Spyglass better, expecially against tron preventinh him from some plays and giving us info what to do after.
Also with Spyglass you can preventually stop some treat from hand
That's my instinct, too. Needle on Vial is very strong against Humans or D&T, but there's a solid chance we'll be on the play against Humans, so Spyglass does functionally the same thing on time. Knowing what Jund/Junk has and being able to name the right thing (Lili vs. Ooze) seems very good.
All we need to do if blue based control increases is add a Cavern of Souls, and make sure we have access to 1-2 Oblivion Ring effects in the maindeck. This will allow us to reset Jace or nip it early. Even if they do bounce it or exile it we have a lot of time. Sun Titan can bring them back too and with Emeria, the Sky Ruin and Proc we will be straining their exile effects. Most matchups I want my oring and blight except aggro so I tend to prefer the one mana difference. Ixalan's Binding will make its way into my sideboard, but I find being able to curve into Ranger of Eos more important for me than to have access to cycling or flash. Also as I play monowhite and have Sun Titan I obviously prefer the three cost to bring back fallen or discarded exile effects.
Cast Out? You can always cycle it against aggro to find Martyr\Wrath.
Actually, even few brainstroms from Jace can sent us far behind Ux control player. That's the sad thing. And we don't always have enough resources to make pressure.
First game I mulled to 5 because of 5 lands or colorless lands in hand. Keept 5 with Runed Halo on top. Easy game agaist Valakut.
Second with Crucible, Field of Ruin and Ghost Quarter.
Second game agaist UW control. Usually we play one long game - draw.
This time he had Jase. Path into Ascendant, 0,Supreme, +2 and zero answers from my side.
Second I could not keep 7 or 6, and mulled to 5. Zero sideboard cards, zero answers. Disastah!!!111
Third game agains Kiki with Blood Moon and Jace.
Bolt the Ascendant, Moon, Jace and Kiki. Game.
Second match I won and in third I had no answers for Jace or Moon.
Fourth game against Eldrazi Tron.
Hopeless.
Seek into Emrakul, but he had two! I had stuck on 4 lands for a quite some time, Karn was exiling my lands.
After these games I want 3-4 Anguished Unmaking and to put Hex Parasite in main, 2-3 Needles or Spyglasses in sideboard.
Today was a really unlucky day for me with mulls and zero sideboard cards, but I feel that the wind changed. If you can't answer Jace right away - you lose the game no matter that.
Has anyone played something like this?
Maybe it's not appropriate to post about the deck in here since it doesn't even run Proc.
The argument I can see for a pure aggro build like this is to get under control decks running JtMS, while still having advantage over other aggro decks.
Has anyone played something like this?
Maybe it's not appropriate to post about the deck in here since it doesn't even run Proc.
The argument I can see for a pure aggro build like this is to get under control decks running JtMS, while still having advantage over other aggro decks.
It's not Martyr Proc.
It's white weenie with Martyrs.
@ Jiskel
Why you cut Flagstones and GQ? This doesn't look reasonable for me.
2nd Crucible is overwin in my mind. You're not playing Ghostly Prisons so there's no mana lock plan while 2-color manabase can contain enough LD lands. Maybe add 2nd Wayfarer?
What your feeling about Sky Hussar in mainboard? I use it only against Control decks. Against other archetypes it's not fast enough bcs we don't have enough white creatures on board or Hussar can be discarded. But I like it as 4\3 flyer with options.
Why no Thraben inscpector, even 1? It makes very powerfull grind wngine with Proclamation.
After my tests with Gideons I don't see Gideon, Ally of Zendikar in Gideon family woth a slot. I like 3 mana more and 1 of 5mana to lock up.
Why Kataki with Stony? I usually played 2-3 Stony and that was enough for me.
In SB instead of Wayfarer better add Kami of false hope? Sometimes I miss him against superaggro decks (affinity, hollow one and etc.).
Also there's funny tech for SB - World Queller. It's a good body, working as universal removal against everything and can be brought back with Emeria.
Teferi's Moat is not an option now - no more 1 color based decks in Modern. Instead of Traft I would prefer extra counterspells in SB like Negate and etc. to improve combo match up.
Has anyone played something like this?
Maybe it's not appropriate to post about the deck in here since it doesn't even run Proc.
The argument I can see for a pure aggro build like this is to get under control decks running JtMS, while still having advantage over other aggro decks.
So the decklist on CFB was an adaption of an earlier list that went 5-0 on MTGO. The Nassif deck isn't really Martyr Proc... as there are no Procs and Oketras Monumnet doesn't really fit in the control plan. Monument is better in a Soul Sisters list that can benefit from creatures entering the battlefield.
About Avignon's list...
So is Gideon family the way to go? They seem to offer a different angle of attack, and they survive to our wraths.
It's interesting that the list does not present any Mistveil Plains, nor any Flagstones of Trokair.
Instead a lot of lands (25) plus 2 Mind Stones to support the many high-CMC cards.
@lordlukas
Gideon family is strong option but against swarm decks they're not very usefull.And yeah, you noted theme right - they're strong with couple of wrath effects helping you take board.
I also wonder why there's no any Windbrisk heights. Really good advantage land for white weenie deck.
@Jiskel
Sad, I hope next tournaments will be with better results!
I see. If it will help, in 1-2 color manabases I usually adhere to this rule:
11 Plains lands minimum for effectivly activating Emeria in lategame (can be 10 but with strong ramp plan), 2 Emerias, 4 Flagstones, 4 GQ. In total it's 21 lands so the rest 2-3 slots are for utility lands whatever you like.
I see you're testing Prairie Stream. How it feels? Aren't they just another 2 taplands?
Isn't it better to play 23 lands + Crucibele of world and 2 Weathered Wayfarers? More white cards and more tutors for lands, slightly improving Tron match up and decreasing mana screw chances.
About second Crucible - you can also exchange it for single one Sun Titan. He can be good midgame plan working as Crucible of 3rd Proclamation when you need it to. Or Just value body 6\6. Also blinking him with Venser can be fun.
Report please how Parasite would have feel in mainboard. I'm still not sure if I wanna him in main while he doesn not much in a lot of match ups. And can you please tell your feeling about mainboard Sky Hussar?
Actually, I don't feel like Gideon tribal is good way to beat lantern. Usually I win with artifact hate and\or cranial effects (Surgicals, Slaughter games and etc.). Is he really worth a slot? I see him as good +1\+1 effect and grind engine against Jund but don't feel like he will be good in other match ups.
P.s. World QUeller is insane against Lantern when he enters the battlefield - they just can't improve their boardstate anymore. Really funny situation
About Kataki, Stony and your current list I would also suggest single one of Austere command instead of 3rd Stony Silence. I see this card more usefull in more situations than extra Stony.
Also about sideboard: don't you want give a try of single one Sphinx's revelation instead of 4th Negate? Or you meta is combo heavy?
Mainboard: Split 3 Supremes for 2 Supremes + 1 Day of Judgement? Against Human decks.
Has anyone played against BBE jund yet? I know the MOC results aren't really representative of the meta, but I'm interested to hear how different builds have done against the deck.
I think Damping Sphere, from Dominaria leak, could help us against some of our worst match-ups: tron and combos like storm.
What do you think? I will try at least 2 in my SB.
Think I may come back to this deck after Damping Sphere gives us a powerful weapon against some of our worst matchups. What is the plan against UWx Control, though? The graveyard strategy probably isn't reliable if they may have RiP.
Yeah, that's the reason why I came back to this deck.
I usually don't play around graveyard postside so it doesn't matter much. About options - Thrun, the Last Troll and Sphinx of the Final Word or any resolved hexproof creature beats them. Gideons are also pretty good against them.
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Also with Spyglass you can preventually stop some treat from hand
Martyr Proc Thread
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Actually, even few brainstroms from Jace can sent us far behind Ux control player. That's the sad thing. And we don't always have enough resources to make pressure.
I took DemannicTheOrc's build for a basis.
4 Martyr of sands
4 Serra Ascendant
1 Kami of False Hope
1 Weathered Wayfarer
4 Squadron Hawk
2 Ayli, Eternal Pilgrim
3 Ranger of Eos
1 Blood Baron of Vizkopa
SPELLS(16)
4 Path to Exile
4 Orzhov Charm
2 Proclamation of Rebirth
2 Anguished Unmaking
2 Wrath of God
1 Settle the Wreckage
1 Crucible of Worlds
1 Runed Halo
2 Field of Ruin
2 Ghost Quarter
2 Emeria, the Sky Ruin
1 Mistviel Plains
2 Marsh Flats
2 Windswept Heath
4 Godless Shrine
1 Sacred Foundry
1 Swamp
6 Plains
3 Leyline of Sanctity
4 Castigate
1 Extirpate
1 Anguished Unmaking
1 Wrath of God
1 Stony Silence
1 Merciless Eviction
2 Slaughter Games
1 Hide // Seek
First game I mulled to 5 because of 5 lands or colorless lands in hand. Keept 5 with Runed Halo on top. Easy game agaist Valakut.
Second with Crucible, Field of Ruin and Ghost Quarter.
Second game agaist UW control. Usually we play one long game - draw.
This time he had Jase. Path into Ascendant, 0,Supreme, +2 and zero answers from my side.
Second I could not keep 7 or 6, and mulled to 5. Zero sideboard cards, zero answers. Disastah!!!111
Third game agains Kiki with Blood Moon and Jace.
Bolt the Ascendant, Moon, Jace and Kiki. Game.
Second match I won and in third I had no answers for Jace or Moon.
Fourth game against Eldrazi Tron.
Hopeless.
Seek into Emrakul, but he had two! I had stuck on 4 lands for a quite some time, Karn was exiling my lands.
After these games I want 3-4 Anguished Unmaking and to put Hex Parasite in main, 2-3 Needles or Spyglasses in sideboard.
Today was a really unlucky day for me with mulls and zero sideboard cards, but I feel that the wind changed. If you can't answer Jace right away - you lose the game no matter that.
https://www.channelfireball.com/articles/please-jace-dont-let-me-down/
Has anyone played something like this?
Maybe it's not appropriate to post about the deck in here since it doesn't even run Proc.
The argument I can see for a pure aggro build like this is to get under control decks running JtMS, while still having advantage over other aggro decks.
It's not Martyr Proc.
It's white weenie with Martyrs.
Pendelhaven is fine addition if you're not playing Emerias.
Rest are unplayable cards.
Why you cut Flagstones and GQ? This doesn't look reasonable for me.
2nd Crucible is overwin in my mind. You're not playing Ghostly Prisons so there's no mana lock plan while 2-color manabase can contain enough LD lands. Maybe add 2nd Wayfarer?
What your feeling about Sky Hussar in mainboard? I use it only against Control decks. Against other archetypes it's not fast enough bcs we don't have enough white creatures on board or Hussar can be discarded. But I like it as 4\3 flyer with options.
Why no Thraben inscpector, even 1? It makes very powerfull grind wngine with Proclamation.
After my tests with Gideons I don't see Gideon, Ally of Zendikar in Gideon family woth a slot. I like 3 mana more and 1 of 5mana to lock up.
Why Kataki with Stony? I usually played 2-3 Stony and that was enough for me.
In SB instead of Wayfarer better add Kami of false hope? Sometimes I miss him against superaggro decks (affinity, hollow one and etc.).
Also there's funny tech for SB - World Queller. It's a good body, working as universal removal against everything and can be brought back with Emeria.
Teferi's Moat is not an option now - no more 1 color based decks in Modern. Instead of Traft I would prefer extra counterspells in SB like Negate and etc. to improve combo match up.
So the decklist on CFB was an adaption of an earlier list that went 5-0 on MTGO. The Nassif deck isn't really Martyr Proc... as there are no Procs and Oketras Monumnet doesn't really fit in the control plan. Monument is better in a Soul Sisters list that can benefit from creatures entering the battlefield.
The 5-0 MTGO list is:
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/951935#paper
And I play a mono white list like that alot. As do many others in this forum.
So is Gideon family the way to go? They seem to offer a different angle of attack, and they survive to our wraths.
It's interesting that the list does not present any Mistveil Plains, nor any Flagstones of Trokair.
Instead a lot of lands (25) plus 2 Mind Stones to support the many high-CMC cards.
Gideon family is strong option but against swarm decks they're not very usefull.And yeah, you noted theme right - they're strong with couple of wrath effects helping you take board.
I also wonder why there's no any Windbrisk heights. Really good advantage land for white weenie deck.
Sad, I hope next tournaments will be with better results!
I see. If it will help, in 1-2 color manabases I usually adhere to this rule:
11 Plains lands minimum for effectivly activating Emeria in lategame (can be 10 but with strong ramp plan), 2 Emerias, 4 Flagstones, 4 GQ. In total it's 21 lands so the rest 2-3 slots are for utility lands whatever you like.
I see you're testing Prairie Stream. How it feels? Aren't they just another 2 taplands?
Isn't it better to play 23 lands + Crucibele of world and 2 Weathered Wayfarers? More white cards and more tutors for lands, slightly improving Tron match up and decreasing mana screw chances.
About second Crucible - you can also exchange it for single one Sun Titan. He can be good midgame plan working as Crucible of 3rd Proclamation when you need it to. Or Just value body 6\6. Also blinking him with Venser can be fun.
Report please how Parasite would have feel in mainboard. I'm still not sure if I wanna him in main while he doesn not much in a lot of match ups. And can you please tell your feeling about mainboard Sky Hussar?
Actually, I don't feel like Gideon tribal is good way to beat lantern. Usually I win with artifact hate and\or cranial effects (Surgicals, Slaughter games and etc.). Is he really worth a slot? I see him as good +1\+1 effect and grind engine against Jund but don't feel like he will be good in other match ups.
P.s. World QUeller is insane against Lantern when he enters the battlefield - they just can't improve their boardstate anymore. Really funny situation
About Kataki, Stony and your current list I would also suggest single one of Austere command instead of 3rd Stony Silence. I see this card more usefull in more situations than extra Stony.
Also about sideboard: don't you want give a try of single one Sphinx's revelation instead of 4th Negate? Or you meta is combo heavy?
Mainboard: Split 3 Supremes for 2 Supremes + 1 Day of Judgement? Against Human decks.
Will wait for Archaeomancer+Venser report
What do you think? I will try at least 2 in my SB.
3 Gideon of the Trials
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Gideon Jura
Creature (15):
1 Kami of False Hope
1 Weathered Wayfarer
2 Thraben Inspector
4 Martyr of Sands
4 Squadron Hawk
3 Ranger of Eos
Sorcery (9):
4 Glittering Wish
2 Proclamation of Rebirth
1 Day of Judgement
1 Wrath of God
1 Supreme Verdict
4 Path to Exile
Enchantment (3)
1 Search for Azcanta
2 Detention Sphere
Lands (23):
2 Emeria, the Sky Ruin
4 Flagstones of Trokair
4 Ghost Quarter
3 Temple Garden
1 Scattered Groves
2 Hallowed Fountain
2 Mistveil PLains
3 Plains
1 Forest
1 Island
1 Hex Parasite
1 Caustic Caterpillar
3 Celestial Purge
1 Thrun, the Last Troll
1 Meddling Mage
1 Gaddock Teeg
2 Supreme Verdict
1 Narset Transcedent
1 Fracturing Gust
1 Sigarda, Host of Herons
1 Sky Hussar
1 Ajani Unyielding
Deck feels good, see some problem points with manabase will try to fix it.
Modern: Merfolk UU // Green Devotion GG // SkRed Red RR
Legacy: Death & Taxes WW // Burn RR // Death's Shadow Delver UB
Commander: Brago UW // Karlov WB
I usually don't play around graveyard postside so it doesn't matter much. About options - Thrun, the Last Troll and Sphinx of the Final Word or any resolved hexproof creature beats them. Gideons are also pretty good against them.