I am short on time, so this will be a quick post - may come across as short.
Scavenger Grounds vs. Buried Ruin --- both 'sound' good and it 'feels' like they have good applications. In Magic, those terms hold little water. What is the 'believe' or 'know'. As for Graveyard removal, that has never been a focus of this deck. You'd think that since we play absolutely no graveyard interaction cards, we'd be taking advantage of blasting graveyards. Nope - we don't have to. Russ doesn't play relic of progenitus/tormod's crypt and neither do I (rare occasions i will use a single relic as a 1/2 card cantrip)
Scavenger grounds isn't contributing to beating our 'bad' matchups, and that should be our focus:
Dredge -- we kill it
Hollow One -- I play this deck. A one-shot gy rip won't stop it
Mardu Tokens -- Theres some game here, but again, a one-shot gy rip won't stop it
Living End -- A lot of game here
Tarmogoyf -- How quickly does this thing grow again?
Snapcaster Mage -- .....one-shot rip at the cost of a land, 2 mana, and a late game play?
Buried ruin absolutely contributes to beating our 'bad' matchups - our total focus:
buried ruin has a ton of targets. All of which are potential superb retrievals. Know why? Because they are already in our deck
buried ruin cantrips
buried ruin had a total of (20) targets in my (75) on the last deck I posted. Tweeeennnnntttttyyyyyy.
WITCHBANE ORB
Is too slow? Helps against hurkyl's recall? Only stops burn? Like The Wolf said in Pulp Fiction, "if I'm curt, it's because time is of the essence." C'mon now, kin.
SLOW? - we play chandra, hazoret, koth, pia and kiran nalaar, and now people are considering dragons (which I courteously disagree with). And, a 4-cmc artifact is too slow??
HURKYL'S RECALL - no one plays this card anymore. especially when merfolk splashed green, it went away
ONLY STOPS BURN - when questions like this come up, take a moment to review the literature. check my official primer. this question has been researched and the applications for witchbane orb are there.
DECK MATCHUPS WHERE ORB COMES IN:
ELDRAZI TRON (an extremely important matchup right now): walking ballista & endbringer [protects planeswalkers]. also, TKS
BURN: obviously
TRIBAL ZOO: obviously
AFFINITY: depending on your (75), I might squeak one in against there (2) Ghirapur Aether Grid. Unlikely, but maybe - also, galvanic blast
TITANSHIFT: valakut, molten pinnacle
UR STORM: grapeshot and gifts ungiven
LANTERN CONTROL: everything, but who cares since we wreck them
VIZIER/COMPANY: walking ballista
AD NAUSEAM: lightning storm
DREDGE: conflagrate
At least until the planeswalker rule changes, play Witchbane Orb. /public service announcement
Sigh, as long as I am spouting off from the mountain top, please stop playing Boil. It's incongruous with Pyro Prison. As an early card, it's worthless, and the way to beat control is early - not late game 1-for-1 counterspell wars. The only mono-blue, heavy island decks out there are mono-blue Tron and Taking Turns which is to say...there are no heavy island decks out there. If it's the dual lands which count as islands that you are looking to sweep, then that answer is already in your deck. It's called blood moon. I understand that boil is an instant, and it has had its knock-out blows that 'felt' great & you talk about at the 19th hole over a couple heinekens, but when you are limited to only (15), 'know' and 'believe' there are wiser options.
@: doctor_no: interesting thought on the thran temporal gateway. Probably a better match for EDH. I'll be targeting that for my Gisela deck.
@: natehill61: there are (4) ensnaring bridge in the maindeck of Pyro Prison. that is set in stone.
@: butterynuga: i like your chops, man. good report and you found a way to kill goliath. rampaging ferocidon beats mardu tokens.
Ray, I really want to see you on camera at 7-0 day one. It would be fantastic. and yes, 4 bridges main. I toyed around with less and got punished both times. Hey, you gotta try some crazy things to see if they work before dismissing it.
Please keep us updated as the tournament progresses. Would love to see you beat a pro on camera....that would be amazing!
Has any1 seen that bomat burn deck floating around. Uses main deck eidolon, harsh mentor, and rampaging ferocidon. I see people talking about ferocidon in Pyro prison, but could harsh mentor fit the bill as well? As a way to just keep doing incremental damage.
Harsh Mentor fits a broader game of running creature prison style play. Maybe. It's rarely been discussed before, Jaken. Seems like Butterynugs might be the fella to try it out.
As for the main event in Hartford saturday, Russ.....as for the main event Grand Prix. I tried to sign up on Tuesday, and was told that the event has reached its maximum capacity. What....the....Koth.....Almighty. That convention center is friggen' huge. The largest GP in history was in Texas last year when Skred won. These events top off at like 4,000 people, which is to say they never top off. At least, I didn't think they could.
I've tried to contact Channel Fireball, but they have no phone number. So, I guess I'll find out tomorrow when we roll into town. Totally bogus, dudes. Anybody know somebody???? My DCI# is 10472 and I'll paypal you the money back. Friggen bummed here. Looks like I'll cry on DevTheRevRyan's shoulder and then cheer him on.
Harsh Mentor fits a broader game of running creature prison style play. Maybe. It's rarely been discussed before, Jaken. Seems like Butterynugs might be the fella to try it out.
As for the main event in Hartford saturday, Russ.....as for the main event Grand Prix. I tried to sign up on Tuesday, and was told that the event has reached its maximum capacity. What....the....Koth.....Almighty. That convention center is friggen' huge. The largest GP in history was in Texas last year when Skred won. These events top off at like 4,000 people, which is to say they never top off. At least, I didn't think they could.
I've tried to contact Channel Fireball, but they have no phone number. So, I guess I'll find out tomorrow when we roll into town. Totally bogus, dudes. Anybody know somebody???? My DCI# is 10472 and I'll paypal you the money back. Friggen bummed here. Looks like I'll cry on DevTheRevRyan's shoulder and then cheer him on.
Channel fireball tweeted yesterday that the event reached max capacity at 1800 people. Said that was all the event could handle. Needless to say, there was a LOT of grief on Twitter about it.
I have tested with harsh mentor in the sideboard. I used it because lantern control started to become more prevalent. You’ll be happier sticking with eidolon.
Yeeeah, that was my general inclination for mentor --- very cool in that Bomat Burn deck. But, it shares a ton of synergies to make it work. We steal some tech and abuse it broadly. Just remember to target answers for problems you actually need to solve - like i said in my last post. Lantern Control is a near automatic win for us.
As for the Grand Prix, thx so much for the updates Russ. The plan is to attend tomorrow, and hopefully snag an invite off of 'early invitation qualifier'.
Bang the motherhumpin' drums, flaming oubliettes of fury are coming to get ya!!!!! Thunder.....Thunder......Thunder......
Ray, no worries. You'll just have to crush it three days in a row, starting with today. Let's make history. Otherwise, you can destroy the side events and go home with a huge oversized card!
Firstly good luck to all those going to GP Hartford!
While I don't play in large tournies and GPs much my deck has been doing very well in the local tournies and FNM (around 15-30 people) and I have noticed a few things.
Firstly against Jund Hazoret is probably the main card I want. A lot of people play Jund in my local meta so I am almost guaranteed to face one Jund deck so I run one spellskite main and 1 SB and now run 2 hazoret main and have found both very good, Hazoret in particular has given me almost as many wins as chandra as a lot of decks can't deal with hazoret and worst case I just burn my opponent behind a bridge. As an aside I cast a T1 hazoret on the play against Jund in a modern tournie and needless to say won that game.
Secondly I often found I was getting mana screwed or just in top deck mode a lot so I have gone up to 3 magma jets, and have found them amazing in smoothing out draws and generally just helping with top decks. I have found at times I can get mana screwed and was wondering what people think about a 22nd land or may I just need to pile shuffle more.
Lastly the cards I am still not high on are walking ballista and now magus of the moon, these often seem to get sided out. Magus almost always seems to die and in most cases is just a 2/2 chump body, ballista seems to be a 2 mana kill a T1 thing or a chump blocker and ping my opponent for 1. I now run in addition to 2 angers SB, 1 pyroclasm and in most cases I would prefer the pyroclasm than the ballista.
As an aside I have been playing scavenger grounds for a few months now and have found it great, most decks are not expecting it, I have shrunk goyfs on many occasions, have forced blue decks to play around it and it just gives me some extra GY hate for decks like storm or hollow one where I often side out my moons.
I forgot to mention also played odern at my LGS on tuesday night and accidentally left my bridges in my legacy deck and the deck was horrible without them. So I don't think going forward we can go for a bridge-less deck unless the creature count or board wipe count goes up a lot.
I do have another monthly modern tournie comping up this weekend and have noticed the deck struggles a lot against the coco decks with knight of the reliquary and also against hollowed one. Any suggestions?
My SB currently is:
1 Shattering spree
2 Relic of progenitus
2 Sorcerous Spyglass
2 Eidolon
1 Torpor Orb
1 Pyroclasm
2 Anger of the gods
1 Trinisphere
1 Seismic assault
1 Pia and Kiran Nalaar
1 Koth of the Hammer
I agree, magus is terrible right now, especially vs jund. also, Walking Ballista is not great vs jund. you are correct. it is great vs affinity, GW decks, lingering souls, mardu pyromancer, dredge, and hollowone, so it definitely has it's applications. I am down to one ballista in my main deck and up to three abrade. Haazoret is definitely one of the best cards vs jund. no doubt about it.
First time i played today this deck in a 12 player tournament. Finished building and bought last cards 5 minutes bevore Start. To be honest, i played horrible and finished 2:2. funniest moments was turn 1 chandra and 4 eidolons in game ( eidolon, 2 phantasmal image and phyrexian Metamorphose all copies eidolon). Lost hollow one, win pillow fort, win jund, lost spirits
I have a top 8 elimination happening in the morning for the 3 month league i've been in. currently sitting in 3rd right now. wanting to tech and tweak my deck I know my first matchup will be versus humans I also know that there will be Abzhan Coco, Esper Death's shadow, Colorless Eldrazi, Storm and 2 Wildcard decks. I want to tech my main/sideboard to be ready to face stuff since I know most of the matchups. I know we arnt keen on Magus right now but it should help us out greatly versus humans though might shave 1 and add an abrade into its place. My current list is -
Thinking also about splitting up the slag/angers to a 1-1 in mainboard and 1-1 in sideboard so meddling mage doesn't blow me out since the decklists will be available to my Opponents. Other than that all I am open to all suggestions. Kinda wanna bring a 4th Eidolon into the side board as well but not 100% sure on the Shattering spree; One of the wildcards might be affinity he has played it before. Event is starting at 6:30 central tomorrow and I have tell 6 to finalize my list. Also store owner Said he wants to stream to the store's facebook page and I can provide a link to anyone interested. thanks for any words of advice in advance.
I’m considering changing up the main board considerably. I think gonna drop:
Magus of the moon x2
And walking ballista x1
My main issue here is outvalueing a Bloodbraid Elf.
Have any of you tested grim lavamancer against jund as we know it today? Seems like it could be really good.
I top 8’d my fnm tonight.
My matches were
Ponza (lost) 2-1
Famulet titan 2-0
Famulet titan 2-0
Jund kid we drew
Top 8:
Jund first round I lose 2-1
direfleet daredevil is better i think vs jund. Used it yesterday. Fatal push against his big ooze with his own push felt great. Will use 2 next time in my Side
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I am short on time, so this will be a quick post - may come across as short.
Scavenger Grounds vs. Buried Ruin --- both 'sound' good and it 'feels' like they have good applications. In Magic, those terms hold little water. What is the 'believe' or 'know'. As for Graveyard removal, that has never been a focus of this deck. You'd think that since we play absolutely no graveyard interaction cards, we'd be taking advantage of blasting graveyards. Nope - we don't have to. Russ doesn't play relic of progenitus/tormod's crypt and neither do I (rare occasions i will use a single relic as a 1/2 card cantrip)
Scavenger grounds isn't contributing to beating our 'bad' matchups, and that should be our focus:
Dredge -- we kill it
Hollow One -- I play this deck. A one-shot gy rip won't stop it
Mardu Tokens -- Theres some game here, but again, a one-shot gy rip won't stop it
Living End -- A lot of game here
Tarmogoyf -- How quickly does this thing grow again?
Snapcaster Mage -- .....one-shot rip at the cost of a land, 2 mana, and a late game play?
Buried ruin absolutely contributes to beating our 'bad' matchups - our total focus:
buried ruin has a ton of targets. All of which are potential superb retrievals. Know why? Because they are already in our deck
buried ruin cantrips
buried ruin had a total of (20) targets in my (75) on the last deck I posted. Tweeeennnnntttttyyyyyy.
WITCHBANE ORB
Is too slow? Helps against hurkyl's recall? Only stops burn? Like The Wolf said in Pulp Fiction, "if I'm curt, it's because time is of the essence." C'mon now, kin.
SLOW? - we play chandra, hazoret, koth, pia and kiran nalaar, and now people are considering dragons (which I courteously disagree with). And, a 4-cmc artifact is too slow??
HURKYL'S RECALL - no one plays this card anymore. especially when merfolk splashed green, it went away
ONLY STOPS BURN - when questions like this come up, take a moment to review the literature. check my official primer. this question has been researched and the applications for witchbane orb are there.
DECK MATCHUPS WHERE ORB COMES IN:
ELDRAZI TRON (an extremely important matchup right now): walking ballista & endbringer [protects planeswalkers]. also, TKS
BURN: obviously
TRIBAL ZOO: obviously
AFFINITY: depending on your (75), I might squeak one in against there (2) Ghirapur Aether Grid. Unlikely, but maybe - also, galvanic blast
TITANSHIFT: valakut, molten pinnacle
UR STORM: grapeshot and gifts ungiven
LANTERN CONTROL: everything, but who cares since we wreck them
VIZIER/COMPANY: walking ballista
AD NAUSEAM: lightning storm
DREDGE: conflagrate
At least until the planeswalker rule changes, play Witchbane Orb. /public service announcement
Sigh, as long as I am spouting off from the mountain top, please stop playing Boil. It's incongruous with Pyro Prison. As an early card, it's worthless, and the way to beat control is early - not late game 1-for-1 counterspell wars. The only mono-blue, heavy island decks out there are mono-blue Tron and Taking Turns which is to say...there are no heavy island decks out there. If it's the dual lands which count as islands that you are looking to sweep, then that answer is already in your deck. It's called blood moon. I understand that boil is an instant, and it has had its knock-out blows that 'felt' great & you talk about at the 19th hole over a couple heinekens, but when you are limited to only (15), 'know' and 'believe' there are wiser options.
@: doctor_no: interesting thought on the thran temporal gateway. Probably a better match for EDH. I'll be targeting that for my Gisela deck.
@: natehill61: there are (4) ensnaring bridge in the maindeck of Pyro Prison. that is set in stone.
@: butterynuga: i like your chops, man. good report and you found a way to kill goliath. rampaging ferocidon beats mardu tokens.
Please keep us updated as the tournament progresses. Would love to see you beat a pro on camera....that would be amazing!
As for the main event in Hartford saturday, Russ.....as for the main event Grand Prix. I tried to sign up on Tuesday, and was told that the event has reached its maximum capacity. What....the....Koth.....Almighty. That convention center is friggen' huge. The largest GP in history was in Texas last year when Skred won. These events top off at like 4,000 people, which is to say they never top off. At least, I didn't think they could.
I've tried to contact Channel Fireball, but they have no phone number. So, I guess I'll find out tomorrow when we roll into town. Totally bogus, dudes. Anybody know somebody???? My DCI# is 10472 and I'll paypal you the money back. Friggen bummed here. Looks like I'll cry on DevTheRevRyan's shoulder and then cheer him on.
Channel fireball tweeted yesterday that the event reached max capacity at 1800 people. Said that was all the event could handle. Needless to say, there was a LOT of grief on Twitter about it.
As for the Grand Prix, thx so much for the updates Russ. The plan is to attend tomorrow, and hopefully snag an invite off of 'early invitation qualifier'.
Bang the motherhumpin' drums, flaming oubliettes of fury are coming to get ya!!!!! Thunder.....Thunder......Thunder......
While I don't play in large tournies and GPs much my deck has been doing very well in the local tournies and FNM (around 15-30 people) and I have noticed a few things.
Firstly against Jund Hazoret is probably the main card I want. A lot of people play Jund in my local meta so I am almost guaranteed to face one Jund deck so I run one spellskite main and 1 SB and now run 2 hazoret main and have found both very good, Hazoret in particular has given me almost as many wins as chandra as a lot of decks can't deal with hazoret and worst case I just burn my opponent behind a bridge. As an aside I cast a T1 hazoret on the play against Jund in a modern tournie and needless to say won that game.
Secondly I often found I was getting mana screwed or just in top deck mode a lot so I have gone up to 3 magma jets, and have found them amazing in smoothing out draws and generally just helping with top decks. I have found at times I can get mana screwed and was wondering what people think about a 22nd land or may I just need to pile shuffle more.
Lastly the cards I am still not high on are walking ballista and now magus of the moon, these often seem to get sided out. Magus almost always seems to die and in most cases is just a 2/2 chump body, ballista seems to be a 2 mana kill a T1 thing or a chump blocker and ping my opponent for 1. I now run in addition to 2 angers SB, 1 pyroclasm and in most cases I would prefer the pyroclasm than the ballista.
As an aside I have been playing scavenger grounds for a few months now and have found it great, most decks are not expecting it, I have shrunk goyfs on many occasions, have forced blue decks to play around it and it just gives me some extra GY hate for decks like storm or hollow one where I often side out my moons.
I do have another monthly modern tournie comping up this weekend and have noticed the deck struggles a lot against the coco decks with knight of the reliquary and also against hollowed one. Any suggestions?
My SB currently is:
1 Shattering spree
2 Relic of progenitus
2 Sorcerous Spyglass
2 Eidolon
1 Torpor Orb
1 Pyroclasm
2 Anger of the gods
1 Trinisphere
1 Seismic assault
1 Pia and Kiran Nalaar
1 Koth of the Hammer
Magus of the moon x2
And walking ballista x1
My main issue here is outvalueing a Bloodbraid Elf.
Have any of you tested grim lavamancer against jund as we know it today? Seems like it could be really good.
I top 8’d my fnm tonight.
My matches were
Ponza (lost) 2-1
Famulet titan 2-0
Famulet titan 2-0
Jund kid we drew
Top 8:
Jund first round I lose 2-1
4 Goblin Rabblemaster
1 Hazoret the Fervent
2 Magus of the Moon
4 Simian Spirit Guide
2 Walking Ballista
Planeswalker
4 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
1 Koth of the Hammer
Enchantment
4 Blood Moon
2 Abrade
4 Desperate Ritual
1 Pyretic Ritual
Sorcery
2 Slagstorm
Artifact
4 Ensnaring Bridge
4 Chalice of the Void
Land
3 Gemstone Caverns
17 Mountain
1 Mutavault
3 Eidolon of the Great Revel
1 Hazoret the Fervent
1 Spellskite
1 Boil
2 Anger of the Gods
1 Shattering Spree
1 Damping Matrix
2 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Sorcerous Spyglass
1 Torpor Orb
Thinking also about splitting up the slag/angers to a 1-1 in mainboard and 1-1 in sideboard so meddling mage doesn't blow me out since the decklists will be available to my Opponents. Other than that all I am open to all suggestions. Kinda wanna bring a 4th Eidolon into the side board as well but not 100% sure on the Shattering spree; One of the wildcards might be affinity he has played it before. Event is starting at 6:30 central tomorrow and I have tell 6 to finalize my list. Also store owner Said he wants to stream to the store's facebook page and I can provide a link to anyone interested. thanks for any words of advice in advance.