Thanks tronix and TheAller for taking the time to reply. What you have explained makes a lot of sense, and my biases probably come from playing Blue Moon and (back in the day) Jeskai Geist. I had tried 3x Knot and 2x Remand and liked it a lot for consistently having early interaction with the stack.
It's hard to argue with the success of Nikolich's list, but I personally hate playing less than 4x Bolt, and in this meta, 4x Helix as well. With a removal suite of 4 Bolt/Helix/Path and 2x Surpeme Verdict, and I have been a lot less impressed with Electrolyze. Now, don't get me wrong-- I love me some Electrolyze! But I did find it somewhat redundant (and clunky) with so much other cheap removal + sweepers. How has it been for you? Beyond that, how have you found Secure the Wastes and maindeck Negate? Thanks.
Thanks tronix and TheAller for taking the time to reply. What you have explained makes a lot of sense, and my biases probably come from playing Blue Moon and (back in the day) Jeskai Geist. I had tried 3x Knot and 2x Remand and liked it a lot for consistently having early interaction with the stack.
It's hard to argue with the success of Nikolich's list, but I personally hate playing less than 4x Bolt, and in this meta, 4x Helix as well. With a removal suite of 4 Bolt/Helix/Path and 2x Surpeme Verdict, and I have been a lot less impressed with Electrolyze. Now, don't get me wrong-- I love me some Electrolyze! But I did find it somewhat redundant (and clunky) with so much other cheap removal + sweepers. How has it been for you? Beyond that, how have you found Secure the Wastes and maindeck Negate? Thanks.
You certainly dont need to cling to a 3/3 split on bolts.
I kept my 4/2 with 2 Electrolyze, and never feel bad about it.
Secure is a house main deck, never feels like a bad draw, Negate Main, I dropped.
im still on 4 path/3 bolt/3 helix/1 abrade/1 electrolyze for my spot removal. electrolyze is nice because the floor on the card is quite high, and when it works as a clean 2-for-1 (or 3-for-1) its obviously amazing. it also plays better with 4 bolts. ive been on one copy for the longest time and have been fine with it in basically any and every meta.
ever since adding secure the wastes i havent once considered removing it. not that its some exceptionally good card or anything. its just flexible and does good work on offense and defense.
negate is pretty 'meh'. havent been particularly impressed with it. it makes sense because with so much removal and sweepers its the noncreature spells that we need to worry about more often than not. whether games play out like that is another story. so ill stick with it for the time being, but its on the short list of cards id swap out.
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Modern: UWGSnow-Bant Control BURGrixis Death's Shadow GWBCoCo Elves WCDeath and Taxes (sold)
How do you feel about abrade? I have changed my sideboard to that 15 card approach as well except 2 abrade. Its pretty versatile in the current meta vs affinity, humans, etc
What do you think?
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Modern RUAffinityUR GMono Green StompyG CEldrazi TronC URWJeskai GeistWRU WRBoros BurnRW BRWMardu PyromancerWRB
yeah jeskai still lookin strong. not surprising to see two of the better control players on the scg tour do well with it. rosum fell victim to the jund hype for a while, but i cant fault him for that.
not sure what matchups davis had in mind with his tuning changes. my best guess is the mirror and tron.
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Modern: UWGSnow-Bant Control BURGrixis Death's Shadow GWBCoCo Elves WCDeath and Taxes (sold)
yeah jeskai still lookin strong. not surprising to see two of the better control players on the scg tour do well with it. rosum fell victim to the jund hype for a while, but i cant fault him for that.
not sure what matchups davis had in mind with his tuning changes. my best guess is the mirror and tron.
Yes, Davis is tuned for the mirror and Tron for sure. I actually like it!
But to be honest if you're going to the lengths to put 2 Field of Ruin in the board, wouldn't it just be better to put in 2x Ghost Quarter? FoR does not stop anybody assembling Tron when you're on the draw.
Plus you can then T1 Ghost Quarter your Tron piece then Surgical.
maybe he thought it was decent enough against tron while still being something you can bring in against jund or other 3-color control decks? gives you more game against opposing manlands and flipped azcanta without falling behind on land drops. though im not sure if he would be swapping out other lands or go up to 27.
i dont think i can be convinced that 2 AV/2 field was the best use of 4 sideboard slots.
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Modern: UWGSnow-Bant Control BURGrixis Death's Shadow GWBCoCo Elves WCDeath and Taxes (sold)
yeah jeskai still lookin strong. not surprising to see two of the better control players on the scg tour do well with it. rosum fell victim to the jund hype for a while, but i cant fault him for that.
not sure what matchups davis had in mind with his tuning changes. my best guess is the mirror and tron.
Yes, Davis is tuned for the mirror and Tron for sure. I actually like it!
But to be honest if you're going to the lengths to put 2 Field of Ruin in the board, wouldn't it just be better to put in 2x Ghost Quarter? FoR does not stop anybody assembling Tron when you're on the draw.
Plus you can then T1 Ghost Quarter your Tron piece then Surgical.
You know they can still kill you without assembling Tron, especially in light of the lack of pressure Jeskai is typically known to apply.
Yeah I just hate even tuning for the matchup. Outside of 2 Clique, and a Rejection in the side, I'm not sure I even want the Damping Spheres for that match because both xTron and Storm are very very used to dealing with hate.
I've seen them pack anti-hate even Main.
I've had games where I was on Blue Moon, with Moon's on the field, and Field of Ruin doing work, and they still come back. Its just a bad match, and if you cannot get there when packing 4 cryptics, just forget it.
Honestly the most success I've had recently was when I was running 3 Jace, the fate seal against them is quite good.
yeah the cantrip split and faerie conclave are just stuff i want to try out. i cut negate, but still wanted to use that slot for a piece of counter magic. snare seems pretty good right now, and having a higher density of 1 mana plays is nice.
gideon3 is mostly a placeholder as i just wanted something proactive in that slot. its cheap, powerful, and can beat people to death. seems good enough for right now.
the 3 azcanta though...im still unsure about. i know people have dropped back down to 2, but having one early in the game can make such a difference. the downside is of course drawing multiples. more cantrips or a looting effect might alleviate that.
frank karsten wrote an article about how many copies of a card you want to play. he outlines several heuristics you can use to make the choice. based on these im going to stay with 3 for the time being.
Yeah, my counter set is still 4 Cryptic/3 Knot Main, 2 Dispel and a Rejection in the side. I did have Snares, but just cannot fit them. I had wanted to try Gideon3 as I like the card, but again, just fighting for slots.
I'm still ok with 3 Azcanta. I always want one early, and I'll jam it turn 2 in probably the majority of scenarios.
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UW Spirits
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It's hard to argue with the success of Nikolich's list, but I personally hate playing less than 4x Bolt, and in this meta, 4x Helix as well. With a removal suite of 4 Bolt/Helix/Path and 2x Surpeme Verdict, and I have been a lot less impressed with Electrolyze. Now, don't get me wrong-- I love me some Electrolyze! But I did find it somewhat redundant (and clunky) with so much other cheap removal + sweepers. How has it been for you? Beyond that, how have you found Secure the Wastes and maindeck Negate? Thanks.
You certainly dont need to cling to a 3/3 split on bolts.
I kept my 4/2 with 2 Electrolyze, and never feel bad about it.
Secure is a house main deck, never feels like a bad draw, Negate Main, I dropped.
Spirits
ever since adding secure the wastes i havent once considered removing it. not that its some exceptionally good card or anything. its just flexible and does good work on offense and defense.
negate is pretty 'meh'. havent been particularly impressed with it. it makes sense because with so much removal and sweepers its the noncreature spells that we need to worry about more often than not. whether games play out like that is another story. so ill stick with it for the time being, but its on the short list of cards id swap out.
UWGSnow-Bant Control
BURGrixis Death's Shadow
GWBCoCo Elves
WCDeath and Taxes(sold)What do you think?
RUAffinityUR
GMono Green StompyG
CEldrazi TronC
URWJeskai GeistWRU
WRBoros BurnRW
BRWMardu PyromancerWRB
I essentially have built to abuse a meta of Humans, Affinity, Hollow One (which I've still not lost to) and Elves.
Spirits
RUAffinityUR
GMono Green StompyG
CEldrazi TronC
URWJeskai GeistWRU
WRBoros BurnRW
BRWMardu PyromancerWRB
There are currently at least two UWR decks at 9-1 in the SCG Open btw folks, we are still looking good.
Spirits
RUAffinityUR
GMono Green StompyG
CEldrazi TronC
URWJeskai GeistWRU
WRBoros BurnRW
BRWMardu PyromancerWRB
http://www.starcitygames.com/decks/121148
http://www.starcitygames.com/decks/121136
http://www.starcitygames.com/decks/121156
1 UWR List in the Top 16 of the Modern Classic, at 11th.
http://www.starcitygames.com/decks/121201
A lot of the same things going on. Jim's list is the most radical departure from what has been forming as the most common 'Control' list.
Spirits
not sure what matchups davis had in mind with his tuning changes. my best guess is the mirror and tron.
UWGSnow-Bant Control
BURGrixis Death's Shadow
GWBCoCo Elves
WCDeath and Taxes(sold)Yes, Davis is tuned for the mirror and Tron for sure. I actually like it!
But to be honest if you're going to the lengths to put 2 Field of Ruin in the board, wouldn't it just be better to put in 2x Ghost Quarter? FoR does not stop anybody assembling Tron when you're on the draw.
Plus you can then T1 Ghost Quarter your Tron piece then Surgical.
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URW Jeskai Control
GUWRB Amulet Titan
GR Ponza
i dont think i can be convinced that 2 AV/2 field was the best use of 4 sideboard slots.
UWGSnow-Bant Control
BURGrixis Death's Shadow
GWBCoCo Elves
WCDeath and Taxes(sold)You know they can still kill you without assembling Tron, especially in light of the lack of pressure Jeskai is typically known to apply.
I've seen them pack anti-hate even Main.
I've had games where I was on Blue Moon, with Moon's on the field, and Field of Ruin doing work, and they still come back. Its just a bad match, and if you cannot get there when packing 4 cryptics, just forget it.
Honestly the most success I've had recently was when I was running 3 Jace, the fate seal against them is quite good.
Spirits
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URW Jeskai Control
GUWRB Amulet Titan
GR Ponza
i lucked out and my LGS had some teferi in stock. here is what i am going to start with:
4 Snapcaster Mage
1 Gideon of the Trials
2 Teferi, Hero of Dominaria
3 Search for Azcanta
3 Serum Visions
2 Opt
4 Path to Exile
3 Lightning Bolt
3 Lightning Helix
3 Logic Knot
1 Spell Snare
1 Electrolyze
3 Cryptic Command
1 Wrath of God
1 Supreme Verdict
1 Secure the Wastes
2 Celestial Colonnade
1 Field of Ruin
4 Flooded Strand
1 Glacial Fortress
2 Hallowed Fountain
3 Island
1 Plains
1 Mountain
1 Sacred Foundry
4 Scalding Tarn
2 Steam Vents
1 Sulfur Falls
1 Engineered Explosives
2 Dispel
1 Abrade
2 Celestial Purge
1 Runed Halo
1 Ceremonious Rejection
1 Negate
1 Stony Silence
1 Vendilion Clique
1 Settle the Wreckage
1 Elspeth, Sun's Champion
1 Baneslayer Angel
1 Wear
UWGSnow-Bant Control
BURGrixis Death's Shadow
GWBCoCo Elves
WCDeath and Taxes(sold)Spirits
gideon3 is mostly a placeholder as i just wanted something proactive in that slot. its cheap, powerful, and can beat people to death. seems good enough for right now.
the 3 azcanta though...im still unsure about. i know people have dropped back down to 2, but having one early in the game can make such a difference. the downside is of course drawing multiples. more cantrips or a looting effect might alleviate that.
frank karsten wrote an article about how many copies of a card you want to play. he outlines several heuristics you can use to make the choice. based on these im going to stay with 3 for the time being.
https://www.channelfireball.com/articles/how-many-copies-of-any-given-card-should-you-put-in-your-deck/
UWGSnow-Bant Control
BURGrixis Death's Shadow
GWBCoCo Elves
WCDeath and Taxes(sold)Yeah, my counter set is still 4 Cryptic/3 Knot Main, 2 Dispel and a Rejection in the side. I did have Snares, but just cannot fit them. I had wanted to try Gideon3 as I like the card, but again, just fighting for slots.
I'm still ok with 3 Azcanta. I always want one early, and I'll jam it turn 2 in probably the majority of scenarios.
Spirits