one.
You could put in a second Gideon, Anguished or Secure the Wastes, even Hero of Bladehold (my personal favourite card of all time but slow and vulnerable); I've tried all of these and am not 100% on any of them if I'm honest. I will most likely settle on a fifth hand disruption spell (likely inquisition) as Storm and Control are becoming increasingly popular at my LGS.
The numbers of the anthems (two ZP's and specifically the singleton HotP) is based on a lot of testing of various numbers of each and feels best in this combination with a third ZP in the sideboard to bring in against go-wides. As I mentioned above, you could potentially also drop a Legion's Landing for another flex slot but I'm so happy with it that I stick to 4.
I appreciate the input. I'll mess around with my deck and see what I like.
Edit: Forgot to ask what your sideboard looks like? I'm looking to add Selfless Spirit currently in mine. But was also curious about Sideboards in general for the shell. We have alot of Burn, Storm, Eldrazi Tron and Death's Shadow in our local meta.
What do you sideboard or run in the sideboard against abzan company?
Isn't Grafdigger's Cage the top remedy for Collected Company? I'm not sure it's good for many other match-ups but one plays what one must for his environment.
pucatrade
big receipts
alpha mox emerald
beta time walk
4 goyfs received
3 liliana of the veil
4 karn liberated
3 force of will
4 grove of the burnwillows
snapcaster mage
3 horizon canopy
2 full art damnation
If you manage to find an effective strategy to beat Eldrazi then let me know.
If this is for FNM, you could try Ensnaring Bridge. Seriously. I have used it in Affinity; one can manage it better there, but it's do-able for BW tokens.
Obviously, one needs to get sufficient value before running such a narrow card, so, how often do you encounter Eldrazi? How much side-board space can you devote to the match-up?
If you manage to find an effective strategy to beat Eldrazi then let me know.
If this is for FNM, you could try Ensnaring Bridge. Seriously. I have used it in Affinity; one can manage it better there, but it's do-able for BW tokens.
Obviously, one needs to get sufficient value before running such a narrow card, so, how often do you encounter Eldrazi? How much side-board space can you devote to the match-up?
I've been running two Fulminator Mages in the SB and two copies of Ghost Quarter in the mainboard for Tron. The Mages might be too slow, but that was the first thing that came to mind to throw in against them.
If you manage to find an effective strategy to beat Eldrazi then let me know.
If this is for FNM, you could try Ensnaring Bridge. Seriously. I have used it in Affinity; one can manage it better there, but it's do-able for BW tokens.
Obviously, one needs to get sufficient value before running such a narrow card, so, how often do you encounter Eldrazi? How much side-board space can you devote to the match-up?
Eldrazi looks like an uphill battle, but you also have to try to race with beatdown and sorin, solemn visitor.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
pucatrade
big receipts
alpha mox emerald
beta time walk
4 goyfs received
3 liliana of the veil
4 karn liberated
3 force of will
4 grove of the burnwillows
snapcaster mage
3 horizon canopy
2 full art damnation
For eldrazi match-ups, I play non-targeting removal to get around Reality smasher's discard effect. Cards like Runed Halo, Blessed alliance and Shriekmaw work (YES Shriekmaw works, read Smasher's effect carefully). Halo also has the advantage of protecting against Thought-knot seer's pesky discard effect.
The floodgate approach pzbw7z is proposing is also great (Thanks again, probably gonna try it actually). ensnaring bridge is definitely the best option, but not the cheapest in term of $dollaridos$. Ghostly prison and Worship can do similar jobs with less pain to your wallets.
Can't say a lot about human since nobody picked-up the deck in my meta/playgroup.
Tron is a bad match-up. It's not unwinnable but if it's a big part of your meta, it can be a good idea to switch deck. I personally play burn when this happens in my meta. If you're obstinated on playing the deck, here's a couple cards that will be helpfull in evening the match-up: Ghost Quarter + Surgical extraction/Extirpate to try to break their urza land combo, Stony Silence to Stops Expedition map, Oblivion Stone and the likes, Pithing Needle/Anguished Unmaking/Oblivion ring to deal with planeswalkers (Especially Ugin).
Jeskai control is usually pretty manageable. We have a lot of discard and sweepers are pretty much the only real problems and you usually see them only in game 2/3.
burn can be hard, but if you have ways to gain life before turn 4-5, you should be good. Auriok champion, Timely reinforcments and Collective brutality are good here. Also KILL THE CREATURES FAST!!!
Raise the alarm will help you race tron and burn while Bitterblossom greatly help against any control/slower decks and not so much against aggro/fast decks. You can do a 2/2 or 2/3 split between Bitter/alarm, or a full playset of RtA. You really don't need bitter if you're starting.
Tested Start // Finish for a good five month. it's "mehokayish"... Play no more than one if any. Can't really talk about Legion's landing has I have yet to test it.
Fantastic against burn and death shadow. It Can block creatures without dying and dodge popular removal like bolt and push. It's also a nice cushion If you're playing Bitterblossom
Upgrade the landbase first. I know it's the boring responsible adult answer to give, but it's the best thing to do really. A playset of Concealed courtyard is a good start if fetches/shockland are too pricy. Shambling vent is also pretty good and most list I see play at least a pair. Shefet Dunes is also worth trying at one or two copies and it's dirt cheap.
U2
(W/B)BW Tokens(W/B) | (B/R)Rakdos Burn(B/R) | (U/R)Gift Storm(U/R)
A few of the W fetches from Khans would be a good investment. Marsh Flats are the best thing, but one should play three or four more W fetches anyway and the Khans fetches are much easier on the wallet.
Frenzy-Affinity-Ghost Quarter-Rock-Tokens- RGWPhyrexian Zoo- WVial KnightsStandard:
BW Knights(Rotated)Pioneer: RW Knights - BW Rally Zombies - UW Heroes
Commander:WUG
Jenara, Asura of War- WGSigarda, Host of HeronsCasualties of economicsLegacy: Good-night, sweet prince. Mono-R Burn
As someone who is going to swap to the more aggressive shell, what does your spell list look like? I have some ideas on how to proceed, but since you've been playing it I figure you would know exactly how to do things.
WBTokensWB
pucatrade
big receipts
alpha mox emerald
beta time walk
4 goyfs received
3 liliana of the veil
4 karn liberated
3 force of will
4 grove of the burnwillows
snapcaster mage
3 horizon canopy
2 full art damnation
Isn't Grafdigger's Cage the top remedy for Collected Company? I'm not sure it's good for many other match-ups but one plays what one must for his environment.
Frenzy-Affinity-Ghost Quarter-Rock-Tokens- RGWPhyrexian Zoo- WVial KnightsStandard:
BW Knights(Rotated)Pioneer: RW Knights - BW Rally Zombies - UW Heroes
Commander:WUG
Jenara, Asura of War- WGSigarda, Host of HeronsCasualties of economicsLegacy: Good-night, sweet prince. Mono-R Burn
https://deckstats.net/decks/74507/843334-agroo-tokens-v2
Questions;
2-3 Sorin?
Trangress help vs Tron and valakut?
Maybe -1 Spectral -1 start / finish?
Edit: Forgot to ask what your sideboard looks like? I'm looking to add Selfless Spirit currently in mine. But was also curious about Sideboards in general for the shell. We have alot of Burn, Storm, Eldrazi Tron and Death's Shadow in our local meta.
WBTokensWB
The issue is the decks resiliency.
I run 2 MD zealous persecution plus an extra in the SB.
Even with that and grafdigger's cage, its still a hard matchup.
You try to deal with collected company and they beatdown with rhonas the indomitable pumps.
They can also CoCo in response to the cage.
pucatrade
big receipts
alpha mox emerald
beta time walk
4 goyfs received
3 liliana of the veil
4 karn liberated
3 force of will
4 grove of the burnwillows
snapcaster mage
3 horizon canopy
2 full art damnation
If this is for FNM, you could try Ensnaring Bridge. Seriously. I have used it in Affinity; one can manage it better there, but it's do-able for BW tokens.
Obviously, one needs to get sufficient value before running such a narrow card, so, how often do you encounter Eldrazi? How much side-board space can you devote to the match-up?
Frenzy-Affinity-Ghost Quarter-Rock-Tokens- RGWPhyrexian Zoo- WVial KnightsStandard:
BW Knights(Rotated)Pioneer: RW Knights - BW Rally Zombies - UW Heroes
Commander:WUG
Jenara, Asura of War- WGSigarda, Host of HeronsCasualties of economicsLegacy: Good-night, sweet prince. Mono-R Burn
I've been running two Fulminator Mages in the SB and two copies of Ghost Quarter in the mainboard for Tron. The Mages might be too slow, but that was the first thing that came to mind to throw in against them.
So is Stony Silence out of the question to throw in the SB? It makes the Affinity match up super easy. Then again so does Zealous Persecution
WBTokensWB
Eldrazi looks like an uphill battle, but you also have to try to race with beatdown and sorin, solemn visitor.
pucatrade
big receipts
alpha mox emerald
beta time walk
4 goyfs received
3 liliana of the veil
4 karn liberated
3 force of will
4 grove of the burnwillows
snapcaster mage
3 horizon canopy
2 full art damnation
BWTokens
GCollected Stompany
BWGUSeance Insanity
URUR Bloo
The floodgate approach pzbw7z is proposing is also great (Thanks again, probably gonna try it actually). ensnaring bridge is definitely the best option, but not the cheapest in term of $dollaridos$. Ghostly prison and Worship can do similar jobs with less pain to your wallets.
(W/B)BW Tokens(W/B) | (B/R)Rakdos Burn(B/R) | (U/R)Gift Storm(U/R)
Stony Silence is also good against Lantern Control, so it might be worth consideration for a slot or two in one's side-board.
Frenzy-Affinity-Ghost Quarter-Rock-Tokens- RGWPhyrexian Zoo- WVial KnightsStandard:
BW Knights(Rotated)Pioneer: RW Knights - BW Rally Zombies - UW Heroes
Commander:WUG
Jenara, Asura of War- WGSigarda, Host of HeronsCasualties of economicsLegacy: Good-night, sweet prince. Mono-R Burn
JundBGR
RW Blood MoonRW
Pauper
Delver U
Elves G
Control B
Commander
Edgar Markov BRW
Captain Sisay GW
Niv-Mizzet, Parun UR
Tymna and Ravos WB
RNA Standard: Grixis Midrange, Jund Deathwhirler, Sultai Vannifar
GRN Standard: Red Midrange, Mono-Blue Tempo, Wr Aggro, Gruul Experimental Dinosaurs, Sultai Midrange, Jeskai Midrange
Modern: Bant Spirits
Forcing a single archetype in all formats: too many colors, bad mana.