MTG Salvation

Yeah, that list has a lot of weird choices and, I agree, flaws. I think the dig spell to be playing is Board the Weatherlight as a 1-3 of. Hits all your artifacts, Urza, Sai, and any other useful walkers.

I think Board the Weatherlight has a lot of potential and might be another good reason to go white over black. It's just a real shame that it's 2 mana, since we're already pretty flooded at 2 mana. But it's certainly worth trying

A new board wipe was spoiled, Dead of Winter, which is at that sweet 3 cmc spot. Might not be too relevant in the new meta, who knows, but if we play Astrolabe and a bunch of snow basics (which with all the color fixing would be pretty easy), we could make use of it. The more I think about Astrolabe, the more it seems like a cantripping mana rock that plays well with all of our relevant cards. This build would not really be able to use Force of Negation well, though.



I know posting these lists is a little silly with all these new relevant spoilers, but what else to do during this excruciating wait until Horizons is released?

If I alter my recent list slightly I can definitely see something like this:


A Jeskai version with board the Weatherlight is also tempting:
I would really miss the Discard though.

Lots of options these days. I thought the astrolabe was pretty bad, but especially with the basic fetch, and I realized it doesn't sac to filter mana, it actually doesn't sound crazy to try to go a basic snow-covered manabase.

Also I'm turning around a bit on Saheeli. Works well with urza, and Urza's Karnstruct token make for finally something worth copying. A giant construct token or two seems like a not unreasonable way to win even if they kill Urza. Or play a goblin engineer, then activate Saheeli to turn something that doesn't have summoning sickness into an engineer, so you can activate it right away. I think she'll be better than Sai in some situations, while Sai will be better in others, but with her ability being somewhat relevant she's not terrible for us!

A thing to keep in mind with Goblin Engineer is that it makes us postboard extremely vunerable to Surgical, so it's a consideration to play something like Silent Gravestone or Scrabbling Claws in the board to counter that.

Doesn't silent gravestone just negate goblin engineers ability?
Making it only relevant for sword use

It could just be that engineer comes out against decks that like surgical. However, not counting his ETB, he actually can help counter surgical with his activated, so I don't know. The answer is probably just: use him wisely and he rewards good play, use him poorly and you pay.

And, oh, hey, this guy is holding up a sword of the meek: Tribute Mage. I think he may be a little too slow, but maybe as a 1 of? I think engineer is just the better option. There could be a case for vial thopter sword, though, with 4 engineer, 4 this guy, and then fill in the blanks. That would be a completely different deck, of course.

Too many goodies!

Hi all!
I m so exited for all those spoilers that I don't even know where to start from! Even tho i wouldn t like to step away from our standard core list i fear that we might have to manipulate it a little and start some testing in order to find the final 75s.

My main problem at the moment is that i tend to play many creatures or none at all in my decks, as i like to have my opponent full of useless cards game1; therefore i fear playing just engineer as a creature exposes him to all the unused removal, on the other hand i don t like to play more than a bunch of creatures because it would dilute our artifact number (the reason i love the deck).

Personally i d like to play a lighter creature version, maybe skipping the goblin engineer and trying to take advantage from mirrodin besieged.. (BTW have you guys seen that card?!)

I m gonna try the new Urza anyways, his flavour is massive in our deck

Sorry for this confusing post,I m just a victim of the hype and wanted to share it with you fellows, I know you understand me!!

Nurmansk, don't worry about Urza turning on creature removal. He comes with a free body and makes you mana, and draws you cards, so say if he gets pathed, you're up 2+ cards on your oponent.

Mirrodin besieged is indeed nuts, but not for us, I'm afraid. It goes in a dedicated grinding station deck (btw, if you're interested in having that deck too, it's not hard to assemble, and I would pick up all those pieces asap while they're still cheap - stuff like grinding station, locket of yesterdays, semblance anvil, possibly mesmeric orb, etc).

Thanks for the tip, I m indeed curious about a grinding station list, but I m a midrangy player and I tend to build grindy decks (sorry for this words trick) instead of comboing off. Thopter swordis the fairest way to combo and that's why i m playing it .

I would have tried to use mirrodin besieged as a double tool: creature engine if needed, looting at the end to sculpt my hand and eventualy (not main focus) win with it. Does this prevent opponent to cast Mycosyinth lattice if you have 15 cards in gy?

Do you think it is so unreasonable?

As for Urza, I m not worried for his health, he can easily win on the spot with thopter sword or just make some advantage. My doubt is for goblin engineer and Sai main

I'm interested in trying a Sai + Urza shell. This could potentially work in a Paradoxical Outcome deck but I am more interested in using Sai + Urza as threats along with Thopter Sword and maybe Karn the Great Creator. I like that we would have threats to attack other Karn decks.

Hi Everyone! I've been away from modern for a while, kinda of hated the format for a multitude of reasons, but Modern Horizons is coming and along with it a bunch of new toys for the archetype! I am looking to update the primer over the course of the next month but I am hoping to get a jump on the vital cards given we should have a lot of new faces around here.

What cards do we think are worth including in the Primer that currently are not?

- Urza, Lord High Artificer is an easy include.

- Force of Negation Deserves a spot in the 75 for builds playing enough blue cards. I'll crunch the numbers (or find the data from some legacy FoW math) and get that in the primer.

- Goblin Engineer Has the potential to open up new avenues for the deck and I am excited to see what this community does with it.

- Tribute Mage This one is a little slow but does exactly what we want it to in many cases.

- Mox Tantalite Bad card right?

- Arcum's Astrolabe Might be worth playing in shells with lots of basics?

- Mirrodin Besieged I feel like this is for a different deck

Any cards within the last year that anyone thinks needed to be added? I tested Karn the Great Creator and hated it but it should get some primer space regardless because I am sure people will ask about it. We have some new Tezzeret's that seem lackluster.

I had about 15 pages worth of material to catch up on here and it looks like a lot of new tech has been tested. I just saw @thenobodys 5-0 list with Narset, Parter of Veils and Teferi's Puzzle box. I'd love to hear more about it. Seems very strong to incidentally hate out the faithless looting/serum visions decks, while introducing another lock piece and another value digging/value generating piece against slower decks.

I tested this main deck before Goblin Engineer, Tribute Mage and Arcum's Astrolabe were spoiled and really liked the upgrades that Urza and FoN brought:


Let me know what you all think!

I really don't see why we would want force of negation.

We can't use it very well on our turn to protect our stuff, and a lot of the hate we face is instant speed artifact destruction/graveyard hate. It can't stop leyline of the void, so we likely still need alternate wincon and/or enchantment removal anyway.

I think if we want a counterspell we should consider stoic rebuttal. Or in a more combo focused deck possibly pact of negation

But personally I don't think I'm really interested in have force even in the sideboard

As for counterspells mb the only one I'd ever consider running is muddle.
I was running a charge counter thoptersword prison combo build with 2 new karns and 2 tezz seeker mb. That was pretty fun and strong. But that'd be the only thopter sword build I could see new karn in.
Excited for new goblin. Urza looks sweet but I'd probably only run 2.
New saheeli is really sweet, i Might try a build with 4 mb of her.
On the fence with new tribute mage.

Quote from Systrill »

I really don't see why we would want force of negation.

We can't use it very well on our turn to protect our stuff, and a lot of the hate we face is instant speed artifact destruction/graveyard hate. It can't stop leyline of the void, so we likely still need alternate wincon and/or enchantment removal anyway.

I think if we want a counterspell we should consider stoic rebuttal. Or in a more combo focused deck possibly pact of negation

But personally I don't think I'm really interested in have force even in the sideboard

I can see where you're coming from, but in looking at Force of Negation, the trap I think a lot of people fall into when evaluating the card is in thinking it can only be cast for its alternate cost. Using it normally just costs 3, which is just 1 more than negate, a card I just played effectively out of the board in a few leagues. I think the extra 1 cmc is worth the added benefit of stopping stuff like early combo, turn 2 stony, or even just protecting a whir that you absolutely need to slam down against control. And while you're right that artifact destruction is instant speed, a lot of the time players don't want you to untap with a foundry and will target it ASAP. So force allows us to just put down a turn 2 foundry and not worry.

I want to try a planeswalker build with talismans as well as opals, saheeli, aob, a couple new karn and maybe only 2 bridge mainboard.

Apart the new card from MH, why no one considered a single Blast Zone in this deck?

I think blast zone is great if you can fit it. However foundry and Whir mean we can afford very few colourless sources and inventors fair or academy ruins often get preference with no room left for blast zone. But if you can fit it into the mana base, it's a great card

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZMmwGoaU7pY
Decklists: http://www.starcitygames.com/articles/38709_Making-The-Most-Of-Modern-Horizons.html
SCG Live promoting Thopter Sword, with new Urza. Different take, trying to assemble the combo quickly rather than toolboxy stall.
Worth a look.