MTG Salvation

Hey, has anybody testing out Harm's Way? This card looks immensely powerful in the current meta, and I think that this deck is probably one of the best decks positioned to use it given that protecting Geist is very important. For example, playing geist with a W open lets you protect it from pyroclasm, one of the few outs many decks actually have to this card. Plus it kills delvers early and overall seems very useful; sort of like a mini-helix for less mana and a little bit more awkward casting restrictions.

I'm just looking at getting into this deck though, so it might just not fit. Could anybody give me a quick idea of its matchups? It's kind of hard to find information on UWR Geist decks because there's so many names/versions they have.

Regarding the matchups, i could tell you my experience.

Against UR Delver we are favourites, we have a lot of removal and a threat they simply can't deal with it (Geist of the saint traft).

Against Burn it depends, i feel we are favourites due to lightning helix and spell snare. And again, we have a thread they simply can't deal. Now, depending of your sb, you could have a even greater chance at winning, because we have access to leyline of sanctity.

Against tron, we are fast enough to put them out, yet we must be carefull with pyroclasm and o-stone. I feel is an even match.

Pod decks are simply bad matchups. They have a lot of creatures and we'll be punished a lot. Finks are terrible, they kill Geist and still survive to block again...

GBx decks are also bad matchups, but post-board we can give some fight back. Leyline can stop they're discard plan, and render like 12 spells useless/almost useless (liliana for instance, would only use her 1st ability)

For the most popular combos decks, twin is 50/50 in my opinion, and scapeshift we have a little advantage because, again, MB they can't deal with geist (maybe post board they bring anger of the gods)

At the moment, at least with online meta, i feel this deck is very strong. UR Delver and burn are like 50% of the matches, and we have against both of them a good matchups.

Hope it helps.

Against Tron, from my experience, We dont have the same problems that uwr control has. We put pressure, and if they dont use pyroclams, or we counter It, they are in a very tight clock. PtE to wurmcoils.

Scapeshift i feel We are favourite because:
- geist (they cant deal with it in MB
- We can stall them (snare in Sakura, remand the search for tomorrow)

It is not yet an auto include card. For instancinstance the scapeshift in top16 didnt used them mb.

But again, that matchup analysis is based on my experience and my opinion. I feel We are even against tron (if geist sticks) and We are slightly favourites vs scapeshift.

Best regards

Going to be most likely taking this abomination of a list to my store tonight:



Will probably update it with 2 resto angels and 2 extra snapcasters when I get them, but we'll see how this pile of garbage does

I'm wondering if anybody else has any more input on the black splash?

Tried this one in a casual group today. Did very well. What does everyone think of Marrow Shards as Delver SB tech? I don't think the main is terrible vs. Delver, but it is fairly reliant on drawing Lightning Helix



I haven't had the opportunity to Delver-in yet, but the idea is to bring them and the three 1-mana counterspells in, and bring the Colonnades, 2x Resto, and a few other curve-toppers out and go on the aggro route. Not sure if there are many matchups where we benefit tons from the transformation, just a fun idea in a meta where people are very aware of Delver decks and may side out once they think they're not against one.

@swordknight

I actually really like the idea of having access to Crackling Doom in this deck. I find that Jund/Abzan are weak matchups for me a lot of the time because Liliana can take care of Geist, but I can't do anything about their Thrun. Crackling Doom gets around both regenerate and hexproof, without having to run wrath of god which kills my own guys too. I think I actually might try running a few sideboard in my next event with a singleton Watery Grave to Fetch. G/B/x is big in my local meta, so this might be a cool card to have.

Also good if anyone runs Bogle Hexproof too.

Yeah, I haven't played much modern recently and kind of just half-brewed that list up to take last night. I ended up going 2-1 and then splitting the last round because the event fired later than usual (about 45 minutes late) and I was hungry haha.

Round 1 was against GR Tron. Any geist deck is naturally favored there, and of course I won.

Round 2 was against Affinity, which is pretty easy for a deck packing 4 bolts, 4 helixes, and 2 electrolyze.

Round 3 was against Abzan and it was real rough. Geist is terrible against lingering souls/courser/siege rhino/anything else they play. Crackling doom helped in the postboard games, but it still didn't feel like enough. Any tips for the matchup? I feel like siding out geist is correct here and just try to control the game, but I'm not sure yet.

Do you guys find Serum Visions good in this deck?

Played in 2 LGS tournaments for the past 1 week or so and won 3-0 (Burn, jeskai control and pod) and 2-1 (won esper control and another jeskai geist midrange) with the loss to a RUG delvers simply due land flooding in game 1 and mulliganing down to 4 and with only 1 land and got stucked on 1 land for quite a few turns and so I actually feel that currently Jeskai Geist midrange is currently quite decently positioned in current meta..

All in all, I played 5 LGS probably in the past 1 month and got 12-3 records so far with 2 loss to the same guy above who played an Abzan mid range the previous round and hand disruption stripped me off too much and I had no answers for Thrun and Siege rhino when it came down. my another loss was to a b/w token deck which all the discards killed me off again and it was piloted by a good friend of mine who know my deck well and knows how I play. I sure can do with some suggestions on how to deal with Abzan and discard as well too. lol..

and after testing, I actually think stormbreath dragon is a card that we can try to use in current meta. It is so good against Jeskai control, Azban and various decks when it come down especially since it can avoid path and block siege rhino and other white creatures including colonnade and restoration angel. it closed quite a few close games for me for at least the past 3 tournaments. Thinking whether to go to 2 or not as well. I run 1 stormbreath mainboard for the past 3 tournaments and it seems to do pretty well at the moment but i'm still thinking if there are any better 5 drops that we can consider in our mid range decks as well?

And I don't really like serum vision in this deck though. I did try it before for a while and the scry might be useful at times but I find that most of the times I rather keep the mana up for counterspells or burns for the first 2 or 3 turns in genera but that's just my opinion though.

I'd say there's a few playable 5 drop bombs that we can run:

Batterskull - Probably the most general purpose one. Helps to win races and stabilizes the board against burn/creature decks. It's kinda awkward against abrupt decay decks and excels in long games when you can replay it over and over again. You can also slap the equipment on a geist/snapcaster and go from there.

Baneslayer Angel - Similar to Batterskull, but can't be abrupt decay'd and is a bit better against affinity because of their fliers. Roughest part about Baneslayer is that she usually gets pathed on the spot whereas Batterskull can always come back eventually. She's pretty GG against burn and delver though (most burn decks will bring in smash to smithereens for spellskites/batterskulls etc).

Gideon Jura - Never upset to maindeck this guy. He demolishes fair creature matchups and you can afford to tap low for him vs twin because they can't combo you out next turn if he resolves. He controls the board and can act as a finisher when required; he doesn't get pathed until he's done his job of clearing the board.

Thundermaw Hellkite - Big finisher that clears the way and annihilates lingering souls tokens. Weak to path.

Stormbreath Dragon - Similar to Hellkite, but trades explosiveness for resilience (can't be pathed).

Keranos - Amazing against decks that look to grind out or go long (control, abzan/jund) because he gives you a special kind of inevitability. Too slow against a large portion of the field though.

Hey, I have u/r tempo twin but used to play this deck quite a bit, and I was wondering if it was at all possible to make a u/r midrange deck. I'm not 100% sure what cards would be in it or where to really ask this question but I thought this deck was the closest. Any thoughts? is it even possible?

Without reading the last 10 pages of this thread, what exactly is stopping this deck from taking advantage of Young Pyromancer? He has the capability to produce a quick clock for a small mana investment and has major game against decks Geist is bad against (like pod and junk)? With Serum Visions, Bolt, Helix, Path , Spell snare, and maybe remand/mana leak you have a good amount of ammo to feed YP on little mana. Yes he's weak to spot removal unlike geist, but you can only run 4 geist and he is much better when your opponent has dudes. If you untap with YP in play you are in a serious advantage and with 3-5 lands you can safely drop him and create tokens on the same turn regardless of their removal.

I feel like Geist and YP are far and away the most impactful creatures we can play in UWR currently as they both can just take over the game. YP is much better against creatures but there is absolutely no better clock than Geist when we need to apply pressure. Unfortunately, they are both weak to sweepers post board, which is a conflict. At the same time, we usually board into Negate/Dispel too, so idk. If we're going to play a UWR strategy that is decidedly faster but less long-term oriented than conventional UWR-control, why not play the highest-impact threats available? It's not like the core of the deck (bolt, helix, path, etc) is would have to change significantly to accommodate YP...

Quote from dopespot »

Without reading the last 10 pages of this thread, what exactly is stopping this deck from taking advantage of Young Pyromancer? He has the capability to produce a quick clock for a small mana investment and has major game against decks Geist is bad against (like pod and junk)? With Serum Visions, Bolt, Helix, Path , Spell snare, and maybe remand/mana leak you have a good amount of ammo to feed YP on little mana. Yes he's weak to spot removal unlike geist, but you can only run 4 geist and he is much better when your opponent has dudes. If you untap with YP in play you are in a serious advantage and with 3-5 lands you can safely drop him and create tokens on the same turn regardless of their removal.

I feel like Geist and YP are far and away the most impactful creatures we can play in UWR currently as they both can just take over the game. YP is much better against creatures but there is absolutely no better clock than Geist when we need to apply pressure. Unfortunately, they are both weak to sweepers post board, which is a conflict. At the same time, we usually board into Negate/Dispel too, so idk. If we're going to play a UWR strategy that is decidedly faster but less long-term oriented than conventional UWR-control, why not play the highest-impact threats available? It's not like the core of the deck (bolt, helix, path, etc) is would have to change significantly to accommodate YP...

Young Pyromancer turns on enemy bolts and paths. It's a big "if" we can untap with him. Young Pyro is also a lot better if we can chain multiple spells in one turn... that's different than just having a bunch of low cmc spells. Burn doesn't run Young Pyro for the same reason; because they can't get as much mileage out of him as the delver decks do and they would most likely spend their turn 2 slinging more burn spells than tapping out for a card that doesn't do anything the turn he comes down.

I mean... you can toss young pyro into UR twin if you want too since they sling so many cantrips and burn spells, doesn't mean it's useful.

Quote from swordknight »

Quote from dopespot »

Without reading the last 10 pages of this thread, what exactly is stopping this deck from taking advantage of Young Pyromancer? He has the capability to produce a quick clock for a small mana investment and has major game against decks Geist is bad against (like pod and junk)? With Serum Visions, Bolt, Helix, Path , Spell snare, and maybe remand/mana leak you have a good amount of ammo to feed YP on little mana. Yes he's weak to spot removal unlike geist, but you can only run 4 geist and he is much better when your opponent has dudes. If you untap with YP in play you are in a serious advantage and with 3-5 lands you can safely drop him and create tokens on the same turn regardless of their removal.

I feel like Geist and YP are far and away the most impactful creatures we can play in UWR currently as they both can just take over the game. YP is much better against creatures but there is absolutely no better clock than Geist when we need to apply pressure. Unfortunately, they are both weak to sweepers post board, which is a conflict. At the same time, we usually board into Negate/Dispel too, so idk. If we're going to play a UWR strategy that is decidedly faster but less long-term oriented than conventional UWR-control, why not play the highest-impact threats available? It's not like the core of the deck (bolt, helix, path, etc) is would have to change significantly to accommodate YP...

Young Pyromancer turns on enemy bolts and paths. It's a big "if" we can untap with him. Young Pyro is also a lot better if we can chain multiple spells in one turn... that's different than just having a bunch of low cmc spells. Burn doesn't run Young Pyro for the same reason; because they can't get as much mileage out of him as the delver decks do and they would most likely spend their turn 2 slinging more burn spells than tapping out for a card that doesn't do anything the turn he comes down.

I mean... you can toss young pyro into UR twin if you want too since they sling so many cantrips and burn spells, doesn't mean it's useful.

I'm curious if this deck can operate with a transformational sideboard though. Start with the Geist plan and see if you can get them to side out their bolts, then transform into a URw Delver build. Out come the Geists, Restos, Cliques, Colonnades, Cryptics, in come the Delvers, YPs, Swiftspears, Forked Bolts. It's doable, but you have to abandon the rest of your sideboard options. A pretty crafty way to 2-0 a match with two different competitive decks though.

Quote from taptwo »

Quote from swordknight »

Quote from dopespot »

Without reading the last 10 pages of this thread, what exactly is stopping this deck from taking advantage of Young Pyromancer? He has the capability to produce a quick clock for a small mana investment and has major game against decks Geist is bad against (like pod and junk)? With Serum Visions, Bolt, Helix, Path , Spell snare, and maybe remand/mana leak you have a good amount of ammo to feed YP on little mana. Yes he's weak to spot removal unlike geist, but you can only run 4 geist and he is much better when your opponent has dudes. If you untap with YP in play you are in a serious advantage and with 3-5 lands you can safely drop him and create tokens on the same turn regardless of their removal.

I feel like Geist and YP are far and away the most impactful creatures we can play in UWR currently as they both can just take over the game. YP is much better against creatures but there is absolutely no better clock than Geist when we need to apply pressure. Unfortunately, they are both weak to sweepers post board, which is a conflict. At the same time, we usually board into Negate/Dispel too, so idk. If we're going to play a UWR strategy that is decidedly faster but less long-term oriented than conventional UWR-control, why not play the highest-impact threats available? It's not like the core of the deck (bolt, helix, path, etc) is would have to change significantly to accommodate YP...

Young Pyromancer turns on enemy bolts and paths. It's a big "if" we can untap with him. Young Pyro is also a lot better if we can chain multiple spells in one turn... that's different than just having a bunch of low cmc spells. Burn doesn't run Young Pyro for the same reason; because they can't get as much mileage out of him as the delver decks do and they would most likely spend their turn 2 slinging more burn spells than tapping out for a card that doesn't do anything the turn he comes down.

I mean... you can toss young pyro into UR twin if you want too since they sling so many cantrips and burn spells, doesn't mean it's useful.

I'm curious if this deck can operate with a transformational sideboard though. Start with the Geist plan and see if you can get them to side out their bolts, then transform into a URw Delver build. Out come the Geists, Restos, Cliques, Colonnades, Cryptics, in come the Delvers, YPs, Swiftspears, Forked Bolts. It's doable, but you have to abandon the rest of your sideboard options. A pretty crafty way to 2-0 a match with two different competitive decks though.

Not sure you're really 2-0ing anybody with this transformational sideboard though. The main attraction to transformational sideboards is to play a completely different game plan so that the answers your opponents bring in don't do anything in order to gain an edge. Something tells me that UR Delver and UWr geist have the same problem matchups (Abzan, pod, etc) and being marginally faster is not going to net us any free wins.

Most decks are probably going to bring in their boardwipes for the geist, which will destroy YP and delver. Any lifegain cards will most likely come in too, and that just spells death for either build.

A much better plan would be to board out the geists and transition into pure UWr control in my opinion.

Jeff Hoogland placed 3rd with 'merican Geist at the SCG Premier IQ at Atlanta last weekend (didn't he used to say geist sucked?). His list seems pretty standard, but I'm a huge fan of his mainboard Aven Mindcensor. I feel I could easily fit the 2 from my side into the main and open up slots in my side. How many Leyline Sanctity should we be running? replacing the 2 Avens in the side with Leylines seems good to me.

I use to have 3 Leyline of Sanctity in sb. I want 1 in my opening hand and i don't want to take to many sb slots (4x), so I feel 3 is the correct number to achieve this.

In another issue, after reading taptwo post about merging 2 decks... I don't feel Delver of Secrets would be that good to merge, but I remembered another deck... UWR Flash
http://www.channelfireball.com/articles/uwr-flash-in-modern/

We could use 4 slots in the sideboard to perform this change: 2x Cryptic Command, 1xSphinx's Revelation and 1x Tectonic Edge. Those cards could come in 2nd game if we feel Geist of the Saint Traft is not good against the matchup... And we'ld have a similar list, but with a more controlling version for game 2, and keep an 'aggro/midrange' deck for Game 1.

What do you think?

Best regards

i think i would want to play desolate lighthouse if i were playing 3+ leylines so that i could just loot and ditch any extra. ill have to try that out.

to merge into a UWR flash list doesnt seem that bad but what are you cutting from your side to make room for those four cards? seems like youd be losing the versatility of our sideboard options which is one of the strongest features of UWR.

heres my current list

I've been playing Jeff Hoogland's list (http://themeadery.org/articles/uwr-geist-primer) now and I really like it. I don't have a Stormbreath or Thundermaw, so I'm instead running Inferno Titan and I think it's pretty sweet.

i really dont understand why he doesnt use spell snare at all. i even sent him a tweet about it and he just directed me to his article which doesnt even mention it...