The Legion Warboss seems awfully shiny at first glance. I can see it replacing the supplemental creature/win-con spots dedicated to Eidolon of the great revel (be it in the traditional SB slots OR in the maindeck, ala Porno for Pyros variant). Except with Warboss, we don't have to burn ourselves down with shock Eidolon pings.
The biggest drawback? The 3-cmc slot! /Shakes a mountain fist at the sky!!!! Always with the over-crowded 3-cmc slot. I try to not exceed (15-16) 3-cmc slots [not counting simian spirit guide]. That's one of the advantages of Eidolon: it fills the 2-cmc slot which is soooo empty for us AND it allows for a deck of 8 rituals.
IF we start packing Legion Warboss into the main deck, then we have to also pack in more mana acceleration. This throws off our whole curve! Deeeeamn. Maybe...Maybe. OR, we do incorporate the Warboss in the main deck: go more 'fair' deck with X-for-1 creatures, power lock suite, and very few spot/sweeper removal spells. Hmmmmmm. Do we become a Gobbo deck through and through?
I was thinking dropping the sweepers maindexk all together. Run 4 abrade and zero sweepers instead if the 2/2 split. Then we can test two new goblin over two chainwhirler, which makes us weaker to Thalia and other creature matches. Honestly, I really like the new goblin, but having a hard time finding room in my list. I think the list I ran this weekend is as optinized as it's gonna be for me at this point. Chainwhirler and walking ballista have proven too valuable and eidolon out the board is much needed aggression va control but also another lock piece vs combo. We can't replace eidolon with new goblin. Crap, this is hard.....
Hi all, new to this deck, loving it so far. Great work on and thanks to everyone.
A common scenario comes up for me and I’m wondering what the right play is. It’s G1 against unknown opponent, on the play. 2 land, chalice, moon, rabblemaster, SSG, Chandra. I see the choices as:
All three plays are potentially defendable against different decks of the meta. I’m inclined in the dark to go with the rabble clock because at the worst you get a clock down and are guaranteed a chalice on t3. Interested in your thoughts.
Went to a PPTQ yesterday and went 4-2 which is a lot better then my previous PPTQ attempt of 1-4.
Round 1: Bant Spirits (with Coco and Vial and MB geist)
G1: I had anger and a bridge a moon and SSGs which meant I could just deal with anything and eventually drew into a threat and won pretty easily.
G2: I had the game locked down with a bridge and was pinging him with a hazoret till he cocoed into a rec sage killed the bridge swinging with geist and about 4 creatures.
G3: he got down an early geist and had queller and basically killed me with the geist.
Round 2: UW control
G1: I had a turn 1 blood moon then missed my next 3 lands drops eventually got down chandra which he bolted and killed with a snapcaster then I cast another one which he killed with a vendillion clique (he just seemed to draw all his creatures) and eventually landed a JTMS so I scooped with him being up lands with a jace fate sealing me and attacking with vendillion clique,
G2: I got down an early eidolon which he killed but then followed up with 2 rabblemasters and a chandra and killed him.
G3: I made a punt. He went to field of ruin my ramunap ruins then changed his mind to my scavenger grounds (I had a desperate ritual and koth in hand and he had a celestial purge in the GY). I cast the ritual in response and meant to sac the scavenger grounds in response to exile the GYs but accidentally said ramnuap ruins so ended up losing both lands which meant I couldn't cast koth for another 2-3 turns and by that stage he caught up and ended up just killing me with colonnades and snap beats.
Round 3: Bant spirits (traditional build)
G1: Wasn't feeling great being 0-2 and had a very aggressive hand with lots of rabblemasters. When I initially put him on spirits I was concerned as I didn't think I would win as he has so many more creatures than me but he mostly blocked tokens, occasionally trading a creature with rabble and eventually chaining them together just ended up wiping his board leaving me with enough tokens and a large rabble to swing for lethal.
G2: He just destroyed me with an early thalia, mausoleum wanderer as protection and just killed me with large flying spirits.
G3: was a long grindy affair I had him locked behind a bridge, managed to ult chandra, he cast worship with a nummber of creatures I wiped the board with an anger, he then cast geist and I cast sarkhan, essentially I killed creatures with chandra emblem that I could target and just dug till I had an anger, killed the geist and finished him with chandra emblem.
Round 4: Titanshift
G1: I cast an early blood moon, bridge, got a redundant blood moon and bridge and won through chandra to which he eventually scooped.
G2: He ramped really quickly cast a prime time which I stopped with a bridge but then he just cast scapeshift and killed me.
G3: I kept a risky hand with 1 mountain, SSG, ritual, 2 moons and 2 bridges on the play. I felt like if he didn't have basic forest in hand I would have 2-3 turns to draw lands/SSGs and could lock him out. Luckily I peeled lands off the top for the next 2 turns and had 2 bridges, 2 moons and won with chandra.
Round 5: Mardu pyromancer
G1: I cast threats he killed or removed things from had cast lingering souls and Hazoret and I couldn't beat hazoret.
G2: I got down a bridge which he later killed then an eidolon and chandra, I managed to get myself hellbent and cast a chalice for 3 shutting off k-cmd he tried to dig through looting and in doing so lost a lot of life, eventually bolted the eidolon but by that stage chandra finished him off.
G3: I got down n early chandra and then cast hazoret he had a rabblemaster which I managed to deal with the tokens with hazoret, I eventually got an abrade and killed rabblemaster swinging with hazoret and he scooped.
Round 6: Eldrazi and taxes
G1: Got down an early moon he cast thalia and displacer and I cast a rabblemaster he would swing at me and I was swinging with rabble, eventually got chalice on 1 and a chandra and just won the race.
G2: Cast an early moon and a rabblemaster and just locked him out to which he scooped.
Overall the deck performed well, I did make some punts and bad plays. I tried trinisphere which unfortunately never really came up as I didn't play storm or burn, and unless cast very early on it's usually a bit average. As spirits is becoming much more common and humans is still a big thing will probably try 2 torpor orb. I have completely dropped ballista I may go back to it, but really the only time I wanted it was to kill Thalia which seems very very narrow. I was using 1 surgical and will go up to 2 now, in certain matchups being able to remove all of one particular threat (i.e surgical cryptic command or against GY strategies seems good) and yes it is a bit of a nonbo with chalice but so is cage and relic.
I will try 2 skab-clans again as I feel the control matchup is winnable but we just need more low cmc threats, boil is great when it works but most of the control decks now play lots of non island blue sources so it doesn't really work as well as it used to between colonnade, sulfur falls, spirebluff canal and glacial fortress, also if they have a field of ruin they can just use it to get a basic back and it's only really good if you can do it early to get ahead of them on mana, so I would probably just want more threats.
I kinda wish we had a recursive threat either a creature with flying or deathtouch or something (squee doesn't really seem good enough as just a bear) or a punishing fire type threat.
We played trashdragons and maybe it is time for trashgoblins? Look at our New m19 goblinlord and abrademachinegun....Mr. Goblin trashmaster....in a build of 8 rabblemasters? More power, more abrades, more goblins, more trash
A common scenario comes up for me and I’m wondering what the right play is. It’s G1 against unknown opponent, [i]on the play[/i].
2 Mountain
1 Chalice of the Void
1 Blood Moon
1 Simian Spirit Guide
1 Goblin Rabblemaster
1 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
All three plays are potentially defendable against different decks of the meta. I’m inclined in the dark to go with the rabble clock because at the worst you get a clock down and are guaranteed a chalice on t3. Interested in your thoughts.
Well, it's been three days and no answers. I guess we are all still thinking this one over Where most other decks can predictably ramp out there plays in a consistent manner, we can not. And, this common puzzle you've presented has a different answer depending on the day and the meta. You've presented (3) options, but really it's (2) options:
A) Do we lay a mountain - pass
B) Do we lay a mountain, fire off a SSG into a Chalice on 1 - pass.
THEN,[i] on turn 2, after we've learned what our opponent is playing (hah, yeah, statistically, we can reliably forecast what's in an opponent's (60) after their first turn), we choose between:
A) Sit behind the Chalice which was played, drop a land - pass (OR, hope to have drawn a ritual and then moon/rabble)
B) SSG into Moon
C) SSG into Rabblemaster
OK, first - To chalice on 1 or not. How would we describe our hand? It is not explosive. Rabble can run, but a turn 2 rabble will likely not bring home the gold on his own, and there is no backup if he goes down. So, my inclination is to treat this game plan as a 'lock' developer. Well, if we do go for a Turn 1 Chalice, then we have only 1 more land in hand to drop on turn 2. Potential problem: there's a small chance we get stalled IF we do not draw a land source in at least 1 of the next 2 draw steps.
Also, a turn 2 blood moon can be the bomb, but it's exponentially weaker than a turn 1 blood moon. The opponent gets to see our turn 1 mountain - pass. This sends up a flag to them that we may be packing a blood moon, so they'll lead with a fetch land or mana dork.
In a broad meta, the other consideration is 'what do we lose to?' What can I reasonably expect to have a tougher time beating on game 1? Example: KCI or Storm. Should I blindly play to edge up my odds against those tougher decks?
Summary: I would lead with a chalice on 1. Against most decks, it slows the game down. This allows you to continue a slow ramp into a blood moon/rabble - with the chance that you pull one of your remaining 8 rituals. Confidence level on this play is about 65%. I can see the argument for simply going mountain - pass.
Welcome to the group - good query, MrJayngles!
[i]Dazza0187[/i]: Excellent write-up, and your summary of 'things learned' at the bottom of the report is always a welcome addition to a tourney report. 4-2 is an accomplishment, and you definitely analyze the plays like you know your chops. You'll get 'em next time.
Match 1 - Rock
G1: Chalice on 1 -> Moon -> Bridge. Koth -> Emblem -> Concession. Guess I saw a Goyf.
G2: Double discard on Rabble and Haz. Chandra. Bridge, Bridge, a Lilly from them at some point. Emblem and game.
Match 2 - Ad Nauseam
G1: Chalice on 1 followed up by Chandra. Opponent seems to be on the all 1 drops plan. They do land an Unlife, but have nothing besides an Attack Monkey to block my evergrowing army of Goblins.
G2: Opponent mulls to 4, suspending a Lotus and playing an Urborg. Play a land, Chal on 0. They don't have anything, so I proceed to play another land and power out a Molten Rain. Playing a Chandra on their empty board brings out another concession.
Match 3 - GWR Goodstuff or something uhh
G1: They Temple Garden into Rugged Praerie into Looting? I'm like uhh I don't get it. Play T2 Moon anyway. They do get a flashback out of their Looting but the Bolt to follow is the last spell they play. Chandra is too much and they give up.
G2: This is where Molten Rain truly shows its power. They get a Forest out but I moon. Chal on 1. Bloodbraid, Goyf...one Abraded, another one spawns...a Bridge stops it all. I topdeck the Molten Rain and destroy their only basic. That's it, especially after a Chandra and a Chal on 2.
Match 4 - UW Control
G1: T1 Moon does absolutely nothing given their Island and Plains to follow. It even eats a Sphere, but I have another one. Teferi, Koth...Koth goes back to the deck. Jace. I try to desperately land a Chandra, but after getting Negated I give up.
G2: Go go Little Chandra! T1 Chal on 1. T2 Little Chandra. T3 Attack, Moon, untap, ping, transform. Uptick. A Big Chandra. Uptick both. They do try to slow me down with a Clique but I keep the pressure on. Oh did you guys realize Little Chandra can also tag PWs???!!? They have no chance whatsoever.
G3: A reaaaally tough call on the starting hand. Rabble, Rabble, Moon, Simian, Gemstone, Mountain, Chalice. I decide to pitch the other Rabble, which might have cost me the game. I do draw a Mountain, and I'm facing an Island. I figure they might just play a Fetch, so I moon. Big mistake - they play a Plains. I mean, I could've just played a Rabble, but I thought, what if they have a Path? Like, I could just play a Chal on 1 the next turn and the Rabble after that. Well it doesn't unfortunately work that way this time around and they even counter my Chal. A topdecked Eidolon gets Leaked. They play a Stony Silence (what??? it's quite apparent people still don't understand our deck lol) and I play a Rabble. I figure this is my chance, but nope. They have a Sphere. We keep trading blows, Timely Reinforcements, Moon, nothing matters. Boil is countered. Teferi pretty much threatens to end the game but I keep drawing gas. This was pretty good btw: they have 2 Islands and a Plains so I Rain the Plains. A Chainwhirler kills their 2 Mages but they STILL draw into 2 more Plains, finally landing an Angel. That was quite frustrating because without the extra Plains, I would've just ran over them with my Rabble and Whirler. Oh well, it was reeaaaaally close. Could've gone the other way, like really.
Match 5 - Grixis DS
G1: Blah blah Chal on 1 blah blah Stubby D blah blah Bridge concede.
G2: This is another super close a match. They destroy my hand but I topdeck a ritual into a Hazoret. I ALMOST kill them but they have not one, not two, but THREE DSses AND a Zombie Fish. I mean, there's no chance I'm getting through all that and I just die facing three 10/10 DSses.
G3: Ahahaha. They do rip my Chal but I go Eidolon, Eidolon, Eidolon. Try even a Chandra in between. One gets blocked by a Snappie but comeon. They can't obviously keep up and can't play anything else, game over.
Thoughts. Molten Rain is still AWESOME. It's like, it always helps. It's GREAT against combo, setting them back by a whole turn. OR - you just 100% lock them down killing their one single basic. Especially with rituals it becomes a T2 LD. I'd want a third one but I can't fit it in. Also good against control, maybe not so much against aggro...but still the possibility of ruining their post-Moon life is golden.
Little Chandra's also great! It's basically a 3 CMC Chandra that can fight THEIR planeswalkers. I mean it's not exactly great against aggro but still if you can play 2 red spells in a single turn you do get to transform it. Or, if everything else fails it's at least a threat (albeit a very weak one).
Grafdigger's Cage was still not missed but to be fair not even needed with these matchups.
OK that's all I can think of this late. Have a good one.
Rekt 'Em! 4-1. And, did so with a pair of li'l Chans. One other note - albeit obvious - with Chandra, Fire of Kaladesh is that you can simply attack for 2, THEN play a red spell to untap her. Ping for 1. This equals 3 total damage and a free flip to Chandra, Roaring Flame.
A common scenario comes up for me and I’m wondering what the right play is. It’s G1 against unknown opponent, on the play.
2 Mountain
1 Chalice of the Void
1 Blood Moon
1 Simian Spirit Guide
1 Goblin Rabblemaster
1 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
All three plays are potentially defendable against different decks of the meta. I’m inclined in the dark to go with the rabble clock because at the worst you get a clock down and are guaranteed a chalice on t3. Interested in your thoughts.
Summary: I would lead with a chalice on 1. Against most decks, it slows the game down. This allows you to continue a slow ramp into a blood moon/rabble - with the chance that you pull one of your remaining 8 rituals. Confidence level on this play is about 65%. I can see the argument for simply going mountain - pass.
Thanks very much for the very thoughtful analysis! Indeed, upon thinking about this a bit more, I think I underestimated just how important the 1-drop slot is in most decks. Shutting down that turn 1 play I do agree is just very powerful, especially before they get to lay the first land. You got thought seize/Iok (black midrange), Vial (humans, spirits, D&T), mana dorks (green decks, humans), other multiple utility dorks (bridgevine, hollow one), combo pieces (KCI, lantern), cantrips (Control, storm), half the burn deck, other various utility like faithless looking, ancient stirrings, expedition map, eggs, and so on...
I was initially scared of being stuck on 2 land and no other play to make, but I think this slows down a LOT of decks enough to warrant it. Also, there's the possibility that a turn 2 moon or rabble master will either be irrelevant or just not enough on its own. Rabble dies in a lot of ways, and moon can be hit or miss against many decks if not T1...all of which you alluded to.
Treasure Chest opened to reveal.........."Amonkhet Set". I've never seen anything like this in one my MTGO chests. Any kin know what to make of it??
I can guess that it's a set of Amonkhet: a single copy of each card in the 'normal' set. This would not include all of the Masterpiece cards, right? Will anything be foil? Can I or should I look into trading the virtual cards in for a real playset in paper?? How would I do this.
Hmmmmmmm, akaHoudini.........how come the virtual set on MTGgoldfish shows as $22.00 and the paper set shows as $160? Which one did I crack in my pack?
Can't be the same thing.
Also, thx for the forward on the link, BUT - when trading in a virtual set for a paper set - there is a stated handling fee of $25.00 for the delivery/transaction of a paper set of Amonkhet. Does this calculate as an overall loss to me??
FWD: "Handling Fee: For every set released after February 1, 2013, (including Gatecrash and all sets released afterward) we charge $25.00 handling per set redeemed. For every set released prior to February 1, 2013, (including Return to Ravnica and all previously released sets) we charge $5.00 handling per set redeemed. This charge is the same for domestic U.S. orders and International orders.
Shipping Fee: We have two different shipping rates depending on your shipping address, $2.99 for orders shipped within the United States"
G3: A reaaaally tough call on the starting hand. Rabble, Rabble, Moon, Simian, Gemstone, Mountain, Chalice. I decide to pitch the other Rabble, which might have cost me the game. I do draw a Mountain, and I'm facing an Island. I figure they might just play a Fetch, so I moon. Big mistake - they play a Plains. I mean, I could've just played a Rabble, but I thought, what if they have a Path?
I think pitching the extra Rabble was the right call. However, when going against a potential Path to Exile, I would not hesitate to go T1 Rabble. A PTE on the Rabble means a free and permanent ramp for us. It is still a 2 for 2 trade plus we get ahead on lands for an early Chandra, Koth, chalice for 2 etc.
It appears you have to pay the $25.00 Handling Fee and $2.99 Shipping. Unfortunately, you have to pay Tax too. You redeem the Virtual set for the Paper set. $159.96-$25.00-$2.99=$131.97(-Tax) I think that's still a good day. It's sad that you have to pay $27.99+Tax to redeem a set though.
The biggest drawback? The 3-cmc slot! /Shakes a mountain fist at the sky!!!! Always with the over-crowded 3-cmc slot. I try to not exceed (15-16) 3-cmc slots [not counting simian spirit guide]. That's one of the advantages of Eidolon: it fills the 2-cmc slot which is soooo empty for us AND it allows for a deck of 8 rituals.
IF we start packing Legion Warboss into the main deck, then we have to also pack in more mana acceleration. This throws off our whole curve! Deeeeamn. Maybe...Maybe. OR, we do incorporate the Warboss in the main deck: go more 'fair' deck with X-for-1 creatures, power lock suite, and very few spot/sweeper removal spells. Hmmmmmm. Do we become a Gobbo deck through and through?
Discord: chat room
MTGsalvation: discussion board
https://discordapp.com/channels/442575196700934144/442575197397057557
A common scenario comes up for me and I’m wondering what the right play is. It’s G1 against unknown opponent, on the play. 2 land, chalice, moon, rabblemaster, SSG, Chandra. I see the choices as:
1. Turn 1 chalice
2. Turn 2 rabble, turn 3 chalice
3. Turn 2 Blood moon
All three plays are potentially defendable against different decks of the meta. I’m inclined in the dark to go with the rabble clock because at the worst you get a clock down and are guaranteed a chalice on t3. Interested in your thoughts.
Round 1: Bant Spirits (with Coco and Vial and MB geist)
G1: I had anger and a bridge a moon and SSGs which meant I could just deal with anything and eventually drew into a threat and won pretty easily.
G2: I had the game locked down with a bridge and was pinging him with a hazoret till he cocoed into a rec sage killed the bridge swinging with geist and about 4 creatures.
G3: he got down an early geist and had queller and basically killed me with the geist.
Round 2: UW control
G1: I had a turn 1 blood moon then missed my next 3 lands drops eventually got down chandra which he bolted and killed with a snapcaster then I cast another one which he killed with a vendillion clique (he just seemed to draw all his creatures) and eventually landed a JTMS so I scooped with him being up lands with a jace fate sealing me and attacking with vendillion clique,
G2: I got down an early eidolon which he killed but then followed up with 2 rabblemasters and a chandra and killed him.
G3: I made a punt. He went to field of ruin my ramunap ruins then changed his mind to my scavenger grounds (I had a desperate ritual and koth in hand and he had a celestial purge in the GY). I cast the ritual in response and meant to sac the scavenger grounds in response to exile the GYs but accidentally said ramnuap ruins so ended up losing both lands which meant I couldn't cast koth for another 2-3 turns and by that stage he caught up and ended up just killing me with colonnades and snap beats.
Round 3: Bant spirits (traditional build)
G1: Wasn't feeling great being 0-2 and had a very aggressive hand with lots of rabblemasters. When I initially put him on spirits I was concerned as I didn't think I would win as he has so many more creatures than me but he mostly blocked tokens, occasionally trading a creature with rabble and eventually chaining them together just ended up wiping his board leaving me with enough tokens and a large rabble to swing for lethal.
G2: He just destroyed me with an early thalia, mausoleum wanderer as protection and just killed me with large flying spirits.
G3: was a long grindy affair I had him locked behind a bridge, managed to ult chandra, he cast worship with a nummber of creatures I wiped the board with an anger, he then cast geist and I cast sarkhan, essentially I killed creatures with chandra emblem that I could target and just dug till I had an anger, killed the geist and finished him with chandra emblem.
Round 4: Titanshift
G1: I cast an early blood moon, bridge, got a redundant blood moon and bridge and won through chandra to which he eventually scooped.
G2: He ramped really quickly cast a prime time which I stopped with a bridge but then he just cast scapeshift and killed me.
G3: I kept a risky hand with 1 mountain, SSG, ritual, 2 moons and 2 bridges on the play. I felt like if he didn't have basic forest in hand I would have 2-3 turns to draw lands/SSGs and could lock him out. Luckily I peeled lands off the top for the next 2 turns and had 2 bridges, 2 moons and won with chandra.
Round 5: Mardu pyromancer
G1: I cast threats he killed or removed things from had cast lingering souls and Hazoret and I couldn't beat hazoret.
G2: I got down a bridge which he later killed then an eidolon and chandra, I managed to get myself hellbent and cast a chalice for 3 shutting off k-cmd he tried to dig through looting and in doing so lost a lot of life, eventually bolted the eidolon but by that stage chandra finished him off.
G3: I got down n early chandra and then cast hazoret he had a rabblemaster which I managed to deal with the tokens with hazoret, I eventually got an abrade and killed rabblemaster swinging with hazoret and he scooped.
Round 6: Eldrazi and taxes
G1: Got down an early moon he cast thalia and displacer and I cast a rabblemaster he would swing at me and I was swinging with rabble, eventually got chalice on 1 and a chandra and just won the race.
G2: Cast an early moon and a rabblemaster and just locked him out to which he scooped.
Overall the deck performed well, I did make some punts and bad plays. I tried trinisphere which unfortunately never really came up as I didn't play storm or burn, and unless cast very early on it's usually a bit average. As spirits is becoming much more common and humans is still a big thing will probably try 2 torpor orb. I have completely dropped ballista I may go back to it, but really the only time I wanted it was to kill Thalia which seems very very narrow. I was using 1 surgical and will go up to 2 now, in certain matchups being able to remove all of one particular threat (i.e surgical cryptic command or against GY strategies seems good) and yes it is a bit of a nonbo with chalice but so is cage and relic.
I will try 2 skab-clans again as I feel the control matchup is winnable but we just need more low cmc threats, boil is great when it works but most of the control decks now play lots of non island blue sources so it doesn't really work as well as it used to between colonnade, sulfur falls, spirebluff canal and glacial fortress, also if they have a field of ruin they can just use it to get a basic back and it's only really good if you can do it early to get ahead of them on mana, so I would probably just want more threats.
I kinda wish we had a recursive threat either a creature with flying or deathtouch or something (squee doesn't really seem good enough as just a bear) or a punishing fire type threat.
Well, it's been three days and no answers. I guess we are all still thinking this one over Where most other decks can predictably ramp out there plays in a consistent manner, we can not. And, this common puzzle you've presented has a different answer depending on the day and the meta. You've presented (3) options, but really it's (2) options:
A) Do we lay a mountain - pass
B) Do we lay a mountain, fire off a SSG into a Chalice on 1 - pass.
THEN,[i] on turn 2, after we've learned what our opponent is playing (hah, yeah, statistically, we can reliably forecast what's in an opponent's (60) after their first turn), we choose between:
A) Sit behind the Chalice which was played, drop a land - pass (OR, hope to have drawn a ritual and then moon/rabble)
B) SSG into Moon
C) SSG into Rabblemaster
OK, first - To chalice on 1 or not. How would we describe our hand? It is not explosive. Rabble can run, but a turn 2 rabble will likely not bring home the gold on his own, and there is no backup if he goes down. So, my inclination is to treat this game plan as a 'lock' developer. Well, if we do go for a Turn 1 Chalice, then we have only 1 more land in hand to drop on turn 2. Potential problem: there's a small chance we get stalled IF we do not draw a land source in at least 1 of the next 2 draw steps.
Also, a turn 2 blood moon can be the bomb, but it's exponentially weaker than a turn 1 blood moon. The opponent gets to see our turn 1 mountain - pass. This sends up a flag to them that we may be packing a blood moon, so they'll lead with a fetch land or mana dork.
In a broad meta, the other consideration is 'what do we lose to?' What can I reasonably expect to have a tougher time beating on game 1? Example: KCI or Storm. Should I blindly play to edge up my odds against those tougher decks?
Summary: I would lead with a chalice on 1. Against most decks, it slows the game down. This allows you to continue a slow ramp into a blood moon/rabble - with the chance that you pull one of your remaining 8 rituals. Confidence level on this play is about 65%. I can see the argument for simply going mountain - pass.
Welcome to the group - good query, MrJayngles!
[i]Dazza0187[/i]: Excellent write-up, and your summary of 'things learned' at the bottom of the report is always a welcome addition to a tourney report. 4-2 is an accomplishment, and you definitely analyze the plays like you know your chops. You'll get 'em next time.
[i]Mtgthewary[/i]: Goblin Trashmaster? Now........c'mon!
3 Gemstone Caverns
4 Ramunap Ruins
1 Scavenger Grounds
13 Mountain
Rito Oscuro
4 Simian Spirit Guide
4 Desperate Ritual
1 Pyretic Ritual
Removal
2 Abrade
2 Slagstorm
4 Blood Moon
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Ensnaring Bridge
Threats
4 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
2 Chandra, Fire of Kaladesh
4 Goblin Rabblemaster
1 Koth of the Hammer
1 Hazoret the Fervent
2 Molten Rain
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
1 Abrade
1 Shattering Spree
1 Torpor Orb
1 Damping Matrix
1 Sorcerous Spyglass
1 Boil
2 Anger of the Gods
1 Hazoret the Fervent
Umm...4-1.
Match 1 - Rock
G1: Chalice on 1 -> Moon -> Bridge. Koth -> Emblem -> Concession. Guess I saw a Goyf.
G2: Double discard on Rabble and Haz. Chandra. Bridge, Bridge, a Lilly from them at some point. Emblem and game.
Match 2 - Ad Nauseam
G1: Chalice on 1 followed up by Chandra. Opponent seems to be on the all 1 drops plan. They do land an Unlife, but have nothing besides an Attack Monkey to block my evergrowing army of Goblins.
G2: Opponent mulls to 4, suspending a Lotus and playing an Urborg. Play a land, Chal on 0. They don't have anything, so I proceed to play another land and power out a Molten Rain. Playing a Chandra on their empty board brings out another concession.
Match 3 - GWR Goodstuff or something uhh
G1: They Temple Garden into Rugged Praerie into Looting? I'm like uhh I don't get it. Play T2 Moon anyway. They do get a flashback out of their Looting but the Bolt to follow is the last spell they play. Chandra is too much and they give up.
G2: This is where Molten Rain truly shows its power. They get a Forest out but I moon. Chal on 1. Bloodbraid, Goyf...one Abraded, another one spawns...a Bridge stops it all. I topdeck the Molten Rain and destroy their only basic. That's it, especially after a Chandra and a Chal on 2.
Match 4 - UW Control
G1: T1 Moon does absolutely nothing given their Island and Plains to follow. It even eats a Sphere, but I have another one. Teferi, Koth...Koth goes back to the deck. Jace. I try to desperately land a Chandra, but after getting Negated I give up.
G2: Go go Little Chandra! T1 Chal on 1. T2 Little Chandra. T3 Attack, Moon, untap, ping, transform. Uptick. A Big Chandra. Uptick both. They do try to slow me down with a Clique but I keep the pressure on. Oh did you guys realize Little Chandra can also tag PWs???!!? They have no chance whatsoever.
G3: A reaaaally tough call on the starting hand. Rabble, Rabble, Moon, Simian, Gemstone, Mountain, Chalice. I decide to pitch the other Rabble, which might have cost me the game. I do draw a Mountain, and I'm facing an Island. I figure they might just play a Fetch, so I moon. Big mistake - they play a Plains. I mean, I could've just played a Rabble, but I thought, what if they have a Path? Like, I could just play a Chal on 1 the next turn and the Rabble after that. Well it doesn't unfortunately work that way this time around and they even counter my Chal. A topdecked Eidolon gets Leaked. They play a Stony Silence (what??? it's quite apparent people still don't understand our deck lol) and I play a Rabble. I figure this is my chance, but nope. They have a Sphere. We keep trading blows, Timely Reinforcements, Moon, nothing matters. Boil is countered. Teferi pretty much threatens to end the game but I keep drawing gas. This was pretty good btw: they have 2 Islands and a Plains so I Rain the Plains. A Chainwhirler kills their 2 Mages but they STILL draw into 2 more Plains, finally landing an Angel. That was quite frustrating because without the extra Plains, I would've just ran over them with my Rabble and Whirler. Oh well, it was reeaaaaally close. Could've gone the other way, like really.
Match 5 - Grixis DS
G1: Blah blah Chal on 1 blah blah Stubby D blah blah Bridge concede.
G2: This is another super close a match. They destroy my hand but I topdeck a ritual into a Hazoret. I ALMOST kill them but they have not one, not two, but THREE DSses AND a Zombie Fish. I mean, there's no chance I'm getting through all that and I just die facing three 10/10 DSses.
G3: Ahahaha. They do rip my Chal but I go Eidolon, Eidolon, Eidolon. Try even a Chandra in between. One gets blocked by a Snappie but comeon. They can't obviously keep up and can't play anything else, game over.
Thoughts. Molten Rain is still AWESOME. It's like, it always helps. It's GREAT against combo, setting them back by a whole turn. OR - you just 100% lock them down killing their one single basic. Especially with rituals it becomes a T2 LD. I'd want a third one but I can't fit it in. Also good against control, maybe not so much against aggro...but still the possibility of ruining their post-Moon life is golden.
Little Chandra's also great! It's basically a 3 CMC Chandra that can fight THEIR planeswalkers. I mean it's not exactly great against aggro but still if you can play 2 red spells in a single turn you do get to transform it. Or, if everything else fails it's at least a threat (albeit a very weak one).
Grafdigger's Cage was still not missed but to be fair not even needed with these matchups.
OK that's all I can think of this late. Have a good one.
Rekt 'Em! 4-1. And, did so with a pair of li'l Chans. One other note - albeit obvious - with Chandra, Fire of Kaladesh is that you can simply attack for 2, THEN play a red spell to untap her. Ping for 1. This equals 3 total damage and a free flip to Chandra, Roaring Flame.
Thanks very much for the very thoughtful analysis! Indeed, upon thinking about this a bit more, I think I underestimated just how important the 1-drop slot is in most decks. Shutting down that turn 1 play I do agree is just very powerful, especially before they get to lay the first land. You got thought seize/Iok (black midrange), Vial (humans, spirits, D&T), mana dorks (green decks, humans), other multiple utility dorks (bridgevine, hollow one), combo pieces (KCI, lantern), cantrips (Control, storm), half the burn deck, other various utility like faithless looking, ancient stirrings, expedition map, eggs, and so on...
I was initially scared of being stuck on 2 land and no other play to make, but I think this slows down a LOT of decks enough to warrant it. Also, there's the possibility that a turn 2 moon or rabble master will either be irrelevant or just not enough on its own. Rabble dies in a lot of ways, and moon can be hit or miss against many decks if not T1...all of which you alluded to.
Thanks again!
Treasure Chest opened to reveal.........."Amonkhet Set". I've never seen anything like this in one my MTGO chests. Any kin know what to make of it??
I can guess that it's a set of Amonkhet: a single copy of each card in the 'normal' set. This would not include all of the Masterpiece cards, right? Will anything be foil? Can I or should I look into trading the virtual cards in for a real playset in paper?? How would I do this.
Here's the MTGgoldfish data on the set's worth:
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/index/AKH#online
Congrats!
Can't be the same thing.
Also, thx for the forward on the link, BUT - when trading in a virtual set for a paper set - there is a stated handling fee of $25.00 for the delivery/transaction of a paper set of Amonkhet. Does this calculate as an overall loss to me??
FWD: "Handling Fee: For every set released after February 1, 2013, (including Gatecrash and all sets released afterward) we charge $25.00 handling per set redeemed. For every set released prior to February 1, 2013, (including Return to Ravnica and all previously released sets) we charge $5.00 handling per set redeemed. This charge is the same for domestic U.S. orders and International orders.
Shipping Fee: We have two different shipping rates depending on your shipping address, $2.99 for orders shipped within the United States"
I think pitching the extra Rabble was the right call. However, when going against a potential Path to Exile, I would not hesitate to go T1 Rabble. A PTE on the Rabble means a free and permanent ramp for us. It is still a 2 for 2 trade plus we get ahead on lands for an early Chandra, Koth, chalice for 2 etc.