@theNB : why 3 compasses ? I can see it as an out to Moon and a okayish lifegain card, but I feel like you can navigate around Moon overall, especially in your build that plays 4 Moxen.
I'm looking forward to the lifegain and the 1-drop permanent tbh, and to test and see what the mana-fixing allows for. If it's too much fixing with my current landbase, I might keep the compasses in and start testing zhalfirin void. Ultimately, they may not be necessary but we'll see.
I like exp map over compass. It puts cardboard in your hand.
Id like to try esper when the full set's spoiled, board weatherlight is strong for us. A very good compliment to whir because it can help you get a piece of the combo in the turns before whir is online.
As for more turbo PW I tried it for about a month, it's powerful but loses hard to thoughtsieze, freebooter and cryptic which are abundant right now. Jumping the curve lowers the threat density and I think that's a huge liability in the meta.
So does silent gravestone have a spot in our deck to stop sheltered and surgical effects ? I know that our academy ruins doesn't play well with it but if we use ipnu rivulet as a secondary win con I think it would work seeing how crucibal doesn't target . Also we can always sac it to foundry if it became a problem. Also it can be pitched to brutality or artificers intuition if anyone else is playing that just a thought
In the UR deck? Edit: Seems like you just mean in general. It seems a little narrow for just surgical and scooze, we have big problems with stony/rip/leyline and as far as surgical if you're playing a deck that has it you just leave one land untapped and another artifact to remove the sword in response to surgical being cast. So overall I'd say this will not be a piece in the deck unless something that get printed in the future really jams us up.
Went to SCG Milwaukee for the Modern Open and was playing Tezz. For weeks I have been tearing it up in FNM but must of just been a bad day cause I just couldn't draw nonlands at all. With that in mind I will say that I had to face Counters Company THREE times and it was just rough. I can sneak a win, but all of the games went to game 3 with me losing. I didn't prep for the match up as I tuned my list for the tier 1 decks, but I would like to hear what everyone likes and doesn't like in the match up. Cage just doesn't seem like enough for them.
Working on building this currently, and after looking at a bunch of lists, is 2 or 4 Opals standard? Was thinking about trying to grab a few before they go even higher and price and was looking for a bit of input.
There's really no standard lists when it comes to numbers of key cards, other than, I suppose, 4 whirs. I would practice a few different builds proxied or on xmage to see what feels right for you. That said, opal is key for our strategy, and drawing multiples isn't terrible. I would sat 3 is a happy medium.
@Xremag I have a buddy who plays bant company with a splash of red for kessig wolf run and we have played several games. needles, cage and tormods crypt are all stars for me also spellskite is great for stealing a wolf run activation from a bird. using artificers intuition to pitch dead cards and find needles or cage or crypt has worked wonders. We have played 6 or 7 games and I've only lost once.
There's really no standard lists when it comes to numbers of key cards, other than, I suppose, 4 whirs. I would practice a few different builds proxied or on xmage to see what feels right for you. That said, opal is key for our strategy, and drawing multiples isn't terrible. I would sat 3 is a happy medium.
Thanks. Thats what I was thinking. around 3. Been messing with the deck on xmage a lot, hoping to proxy it and start getting some testing in there too.
I played the thopter sword deck again in a win a box, it was just clunky and awkward in a few matches. Such a glut of two and four drops makes for some really brutal games against remand style decks. I'm gonna let that list rest til the new set and keep playing the UR Tez prison deck Mis4tune has been playing.
The dudes who created the deck were streaming the other night as judge__dredge on twitch and they answered a ton of questions for me. They said they hardly ever finish lower than 4-1 in leagues and watching them I believe it. There are a few things that helped make more sense for me, like oboro can be UU if you have a colorless land and haven't played a land that turn, and the ghost quarters are pretty strictly for your mana fixing in the eary turns. I asked them to come comment on here but they declined because they think the site is ugly hahahaha
@boomforest do you have a deck list or a link to one? I like the deck a lot and have most of the pieces is red really the best color to splash has anyone tried anything else also a few post ago you said the primary engine of the deck is map,crucibal,fair is this usually the first thing to assemble when playing the deck ? Thanks
Red's not really a splash, it's basically a mountain to allow for engineered explosives on 3 with an opal and two aether grids in the SB.
After playing it more the deck is an all-in on getting a bridge, getting under the bridge, protecting the bridge and finally pulling ahead via tezzeret/bottled cloister/recurred ghost quarters
The deck is very very tightly and intelligently tuned. I was fairly certain the designers were dialed in and after talking to them I'm certain I trust their choices.
I 3-0d last night vs Hollow One, GR Eldrazi and Affinity, most of the games were nail-biters but the deck delivers what it needs to a spooky amount of the time, you just need to know your outs and play to them. I've said it before but it's a deck for seasoned players who are prepared to play with a slim margin of error, but for those players I think this is the strongest deck in the meta. I'm not kidding.
I played against mis4tune a few weeks ago. I think it's a little like amulet titan, in that it really rewards knowledgable, skilled players, is hard to pilot, and has strange interractions. I wouldn't go so far as to say it's the best deck in the meta. Its success is due to its unfamiliarity to some degree. Its success is also due to the MTGO timer, which is relevant online only. In paper, it needs to actually win game 2. It also has the problem that lantern has, in that it relies on activated abilities completely. Needle on explosives, needle on rivulet/big Tezz might be hard to beat, whereas thopter/sword can make/board in bodies and chip away with damage. I do like its game-1 and how many "outs" it has. Very tough to beat game 1.
You don't actually need to win G2 in paper if you win G1, and your G1 is going to be better than your G2 the majority of the time, just like in a ThopterSword build. That and I think it's largely trivial to win in a lot of cases, just like with Lantern. I've started asking people if they'd like to concede at a certain point, and usually they say yes.
I think Needle is also not a huge deal, but it depends. If you absolutely need a specific card to win (likely Explosives), then it's a problem. Even under Stony, you would need a Needle on Tezz+Grid+Rivulet+Ruins to be locked out of winning if you had less cards in library. EE is definitely the most relevant, since otherwise it's an out to Needle.
The deck is favorable game one against most decks in the meta and g2 only really has a hard time against shattering spree which is a one or two of in SBs. That puts it int he lead for me. Maybe it's not the best deck for you @the_nobodys - that's cool. I would say the deck is very sub optimal in most player's hands, which is a good thing for making sure it doesn't become commonplace and push up shatterstorms.
So I haven't posted in a bit since my deck is very similar to lantern now. However, in my eyes it's a pretty strong hybrid. Lantern pieces help shore up the weaknesses against sideboard cards actually. People in my meta have moved beyond minor artifact hate like K-command and Abrade and play legitimate artifact hate like By Force/Shatterstorm/Spree/Kataki. Many games with normal UBG Tezz I'd get stuck not being able to beat them drawing a shatterstorm or a shattering spree etc.
In matchups where lantern pieces are bad (Coco/elves/Grixis Death Shadow/Jund) you get to play like UBg Tezz and grind.
Having 6 mill rocks I constantly mill myself and each time is +1 draw towards a sword of the meek basically.
Thopter Sword beats all of the fringe things Lantern has trouble with (Noble hierarch, Thalia, Burn,Jund, Blue control decks, winning in time).
By running rainbow lands you get access to way sweeter sideboard cards like Grid/Leyline.
All of this being said. I've played in 3 FNMs, a $1K and 2 $2Ks in the past ~30 days and I've lost 1 match in total. That puts me around 25-1 in paper recently. That one loss match included me mulliganing to a non-functional 3 lantern 5 card hand versus a very strong humans draw. I will say in game 3 I found a sweet line. I played a foundry, he meddling maged thopter sword (because he free bootered my whir) and I thoughtseized my own sword to start making thopters. He off the top drew a way to kill foundry and quick aggression before my 6 looks could find a bridge.
I've played against basically everything, including beating green tron multiple times (looking forward to the matchup getting much easier).
Something different to consider. It is easily the hardest deck I've ever played though.
I also like the UR bridge deck, but it seems very weak to a top decked true artifact hate spell.
Also, Padeem has been nuts. I fully support playing 2.
You don't actually need to win G2 in paper if you win G1, and your G1 is going to be better than your G2 the majority of the time, just like in a ThopterSword build. That and I think it's largely trivial to win in a lot of cases, just like with Lantern. I've started asking people if they'd like to concede at a certain point, and usually they say yes.
I think Needle is also not a huge deal, but it depends. If you absolutely need a specific card to win (likely Explosives), then it's a problem. Even under Stony, you would need a Needle on Tezz+Grid+Rivulet+Ruins to be locked out of winning if you had less cards in library. EE is definitely the most relevant, since otherwise it's an out to Needle.
@atomacity - good point, you don't need to win game 2 in paper. I like the deck a lot, I really do. I looked at the list and tweaked my tezz list for a while to include the map/land package, and did well. I just think saying its the best deck in the meta is a little shortsighted and ignores a few factors. Not long ago, the pilot of the new mardu pyromancer list was just wrecking modern leagues online to a ridiculous mumber of 5-0's. The reason this deck isn't still doing that is because opponents caught on as to how to play against it. The prison deck has the same thing going for it currently - people still need to look up ipnu when they see the list. The deck had an "Opponent doesn't know the list/how to play against it" factor. In addition to this advantage, it also has the mtgo clock advantage. The pilots doing well play incredibly fast from practice, and get wins because the clocl comes into play games 2-3. I respect this advantage. When I started playing against UW control when I was new to online magic, they beat me all the time through the clock. Eventually, through practice, I could play the matchup at their pace.
Really, my only point about the deck is to say it has a few things going for it that have to do with its newness. It's fun to see new decks do well, and I hope it holds up like lantern has.
Hey Guys and Gals! I just (this week) sold a bunch of cards (was slowly building Sultai, but was STILL a set of Bob's and Goyf's short, decided it's too freakin' expensive and sold everything) and bought all the cards needed for the Tezz (Sultai) build. I've been watching streams and reading up on it, seems fun! Anyways... this is my first time posting, but I came across a card Sly Requisitioner and was very curious to get your guys take on it? I'm thinking I'm going to run as a one of, seems like it add a good bit of Value when sacing the sword to foundry! Anyways, I'm interested to hear your take (or maybe it's already been tried and sucks?!?!)
I'm looking forward to the lifegain and the 1-drop permanent tbh, and to test and see what the mana-fixing allows for. If it's too much fixing with my current landbase, I might keep the compasses in and start testing zhalfirin void. Ultimately, they may not be necessary but we'll see.
Id like to try esper when the full set's spoiled, board weatherlight is strong for us. A very good compliment to whir because it can help you get a piece of the combo in the turns before whir is online.
As for more turbo PW I tried it for about a month, it's powerful but loses hard to thoughtsieze, freebooter and cryptic which are abundant right now. Jumping the curve lowers the threat density and I think that's a huge liability in the meta.
UBx Tezzeret: http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/18-06-17-ub-tezzeret/
Thanks. Thats what I was thinking. around 3. Been messing with the deck on xmage a lot, hoping to proxy it and start getting some testing in there too.
The dudes who created the deck were streaming the other night as judge__dredge on twitch and they answered a ton of questions for me. They said they hardly ever finish lower than 4-1 in leagues and watching them I believe it. There are a few things that helped make more sense for me, like oboro can be UU if you have a colorless land and haven't played a land that turn, and the ghost quarters are pretty strictly for your mana fixing in the eary turns. I asked them to come comment on here but they declined because they think the site is ugly hahahaha
Red's not really a splash, it's basically a mountain to allow for engineered explosives on 3 with an opal and two aether grids in the SB.
After playing it more the deck is an all-in on getting a bridge, getting under the bridge, protecting the bridge and finally pulling ahead via tezzeret/bottled cloister/recurred ghost quarters
The deck is very very tightly and intelligently tuned. I was fairly certain the designers were dialed in and after talking to them I'm certain I trust their choices.
I 3-0d last night vs Hollow One, GR Eldrazi and Affinity, most of the games were nail-biters but the deck delivers what it needs to a spooky amount of the time, you just need to know your outs and play to them. I've said it before but it's a deck for seasoned players who are prepared to play with a slim margin of error, but for those players I think this is the strongest deck in the meta. I'm not kidding.
I think Needle is also not a huge deal, but it depends. If you absolutely need a specific card to win (likely Explosives), then it's a problem. Even under Stony, you would need a Needle on Tezz+Grid+Rivulet+Ruins to be locked out of winning if you had less cards in library. EE is definitely the most relevant, since otherwise it's an out to Needle.
4 Glimmervoid
4 Darkslick Shores
3 Botanical Sanctum
2 Island
1 Academy Ruins
3 Mox Opal
4 Mishra's Bauble
1 Pithing Needle
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Sorcerous Spyglass
1 Witchbane Orb
4 Codex Shredder
2 Ghoulcaller's bell
4 Lantern of Insight
3 Thopter Foundry
2 Sword of the Meek
4 Ensnaring Bridge
4 Whir of Invention
4 Thoughtseize
2 Padeem
2 Tezz
2 Ghirapur Aethergrid
2 Leyline of Sanctity
2 Abrupt Decay
1 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Search for Azcanta
2 Welding Jar
1 Pithing Needle
So I haven't posted in a bit since my deck is very similar to lantern now. However, in my eyes it's a pretty strong hybrid. Lantern pieces help shore up the weaknesses against sideboard cards actually. People in my meta have moved beyond minor artifact hate like K-command and Abrade and play legitimate artifact hate like By Force/Shatterstorm/Spree/Kataki. Many games with normal UBG Tezz I'd get stuck not being able to beat them drawing a shatterstorm or a shattering spree etc.
In matchups where lantern pieces are bad (Coco/elves/Grixis Death Shadow/Jund) you get to play like UBg Tezz and grind.
Having 6 mill rocks I constantly mill myself and each time is +1 draw towards a sword of the meek basically.
Thopter Sword beats all of the fringe things Lantern has trouble with (Noble hierarch, Thalia, Burn,Jund, Blue control decks, winning in time).
By running rainbow lands you get access to way sweeter sideboard cards like Grid/Leyline.
All of this being said. I've played in 3 FNMs, a $1K and 2 $2Ks in the past ~30 days and I've lost 1 match in total. That puts me around 25-1 in paper recently. That one loss match included me mulliganing to a non-functional 3 lantern 5 card hand versus a very strong humans draw. I will say in game 3 I found a sweet line. I played a foundry, he meddling maged thopter sword (because he free bootered my whir) and I thoughtseized my own sword to start making thopters. He off the top drew a way to kill foundry and quick aggression before my 6 looks could find a bridge.
I've played against basically everything, including beating green tron multiple times (looking forward to the matchup getting much easier).
Something different to consider. It is easily the hardest deck I've ever played though.
I also like the UR bridge deck, but it seems very weak to a top decked true artifact hate spell.
Also, Padeem has been nuts. I fully support playing 2.
Grats bro
OLD SCHOOL 93/94 «The Pain Train» Black Sligh, Esper «Machine Gun» Artifacts, Jund «Psycho» Ponza-Disko.
@atomacity - good point, you don't need to win game 2 in paper. I like the deck a lot, I really do. I looked at the list and tweaked my tezz list for a while to include the map/land package, and did well. I just think saying its the best deck in the meta is a little shortsighted and ignores a few factors. Not long ago, the pilot of the new mardu pyromancer list was just wrecking modern leagues online to a ridiculous mumber of 5-0's. The reason this deck isn't still doing that is because opponents caught on as to how to play against it. The prison deck has the same thing going for it currently - people still need to look up ipnu when they see the list. The deck had an "Opponent doesn't know the list/how to play against it" factor. In addition to this advantage, it also has the mtgo clock advantage. The pilots doing well play incredibly fast from practice, and get wins because the clocl comes into play games 2-3. I respect this advantage. When I started playing against UW control when I was new to online magic, they beat me all the time through the clock. Eventually, through practice, I could play the matchup at their pace.
Really, my only point about the deck is to say it has a few things going for it that have to do with its newness. It's fun to see new decks do well, and I hope it holds up like lantern has.
Deck I'm planning on running:
1x Academy Ruins
2x Botanical Sanctum
1x Breeding Pool
2x Darkslick Shores
2x Darksteel Citadel
1x Inventors' Fair
3x Island
2x Misty Rainforest
4x Polluted Delta
1x Swamp
2x Watery Grave
4x Whir of Invention
3x Mishra's Bauble
4x Mox Opal
1x Relic of Progenitus
1x Sorcerous Spyglass
2x Sword of the Meek
4x Talisman of Dominance
3x Thopter Foundry
2x Welding Jar
3x Ancient Stirrings
3x Thoughtseize
1x Sly Requisitioner
4x Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
2x Abrupt Decay
1x Back to Nature
2x Collective Brutality
1x Damnation
1x Glaring Spotlight
2x Herald of Anguish
2x Maelstrom Pulse
1x Pithing Needle
2x Surgical Extraction
1x Witchbane Orb
This version is a blast and every game is enjoyable on both sides of the table.
It's miserable to play online though, so I'll stick to paper testing.