Played Tasigur as a splash (along with Souls) in UWRb control, and I felt a lot more like a midrange deck. If you're playing UWRb midrange, it'll feel a lot more natural than in control. Souls and Tas are both awesome cards, and can probably help make bad matchups better. Slaughter Games sideboard is a big thing, too.
Yesterday's matches:
2-0 Burn (not a very experienced player)
0-2 Tarmo-Twin (horrible misplay on my end, I knew Blood Moon was coming yet I still tapped out with a Remand on hand - never again)
1-0 UW Titan (went to time. I think we are vastly favored in this matchup, just grind it out, path the Titans and Keranos wins, or go full tempo and burn them to 0. Options!)
0-2 Burn (decent player, his timing was on point, Skullcrack was crucial and I was screwed on mana in the last game)
Another 2-2 with Geist as always. The old adage still rings true for me - when Geist is good, he's great, but when he's bad, he's backbreakingly horrible and we go to topdeck mode which is the single worst place in the world for us. Maybe I'm just not good at playing the midrange game but I find it really hard to feel out the proper tempo for this deck. Of course, tempo is a fluid thing in midrange and it changes constantly but I can't shake the idea that this deck isn't 100% sure on what it wants to do. We have a lot of answers but not much of a solid gameplan when compared to other midrange decks like Abzan or Jund.
The addition of black makes for some awesome card options in Tasigur and Lingering Souls (i'm still not convinced Crackling Doom is worth the awkward mana cost over PTE just to add 2dmg when removing a problematic creature), but I feel it also further dilutes the deck's goal and purpose. It used to be either UWR Geist skewed towards control (Cryptics, hard counters) or UWR Geist skewed towards tempo (Tmaw, 4 Remand). Now we're jamming great cards in but can't decide on what counterspell suite to run as the slots are so limited. Remand is great in the early turns if you're lucky enough to draw it but it's completely dead against a lot of decks. "At least it cycles" doesn't make me feel very much in control of the board when that's the only counterspell I'm running. Mana Leak was useless in all my games yesterday, every single time I found myself wishing I'd had a Dispel in hand instead - up to the point where I'm considering running a 2 Dispel / 2 Spell Snare suite. They might be dead draws later on but they stop so many problematic cards I'm willing to take a shot at it.
Also not very convinced by Serum Visions just yet - I ran a Serum Visions / Anticipate split and never really wanted to tap out for either, but at least Anticipate lets me do it whenever. The amount of times I've been stuck with Colonnade and SV in hand with a bunch of 2- and 3-drops... There's just no great time to play it unless you're in a good spot already anyway. It's a great card but it messes with our tempo in my opinion.
Anyway, rant over, in conclusion I still really enjoy playing this deck and love the amount of interactivity it offers - landing a Geist still makes a lot of players nervous and that's great to see. It rewards solid thinking which I think is what Magic should be all about. On the other hand I'm not surprised that we dropped to Developing Competitive and I don't see us moving back up to Tier 2 any time soon. The deck (/Geist itself?) is too unreliable and too scatterbrained with all of its current iterations, and the lack of a strong counterspell package isn't helping the UWRb version at all, in my opinion.
Yesterday's matches:
2-0 Burn (not a very experienced player)
0-2 Tarmo-Twin (horrible misplay on my end, I knew Blood Moon was coming yet I still tapped out with a Remand on hand - never again)
1-0 UW Titan (went to time. I think we are vastly favored in this matchup, just grind it out, path the Titans and Keranos wins, or go full tempo and burn them to 0. Options!)
0-2 Burn (decent player, his timing was on point, Skullcrack was crucial and I was screwed on mana in the last game)
Another 2-2 with Geist as always. The old adage still rings true for me - when Geist is good, he's great, but when he's bad, he's backbreakingly horrible and we go to topdeck mode which is the single worst place in the world for us. Maybe I'm just not good at playing the midrange game but I find it really hard to feel out the proper tempo for this deck. Of course, tempo is a fluid thing in midrange and it changes constantly but I can't shake the idea that this deck isn't 100% sure on what it wants to do. We have a lot of answers but not much of a solid gameplan when compared to other midrange decks like Abzan or Jund.
The addition of black makes for some awesome card options in Tasigur and Lingering Souls (i'm still not convinced Crackling Doom is worth the awkward mana cost over PTE just to add 2dmg when removing a problematic creature), but I feel it also further dilutes the deck's goal and purpose. It used to be either UWR Geist skewed towards control (Cryptics, hard counters) or UWR Geist skewed towards tempo (Tmaw, 4 Remand). Now we're jamming great cards in but can't decide on what counterspell suite to run as the slots are so limited. Remand is great in the early turns if you're lucky enough to draw it but it's completely dead against a lot of decks. "At least it cycles" doesn't make me feel very much in control of the board when that's the only counterspell I'm running. Mana Leak was useless in all my games yesterday, every single time I found myself wishing I'd had a Dispel in hand instead - up to the point where I'm considering running a 2 Dispel / 2 Spell Snare suite. They might be dead draws later on but they stop so many problematic cards I'm willing to take a shot at it.
Also not very convinced by Serum Visions just yet - I ran a Serum Visions / Anticipate split and never really wanted to tap out for either, but at least Anticipate lets me do it whenever. The amount of times I've been stuck with Colonnade and SV in hand with a bunch of 2- and 3-drops... There's just no great time to play it unless you're in a good spot already anyway. It's a great card but it messes with our tempo in my opinion.
Anyway, rant over, in conclusion I still really enjoy playing this deck and love the amount of interactivity it offers - landing a Geist still makes a lot of players nervous and that's great to see. It rewards solid thinking which I think is what Magic should be all about. On the other hand I'm not surprised that we dropped to Developing Competitive and I don't see us moving back up to Tier 2 any time soon. The deck (/Geist itself?) is too unreliable and too scatterbrained with all of its current iterations, and the lack of a strong counterspell package isn't helping the UWRb version at all, in my opinion.
@whocansay
I understand where you are coming from which is why I am hesitant to move more into the black. Tasigur, the Golden Fang is an amazing card and I am bringing one in my binder to Philly so it can compete with the "top of curve spot" but I think my lack of experience with it holds me back. I believe I need to test more with it before I move in that direction. Crackling Doomis the entire reason I splach black, he gets ride of Eldrazi especially Emrakul, the Aeons Torn or cards with protection. That is my entire reason for running it, this may not be such a big thing now but it also comes into play with Amulet Bloom and bogles.
Remember we have two versions of this deck a control and a midrange. I think it is a mistake to try and merge the two because you will more likely get the worst of both of them and nothing good. My goal is to try to make the deck faster and/or dictate tempo. To do this I am looking for value cards and Remand fits that bill. It is cheap, grabs you are card and early game stalls the opp. If I was looking for a hard counter I would go with Spell Snare as you suggested but I feel Mana Leak is to slow... PTE is one that purplexes me because it gives them a land i feel the trade off is but providing them with a land at times really hurts. That is my reason for looking at Aven Mindcensor I really would like to limit their search. I do see potential for other cards that stop searching libraries!
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Thanks to Argetlam over at Hakai Studios for the Sig!
Have you ever crossed the road, and looked the wrong way? A car's nearly on you? So what do you do? Something very silly. You freeze. Your life doesn't flash before you, 'cause you're too' scared to think - you just freeze and pull a stupid face
BW Midrange | G Legacy Elves | X MUD Weilder |X Affinity | R RDW | UWB Esper Stoneblade | W Death and Taxes | W Mono White Control (Modern) | UWRGeist Midrange (Modern) | UW Heroic | UWGrand Arbiter Augustin IV EDH
What are your thoughts on the remand/mana leak split? I'm heavy on the remand train, but the post you listed had the split.
I like leak in the deck for a few reasons.
UWR/UWRb Geist is an Aggro Control deck and it's important for the deck to be able to operate in both roles. A mid-range deck is a better home for Mana Leak that in a control deck, because our deck is actively trying to end the game before mana leak is dead.
Modern is a format with powerful spells, not all of which we're ready to interact with if they resolve, and Mana leak gives you main deck answers to them.
Additionally, Remand while being an awesome spell, is really only amazing if you are converting the tempo advantage that Remand gives into something useful, like a reduction in your opponents life total. Because our primary threats are either Sorcery speed (Geist) or costed far above Remand (Resto), the opportunity isn't always going to present itself to get maximum value from remand. In these situations, it's better to have Mana Leak. In a perfect world, you'd draw Leak Early to slow down your opponent and help you play Geist on to an empty board, and then utilize Remand with a Geist in play to gain a massive tempo advantage when they try to play something that has a 3-4 CMC.
A more specific question in the Burn matchup: When do we kill Goblin Guide? Is it purely situational? He accelerates us at the cost of 2 life every time, after all, and tempo is what we need against Burn.
Played Tasigur as a splash (along with Souls) in UWRb control, and I felt a lot more like a midrange deck. If you're playing UWRb midrange, it'll feel a lot more natural than in control. Souls and Tas are both awesome cards, and can probably help make bad matchups better. Slaughter Games sideboard is a big thing, too.
I agree completely. Well said. If you add the black splash you need to make and play the deck as a midrange deck. It is no longer a control list.
I run essentially the same list with small differences:
MB
-1 Ghost Quarter
+1 Serum Visions
SB
-1 Thundermaw Hellkite
-1 Shatterstorm
+1 Counterflux
+1 Spellskite
The spellskite is an awesome out against bogle decks (a big part of my local scene) and as I prepare for a big GP (Pittsburgh) I know a lot of the meta will skew to the cheaper easier decks that most standard players can throw together and pick up real quick. I'm not trying to lose any edge to burn either, hence my tentativeness on moving into black. Kor Firewalker is just too good, and the free wins it gets against burn are more valuable in bigger events that weekly events against adept players.
That said, I really want to try Shatterstorm, but would rather use Valorous Stance's spot over Counterflux's. Flux has just been so good against any of the blue decks. And maybe it's just my piloting and small sample size, but Affinity has been pretty tough for me so far. It's definitely something I'd like another card for other than just wear/tear.
Yesterday's matches:
2-0 Burn (not a very experienced player)
0-2 Tarmo-Twin (horrible misplay on my end, I knew Blood Moon was coming yet I still tapped out with a Remand on hand - never again)
1-0 UW Titan (went to time. I think we are vastly favored in this matchup, just grind it out, path the Titans and Keranos wins, or go full tempo and burn them to 0. Options!)
0-2 Burn (decent player, his timing was on point, Skullcrack was crucial and I was screwed on mana in the last game)
Another 2-2 with Geist as always. The old adage still rings true for me - when Geist is good, he's great, but when he's bad, he's backbreakingly horrible and we go to topdeck mode which is the single worst place in the world for us. Maybe I'm just not good at playing the midrange game but I find it really hard to feel out the proper tempo for this deck. Of course, tempo is a fluid thing in midrange and it changes constantly but I can't shake the idea that this deck isn't 100% sure on what it wants to do. We have a lot of answers but not much of a solid gameplan when compared to other midrange decks like Abzan or Jund.
The addition of black makes for some awesome card options in Tasigur and Lingering Souls (i'm still not convinced Crackling Doom is worth the awkward mana cost over PTE just to add 2dmg when removing a problematic creature), but I feel it also further dilutes the deck's goal and purpose. It used to be either UWR Geist skewed towards control (Cryptics, hard counters) or UWR Geist skewed towards tempo (Tmaw, 4 Remand). Now we're jamming great cards in but can't decide on what counterspell suite to run as the slots are so limited. Remand is great in the early turns if you're lucky enough to draw it but it's completely dead against a lot of decks. "At least it cycles" doesn't make me feel very much in control of the board when that's the only counterspell I'm running. Mana Leak was useless in all my games yesterday, every single time I found myself wishing I'd had a Dispel in hand instead - up to the point where I'm considering running a 2 Dispel / 2 Spell Snare suite. They might be dead draws later on but they stop so many problematic cards I'm willing to take a shot at it.
Also not very convinced by Serum Visions just yet - I ran a Serum Visions / Anticipate split and never really wanted to tap out for either, but at least Anticipate lets me do it whenever. The amount of times I've been stuck with Colonnade and SV in hand with a bunch of 2- and 3-drops... There's just no great time to play it unless you're in a good spot already anyway. It's a great card but it messes with our tempo in my opinion.
Anyway, rant over, in conclusion I still really enjoy playing this deck and love the amount of interactivity it offers - landing a Geist still makes a lot of players nervous and that's great to see. It rewards solid thinking which I think is what Magic should be all about. On the other hand I'm not surprised that we dropped to Developing Competitive and I don't see us moving back up to Tier 2 any time soon. The deck (/Geist itself?) is too unreliable and too scatterbrained with all of its current iterations, and the lack of a strong counterspell package isn't helping the UWRb version at all, in my opinion.
@whocansay
I understand where you are coming from which is why I am hesitant to move more into the black. Tasigur, the Golden Fang is an amazing card and I am bringing one in my binder to Philly so it can compete with the "top of curve spot" but I think my lack of experience with it holds me back. I believe I need to test more with it before I move in that direction. Crackling Doomis the entire reason I splach black, he gets ride of Eldrazi especially Emrakul, the Aeons Torn or cards with protection. That is my entire reason for running it, this may not be such a big thing now but it also comes into play with Amulet Bloom and bogles.
Remember we have two versions of this deck a control and a midrange. I think it is a mistake to try and merge the two because you will more likely get the worst of both of them and nothing good. My goal is to try to make the deck faster and/or dictate tempo. To do this I am looking for value cards and Remand fits that bill. It is cheap, grabs you are card and early game stalls the opp. If I was looking for a hard counter I would go with Spell Snare as you suggested but I feel Mana Leak is to slow... PTE is one that purplexes me because it gives them a land i feel the trade off is but providing them with a land at times really hurts. That is my reason for looking at Aven Mindcensor I really would like to limit their search. I do see potential for other cards that stop searching libraries!
Exactly. There are 2 different versions of this deck. And you need to understand how to play the one you are running. Tempo/midrange is not easy to play. The hardest part of the geist plan is knowing when to make the switch, when to turn the corner between being the controlish deck and being the primary aggressor. This comes from practice and watching your opponent's tells.
Regarding Crackling Doom. Whocansay, Crackling doom does not replace path to exile, they coexist. Running two crackling doom is like having 6 path to exiles mainboard. Yes it costs 2 more mana, but it does not give them a land, shocks them, and deals with emrakrul, geist of saint traft, boggles, titans, anything. And the 2 damage can be redirected to kill Lilianas or other PW.
Whocansay, I recommend you have at least 2 dispel in the Sideboard. They are great cards to bring in especially in the burn matchup. I do not recommend main decking them. I'm on the full 4 remand plan but will be testing the mana leaks soon (mostly because GreatNate uses them and I respect the thousands of hours of experience he has). I don't think you need dispels or spell snares mainboard if you are playing a midrange/tempo plan. If you want the more controlling list, then the black splash is not preferably as it has a more tap out playstyle then the typical UWR flash plan (lingering souls is not instant speed).
A more specific question in the Burn matchup: When do we kill Goblin Guide? Is it purely situational? He accelerates us at the cost of 2 life every time, after all, and tempo is what we need against Burn.
Your thoughts Nate / StDoom?
Preferably kill him after he has declared attacking so you can potentially draw a card. I would not play phyrexian arena versus burn (and certainly not if it deals 2 damage per turn to draw a card 40% of the time (or less after fetches). So kill him ASAP. But since your removal is all instant speed you can wait until he is declared as an attacker (so you get the potential draw) and then bolt/path/helix/doom/electrolyze/k-command him.
I run essentially the same list with small differences:
MB
-1 Ghost Quarter
+1 Serum Visions
SB
-1 Thundermaw Hellkite
-1 Shatterstorm
+1 Counterflux
+1 Spellskite
The spellskite is an awesome out against bogle decks (a big part of my local scene) and as I prepare for a big GP (Pittsburgh) I know a lot of the meta will skew to the cheaper easier decks that most standard players can throw together and pick up real quick. I'm not trying to lose any edge to burn either, hence my tentativeness on moving into black. Kor Firewalker is just too good, and the free wins it gets against burn are more valuable in bigger events that weekly events against adept players.
That said, I really want to try Shatterstorm, but would rather use Valorous Stance's spot over Counterflux's. Flux has just been so good against any of the blue decks. And maybe it's just my piloting and small sample size, but Affinity has been pretty tough for me so far. It's definitely something I'd like another card for other than just wear/tear.
Could I recommend Stony silence? It's great to shut down their mana rocks and equipment. Can't do much with a 0/2 flyer.
A more specific question in the Burn matchup: When do we kill Goblin Guide? Is it purely situational? He accelerates us at the cost of 2 life every time, after all, and tempo is what we need against Burn.
Your thoughts Nate / StDoom?
Kill Goblin Guide as soon as you can do so in a manner that doesn't cost you more life than taking a hit from him will cause.
The preferred method is just fetching up a basic mountain and bolting him after his trigger, but before he hits you. The way to beat burn is to trade resources one for one whenever possible, and to make their creatures do as little damage as possible. Burns best damage to mana ratio is one red for three damage, Lightning Bolt, Lava Spike etc. Goblin Guides only beats this if it hits you more than once, otherwise it is a shock. If he hits you twice, that is four damage for one mana and so on. This is Burn best way to to beat you, by getting as much damage from their creature spells as they can, so do your best to deny them that.
Additionally, Goblin Guide does not "ramp" becuase the land he gives you goes into your hand, not on the the battlefield.
A more specific question in the Burn matchup: When do we kill Goblin Guide? Is it purely situational? He accelerates us at the cost of 2 life every time, after all, and tempo is what we need against Burn.
Your thoughts Nate / StDoom?
Preferably kill him after he has declared attacking so you can potentially draw a card. I would not play phyrexian arena versus burn (and certainly not if it deals 2 damage per turn to draw a card 40% of the time (or less after fetches). So kill him ASAP. But since your removal is all instant speed you can wait until he is declared as an attacker (so you get the potential draw) and then bolt/path/helix/doom/electrolyze/k-command him.
If your only removal spell is Electrolyze, be careful about waiting until after the declaration of attack, because you can get blown out by Atarka's Command making Guide a 3/3.
Exactly. There are 2 different versions of this deck.
See, this is where I beg to differ. We have straight up UWR Geist, UWR Tempo Geist and UWRb Geist now. Who knows what's next! Identity crisis
haha. JediSolo and I are just noting that the colors of the deck are less important than the playstyle. You could have a 4 color control shell with UWRb colors but it be completely different in nature. Again, I'll refer to GreatNate's post about serum visions (from his website) " One thing I've considered is that as my build has gotten more controlling (swapping 2x Remand for 2x Leak, adding 2 Cryptic), Serum Visions stock has risen. The reason is, when your on the all proactive burn em' plan, you're affected less by not having the selection/draw because all you want to do is draw gas, so being as redundant as possible means the selection is less important."
So if your plan is the all proactive burn 'em plan (which I'm on in UWRb: I try to run as many threats as possible and as many spells that can hit the face as possible. Crackling Doom hits for 2 even if they have zero creatures...) then you should be on a more Aggro/midrange play style. If you are running cryptic commands then you should probably be playing a more control style. If you aren't sure what I mean I will once again refer to GreatNate's website. Watch his videos and how he changes his play style per each opponent and has over the course of time sculpted his deck to better fit his play style.
tl;dr: I'm against categorically defining decks by their colors but prefer to do so by its goal. I run a UWRb proactive aggro/midrange burn deck. There could be a UWRb control deck out there that has a different game plan then my list.
Hi guys. I posted my first post on MTGSalv a couple weeks back promising a tournament report but never got around to it, but I finally found the time to go to my LGS for a modern event.
First game I keep 2 Geist of saint traft, 2 cryptic command and 3 lands. Well-timed cryptics and 2 geist hits take him down to 6, and the good ol' bolt-snap-bolt seals the win for me.
G1: This is my first time playing against/seeing this deck in action. He pretty much locks me with ensnaring bridge and his lantern/mill pieces and manages to pyrite spellbomb me for 20, recurring them with academy ruins.
G3: I burn him and start beating with aven mindcensor but time runs out for the round. He didn't play ensnaring bridge but had welding jar as well as his lantern + mill combo, so I'm not sure who would have won.
R3: Amulet Bloom (OH DEAR) 2-1 Win (should have been a loss)
G3: I keep a one land (I don't even know why. Stupid decision) hand and I miss a few crucial early land drops. He punishes me with 2 amulet of vigor and primeval titan with slayers' stronghold activation. I path to exile it, but he pact of negations it. At this point I think I've lost, which I very likely should have, but after resolving his Titan triggers he bounces a tolaria west which he needed to pay the pact, so he lost to himself. A pretty understandable mistake, plus he told me it was about his 4th or 5th time playing the deck.
R4: Temur Twin 0-2 Loss
My opponent was a pretty close friend of mine, so we chatted a bit during the games so I don't remember much of the game.
G1: I get greedy and tap out to protect my geist of saint traft from dying. Why the f*** did I tap out against Twin? I have no idea. He immediately follows up with deceiver exarch and splinter twin. HURR DURR. I do get him down to 3 before losing.
G2: Game is pretty even until about turn 6-7 when I cast geist of saint traft with 3 remaining mana. At this point my hand is 1 snapcaster mage, 1 wear//tear and 1 steam vents and I played my land for turn. He was down to 1 or 2, but he has the combo with dispel backup. I am 1 mana short from being able to flashback something with snapcaster mage, so I lose, but he does go down to 1 just before he wins.
Thank you for reading this post. I do enjoy writing these and plan to write more here, so please tell me if there's anything I can improve on with writing these reports. As you can see I do misplay quite often and I sometimes make very questionable sideboard decisions which I do hope to improve on (along with other aspects of the deck, of course). If you have any comments about my thought processes/decisions please let me know. In hindsight I definitely could have won the twin matchup I think, it's just that I lack experience against twin variants (there just aren't many twin players in my LGS), but I know it's beatable with UWR Geist.
I've always liked having at least one 5 drop in UWR Geist. Initially I had 2 mainboard but eventually cut down to just one.
Keranos doesn't do anything the turn he hits (which is what a lot of people say) and I think he's only really good against very creature heavy decks, in which I board out all my Geists and bring in the sweeper package alongside Keranos.
IMO Keranos doesn't make much sense in the main because at least against combo decks Stormbreath Dragon actually lets me kill the opponent faster, whereas with Keranos I'm looking to prolong the game. Is this a wrong way to use Keranos?
I just think it's a weird combination with the cryptics and serum visions, it seems like you're going for the long game anyway. If you're looking for a big fast finisher, Tmaw might be better anyway? Unless there's a lot of PTE in your meta, I guess.
Random thought here in general for our deck - how about one or two Vapor Snags main as additional tempo / burn? It's cheap, fast, paves the way for Geist, saves Geist, fizzles Twin, gives us multiple uses out of Snapcaster Mage, saves active Colonnades, takes care of threats, and deals an extra point of damage that 9 out of 10 players won't see coming. The more I think about it, the more sense it seems to make as there's so many uses for it.
UWR Control
Legacy:
W D&T
2-0 Burn (not a very experienced player)
0-2 Tarmo-Twin (horrible misplay on my end, I knew Blood Moon was coming yet I still tapped out with a Remand on hand - never again)
1-0 UW Titan (went to time. I think we are vastly favored in this matchup, just grind it out, path the Titans and Keranos wins, or go full tempo and burn them to 0. Options!)
0-2 Burn (decent player, his timing was on point, Skullcrack was crucial and I was screwed on mana in the last game)
Another 2-2 with Geist as always. The old adage still rings true for me - when Geist is good, he's great, but when he's bad, he's backbreakingly horrible and we go to topdeck mode which is the single worst place in the world for us. Maybe I'm just not good at playing the midrange game but I find it really hard to feel out the proper tempo for this deck. Of course, tempo is a fluid thing in midrange and it changes constantly but I can't shake the idea that this deck isn't 100% sure on what it wants to do. We have a lot of answers but not much of a solid gameplan when compared to other midrange decks like Abzan or Jund.
The addition of black makes for some awesome card options in Tasigur and Lingering Souls (i'm still not convinced Crackling Doom is worth the awkward mana cost over PTE just to add 2dmg when removing a problematic creature), but I feel it also further dilutes the deck's goal and purpose. It used to be either UWR Geist skewed towards control (Cryptics, hard counters) or UWR Geist skewed towards tempo (Tmaw, 4 Remand). Now we're jamming great cards in but can't decide on what counterspell suite to run as the slots are so limited. Remand is great in the early turns if you're lucky enough to draw it but it's completely dead against a lot of decks. "At least it cycles" doesn't make me feel very much in control of the board when that's the only counterspell I'm running. Mana Leak was useless in all my games yesterday, every single time I found myself wishing I'd had a Dispel in hand instead - up to the point where I'm considering running a 2 Dispel / 2 Spell Snare suite. They might be dead draws later on but they stop so many problematic cards I'm willing to take a shot at it.
Also not very convinced by Serum Visions just yet - I ran a Serum Visions / Anticipate split and never really wanted to tap out for either, but at least Anticipate lets me do it whenever. The amount of times I've been stuck with Colonnade and SV in hand with a bunch of 2- and 3-drops... There's just no great time to play it unless you're in a good spot already anyway. It's a great card but it messes with our tempo in my opinion.
Anyway, rant over, in conclusion I still really enjoy playing this deck and love the amount of interactivity it offers - landing a Geist still makes a lot of players nervous and that's great to see. It rewards solid thinking which I think is what Magic should be all about. On the other hand I'm not surprised that we dropped to Developing Competitive and I don't see us moving back up to Tier 2 any time soon. The deck (/Geist itself?) is too unreliable and too scatterbrained with all of its current iterations, and the lack of a strong counterspell package isn't helping the UWRb version at all, in my opinion.
Abzan Traverse / Traverse Shadow / UR Kiki
@whocansay
I understand where you are coming from which is why I am hesitant to move more into the black. Tasigur, the Golden Fang is an amazing card and I am bringing one in my binder to Philly so it can compete with the "top of curve spot" but I think my lack of experience with it holds me back. I believe I need to test more with it before I move in that direction. Crackling Doomis the entire reason I splach black, he gets ride of Eldrazi especially Emrakul, the Aeons Torn or cards with protection. That is my entire reason for running it, this may not be such a big thing now but it also comes into play with Amulet Bloom and bogles.
Remember we have two versions of this deck a control and a midrange. I think it is a mistake to try and merge the two because you will more likely get the worst of both of them and nothing good. My goal is to try to make the deck faster and/or dictate tempo. To do this I am looking for value cards and Remand fits that bill. It is cheap, grabs you are card and early game stalls the opp. If I was looking for a hard counter I would go with Spell Snare as you suggested but I feel Mana Leak is to slow... PTE is one that purplexes me because it gives them a land i feel the trade off is but providing them with a land at times really hurts. That is my reason for looking at Aven Mindcensor I really would like to limit their search. I do see potential for other cards that stop searching libraries!
I like leak in the deck for a few reasons.
Your thoughts Nate / StDoom?
Abzan Traverse / Traverse Shadow / UR Kiki
I agree completely. Well said. If you add the black splash you need to make and play the deck as a midrange deck. It is no longer a control list.
I run essentially the same list with small differences:
MB
-1 Ghost Quarter
+1 Serum Visions
SB
-1 Thundermaw Hellkite
-1 Shatterstorm
+1 Counterflux
+1 Spellskite
The spellskite is an awesome out against bogle decks (a big part of my local scene) and as I prepare for a big GP (Pittsburgh) I know a lot of the meta will skew to the cheaper easier decks that most standard players can throw together and pick up real quick. I'm not trying to lose any edge to burn either, hence my tentativeness on moving into black. Kor Firewalker is just too good, and the free wins it gets against burn are more valuable in bigger events that weekly events against adept players.
That said, I really want to try Shatterstorm, but would rather use Valorous Stance's spot over Counterflux's. Flux has just been so good against any of the blue decks. And maybe it's just my piloting and small sample size, but Affinity has been pretty tough for me so far. It's definitely something I'd like another card for other than just wear/tear.
Exactly. There are 2 different versions of this deck. And you need to understand how to play the one you are running. Tempo/midrange is not easy to play. The hardest part of the geist plan is knowing when to make the switch, when to turn the corner between being the controlish deck and being the primary aggressor. This comes from practice and watching your opponent's tells.
Regarding Crackling Doom. Whocansay, Crackling doom does not replace path to exile, they coexist. Running two crackling doom is like having 6 path to exiles mainboard. Yes it costs 2 more mana, but it does not give them a land, shocks them, and deals with emrakrul, geist of saint traft, boggles, titans, anything. And the 2 damage can be redirected to kill Lilianas or other PW.
Whocansay, I recommend you have at least 2 dispel in the Sideboard. They are great cards to bring in especially in the burn matchup. I do not recommend main decking them. I'm on the full 4 remand plan but will be testing the mana leaks soon (mostly because GreatNate uses them and I respect the thousands of hours of experience he has). I don't think you need dispels or spell snares mainboard if you are playing a midrange/tempo plan. If you want the more controlling list, then the black splash is not preferably as it has a more tap out playstyle then the typical UWR flash plan (lingering souls is not instant speed).
Preferably kill him after he has declared attacking so you can potentially draw a card. I would not play phyrexian arena versus burn (and certainly not if it deals 2 damage per turn to draw a card 40% of the time (or less after fetches). So kill him ASAP. But since your removal is all instant speed you can wait until he is declared as an attacker (so you get the potential draw) and then bolt/path/helix/doom/electrolyze/k-command him.
Could I recommend Stony silence? It's great to shut down their mana rocks and equipment. Can't do much with a 0/2 flyer.
Kill Goblin Guide as soon as you can do so in a manner that doesn't cost you more life than taking a hit from him will cause.
The preferred method is just fetching up a basic mountain and bolting him after his trigger, but before he hits you. The way to beat burn is to trade resources one for one whenever possible, and to make their creatures do as little damage as possible. Burns best damage to mana ratio is one red for three damage, Lightning Bolt, Lava Spike etc. Goblin Guides only beats this if it hits you more than once, otherwise it is a shock. If he hits you twice, that is four damage for one mana and so on. This is Burn best way to to beat you, by getting as much damage from their creature spells as they can, so do your best to deny them that.
Additionally, Goblin Guide does not "ramp" becuase the land he gives you goes into your hand, not on the the battlefield.
If your only removal spell is Electrolyze, be careful about waiting until after the declaration of attack, because you can get blown out by Atarka's Command making Guide a 3/3.
There will be times where you have leak and wish it was remand, and times you have remand and wish you had leak.
Overall I have found the mix to be best.
See, this is where I beg to differ. We have straight up UWR Geist, UWR Tempo Geist and UWRb Geist now. Who knows what's next! Identity crisis
Abzan Traverse / Traverse Shadow / UR Kiki
haha. JediSolo and I are just noting that the colors of the deck are less important than the playstyle. You could have a 4 color control shell with UWRb colors but it be completely different in nature. Again, I'll refer to GreatNate's post about serum visions (from his website) " One thing I've considered is that as my build has gotten more controlling (swapping 2x Remand for 2x Leak, adding 2 Cryptic), Serum Visions stock has risen. The reason is, when your on the all proactive burn em' plan, you're affected less by not having the selection/draw because all you want to do is draw gas, so being as redundant as possible means the selection is less important."
So if your plan is the all proactive burn 'em plan (which I'm on in UWRb: I try to run as many threats as possible and as many spells that can hit the face as possible. Crackling Doom hits for 2 even if they have zero creatures...) then you should be on a more Aggro/midrange play style. If you are running cryptic commands then you should probably be playing a more control style. If you aren't sure what I mean I will once again refer to GreatNate's website. Watch his videos and how he changes his play style per each opponent and has over the course of time sculpted his deck to better fit his play style.
tl;dr: I'm against categorically defining decks by their colors but prefer to do so by its goal. I run a UWRb proactive aggro/midrange burn deck. There could be a UWRb control deck out there that has a different game plan then my list.
My list: http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/uwr-geist-v2-serum-visions/
Nothing special going on, it's just a pretty typical list.
The report itself:
Summary: R1: "Mini(?)" Abzan. 2-0 Win
R2: Lantern Control 1-1 Draw
R3: Amulet Bloom 2-1 Win (should have been a loss)
R4: Temur Twin 0-2 Loss
R1: "Mini" Abzan 2-0
G1: I don't see any tarmogoyf, lilliana of the veil or wilt-leaf liege or even any discard ,so not sure how to label his deck. From what I saw it was essentially a few mana dorks (Birds/Hierarch), thalia, guardian of thraben, Flickerwisp, voice of resurgence and siege rhino at the top of the curve, and also gavony township.
First game I keep 2 Geist of saint traft, 2 cryptic command and 3 lands. Well-timed cryptics and 2 geist hits take him down to 6, and the good ol' bolt-snap-bolt seals the win for me.
Sideboard: -4 Geist of saint traft. +1 engineered explosives, +1 Wrath of god, +1 supreme verdict, +1 Anger of the gods, Don't ask me why but I also think I -2 remand for +2 wear/tear, which I didn't end up seeing/needing in the first place, but I was afraid of maybe seeing choke or batterskull.
G2: He starts off very fast with a board of siege rhino, thalia, guardian of thraben, noble hierarch and birds of paradise by turn 3. I get beat down to 11-12, but manage to fire off a well-timed wrath of god for a 4 for 1. He then builds up another board of 3 creatures which I supreme verdict. He then runs out of gas and I'm able to seal the win with snapcaster mage, restoration angel and celestial colonnade beats as well as burn spells.
R2: Lantern Control 1-1 Draw.
G1: This is my first time playing against/seeing this deck in action. He pretty much locks me with ensnaring bridge and his lantern/mill pieces and manages to pyrite spellbomb me for 20, recurring them with academy ruins.
Sideboard: +2 wear//tear, +2stony silence +1 rest in peace (P.S. I derped and didn't trim any snapcaster mage) +1 negate +1 engineered explosives (not sure if this was a good idea bringing in 2 stony silence but I did anyway)
-4 path to exile -1 stormbreath dragon -2 remand (In hindsight I think I should've sided out electrolyze but I'm not sure. Perhaps someone could comment about this.
G2: I don't draw stony silence which is the main card I wanted to see. I manage to burn him and get some snapcaster mage and restoration angel beats in until he plays ensnaring bridge again, but I play a well-timed wear//tear and attack for the win.
Side: +2 aven mindcensor -2 cryptic command because I wanted the 2/1 flyer body more than a clunky 4 mana card.
G3: I burn him and start beating with aven mindcensor but time runs out for the round. He didn't play ensnaring bridge but had welding jar as well as his lantern + mill combo, so I'm not sure who would have won.
R3: Amulet Bloom (OH DEAR) 2-1 Win (should have been a loss)
G1: I manage to draw enough path to exile and ghost quarter his cavern of souls to keep removing/countering his primeval titan, then counter a hive mind to eventually seal the win.
Side: -3 lightning helix -2 electrolyze -1 restoration angel. +2 aven mindcensor, +1 negate, +1 counterflux and +2 wear//tear.
G2: Much of the same with Game 1 except this time he pact of negation my counter for hive mind and hive mind kills me. I nearly got there though, getting him down to 4 with restoration angel and celestial colonnade online to secure the win had he not won that turn.
G3: I keep a one land (I don't even know why. Stupid decision) hand and I miss a few crucial early land drops. He punishes me with 2 amulet of vigor and primeval titan with slayers' stronghold activation. I path to exile it, but he pact of negations it. At this point I think I've lost, which I very likely should have, but after resolving his Titan triggers he bounces a tolaria west which he needed to pay the pact, so he lost to himself. A pretty understandable mistake, plus he told me it was about his 4th or 5th time playing the deck.
R4: Temur Twin 0-2 Loss
My opponent was a pretty close friend of mine, so we chatted a bit during the games so I don't remember much of the game.
G1: I get greedy and tap out to protect my geist of saint traft from dying. Why the f*** did I tap out against Twin? I have no idea. He immediately follows up with deceiver exarch and splinter twin. HURR DURR. I do get him down to 3 before losing.
Side: -3 Lighting helix -2 cryptic command and I think -1 restoration angel. +1 engineered explosives, +1 celestial purge, +2 wear//tear, +1 negate, +1 counterflux.
G2: Game is pretty even until about turn 6-7 when I cast geist of saint traft with 3 remaining mana. At this point my hand is 1 snapcaster mage, 1 wear//tear and 1 steam vents and I played my land for turn. He was down to 1 or 2, but he has the combo with dispel backup. I am 1 mana short from being able to flashback something with snapcaster mage, so I lose, but he does go down to 1 just before he wins.
Thank you for reading this post. I do enjoy writing these and plan to write more here, so please tell me if there's anything I can improve on with writing these reports. As you can see I do misplay quite often and I sometimes make very questionable sideboard decisions which I do hope to improve on (along with other aspects of the deck, of course). If you have any comments about my thought processes/decisions please let me know. In hindsight I definitely could have won the twin matchup I think, it's just that I lack experience against twin variants (there just aren't many twin players in my LGS), but I know it's beatable with UWR Geist.
Once again thanks for reading!
Abzan Traverse / Traverse Shadow / UR Kiki
Keranos doesn't do anything the turn he hits (which is what a lot of people say) and I think he's only really good against very creature heavy decks, in which I board out all my Geists and bring in the sweeper package alongside Keranos.
IMO Keranos doesn't make much sense in the main because at least against combo decks Stormbreath Dragon actually lets me kill the opponent faster, whereas with Keranos I'm looking to prolong the game. Is this a wrong way to use Keranos?
Random thought here in general for our deck - how about one or two Vapor Snags main as additional tempo / burn? It's cheap, fast, paves the way for Geist, saves Geist, fizzles Twin, gives us multiple uses out of Snapcaster Mage, saves active Colonnades, takes care of threats, and deals an extra point of damage that 9 out of 10 players won't see coming. The more I think about it, the more sense it seems to make as there's so many uses for it.
Abzan Traverse / Traverse Shadow / UR Kiki