Clique out of the board has definitely been proving itself. I have a funny story that does not prove that point however; I was playing Vs UW earlier today. I absolutely crushed him g1 and was continuing to crush him game 2, he made the control mistake and was playing too aggressively. Anyway, it's turn 57 or something, I have 8 or so soldiers on the field and he's at 5. I know he has a verdict in hand from when I extracted his negates earlier in the game, I also saw that he'd sided out his cryptics for some reason. I Clique him after draw and he has THREE verdicts in hand.. so he verdicts and I cast my second secure at end step.
One thing that I've learned is that Ghost Quarter really keeps our mainland's down, which is unfortunate. I loved pithing needle out of the board for this reason when I was on Abzan. I really wish boards would go up to 20 cards so I could run more answers..
It's not uncommon for people to board out CC in the blue mirror. I think it's a remnant from the Splinter Twin / Delver era when all the relevant blue decks played counterspells that just embarrassed Cryptic.
I think boarding out cryptics in blue mirrors is still correct:
Against anything UR, they could moon us so cutting mana intensive spells has innate value
Against any of the delver or death's shadow variants, they have more mana efficient counterspells and discard, so cmc 4 cards that aren't immediately live when topdecked are awkward.
Against merfolk, cryptic is a card you want to shave for curve reasons usually.
The only remaining category is blue control mirrors. cryptic is powerful here, but mana efficiency is just as big of a deal, and I find myself more likely to be on zero or one cryptics postboard than on two or more.
Private Mod Note
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Yes, I am a local area mod. WELP. GOOD LIFE CHANGES ALL HAPPEN AT ONCE AND SOME ARE MUTUALLY EXCLUSIVE
Primary Decks:
Modern: Esper Draw-Go
Legacy: RUG Lands
EDH: Sidisi turn-3 storm
Hey guys-I've got a decklist that is very similar to my old one, but I decided that I liked WSZ more the Secure. I now have one slot open for the following list. Maybe a Spell Snare?
I may test that eventually, but right now I don't have Halos for the sideboard, much less the main. If I do move the Halos to MB, what would you put in the side for those two empty slots? Also, RN since I don't have Halos, what should that one open slot be?
I've been happy with a one-of Snare, but with your 3x Push MD and 5x 2-cmc counters, there might be something more impactful. Maybe move an EE to the main?
Atomic, to me, runed halo is the best unplayed modern card ever. You gonna catch so many people of guard. For exemple, if you name bolt against grixis control, they automatically become and weak creature deck. If you name mutavault against merfolk, your wraths become more impactful and they have to rely on aether vial to apply decent pressure. Against valakut, and storm its an mvp. Against any green deck, it can blank 4 tarmogoyfs or whatever decent threat hited the board. Against eldrazi, pick your poison, but thought knot seer is a crazy good target. Against infect, and boogle its almost an instant win. Against 8 rax, name raven crime and watch them cry once you chained a coupme TT and ECharm. So for me, that card is either decent or a complete mvp. I know it gets killed by abrupt decay and thats a problem, but since the meta kinda shifted off of it a little (thank you Mr Push) I have never found that card to be more powerfull then now. As for 25 lands I play, I realised that oftentimes, a push, a knot, a path, a runed halo is giving me a free turn. I don't know how to explain this clearly since french is my first language but I'll do my best. I don't think hiting 4 mana on turn 4 is a necessity. I want to hit every land drop for sure, don't get me wrong, and I do it about 90% if not more of all my games. But I think that hiting 10 mana before the game ends is more important than hiting 4 turn 4. Lets say I pushed turn 1, logic knot turn 2, path turn 3, my opponent is on nothing. If I miss a land drop and have a snapcaster in hand, there is still absolutely no way my opponent gets enough momentum to put me in serious danger, exept some rare case scrnario that are rarer than the number of time I cant make my land drop properly. I hope you get the idea I'm trying to share. Good luck with your list. If you need a 1 off to complete it, I suggest BA.
Hey guys-I've got a decklist that is very similar to my old one, but I decided that I liked WSZ more the Secure. I now have one slot open for the following list. Maybe a Spell Snare?
The second Glacial Fortress could be a GQ. Thanks!
Blessed Alliance has been doing God's work for me haha. It's been the most consistent way I've been able to beat burn (alongside the 3rd Snap and now Cliques in the board). It's a little bit of a liability against Death's Shadow and BGx, but I play the 3rd Push in the board (might try to fit in the 4th Push).
Been loving the fact that I can consistently lock the gate and throw away the key against aggro decks with reach and BA's life gain has been a HUGE part of this. Very tempted to make this change tbh...
I was chatting a bit this morning with Pimpdonny and let him know that I was going to GP Copenhagen next week. Apparently he would be interested to have a card signed by Wafo Tapa. If anyone else is interested, I can take some cheap cards with me (dispel, duress, mana leak, logic knot, think twice) and try to have them signed (no guarantee but I will do my best).
All I ask is a PM from you with the card you want to have signed (still this week because I may need to buy cards) and that you take in charge the shipping costs (from Belgium) if I succeed
Well, so far 5-1-1 (we play 40 min rounds on mondays) with this configuration. 3-0 tonight (2-1 UR Delver, 2-0 Affinity, 1-0 UW control). Record doesn't really mean much so to the cards; Gideon has performed very well in a wide range of MU's - UW control, Burn, UR delver, etc. I still don't think you want to play more than 2, but I'm always happy to see him when he shows up as keeping the board clear / manageable is pretty easy with the deck. Cast Out has performed well as well dealing with resolved Blood Moons, Planeswalkers, Cranial Plating, etc. if the card is slow or dead you can cycle which has come up a few times - fuels delirium in my list as well. Cyclers - you can just think of these as split cards (U - instant; uncounterable draw a card and 2UB or 3UW creature) later in the game. In that way, they're versatile, but primarily there as a way to improve consistency and enable the way better CA engine (than TT) in Scour the Laboratory. Scour the Laboratory has been fantastic and has been 4 mana when I needed it to be in all my games except one post-board against BGx, where the fallback of 6 mana draw 3 was still fine. Again, it's my opinion, but this is just more consistent and more powerful than TT. It's allowed me to use my Esper Charms on the discard mode more often and not feeling terrible about it. By the way (confirmed by my local L2) you can cast Scour for 4 mana with Snapcaster if you still have delirium as you flash it back (it's because of CDA - characteristic defining ability). Ergo, Snapcaster is a MUCH better card in a shell like this as Snapcaster - Scour is amazing. SB as always should be determined by local meta and your 60.
I'm still not sure if it should be 4 Architects and 1 Glassdust or 4 Glass and 1 Architects (I've been running the latter). I think it's probably 3 Architects and 2 Glassdust, because the Architects ability is actually decently relevant later in the game and Hulk dodging Push and Bolt isn't that relevant on T15+. I'm probably the only doofus on the planet who spends time pondering this lol.
I basically side in relevant "hate bears" and disruption. Focusing on presenting a clock while disrupting at the same time. I generally cut removal spells and sweepers to find room for this.
I feel I'm generally good post-board with more "permanent" based win conditions as opposed to one off Lightning Bolts. But I do think that in game 1's, Snap/Bolt/Snap has proven itself enough times in my testing to be good ENOUGH against combo decks and to also punish slow starts.
I'm just at the moment feeling like a 3rd Blessed Alliance would be neat to have and the only plausible cut (to keep my curve relevant) I can see is the 3rd Snapcaster Mage but in saying that, I'm not too sure if cutting 1 Snap will punish me against combo decks in game 1...
Bloodyrabbit: disagree. You cant say that push is better without considering his build. He _does_ have leyline and snare, and thus BA _is_ better.
Explain yourself: how having Snare (which "kills" cc2 threats, not cc1) and Leyline would have anything to do with BA > Push? If something, Push is even better in his list, because he doesn't need the life gain from BA thanks to Leylines. So, it's rather the opposite.
Also disagree with your statement that "most lists run sv", when the majority of players in this thread _dont_ run sv. We've played and tuned and worked out this deck over years, wich should count more than random people picking up this deck (after reading articles by peopleh who dont have much experience with the deck) and getting results.
Lol? People getting results should count less than people from this thread? The successful lists are exactly what you should take into consideration, not the other way around.
The last paragraph is what started the math arguments. Bloodrabbit, you are stubborn or blind and YOU are the one that can't understand a thing.
You said those low number of results (that we have no idea how they were made) are more relevant than opinions and tests by threaders here AND furthermore that we should all look up to it. We have used the stats argument to proove you that this was actually the wrong path to take. We tried to teach you that without enough data, in a world of variance, you cannot trust what you see. You have to be wiser and use tools we human made to find it.
The whole thing was simple, and was not an OPINION.
Also, is fetching and shocking on T1 for Serum Visions advisable?
It really depends on a few factors, namely what you're playing VS and what your hand looks like.
For instance, vs Burn it's probably not a great idea unless you're deaparatly digging for something or want to land it before they drop an Eidolon.
But, vs something slower like another UWx control, it can be fine, or if you've only got 2 lands and a TT in hand, it lets you curve into the TT on 2 for maximum hand dig.
G2 vs certain matches you really need certain answers, so it can be correct there too.
One thing that I've learned is that Ghost Quarter really keeps our mainland's down, which is unfortunate. I loved pithing needle out of the board for this reason when I was on Abzan. I really wish boards would go up to 20 cards so I could run more answers..
Against anything UR, they could moon us so cutting mana intensive spells has innate value
Against any of the delver or death's shadow variants, they have more mana efficient counterspells and discard, so cmc 4 cards that aren't immediately live when topdecked are awkward.
Against merfolk, cryptic is a card you want to shave for curve reasons usually.
The only remaining category is blue control mirrors. cryptic is powerful here, but mana efficiency is just as big of a deal, and I find myself more likely to be on zero or one cryptics postboard than on two or more.
Yes, I am a local area mod.WELP. GOOD LIFE CHANGES ALL HAPPEN AT ONCE AND SOME ARE MUTUALLY EXCLUSIVEPrimary Decks:
Modern: Esper Draw-Go
Legacy: RUG Lands
EDH: Sidisi turn-3 storm
3 Supreme Verdict
4x Cryptic Command
4x Esper Charm
3x Fatal Push
3x Logic Knot
2x Negate
4x Path to Exile
2x Sphinx's Revelation
4x Think Twice
1x White Sun's Zenith
1x Drowned Catacomb
4x Flooded Strand
1x Ghost Quarter
2x Glacial Fortress
1x Godless Shrine
2x Hallowed Fountain
3x Island
1x Plains
4x Polluted Delta
1x Swamp
2x Watery Grave
2x Dispel
2x Leyline of Sanctity
1x Negate
2x Runed Halo
1x Supreme Verdict
3x Surgical Extraction
3x Thoughtseize
The second Glacial Fortress could be a GQ. Thanks!
UWR Control
BR Hollow One
35 cards 25 lands. Always on time.
UWR Control
BR Hollow One
Blessed Alliance has been doing God's work for me haha. It's been the most consistent way I've been able to beat burn (alongside the 3rd Snap and now Cliques in the board). It's a little bit of a liability against Death's Shadow and BGx, but I play the 3rd Push in the board (might try to fit in the 4th Push).
UWB Esper Draw-Go Control (clicky)
UW Azorius Control (clicky)
Currently pursuing a degree in Biochemistry.
EDH: I've decided I don't like multiplayer formats.
3 Snapcaster Mage / 2 Blessed Alliance
to:
2 Snapcaster Mage / 3 Blessed Alliance
Been loving the fact that I can consistently lock the gate and throw away the key against aggro decks with reach and BA's life gain has been a HUGE part of this. Very tempted to make this change tbh...
WMMT5dx: Car - RK Coupe Track - Hakone Outbound
All I ask is a PM from you with the card you want to have signed (still this week because I may need to buy cards) and that you take in charge the shipping costs (from Belgium) if I succeed
I'm still not sure if it should be 4 Architects and 1 Glassdust or 4 Glass and 1 Architects (I've been running the latter). I think it's probably 3 Architects and 2 Glassdust, because the Architects ability is actually decently relevant later in the game and Hulk dodging Push and Bolt isn't that relevant on T15+. I'm probably the only doofus on the planet who spends time pondering this lol.
4 Glassdust Hulk
1 Architects of Will
4 Esper Charm
3 Scour the Laboratory
Draw/Removal/Counter:
4 Snapcaster Mage
Board Control:
4 Fatal Push
3 Path to Exile
2 Supreme Verdict
2 Cast Out
2 Gideon of the Trials
Counters:
2 Negate
1 Logic Knot
1 Deprive
3 Cryptic Command
2 Celestial Colonnade
1 Irrigated Farmland
4 Flooded Strand
2 Polluted Delta
2 Marsh Flats
2 Watery Grave
1 Hallowed Fountain
1 Godless Shrine
2 Island
1 Swamp
1 Plains
1 Oboro, Palace in the Clouds
2 Mystic Gate
2 Drowned Catacombs
2 Ceremonious Rejection
1 Dispel
1 Disdainful Stroke
2 Thoughtseize
2 Collective Brutality
1 Blessed Alliance
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Nihil Spellbomb
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Night of Souls Betrayal
1 Stony Silence
Sometimes it feels like I don't play ENOUGH removals... so good to hear that
Anyway, I'll try to explain how I attempt to tackle combo match ups. Keep in mind I do also splash red too.
Main board:
Counters - 2 Mana Tithe, 3 Logic Knot, 3 Cryptic Command
Disruption elements - 1 Surgical Extraction, 1 Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir, 1 Ghost Quarter, 2 Esper Charm
Pressure/Clock - 3 Snapcaster Mage, 3 Lightning Bolt, 2 Kolaghan's Command, 2 Creeping Tar Pit.
Postboard:
1 Ravenous Trap
1 Rakdos Charm
1 Mindbreak Trap
1 Wear // Tear
1 Commandeer
1 Anguished Unmaking
1 Aven Mindcensor
1 Vendilion Clique
1 Notion Thief
1 Voidmage Husher
1 Sulfur Elemental
1 Venser, Shaper Savant
1 Izzet Staticaster
I basically side in relevant "hate bears" and disruption. Focusing on presenting a clock while disrupting at the same time. I generally cut removal spells and sweepers to find room for this.
I feel I'm generally good post-board with more "permanent" based win conditions as opposed to one off Lightning Bolts. But I do think that in game 1's, Snap/Bolt/Snap has proven itself enough times in my testing to be good ENOUGH against combo decks and to also punish slow starts.
I'm just at the moment feeling like a 3rd Blessed Alliance would be neat to have and the only plausible cut (to keep my curve relevant) I can see is the 3rd Snapcaster Mage but in saying that, I'm not too sure if cutting 1 Snap will punish me against combo decks in game 1...
WMMT5dx: Car - RK Coupe Track - Hakone Outbound
You said those low number of results (that we have no idea how they were made) are more relevant than opinions and tests by threaders here AND furthermore that we should all look up to it. We have used the stats argument to proove you that this was actually the wrong path to take. We tried to teach you that without enough data, in a world of variance, you cannot trust what you see. You have to be wiser and use tools we human made to find it.
The whole thing was simple, and was not an OPINION.
UWR Control
BR Hollow One
It really depends on a few factors, namely what you're playing VS and what your hand looks like.
For instance, vs Burn it's probably not a great idea unless you're deaparatly digging for something or want to land it before they drop an Eidolon.
But, vs something slower like another UWx control, it can be fine, or if you've only got 2 lands and a TT in hand, it lets you curve into the TT on 2 for maximum hand dig.
G2 vs certain matches you really need certain answers, so it can be correct there too.
We've got enough debate about secure vs WsZ / souls or no souls, to have to deal with his social justice nonsense.
-White, American, residing in the south.
Jesus Christ you guys. I'm gone for 6 months and now this lmfao