I was playing Tezz in old era - Trinquet + C.Mox + Tezzeret.
The list I first tried was the one from Travis Brown (http://tcdecks.net/deck.php?id=26945&iddeck=213233)I just copy/paste the list anf give it a try. and was surprinsingly good. I do not see much differneces between yours and this.
I really don't know about Talisman/Pentad Prism when I tried PP I felt it was good as you really need it in the first turns.
At first I was a little eskeptical about 4 M.Opal but the card really shines in here it is the most similar to C.M. so I would not play less than 3.
Regarding the discard package I feel T.Seize is just great and better than IoK 1 concern is vs Company decks and C.Command - T.Seize can be the diff between beeing dead or not and vs Burn you have Thopter+M.Opal for speeding the things up - If I don't play a Grafdiggers cage in main I would play 4 TSeize and maybe 1 IoK that is my reasoning.
I feel also that 4Tezz and 2JTM are key in the deck - you have lots of mana acc. so it is easy to play 1 of these soon and having 6 alsmot guarraties to play 1. I see logic playing 3/2 and less mana acc. as you. likely is the thing I want to do most with the deck - land a good planeswalker.
Rearding the list from Travis Brown I really would like to fit in 4th S.Visions. - maybe 1 M.Opal
I would like you to expose me how do you side vs the diff. deck with that 75 just to make an starting idea (Burn, company vizier, Hollowing, Aff, Combo, jund, humans, U/W control or jeskay, EldraziTron, UG tron, latern) mayebe I miss something..
I really would like to uniformize the deck in such a way that I have clear what to play and how to side. We have all the same meta...
I really don't mind to play one or other deck- after some match ups played I'll expose my conclusions.
I am having in mind the new card - Damping Sphere - which seems huge vs tron and combo on this deck. I play also UTron and this deck seems like a bye for UTron - in theory. Could not we fit some kinf of counterspell in here? Cryptic seems wonderfull - but really don't know I usedto play 3 Cryptic/snare Chalice in old era...
Thanks in advance.
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After looking at the U/R Prison list a little yesterday, I decided to take some of its fundamentals and change my Tezz list. My thinking: If this list can get away with playing 10 blue sources in its lands, then there's no reason a Tezz list that isn't trying to hit blue or black for visions/IoK early can't also run a land package like this.
So I muddled around and came up with this list, which 4-1'd last night. Deck played surprisngly smooth.
I have 11 blue sources in lands, and 9 black sources in lands, and of course there's 4 opals to help. Early turns have been more explosive, and turn 2 Thoughtcasts have been common. It is a little harder to cast foundry on turn 2, but expedition map helps for turn 3. Whirring hasn't been that much different, but whir isn't really a turn 3 spell usually. Several times I used Ghost Quarter on my citadel to fetch an island. There's definitely "hidden" colored sources all over this build. When Dominaria rolls around, looking forward to adding 1-2 Navigator's Compass to smooth things even more.
I feel also that 4Tezz and 2JTM are key in the deck - you have lots of mana acc. so it is easy to play 1 of these soon and having 6 alsmot guarraties to play 1. I see logic playing 3/2 and less mana acc. as you. likely is the thing I want to do most with the deck - land a good planeswalker.
Rearding the list from Travis Brown I really would like to fit in 4th S.Visions. - maybe 1 M.Opal
I would like you to expose me how do you side vs the diff. deck with that 75 just to make an starting idea (Burn, company vizier, Hollowing, Aff, Combo, jund, humans, U/W control or jeskay, EldraziTron, UG tron, latern) mayebe I miss something..
I really would like to uniformize the deck in such a way that I have clear what to play and how to side. We have all the same meta...
I really don't mind to play one or other deck- after some match ups played I'll expose my conclusions.
I am having in mind the new card - Damping Sphere - which seems huge vs tron and combo on this deck. I play also UTron and this deck seems like a bye for UTron - in theory. Could not we fit some kinf of counterspell in here? Cryptic seems wonderfull - but really don't know I usedto play 3 Cryptic/snare Chalice in old era...
Thanks in advance.
Hey Pelikanudo, glad you liked the deck so far! To address a couple of your points:
1. Regarding the 4 Tezz, 2 JTMS split: I have cut JTMS entirely from the deck for the 4th Serum Visions and the 1st Krark-Clan Ironworks. I found that the deck really wanted more things going on on turn 1 when you don't have the nutty turn 1 Pentad Prism, and Visions has smoothed out the deck considerably. the KCI gave the deck much a much needed gameplan vs Storm and Tron (two of the worst matchups), as well as ways to simply win the game outright.
2. 4 Thoughtseize. I really like the Thoughtseize, but I am currently testing 3 TS/1 IoK split to better the burn/zoo matchup. I have no problems with the 4 TS, but I think it is worth testing out other options. I have also cut the witchbane orb from the board for a collective brutality as well, because I found that the orb didn't do enough vs storm (costs too much and they can simply bounce it), and CoBru does a lot more in general.
3. I can type up a general sideboard guide, but I am still putting together a "perfect" plan myself.
4. As for countermagic, I am not a big fan. We can whir at instant speed anyway, and a Thoughtseize into Whir is how I often beat control. I prefer proactive ways to beat control and countermagic.
5. Damping Sphere. I will 100% be playing this as a 1-of in my main, and likely a second in the board. I will probably cut the Pithing Needle or the 4th Serum Visions. The card is too strong.
Spyglass is onviously powerful but comes with some real costs. With an opal based deck being able to have access to three mana on turn two is activated by needle, it's easier to get with whir in the emergency situations where it's vital, like in response to an extremely fast goryo'd griselbrand or something similar - and finally it is less likely to get you stuck with a bridge out and a clogged hand.
Magic has long loathed that they don't have fractions of mana to use in design because the jump in power and the burden of cost between 1, 2 and 3 cmc spells is so significant.
These may seem like elementary ideas, but the consideration of the two cards' differences is basically talking about the tiny edges in your deckbuilding. In my opinion, if forced to choose one I would choose needle.
@the nobodys Been trying out that list, and I like it much more than I expected. Main things I don't love are the Maps. They feel not great at all. I think I've yet to actually activate one. I ended up making a few changes. Cut the Thoughtcasts, and 1 Map for 3 Chalice of the Void and a 2nd Collective Brutality. I really really like chalice these days. There aren't a lot of decks where chalice on 1 feels bad to have, even if it's just on turn 2. The manabase has been working out better than I expected. I cut the thoughtcasts, which may be wrong, because often I don't really love drawing extra cards in the deck. Either cause I have bridge out, or I want to be making thopters. It could be wrong, Thoughtcast could be where you want to be in this more artifact heavy build. I could see maybe cutting 1 or even 2 of the maindeck graveyard hate cards for something like a thoughtcast, or a spellskite, or a KCI/Time Sieve or something.
But over all, really liking the feel of the build. Thopter Sword, Chalice, Bridge, and GQ+Crucible feels like it's got game vs everything
yes please, as a starting point share your side strategy!
KCI > than time slieve? it seems.
I don't think you should take out the P.Nedle and now we have D.S. maybe KCI is not needed as this card by itself just stops combo and tron - but don't know -
at least in 1st game.
4 Mox Opal, why not 3? better Pentad than other stuff like Talisman? I really felt I wanted to draw always Mox but not 2.
I just need to test this also... Is by here mis4tune so that he can give us some Side strategy also? weird and interesting deck... this seems more like old Tezz deck. with Chalices and even Tezz the Seeker! does this deck wins via Ipnu Rivulet?? can't believe it..
More questions:
Is really E.Explosives not needed? and neither Chalice?
I find that as example a resolved D.Confidant can cause serious problems to us. is not really needed some kind of asnwer to this as Jund seems everywhere by here and likely D.C. is just their best card vs us as we do not really have an answer..
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@Systrill - Cool that you've also been liking that build. I actually cut 1 thoughtcast and 1 spellbomb for 2 serum visions, so you were right there. Thouhtcast is quite good, it actually helps dig for your land drops, but you don't really want it in your opener. The build definitely has more game against tron and combo, but burn is worse, so more CB is definitely good. The deck loses to itself more than regular tezz builds due to mana screw, but it has more powerful plays as a trade off.
I actually played a really long match against the Ur prison deck that I took the changes from. I lost due to timing out game 3, as he was just quicker with his lines of play. It was fun. It really came down to who could exile what from the opponents graveyard.
Travis’s list and my list are very similar but I feel like the major difference is how I sideboard. The starting point for my current build was very similar to his but I found that in side boarding you rarely want that many planeswalkers or artifacts that get locked under a stony silence. I was boarding out Pentad Prism and extra mox opals quite often. When side boarding to beat value decks like control or Jund you just want to top deck well and the acceleration are awful top decks. When you want to beat decks like Burn/Hollow One/Storm the acceleration is great but 10 4+ drops is a death sentence so you board some of those out.
Therefore I aligned my deck to have better pre-boarded games against everything trimming some of the mana acceleration and the planeswalkers. I also increased the number of green sources from my lands to more consistently cast abrupt decay through hate.
Here is a short sideboard guide:
Humans:
-2 Thoughtseize
-1 Nihil Spellbomb
-2 Thopter Foundry
-1 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
-1 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
+3 Abrupt Decay
+2 Fatal Push
+2 Damnation
It is very difficult for them to beat ensnaring bridge and it is very difficult for you to beat Thalia/Meddling Mage/Kitesail Freebooter. If you can kill Thalia immediately you should be okay.
Jund:
-3 Inquisition of Kozelik
-2 Thoughtseize
-3 Talisman of Dominance
+1 Padeem, Consul of Innovation
+1 Spellskite
+2 Fatal Push
+1 Pithing Needle
+1 Welding Jar
+2 Collective Brutality
I’ve always liked this matchup. Board into ways to remove Dark Confidant and protect Thopter/Sword. This includes Pithing Needle for Scavenging Ooze. Occasionally you will have to needle a Liliana but I race to the combo and beat her down with thopters most of the time. Lingering Souls is hard for them to beat, so prioritize your repeatable lingering souls engine.
Gx Tron
-1 Nihil Spellbomb
-2 Thopter Foundry
-2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
+1 Padeem, Consul of Innovation
+1 Spellskite
+2 Damnation
+1 Witchbane Orb
I am of the opinion that little can be done in this matchup. Hopefully Dampening Sphere is going to help us out.
Burn:
-2 Thoughtsieze
-1 Expedition Map
-1 Nihil Spellbomb
-1 Pithing Needle
-1 Ghost Quarter
+1 Spellskite
+2 Fatal Push
+2 Collective Brutality
+1 Witchbane Orb
I like our position in this match up. Thopter/Sword is crazy good here and you just need to survive long enough to deploy it. Most burn decks are dropping green/destructively revelry which is great news for us.
Affinity:
-2 Thoughtseize
-3 Inquisition of Kozelik (Keep on the play)
-1 Nihil Spellbomb
-1 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
+1 Pithing Needle
+2 Abrupt Decay
+2 Fatal Push (Not on the play)
+1 Welding Jar (Not on the play)
+1 Damnation
Thopter/Sword is very good here but sideboard ancient grudge is terrifying when backed by a fast clock. Aggressively play planeswalkers as fogs while setting up the combo. Always needle Cranial Plating.
Jeskai Control:
-1 Welding Jar
-3 Talisman of Dominance
-1 Ensnaring Bridge
+3 Abrupt Decay
+1 Padeem, Consul of Innovation
+1 Spellskite
Super favorable matchup before and after side boarding. Thopter/Sword is nearly unbeatable for them.
Eldrazi Tron:
-3 Inquisition of Kozelik
-1 Thopter Foundry
-1 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
+2 Fatal Push
+2 Damnation
+1 Pithing Needle
Much better match up then Gx Tron but your Pithing Needles will be working overtime. Combo quickly and lock them down with Ensnaring Bridge.
Bogles:
-3 Inquisition of Kozelik
-2 Thoughtseize
-1 Expedition Map
-1 Nihil Spellbomb
+3 Abrupt Decay
+2 Damnation
+1 Welding Jar
+1 Spellskite
They can’t beat ensnaring bridge. Full stop. Protect it as much as possible and get it as quickly as possible.
UW Control:
-1 Ensnaring Bridge
-1 Welding Jar
-1 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
-3 Talisman of Dominance
+1 Padeem, Consul of Innovation
+1 Spellskite
+3 Abrupt Decay
+1 Pithing Needle
Slightly worse than Jeskai control. Keep the planeswalkers at bay and be weary of Detention Sphere effects. Grind them out with thopter/sword.
Grixis Deaths Shadow:
-3 Inquisition of Kozelik
-2 Thoughtseize
-1 Expedition Map
-1 Pithing Needle
-3 Talisman of Dominance
+1 Padeem, Consul of Innovation
+1 Spellskite
+2 Fatal Push
+2 Collective Brutality
+2 Damnation
+1 Grafdigger’s Cage
+1 Welding Jar
Probably the biggest transformation. Snapcaster Mage/KCommand can be brutal. Defend Ensnaring Bridge as much as possible and grind them down afterwards.
Storm:
-1 Ensnaring Bridge
-1 Expedition Map
-1 Pithing Needle
-1 Sword of the Meek
-2 Thopter Foundry
-1 Welding Jar
-2 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
+1 Spellskite
+2 Abrupt Decay
+2 Fatal Push
+2 Collective Brutality
+1 Grafdigger’s Cage
+1 Witchbane Orb
This matchup and dredge are the reason for the main deck Nihil Spellbomb. Easy against a storm pilot unfamiliar with our kit. Try to use Whir of invention reactively to lock out Empty the Warrens, Past in Flames, or Grapeshot.
Dredge:
-3 Inquisition of Kozelik
-2 Thoughtseize
-1 Pithing Needle
-2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
-1 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
+1 Padeem, Consul of Innovation
+1 Spellskite
+2 Collective Brutality
+2 Damnation
+1 Grafdigger’s Cage
+1 Welding Jar
+1 Witchbane Orb
A lot of weak cards in game 1. Try to sideboard into a way to beat Ancient Grudge on Ensnaring Bridge and Conflagrate.
I sort of just threw this together, so if anyone is interested in a more in depth side boarding guide I could put one together.
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U/B Tezzeret Control
Sultai Midrange
Anything Innovative
This list is a little tuned towards my shop's metagame. I board out the artifact mana against kataki/stony silence to turn into a UB control deck so the 2 lands is a necessary evil in the SB. Spellskite is excellent against Jund, play them. Tron is still tough, hurry up Dominaria! I'm like 15-4 in my last 4 modern events so it's working. SFA is really strong, I would keep a 2nd in the board if I had more planeswalkers/alternative win-cons.
Nice results with that list, Trav. How necessary are the 3 main-deck welding jars? They seem like they might be a bit of dead weight in a lot of games one.
@racing089 Thanks for the guide! I just wanted to mention a few sideboard considerations in addition to what you've listed. I know everyone has different configurations, but the core of the decks should be relatively universal:
Bogles
Pithing Needle should be a consideration against Boggles because a) a lot of decks play sideboard seal of primordium, which is one of the few cards you care about after deploying a bridge, and b) keeps the density of 0-1 mana artifacts high to turn on early mox opals to get under/deploy bridge as early as possible.
Burn
Needle should also be a consideration as a 1-of against burn opponents that have grim lavamancer, as they will often apply early pressure and get you within a single-digit life total, and one of the few outs they could have is an unanswered lavamancer (especially if you play brutality/fatal push and have to use them on other creatures early to hold them at bay). Again, not a card you NEED to keep in, but something you should bear in mind.
Storm
If you see shattering spree instead of shatterstorm game 2, I'd consider bringing welding jars back in. If you're playing the heavier planeswalker build, I also like cutting Jace and keeping a high density of Tez, as the 5/5 beatdown plan is particularly good against them. I get that the fateseal ability can be useful against them, but I personally just like to have a focused plan of attack and try to maximize my ability to deploy my strategy as consistently as possible (rather than split the difference) - but to each their own. TBH though, I really don't think Jace should be in this deck at all, as Tez 4 is a bit too much sometimes, and Tez 4 is better than Jace 1-2.
Also, many of you might already be aware of this, but if you can manage to whir for Witchbane Orb in response to a Gifts Ungiven, you'll effectively counter it (as an avid gifts player, Leyline of Sanctity can be a huge pain - this line is similar) and can make a huge difference from seemingly out of nowhere.
@HILTONMODE I don't think you need Jace at all, I'd rather play more artifacts. I'm not sure what your numbers look like, but I personally like maxing out the Thopter/Sword count to 4/3, as it puts less pressure on whir needing to become the thing you're missing. If you want a replacement effect for a value engine, I highly recommend Search for Azcanta and/or Bottled Cloister. I was hesitant on them at first (especially BC), but I really like the pseudo-walker roles both cards play, as well as the synergy with the rest of the deck.
As for the Mox Opals, you could just play different mana rocks or other cheap spells in the Mox slots, however cards like prism/talisman just aren't the same. I really think this deck should be playing no less than 3-4 Mox Opals.
I'll second the power of cloister. An out to a bridge/clogged hand in your 60 is incredible. In the UR prison build I can't tell you how many games are stone lost only to topdeck a timely whir/cloister and cruise to victory. Azcanta is also very very good, I think we will see a constant uptick of this card in all eternal formats and our deck should be no exception. Jace is SO powerful but lack of real synergy is glaring - both the guys playing the deck in Dallas wanted to cut it entirely for more serums/siezes and I agree with that.
Nice results with that list, Trav. How necessary are the 3 main-deck welding jars? They seem like they might be a bit of dead weight in a lot of games one.
Not enough data to say confidently, but I swapped a bauble for it which I think is minimal impact to the deck. Jar is just so important against all the Kolaghan's and Rec/qasali's I'm seeing that I think the upside is worth it. I don't want to waste a SB slot on a 3rd.
Thopter foundry (and Tezz) are blue cards. So is Time Sieve.
The black cards aren't absolutely vital to making the deck function (although they are very good).
We are trying to empty our hand for Ensnaring bridge.
Our two Planeswalkers of choice offer absurd card advantage.
Should Disrupting Shoal be a consideration? I'm particularly interested in the idea given that we have a glut of 2 drops, and the most powerful hate cards against us are Stony and Ancient Grudge. In many games card advantage is literally useless compared to defending the combo and using mana to make more thopters.
Got a 5-0 last night (finally) in a mtgo competitive league with the artifact-heavy list I've been running recently. Games against grisshoalbrand, blue moon, grixis control, GR eldrazi, and Amulet Titan, in that order. The grisselbrand player was totally screwed at all phases of the match. The control matches were won on the backs of padeem and skite, but it was a slog through some timely explosives/staticaster. I almost gave away the blue-moon match by casting a second thopter foundry with the combo online, against a board of staticaster. He topdecked an explosives the next turn for the ultimate feel-bad. Amulet Titan was really tight, and the opponent was salty at the end of game 3. This match takes a lot of practice, but I think we're favored. Needling Tolaria West is very important.
The maps/utility land package didn't really help or hurt in these matches. I didn't get color screwed, but I also wasn't attacking the opponents' landbase that hard. Oftentimes, I was just glad of all the low-cost artifacts to help get opal and thoughtcast online.
A few notes/changes:
I threw the two repeals in a few leagues ago because I wanted a cantrip with a little board interaction. Early game, they can bounce things like hierarchs, confidants, utopia sprawls, and aether vials for a huge tempo boost. Late game they are at worst a "free" cantrip with mox opal. They give the deck some pre-boarded extra oomph against SB hate permanents. I wouldn't play them in a non-4 opal build, though. In my matches, they were very useful against GR eldrazi. I bounced hierarchs and signets to delay TKS in time for me to drop bridges/combo.
After getting wrecked by burn every match, I made room in the board for 2 battle at the bridges. They were useful against GR eldrazi to help stabilize. Might find room for a third.
I have yet to resolve a defense grid. It's very frustrating, because I can't get a feel for whether or not the card is worth its SB space. I guess it eats a spell snare that would go toward foundry. What are others' experiences with defense grid? Good/not good?
Padeem and Skite are SB all-stars. I was a little dubious about spellskite (versus, like, another jar or padeem), but it did such work in the blue moon and grixis control matches.
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I was playing Tezz in old era - Trinquet + C.Mox + Tezzeret.
The list I first tried was the one from Travis Brown (http://tcdecks.net/deck.php?id=26945&iddeck=213233)I just copy/paste the list anf give it a try. and was surprinsingly good. I do not see much differneces between yours and this.
I really don't know about Talisman/Pentad Prism when I tried PP I felt it was good as you really need it in the first turns.
At first I was a little eskeptical about 4 M.Opal but the card really shines in here it is the most similar to C.M. so I would not play less than 3.
Regarding the discard package I feel T.Seize is just great and better than IoK 1 concern is vs Company decks and C.Command - T.Seize can be the diff between beeing dead or not and vs Burn you have Thopter+M.Opal for speeding the things up - If I don't play a Grafdiggers cage in main I would play 4 TSeize and maybe 1 IoK that is my reasoning.
I feel also that 4Tezz and 2JTM are key in the deck - you have lots of mana acc. so it is easy to play 1 of these soon and having 6 alsmot guarraties to play 1. I see logic playing 3/2 and less mana acc. as you. likely is the thing I want to do most with the deck - land a good planeswalker.
Rearding the list from Travis Brown I really would like to fit in 4th S.Visions. - maybe 1 M.Opal
I would like you to expose me how do you side vs the diff. deck with that 75 just to make an starting idea (Burn, company vizier, Hollowing, Aff, Combo, jund, humans, U/W control or jeskay, EldraziTron, UG tron, latern) mayebe I miss something..
I really would like to uniformize the deck in such a way that I have clear what to play and how to side. We have all the same meta...
I really don't mind to play one or other deck- after some match ups played I'll expose my conclusions.
I am having in mind the new card - Damping Sphere - which seems huge vs tron and combo on this deck. I play also UTron and this deck seems like a bye for UTron - in theory. Could not we fit some kinf of counterspell in here? Cryptic seems wonderfull - but really don't know I usedto play 3 Cryptic/snare Chalice in old era...
Thanks in advance.
So I muddled around and came up with this list, which 4-1'd last night. Deck played surprisngly smooth.
4 Mishra's Bauble
4 Mox Opal
1 Welding Jar
1 Pithing Needle
1 Grafdigger's Cage
3 Expedition Map
2 Nihil Spellbomb
4 Thopter Foundry
3 Sword of the Meek
3 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Crucible of Worlds
1 Witchbane Orb
Other Spells: 11
1 Collective Brutality
3 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
3 Thoughtcast
4 Whir of Invention
3 Darksteel Citadel
3 Ghost Quarter
1 Field of Ruin
1 Inventors' Fair
1 Academy Ruins
3 Island
4 Spire of Industry
3 Darkslick Shores
1 Glimmervoid
1 Swamp
2 Lingering Souls
1 Paraselene
1 Fragmentize
2 Echoing Truth
2 Padeem, Consul of Innovation
2 Damnation
1 Pithing Needle
1 Sorcerous Spyglass
2 Defense Grid
1 Ratchet Bomb
I have 11 blue sources in lands, and 9 black sources in lands, and of course there's 4 opals to help. Early turns have been more explosive, and turn 2 Thoughtcasts have been common. It is a little harder to cast foundry on turn 2, but expedition map helps for turn 3. Whirring hasn't been that much different, but whir isn't really a turn 3 spell usually. Several times I used Ghost Quarter on my citadel to fetch an island. There's definitely "hidden" colored sources all over this build. When Dominaria rolls around, looking forward to adding 1-2 Navigator's Compass to smooth things even more.
I'll continue to test!
Hey Pelikanudo, glad you liked the deck so far! To address a couple of your points:
1. Regarding the 4 Tezz, 2 JTMS split: I have cut JTMS entirely from the deck for the 4th Serum Visions and the 1st Krark-Clan Ironworks. I found that the deck really wanted more things going on on turn 1 when you don't have the nutty turn 1 Pentad Prism, and Visions has smoothed out the deck considerably. the KCI gave the deck much a much needed gameplan vs Storm and Tron (two of the worst matchups), as well as ways to simply win the game outright.
2. 4 Thoughtseize. I really like the Thoughtseize, but I am currently testing 3 TS/1 IoK split to better the burn/zoo matchup. I have no problems with the 4 TS, but I think it is worth testing out other options. I have also cut the witchbane orb from the board for a collective brutality as well, because I found that the orb didn't do enough vs storm (costs too much and they can simply bounce it), and CoBru does a lot more in general.
3. I can type up a general sideboard guide, but I am still putting together a "perfect" plan myself.
4. As for countermagic, I am not a big fan. We can whir at instant speed anyway, and a Thoughtseize into Whir is how I often beat control. I prefer proactive ways to beat control and countermagic.
5. Damping Sphere. I will 100% be playing this as a 1-of in my main, and likely a second in the board. I will probably cut the Pithing Needle or the 4th Serum Visions. The card is too strong.
Magic has long loathed that they don't have fractions of mana to use in design because the jump in power and the burden of cost between 1, 2 and 3 cmc spells is so significant.
These may seem like elementary ideas, but the consideration of the two cards' differences is basically talking about the tiny edges in your deckbuilding. In my opinion, if forced to choose one I would choose needle.
But over all, really liking the feel of the build. Thopter Sword, Chalice, Bridge, and GQ+Crucible feels like it's got game vs everything
yes please, as a starting point share your side strategy!
KCI > than time slieve? it seems.
I don't think you should take out the P.Nedle and now we have D.S. maybe KCI is not needed as this card by itself just stops combo and tron - but don't know -
at least in 1st game.
4 Mox Opal, why not 3? better Pentad than other stuff like Talisman? I really felt I wanted to draw always Mox but not 2.
Apart I've seen 2 Tezz decks like this:
http://tcdecks.net/deck.php?id=26895&iddeck=212610
I just need to test this also... Is by here mis4tune so that he can give us some Side strategy also? weird and interesting deck... this seems more like old Tezz deck. with Chalices and even Tezz the Seeker! does this deck wins via Ipnu Rivulet?? can't believe it..
More questions:
Is really E.Explosives not needed? and neither Chalice?
I find that as example a resolved D.Confidant can cause serious problems to us. is not really needed some kind of asnwer to this as Jund seems everywhere by here and likely D.C. is just their best card vs us as we do not really have an answer..
I actually played a really long match against the Ur prison deck that I took the changes from. I lost due to timing out game 3, as he was just quicker with his lines of play. It was fun. It really came down to who could exile what from the opponents graveyard.
Travis’s list and my list are very similar but I feel like the major difference is how I sideboard. The starting point for my current build was very similar to his but I found that in side boarding you rarely want that many planeswalkers or artifacts that get locked under a stony silence. I was boarding out Pentad Prism and extra mox opals quite often. When side boarding to beat value decks like control or Jund you just want to top deck well and the acceleration are awful top decks. When you want to beat decks like Burn/Hollow One/Storm the acceleration is great but 10 4+ drops is a death sentence so you board some of those out.
Therefore I aligned my deck to have better pre-boarded games against everything trimming some of the mana acceleration and the planeswalkers. I also increased the number of green sources from my lands to more consistently cast abrupt decay through hate.
Here is a short sideboard guide:
Humans:
-2 Thoughtseize
-1 Nihil Spellbomb
-2 Thopter Foundry
-1 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
-1 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
+3 Abrupt Decay
+2 Fatal Push
+2 Damnation
It is very difficult for them to beat ensnaring bridge and it is very difficult for you to beat Thalia/Meddling Mage/Kitesail Freebooter. If you can kill Thalia immediately you should be okay.
Jund:
-3 Inquisition of Kozelik
-2 Thoughtseize
-3 Talisman of Dominance
+1 Padeem, Consul of Innovation
+1 Spellskite
+2 Fatal Push
+1 Pithing Needle
+1 Welding Jar
+2 Collective Brutality
I’ve always liked this matchup. Board into ways to remove Dark Confidant and protect Thopter/Sword. This includes Pithing Needle for Scavenging Ooze. Occasionally you will have to needle a Liliana but I race to the combo and beat her down with thopters most of the time. Lingering Souls is hard for them to beat, so prioritize your repeatable lingering souls engine.
Gx Tron
-1 Nihil Spellbomb
-2 Thopter Foundry
-2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
+1 Padeem, Consul of Innovation
+1 Spellskite
+2 Damnation
+1 Witchbane Orb
I am of the opinion that little can be done in this matchup. Hopefully Dampening Sphere is going to help us out.
Burn:
-2 Thoughtsieze
-1 Expedition Map
-1 Nihil Spellbomb
-1 Pithing Needle
-1 Ghost Quarter
+1 Spellskite
+2 Fatal Push
+2 Collective Brutality
+1 Witchbane Orb
I like our position in this match up. Thopter/Sword is crazy good here and you just need to survive long enough to deploy it. Most burn decks are dropping green/destructively revelry which is great news for us.
Affinity:
-2 Thoughtseize
-3 Inquisition of Kozelik (Keep on the play)
-1 Nihil Spellbomb
-1 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
+1 Pithing Needle
+2 Abrupt Decay
+2 Fatal Push (Not on the play)
+1 Welding Jar (Not on the play)
+1 Damnation
Thopter/Sword is very good here but sideboard ancient grudge is terrifying when backed by a fast clock. Aggressively play planeswalkers as fogs while setting up the combo. Always needle Cranial Plating.
Jeskai Control:
-1 Welding Jar
-3 Talisman of Dominance
-1 Ensnaring Bridge
+3 Abrupt Decay
+1 Padeem, Consul of Innovation
+1 Spellskite
Super favorable matchup before and after side boarding. Thopter/Sword is nearly unbeatable for them.
Eldrazi Tron:
-3 Inquisition of Kozelik
-1 Thopter Foundry
-1 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
+2 Fatal Push
+2 Damnation
+1 Pithing Needle
Much better match up then Gx Tron but your Pithing Needles will be working overtime. Combo quickly and lock them down with Ensnaring Bridge.
Bogles:
-3 Inquisition of Kozelik
-2 Thoughtseize
-1 Expedition Map
-1 Nihil Spellbomb
+3 Abrupt Decay
+2 Damnation
+1 Welding Jar
+1 Spellskite
They can’t beat ensnaring bridge. Full stop. Protect it as much as possible and get it as quickly as possible.
UW Control:
-1 Ensnaring Bridge
-1 Welding Jar
-1 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
-3 Talisman of Dominance
+1 Padeem, Consul of Innovation
+1 Spellskite
+3 Abrupt Decay
+1 Pithing Needle
Slightly worse than Jeskai control. Keep the planeswalkers at bay and be weary of Detention Sphere effects. Grind them out with thopter/sword.
Grixis Deaths Shadow:
-3 Inquisition of Kozelik
-2 Thoughtseize
-1 Expedition Map
-1 Pithing Needle
-3 Talisman of Dominance
+1 Padeem, Consul of Innovation
+1 Spellskite
+2 Fatal Push
+2 Collective Brutality
+2 Damnation
+1 Grafdigger’s Cage
+1 Welding Jar
Probably the biggest transformation. Snapcaster Mage/KCommand can be brutal. Defend Ensnaring Bridge as much as possible and grind them down afterwards.
Storm:
-1 Ensnaring Bridge
-1 Expedition Map
-1 Pithing Needle
-1 Sword of the Meek
-2 Thopter Foundry
-1 Welding Jar
-2 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
+1 Spellskite
+2 Abrupt Decay
+2 Fatal Push
+2 Collective Brutality
+1 Grafdigger’s Cage
+1 Witchbane Orb
This matchup and dredge are the reason for the main deck Nihil Spellbomb. Easy against a storm pilot unfamiliar with our kit. Try to use Whir of invention reactively to lock out Empty the Warrens, Past in Flames, or Grapeshot.
Dredge:
-3 Inquisition of Kozelik
-2 Thoughtseize
-1 Pithing Needle
-2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
-1 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
+1 Padeem, Consul of Innovation
+1 Spellskite
+2 Collective Brutality
+2 Damnation
+1 Grafdigger’s Cage
+1 Welding Jar
+1 Witchbane Orb
A lot of weak cards in game 1. Try to sideboard into a way to beat Ancient Grudge on Ensnaring Bridge and Conflagrate.
I sort of just threw this together, so if anyone is interested in a more in depth side boarding guide I could put one together.
Sultai Midrange
Anything Innovative
4 Darkslick Shores
4 Polluted Delta
2 Flooded Strand
3 Watery Grave
2 Breeding Pool
1 Spire of Industry
1 Academy Ruins
1 Inventor's Fair
1 Ghost Quarter
2 Island
Spells:
4 Whir of Invention
1 Krark-Clan Ironworks
4 Thopter Foundry
3 Sword of the Meek
3 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Crucible of Worlds
3 Pentad Prism
1 Collective Brutality
1 Fatal Push
1 Grafdigger's cage
1 Relic of Progenitus
1 Expedition Map
2 Pithing Needle
3 Serum Visions
3 Mox Opal
3 Mishra's Bauble
3 Welding Jar
1 Search for Azcanta
2 Ghost Quarter
2 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
1 Bottled Cloister
1 Liliana of the Veil
3 Abrupt Decay
1 Collective Brutality
2 Fatal Push
2 Spellskite
1 Padeem, Consul of Innovation
This list is a little tuned towards my shop's metagame. I board out the artifact mana against kataki/stony silence to turn into a UB control deck so the 2 lands is a necessary evil in the SB. Spellskite is excellent against Jund, play them. Tron is still tough, hurry up Dominaria! I'm like 15-4 in my last 4 modern events so it's working. SFA is really strong, I would keep a 2nd in the board if I had more planeswalkers/alternative win-cons.
Bogles
Pithing Needle should be a consideration against Boggles because a) a lot of decks play sideboard seal of primordium, which is one of the few cards you care about after deploying a bridge, and b) keeps the density of 0-1 mana artifacts high to turn on early mox opals to get under/deploy bridge as early as possible.
Burn
Needle should also be a consideration as a 1-of against burn opponents that have grim lavamancer, as they will often apply early pressure and get you within a single-digit life total, and one of the few outs they could have is an unanswered lavamancer (especially if you play brutality/fatal push and have to use them on other creatures early to hold them at bay). Again, not a card you NEED to keep in, but something you should bear in mind.
Storm
If you see shattering spree instead of shatterstorm game 2, I'd consider bringing welding jars back in. If you're playing the heavier planeswalker build, I also like cutting Jace and keeping a high density of Tez, as the 5/5 beatdown plan is particularly good against them. I get that the fateseal ability can be useful against them, but I personally just like to have a focused plan of attack and try to maximize my ability to deploy my strategy as consistently as possible (rather than split the difference) - but to each their own. TBH though, I really don't think Jace should be in this deck at all, as Tez 4 is a bit too much sometimes, and Tez 4 is better than Jace 1-2.
Also, many of you might already be aware of this, but if you can manage to whir for Witchbane Orb in response to a Gifts Ungiven, you'll effectively counter it (as an avid gifts player, Leyline of Sanctity can be a huge pain - this line is similar) and can make a huge difference from seemingly out of nowhere.
As for the Mox Opals, you could just play different mana rocks or other cheap spells in the Mox slots, however cards like prism/talisman just aren't the same. I really think this deck should be playing no less than 3-4 Mox Opals.
Not enough data to say confidently, but I swapped a bauble for it which I think is minimal impact to the deck. Jar is just so important against all the Kolaghan's and Rec/qasali's I'm seeing that I think the upside is worth it. I don't want to waste a SB slot on a 3rd.
Thopter foundry (and Tezz) are blue cards. So is Time Sieve.
The black cards aren't absolutely vital to making the deck function (although they are very good).
We are trying to empty our hand for Ensnaring bridge.
Our two Planeswalkers of choice offer absurd card advantage.
Should Disrupting Shoal be a consideration? I'm particularly interested in the idea given that we have a glut of 2 drops, and the most powerful hate cards against us are Stony and Ancient Grudge. In many games card advantage is literally useless compared to defending the combo and using mana to make more thopters.
4 Mishra's Bauble
4 Mox Opal
1 Welding Jar
1 Pithing Needle
1 Grafdigger's Cage
3 Expedition Map
1 Nihil Spellbomb
4 Thopter Foundry
3 Sword of the Meek
1 Crucible of Worlds
3 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Witchbane Orb
Other Spells: 12
2 Repeal
1 Collective Brutality
3 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
2 Thoughtcast
4 Whir of Invention
3 Darksteel Citadel
1 Inventors' Fair
1 Academy Ruins
3 Ghost Quarter
1 Field of Ruin
3 Darkslick Shores
3 Island
1 Swamp
1 Glimmervoid
4 Spire of Industry
1 Fragmentize
2 Lingering Souls
2 Echoing Truth
2 Padeem, Consul of Innovation
1 Damnation
2 Battle at the Bridge
1 Pithing Needle
1 Sorcerous Spyglass
1 Spellskite
2 Defense Grid
The maps/utility land package didn't really help or hurt in these matches. I didn't get color screwed, but I also wasn't attacking the opponents' landbase that hard. Oftentimes, I was just glad of all the low-cost artifacts to help get opal and thoughtcast online.
A few notes/changes:
I threw the two repeals in a few leagues ago because I wanted a cantrip with a little board interaction. Early game, they can bounce things like hierarchs, confidants, utopia sprawls, and aether vials for a huge tempo boost. Late game they are at worst a "free" cantrip with mox opal. They give the deck some pre-boarded extra oomph against SB hate permanents. I wouldn't play them in a non-4 opal build, though. In my matches, they were very useful against GR eldrazi. I bounced hierarchs and signets to delay TKS in time for me to drop bridges/combo.
After getting wrecked by burn every match, I made room in the board for 2 battle at the bridges. They were useful against GR eldrazi to help stabilize. Might find room for a third.
I have yet to resolve a defense grid. It's very frustrating, because I can't get a feel for whether or not the card is worth its SB space. I guess it eats a spell snare that would go toward foundry. What are others' experiences with defense grid? Good/not good?
Padeem and Skite are SB all-stars. I was a little dubious about spellskite (versus, like, another jar or padeem), but it did such work in the blue moon and grixis control matches.