I've been thinking about deathmark, seems pretty relevant right now as removal tech, not to mention the awesome artwork as well. I've always struggled with bw tokens in general because I never seem to know when to play the control game and grind or apply pressure as quickly as possible so my deck list is somewhat caught between both modes as far as individual cards like bb vs rta. I just can't seem to part with blossoms but maybe it's time...
I've been thinking about deathmark, seems pretty relevant right now as removal tech, not to mention the awesome artwork as well. I've always struggled with bw tokens in general because I never seem to know when to play the control game and grind or apply pressure as quickly as possible so my deck list is somewhat caught between both modes as far as individual cards like bb vs rta. I just can't seem to part with blossoms but maybe it's time...
I don't like it quite as much as Fatal Push due to it being sorcery speed, but the reliability wins out in this case.
Liliana of the veil again. I'm going to admit I've never piloted a deck that uses her so I do not know her in and out like some players probably do. I'll have to see if there are any gameplay videos of BW tokens running Liliana to get a better picture.
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1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
With the largely superior Auriok Champion being reprinted and now available at a fifth of the pre-iconic master price, I see very little reason to run Anointer Priest. In the match ups where the lifegain is attractive, she will be virtually impossible to kill. The fact that the lifegain also applies to opponent's creatures seals the deal.
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BGW Elves BGW|BW Tokens BW|WBR Sword&ShieldWBR|BUG DelverBUG|UWR Kiki UWR | UR Storm UR
G1, Grixis Death Shadow 2-1
This matchup is just too easy for us. He had a hand with triple death shadow + gurmag angler that took him to win the second game. Third game I kept a 5-lander and I still got the win. BB is too strong in this match. Landing one is almost game.
G3, GW eldrazi and taxes 0-2
I lost game 1 to eldrazi displacer. I threw a path and he responded blinking his flickerwisp to blink his displacer and nab my path. Should have destroyed his temple using my GQ before that, but I totally missed it. Second game I lost again to the displacer and topdeck TKS exiling the wrath of god I was holding... Lack of focus was deadly here. Should have paid more attention, but it was a tough week at work...
G4, Mardu tokens 2-0
Ey! another token list. Ey! you don't play Orzhov. GG opponent. Gideon here was amaaaaazing.
Conclusions:
- I loved how Gids worked. I am keeping him in my list as a 1-of. Great value.
- I alsp liked sorin, lord of innistrad but he didnt have the chance to shine as much as gids. At some time I had the two sorins and gideon in play at once and my opponent just started laughing... I like that the emblem doesnt kill him.
- First time I played only 2 Spectrals and I didnt miss them. i am actually considering using midnight haunting as a replacement. It is one less token, but I love how Start // Finish works at instant speed, and I wouldnt mind having more of that in my deck. I feel spectral procession is a bit overrated (clearly is super good, but I am not so sure it is a staple to our deck anymore, in more control-based version at least). I like them in 2.
- For the Liliana debate, I didnt have the chance to play her a lot this time, since she was really bad against my matchups that day. However, that does not mean that I would cut her at all. She is so powerful and versatile that I dont see myself taking her out of my list.
All in all, great time, great results, and lessons learned for next time displacer and flickerwisp are around... Always room for improvement.
With the largely superior Auriok Champion being reprinted and now available at a fifth of the pre-iconic master price, I see very little reason to run Anointer Priest. In the match ups where the lifegain is attractive, she will be virtually impossible to kill. The fact that the lifegain also applies to opponent's creatures seals the deal.
She's often the right answer for most situations. It's always good to look at what other options there are, though. Suture Priest is pretty good in a mirror match since the primary removal the deck runs vs creatures is Path to Exile.
I'd say in order of power, these are probably the best life gain options for the deck depending on build...
Authority is good since it comes down fast against burn and aggro and often buys time to build a good board state. Plus most people don't main deck enchantment removal. Auriok champion (or syrup champion according to android auto correct) fills a lot of the same roles as authority, but is better against decks that have a few big creatures and run black or red removal like deaths shadow.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Authority is good since it comes down fast against burn and aggro and often buys time to build a good board state. Plus most people don't main deck enchantment removal. Auriok champion (or syrup champion according to android auto correct) fills a lot of the same roles as authority, but is better against decks that have a few big creatures and run black or red removal like deaths shadow.
I really feel like Timely reinforcements should be in this list somewhere. 6 life and/or three chump blockers goes a long way to stay alive and against aggro, you'll almost always get both. I'd place it between Auriok Champion and authority of the consuls.
Authority is good since it comes down fast against burn and aggro and often buys time to build a good board state. Plus most people don't main deck enchantment removal. Auriok champion (or syrup champion according to android auto correct) fills a lot of the same roles as authority, but is better against decks that have a few big creatures and run black or red removal like deaths shadow.
I really feel like Timely reinforcements should be in this list somewhere. 6 life and/or three chump blockers goes a long way to stay alive and against aggro, you'll almost always get both. I'd place it between Auriok Champion and authority of the consuls.
I was mostly sticking with persistent ones. Timely reinforcements is a proven staple in the deck and we'll worth having in the 75 even if only in the sideboard.
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1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Authority is good since it comes down fast against burn and aggro and often buys time to build a good board state. Plus most people don't main deck enchantment removal. Auriok champion (or syrup champion according to android auto correct) fills a lot of the same roles as authority, but is better against decks that have a few big creatures and run black or red removal like deaths shadow.
I really feel like Timely reinforcements should be in this list somewhere. 6 life and/or three chump blockers goes a long way to stay alive and against aggro, you'll almost always get both. I'd place it between Auriok Champion and authority of the consuls.
I was mostly sticking with persistent ones. Timely reinforcements is a proven staple in the deck and we'll worth having in the 75 even if only in the sideboard.
I disagree about timely reinforcements. We almost never have fewer creatures against most decks
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alpha mox emerald
beta time walk
4 goyfs received
3 liliana of the veil
4 karn liberated
3 force of will
4 grove of the burnwillows
snapcaster mage
3 horizon canopy
2 full art damnation
I disagree about timely reinforcements. We almost never have fewer creatures against most decks
If we don't, we're probably doing it wrongly.
There are decks that will play creatures turn-one and turn-two and we will often not play any until turn-three. Timely Reinforcements can be a game-saver on turn-three against an aggro deck but its stock plummets as the game progresses. I do not really feel it is a staple or even really necessary but I wouldn't make fun of anyone who plays it. It's not awful and it can work it just shouldn't work very often.
I disagree about timely reinforcements. We almost never have fewer creatures against most decks
I see where you're coming from. If we're talking Jund , abzan or midrange in general, we're likely to have more creature very quickly and that situation will likely stay that way. However, decks like Naya zoo or burn (You know aggro decks in general) will have creatures on the board by turn 1/2 and attacking while dispensing plenty of removal to keep the advantage.
Unless we run Raise the alarm or Legion's landing (Still have to test this card), we will have no creature on the battlefield until turn 3 which mean we'll have lost life. If this is the first token generator we fire off, it's a huge swing, especially if we put an intangible virtue turn 2. Gaining back six life and putting three 2/2 will at least slow down anybody. Couple of Worst case scenario are: you get a Skullcrack in respond (which still leaves you with three tokens) or All the tokens gets no trades and only chump block, which still gained you one turn at least and a couple of life.
also, I don't want to talk for anybody here (definitely correct me if I'm wrong), but I often loose tokens to spot removal and combat trades (Or chump blocking). It's pretty rare that all of my tokens survive the whole game, and I think it would be foolish to assume their safety. A scenario where we have less monster than an opponent more than once in the same game is not uncommon, especially against aggro.
Now if we're talking mainboard inclusion, I agree with you, it's not that good of a card simply because it can be dead in some scenarios (Controls and combo in general). But this is my opinion for the card in the 75. It's a good card to have against burn and aggro in the sideboard. At worst it buys us time, at best it swings the game around.
Yea our tokens makes spot removal bad, but it certainly does not invalidate them. Removal will be spent and tokens will die, for sure.
Regarding Timely, I feel that it helps when you're behind, which is nice but cannot advance your board state when you're trying to press the advantage. We're not short on token producers on turn 3 and we certainly have access to plenty of lifegain, so its question then of being greedy against aggro decks.
Legion's Landing into Intangible Virtue is a common start for me and basically makes aggro life a living hell, so I don't really think Timely is good for my build. Perhaps the more traditional ones that still spend turn 1 disrupting.
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I disagree about timely reinforcements. We almost never have fewer creatures against most decks
I see where you're coming from. If we're talking Jund , abzan or midrange in general, we're likely to have more creature very quickly and that situation will likely stay that way. However, decks like Naya zoo or burn (You know aggro decks in general) will have creatures on the board by turn 1/2 and attacking while dispensing plenty of removal to keep the advantage. If this is the first token generator we fire off, it's a huge swing, especially if we put an intangible virtue turn 2. Gaining back six life and putting three 2/2 will at least slow down anybody. Couple of Worst case scenario are: you get a Skullcrack in respond (which still leaves you with three tokens) or All the tokens gets no trades and only chump block, which still gained you one turn at least and a couple of life.
I agree with this 100%. Timely Reinforcements has worked out pretty spectacularly for me. I think it is essentially tied with Auriok Champion for the strongest form of dedicated burn hate we have access to (although AC is the better card overall). This is a little build dependent though. The only way possible for me to get a token out before my Turn 3 main phase is T2 Bitterblossom, and I board most of those out against burn anyways. If you're running a Raise the Alarm build, it is a different story, and I would run AC or Blessed Alliance instead.
I’m trying to stick to a more aggro shell that is desperately trying not to lean too far into the control side, hope I’ve got the balance right but I’m not convinced.
I’ve also taken out the third fatal push in exchange for another anguished which I know a lot of people advocate only having one of.
I’ve found this quite comforting going into an unknown meta and it has been a saviour in the past against a lot of enchantment control or unexpected artefacts and combos relying on such but is probably the first card I’d be willing to switch out.
Typical all round non-amazing sideboard with essentially the plan to roll over and die to Tron or go-wides (don’t own any board wipes ><).
Any feedback or advice is greatly appreciated. Will add in my report once I get back on Friday night!
In my opinion, your build is focused, aggressive, strong, and well-built overall. That being said, I do see room for improvement, starting with your land base. It would be more flexible, result in fewer mulligans, and fewer instances of not being able to cast Turn 1 disruption if you added a second set of fetches. This is my first recommendation:
The second land change I would suggest regards utility. Tap-land is the enemy of aggressive builds. Personally, I would swap one Shambling Vent for a second Vault of the Archangel, or even ditch both for a Vault and a Ghost Quarter. With a second set of fetch lands, running three colorless utility lands should not cause you any appreciable amount of mana issues and the loss of two tap-lands will help to ensure that you do not encounter hiccups in maintaining an aggressive tempo.
My other suggestions concern your sideboard. I don't think there is a compelling reason to run four additional removal spells here. You are already running 8 (10 counting Collective Brutality), and the types of creatures that Dismember and Devour Flesh are useful for are often found in decks that we are already favored against, like Grixis Shadow. There are exceptions, of course (such as Devour Flesh being strong against Bogles, or Dismember being useful against Eldrazi Tron. They are still ultimately second-rate removal spells though that could be substituted for better cards.
Since your build is aggressive, how about sideboard Zealous Persecution? It's a selective board wipe against Affinity and Elves, or a temporary anthem when you need to push through additional damage. I would also consider including 1-2 copies of Surgical Extraction or Extirpate for combo decks, and a second Pithing Needle. If you really do feel the need for additional sideboard removal, maybe Blessed Alliance could be a better and more versatile alternative to Devour Flesh.
Kataki, RIP, and Timely are all good, although the argument can be made that there are better options. Stony Silence, Auriok Champion, and Nihil Spellbomb all have pros and cons relative to the cards you are currently running. Just something to consider.
I’m trying to stick to a more aggro shell that is desperately trying not to lean too far into the control side, hope I’ve got the balance right but I’m not convinced.
I’ve also taken out the third fatal push in exchange for another anguished which I know a lot of people advocate only having one of.
I’ve found this quite comforting going into an unknown meta and it has been a saviour in the past against a lot of enchantment control or unexpected artefacts and combos relying on such but is probably the first card I’d be willing to switch out.
Typical all round non-amazing sideboard with essentially the plan to roll over and die to Tron or go-wides (don’t own any board wipes ><).
Any feedback or advice is greatly appreciated. Will add in my report once I get back on Friday night!
I have always been an advocate of having at least oneAnguished Unmaking main-deck. Two seems entirely reasonable in the 75. I have no quibbles against them both being main-deck. I like it better main-deck as opposed to side-board. I want more specific answers there I think.
You certainly don't need four shocks. I would swap two for two more W-fetches. Fetid Heath is another good option. I would recommend only one Swamp as well. It's a horrible thing to top deck when you need to hit WWW.
Is including LotV and/or Phyrexian Arena too crazy? Am I insane for wanting to mix these with a more aggro-focused build?
Liliana of the Veil is sometimes played in BW tokens but Phyrexian Arena has never really gotten any traction. I personally don't like any BB spells in BW tokens. It should really be referred to as WB tokens, you know. Arena is also a three drop that doesn't have any impact the turn it is played. None for me, thanks.
My opinion (and many others too as I can see) on Liliana of the veil is that she's not NECESSARY. It can be a nice card to have as a one of to fill a flex slot (especially if your meta has boggles), but take it from someone who tested a pair for two month; I don't run them anymore and don't feel like running them in the future. Here's why:
1) the BB cost. It's definitely is manageable, but risky (Merfolk, Blue moon exist) and often painful (Shockland + fetching). Lili has a hard time living harmoniously in our deck with a full playset of Spectral procession, and I don't recommend cutting any copy of those. Don't make the same mistake I didand cut two to ease the mana base. It doesn't work.
2) the coverted mana cost of 3. It usually conflict with our ideal line of play of T1 Disrupt, T2 double disrupt or Intangible virtue, T3 Token, T4 Planeswalker. I may need to, but I don't want to keep my tokens on hold to disrupt my opponent on turn 3. I want my token out on curve, and lili doesn't really help with that. Also, I like my disruption cheap (See my list, my 16 of my maindeck disruption are CMC 1).
I like to live dangerously. Also Disenchant. Also also, I can just discard it with all of my hand hate.
3) She's really expensive. Like I don't like to bring budget into the equation, but holy moly! We're talking Tarmogoyf kind of prices here. at this moment right now she has an average price of 88,35$ on MTGstock. You could buy yourself most of the deck with this kind of dough. Hell you can get yourself a playset of windswept heath for that price and I'd recommend going this route a hundred time more before getting yourself a lili. Furthermore, the deck can easily function without her. She isn't a crucial part of the deck. She's a damn fine piece for disrupting our opponent, but she's not mandatory by a long shot.
Now I'm not bashing the card. It's a fantastic card and I'd love for my pair to go in the deck. But she cannot be played until turn 3, the same turn we usually want tokens for optimal plays and that's a conflict that became more and more apparent the more I played the card. Play it if you want, I personally won't until my meta calls for more non-targeting removal.
I agree with what you say about her not being necessary. That is totally true. But I must answer to some of your points:
1) the cost makes the manabase less flexible, true. But I am running myself 2 spectral processions and the deck runs super smooth either way. I complemented with the inclusion of a Gideon, ally of Zendikar and a Sorin, Lord of Innistrad to rise up the token generators again, and they work out great (specially Gids). Also...
2) Notice that this solutions leads to a nice:
T1-Disruption
T2-BB
T3-Lili/Tokens
T4-Any kind of anthem (Sorin1, Sorin2, Gids, intangible virtue)
Seems extremely powerful to me, and the possibility to choose whether you want to punish opponent's hand (Lili), board (Lili or tokens), or life (tokens) is always welcome.
3)mmmm... yeah, she is too expensive, I have to agree
I could survive without her in my deck (as I did for many months), but having her is where I want to be. The deck is perfectly capable of sustaining her, and she fits the strategy (at least in my shell).
Haven't posted in a while, but I've been piloting this variation. I plan on taking it to another FNM soon, it usually does pretty well. Let me know of your thoughts.
Haven't posted in a while, but I've been piloting this variation. I plan on taking it to another FNM soon, it usually does pretty well. Let me know of your thoughts.
A Plains seems necessary. Four Shrines seems excessive. I don't see the need for Urborg. Smallpox seems at odds with the typical lines of play in BW tokens. It will make hitting those four-drops difficult. Having a Flagstone in play at the right time doesn't seem reliable. Main-deck damnation is an unusual choice as well.
My goodness, that's a lot of Plainswalkers.
Four EtB-tapped lands out of 23 is one too many for my tastes.
Sorry I've nothing but nitpicking to offer, but I just don't see the deviations from the typical deck as positive. But hey, if it's fun, rock it!
Lili, the last hope has very little utility here. I could see her as a sb card against deck where she’ll have a lot of targets but her -2 is blank so your plan is to try to get her to ult? That slot could be better utilized with paths and more token producers like start//finish and spectral procession. Main deck damnation seems odd too.
I agree with tarotplz, either smallpox or tokens. This kind of dilutes what both decks are good at.
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I don't like it quite as much as Fatal Push due to it being sorcery speed, but the reliability wins out in this case.
Liliana of the veil again. I'm going to admit I've never piloted a deck that uses her so I do not know her in and out like some players probably do. I'll have to see if there are any gameplay videos of BW tokens running Liliana to get a better picture.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
BGW Elves BGW|BW Tokens BW|WBR Sword&ShieldWBR|BUG DelverBUG|UWR Kiki UWR | UR Storm UR
4x Marsh Flats
1x Flooded Strand
2x Windswept Heath
3x Shambling Vent
4x Concealed Courtyard
1x Vault of the Archangel
2x Swamp
2x Godless Shrine
2x Plains
3x Ghost Quarter
-DISRUPTION 17-
4x Inquisition of Kozilek
2x Thoughtseize
2x Collective Brutality
2x Liliana of the Veil
3x Fatal Push
4x Path to Exile
4x Lingering Souls
2x Spectral Procession
2x Start / Finish
3x Bitterblossom
1x Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
1x Sorin, Lord of Innistrad
-ANTHEMS 6-
2x Sorin, Solemn Visitor
4x Intangible Virtue
2x Disenchant
2x Pithing Needle
2x Rest in Peace
2x Blessed Alliance
3x Stony Silence
1x Surgical Extraction
1x Extirpate
2x Wrath of God
G1, Grixis Death Shadow 2-1
This matchup is just too easy for us. He had a hand with triple death shadow + gurmag angler that took him to win the second game. Third game I kept a 5-lander and I still got the win. BB is too strong in this match. Landing one is almost game.
G2, Rakdos prowess 2-0
Spicy brew using monastery swiftspear and young pyromancer type creatures, along with some looting effects. Easy outrun.
G3, GW eldrazi and taxes 0-2
I lost game 1 to eldrazi displacer. I threw a path and he responded blinking his flickerwisp to blink his displacer and nab my path. Should have destroyed his temple using my GQ before that, but I totally missed it. Second game I lost again to the displacer and topdeck TKS exiling the wrath of god I was holding... Lack of focus was deadly here. Should have paid more attention, but it was a tough week at work...
G4, Mardu tokens 2-0
Ey! another token list. Ey! you don't play Orzhov. GG opponent. Gideon here was amaaaaazing.
Conclusions:
- I loved how Gids worked. I am keeping him in my list as a 1-of. Great value.
- I alsp liked sorin, lord of innistrad but he didnt have the chance to shine as much as gids. At some time I had the two sorins and gideon in play at once and my opponent just started laughing... I like that the emblem doesnt kill him.
- First time I played only 2 Spectrals and I didnt miss them. i am actually considering using midnight haunting as a replacement. It is one less token, but I love how Start // Finish works at instant speed, and I wouldnt mind having more of that in my deck. I feel spectral procession is a bit overrated (clearly is super good, but I am not so sure it is a staple to our deck anymore, in more control-based version at least). I like them in 2.
- For the Liliana debate, I didnt have the chance to play her a lot this time, since she was really bad against my matchups that day. However, that does not mean that I would cut her at all. She is so powerful and versatile that I dont see myself taking her out of my list.
All in all, great time, great results, and lessons learned for next time displacer and flickerwisp are around... Always room for improvement.
BW BW Tokens
RG Dredgeplendid Reclamation
RW Boros Burn
GB Elves
RB Dark Goblins
WU Azorius' Relic
She's often the right answer for most situations. It's always good to look at what other options there are, though. Suture Priest is pretty good in a mirror match since the primary removal the deck runs vs creatures is Path to Exile.
I'd say in order of power, these are probably the best life gain options for the deck depending on build...
Authority is good since it comes down fast against burn and aggro and often buys time to build a good board state. Plus most people don't main deck enchantment removal. Auriok champion (or syrup champion according to android auto correct) fills a lot of the same roles as authority, but is better against decks that have a few big creatures and run black or red removal like deaths shadow.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
(W/B)BW Tokens(W/B) | (B/R)Rakdos Burn(B/R) | (U/R)Gift Storm(U/R)
I was mostly sticking with persistent ones. Timely reinforcements is a proven staple in the deck and we'll worth having in the 75 even if only in the sideboard.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I disagree about timely reinforcements. We almost never have fewer creatures against most decks
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big receipts
alpha mox emerald
beta time walk
4 goyfs received
3 liliana of the veil
4 karn liberated
3 force of will
4 grove of the burnwillows
snapcaster mage
3 horizon canopy
2 full art damnation
If we don't, we're probably doing it wrongly.
There are decks that will play creatures turn-one and turn-two and we will often not play any until turn-three. Timely Reinforcements can be a game-saver on turn-three against an aggro deck but its stock plummets as the game progresses. I do not really feel it is a staple or even really necessary but I wouldn't make fun of anyone who plays it. It's not awful and it can work it just shouldn't work very often.
Frenzy-Affinity-Ghost Quarter-Rock-Tokens- RGWPhyrexian Zoo- WVial KnightsStandard:
BW Knights(Rotated)Pioneer: RW Knights - BW Rally Zombies - UW Heroes
Commander:WUG
Jenara, Asura of War- WGSigarda, Host of HeronsCasualties of economicsLegacy: Good-night, sweet prince. Mono-R Burn
Unless we run Raise the alarm or Legion's landing (Still have to test this card), we will have no creature on the battlefield until turn 3 which mean we'll have lost life. If this is the first token generator we fire off, it's a huge swing, especially if we put an intangible virtue turn 2. Gaining back six life and putting three 2/2 will at least slow down anybody. Couple of Worst case scenario are: you get a Skullcrack in respond (which still leaves you with three tokens) or All the tokens gets no trades and only chump block, which still gained you one turn at least and a couple of life.
also, I don't want to talk for anybody here (definitely correct me if I'm wrong), but I often loose tokens to spot removal and combat trades (Or chump blocking). It's pretty rare that all of my tokens survive the whole game, and I think it would be foolish to assume their safety. A scenario where we have less monster than an opponent more than once in the same game is not uncommon, especially against aggro.
Now if we're talking mainboard inclusion, I agree with you, it's not that good of a card simply because it can be dead in some scenarios (Controls and combo in general). But this is my opinion for the card in the 75. It's a good card to have against burn and aggro in the sideboard. At worst it buys us time, at best it swings the game around.
(W/B)BW Tokens(W/B) | (B/R)Rakdos Burn(B/R) | (U/R)Gift Storm(U/R)
Regarding Timely, I feel that it helps when you're behind, which is nice but cannot advance your board state when you're trying to press the advantage. We're not short on token producers on turn 3 and we certainly have access to plenty of lifegain, so its question then of being greedy against aggro decks.
Legion's Landing into Intangible Virtue is a common start for me and basically makes aggro life a living hell, so I don't really think Timely is good for my build. Perhaps the more traditional ones that still spend turn 1 disrupting.
BGW Elves BGW|BW Tokens BW|WBR Sword&ShieldWBR|BUG DelverBUG|UWR Kiki UWR | UR Storm UR
I agree with this 100%. Timely Reinforcements has worked out pretty spectacularly for me. I think it is essentially tied with Auriok Champion for the strongest form of dedicated burn hate we have access to (although AC is the better card overall). This is a little build dependent though. The only way possible for me to get a token out before my Turn 3 main phase is T2 Bitterblossom, and I board most of those out against burn anyways. If you're running a Raise the Alarm build, it is a different story, and I would run AC or Blessed Alliance instead.
BW BW Tokens
BUW Esper Shadow
BUR Grixis Shadow
In my opinion, your build is focused, aggressive, strong, and well-built overall. That being said, I do see room for improvement, starting with your land base. It would be more flexible, result in fewer mulligans, and fewer instances of not being able to cast Turn 1 disruption if you added a second set of fetches. This is my first recommendation:
+4 Windswept Heath
-2 Plains
-1 Swamp
-1 Godless Shrine
The second land change I would suggest regards utility. Tap-land is the enemy of aggressive builds. Personally, I would swap one Shambling Vent for a second Vault of the Archangel, or even ditch both for a Vault and a Ghost Quarter. With a second set of fetch lands, running three colorless utility lands should not cause you any appreciable amount of mana issues and the loss of two tap-lands will help to ensure that you do not encounter hiccups in maintaining an aggressive tempo.
My other suggestions concern your sideboard. I don't think there is a compelling reason to run four additional removal spells here. You are already running 8 (10 counting Collective Brutality), and the types of creatures that Dismember and Devour Flesh are useful for are often found in decks that we are already favored against, like Grixis Shadow. There are exceptions, of course (such as Devour Flesh being strong against Bogles, or Dismember being useful against Eldrazi Tron. They are still ultimately second-rate removal spells though that could be substituted for better cards.
Since your build is aggressive, how about sideboard Zealous Persecution? It's a selective board wipe against Affinity and Elves, or a temporary anthem when you need to push through additional damage. I would also consider including 1-2 copies of Surgical Extraction or Extirpate for combo decks, and a second Pithing Needle. If you really do feel the need for additional sideboard removal, maybe Blessed Alliance could be a better and more versatile alternative to Devour Flesh.
Kataki, RIP, and Timely are all good, although the argument can be made that there are better options. Stony Silence, Auriok Champion, and Nihil Spellbomb all have pros and cons relative to the cards you are currently running. Just something to consider.
Best of luck with your tournament on Friday!
BW BW Tokens
BUW Esper Shadow
BUR Grixis Shadow
I have always been an advocate of having at least one Anguished Unmaking main-deck. Two seems entirely reasonable in the 75. I have no quibbles against them both being main-deck. I like it better main-deck as opposed to side-board. I want more specific answers there I think.
You certainly don't need four shocks. I would swap two for two more W-fetches. Fetid Heath is another good option. I would recommend only one Swamp as well. It's a horrible thing to top deck when you need to hit WWW.
Frenzy-Affinity-Ghost Quarter-Rock-Tokens- RGWPhyrexian Zoo- WVial KnightsStandard:
BW Knights(Rotated)Pioneer: RW Knights - BW Rally Zombies - UW Heroes
Commander:WUG
Jenara, Asura of War- WGSigarda, Host of HeronsCasualties of economicsLegacy: Good-night, sweet prince. Mono-R Burn
Liliana of the Veil is sometimes played in BW tokens but Phyrexian Arena has never really gotten any traction. I personally don't like any BB spells in BW tokens. It should really be referred to as WB tokens, you know. Arena is also a three drop that doesn't have any impact the turn it is played. None for me, thanks.
Frenzy-Affinity-Ghost Quarter-Rock-Tokens- RGWPhyrexian Zoo- WVial KnightsStandard:
BW Knights(Rotated)Pioneer: RW Knights - BW Rally Zombies - UW Heroes
Commander:WUG
Jenara, Asura of War- WGSigarda, Host of HeronsCasualties of economicsLegacy: Good-night, sweet prince. Mono-R Burn
1) the BB cost. It's definitely is manageable, but risky (Merfolk, Blue moon exist) and often painful (Shockland + fetching). Lili has a hard time living harmoniously in our deck with a full playset of Spectral procession, and I don't recommend cutting any copy of those. Don't make the same mistake I didand cut two to ease the mana base. It doesn't work.
2) the coverted mana cost of 3. It usually conflict with our ideal line of play of T1 Disrupt, T2 double disrupt or Intangible virtue, T3 Token, T4 Planeswalker. I may need to, but I don't want to keep my tokens on hold to disrupt my opponent on turn 3. I want my token out on curve, and lili doesn't really help with that. Also, I like my disruption cheap (See my list, my 16 of my maindeck disruption are CMC 1).
inb4 Chalice of the void
I like to live dangerously. Also Disenchant. Also also, I can just discard it with all of my hand hate.
3) She's really expensive. Like I don't like to bring budget into the equation, but holy moly! We're talking Tarmogoyf kind of prices here. at this moment right now she has an average price of 88,35$ on MTGstock. You could buy yourself most of the deck with this kind of dough. Hell you can get yourself a playset of windswept heath for that price and I'd recommend going this route a hundred time more before getting yourself a lili. Furthermore, the deck can easily function without her. She isn't a crucial part of the deck. She's a damn fine piece for disrupting our opponent, but she's not mandatory by a long shot.
Now I'm not bashing the card. It's a fantastic card and I'd love for my pair to go in the deck. But she cannot be played until turn 3, the same turn we usually want tokens for optimal plays and that's a conflict that became more and more apparent the more I played the card. Play it if you want, I personally won't until my meta calls for more non-targeting removal.
(W/B)BW Tokens(W/B) | (B/R)Rakdos Burn(B/R) | (U/R)Gift Storm(U/R)
1) the cost makes the manabase less flexible, true. But I am running myself 2 spectral processions and the deck runs super smooth either way. I complemented with the inclusion of a Gideon, ally of Zendikar and a Sorin, Lord of Innistrad to rise up the token generators again, and they work out great (specially Gids). Also...
2) Notice that this solutions leads to a nice:
T1-Disruption
T2-BB
T3-Lili/Tokens
T4-Any kind of anthem (Sorin1, Sorin2, Gids, intangible virtue)
Seems extremely powerful to me, and the possibility to choose whether you want to punish opponent's hand (Lili), board (Lili or tokens), or life (tokens) is always welcome.
3)mmmm... yeah, she is too expensive, I have to agree
I could survive without her in my deck (as I did for many months), but having her is where I want to be. The deck is perfectly capable of sustaining her, and she fits the strategy (at least in my shell).
BW BW Tokens
RG Dredgeplendid Reclamation
RW Boros Burn
GB Elves
RB Dark Goblins
WU Azorius' Relic
3 Fetid Heath
4 Flagstones of Trokair
4 Godless Shrine
3 Marsh Flats
4 Shambling Vent
2 Swamp
3 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
3 Liliana of the Veil
2 Liliana, the Last Hope
2 Sorin, Lord of Innistrad
1 Sorin, Solemn Visitor
Spells
2 Collective Brutality
1 Damnation
4 Fatal Push
4 Inquisition of Kozilek
4 Lingering Souls
4 Smallpox
2 Thoughtseize
4 Bitterblossom
3 Intangible Virtue
Haven't posted in a while, but I've been piloting this variation. I plan on taking it to another FNM soon, it usually does pretty well. Let me know of your thoughts.
A Plains seems necessary. Four Shrines seems excessive. I don't see the need for Urborg. Smallpox seems at odds with the typical lines of play in BW tokens. It will make hitting those four-drops difficult. Having a Flagstone in play at the right time doesn't seem reliable. Main-deck damnation is an unusual choice as well.
My goodness, that's a lot of Plainswalkers.
Four EtB-tapped lands out of 23 is one too many for my tastes.
Sorry I've nothing but nitpicking to offer, but I just don't see the deviations from the typical deck as positive. But hey, if it's fun, rock it!
Frenzy-Affinity-Ghost Quarter-Rock-Tokens- RGWPhyrexian Zoo- WVial KnightsStandard:
BW Knights(Rotated)Pioneer: RW Knights - BW Rally Zombies - UW Heroes
Commander:WUG
Jenara, Asura of War- WGSigarda, Host of HeronsCasualties of economicsLegacy: Good-night, sweet prince. Mono-R Burn
I agree with tarotplz, either smallpox or tokens. This kind of dilutes what both decks are good at.