Since you're practically betting the farm on Revolt, ten or even eleven fetches is probably in order. Alternatively, you could ease up on the Hidden Stockpile count.
So here's how the game goes:
R1. Affinity (2-0) on the draw
I kept a good starting hand, 2 fatal pushes 1 iok and 2 lands.
At some point of the game i dont have any removal to steel overseer but i managed to keep him down to only 2 creatures and 1 blinkmoth.
Side-out: 2 thoughtseize,2 bitterblossom,2 timely reinforcement
In: 2 stony silence, 2 sundering growth, 1 pithing needle, 1 selfless spirit.
Game 2 i super-keep a turn 1 iok and turn 2 stony silence. From then the game goes like usual till i hit 30ish life.
R2. Krark-clan Egg (2-1) on the draw
G1. I lost with only 2 damage left. Turn 2 raise to turn 3 spectral to turn 4 intangible and zealous.
Out: 4 ptes 3 fatal push 2 timely reinforcement.
In: 2 rip 2 stony 1 pithing 2 duress 2 sundering
Game 2 and 3 is pretty similiar. I turn 2 stony then turn 3 rip to lock the combo, and start building clock from that point forward.
R3. BG Rock (1-1)
I id with my friend to make sure both of us goes to top 8, or so i thought.
R4 burn (0-2) on the draw
From this point forward the game goes downhill. Turn 1 goblin guide to turn 2 swiftspear and lava spike. Did draw a timely but opponent atarka commanded it.
Out: 2 thoughtseize 2 bitterblossom 1 intangible 2 zealous
In: 1 timely 2 brutality 2 kor 2 duress
I did a bad misplay and miscount the damage that he can do with 3 swiftspear and 1 guide. A kor brutality and pushes didnt help 2time boroscharm topdeck.
R5 Ad nauseam (1-2) on the draw,again
G1. Game 1 my opponent didnt draw any ad nauseam, and i discard the 1mana tutor. I got to 48life which is a good point not to die.
Out: 2 timely 2 bitterblossom 3 fatal push 2 pte
In: 2 duress 2 stony 2 sundering 1 pithing 2 brutality
G2. My opponent assemble a good turn 4 combo. Nuff said
G3. I kept a good 1 duress 1 brutality 1 iok 1 zealous and 2 land. Opponent opened with leyline of sanctity. I also got flooded, so yeah. I did do something wrong on id-ing on r3, which i wont do ever again.
My concerns with the new card are that...it does nothing when it enters, and doing nothing on turn 4 is kind of bad. Wouldn't this be a card for a GW variant?
My concerns with the new card are that...it does nothing when it enters, and doing nothing on turn 4 is kind of bad. Wouldn't this be a card for a GW variant?
It is a win more card. Doin nothing until turn 5 should be clear sign that it has no place in the deck. I doubt that even in a GW version with ramp this would be useful.
Yeah, didn't go so well last night. Was a small night, but went 1-2.
Round 1 vs Boros Burn (On the draw)(0-2) Game 1:He burned me out by turn 6. Timely reinforcements helped me a bit but he was playing Pyroclasm maindeck :/ game 2:He was literally dead next turn if he did not top deck a burn spell. Side-in/out: Removed the Thoughtseize for Blessed alliance and Selfless spirit. could have, but did not matter.
Round 2 vs Lanterncontrol (On the draw)(1-2) Game 1: He dropped Ensnaring Bridge on the board. game 2: I outsped his prison game. Thanks to plenty of hand-hate and Pithing Needle game 3: Struggled, but he was eventually able to get his engine online with a bridge and he milled me out :/ Side-in/out:Pithing Needle + My Artifact hate package for all of my removal. Also my Rest in peace. Second and Third game was close and I now remember why I kinda like Stony silence. Leyline of Sanctity would also have been nice here since he kept making me discard good cards.
Round 3 vs Monogreen Stompy (On the draw)(2-0) Game 1:He emptied his entire hand on Mutagenic Growth and other pump spell and did 12 damage to me turn 2 (Yolo as ****)... But that's All he did the whole game. game 2:Was more close, but he started drawing extra lands during the end game, and I had plenty of removal. His Troll Ascetic was very problematic though. Side-in/out:I don't remember. I think I did not side anything.
Gonna give another try to Leyline of Sanctity. People are starting to play Thoughtseize and Inquisition of Kozilek more and more and I keep losing because of that. Plus there's another brand-new 8-rack deck in my meta and still as many burn.
GW has Parallel Lives. It doesn't need this. If you're playing Control Tokens with a Playset of Bitterblossoms this is a possible one-of. Anything that allows me to get more value out of a Bitter is a nice addition.
What's everyone's thought on the new amonketh white god Oketra the True? Looks like it could work in our deck.
Seems interesting enough to test, although it's a lot less versatile than Sorin or Gideon for the same mana. I like the fact that it's indestructible but any sort of boardwipe can render it useless.
Three Gideons seems excessive. I would trade one of them out for a seventh removal spell, which is the one area where your deck seems to be running a little thin.
Start could have been a nice addition if it only was W (maybe in exchange for vigilance and/or sorcery speed) but at CMC 3 I think it cannot compete with our flying tokens
Hello everybody. I am late to the party and appologize if I come off as a total n00b regarding W/B tokens... because I am. I have live in Lima, Peru and have been collecting the parts for the deck on the side for fun over a couple of years. Cards are not impossible to find here, but unlike the States back home, they don't have a deep infrastructure for buying and selling nor a vast collection of cards spanning many years. The whole country is about the size of California and texas put together and that's it with about 2/3rds of its population centered mostly in one city. I can't just go out and buy whatever I want at the local card shop or place an order online and get whatever I want sent to my door in a week with free shipping.
That being said, I put together a list based on an article from mtgGoldfish about budget tokens. The local store has been running casual contructed for new players and I felt that this was a great time to try out my budget list while my girlfriend plays her deck. Eventhough it was a beginners event, there were some very nice decks. Red deck wins (agor/burn), Mardu Vehicles, Green stompy, mono blue Delver control, and a few others I can't recall in the haze of my memory.
My list involved going wide. Raise the alarm, gather the townsfolk, lingering souls, and spectral procession are 4x copies. Triplicate spirits was 2x. After that, I had 4x Zellous Percecution and Intangible Virtue along with one each of Sorin SV and Elspeth KE. Beyond that, I had 4x Iquisition of Kozzy and 4x duress plus my mana base.
Here is what I noticed:
1) I personally like Gather the Townsfolk and Raise the alarm more than earlier builds I was goldfishing with my 4x Bitterblossom. Call me crazy, but I don't like how slow it is and how much life you lose in this deck. I know it is a great card and own 4 copies for other decks. In here, if you cast it on turn 2, you dont see the benefit over the other cards unyil turn 5 where it finally gives you a 3rd token. If you cast it in the late game, it is worthless. On the other hand, Gather the townsfolk not only gives me my two creatures NOW so I can chump/trade against an aggressive start, but mid or late game it also gives me my 2 guys right away rather than waiting 3 turns and sometimes gives me 5 guys. Raise the alarm was a fantastic surprise play all night long. They didn't know if I was going to Path, Zellous Persecution, Raise the Alarm, or any combination of all three during their attack phase. Especially on turn four after a land drop and passing. So, while Bitterblossom is probably the better card, at no point was I longing for it wishing I had it over anything else in my deck.
2) I want another Sorin SV if I can find it, but until then I was stuck with choosing to add Elspth KE or Soring LoI. I felt that having two Sorin's in my deck could run into trouble if I draw them both and have a dead card. Not a bad problem to have, but it came up in the game twice last night when I found myself with Sorin and Elspth in my opening hand or drawn close together. Because I went with Elspeth over Sorin LoI, I was able to cast both Elspeth and Sorin SV in the same game and make life extra miserable and "win more." The pressure of both was enpugh to cause both opponents to just scoop.
3) I didn't have a sideboard, and even though I won every game last night, going 2-0 in all 4 rounds, I wondered what would be the best tech.
I was thinking that Timely Reinforcements would be great against the red burn decks. Stoney Silence (if I can find them) to help fight affinity/vehicle decks, Then maybe some graveyard hate?
4) I was looking at the non-budget lists which had bitterblossome and other cards including 2x Phyrexian Arena. I love Arena and did feel that some card draw would be nice... but what is worth cutting for a couple copies and is it really woth it? I was thinking of moving two zellous persecution to the sideboard for arena but I am not sure. That card was a game buster for me all night long, completely ruining math for my opponent.
Moreover, my schedule doesn't allow me to normally play at FNM, but thanks to the Holiday vacation (Holy week/Easter) I was able to join my Girlfriend last night. I wanted to improve the list and lend her the deck for future fridays.
I love how many different ways there are to build the deck. Some have more removal than just the 4 Path to Exile. Some have more or less discard. Some really cut down on token production. I guess it all depends on taste.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Whatever style you wish to play, be it fast and frenzied or slow and tactical, the surest way to defeat your opponent consistently is by dominating him or her in the war of card advantage." - Brian Wiseman, April 1996
The most important changes that I would suggest for your deck based on the information you have provided would be additional removal, starting with 2x Fatal Push, and a second Sorin SV.
Phyrexian Arena is not a great fit for BW Tokens for two reasons. The first is that we tend to play on the curve (or at least close to it), and with the virtual card advantage provided by cards like Lingering Souls and utility lands, dedicated card advantage engines are generally only helpful to us in really grindy matchups.
The second reason is that we already run a LOT of 3-drops and want to play cards like Spectral/Lingering/Timely as soon as we can, so you would likely end up playing Phyrexian Arena no earlier than Turn 4, which limits its value proposition. I tried running 2x Night's Whisper mainboard at one point, but could not justify the tempo and life loss for just an extra card in most games, so it eventually went to the sideboard before being dropped completely.
It would be helpful if you could post your land base. That's something that we could definitely help you fine-tune on here.
At first glance, your deck seem pretty fast, and goes all out on the token generation + Anthem side of thing. We usually like a more control-oriented approach with some spot removals since it has been bringing result competitively, but there are definitely lists like yours that capitalize more on the very good synergy tokens have with anthem-like effect. If you're willing to stay on that track of mind, I will strongly recommend trying Honor of the pure, especially seeing you don't like playing Bitterblossom.
Also, on that note, Bitterblossom and Raise the alarm each have different strenght/weakness and both are interchangeable and fantastic cards. Raise the alarm shine against aggro deck by providing bodies fast and at instant speed, but it's a little underwhelming late game. Bitterblossom will shine in control match-up more since it gets better the longer the game goes, but it's at the cost of some speed and you need some kind of ways to gain back life and prevent killing yourself with it. sorin, Solemn visitor does a pretty good job of giving us back life, but we also run Shambling Vent and Vault of the Archangel in our landbase. Extra ways to gain life could go in the form of timely reinforcements, Blessed Alliance or Auriok Champion (Or her sisterly and more budget counterparts soul warden and soul's attendant) Note that all of those are great side against burn.
Now to go point by point.
1)Raise the alarm instant speed really make it shine. if you like that, I could recommend trying out a copy or two of Secure the wastes.
2) Most people like to play 2 to 3 copies of Sorin. Most people will tell you that Gideon, Ally of Zendikar is better than elspeth, but she definitely has her upsides, especially since a good chunk of your tokens don't have flying. And yes, having a variety of planeswalker out is very overwhelming, I personally am a big fan of Sorin+Gideon.
3)oh gosh, that's actually a pretty big question, but as a baseline, I'm gonna copy/paste something I said earlier in this thread:
| 2x Selfless Spirit
Protects from most sweepers like wrath of god or Pyroclasm, while providing a 2/1 flying body. You could even go to 3, or play some mainboard if your meta is sweeper heavy. I'm personally cozy at 2 in the side.
| 2x Rest in Peace/Nihil Spellbomb/Tormod's Crypt/Relic of Progenitus/Etc.
You need some form of graveyard hate. Those dredge/living end deck can be a real pain in the neck and thrust me, shutting them down is worth losing the flashback on Lingering Souls. I'd even argue that you should run at least 3 as I currently do, but two is the very least I'm willing to bargain for.
| 2x Disenchant/Sundering Growth/Fragmentize
Floodgate type cards can create lockdowns we're usually not able to deal with (We're talking Ghostly Prison, Ensnaring Bridge and Worship here). Therefore, running some form of Artifact/enchantment hate is crucial. Pick your favorites. They all have upside/downside of their own. I run four because my hatred for those is only equal to the hatred I have for Ugin, the spirit dragon.
That would be the bare minimum start for a sideboard. Rest is up to you and your meta really.
4) I'm not a big fan of Phyrexian Arena in this deck. But if card draw is what you're looking for, it's probably your best option. We're not very good at drawing cards. Other options in that category you can look into is Night's Whisper and I've also seen some run Asylum Visitor.
And like you said, there are a lots of cards people talk about for this deck and lots of different ways to play. Don't be affraid to tcheck out some decklist in peoples signature. And don't be affraid to try some new cards too. My personnal first recommendation would be to build a sideboard. It will give you lots of info on the shortcoming of your deck and how to cover them as well as some nice info on problems/strong decks that runs around.
My second recommendation would be to find something else to replace triplicate spirits. I see what you want to do with the convoke, but it's without a doubt the least efficient of your token generator. I think 18 token generator (Not counting Sorin and elspeth, which would put you at 20) is too much. Plus, You could use some extra spot removal. Obvious recommendation would be Fatal Push, but you could also try the old package of Murderous cut, dismember and/or slaughter Pact. You have a lot of options here.
Sorry for the long post. Feel free to take or leave anything.
Hello! I'm a casual player, relatively new to the game, and also working with a pretty small collection / budget, so this conversation is really interesting to me. Thanks for all the discussion. I'm wondering what more experienced players think about a few cards.
What do people think about a card like Doomed Traveler? Clearly, the normal plan of this deck seems to be using the Thoughtseize variant as a go-to one drop, and of course that makes sense, but otherwise, the one CMC slot seems sparse. My (beginner) line of thinking was that this is a creature that can blindly attack, and if it dies, or the opponent uses up removal on it, well, almost all the better. I had similar thoughts about something like Hangarback Walker. Sure, we don't want to 'turn on' creature removal, but the primer had talked about sideboarding creatures in and out as a tactic, so I figured I'd ask.
Again, I'm the classic casual player who's going to be blindly trying out Annointed Procession and playing Elspeth, Sun's Champion (because I have one) over Sorin, Solemn Visitor for a while (because I don't have any). But with questions like these, I really appreciate the input from the more experienced and competitive crowd.
What do people think about a card like Doomed Traveler? Clearly, the normal plan of this deck seems to be using the Thoughtseize variant as a go-to one drop, and of course that makes sense, but otherwise, the one CMC slot seems sparse. My (beginner) line of thinking was that this is a creature that can blindly attack, and if it dies, or the opponent uses up removal on it, well, almost all the better. I had similar thoughts about something like Hangarback Walker. Sure, we don't want to 'turn on' creature removal, but the primer had talked about sideboarding creatures in and out as a tactic, so I figured I'd ask.
This card would fit more in an aristocrat variant, a style that focus on making value out of creature dying. Token can make for a very good aristocrat deck if we want to. Cards like Blood artist and Zulaport cutthroat make for a greath engine. Problem is, Zulaport and artist are very prone to removal, and this is exactly why our deck start to not like Doomed traveler. Still, it's a very good chump blooker and There are scenarios where you put this out on turn 1 and then cast Intangible Virtue for a potential 2/2 flyer with vigilance on turn 2.
The problem with apparition is since we run next to no creature, we have to rely on our opponent playing creatures, which first is not always the case, and second makes it way too conditional. If your goal is to hate the grave, unconditionnal grave hate is the way to go. If your goal is to make token, just put another token generator.
Again, I'm the classic casual player who's going to be blindly trying out Annointed Procession and playing Elspeth, Sun's Champion (because I have one) over Sorin, Solemn Visitor for a while (because I don't have any). But with questions like these, I really appreciate the input from the more experienced and competitive crowd.
Elspeth, sun's champion is actually a fantastic card that can quickly put you on a winning spot. The problem is casting it with its huge 6 cmc, but it's possible. You could capitalize on her by running 25 lands and a couple of Orzhov signet. You could make some kind of token ramp deck. My friend has a selesnya token deck and he plays a playset of Birds of paradise and llanowar elves for ramp, along with two copies of Elspeth, sun's champion and Parallel Lives. he actually managed to place in the top 3 on a few FNM event with it.
Four Marsh Flats are essential. I'd go with four Concealed Courtyard as well.
Since you're practically betting the farm on Revolt, ten or even eleven fetches is probably in order. Alternatively, you could ease up on the Hidden Stockpile count.
Five four-CMC Plainswalkers seems a bit much too.
Sundering Growth may turn out to be very inconvenient if you encounter a Blood Moon.
So, just a few nit-pics here, no complaint about about the other seventy or so cards.
How does it work for you? How often do you like Hidden Stockpile? How often do you hate it?
Frenzy-Affinity-Ghost Quarter-Rock-Tokens- RGWPhyrexian Zoo- WVial KnightsStandard:
BW Knights(Rotated)Pioneer: RW Knights - BW Rally Zombies - UW Heroes
Commander:WUG
Jenara, Asura of War- WGSigarda, Host of HeronsCasualties of economicsLegacy: Good-night, sweet prince. Mono-R Burn
R1. Affinity (2-0) on the draw
I kept a good starting hand, 2 fatal pushes 1 iok and 2 lands.
At some point of the game i dont have any removal to steel overseer but i managed to keep him down to only 2 creatures and 1 blinkmoth.
Side-out: 2 thoughtseize,2 bitterblossom,2 timely reinforcement
In: 2 stony silence, 2 sundering growth, 1 pithing needle, 1 selfless spirit.
Game 2 i super-keep a turn 1 iok and turn 2 stony silence. From then the game goes like usual till i hit 30ish life.
R2. Krark-clan Egg (2-1) on the draw
G1. I lost with only 2 damage left. Turn 2 raise to turn 3 spectral to turn 4 intangible and zealous.
Out: 4 ptes 3 fatal push 2 timely reinforcement.
In: 2 rip 2 stony 1 pithing 2 duress 2 sundering
Game 2 and 3 is pretty similiar. I turn 2 stony then turn 3 rip to lock the combo, and start building clock from that point forward.
R3. BG Rock (1-1)
I id with my friend to make sure both of us goes to top 8, or so i thought.
R4 burn (0-2) on the draw
From this point forward the game goes downhill. Turn 1 goblin guide to turn 2 swiftspear and lava spike. Did draw a timely but opponent atarka commanded it.
Out: 2 thoughtseize 2 bitterblossom 1 intangible 2 zealous
In: 1 timely 2 brutality 2 kor 2 duress
I did a bad misplay and miscount the damage that he can do with 3 swiftspear and 1 guide. A kor brutality and pushes didnt help 2time boroscharm topdeck.
R5 Ad nauseam (1-2) on the draw,again
G1. Game 1 my opponent didnt draw any ad nauseam, and i discard the 1mana tutor. I got to 48life which is a good point not to die.
Out: 2 timely 2 bitterblossom 3 fatal push 2 pte
In: 2 duress 2 stony 2 sundering 1 pithing 2 brutality
G2. My opponent assemble a good turn 4 combo. Nuff said
G3. I kept a good 1 duress 1 brutality 1 iok 1 zealous and 2 land. Opponent opened with leyline of sanctity. I also got flooded, so yeah. I did do something wrong on id-ing on r3, which i wont do ever again.
Is this going to be a thing? Does the Lingering Souls spell cause an effect that puts tokens on the board for example?
My Modern Playlist:
BWTokens | GBElves
It is a win more card. Doin nothing until turn 5 should be clear sign that it has no place in the deck. I doubt that even in a GW version with ramp this would be useful.
Frenzy-Affinity-Ghost Quarter-Rock-Tokens- RGWPhyrexian Zoo- WVial KnightsStandard:
BW Knights(Rotated)Pioneer: RW Knights - BW Rally Zombies - UW Heroes
Commander:WUG
Jenara, Asura of War- WGSigarda, Host of HeronsCasualties of economicsLegacy: Good-night, sweet prince. Mono-R Burn
Round 1 vs Boros Burn (On the draw)(0-2)
Game 1:He burned me out by turn 6. Timely reinforcements helped me a bit but he was playing Pyroclasm maindeck :/
game 2:He was literally dead next turn if he did not top deck a burn spell.
Side-in/out: Removed the Thoughtseize for Blessed alliance and Selfless spirit. could have, but did not matter.
Round 2 vs Lanterncontrol (On the draw)(1-2)
Game 1: He dropped Ensnaring Bridge on the board.
game 2: I outsped his prison game. Thanks to plenty of hand-hate and Pithing Needle
game 3: Struggled, but he was eventually able to get his engine online with a bridge and he milled me out :/
Side-in/out: Pithing Needle + My Artifact hate package for all of my removal. Also my Rest in peace. Second and Third game was close and I now remember why I kinda like Stony silence. Leyline of Sanctity would also have been nice here since he kept making me discard good cards.
Round 3 vs Monogreen Stompy (On the draw)(2-0)
Game 1:He emptied his entire hand on Mutagenic Growth and other pump spell and did 12 damage to me turn 2 (Yolo as ****)... But that's All he did the whole game.
game 2:Was more close, but he started drawing extra lands during the end game, and I had plenty of removal. His Troll Ascetic was very problematic though.
Side-in/out:I don't remember. I think I did not side anything.
Gonna give another try to Leyline of Sanctity. People are starting to play Thoughtseize and Inquisition of Kozilek more and more and I keep losing because of that. Plus there's another brand-new 8-rack deck in my meta and still as many burn.
(W/B)BW Tokens(W/B) | (B/R)Rakdos Burn(B/R) | (U/R)Gift Storm(U/R)
(W/B)BW Tokens(W/B) | (B/R)Rakdos Burn(B/R) | (U/R)Gift Storm(U/R)
You act like this is a new effect.
Seems interesting enough to test, although it's a lot less versatile than Sorin or Gideon for the same mana. I like the fact that it's indestructible but any sort of boardwipe can render it useless.
Three Gideons seems excessive. I would trade one of them out for a seventh removal spell, which is the one area where your deck seems to be running a little thin.
How has Hidden Stockpile been working out for you?
BW BW Tokens
BUW Esper Shadow
BUR Grixis Shadow
That being said, I put together a list based on an article from mtgGoldfish about budget tokens. The local store has been running casual contructed for new players and I felt that this was a great time to try out my budget list while my girlfriend plays her deck. Eventhough it was a beginners event, there were some very nice decks. Red deck wins (agor/burn), Mardu Vehicles, Green stompy, mono blue Delver control, and a few others I can't recall in the haze of my memory.
My list involved going wide. Raise the alarm, gather the townsfolk, lingering souls, and spectral procession are 4x copies. Triplicate spirits was 2x. After that, I had 4x Zellous Percecution and Intangible Virtue along with one each of Sorin SV and Elspeth KE. Beyond that, I had 4x Iquisition of Kozzy and 4x duress plus my mana base.
Here is what I noticed:
1) I personally like Gather the Townsfolk and Raise the alarm more than earlier builds I was goldfishing with my 4x Bitterblossom. Call me crazy, but I don't like how slow it is and how much life you lose in this deck. I know it is a great card and own 4 copies for other decks. In here, if you cast it on turn 2, you dont see the benefit over the other cards unyil turn 5 where it finally gives you a 3rd token. If you cast it in the late game, it is worthless. On the other hand, Gather the townsfolk not only gives me my two creatures NOW so I can chump/trade against an aggressive start, but mid or late game it also gives me my 2 guys right away rather than waiting 3 turns and sometimes gives me 5 guys. Raise the alarm was a fantastic surprise play all night long. They didn't know if I was going to Path, Zellous Persecution, Raise the Alarm, or any combination of all three during their attack phase. Especially on turn four after a land drop and passing. So, while Bitterblossom is probably the better card, at no point was I longing for it wishing I had it over anything else in my deck.
2) I want another Sorin SV if I can find it, but until then I was stuck with choosing to add Elspth KE or Soring LoI. I felt that having two Sorin's in my deck could run into trouble if I draw them both and have a dead card. Not a bad problem to have, but it came up in the game twice last night when I found myself with Sorin and Elspth in my opening hand or drawn close together. Because I went with Elspeth over Sorin LoI, I was able to cast both Elspeth and Sorin SV in the same game and make life extra miserable and "win more." The pressure of both was enpugh to cause both opponents to just scoop.
3) I didn't have a sideboard, and even though I won every game last night, going 2-0 in all 4 rounds, I wondered what would be the best tech.
I was thinking that Timely Reinforcements would be great against the red burn decks. Stoney Silence (if I can find them) to help fight affinity/vehicle decks, Then maybe some graveyard hate?
4) I was looking at the non-budget lists which had bitterblossome and other cards including 2x Phyrexian Arena. I love Arena and did feel that some card draw would be nice... but what is worth cutting for a couple copies and is it really woth it? I was thinking of moving two zellous persecution to the sideboard for arena but I am not sure. That card was a game buster for me all night long, completely ruining math for my opponent.
Moreover, my schedule doesn't allow me to normally play at FNM, but thanks to the Holiday vacation (Holy week/Easter) I was able to join my Girlfriend last night. I wanted to improve the list and lend her the deck for future fridays.
I love how many different ways there are to build the deck. Some have more removal than just the 4 Path to Exile. Some have more or less discard. Some really cut down on token production. I guess it all depends on taste.
The most important changes that I would suggest for your deck based on the information you have provided would be additional removal, starting with 2x Fatal Push, and a second Sorin SV.
Phyrexian Arena is not a great fit for BW Tokens for two reasons. The first is that we tend to play on the curve (or at least close to it), and with the virtual card advantage provided by cards like Lingering Souls and utility lands, dedicated card advantage engines are generally only helpful to us in really grindy matchups.
The second reason is that we already run a LOT of 3-drops and want to play cards like Spectral/Lingering/Timely as soon as we can, so you would likely end up playing Phyrexian Arena no earlier than Turn 4, which limits its value proposition. I tried running 2x Night's Whisper mainboard at one point, but could not justify the tempo and life loss for just an extra card in most games, so it eventually went to the sideboard before being dropped completely.
It would be helpful if you could post your land base. That's something that we could definitely help you fine-tune on here.
BW BW Tokens
BUW Esper Shadow
BUR Grixis Shadow
4x Raise the alarm
4x gather the townsfolk
4x lingering souls
4x spectral procession
2x Triplicate spirits
4x Intangible Virtue
Swiss Knives (6)
4x Zealous Percecution
1x Sorin, Solemn Visitor
1x Elspeth Knight-errant
4x Path to exile
Hand-Hate (8)
4x Inquisition of Kozilek
4x duress
At first glance, your deck seem pretty fast, and goes all out on the token generation + Anthem side of thing. We usually like a more control-oriented approach with some spot removals since it has been bringing result competitively, but there are definitely lists like yours that capitalize more on the very good synergy tokens have with anthem-like effect. If you're willing to stay on that track of mind, I will strongly recommend trying Honor of the pure, especially seeing you don't like playing Bitterblossom.
Also, on that note, Bitterblossom and Raise the alarm each have different strenght/weakness and both are interchangeable and fantastic cards. Raise the alarm shine against aggro deck by providing bodies fast and at instant speed, but it's a little underwhelming late game. Bitterblossom will shine in control match-up more since it gets better the longer the game goes, but it's at the cost of some speed and you need some kind of ways to gain back life and prevent killing yourself with it. sorin, Solemn visitor does a pretty good job of giving us back life, but we also run Shambling Vent and Vault of the Archangel in our landbase. Extra ways to gain life could go in the form of timely reinforcements, Blessed Alliance or Auriok Champion (Or her sisterly and more budget counterparts soul warden and soul's attendant) Note that all of those are great side against burn.
Now to go point by point.
1)Raise the alarm instant speed really make it shine. if you like that, I could recommend trying out a copy or two of Secure the wastes.
2) Most people like to play 2 to 3 copies of Sorin. Most people will tell you that Gideon, Ally of Zendikar is better than elspeth, but she definitely has her upsides, especially since a good chunk of your tokens don't have flying. And yes, having a variety of planeswalker out is very overwhelming, I personally am a big fan of Sorin+Gideon.
3)oh gosh, that's actually a pretty big question, but as a baseline, I'm gonna copy/paste something I said earlier in this thread:
| 2x Selfless Spirit
Protects from most sweepers like wrath of god or Pyroclasm, while providing a 2/1 flying body. You could even go to 3, or play some mainboard if your meta is sweeper heavy. I'm personally cozy at 2 in the side.
| 2x Rest in Peace/Nihil Spellbomb/Tormod's Crypt/Relic of Progenitus/Etc.
You need some form of graveyard hate. Those dredge/living end deck can be a real pain in the neck and thrust me, shutting them down is worth losing the flashback on Lingering Souls. I'd even argue that you should run at least 3 as I currently do, but two is the very least I'm willing to bargain for.
| 2x Disenchant/Sundering Growth/Fragmentize
Floodgate type cards can create lockdowns we're usually not able to deal with (We're talking Ghostly Prison, Ensnaring Bridge and Worship here). Therefore, running some form of Artifact/enchantment hate is crucial. Pick your favorites. They all have upside/downside of their own. I run four because my hatred for those is only equal to the hatred I have for Ugin, the spirit dragon.
That would be the bare minimum start for a sideboard. Rest is up to you and your meta really.
4) I'm not a big fan of Phyrexian Arena in this deck. But if card draw is what you're looking for, it's probably your best option. We're not very good at drawing cards. Other options in that category you can look into is Night's Whisper and I've also seen some run Asylum Visitor.
And like you said, there are a lots of cards people talk about for this deck and lots of different ways to play. Don't be affraid to tcheck out some decklist in peoples signature. And don't be affraid to try some new cards too. My personnal first recommendation would be to build a sideboard. It will give you lots of info on the shortcoming of your deck and how to cover them as well as some nice info on problems/strong decks that runs around.
My second recommendation would be to find something else to replace triplicate spirits. I see what you want to do with the convoke, but it's without a doubt the least efficient of your token generator. I think 18 token generator (Not counting Sorin and elspeth, which would put you at 20) is too much. Plus, You could use some extra spot removal. Obvious recommendation would be Fatal Push, but you could also try the old package of Murderous cut, dismember and/or slaughter Pact. You have a lot of options here.
Sorry for the long post. Feel free to take or leave anything.
(W/B)BW Tokens(W/B) | (B/R)Rakdos Burn(B/R) | (U/R)Gift Storm(U/R)
Beat Mardu Midrange 2-0, Merfolk 2-0, and Skred 2-1, lost to Burn 1-2 (Ensnaring Bridge...)
What do people think about a card like Doomed Traveler? Clearly, the normal plan of this deck seems to be using the Thoughtseize variant as a go-to one drop, and of course that makes sense, but otherwise, the one CMC slot seems sparse. My (beginner) line of thinking was that this is a creature that can blindly attack, and if it dies, or the opponent uses up removal on it, well, almost all the better. I had similar thoughts about something like Hangarback Walker. Sure, we don't want to 'turn on' creature removal, but the primer had talked about sideboarding creatures in and out as a tactic, so I figured I'd ask.
I was also wondering about Beckon Apparition. Is that just too outclassed by repeatable effects like Relic of Progenitus or hits-the-whole-graveyard effects like Tormod's Crypt?
Again, I'm the classic casual player who's going to be blindly trying out Annointed Procession and playing Elspeth, Sun's Champion (because I have one) over Sorin, Solemn Visitor for a while (because I don't have any). But with questions like these, I really appreciate the input from the more experienced and competitive crowd.
The problem with apparition is since we run next to no creature, we have to rely on our opponent playing creatures, which first is not always the case, and second makes it way too conditional. If your goal is to hate the grave, unconditionnal grave hate is the way to go. If your goal is to make token, just put another token generator.
Elspeth, sun's champion is actually a fantastic card that can quickly put you on a winning spot. The problem is casting it with its huge 6 cmc, but it's possible. You could capitalize on her by running 25 lands and a couple of Orzhov signet. You could make some kind of token ramp deck. My friend has a selesnya token deck and he plays a playset of Birds of paradise and llanowar elves for ramp, along with two copies of Elspeth, sun's champion and Parallel Lives. he actually managed to place in the top 3 on a few FNM event with it.
Competitively, I can't recommend annointed procession (the white Parallel lives), but Elspeth, sun's champion is definitely worth a try at one/two copies, especially if you're on a budget.
(W/B)BW Tokens(W/B) | (B/R)Rakdos Burn(B/R) | (U/R)Gift Storm(U/R)