Hm ok. I've been toying with the idea of replacing Baneslayer and something else for 2 Restos in the side, I'm trying to run 3 Snap/2 Clique main, and Restos seem real good there. I can see how Cataclysmic Gearhulk would be good, I just feel that Karn GC doesn't exactly fill any slot amazingly, other than maindeck Artifact hate. Even if Gearhulk isn't taxed by Thalia, Karn is, and an untaxed Gearhulk just costs the same as any other taxed sweeper, and leaves them with their most relevant piece of interaction on the board, though I haven't tested it so wiping all but one might be enough.
After g1 you bring in the Gearhulk so the Karn being taxed aspect isn't relevant. I was justing pointing out reasons to play the Gearhulk by itself. Usually dealing with anything but a creature is good enough. The Hulk has a big ass to play defense really well. With Vigilance you can freely start pressuring them without fearing being dead on the swing back.
I used to play the Baneslayer alongside Lyra but since everyone was on that plan it was less effective. The angels are great when we get to untap with them but if you need to drop them on 5 you'll end up on a bad spot. Wurmcoil although more expensive generates a bit of value when dealt with (instead of Pathing) and doesn't die to Dismember or Lava Axe that are the most common removal spells that people leave in or bring in to deal with the Angels if they suspect you're on that plan.
Karn isn't amazing by itself but it's good enough. Liquimetal Coating is a cheaper Lattice that Tron is using to bridge the gap and shutdown a troublesome permanent with Karn. It can also serve as a LD spell. We don't have that many free slots to afford playing a "do nothing" card but there have been situations where I would have won if I had it on my SB.
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Currently Playing: WUMiracles ControlUW RUBGrixis Death's ShadowBUR
Just went 3-0-1 tonight using 2x Puzzle Box and 4x Narset.
Matchups:
UW vs UW = Draw
UW vs UW = 2-0 Win
UW vs BG Midrange = 2-1 Win
UW vs Waste Not Brew = 2-1 Win
Overall Puzzle box was great, even on its own it digs towards the combo and allows for filtering. We also play a lot of instant speed maindeck so we can respond to the trigger. Being able to curve out Narset into puzzle box on an empty board can virtually win the game on the spot, its a really nice thing to have access to in UW. Sanitarium was amazing all night, highly recommend this with 4x Narset.
Hey all, back to control after long time in Jund. For now I play 6 walers MB, 2 Jace, 1 Papa Teferi, 1 Narset, 2 karn. My wish package is Relic, Cage, White Gearhulk, Lattice, Spyglass, wurmcoil and bridge.
Im still not sure about the Karn but he won me many games I should have lost. Slamming him on a open board does feel great as the other +4 CMC PW because of lattice and having access to alot of hate piece G1 is defenitly a thing. When Im behind, especially on turn 4 Jace would be better for sure and it is IMO his biggest weakness on curve he is really weak if im not at least on parity with my oppenent.
Because narset digs for anything you need and is a piece of hate at the same time. Would play more copies. That way you could run puzzle box lock, with Karn to grab it from side or just box for karn.
Because narset digs for anything you need and is a piece of hate at the same time.
Aggro decks attack the planeswalker instead of attacking you?
What's the problem with that? If they kill Narset the turn after you cast her you essentially cast Ponder + gained at least 3 life. That's a decent floor. As a hate piece Narset is quite strong against some decks. The static ability shuts down UR Phoenix and is very good in the mirror.
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Modern UR Blue Moon UBR Grixis Shadow GWU Amulet Titan BRW Mardu Pyromancer
Hey! Back from playing decks like Taking Turns for a long time
Still feel comfortable playing the deck but was wondering if there is a recent side boarding strategy guide? Like when cards like Restoration angel are good and whatnot
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UU"Brute force can sometimes kick down a locked door, but knowledge is a skeleton key"UU
Resto is good to pressure opposing planeswalkers and against Humans / other control mirrors.
How does everyone feel about Watcher for Tomorrow in the midrange control version as a way of replacing Wall of Omens?
I don't like entering tapped, I don't like delayed draw, I don't like only being a 2/1. I'm personally not a huge fan of Fblthp in the midrange/control list that Nassif has been running, and that seems better than this thing. Against decks where you want to be using the slot to attack, Watcher doesn't actually get you card advantage until he is dealt with. Against the aggro decks where you need a blocker, he enters tapped, so you're basically spending 2 mana on a block in two turns and no card advantage immediately. Seems like too much going against him. Would have liked to see them remove the entering tapped part of Hideaway for the Creature version of the ability.
The purpose of Omen is to clog the board while being a free card. This guys does a poor job in blocking over multiple turns, the only aggro creature he trades with is Goblin Guide.
If you want to upgrade the Omen probably Augur of Bolas would be a tiny bit better at blocking, with 25 instants and sorceries for it to hit around 90% of the time. Since we are now playing more planeswalker heavy builds the number has decreased a lot so... not a good idea...
Basically if you want a 2 drop that draws a card a defends just play Wall of Omens. It's the perfect card for the job.
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Currently Playing: WUMiracles ControlUW RUBGrixis Death's ShadowBUR
Yeah I think Wall is the best option there, I understand the reasoning behind Fblthp, as it allows you to pressure opposing Walkers, but I think you just want to increase the number of Snaps you run before throwing a cantripping 1/1 into your deck.
I'd rather play more Cliques and Snapcasters before playing a Fblthp. That is a just Nassif being Nassif. He can get a away with playing really nonsense cards in his deck for the most part. I recall when he got kinda mad for losing to Mill that he started to play an Eldrazi titan in his board in order to get his cards back...
It wasn't even a good plan at that due to Surgical and Extirpate... but hey he's Nassif...
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I'd rather play more Cliques and Snapcasters before playing a Fblthp. That is a just Nassif being Nassif. He can get a away with playing really nonsense cards in his deck for the most part. I recall when he got kinda mad for losing to Mill that he started to play an Eldrazi titan in his board in order to get his cards back...
It wasn't even a good plan at that due to Surgical and Extirpate... but hey he's Nassif...
Eldrazi against mill is actually super powerful, even in the face of surgical/extripate you still get at least 1 full GY shuffle. It's basically a 1 card strategy against them. Nassif himself said that he never lost a single game where an eldrazi trigger happened.
That said, I don't think elvish visionary is good enough for UW control. Although, the two drop slot is the weak spot now in UW.
I thought watcher for tomorrow might have been good so I gave it a try. It only felt passable against control - against almost everything else the ETB tapped was too big of a drawback to overcome.
The point is not that Eldrazi's are good or not against mill. Its who the hell play's mill in any competitive environment and why would you spend a sideboard slot for it when you only have 15.
In a local meta or mtg, fair game I guess since those have weird metas sometimes, hehehe.
Wall is pretty good if you need more cantrips and a way to hold aggro or if you are more midrange.
The point is not that Eldrazi's are good or not against mill. Its who the hell play's mill in any competitive environment and why would you spend a sideboard slot for it when you only have 15.
In a local meta or mtg, fair game I guess since those have weird metas sometimes, hehehe.
Wall is pretty good if you need more cantrips and a way to hold aggro or if you are more midrange.
I'm the one that "bashed" mill but at the same time I lost to a freaking Mill deck at GP Liverpool... Felt really bad but no way I'd play an Eldrazi titan on my sideboard just for that. That's modern for you. All you have to do is have a couple of byes or win the first two rounds and you won't have to face any of the nonsense and from that point on you can make a real run for it.
Anyway, following the uprising of the Bridgevine decks and the post I made on the State of the Format thread, this is the deck I'll be playing for now.
Surgical is definitely powerful enough to warrant maindeck inclusion right now, but even drawing 2 against non-GY decks is usually game losing. There's no way 4 can be correct.
Force of Negation is the new Force of Will - just hit the Altar and they become a bad dredge deck. A few FoN and a pair of surgical in the main, coupled with a trio of Rest In Peace out of the board should bring that match closer to even without auto-losing to the rest of the format.
Also, Karn isn't doing you any favors in your bad matchups either, especially the ones you seem worried about the most, the GY-Aggro matchups. Spending two turns and 5 mana over turns 4 and 5 on a grafdiggers cage is a losing recipe, and then you're stuck with the crappy situation of deciding between leaving your Cage in the board or having dead Karns.
I feel like it's beating a dead horse at this point, but Karn is awful in UW. Think about how much better your GY-aggro match would be if you had the space for 3 Rest in Peace in the board.
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I used to play the Baneslayer alongside Lyra but since everyone was on that plan it was less effective. The angels are great when we get to untap with them but if you need to drop them on 5 you'll end up on a bad spot. Wurmcoil although more expensive generates a bit of value when dealt with (instead of Pathing) and doesn't die to Dismember or Lava Axe that are the most common removal spells that people leave in or bring in to deal with the Angels if they suspect you're on that plan.
Karn isn't amazing by itself but it's good enough. Liquimetal Coating is a cheaper Lattice that Tron is using to bridge the gap and shutdown a troublesome permanent with Karn. It can also serve as a LD spell. We don't have that many free slots to afford playing a "do nothing" card but there have been situations where I would have won if I had it on my SB.
WUMiracles ControlUW
RUBGrixis Death's ShadowBUR
Matchups:
UW vs UW = Draw
UW vs UW = 2-0 Win
UW vs BG Midrange = 2-1 Win
UW vs Waste Not Brew = 2-1 Win
Overall Puzzle box was great, even on its own it digs towards the combo and allows for filtering. We also play a lot of instant speed maindeck so we can respond to the trigger. Being able to curve out Narset into puzzle box on an empty board can virtually win the game on the spot, its a really nice thing to have access to in UW. Sanitarium was amazing all night, highly recommend this with 4x Narset.
Im still not sure about the Karn but he won me many games I should have lost. Slamming him on a open board does feel great as the other +4 CMC PW because of lattice and having access to alot of hate piece G1 is defenitly a thing. When Im behind, especially on turn 4 Jace would be better for sure and it is IMO his biggest weakness on curve he is really weak if im not at least on parity with my oppenent.
(sorry for my English)
What's the problem with that? If they kill Narset the turn after you cast her you essentially cast Ponder + gained at least 3 life. That's a decent floor. As a hate piece Narset is quite strong against some decks. The static ability shuts down UR Phoenix and is very good in the mirror.
UR Blue Moon
UBR Grixis Shadow
GWU Amulet Titan
BRW Mardu Pyromancer
Still feel comfortable playing the deck but was wondering if there is a recent side boarding strategy guide? Like when cards like Restoration angel are good and whatnot
How does everyone feel about Watcher for Tomorrow in the midrange control version as a way of replacing Wall of Omens?
I don't like entering tapped, I don't like delayed draw, I don't like only being a 2/1. I'm personally not a huge fan of Fblthp in the midrange/control list that Nassif has been running, and that seems better than this thing. Against decks where you want to be using the slot to attack, Watcher doesn't actually get you card advantage until he is dealt with. Against the aggro decks where you need a blocker, he enters tapped, so you're basically spending 2 mana on a block in two turns and no card advantage immediately. Seems like too much going against him. Would have liked to see them remove the entering tapped part of Hideaway for the Creature version of the ability.
If you want to upgrade the Omen probably Augur of Bolas would be a tiny bit better at blocking, with 25 instants and sorceries for it to hit around 90% of the time. Since we are now playing more planeswalker heavy builds the number has decreased a lot so... not a good idea...
Basically if you want a 2 drop that draws a card a defends just play Wall of Omens. It's the perfect card for the job.
WUMiracles ControlUW
RUBGrixis Death's ShadowBUR
It wasn't even a good plan at that due to Surgical and Extirpate... but hey he's Nassif...
WUMiracles ControlUW
RUBGrixis Death's ShadowBUR
Eldrazi against mill is actually super powerful, even in the face of surgical/extripate you still get at least 1 full GY shuffle. It's basically a 1 card strategy against them. Nassif himself said that he never lost a single game where an eldrazi trigger happened.
That said, I don't think elvish visionary is good enough for UW control. Although, the two drop slot is the weak spot now in UW.
I thought watcher for tomorrow might have been good so I gave it a try. It only felt passable against control - against almost everything else the ETB tapped was too big of a drawback to overcome.
In a local meta or mtg, fair game I guess since those have weird metas sometimes, hehehe.
Wall is pretty good if you need more cantrips and a way to hold aggro or if you are more midrange.
Anyway, following the uprising of the Bridgevine decks and the post I made on the State of the Format thread, this is the deck I'll be playing for now.
2 Snow-covered Plains
7 Snow-covered Island
3 Field of Ruin
1 Blast Zone
4 Flooded Strand
2 Glacial Fortress
2 Prismatic Vista
2 Hallowed Fountain
2 Celestial Colonnade
Creatures:
1 Vendilion Clique
3 Snapcaster Mage
Planeswalkers:
1 Teferi, Hero of Dominaria
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
2 Karn, the Great Creator
2 Narset, Parter of Veils
1 Teferi, Time Raveler
4 Opts
Permission:
2 Cryptic Command
2 Dovin's Veto
1 Spell Pierce
Removal:
4 Path to Exile
1 Detention Sphere
1 On Thin Ice
1 Supreme Verdict
1 Wrath of God
1 Settle the Wreckage
Other:
4 Surgical Extraction
1 Timely Reinforcements
2 Celestial Purge
2 Ceremonious Rejection
1 Disdainful Stroke
1 Lyra Dawnbringer
1 Vendilion Clique
1 Teferi Time Raveler
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Pithing Needle
1 Relic of Progenitus
1 Sorcerous Spyglass
1 Mycosynth Lattice
1 Wurmcoil Engine
1 Cataclysmic Gearhulk
WUMiracles ControlUW
RUBGrixis Death's ShadowBUR
Force of Negation is the new Force of Will - just hit the Altar and they become a bad dredge deck. A few FoN and a pair of surgical in the main, coupled with a trio of Rest In Peace out of the board should bring that match closer to even without auto-losing to the rest of the format.
Also, Karn isn't doing you any favors in your bad matchups either, especially the ones you seem worried about the most, the GY-Aggro matchups. Spending two turns and 5 mana over turns 4 and 5 on a grafdiggers cage is a losing recipe, and then you're stuck with the crappy situation of deciding between leaving your Cage in the board or having dead Karns.
I feel like it's beating a dead horse at this point, but Karn is awful in UW. Think about how much better your GY-aggro match would be if you had the space for 3 Rest in Peace in the board.