Talking about spoiled, there is one interesting one in the Ixalan leaks: Bishop of Rebirth is basically a mini-Sun Titan at 5-cmc, I don't know if it is good enough but it is rather promising.
Looking over the deck I notice that Bladesplicer + Gideon package taking up five cards in the main, this means the deck value's aggression over card advantage / selection. Honestly this reminds me of an amalgamation of Mono-W with a standard U/W build.
Also since basically the exact same build placed with so little time between the two, can we assume that this is the optimal build of Emeria in the current meta?
Ps. Schuppius, I'm glad you're enjoying a GW build. A card to consider is Engineerined Explosives for the sideboard. Anyways, how is the deck playing in your opinion?
I ran the Blue/White version of this deck at a local modern tournament for the first time ever. I normally play this deck in a casual setting and in multiplayer games with friends.
Emeria only went off once, and I still lost in that game. The meta was burn heavy, and Lone Missionary kept me alive for a while, but I only ended up winning 1 match against a blue/red burn variant. It really wasn't that fun, and I don't feel like the deck performs very well against the top tier ***** I was running into at the tournament. The meta here is super amounts of removal and burn. My deck felt clunky and slow, and nobody there seemed too impressed by the "stall and wait until i have 7 plains" strategy that I normally employ. My graveyard got destroyed by a scavenging ooze once, and.. got completely owned by a deck running 4 Liliana of the Veil with lingering souls (Each of us discards 2 cards, oh well I guess I'll discard Lingering souls and then cast it with it's flashback, lol)
Anyways, I felt like a little kid with a casual deck playing against these super competitive guys. Thoughts on how to make the build better in tournament environment? My deck is basically the deck featured on primer, with Lone Missionary in lieu of the Inquisitor Exarch.
Thank you! I'll see about making some changes. I'd feel kind of naked without my Negates in the main board honestly. I do already have one Gideon of the Trials in the deck and I am never sad about drawing that card, so i could see adding another one of those.
I have 3 spreading seas in my sideboard, but would definitely consider main decking them - what kind of matchups is spreading seas best against? It is really just used to mess up the enemy's mana base right? So any deck that doesn't run blue would be hindered by it, right?
Any specific recommendations for burn and lots of removal?
Spreading Seas is good against any deck with a greedy (3-4C) manabase and Eldrazi/Tron decks, can also hit powerful creature lands like Inkmoth Nexus in "Affinity" or Mutavault in "Merfolk"
(though this an almost an auto-lose matchup as you can't block and need to wrath asap to even stand a chance).
I've been thinking about the GW version lately and wonder if Cast Out can be a better option than Beast Within in the deck in the slot which Detention Sphere occupies in U/W.
Both cards have no synergy with Sun Titan but I don't think that it makes Oblivion Ring/Banishing Light a better maindeck option
(though I'd play 1-2x copies in the SB).
I'm not sure that CoCo is the right card for the deck though it is admitedly a powerful card, especially with Eternal Witness (which I eventually dropped on my version).
In my deck I like the Oath of Nissa + Renegade Rallier package for grinding value, ramping or finding the right threats/lands.
I'm running a fairly similar list here that I've been having some success with, I've shaken it up a bit recently so it's not perfect (1 blessed in main feels weird, might drop it for a 4th hussar.)
Now my meta is incredibly diverse and I don't see burn too often, but Lone missionary usually doesn't do it for me in jeskai and I'd cut it to 2 of maybe.
Also consider that you have 12 flicker effects (cat. Wisp, Saheeli) and it's worth trimming the numbers on them unless you want to be stuck with a lot of flicker effects and no payoff (it won't always happen, but it feels bad when it does).
The deck now has a quick combo Wincon and doesn't always need to grind - for this reason you can drop to 2 emerias - in the drawn out games where you need it, you will find it.
Finally, court hussar is an excellent card in UW and even better in Jeskai - it lets us dig for combo pieces! They make the deck much more consistent in my opinion.
I took a slightly different list (a couple different sideboard cards) to a cash tournament where I knew what the other 15 were playing and ended up 5th/16, report here:
Round 1: burn
Game 1:
I was on the draw. I thought this guy was on skred so I took a slower hand. Got destroyed by lightning bolts, lava spikes and a grim lavamancer, got Saheeli bolted mid combo fizzling my attempts to go off.
Games 2 & 3 involved muliganing for SB Leylines, and a combination of walls, Lone missionaries and removal kept my life total out of the red zone until I could combo off.
Round 2: storm
Game 1:
I was on the draw. Pathed his electromancers and barals which felt bad because I was giving him mana. He eventually stormed off and the single negate in my hand could not do much.
Game 2:
Muliganed to 6 for a Leyline again, felt good keeping a hand with Leyline, Saheeli, guardian and 2 lands. Turn 3 I got a Saheeli down however on turn 4 it died to electromancer beats when I didn't make a 4th land drop for my guardian. An echoing truth dealt with my Leyline and the storm player took the round 2-0.
Round 3: Bogles
Game 1:
I was on the play. We both Muliganed to 6. An early spreading seas slowed the bogles player down a bit and a turn 4 Supreme verdict dealt with a suited up Bogle. He didn't see any other creatures after that and I combo'd off pretty easily.
Game 2:
Bogles player took another Muligan and I kept my 7 because it had a blessed alliance, spreading seas, Saheeli, 3 lands and a verdict. He dropped a fairly suited up Bogle but a turn 3 blessed alliance dealt with it. He then dropped another Bogle and a kor spiritwalker, but the lack of totem armor meant that Supreme verdict cleared the board and he didnt see any more creatures. After that I drew into a flickerwisp with Saheeli on board, and closed out the game with wisp beats copied by Saheeli.
Round 4: Esper control
Game 1: I was on the draw. Acombination of disruption of my combo and a secure the wastes for 5 ended this game pretty quick in my opponents favour.
Game 2: my opponent took a Muligan while I had a hand with Saheeli and Felidar. Curved the combo out and the esper player had no answer.
Game 3: this was really long and drawn out, I got the Saheelis to stick, however my Felidars and sun titans ate paths, and was able to dig pretty hard by copying court hussars and the like. Constant pinging by saheeli brought the esper player to 1 life before we drew, however I noticed too late if I had copied wall to draw on the final turn instead of scry and ping, I would have hit a Bolt and ended it.
Overall I went 2-1-1
I've been considering bolts vs paths for removal - some of our bad matchups (elves, storm) would much prefer to have their creatures eat paths than bolts
Also, what do people think of devout lightcaster? Seems like a perfect sideboard card for us against Deaths shadow.
Oath of Nissa is pretty much GW's replacement to Court Hussar for card selection.
It is even better in this deck imho because:
It comes down on turn 1 (I have no other turn 1 plays), can be repeatedly flickered with Flickerwisp (unlike Court Hussar) and recurred
with Renegade Rallier (after I legend rule the first one).
It can also help find Nissa (or Elspeth) in longer games.
I find the Wraths really important right now as some matchups are really hard without them (Merfolk, Affinity, Eldrazi, Knightfall) and they are some of the best cards in the deck.
I don't really see the need for Gavony Township in the deck as I don't go very wide (STE and Wall are actually irrelevant in combat) and the land slots are very tight in the deck (also Ghost Quarter is better here imho).
Another card I haven't tried yet but could be very good in the deck is Evolutionary Leap, it can provide a steady source of CA and outgrind any other deck.
I can vouch for Evolutionary Leap, back when I was playing GW Emeria it single handidly turned games around. It should be amazing against Death Shadow.
Also Gideon of the Trials finally proved his worth to me yesterday as I was played against Lantern Control. Every avenue of victory was shut off. Over the course of the game Gideon of the Trials got Inquisitioned twice and Abrupt Decayed once. Leyline of Sanctity meant Mortipod was no longer an obvious out, a Bridge was in play, and both Eldrazi Displacer and Ghost Quarter both got named by Pithing Needle. Flickerwisp was hit by a MD Lost Legacy because of its potential to hit Ensnaring Bridge. Restoration Angel ate Surgical Extraction after a few tricky Emeria triggers. I had hope though and it paid off. I had no cards in Library but Gideon was in play with an Emblem, Emeria was online, and Sun Titan was recurring Tectonic Edge. I managed to keep him off the five lands and colors needed to buy back the Abrupt Decay with Codex Shredder which would have destroyed Gideon during upkeep after Emeria triggers. Tectonic Edge also took care of Academy Ruins and I decked the Lantern Control player with ten minutes left in the round! Second most grindy matchup I ever played against.
I think the overall lesson for me from this, is to never give up if you still have a slight chance of winning.
How did you use S.Titan's ability under E.Bridge ?
Did you sac' it to Mortarpod (which needs targets, especially with Leyline on board) to recurr it with Emeria every turn ?
Yup, exactly that. I had my two Titans on the field and to play around another Surgical Extraction I would only sacrifice one per turn to Mortipod. I always redirected the damage to Wall of Omens because of the Leyline.
Hey sorry so late to the party but this is my list. I had a friend send me the GP list on a thursday night and 36 hours later I decided to play it at this IQ having never played any emeria/titan deck. I picked it up quickly after a some rough learnings at FNM (went 2-3) but stuck with it and ended up going undefeated in swiss at the 60+ person IQ (4-0 then ID the last two rounds). We split top 4 but played it out for the points and I ended up losing a very close game 3 to Jody Keith (top 4 GP Vegas Legacy and undefeated day one of Modern with the same deck he beat me with). I attribute this loss mostly to a poor sideboard, brought in grafdiggers cage and it did more harm than good.
Looking over the deck I notice that Bladesplicer + Gideon package taking up five cards in the main, this means the deck value's aggression over card advantage / selection. Honestly this reminds me of an amalgamation of Mono-W with a standard U/W build.
Also since basically the exact same build placed with so little time between the two, can we assume that this is the optimal build of Emeria in the current meta?
Ps. Schuppius, I'm glad you're enjoying a GW build. A card to consider is Engineerined Explosives for the sideboard. Anyways, how is the deck playing in your opinion?
I would very much agree with this statement, the build I have played is geared very much towards beating the top tier decks. Most of my losses have come at the hands of more fringe type decks. I played it GP Vegas and started 4-0 until I lost with a bad mull to 5 then barely missed day 2 because the losing bracket had significantly worse match ups.
Having played the deck first then read these forums I honestly cannot understand everyone'e infatuation with court hussar. I think it's terrible. Its slow, doesn't block well in the current format, and is a terrible flickerwisp/sun titan/emeria target. If you build enough redundancy (which you should because there are a lot of thoughtseizes running around) then card selection isn't what you need, card draw does just fine. Playing a turn two spreading seas into a turn three flickerwhisp is night and day better than a turn three husar. I must say the best three cards in the deck are by far spreading seas, flickerwisp and Gideon. So much so that I would consider running a 3rd Gideon and added the Resto as a 4th flickerwisp.
My game plan is usually to use spreading seas and wall of omens to slow the opponent down while making all my land drops until I land a turn 5 or 6 sun titan and ghost quarter lock them out of the game. I would probably say I target ghost quarter with titan around 75% of the time I can unless it is with the first trigger then I always get back flickerwisp.
You'll notice the main board is mostly the same, but the SB drastically different. RIP and cage were terrible, and I think crypt does just fine with fewer slots. Ive gone back and forth between the negates and leylines. I think I like the negates a little better as they help combo match ups but the leylines really help against midrange and death shadow decks, it's probably a meta call. I have been able to beat burn many times without ever drawing a leyline as they just cant beat lone missionary + Gideon. If you plus Gideon as soon as he comes down then make an emblem the next turn he is going to at the very least absorb 2 bolts. Also, rune halo is great. Round 1 of the IQ I faced goryo's vengance with no negates and thought I was toast. Game 2 op had a turn 3 emrakul and a turn 5 grisselbrand and game 4 he put in 2 emrakuls and 2 grisselbrands and I still managed to win both games.
I would love to hear your thoughts and the list more as well as provide insight on the choices as I know this version is drastically different from what most people run. And apologies is the post looks or reads poorly, this is my first time posting on here, I created and account just to share this and help provide some insight and experiences.
Sunscourge Champion looks potentially playable, 2 life upon EtB and the eternalize cost isn't too high for a 4/4 that gains 4 life.
There is also Champion of Wits but it doesn't seem that good, Court Hussar is still better imho.
A very bad match-up for the deck is "UB Mill" but I've found that Wheel of Sun and Moon single-handedly beats this deck
(if they don't Surgical it).
I'm confused, many archtypes on your list I have had overwhelming success against. Specifically any Grixis vartients be it Delver/Shadow/Control and D&T. I was under the impression those were great matchups. Just yesterday even, I played Grixis Delver followed by two Grixis control vartients at my LGS and won all three no trouble. Against the one player they even resolved four AV and a total of seven Cryptic Commands off Snapcaster and still lost. Sorry just would like to know your thought process.
@D90Dennis14
If you're worried about Mill just play Gideon of the Trials. The Emblem is gamebreaking and you'll either draw it before you mill out, draw a Sun Titan to reanimate it or Emeria will come online which will bring back S-Titan which will bring back Gideon. Their only meaningful interaction with your graveyard MB is Crypt Incurrsion, which only eats creatures.
@D90Dennis14
If you're worried about Mill just play Gideon of the Trials. The Emblem is gamebreaking and you'll either draw it before you mill out, draw a Sun Titan to reanimate it or Emeria will come online which will bring back S-Titan which will bring back Gideon. Their only meaningful interaction with your graveyard MB is Crypt Incurrsion, which only eats creatures.
I definetly plan to get them, they really help against some of the spell-heavy combo decks and random decks like UB Mill.
Meanwhile I have Kitchen Finks as placeholders in the deck.
Hey sorry so late to the party but this is my list. I had a friend send me the GP list on a thursday night and 36 hours later I decided to play it at this IQ having never played any emeria/titan deck. I picked it up quickly after a some rough learnings at FNM (went 2-3) but stuck with it and ended up going undefeated in swiss at the 60+ person IQ (4-0 then ID the last two rounds). We split top 4 but played it out for the points and I ended up losing a very close game 3 to Jody Keith (top 4 GP Vegas Legacy and undefeated day one of Modern with the same deck he beat me with). I attribute this loss mostly to a poor sideboard, brought in grafdiggers cage and it did more harm than good.
Having played the deck first then read these forums I honestly cannot understand everyone'e infatuation with court hussar. I think it's terrible. Its slow, doesn't block well in the current format, and is a terrible flickerwisp/sun titan/emeria target. If you build enough redundancy (which you should because there are a lot of thoughtseizes running around) then card selection isn't what you need, card draw does just fine. Playing a turn two spreading seas into a turn three flickerwhisp is night and day better than a turn three husar. I must say the best three cards in the deck are by far spreading seas, flickerwisp and Gideon. So much so that I would consider running a 3rd Gideon and added the Resto as a 4th flickerwisp.
My game plan is usually to use spreading seas and wall of omens to slow the opponent down while making all my land drops until I land a turn 5 or 6 sun titan and ghost quarter lock them out of the game. I would probably say I target ghost quarter with titan around 75% of the time I can unless it is with the first trigger then I always get back flickerwisp.
You'll notice the main board is mostly the same, but the SB drastically different. RIP and cage were terrible, and I think crypt does just fine with fewer slots. Ive gone back and forth between the negates and leylines. I think I like the negates a little better as they help combo match ups but the leylines really help against midrange and death shadow decks, it's probably a meta call. I have been able to beat burn many times without ever drawing a leyline as they just cant beat lone missionary + Gideon. If you plus Gideon as soon as he comes down then make an emblem the next turn he is going to at the very least absorb 2 bolts. Also, rune halo is great. Round 1 of the IQ I faced goryo's vengance with no negates and thought I was toast. Game 2 op had a turn 3 emrakul and a turn 5 grisselbrand and game 4 he put in 2 emrakuls and 2 grisselbrands and I still managed to win both games.
I would love to hear your thoughts and the list more as well as provide insight on the choices as I know this version is drastically different from what most people run. And apologies is the post looks or reads poorly, this is my first time posting on here, I created and account just to share this and help provide some insight and experiences.
#I don't agree with your assessment of Court Hussar, the card offers much needed card selection/digging to the deck whether you are looking for a removal spell (a sweeper) or Emeria/Sun Titan (or land drops) to start the value engine.
It becomes a free Anticipate with Sun Titan/Emeria and will overwhelm opponents with CA (unless you are too far behind).
I would play it over Blade Splicer which I find mediocre in the deck (Gideon is better as the "beatdown" option in the deck).
#Also why play Resto "as the 4th Flickerwisp" ?
Just play the 4th Flickerwisp, it is one of the best creatures in the deck (if not the best one).
#I don't find Crucible of Worlds particularly necessary here as you have Sun Titan to recycle lands.
As a 1x-of I really like Phantasmal Image in this deck, it is very good for copying any of the value creatures or opponents fatties and quickly gets in the GY where it can be reccured to copy Sun Titan.
In the SB:
#What is Autiok Champion for ? You mentioned that the Burn match-up is already good and there are Wraths/D.Spheres for go wide aggro decks.
#I don't think that Surgical Extraction is great in this deck, without discard (or more than just 2x Negate) you either need to rely on opponents to cast their key spells to extract them or to GQ+Surgical which is not necessary with 4x Spreading Seas in the deck already imho.
I'd rather add a 3rd Tormod's Crypt and a copy of Wheel of Sun and Moon or 2x more Negates.
Before I go into commenting on your card choices I would like to hear some informations: How's irrigated Farmland? It's ok only with crucible or worth it's spot even without it? Blade Splicer able to stop the big goyfs and shadows on it's own? I tried it, but it never felt that great (maybe I prefer another style of play).
Farmland is a great one of. While I see the synergy it could have with crucible Ive never used any of it. Both are one ofs and the situations where you would want to abuse one with the other will almost never come up and be the best line of play simultaneously. Its mostly a nice way to help you if you flood out. If I have a land light hand I will fetch it first so I'm not punished by an etb tapped land. If i have a land heavy hand I wont so if I draw it late game I can cycle it. Any more than the one though and I think you'll run into the issue of needing an untapped land on turn 3 for a flickerwisp or to draw into your 6th land for titan and that being all you see. I think the only other deck that plays is is UW control, so if you fetch it one turn 1 sometimes people play a lot differently expecting lots of counter magic.
On the subject of lands, the island is terrible. I hate it. I have found myself multiple times with 8 lands in play and that damn thing being all that stops me from recurring the titan that I just had die. Alas, blood moon is a card that sees enough play it is necessary, especially since our best answers to it are blue.
Splicer is also amazing. At its worst it gives you two chump blockers for the price of one. With a single flicker you now have 2 tokens that can block almost anything and not die. While it can be a nice beater, I mostly just us them to slow the game down and buy time until I can land a titan.
#I don't agree with your assessment of Court Hussar, the card offers much needed card selection/digging to the deck whether you are looking for a removal spell (a sweeper) or Emeria/Sun Titan (or land drops) to start the value engine.
It becomes a free Anticipate with Sun Titan/Emeria and will overwhelm opponents with CA (unless you are too far behind).
I would play it over Blade Splicer which I find mediocre in the deck (Gideon is better as the "beatdown" option in the deck).
#Also why play Resto "as the 4th Flickerwisp" ?
Just play the 4th Flickerwisp, it is one of the best creatures in the deck (if not the best one).
#I don't find Crucible of Worlds particularly necessary here as you have Sun Titan to recycle lands.
As a 1x-of I really like Phantasmal Image in this deck, it is very good for copying any of the value creatures or opponents fatties and quickly gets in the GY where it can be reccured to copy Sun Titan.
In the SB:
#What is Autiok Champion for ? You mentioned that the Burn match-up is already good and there are Wraths/D.Spheres for go wide aggro decks.
#I don't think that Surgical Extraction is great in this deck, without discard (or more than just 2x Negate) you either need to rely on opponents to cast their key spells to extract them or to GQ+Surgical which is no necessary with 4x Spreading Seas in the deck already imho.
I'd rather add a 3rd Tormod's Crypt and a copy of Wheel of Sun and Moon or 2x more Negates.
In regards to to the hussar, your definitely entitled to your opinion but like I've said, I tried it and hated it. If i want cards I'll play or flicker one of the 8 cards that do me that. If i want a blocker I'll play or flicker something that can chump twice. by running so many 3 and 4 ofs any time I have found myself in the position where I absolutely need something I usually get it with the card draw I have. If i reallllly wanted some way to offer card selection I would just play serum visions. 3 mana I just too much for this effect in a deck that already plays some amazing 3 drops. If it was a 2 drop I would play 4 in a heartbeat. I've found if there is something you just absolutely need to find, just play more of those in the deck (such as 3 main deck sweepers and the 4th in the side). If you have done any hard digging into Natan Forslin's lists other than his GP list, you will see he also tried it out and moved off from it. And if you really are attacking with a sun titan and needing an anticipate effect you are either so far ahead it should matter what you get back or so far behind one card a turn won't save you.
My apologies, the Resto is the *5th* flicker wisp. Image is a good idea and I may try it out, I just think I like resto a little better as it is good without having anything on the field. It is also an all star vs any control deck as it is just so strong to be able to bait a counter on their end step so you can untap and jam a titan or elspeth (another all star IMO, well worth the single slot).
Crucible is at its best when you are using it before you play a titan. Lets be real, if you get to 6 mana and stick a titan you have most likely already won the game. I have won multiple games by going turn 2 spreading seas, turn 3 spreading seas, ghost quarter. Cutting your opponent off of a color I have found is the best path to victory in almost any matchup. Crucible just makes this line even more punishing. On this subject, pay attention to how your opponents scry. I have found people will sometime refuse to search for a basic if the go top-top with a serum visions. I get very aggressive with Ghost Quarters, Paths, and Surgicals when my opponent has missed crucial land drops or is behind on board and they scry cards to the top. Is crucible necesarry? Probably not but there are those times its just sooooo good I think its worth the single slot.
Ariok Champion is at it's best vs jund and especially grixis. None of their removal can kill it and it can block most or all of their worst threats infinitely. I see your 10/10 death's shadow and raise you my 1/1 protection from everything in your deck.
Surgical is medium at best, I agree. The original List ran it along with 2each grafdiggers cage and rest in peace (cards I found to be terrible). Maybe extra crypts are correct, but I just like a little versatility. If they have an answer for one they may not have one for another. Surgical is at its best vs dredge because if you can snag their bloodgasts or narcomebas they have a real tough time getting anything out of the yard in a timely manner. Wheel does seem interesting, I honestly didn't know it was a card until now.
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Sunset Pyramid seems really weak, I'm not sure I'd even play it over Mind Stone or Thraben Inspector.
Talking about spoiled, there is one interesting one in the Ixalan leaks:
Bishop of Rebirth is basically a mini-Sun Titan at 5-cmc, I don't know if it is good enough but it is rather promising.
Almost identiacal to the GP list (with a basic Island at least)) and no Court Hussar.
Also since basically the exact same build placed with so little time between the two, can we assume that this is the optimal build of Emeria in the current meta?
Ps. Schuppius, I'm glad you're enjoying a GW build. A card to consider is Engineerined Explosives for the sideboard. Anyways, how is the deck playing in your opinion?
Emeria only went off once, and I still lost in that game. The meta was burn heavy, and Lone Missionary kept me alive for a while, but I only ended up winning 1 match against a blue/red burn variant. It really wasn't that fun, and I don't feel like the deck performs very well against the top tier ***** I was running into at the tournament. The meta here is super amounts of removal and burn. My deck felt clunky and slow, and nobody there seemed too impressed by the "stall and wait until i have 7 plains" strategy that I normally employ. My graveyard got destroyed by a scavenging ooze once, and.. got completely owned by a deck running 4 Liliana of the Veil with lingering souls (Each of us discards 2 cards, oh well I guess I'll discard Lingering souls and then cast it with it's flashback, lol)
Anyways, I felt like a little kid with a casual deck playing against these super competitive guys. Thoughts on how to make the build better in tournament environment? My deck is basically the deck featured on primer, with Lone Missionary in lieu of the Inquisitor Exarch.
Thanks in advance!
If I'd play a U/W list now it would probably look like this:
4x Wall of Omens
3x Lone Missionary
1x Phantasmal Image
4x Flickerwisp
3x Court Hussar
4x Sun Titan
Planeswalker (3)
2x Gideon of the Trials
1x Gideon Jura
Enchantment (7)
4x Spreading Seas
3x Detention Sphere
4x Path to Exile
Sorcery (3)
3x Supreme Verdict
Land (24)
3x Emeria, the Sky Ruin
3x Ghost Quarter
4x Flooded Strand
4x Hallowed Fountain
3x Prairie Stream
6x Plains
1x Island
4x Negate
1x Elspeth, Sun's Champion
3x Tormod's Crypt
1x Eidolon of Rhetoric
1x Wheel of Sun and Moon
2x Stony Silence
1x Detention Sphere
1x Pithing Needle
1x Supreme Verdict
I have 3 spreading seas in my sideboard, but would definitely consider main decking them - what kind of matchups is spreading seas best against? It is really just used to mess up the enemy's mana base right? So any deck that doesn't run blue would be hindered by it, right?
Any specific recommendations for burn and lots of removal?
Blessed Alliance, Kitchen Finks or Timely Reinforcements.
Spreading Seas is good against any deck with a greedy (3-4C) manabase and Eldrazi/Tron decks, can also hit powerful creature lands like Inkmoth Nexus in "Affinity" or Mutavault in "Merfolk"
(though this an almost an auto-lose matchup as you can't block and need to wrath asap to even stand a chance).
Kitchen Finks and Gideon are good against removal heavy decks.
Dragonlord Ojutai can be an option in the flex-slot (where I have Gideon Jura).
Beast Within can hit lands and costs less mana but Cast Out can be cycled when it isn't relevant and can switch targets with Flickerwisp
(while avoiding Abrupt Decay which hits Oblivion Ring and having flash).
Both cards have no synergy with Sun Titan but I don't think that it makes Oblivion Ring/Banishing Light a better maindeck option
(though I'd play 1-2x copies in the SB).
I'm not sure that CoCo is the right card for the deck though it is admitedly a powerful card, especially with Eternal Witness (which I eventually dropped on my version).
In my deck I like the Oath of Nissa + Renegade Rallier package for grinding value, ramping or finding the right threats/lands.
Here is my list:
4x Sakura-Tribe Elder
4x Wall of Omens
4x Flickerwisp
4x Kitchen Finks
3x Renegade Rallier
4x Sun Titan
Enchantment (3)
3x Oath of Nissa
Planeswalker (1)
1x Nissa, Vital Force
Instant (7)
4x Path to Exile
3x Beast Within
3x Wrath of God
Lands (23)
3x Emeria, the Sky Ruin
4x Windswept Heath
2x Flooded Strand
4x Temple Garden
1x Canopy Vista
3x Ghost Quarter
5x Plains
1x Forest
2x Qasali Pridemage
2x Scavenging Ooze
2x Tormod's Crypt
2x Stony Silence
2x Banishing Light
2x Blessed Alliance
1x Wrath of God
1x Nissa, Vital Force
1x Elspeth, Sun's Champion
Now my meta is incredibly diverse and I don't see burn too often, but Lone missionary usually doesn't do it for me in jeskai and I'd cut it to 2 of maybe.
Also consider that you have 12 flicker effects (cat. Wisp, Saheeli) and it's worth trimming the numbers on them unless you want to be stuck with a lot of flicker effects and no payoff (it won't always happen, but it feels bad when it does).
The deck now has a quick combo Wincon and doesn't always need to grind - for this reason you can drop to 2 emerias - in the drawn out games where you need it, you will find it.
Finally, court hussar is an excellent card in UW and even better in Jeskai - it lets us dig for combo pieces! They make the deck much more consistent in my opinion.
I took a slightly different list (a couple different sideboard cards) to a cash tournament where I knew what the other 15 were playing and ended up 5th/16, report here:
Round 1: burn
Game 1:
I was on the draw. I thought this guy was on skred so I took a slower hand. Got destroyed by lightning bolts, lava spikes and a grim lavamancer, got Saheeli bolted mid combo fizzling my attempts to go off.
Games 2 & 3 involved muliganing for SB Leylines, and a combination of walls, Lone missionaries and removal kept my life total out of the red zone until I could combo off.
Round 2: storm
Game 1:
I was on the draw. Pathed his electromancers and barals which felt bad because I was giving him mana. He eventually stormed off and the single negate in my hand could not do much.
Game 2:
Muliganed to 6 for a Leyline again, felt good keeping a hand with Leyline, Saheeli, guardian and 2 lands. Turn 3 I got a Saheeli down however on turn 4 it died to electromancer beats when I didn't make a 4th land drop for my guardian. An echoing truth dealt with my Leyline and the storm player took the round 2-0.
Round 3: Bogles
Game 1:
I was on the play. We both Muliganed to 6. An early spreading seas slowed the bogles player down a bit and a turn 4 Supreme verdict dealt with a suited up Bogle. He didn't see any other creatures after that and I combo'd off pretty easily.
Game 2:
Bogles player took another Muligan and I kept my 7 because it had a blessed alliance, spreading seas, Saheeli, 3 lands and a verdict. He dropped a fairly suited up Bogle but a turn 3 blessed alliance dealt with it. He then dropped another Bogle and a kor spiritwalker, but the lack of totem armor meant that Supreme verdict cleared the board and he didnt see any more creatures. After that I drew into a flickerwisp with Saheeli on board, and closed out the game with wisp beats copied by Saheeli.
Round 4: Esper control
Game 1: I was on the draw. Acombination of disruption of my combo and a secure the wastes for 5 ended this game pretty quick in my opponents favour.
Game 2: my opponent took a Muligan while I had a hand with Saheeli and Felidar. Curved the combo out and the esper player had no answer.
Game 3: this was really long and drawn out, I got the Saheelis to stick, however my Felidars and sun titans ate paths, and was able to dig pretty hard by copying court hussars and the like. Constant pinging by saheeli brought the esper player to 1 life before we drew, however I noticed too late if I had copied wall to draw on the final turn instead of scry and ping, I would have hit a Bolt and ended it.
Overall I went 2-1-1
I've been considering bolts vs paths for removal - some of our bad matchups (elves, storm) would much prefer to have their creatures eat paths than bolts
Also, what do people think of devout lightcaster? Seems like a perfect sideboard card for us against Deaths shadow.
It is even better in this deck imho because:
It comes down on turn 1 (I have no other turn 1 plays), can be repeatedly flickered with Flickerwisp (unlike Court Hussar) and recurred
with Renegade Rallier (after I legend rule the first one).
It can also help find Nissa (or Elspeth) in longer games.
Renegade Rallier does a similar job to Eternal Witness but has better internal synergies (bringing back lands, STE and Oath) and a better body.
Also the GG for Eternal Witness can be an issue sometimes.
I find the Wraths really important right now as some matchups are really hard without them (Merfolk, Affinity, Eldrazi, Knightfall) and they are some of the best cards in the deck.
I don't really see the need for Gavony Township in the deck as I don't go very wide (STE and Wall are actually irrelevant in combat) and the land slots are very tight in the deck (also Ghost Quarter is better here imho).
Another card I haven't tried yet but could be very good in the deck is Evolutionary Leap, it can provide a steady source of CA and outgrind any other deck.
Also Gideon of the Trials finally proved his worth to me yesterday as I was played against Lantern Control. Every avenue of victory was shut off. Over the course of the game Gideon of the Trials got Inquisitioned twice and Abrupt Decayed once. Leyline of Sanctity meant Mortipod was no longer an obvious out, a Bridge was in play, and both Eldrazi Displacer and Ghost Quarter both got named by Pithing Needle. Flickerwisp was hit by a MD Lost Legacy because of its potential to hit Ensnaring Bridge. Restoration Angel ate Surgical Extraction after a few tricky Emeria triggers. I had hope though and it paid off. I had no cards in Library but Gideon was in play with an Emblem, Emeria was online, and Sun Titan was recurring Tectonic Edge. I managed to keep him off the five lands and colors needed to buy back the Abrupt Decay with Codex Shredder which would have destroyed Gideon during upkeep after Emeria triggers. Tectonic Edge also took care of Academy Ruins and I decked the Lantern Control player with ten minutes left in the round! Second most grindy matchup I ever played against.
I think the overall lesson for me from this, is to never give up if you still have a slight chance of winning.
Did you sac' it to Mortarpod (which needs targets, especially with Leyline on board) to recurr it with Emeria every turn ?
Hey sorry so late to the party but this is my list. I had a friend send me the GP list on a thursday night and 36 hours later I decided to play it at this IQ having never played any emeria/titan deck. I picked it up quickly after a some rough learnings at FNM (went 2-3) but stuck with it and ended up going undefeated in swiss at the 60+ person IQ (4-0 then ID the last two rounds). We split top 4 but played it out for the points and I ended up losing a very close game 3 to Jody Keith (top 4 GP Vegas Legacy and undefeated day one of Modern with the same deck he beat me with). I attribute this loss mostly to a poor sideboard, brought in grafdiggers cage and it did more harm than good.
I would very much agree with this statement, the build I have played is geared very much towards beating the top tier decks. Most of my losses have come at the hands of more fringe type decks. I played it GP Vegas and started 4-0 until I lost with a bad mull to 5 then barely missed day 2 because the losing bracket had significantly worse match ups.
Having played the deck first then read these forums I honestly cannot understand everyone'e infatuation with court hussar. I think it's terrible. Its slow, doesn't block well in the current format, and is a terrible flickerwisp/sun titan/emeria target. If you build enough redundancy (which you should because there are a lot of thoughtseizes running around) then card selection isn't what you need, card draw does just fine. Playing a turn two spreading seas into a turn three flickerwhisp is night and day better than a turn three husar. I must say the best three cards in the deck are by far spreading seas, flickerwisp and Gideon. So much so that I would consider running a 3rd Gideon and added the Resto as a 4th flickerwisp.
My game plan is usually to use spreading seas and wall of omens to slow the opponent down while making all my land drops until I land a turn 5 or 6 sun titan and ghost quarter lock them out of the game. I would probably say I target ghost quarter with titan around 75% of the time I can unless it is with the first trigger then I always get back flickerwisp.
Here is a link to what I've been running:
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/uw-emeria-and-taxes/
You'll notice the main board is mostly the same, but the SB drastically different. RIP and cage were terrible, and I think crypt does just fine with fewer slots. Ive gone back and forth between the negates and leylines. I think I like the negates a little better as they help combo match ups but the leylines really help against midrange and death shadow decks, it's probably a meta call. I have been able to beat burn many times without ever drawing a leyline as they just cant beat lone missionary + Gideon. If you plus Gideon as soon as he comes down then make an emblem the next turn he is going to at the very least absorb 2 bolts. Also, rune halo is great. Round 1 of the IQ I faced goryo's vengance with no negates and thought I was toast. Game 2 op had a turn 3 emrakul and a turn 5 grisselbrand and game 4 he put in 2 emrakuls and 2 grisselbrands and I still managed to win both games.
I would love to hear your thoughts and the list more as well as provide insight on the choices as I know this version is drastically different from what most people run. And apologies is the post looks or reads poorly, this is my first time posting on here, I created and account just to share this and help provide some insight and experiences.
There is also Champion of Wits but it doesn't seem that good, Court Hussar is still better imho.
A very bad match-up for the deck is "UB Mill" but I've found that Wheel of Sun and Moon single-handedly beats this deck
(if they don't Surgical it).
Grixis Delver
Death Shadow (both versions)
Tron
Death & Taxes
Living End
Eldrazi Tron
Devoted Druid Combo
Ad Nauseum
These are the most difficult matchups i have found so far
@D90Dennis14
If you're worried about Mill just play Gideon of the Trials. The Emblem is gamebreaking and you'll either draw it before you mill out, draw a Sun Titan to reanimate it or Emeria will come online which will bring back S-Titan which will bring back Gideon. Their only meaningful interaction with your graveyard MB is Crypt Incurrsion, which only eats creatures.
I definetly plan to get them, they really help against some of the spell-heavy combo decks and random decks like UB Mill.
Meanwhile I have Kitchen Finks as placeholders in the deck.
#I don't agree with your assessment of Court Hussar, the card offers much needed card selection/digging to the deck whether you are looking for a removal spell (a sweeper) or Emeria/Sun Titan (or land drops) to start the value engine.
It becomes a free Anticipate with Sun Titan/Emeria and will overwhelm opponents with CA (unless you are too far behind).
I would play it over Blade Splicer which I find mediocre in the deck (Gideon is better as the "beatdown" option in the deck).
#Also why play Resto "as the 4th Flickerwisp" ?
Just play the 4th Flickerwisp, it is one of the best creatures in the deck (if not the best one).
#I don't find Crucible of Worlds particularly necessary here as you have Sun Titan to recycle lands.
As a 1x-of I really like Phantasmal Image in this deck, it is very good for copying any of the value creatures or opponents fatties and quickly gets in the GY where it can be reccured to copy Sun Titan.
In the SB:
#What is Autiok Champion for ? You mentioned that the Burn match-up is already good and there are Wraths/D.Spheres for go wide aggro decks.
#I don't think that Surgical Extraction is great in this deck, without discard (or more than just 2x Negate) you either need to rely on opponents to cast their key spells to extract them or to GQ+Surgical which is not necessary with 4x Spreading Seas in the deck already imho.
I'd rather add a 3rd Tormod's Crypt and a copy of Wheel of Sun and Moon or 2x more Negates.
Farmland is a great one of. While I see the synergy it could have with crucible Ive never used any of it. Both are one ofs and the situations where you would want to abuse one with the other will almost never come up and be the best line of play simultaneously. Its mostly a nice way to help you if you flood out. If I have a land light hand I will fetch it first so I'm not punished by an etb tapped land. If i have a land heavy hand I wont so if I draw it late game I can cycle it. Any more than the one though and I think you'll run into the issue of needing an untapped land on turn 3 for a flickerwisp or to draw into your 6th land for titan and that being all you see. I think the only other deck that plays is is UW control, so if you fetch it one turn 1 sometimes people play a lot differently expecting lots of counter magic.
On the subject of lands, the island is terrible. I hate it. I have found myself multiple times with 8 lands in play and that damn thing being all that stops me from recurring the titan that I just had die. Alas, blood moon is a card that sees enough play it is necessary, especially since our best answers to it are blue.
Splicer is also amazing. At its worst it gives you two chump blockers for the price of one. With a single flicker you now have 2 tokens that can block almost anything and not die. While it can be a nice beater, I mostly just us them to slow the game down and buy time until I can land a titan.
In regards to to the hussar, your definitely entitled to your opinion but like I've said, I tried it and hated it. If i want cards I'll play or flicker one of the 8 cards that do me that. If i want a blocker I'll play or flicker something that can chump twice. by running so many 3 and 4 ofs any time I have found myself in the position where I absolutely need something I usually get it with the card draw I have. If i reallllly wanted some way to offer card selection I would just play serum visions. 3 mana I just too much for this effect in a deck that already plays some amazing 3 drops. If it was a 2 drop I would play 4 in a heartbeat. I've found if there is something you just absolutely need to find, just play more of those in the deck (such as 3 main deck sweepers and the 4th in the side). If you have done any hard digging into Natan Forslin's lists other than his GP list, you will see he also tried it out and moved off from it. And if you really are attacking with a sun titan and needing an anticipate effect you are either so far ahead it should matter what you get back or so far behind one card a turn won't save you.
My apologies, the Resto is the *5th* flicker wisp. Image is a good idea and I may try it out, I just think I like resto a little better as it is good without having anything on the field. It is also an all star vs any control deck as it is just so strong to be able to bait a counter on their end step so you can untap and jam a titan or elspeth (another all star IMO, well worth the single slot).
Crucible is at its best when you are using it before you play a titan. Lets be real, if you get to 6 mana and stick a titan you have most likely already won the game. I have won multiple games by going turn 2 spreading seas, turn 3 spreading seas, ghost quarter. Cutting your opponent off of a color I have found is the best path to victory in almost any matchup. Crucible just makes this line even more punishing. On this subject, pay attention to how your opponents scry. I have found people will sometime refuse to search for a basic if the go top-top with a serum visions. I get very aggressive with Ghost Quarters, Paths, and Surgicals when my opponent has missed crucial land drops or is behind on board and they scry cards to the top. Is crucible necesarry? Probably not but there are those times its just sooooo good I think its worth the single slot.
Ariok Champion is at it's best vs jund and especially grixis. None of their removal can kill it and it can block most or all of their worst threats infinitely. I see your 10/10 death's shadow and raise you my 1/1 protection from everything in your deck.
Surgical is medium at best, I agree. The original List ran it along with 2each grafdiggers cage and rest in peace (cards I found to be terrible). Maybe extra crypts are correct, but I just like a little versatility. If they have an answer for one they may not have one for another. Surgical is at its best vs dredge because if you can snag their bloodgasts or narcomebas they have a real tough time getting anything out of the yard in a timely manner. Wheel does seem interesting, I honestly didn't know it was a card until now.