What do you guys think about Detention Sphere in the main? I like the idea of a flexible answer like Dsphere, but 3 mana (and sorcery speed) might be too slow. Am I better off just throwing in a couple Condemn instead?
What do you guys think about Detention Sphere in the main? I like the idea of a flexible answer like Dsphere, but 3 mana (and sorcery speed) might be too slow. Am I better off just throwing in a couple Condemn instead?
Condemn and dsphere serve different purposes. Condemn stops hardcore aggressio with efficiency while dsphere is very inefficient but versatile and answers slower threats. In modern mana efficiency is king so yes you are better off running condemn.
Saying my sideboard is a trainwreck because you don't like Bribery and Flashfreeze (and fallow the new tendancy to cut Teferi) is not something I would call polite to say the least, especially since I'm reading this thread since day one and I personnally saw Guillaume Wafo-Tapa play the deck at gp Rochester and talked about it the whole way back home (Boston -> Montréal is 4,5 hours trip hehe). And my name is Guillaume
Anyway I knew Bribery was bad and shoudn't have played it but other than that I was pretty happy with the sideboard. Flashfreeze is far from being a bad sideboard card. And also saying the 15 creatures version (Willy Edel style, wich my opponent was playing) is the subpar old version of Junk is also false since they both have different match ups. And on top of that my win rate with this deck is very high and I've got lots of practice on cockatrice and with friends. Anyway I'll keep you guys informed with my fnms and try my best to translate my reports in my 2nd language.
I did made some changes to my sideboard but I'll post what I will end up playing friday.
with the notable maindeck inclusion of a teachings.
The reason I call this a trainwreck is that for most of your matchups, you have "good cards" to bring in, but don't appear to have a cohesive strategy. Let's look at your burn matchup: you brought in everything but disenchant and bribery. You cut all the think twice, two cryptics, two remands, etc. This leaves you with no actual card draw except 2x rev, 2x cryptic, and 4x esper charm in the deck. At the same time, you've also raised the curve significantly. Sure, most of those cards are mediocre to good against burn, but boarding like you listed is cutting of your nose to spite your face. Yes, the burn matchup is hard. Yes, it is possible to pack enough hate that they can't win. No, it's really not correct to do it that way. Almost any time you're bringing in 7 or more cards for a matchup with this deck, it's probably wrong--remember that we're playing a card drawing engine--you strip away too much of the engine, the deck falls on its face without much assistance from the other guy. Sure, there's a few matchups where we might bring in more, but it's the exception not the rule; most of the time, you're bringing in 5-6 cards if you have a balanced sideboard. The other thing that makes this sideboard a trainwreck is that it has no cohesion--I see a pile of marginally cheaper situational countermagic, three different pieces of burn hate with different situational usage, some random situational sweepers that are good in matchups we're already favored in, and then a small core of flexible utility spells with nothing to back them up as parts of a sideboard plan. How would you sideboard vs affinity with that pile? What about against a grixis twin player who aggressively attempts to force the combo against you with discard and dispels? Even within your "burn plan", despite your huge swath of cards that you exchange, you're still overloaded on some early answers that are great in your opening hand, but you're still going to lose a lot of games to chip-shot damage or topdecked burn spells because your only way to lock the game away against them is a 1-of teferi or baneslayer, and you don't have enough cheap ways to pressure them without multiple copies of timely reinforcements. It looks like a sideboard built from a list of "I need x cards against deck y" and then trying to trim down to 15 total slots, not like a sideboard built with actual gameplans in mind. This isn't a midrange deck--we don't just overpower people based on raw card quality, so we can't afford to pack a sideboard full of goodstuff.
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Yes, I am a local area mod. WELP. GOOD LIFE CHANGES ALL HAPPEN AT ONCE AND SOME ARE MUTUALLY EXCLUSIVE
Primary Decks:
Modern: Esper Draw-Go
Legacy: RUG Lands
EDH: Sidisi turn-3 storm
I've been considering adding a pair of Flashfreeze to my sideboard. Just not sure if they bring enough value in enough matchups. Probably overkill against Twin, comes in too late for Tarmogoyf if we're on the draw (and Spell Snare plain does that better). Answers Blood Moon, can potentially stop an Anger of the Gods from wiping our tokens, is active before turn 4 vs infect, can counter Primeval Titan, and trades with burn spells to slow down their clock. Would appreciate input from anyone who has tried them.
Considering just about any competitive combo deck in modern is either red or green based Flashfreeze is gold. I ran it many times before and if modern allowed more sb slots it would definitely go in.
There is not much I would change about your md except the mana base, your def running some questionable numbers as the lack of 4 colonnades is I assume budget issues as you want 4 colonnade before any amount of tar pits and I would flip the numbers on ur plains and island you want 3 islands to be able to cryptic command under blood moon. Once you get back to 4 colonnade your glacial fortress can become another catacomb and I would def look into an additional fetch as 7 is the minimum I would consider running with logic knot in mind.
Sb looks okay tho the 1 of rest I. Peace seems suspect I would suggest an elsprth for midrange matchups.
I have just acquired a third colonnade, and now my mana base is as follows:
I should be able to get a third delta this weekend. Once I do any advice on what land to replace? Also, I should be able to order a fourth colonnade. As far as the SB, I do have another rest, but if I put that in dunno what you would suggest replacing?
Thanks for the advice and help. My sister-in-law was in the hospital so I was unable to attend the tournament this past Tues but am hoping to go next week with at least another delta and maybe those changes to the SB. Thanks again!
Anyone played the new BW Eldrazi deck? Looks annoying with all of the upon cast effects. Night of Souls Betrayal looks nice though.
In regards to D-sphere I have been experimenting with an Utter End in a flex slot, and I haven't been sad to see it in my hand once. Trying a second in the side but I think it ups the curve too much.
I used to play utter end as a singleton when I played teachings, and I'm kind of torn on the card. Its terrible against decks like affinity, infect, burn, or bogles, and often times those are the decks we really care about, but it is quite solid against planeswalkers, keranos, or other such things.
I think the major point is that you have to keep a much lower curve than you would otherwise. I ended up playing 2 teachings, 2-3 cryptics (depending on the day), 3 wipes, an utter end, and a mindbreak trap at 4+, and had the normal tt, esper charm, remand, logic knot, condemn, negate, path, and snare as everything else.
It was alright and I might go back to it.
My issue with teachings is that, if I'm going to warp my deck around teachings, I really want to maximize it and have access to abrupt decay in the mainboard, and krosan grip in the side.
I'm actually working on re-tooling my 5c teachings build at the moment, and if there's interest, I would be willing to share it. It plays out very much like this deck does, at least for game 1's, but it sideboards very differently.
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Yes, I am a local area mod. WELP. GOOD LIFE CHANGES ALL HAPPEN AT ONCE AND SOME ARE MUTUALLY EXCLUSIVE
Primary Decks:
Modern: Esper Draw-Go
Legacy: RUG Lands
EDH: Sidisi turn-3 storm
I'm curious now to see how some kind of five color gifts/teachings/bring to light monstrosity might play.
I messed around with sultai teachings a bit too, and it has some advantages, but I liked cards like rev or colonnade more than what sultai offered.
Hey all, i have been a long time lurker for this thread for awhile. I am pretty good friends with pimpdonny. I have been testing esper control and made the finals of this online single elimination tournament with the deck. Managed to beat a black eldrazi deck splashing blue for several counters 2-0, and also managed to beat amulet 2-0, and a uw control deck with dragonlord ojutai. Black eldrazi is a pretty tough matchup but with proper patients and lines of play the matchup is definitely winnable.
Also knowing in to get in with collonade is important too but i have find myself i have just been jamming in with them even on nonideal times. I think its definitely good to be aggressive with collonade against ramp decks since you want to shorten the clock you put on them and the fact that their topdecks can be so much more powerful then yours. I also find esper charm to be great against the black ramp decks i have been just making them discard two so it makes it easier to get in with collonade with them having few cards in hand. I also like to bounce a land of theirs too with cryptic and then snapcaster flashback cryptic just to also get aggressive with snapcaster.
Bashing in with colonnade is a great way to lose a game when they answer your colonnade while you're tapped low, then untap and jam a threat. It's the most important card in the deck but it's also the easiest way to lose games.
If you need outs to ramp decks, just jam more cliques in the sideboard. That's the best advice I've got. Or, go REALLY deep and jam geists + thoughtseize. That also does work.
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Yes, I am a local area mod. WELP. GOOD LIFE CHANGES ALL HAPPEN AT ONCE AND SOME ARE MUTUALLY EXCLUSIVE
Primary Decks:
Modern: Esper Draw-Go
Legacy: RUG Lands
EDH: Sidisi turn-3 storm
I don't know, this is just my opinion but i like putting a clock on them especially in game 1 through collonade and yes the games against black eldrazi can be pretty grindy and can take awhile to finish.
This is just my reasoning, they instantly gain value from their eldrazis when they cast them like oblivion sower and they also play cavern of souls so you can't really just sit back and hold up reactive spells sometimes you just have to activate collonade and attack. I am not implying you should blindly activate and attack but sometimes you have to draw a line and just get aggressive after you have analyzed the game state closely. Again just my opinion.
There is not much I would change about your md except the mana base, your def running some questionable numbers as the lack of 4 colonnades is I assume budget issues as you want 4 colonnade before any amount of tar pits and I would flip the numbers on ur plains and island you want 3 islands to be able to cryptic command under blood moon. Once you get back to 4 colonnade your glacial fortress can become another catacomb and I would def look into an additional fetch as 7 is the minimum I would consider running with logic knot in mind.
Sb looks okay tho the 1 of rest I. Peace seems suspect I would suggest an elsprth for midrange matchups.
What is suspect about the Rest in Peace in the side? And what would you recommend me taking out for an Elspeth, Sun's Champion in the side? Thanks.
Also, wouldn't it better to have 2 of the extractions/extirpates and if so, not sure how to fit them into what I am suggesting. Sorry for being so annoying here. Thanks again.
Surgical Extraction if you want to go that route. It's a turn faster than Extirpate in some cases and since it isn't a strong card against the decks packing multiple dispels the Split Second rarely makes a difference. The biggest pro to extract effects in my opinion is it gives us a fair chance of beating Tron. Seize plus Extraction and 2 Vendilion Cliques is enough to win the game. I do run Negate, Utter End, and 3 copies of Ghost Quarter as well though. What can I say, I don't like to throw in the towel vs Tron!
This is a well-beaten horse, but isn't Surgical a dead card except when you draw Ghost Quarter? If you've got 2 Ghost Quarter, 80% of the time you draw Surgical it's not hitting a Tron land.
Which makes me think that people are using it to thin the Tron deck of threats. That's like running Memoricide...
I think Gather Specimens or something big and dumb like that is going to be a better "I-win" card. Hell, I put Kheru Spellsnatcher in my sideboard for a second, but decided I had so many cards in my sideboard to transition to a Tempo gameplan that I didn't need a clunky whammy.
Spellsnatcher gives you the cast trigger. The cast trigger. I've spelljacked someone three times with the card in Standard, and it's almost an unwritten rule that your opponent must instantly scoop.
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WUBR [url=http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/06-04-17-ad-nauseam/]Ad Nauseam WUBR
Condemn and dsphere serve different purposes. Condemn stops hardcore aggressio with efficiency while dsphere is very inefficient but versatile and answers slower threats. In modern mana efficiency is king so yes you are better off running condemn.
I call things like I see them; Your sideboard:
1 pulse of the fields
1 timely reinforcements
1 dispel
1 negate
1 flashfreeze
1 celestial purge
1 disenchant
1 bribery
1 teferi, mage of zhalfir
1 vendilion clique
2 runed halo
2 engineered explosives
with the notable maindeck inclusion of a teachings.
The reason I call this a trainwreck is that for most of your matchups, you have "good cards" to bring in, but don't appear to have a cohesive strategy. Let's look at your burn matchup: you brought in everything but disenchant and bribery. You cut all the think twice, two cryptics, two remands, etc. This leaves you with no actual card draw except 2x rev, 2x cryptic, and 4x esper charm in the deck. At the same time, you've also raised the curve significantly. Sure, most of those cards are mediocre to good against burn, but boarding like you listed is cutting of your nose to spite your face. Yes, the burn matchup is hard. Yes, it is possible to pack enough hate that they can't win. No, it's really not correct to do it that way. Almost any time you're bringing in 7 or more cards for a matchup with this deck, it's probably wrong--remember that we're playing a card drawing engine--you strip away too much of the engine, the deck falls on its face without much assistance from the other guy. Sure, there's a few matchups where we might bring in more, but it's the exception not the rule; most of the time, you're bringing in 5-6 cards if you have a balanced sideboard. The other thing that makes this sideboard a trainwreck is that it has no cohesion--I see a pile of marginally cheaper situational countermagic, three different pieces of burn hate with different situational usage, some random situational sweepers that are good in matchups we're already favored in, and then a small core of flexible utility spells with nothing to back them up as parts of a sideboard plan. How would you sideboard vs affinity with that pile? What about against a grixis twin player who aggressively attempts to force the combo against you with discard and dispels? Even within your "burn plan", despite your huge swath of cards that you exchange, you're still overloaded on some early answers that are great in your opening hand, but you're still going to lose a lot of games to chip-shot damage or topdecked burn spells because your only way to lock the game away against them is a 1-of teferi or baneslayer, and you don't have enough cheap ways to pressure them without multiple copies of timely reinforcements. It looks like a sideboard built from a list of "I need x cards against deck y" and then trying to trim down to 15 total slots, not like a sideboard built with actual gameplans in mind. This isn't a midrange deck--we don't just overpower people based on raw card quality, so we can't afford to pack a sideboard full of goodstuff.
Yes, I am a local area mod.WELP. GOOD LIFE CHANGES ALL HAPPEN AT ONCE AND SOME ARE MUTUALLY EXCLUSIVEPrimary Decks:
Modern: Esper Draw-Go
Legacy: RUG Lands
EDH: Sidisi turn-3 storm
Considering just about any competitive combo deck in modern is either red or green based Flashfreeze is gold. I ran it many times before and if modern allowed more sb slots it would definitely go in.
I have just acquired a third colonnade, and now my mana base is as follows:
I should be able to get a third delta this weekend. Once I do any advice on what land to replace? Also, I should be able to order a fourth colonnade. As far as the SB, I do have another rest, but if I put that in dunno what you would suggest replacing?
Thanks for the advice and help. My sister-in-law was in the hospital so I was unable to attend the tournament this past Tues but am hoping to go next week with at least another delta and maybe those changes to the SB. Thanks again!
Once you get a third delta, i would trim the 3rd fountain, and the 4th colonnade replaces the fortress to strengthen the mana base.
Esper draw go Control!
Twitch stream: http://www.twitch.tv/pimpdonny
In regards to D-sphere I have been experimenting with an Utter End in a flex slot, and I haven't been sad to see it in my hand once. Trying a second in the side but I think it ups the curve too much.
I think the major point is that you have to keep a much lower curve than you would otherwise. I ended up playing 2 teachings, 2-3 cryptics (depending on the day), 3 wipes, an utter end, and a mindbreak trap at 4+, and had the normal tt, esper charm, remand, logic knot, condemn, negate, path, and snare as everything else.
It was alright and I might go back to it.
I'm actually working on re-tooling my 5c teachings build at the moment, and if there's interest, I would be willing to share it. It plays out very much like this deck does, at least for game 1's, but it sideboards very differently.
Yes, I am a local area mod.WELP. GOOD LIFE CHANGES ALL HAPPEN AT ONCE AND SOME ARE MUTUALLY EXCLUSIVEPrimary Decks:
Modern: Esper Draw-Go
Legacy: RUG Lands
EDH: Sidisi turn-3 storm
I messed around with sultai teachings a bit too, and it has some advantages, but I liked cards like rev or colonnade more than what sultai offered.
Also knowing in to get in with collonade is important too but i have find myself i have just been jamming in with them even on nonideal times. I think its definitely good to be aggressive with collonade against ramp decks since you want to shorten the clock you put on them and the fact that their topdecks can be so much more powerful then yours. I also find esper charm to be great against the black ramp decks i have been just making them discard two so it makes it easier to get in with collonade with them having few cards in hand. I also like to bounce a land of theirs too with cryptic and then snapcaster flashback cryptic just to also get aggressive with snapcaster.
If you need outs to ramp decks, just jam more cliques in the sideboard. That's the best advice I've got. Or, go REALLY deep and jam geists + thoughtseize. That also does work.
Yes, I am a local area mod.WELP. GOOD LIFE CHANGES ALL HAPPEN AT ONCE AND SOME ARE MUTUALLY EXCLUSIVEPrimary Decks:
Modern: Esper Draw-Go
Legacy: RUG Lands
EDH: Sidisi turn-3 storm
This is just my reasoning, they instantly gain value from their eldrazis when they cast them like oblivion sower and they also play cavern of souls so you can't really just sit back and hold up reactive spells sometimes you just have to activate collonade and attack. I am not implying you should blindly activate and attack but sometimes you have to draw a line and just get aggressive after you have analyzed the game state closely. Again just my opinion.
What is suspect about the Rest in Peace in the side? And what would you recommend me taking out for an Elspeth, Sun's Champion in the side? Thanks.
Esper draw go Control!
Twitch stream: http://www.twitch.tv/pimpdonny
02 Dispel
01 Celestial Purge
01 Wrath of God
01 Extirpate
02 Thoughtseize
02 Stony Silence
02 Timely Reinforcements
02 Leyline of Sanctity
01 Elspeth, Sun's Champion
Also, wouldn't it better to have 2 of the extractions/extirpates and if so, not sure how to fit them into what I am suggesting. Sorry for being so annoying here. Thanks again.
Which makes me think that people are using it to thin the Tron deck of threats. That's like running Memoricide...
I think Gather Specimens or something big and dumb like that is going to be a better "I-win" card. Hell, I put Kheru Spellsnatcher in my sideboard for a second, but decided I had so many cards in my sideboard to transition to a Tempo gameplan that I didn't need a clunky whammy.
Spellsnatcher gives you the cast trigger. The cast trigger. I've spelljacked someone three times with the card in Standard, and it's almost an unwritten rule that your opponent must instantly scoop.