Hi everyone,
I finally finished reading this thread and have fallen in love with this archetype! I brewed this deck up based on this RW Angels deck I found and mashed it together with drmarkb's Suppression Field land destruction list (I love Suppression Field and think it hits a huge swath of decks in the format and some of them fairly hard)
I'm still working on this but would love some input before I pull the trigger. My rational on it is to grab some tempo from the Suppression Field and Boom // Bust and capitalize with evasive threats and finish them off with burn, and angel, or a Bust with a better board presence. The only notable interaction that I haven't seen discussed prior in the thread is Suppression field with clue tokens from Declaration in Stone costing 4 making them less of a drawback.
If you want to land-lock somebody then you have three main paths.
1: Ultimate with Ajani
2: Use the interaction between Goblin Dark-Dwellers and Boom//Bust to create an Armageddon, and try to make certain that your board-state is good prior to going off.
3: "Ghost-Lock" with Crucible of Worlds.
You asked about the third option and that's the one that I've been working on. The main problem is just that the land destruction in Modern is pretty bad compared to what it needs to be. The best LD spell in the format is Smallpox because it gets a creature too, but that's double black. Land destruction is mostly down to overpriced spells (3 cmc is too much unless they double as artifact removal a la pillage) or spells that have a drawback like Boom // Bust and Crack the Earth.
DrMarkB has provided his decklist, which adds various tax cards and is truly about the best you can do for mana denial atm. I keep looking for other angles but if I wanted to win I would copy his list and only make small changes to suit the local meta.
You did have an interesting suggestion with Declaration in Stone btw Ekkus. The interaction with Suppression Field is good, and it also could have an extremely niche interaction with something else. The Eldritch Moon card that I'm most interested in breaking right now is Eternal Scourge. I was planning to use Relic of Progenitus for that but I hate being so narrow that a pithing needle could shut it down, and exiling your own creature sounds better if you can get it back AND you get a clue token out of it.
Hi everyone,
I finally finished reading this thread and have fallen in love with this archetype! I brewed this deck up based on this RW Angels deck I found and mashed it together with drmarkb's Suppression Field land destruction list (I love Suppression Field and think it hits a huge swath of decks in the format and some of them fairly hard)
I'm still working on this but would love some input before I pull the trigger. My rational on it is to grab some tempo from the Suppression Field and Boom // Bust and capitalize with evasive threats and finish them off with burn, and angel, or a Bust with a better board presence. The only notable interaction that I haven't seen discussed prior in the thread is Suppression field with clue tokens from Declaration in Stone costing 4 making them less of a drawback.
Please let me know what you think and any suggestions you might have for this direction of the archetype and concerns about weaknesses/card choices!
I don't want the crucible package in a Moon deck. In fact I don't really want Moon in a Landkill-SField deck, because I don't want to turn on their fetches as mountains, I like them late game once SF is down as non-crackable land drops, something that is very common against the greedier decks, especially post bust.
The crucible package is very effective if you run mindcensor. There is an obvious nonbo between GQ and SF, but it does not really matter- a Sfield down is already doing work, and late game you have a massive mana advantage.....
Moon is annoying for Temples too.
On mana sources I would say it is worth considering painlands and if you are not doing much a single rugged p. as the "need a friend" check lands lands are hard to get working.
In my latest iteration of my list I use a runed halo main and an oust in the board. I will alter my primer for my latest list.
@maniospas....
It would surely depend on the game state and matchup, and on how much infor they have. If you are dead unless you have instant blow-you-out removal Y, and they know it, then you want to scry and leave the mindstone untapped- the untapped mindstone is a potential card off the top you know about or not. It might discourage an all in infect attack, say, especially if you chose to keep it there.
If you need to find permanent X to save you eg a Bridge or Halo type effect vs boggles then I would want to see more cards to give me maximum chance of playing correctly, especially if I have options with the permanents I already have- eg a blocker that can block or not........
Well I can do a small report from last week- I have been busy lately.
R1
Grishoalbrand
2-0
My t2 Suppression field basically ruined the game for him- he used the Jace version, and I had no idea he was on Bobyg. after the first game! He played Jace t2, I killed it with clasm t3, and then he played another that did some stuff. I saw a fair chunk of landkill, I saw Mr. G. Brand come back once, but I had SF down, and he could only hit once with it before passing. I then nerfed land after land, hid behind fields and won. He scooped with two fields down and just fetches.
G2 I lost S field to a t1 duress, but I did lots of landkill, got a Bridge down. His Jace went all the way and ultimated, I was a bit worried but kept his land down to zero before dropping S field. He managed to pitch a Spirit guide for mana and mill me once, but once the second SF came down with a Mindcensor it was game. He almost got a game loss for not shuffling properly between a double fetch activation with Mindcensor down at one point, I was glad he did not.
R2 - A fair junk deck designed to be blood moon proof and critter light is not what I want to face. I know he ran 4 decay, but pulses etc were hard on me. I got him to 12 and played a second Magus when he was down to two land- he had pulse and a mana source in hand to cast it and that was game.
G2 I drew 4 lands in a row when I had some pressure, but he drew all the removal for my permanents. When I died the next card was Bust with Flagtones down and a Magus......( I did learn stuff for when I met him again.
R3 Infect on the draw.
Lose g1 early doors past a ghostly - a t1 Noble is ideal for him.
G2 I get a S field t2 and an Oust t1, and don't really look back as Magus comes to the party and landkill happens.....
G3 I get the t3 Ghostly after a 'clasm t2 that gets stopped by a pair of growths and feel I am dead. He does not get the fetch he needed to win via Become Immense. The match swings to me at that point, especially once Magus comes down. I was very pleased to win from two games on the draw in the match. S field was super great, and my scrys were super for me.
I had to board out lots of win con type cards for this match- Darkdwellers, Crucible. My whole deck thus takes a lot longer to win, so my poor opponent, who I know well, has to go on in game 3 when I have Prisons, Chalice, S Field and Magus down and landkill in hand. Eventually he scoops as the board becomes more ridiculous.
2-1
R4 Boggles-
G1 I get the scoop after t3 chalice
G2 I should have won but laid a Magus over a Chalice. He had the Rancor and another enchantment needed to trample through for exactly lethal, being on only 6 himself due to me killing land. He did make a magus mistake, paying 1 and not 2 when I laid two Magi.
G3 I get Landkill, 'Clasm and Chalice, and that is enough for a scoop.
2-1
R5
Infect.
I get game one on the play, t2 clasm, a t3 kill being negated by Apostle's blessing after he activates an Inkmoth and gives it pro. S field comes down after a Ghostly, though, and from that point it is hard for him to win.
In G2 he thinks he has me t4 with a Ghostly down via an activation of Inkmoth, but in fact he can't cast, activate and pay. I then take control as S field, Chalice and Magus hit in an order I can't remember but was brutally effective. Halo does a bit of work here and although he Pierces one landkill spell he can't hit them all. Again I remove both Dwellers, making winning harder and making him having to sit there as the prison builds around him.
- 1/4 finalss
V A bad affinity deck, if there ever is such a thing.
G1 He gets the Overseer who twice is exactly one too big to kill.
Ghostly reduces my damage significantly, but eventually he gets 2 citadel a mox and a sprigleaf to hit me for lethal. I just needed a magus to win.
G2 - I drop chalice for zero and when magus hits t4 he is screwed as I have ghostly down and citadels have not turned up, meaning his land is killable in the intervening turns. He finishes on 0 permanents.
G3 Just as facile, really. A stony silence the turn after I kill his glimmervoid is cruel, a Magus t4 is game. He has the removal spell for Stony, but Mox can't tap.
2-1
semis- back to the fair dck, and this time I bring in Linvala as it is a 3/4 flyer and I want as many different threats as possible, and as much flying as possible.
G1 - tight, his third path wins it for him, I get a lot killed, manage a boom bust with magus down but he has bagged 3 land in hand and comes back. Pathing Magus and Dweller and Linvala was harsh for me, he finished by nibbling in their air with Spirit tokns. I am tempted when he is on 12 to throw two Helices to the face, but kill a Goyf instead, which may have been an error.
G2 I mull to 5 but this is actually the closest game of all, I get done in the end by a Scooze, which if I had kept Mystifying Maze in would have been no issue as I always had a Magus blocker. Eventually he gets it to 7 and wins. Leyline keeps me in it as he takes a discard heavy hand.
0-2
I have changed my list slightly, increasing the number of ousts in the board to 2, introducing a second halo to the board and dropping CTD totally as although it is great v Tron I feel it is too narrow. I also have gone to 3 Stony and not 4. Bridge is gone too, great card but unnecessary in my build.
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The match report is much appreciated. The fair Junk deck I feel is troublesome. It undermines most of our concept if a deck like that can tolerate our resource denial efforts.
I noticed a repeated theme of Magus not closing out the game. Of course sometimes he seals it, but as a curve-topper it seems that he should be more reliable than that.
Yes, he really sealed the deal against unfair Infect and Affinity when he showed up, but did not do it vs the fair deck and to an extent against boggles....
Beating Junk in landkill is hard, but not impossible. A Karma could have done something- leave the swamps till last and hit the green, as could a the Mystifying Maze. He knew to keep Path in against me, which did not help. Just running Rest in Peace x2/3 would help the match a long way- rubbish goyfs, voices that do nothing when they "die", finks that stays dead, no souls. The issue is it hurts Dwellers who are great vs the rest.............
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Well I've been away for quite some time. Nice to see this deck type is still getting some work. Might be tooting my horn but interesting to see World Queller in some of the lists as I *think* I was the first one to throw them in to create a Stax style countdown. The latest goblin that came out seems to make this deck style quite interesting especially when added into a few of the lands.
He is in the primer of course, although that is in the generally more casual decks- he was showcased in the article on the mothership in 2012, so I included those decks as articles are thin on the ground and it is nice to see where we came from...I love him but he can't really be justified today. Unlike Magus he does not influence the board for a while and costs a whopping 5cc. I wish he were 3 cc and a 1/4 or 4 cc and a 2/5 or whatever. To be honest even in Legacy Smokestack does not always make Stax decks nowadays for the same reasons. Dark-Dweller is nuts, he really combos well with boom//bust, at least until they change the rules, and he does impact the board pretty much as he is cast- a 4/4 menace body is often just the bonus.....)
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3 Chalice of the Void
4 Suppression Field
2 Lightning Helix
3 Anger of the Gods
4 Boom // Bust
4 Stone Rain
4 Molten Rain
1 Crucible of Worlds
2 Goblin Dark-Dwellers
4 Magus of the Tabernacle
4 Ghostly Prison
1 Stormbreath Dragon
I would definately recommend people trying this deck-archetype out, cuz it's both fun and really good in the actual meta.
First match was against Coco-Company, they had no chance as they both run a greedy mana base, and anger of the gods take care of pretty much every dude they play...
Second was vs a Mardu-control brew. They had me with a few discard spells, but played too many dead cards (removal) and their tokens from lingering souls did pretty much nothing against Magus and Ghostly prison. One time they had a Liliana at 6, and I had 2 suppression fields out, so they couldn't both play a spell and activate her... I just waited a few turns, playing nothing (to keep my hand intact with her going +1 each turn) until I got a Goblind Dark-Dweller and turned the fight (had 2 Boom/Bust in the grave so...). With no mana on board, they couldn't activate her, or do anything about my goblin, so it was just a few turns before they were dead.
Third up was Burn. Straight, ordinary naya burn. They were on the play but I held a hand with Chalice, so I got a few spells from them before turning the tide of battle with lots of land destruction and a lightning helix played twice (one from hand, one from graveyard). Match 2 they had a great start, killing me on turn 3. Match 3 I got both Leyline and Chalice on hand, so it was pretty much game at that point, and they never drew their enchantment-removal.
Fourth I met the Death & Taxes deck in modern. Pretty much a heatbear-deck with some eldrazi elements going. This was a hard matchup, both because of Thalia (making pretty much every card in my deck worthless) but also because how much discard and card-steal they had... At last matchm in time I turned the tide with Bust, with them having a Bitterblossom in game (I guess from sideboard vs control?) ticking them at 1 each turn. With two ghostly in play, they could just sit there wait for 4 new lands to attack with one of their tokens each turn... but forntunately for me, that took too long for them.
Last, fifth match me and my opponent never played, we just drawed into the top 8.
And in the quarterfinals I met Elves! I hate that deck as they rarely care about their lands except for the few first turns, as they have lots of mana-givers. Unfortunately for them, I play Anger and pretty much kill everything they play. Tabernacle did do some stuff, but their Druid-lord that taps for 1 green for each elf did the trick, so they rarely had any problems with keeping their dudes on board. That is, until I killed that sucker. Therefrom i turned the tide in my favour, beating them slowly to death with my magus and destroying their lands.
Semifinals... Dredge. The new modern-beast back again, with new engines... I knew it was played, but I couldn't play RiP because of my Flagstones and Goblins, so I had to make a call... I made the wrong choice, as I picked Tormod's, which pretty much does nothing except buying you a turn against dredge. So I got owned by a few large Trolls, and a flashbacked Conflagrate on 11. Though, I learned a lesson... I'm now changing my 2 Tormod's to 2 Sun och Wheel and Moon (just need to buy 2) as they shut down all my opponents stuff, and I get to play Goblins and Flagstones as usual. Also looking for another Linvala, as it completely shuts down lots of good creatures in the meta, and It's another wincon in my not so win-con heavy decklist.
3 Chalice of the Void
4 Suppression Field
2 Lightning Helix
3 Anger of the Gods
4 Boom // Bust
4 Stone Rain
4 Molten Rain
1 Crucible of Worlds
2 Goblin Dark-Dwellers
4 Magus of the Tabernacle
4 Ghostly Prison
1 Stormbreath Dragon
I would definately recommend people trying this deck-archetype out, cuz it's both fun and really good in the actual meta.
First match was against Coco-Company, they had no chance as they both run a greedy mana base, and anger of the gods take care of pretty much every dude they play...
Second was vs a Mardu-control brew. They had me with a few discard spells, but played too many dead cards (removal) and their tokens from lingering souls did pretty much nothing against Magus and Ghostly prison. One time they had a Liliana at 6, and I had 2 suppression fields out, so they couldn't both play a spell and activate her... I just waited a few turns, playing nothing (to keep my hand intact with her going +1 each turn) until I got a Goblind Dark-Dweller and turned the fight (had 2 Boom/Bust in the grave so...). With no mana on board, they couldn't activate her, or do anything about my goblin, so it was just a few turns before they were dead.
Third up was Burn. Straight, ordinary naya burn. They were on the play but I held a hand with Chalice, so I got a few spells from them before turning the tide of battle with lots of land destruction and a lightning helix played twice (one from hand, one from graveyard). Match 2 they had a great start, killing me on turn 3. Match 3 I got both Leyline and Chalice on hand, so it was pretty much game at that point, and they never drew their enchantment-removal.
Fourth I met the Death & Taxes deck in modern. Pretty much a heatbear-deck with some eldrazi elements going. This was a hard matchup, both because of Thalia (making pretty much every card in my deck worthless) but also because how much discard and card-steal they had... At last matchm in time I turned the tide with Bust, with them having a Bitterblossom in game (I guess from sideboard vs control?) ticking them at 1 each turn. With two ghostly in play, they could just sit there wait for 4 new lands to attack with one of their tokens each turn... but forntunately for me, that took too long for them.
Last, fifth match me and my opponent never played, we just drawed into the top 8.
And in the quarterfinals I met Elves! I hate that deck as they rarely care about their lands except for the few first turns, as they have lots of mana-givers. Unfortunately for them, I play Anger and pretty much kill everything they play. Tabernacle did do some stuff, but their Druid-lord that taps for 1 green for each elf did the trick, so they rarely had any problems with keeping their dudes on board. That is, until I killed that sucker. Therefrom i turned the tide in my favour, beating them slowly to death with my magus and destroying their lands.
Semifinals... Dredge. The new modern-beast back again, with new engines... I knew it was played, but I couldn't play RiP because of my Flagstones and Goblins, so I had to make a call... I made the wrong choice, as I picked Tormod's, which pretty much does nothing except buying you a turn against dredge. So I got owned by a few large Trolls, and a flashbacked Conflagrate on 11. Though, I learned a lesson... I'm now changing my 2 Tormod's to 2 Sun och Wheel and Moon (just need to buy 2) as they shut down all my opponents stuff, and I get to play Goblins and Flagstones as usual. Also looking for another Linvala, as it completely shuts down lots of good creatures in the meta, and It's another wincon in my not so win-con heavy decklist.
How did Blessed Alliance help you in sideboard matchups, against burn and not against it? Was it better than Kor Firewalker for you or did you feel like it did more work in general?
3 Chalice of the Void
4 Suppression Field
2 Lightning Helix
3 Anger of the Gods
4 Boom // Bust
4 Stone Rain
4 Molten Rain
1 Crucible of Worlds
2 Goblin Dark-Dwellers
4 Magus of the Tabernacle
4 Ghostly Prison
1 Stormbreath Dragon
I would definately recommend people trying this deck-archetype out, cuz it's both fun and really good in the actual meta.
First match was against Coco-Company, they had no chance as they both run a greedy mana base, and anger of the gods take care of pretty much every dude they play...
Second was vs a Mardu-control brew. They had me with a few discard spells, but played too many dead cards (removal) and their tokens from lingering souls did pretty much nothing against Magus and Ghostly prison. One time they had a Liliana at 6, and I had 2 suppression fields out, so they couldn't both play a spell and activate her... I just waited a few turns, playing nothing (to keep my hand intact with her going +1 each turn) until I got a Goblind Dark-Dweller and turned the fight (had 2 Boom/Bust in the grave so...). With no mana on board, they couldn't activate her, or do anything about my goblin, so it was just a few turns before they were dead.
Third up was Burn. Straight, ordinary naya burn. They were on the play but I held a hand with Chalice, so I got a few spells from them before turning the tide of battle with lots of land destruction and a lightning helix played twice (one from hand, one from graveyard). Match 2 they had a great start, killing me on turn 3. Match 3 I got both Leyline and Chalice on hand, so it was pretty much game at that point, and they never drew their enchantment-removal.
Fourth I met the Death & Taxes deck in modern. Pretty much a heatbear-deck with some eldrazi elements going. This was a hard matchup, both because of Thalia (making pretty much every card in my deck worthless) but also because how much discard and card-steal they had... At last matchm in time I turned the tide with Bust, with them having a Bitterblossom in game (I guess from sideboard vs control?) ticking them at 1 each turn. With two ghostly in play, they could just sit there wait for 4 new lands to attack with one of their tokens each turn... but forntunately for me, that took too long for them.
Last, fifth match me and my opponent never played, we just drawed into the top 8.
And in the quarterfinals I met Elves! I hate that deck as they rarely care about their lands except for the few first turns, as they have lots of mana-givers. Unfortunately for them, I play Anger and pretty much kill everything they play. Tabernacle did do some stuff, but their Druid-lord that taps for 1 green for each elf did the trick, so they rarely had any problems with keeping their dudes on board. That is, until I killed that sucker. Therefrom i turned the tide in my favour, beating them slowly to death with my magus and destroying their lands.
Semifinals... Dredge. The new modern-beast back again, with new engines... I knew it was played, but I couldn't play RiP because of my Flagstones and Goblins, so I had to make a call... I made the wrong choice, as I picked Tormod's, which pretty much does nothing except buying you a turn against dredge. So I got owned by a few large Trolls, and a flashbacked Conflagrate on 11. Though, I learned a lesson... I'm now changing my 2 Tormod's to 2 Sun och Wheel and Moon (just need to buy 2) as they shut down all my opponents stuff, and I get to play Goblins and Flagstones as usual. Also looking for another Linvala, as it completely shuts down lots of good creatures in the meta, and It's another wincon in my not so win-con heavy decklist.
Similar to my list, similar results too- well done. Dredge is not so bad for us, Ghostly Prison, Magus and landkill hurt them. Leyline hits the Conflagrate post board. I always like 4 in the board. I don't run Anger OTG, so Elves is hard for me game one, I find Livala is a beast in that match. Tormod's is terrible, Relic is better, Grafdigger's and Wheel are better, as is playing the nonbo with RIP/Flagstones and just living with it and taking out the Crucible.
I use Blessed Alliance in White-X pillow fort, it is a great card, very flexible, but for landkill I prefer Oust.
How is the match versus Jund? Because abrupt decay and maelstrom pulse, is destoyer with the supression field and Ghostly prision.
How sideboarding vs Jund?,What card is the best vs Jund,Junk,....?
Most versions of Landkill Stax and Bride/Moon lists have grindy matches vs Jund/k. There are no perfect solutions.
Karma is very good, albiet narrow; it will rapidly kill Planeswalkers and players, and normally 3 or 4 a turn is pretty quick to kill with all their self-harm and Molten Rain damage. It does not work well with wiping the board's lands, but that is far less likely to happen when you can't get an advantage out of it. Karma is also Decay-proof, meaning it needs to be Pulsed or Charmed post board. Aiming landkill at the green is not a bad idea anyway, leaving Swamps.
You can't cast the big half of boom-bust unless you have a good board presence, which is hard when they kill everything in sight, and the Geddon/fetch a land/Magus combo mid game rarely comes off, making RIP's nonbo with Flagstones less of a big issue, so if you run RIP board it in- it is a strong anti-Jund or Junk board card, hitting Finks, Lingering Souls, Goyf and directing Abrupt Decays. Boarding in one flying one ofs - eg Linvala- is actually quite profitable- aside from hitting the odd activated ability (eg Scaveging Ooze in Jund), they tend to set up nuts ground defenses but are weaker in the air. But there is no magic button- Outpost Siege is pretty strong and must be dealt with, and I have seen lists with it in the board for grindy BG-x decks. Again dodging Decay, its very strong. Assemble the Legion is good too, athough it probably is not an ideal fit for landkill decks. Keldon Megaliths is a decent land against Jund/k, the pinging for one hitting lingering souls, keeps Liliana down, and if they run Bobs it shoots them alongside Finks with-1-1 counters too.
The alternative is to board in cards like Mirran Crusader- but that sucks if they have Path or especially Bolt.
been dormant from this deck with the resurgence of blue counterspell decks when ancestral vision and sword were unbanned. My bridge version only had bad matchups against counterspells and rock decks. Since I run the full lockdown version, I was always frustrated that my lock pieces would barely make it, but eventually get killed. Spellskite was good, but not enough because fundamentally, lockdown doesn't work against jund. They'll eventually draw out of the blood moon and find an answer or whatever. Likewise, counterspells completely wreck you (holy remand batman) because they just get to keep playing their game while denying your lock. Terrible. I used to run things like defense grid/ricochet trap and outpost siege, but they ultimately are on the same axis as lock pieces. When the unban happened and mtgo became overrun with blue decks, I shelved the deck for a bit and played some other decks. I never lost my love for this archetype, and I always would play it hoping the heavy counterspell decks would subside. Lo, that day has come.
Blue is currently a lot more skewed to the "play proactive spells for reveler" type deals right now and heavy counterspell decks are at an all time low. This led me to some rethinking of the archetype and I came upon a pretty deep realization: you need threats against these decks. While lock piece are questions that require answers, they are not threatening per se. When I dropped suppression field earlier in my testing for the reason that it was ultimately a lock piece for planeswalkers (read liliana) because of similar reasons I explained above, I included Ajani in my sideboard, leery of including it main deck since I liked the idyllic tutor package I was running with Assemble the legion wincon. (As an aside, the other reason I dropped suppression field was because against anything other than midrange decks where it gave you time against fetchlands and planeswalkers, the other lock pieces I ran were far superior and left field feeling underwhelming). Ajani was always the most difficult thing for jund to deal with coupled with my other lock pieces. I was a true threat, albeit a weak one. I still like his ability to destroy lands, but it led me to search for planeswalker finishers to sub in for outpost siege. Chandra, Flamecaller is my current choice. In theory, Elspeth, sun's champion is more powerful, but double white under blood moon is not something I want to be searching for. I've had a crush on Chandra since she was printed and I think she is just so powerful. Can stabilize most boards that are under a bridge and can race effectively otherwise. Her 0 can eventually draw you into 3 cards to start attacking even under a bridge if you're trying to close out the game on an empty board against control. The key is that she is effective in both matchups like ajani. Anyway, list below
This deck is super unfair btw. Like I feel legitimately bad playing against some matchups. Against suicide zoo (the deck full of one drops, notorious for not playing basics, whose only hope to beat you with no creatures is direct damage) just now, third game on the play, I leyline, first turn plains ssg into chalice, second turn radiant fountain blood moon to their lone tapped godless shrine. I literally felt like a jerk.
Not much of an update since last time. card choices continue to be relevant and have proven their worth. Every component is necessary, and the idyllic tutor package is worth it every time. Gets the bullets you need or AtL when you need it. Torpor orb was increased to 2 slots when it proved itself against blue decks with snapcaster and vendilion, not to mention the main reason it is there: reclamation sage. That card is just silly against us. Cherry on top that it also shuts down various combos. singleton boom is great against grindy matchups for bust, but also for the annoying tron or arbor elf type ramp decks. affinity is not a bad matchup per se, you can just never truly lock them down because it's so easy for them to get under you and being able to pick off many noncreature artifacts is really what the deck needs to seal the deal once your lock is setup. If there is an uptick in affinity, you can just add another one over a nevermore (spell based combo decks are on the decline and it's not really needed but it's nice to bring something in for the helixes or what not). Only thing I kinda wish I had sometimes is a pithing needle/phyrexian revoker effect, but both have their pretty severe downsides which is why I still don't include them: being turned off by chalice (notice I don't run a single 1 drop) and turning on opponent's removal (only creature in the 75 is spellskite cause you know ssg don't count) respectively.
Anyway, I highly recommend running the deck right now. It's always been super powerful and only has 2 real bad matchups (and really it's remand/leak and decay), and the metagame is super hospitable to it right now. Matchup analysis below
Jund - you can't lock jund out because of all the axes it plays on. Nothing KO's it. that being said, RIP isn't bad, leyline is great, blood moon is traditionally great, nevermore is great against decay, wrath is good, ajani is good, bust is good, spellskite is good against decay, and of course recent addition chandra. It's not a terrible matchup, it's just hard and not ez mode like almost every matchup. Almost your entire sideboard is good against it.
Bant Eldrazi - Ensnaring bridge, wrath, torpor orb, blood moon, even chalice isn't terrible like against other eldrazi matchups.
Affinity - how can a deck with md stony and ways to tutor for it ever have a terrible matchup against affinity? spellskite is good, albeit the nonbo, chalice, wrath, blood moon (for nexus). Kinda slim pickins on super hateful cards, but shattering spree fills holes and can be upped in count
Infect - chalice, prison, moon, helix, bridge (eventually), spellskite, wrath are all good. pretty easy matchup
Merfolk - can be a tough matchup if they pack a lot of counters, but it's still a creature deck that has to battle through prison, bridge, helix, unlife, stony and chalice on 2.
dredge - stony silence is to affinity as rest in peace is to dredge. Again, still a creature deck that has to battle through prison, bridge, helix, unlife, moon (ish).
burn - leyline, chalice, helix, unlife is pretty much KO. blood moon is not even that bad
Tron - Not a great matchup, but moon, stony, o ring, nevermore, bust, and spellskite even pull some decent weight against them.
suicide zoo - See above. it's unfair how good this deck is against them.
Jeskai - the other baddie. Same deal as Jund. shave on a lot of things, but diversify. Planeswalkers for finishers.
RG Breach - bridge, moon, leyline, lock their main wincons. torpor orb from the side is great and bust can surprise them.
Ad nauseam - leyline, nevermore, chalice, stony, moon (ish), helix (for maniac) are all great. this is one of the matchups where nevermore shines. if it weren't for it's bonus use against decay, nevermore would be a looser choice. it's great against combo tho in a deck that is very dedicated to creature hate
Chord decks - could use a cage, but the one drop status is jarring. torpor orb, rip, prison, cage, moon, etc.
Bogles - bridge, spellskite, chalice, are great
Storm - tough and tense matchup since a timely echoing truth can beat us, but they have to get it before we lock them out completely with spellskite. leyline and prison lock out grapeshot and empty the warrens effectively so it's a matter of them finding anti hate
I'm losing steam but I hope you can see that the deck has great matchups
Edit: Chandra is really good fyi. The 0 is deceptively strong. Cashing in lands for gas is so good.
I have been fiddling with Moon/Bridge lists a lot recently. Beating remand/leak lists is most likely when Rest in Peace is main deck- I use 3 copies- stopping Snappy CA is key. I just get fed up with those snappy/remand tricks,a nd RIP is a decent meta shout anyway. Ajani is pretty good in the match too. If the control deck is a Nahiri UWR one and it lands her early its much harder to win game 1, even if you use O ring type cards and burn.
S field is better in landkill decks, without that it is not so stellar unless it does some other job- eg count toards enchantments in Pillow-Fort builds.
One solution for UR- matches is to board into Obliterate, if you are Enchantment heavy you get a good board to work with. It still does not solve Nahiri, but Pithing Needling her allows time to get rid of her.
One for Jund and decay decks in general is Karma. They need to draw the Pulse pretty quickly.
I like Outpost siege too against both UWR-X and BG-x, if you get enough cards like ATL, and Siege, i.e. ones that rapidly need answers, you can win games. C n P Nalaar works ok too.
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I do not know if she is an upgrade- killing an enchantment is probably harder than killing a planeswalker, plus the needles can be common in some metas.
Good luck with the Isochron build!
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Forgot to put this here. http://magic.tcgplayer.com/db/article.asp?ID=13466
Boros Control, our sort of stuff Chalice, Leylines, Boom Bust. A hybrid of Moon/Chalice/Bridge/Ajani type decks and Stax Landkill, only with a few more critters and no bridge.
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I have been fiddling with Moon/Bridge lists a lot recently. Beating remand/leak lists is most likely when Rest in Peace is main deck- I use 3 copies- stopping Snappy CA is key. I just get fed up with those snappy/remand tricks,a nd RIP is a decent meta shout anyway. Ajani is pretty good in the match too. If the control deck is a Nahiri UWR one and it lands her early its much harder to win game 1, even if you use O ring type cards and burn.
S field is better in landkill decks, without that it is not so stellar unless it does some other job- eg count toards enchantments in Pillow-Fort builds.
One solution for UR- matches is to board into Obliterate, if you are Enchantment heavy you get a good board to work with. It still does not solve Nahiri, but Pithing Needling her allows time to get rid of her.
One for Jund and decay decks in general is Karma. They need to draw the Pulse pretty quickly.
I like Outpost siege too against both UWR-X and BG-x, if you get enough cards like ATL, and Siege, i.e. ones that rapidly need answers, you can win games. C n P Nalaar works ok too.
I have been dabbling with a bridge build, and was pretty happy with Outpost siege. Lately I saw Chandra, Pyromaster mentioned in the thread, and she might be a minor upgrade.
2RR should effectively be the same as 3R in this deck.
Herr +0 ability does exactly the same as Outpost siege(@Khans). This is the mode I would expect to use the most.
The +1 isn't great, but might be able to deal with an annoying utility creature here and there. This seems pretty potent vs a deck like Soul Sisters or Elves. Could also help contain an opposing PW.
I wouldn't expect the ultimate to be used very often.
Of course, a planes walker is a bit more vulnerable than an enchantment, but if it takes a bullet (i.e. a Lightning Bolt or an attack) for the player, isn't that ok?
She can be disabled by Pithing Needle effects whereas OS is a triggered ability. Shouldn't be a big deal though.
I have also been having difficulties with Ux counter heavy decks. Boil seems like the perfect SB card. Not sure how to tweak the main deck, though. Here is my current (rough) list for reference:
Any comments on the deck are welcome. The Scepters are a bit of an experiment. They are obv. vulnerable to removal, but if they take an Abrupt Decay for a bridge, that is typically an acceptable trade. They also help empty the hand. If the Scepters go, the Boros Charms go with them. The main purpose of Boros Charm is to protect the lock pieces. Not a great solution as it is rather situational.
Forgot to put this here. http://magic.tcgplayer.com/db/article.asp?ID=13466
Boros Control, our sort of stuff Chalice, Leylines, Boom Bust. A hybrid of Moon/Chalice/Bridge/Ajani type decks and Stax Landkill, only with a few more critters and no bridge.
I took some inspiration from the planeswalkers in that build. I have found chandra, flamecaller to be really good, which is way better than chandra, pyromaster
to be clear, her +1 takes over games if you don't have your bridge out.
If you are under bridge, then her +0 can cycle lands and redundant cards and provides real card advantage against Uxx and BGx decks.
Her -X is also bonkers because it adds 2 more sweepers, albeit really expensive, to the deck after the 2 wrath.
I have also been having difficulties with Ux counter heavy decks. Boil seems like the perfect SB card. Not sure how to tweak the main deck, though.
In my experience, Boil was too inconsistent. Most of the higher tier decks running counters also run a good handful of manlands, fast lands and check lands (likely more in the near future, since Spirebluff Canal was just spoiled). If you draw 1 of your 2 copies by turn 4, there's a reasonable chance that it's just a 4-mana Stone Rain against something like Grixis or Jeskai Control... That just doesn't (consistently) make enough of an impact in my opinion. Holding onto it longer to try to hit more Islands feels like a losing proposition because it's not interfering with their game plan while it sits in your hand. Meanwhile they're just drawing into more potential counters with every draw step and/or deploying Nahiri or Tasigur or whatever.
Personally I've liked Restoration Angel so far as an unboltable, instant speed creature that either presents a clock, or they have to tap some mana to counter it and hopefully you can push through a haymaker (Nahiri in my list) when you untap. Boil can hit a lot of Islands against something like Merfolk, but that should already be a good matchup with all the mass creature hate. Plus it'll feel really bad when you keep a hand with Boil and they kept double Spreading Seas lol. Blue Tron is much lower tier and it's not going to get a whole lot better with a pair of Boils in post board games anyway. I don't know... it just doesn't feel good enough to me... As they say, YMMV.
I haven't played this deck at all lately, but I if I were to sleeve it up this week I would probably run 2-3 Ricochet Trap in those slots. Not only does it give you a shot at pushing through your own spells (albeit slightly behind curve), the Misdirection effect is pretty sweet when you nail an Ancestral Vision with it while they're holding Spell Snare, Mana Leak or Remand.
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WUBG Atraxa Superfriends WRBG Saskia's Angry UBRG Yidris Valuetown WUBR Breya "not just for infinite combos anymore" Etherium Shaper
mana]W[/mana]UR Narset the Nerfed WBG Ghave counters madness BRG Prossh, Token Master UBG Tasigur Seedborn Control WU Brago Bouncy Castle WB Karlov Voltron B Erebos/Drana MBC R Feldon jank
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I finally finished reading this thread and have fallen in love with this archetype! I brewed this deck up based on this RW Angels deck I found and mashed it together with drmarkb's Suppression Field land destruction list (I love Suppression Field and think it hits a huge swath of decks in the format and some of them fairly hard)
4 temple of triumph
4 battlefield forge
4 sacred foundry
3 plain
1 mountain
1 keldon megalith
2 ghost quarter
1 mystifying maze
2 chalice of the void
4 suppression field
2 lightning helix
2 pyroclasm
4 boom // bust
4 stone rain
4 molten rain
1 ensnaring bridge
4 ghostly prison
2 aven mindcensor
4 magus of the tabernacle
2 Goblin Dark Dwellers
1 crumble to dust
4 stony silence
2 eidolon of rhetoric
2 linvala, keeper of silence
3 leyline of sanctity
1 boil
1 grafdigger's cage
1 pyroclasm
2 Brimaz, King of Oreskos
1 Linvala, Keeper of Silence
4 Guardian Seraph
2 Baneslayer Angel
2 Goblin Dark-Dwellers
Other spells (24)
4 Lightning Bolt
1 Celestial Flare
4 Lightning Helix
2 Declaration in Stone
4 Boom // Bust (Boom)
2 Anger of the Gods
4 Suppression Field
3 Leyline of Sanctity
2 Plains
3 Mountain
4 Flagstones of Trokair
2 Rugged Prairie
1 Slayers' Stronghold
4 Clifftop Retreat
1 Cavern of Souls
4 Temple of Triumph
4 Sacred Foundry
2 Crumble to Dust
2 Stony Silence
1 Rest in Peace
2 Sudden Shock
2 Timely Reinforcements
1 Eidolon of Rhetoric
1 Wrath of God
2 Wear // Tear
2 Grafdigger's Cage
I'm still working on this but would love some input before I pull the trigger. My rational on it is to grab some tempo from the Suppression Field and Boom // Bust and capitalize with evasive threats and finish them off with burn, and angel, or a Bust with a better board presence. The only notable interaction that I haven't seen discussed prior in the thread is Suppression field with clue tokens from Declaration in Stone costing 4 making them less of a drawback.
On a side note: what are people's thoughts on a Crucible of Worlds package (Ghost Quarter, Horizon Canopy, Fetch Lands) in a deck running 3-4 Blood Moons?
Please let me know what you think and any suggestions you might have for this direction of the archetype and concerns about weaknesses/card choices!
1: Ultimate with Ajani
2: Use the interaction between Goblin Dark-Dwellers and Boom//Bust to create an Armageddon, and try to make certain that your board-state is good prior to going off.
3: "Ghost-Lock" with Crucible of Worlds.
You asked about the third option and that's the one that I've been working on. The main problem is just that the land destruction in Modern is pretty bad compared to what it needs to be. The best LD spell in the format is Smallpox because it gets a creature too, but that's double black. Land destruction is mostly down to overpriced spells (3 cmc is too much unless they double as artifact removal a la pillage) or spells that have a drawback like Boom // Bust and Crack the Earth.
DrMarkB has provided his decklist, which adds various tax cards and is truly about the best you can do for mana denial atm. I keep looking for other angles but if I wanted to win I would copy his list and only make small changes to suit the local meta.
I don't want the crucible package in a Moon deck. In fact I don't really want Moon in a Landkill-SField deck, because I don't want to turn on their fetches as mountains, I like them late game once SF is down as non-crackable land drops, something that is very common against the greedier decks, especially post bust.
The crucible package is very effective if you run mindcensor. There is an obvious nonbo between GQ and SF, but it does not really matter- a Sfield down is already doing work, and late game you have a massive mana advantage.....
Moon is annoying for Temples too.
On mana sources I would say it is worth considering painlands and if you are not doing much a single rugged p. as the "need a friend" check lands lands are hard to get working.
In my latest iteration of my list I use a runed halo main and an oust in the board. I will alter my primer for my latest list.
@maniospas....
It would surely depend on the game state and matchup, and on how much infor they have. If you are dead unless you have instant blow-you-out removal Y, and they know it, then you want to scry and leave the mindstone untapped- the untapped mindstone is a potential card off the top you know about or not. It might discourage an all in infect attack, say, especially if you chose to keep it there.
If you need to find permanent X to save you eg a Bridge or Halo type effect vs boggles then I would want to see more cards to give me maximum chance of playing correctly, especially if I have options with the permanents I already have- eg a blocker that can block or not........
R1
Grishoalbrand
2-0
My t2 Suppression field basically ruined the game for him- he used the Jace version, and I had no idea he was on Bobyg. after the first game! He played Jace t2, I killed it with clasm t3, and then he played another that did some stuff. I saw a fair chunk of landkill, I saw Mr. G. Brand come back once, but I had SF down, and he could only hit once with it before passing. I then nerfed land after land, hid behind fields and won. He scooped with two fields down and just fetches.
G2 I lost S field to a t1 duress, but I did lots of landkill, got a Bridge down. His Jace went all the way and ultimated, I was a bit worried but kept his land down to zero before dropping S field. He managed to pitch a Spirit guide for mana and mill me once, but once the second SF came down with a Mindcensor it was game. He almost got a game loss for not shuffling properly between a double fetch activation with Mindcensor down at one point, I was glad he did not.
R2 - A fair junk deck designed to be blood moon proof and critter light is not what I want to face. I know he ran 4 decay, but pulses etc were hard on me. I got him to 12 and played a second Magus when he was down to two land- he had pulse and a mana source in hand to cast it and that was game.
G2 I drew 4 lands in a row when I had some pressure, but he drew all the removal for my permanents. When I died the next card was Bust with Flagtones down and a Magus......( I did learn stuff for when I met him again.
R3 Infect on the draw.
Lose g1 early doors past a ghostly - a t1 Noble is ideal for him.
G2 I get a S field t2 and an Oust t1, and don't really look back as Magus comes to the party and landkill happens.....
G3 I get the t3 Ghostly after a 'clasm t2 that gets stopped by a pair of growths and feel I am dead. He does not get the fetch he needed to win via Become Immense. The match swings to me at that point, especially once Magus comes down. I was very pleased to win from two games on the draw in the match. S field was super great, and my scrys were super for me.
I had to board out lots of win con type cards for this match- Darkdwellers, Crucible. My whole deck thus takes a lot longer to win, so my poor opponent, who I know well, has to go on in game 3 when I have Prisons, Chalice, S Field and Magus down and landkill in hand. Eventually he scoops as the board becomes more ridiculous.
2-1
R4 Boggles-
G1 I get the scoop after t3 chalice
G2 I should have won but laid a Magus over a Chalice. He had the Rancor and another enchantment needed to trample through for exactly lethal, being on only 6 himself due to me killing land. He did make a magus mistake, paying 1 and not 2 when I laid two Magi.
G3 I get Landkill, 'Clasm and Chalice, and that is enough for a scoop.
2-1
R5
Infect.
I get game one on the play, t2 clasm, a t3 kill being negated by Apostle's blessing after he activates an Inkmoth and gives it pro. S field comes down after a Ghostly, though, and from that point it is hard for him to win.
In G2 he thinks he has me t4 with a Ghostly down via an activation of Inkmoth, but in fact he can't cast, activate and pay. I then take control as S field, Chalice and Magus hit in an order I can't remember but was brutally effective. Halo does a bit of work here and although he Pierces one landkill spell he can't hit them all. Again I remove both Dwellers, making winning harder and making him having to sit there as the prison builds around him.
- 1/4 finalss
V A bad affinity deck, if there ever is such a thing.
G1 He gets the Overseer who twice is exactly one too big to kill.
Ghostly reduces my damage significantly, but eventually he gets 2 citadel a mox and a sprigleaf to hit me for lethal. I just needed a magus to win.
G2 - I drop chalice for zero and when magus hits t4 he is screwed as I have ghostly down and citadels have not turned up, meaning his land is killable in the intervening turns. He finishes on 0 permanents.
G3 Just as facile, really. A stony silence the turn after I kill his glimmervoid is cruel, a Magus t4 is game. He has the removal spell for Stony, but Mox can't tap.
2-1
semis- back to the fair dck, and this time I bring in Linvala as it is a 3/4 flyer and I want as many different threats as possible, and as much flying as possible.
G1 - tight, his third path wins it for him, I get a lot killed, manage a boom bust with magus down but he has bagged 3 land in hand and comes back. Pathing Magus and Dweller and Linvala was harsh for me, he finished by nibbling in their air with Spirit tokns. I am tempted when he is on 12 to throw two Helices to the face, but kill a Goyf instead, which may have been an error.
G2 I mull to 5 but this is actually the closest game of all, I get done in the end by a Scooze, which if I had kept Mystifying Maze in would have been no issue as I always had a Magus blocker. Eventually he gets it to 7 and wins. Leyline keeps me in it as he takes a discard heavy hand.
0-2
I have changed my list slightly, increasing the number of ousts in the board to 2, introducing a second halo to the board and dropping CTD totally as although it is great v Tron I feel it is too narrow. I also have gone to 3 Stony and not 4. Bridge is gone too, great card but unnecessary in my build.
I noticed a repeated theme of Magus not closing out the game. Of course sometimes he seals it, but as a curve-topper it seems that he should be more reliable than that.
Beating Junk in landkill is hard, but not impossible. A Karma could have done something- leave the swamps till last and hit the green, as could a the Mystifying Maze. He knew to keep Path in against me, which did not help. Just running Rest in Peace x2/3 would help the match a long way- rubbish goyfs, voices that do nothing when they "die", finks that stays dead, no souls. The issue is it hurts Dwellers who are great vs the rest.............
:symr::xmana:Welder Stax:xmana::symr:
:symb:Pox:symb:
Modern:
:symw::symr:Thoughts of the Magus of the Ghostly Prison (TMGP) [WIP]:symr::symw:
He is in the primer of course, although that is in the generally more casual decks- he was showcased in the article on the mothership in 2012, so I included those decks as articles are thin on the ground and it is nice to see where we came from...I love him but he can't really be justified today. Unlike Magus he does not influence the board for a while and costs a whopping 5cc. I wish he were 3 cc and a 1/4 or 4 cc and a 2/5 or whatever. To be honest even in Legacy Smokestack does not always make Stax decks nowadays for the same reasons. Dark-Dweller is nuts, he really combos well with boom//bust, at least until they change the rules, and he does impact the board pretty much as he is cast- a 4/4 menace body is often just the bonus.....)
Just went to the semifinals in a PPTQ here in Sweden with the following decklist:
4 Flagstones of Trokair
4 Temple of Triumph
4 Sacred Foundry
2 Ghost Quarter
7 Mountain
1 Plains
2 Rugged Prairie
3 Chalice of the Void
4 Suppression Field
2 Lightning Helix
3 Anger of the Gods
4 Boom // Bust
4 Stone Rain
4 Molten Rain
1 Crucible of Worlds
2 Goblin Dark-Dwellers
4 Magus of the Tabernacle
4 Ghostly Prison
1 Stormbreath Dragon
SIDEBOARD
SB: 2 Stony Silence
SB: 1 Linvala, Keeper of Silence
SB: 2 Runed Halo
SB: 2 Leyline of Sanctity
SB: 2 Tormod's Crypt
SB: 1 Celestial Purge
SB: 1 Pyroclasm
SB: 2 Blessed Alliance
SB: 1 Eidolon of Rhetoric
SB: 1 Lightning Helix
I would definately recommend people trying this deck-archetype out, cuz it's both fun and really good in the actual meta.
First match was against Coco-Company, they had no chance as they both run a greedy mana base, and anger of the gods take care of pretty much every dude they play...
Second was vs a Mardu-control brew. They had me with a few discard spells, but played too many dead cards (removal) and their tokens from lingering souls did pretty much nothing against Magus and Ghostly prison. One time they had a Liliana at 6, and I had 2 suppression fields out, so they couldn't both play a spell and activate her... I just waited a few turns, playing nothing (to keep my hand intact with her going +1 each turn) until I got a Goblind Dark-Dweller and turned the fight (had 2 Boom/Bust in the grave so...). With no mana on board, they couldn't activate her, or do anything about my goblin, so it was just a few turns before they were dead.
Third up was Burn. Straight, ordinary naya burn. They were on the play but I held a hand with Chalice, so I got a few spells from them before turning the tide of battle with lots of land destruction and a lightning helix played twice (one from hand, one from graveyard). Match 2 they had a great start, killing me on turn 3. Match 3 I got both Leyline and Chalice on hand, so it was pretty much game at that point, and they never drew their enchantment-removal.
Fourth I met the Death & Taxes deck in modern. Pretty much a heatbear-deck with some eldrazi elements going. This was a hard matchup, both because of Thalia (making pretty much every card in my deck worthless) but also because how much discard and card-steal they had... At last matchm in time I turned the tide with Bust, with them having a Bitterblossom in game (I guess from sideboard vs control?) ticking them at 1 each turn. With two ghostly in play, they could just sit there wait for 4 new lands to attack with one of their tokens each turn... but forntunately for me, that took too long for them.
Last, fifth match me and my opponent never played, we just drawed into the top 8.
And in the quarterfinals I met Elves! I hate that deck as they rarely care about their lands except for the few first turns, as they have lots of mana-givers. Unfortunately for them, I play Anger and pretty much kill everything they play. Tabernacle did do some stuff, but their Druid-lord that taps for 1 green for each elf did the trick, so they rarely had any problems with keeping their dudes on board. That is, until I killed that sucker. Therefrom i turned the tide in my favour, beating them slowly to death with my magus and destroying their lands.
Semifinals... Dredge. The new modern-beast back again, with new engines... I knew it was played, but I couldn't play RiP because of my Flagstones and Goblins, so I had to make a call... I made the wrong choice, as I picked Tormod's, which pretty much does nothing except buying you a turn against dredge. So I got owned by a few large Trolls, and a flashbacked Conflagrate on 11. Though, I learned a lesson... I'm now changing my 2 Tormod's to 2 Sun och Wheel and Moon (just need to buy 2) as they shut down all my opponents stuff, and I get to play Goblins and Flagstones as usual. Also looking for another Linvala, as it completely shuts down lots of good creatures in the meta, and It's another wincon in my not so win-con heavy decklist.
How did Blessed Alliance help you in sideboard matchups, against burn and not against it? Was it better than Kor Firewalker for you or did you feel like it did more work in general?
Similar to my list, similar results too- well done. Dredge is not so bad for us, Ghostly Prison, Magus and landkill hurt them. Leyline hits the Conflagrate post board. I always like 4 in the board. I don't run Anger OTG, so Elves is hard for me game one, I find Livala is a beast in that match. Tormod's is terrible, Relic is better, Grafdigger's and Wheel are better, as is playing the nonbo with RIP/Flagstones and just living with it and taking out the Crucible.
I use Blessed Alliance in White-X pillow fort, it is a great card, very flexible, but for landkill I prefer Oust.
Most versions of Landkill Stax and Bride/Moon lists have grindy matches vs Jund/k. There are no perfect solutions.
Karma is very good, albiet narrow; it will rapidly kill Planeswalkers and players, and normally 3 or 4 a turn is pretty quick to kill with all their self-harm and Molten Rain damage. It does not work well with wiping the board's lands, but that is far less likely to happen when you can't get an advantage out of it. Karma is also Decay-proof, meaning it needs to be Pulsed or Charmed post board. Aiming landkill at the green is not a bad idea anyway, leaving Swamps.
You can't cast the big half of boom-bust unless you have a good board presence, which is hard when they kill everything in sight, and the Geddon/fetch a land/Magus combo mid game rarely comes off, making RIP's nonbo with Flagstones less of a big issue, so if you run RIP board it in- it is a strong anti-Jund or Junk board card, hitting Finks, Lingering Souls, Goyf and directing Abrupt Decays. Boarding in one flying one ofs - eg Linvala- is actually quite profitable- aside from hitting the odd activated ability (eg Scaveging Ooze in Jund), they tend to set up nuts ground defenses but are weaker in the air. But there is no magic button- Outpost Siege is pretty strong and must be dealt with, and I have seen lists with it in the board for grindy BG-x decks. Again dodging Decay, its very strong. Assemble the Legion is good too, athough it probably is not an ideal fit for landkill decks. Keldon Megaliths is a decent land against Jund/k, the pinging for one hitting lingering souls, keeps Liliana down, and if they run Bobs it shoots them alongside Finks with-1-1 counters too.
The alternative is to board in cards like Mirran Crusader- but that sucks if they have Path or especially Bolt.
been dormant from this deck with the resurgence of blue counterspell decks when ancestral vision and sword were unbanned. My bridge version only had bad matchups against counterspells and rock decks. Since I run the full lockdown version, I was always frustrated that my lock pieces would barely make it, but eventually get killed. Spellskite was good, but not enough because fundamentally, lockdown doesn't work against jund. They'll eventually draw out of the blood moon and find an answer or whatever. Likewise, counterspells completely wreck you (holy remand batman) because they just get to keep playing their game while denying your lock. Terrible. I used to run things like defense grid/ricochet trap and outpost siege, but they ultimately are on the same axis as lock pieces. When the unban happened and mtgo became overrun with blue decks, I shelved the deck for a bit and played some other decks. I never lost my love for this archetype, and I always would play it hoping the heavy counterspell decks would subside. Lo, that day has come.
Blue is currently a lot more skewed to the "play proactive spells for reveler" type deals right now and heavy counterspell decks are at an all time low. This led me to some rethinking of the archetype and I came upon a pretty deep realization: you need threats against these decks. While lock piece are questions that require answers, they are not threatening per se. When I dropped suppression field earlier in my testing for the reason that it was ultimately a lock piece for planeswalkers (read liliana) because of similar reasons I explained above, I included Ajani in my sideboard, leery of including it main deck since I liked the idyllic tutor package I was running with Assemble the legion wincon. (As an aside, the other reason I dropped suppression field was because against anything other than midrange decks where it gave you time against fetchlands and planeswalkers, the other lock pieces I ran were far superior and left field feeling underwhelming). Ajani was always the most difficult thing for jund to deal with coupled with my other lock pieces. I was a true threat, albeit a weak one. I still like his ability to destroy lands, but it led me to search for planeswalker finishers to sub in for outpost siege. Chandra, Flamecaller is my current choice. In theory, Elspeth, sun's champion is more powerful, but double white under blood moon is not something I want to be searching for. I've had a crush on Chandra since she was printed and I think she is just so powerful. Can stabilize most boards that are under a bridge and can race effectively otherwise. Her 0 can eventually draw you into 3 cards to start attacking even under a bridge if you're trying to close out the game on an empty board against control. The key is that she is effective in both matchups like ajani. Anyway, list below
This deck is super unfair btw. Like I feel legitimately bad playing against some matchups. Against suicide zoo (the deck full of one drops, notorious for not playing basics, whose only hope to beat you with no creatures is direct damage) just now, third game on the play, I leyline, first turn plains ssg into chalice, second turn radiant fountain blood moon to their lone tapped godless shrine. I literally felt like a jerk.
4 radiant fountain
3 clifftop retreat
4 arid mesa
4 sacred foundry
5 plains
1 mountain
4 simian spirit guide
4 lightning helix
4 leyline of sanctity
4 chalice of the void
4 blood moon
4 ensnaring bridge
4 ghostly prison
2 idyllic tutor
1 rest in peace
1 stony silence
1 nevermore
1 phyrexian unlife
2 oblivion ring
2 assemble the legion
1 stony silence
1 nevermore
1 shattering spree
1 boom
2 wrath of god
2 spellskite
2 torpor orb
2 ajani vengeant
2 chandra, flamecaller
Not much of an update since last time. card choices continue to be relevant and have proven their worth. Every component is necessary, and the idyllic tutor package is worth it every time. Gets the bullets you need or AtL when you need it. Torpor orb was increased to 2 slots when it proved itself against blue decks with snapcaster and vendilion, not to mention the main reason it is there: reclamation sage. That card is just silly against us. Cherry on top that it also shuts down various combos. singleton boom is great against grindy matchups for bust, but also for the annoying tron or arbor elf type ramp decks. affinity is not a bad matchup per se, you can just never truly lock them down because it's so easy for them to get under you and being able to pick off many noncreature artifacts is really what the deck needs to seal the deal once your lock is setup. If there is an uptick in affinity, you can just add another one over a nevermore (spell based combo decks are on the decline and it's not really needed but it's nice to bring something in for the helixes or what not). Only thing I kinda wish I had sometimes is a pithing needle/phyrexian revoker effect, but both have their pretty severe downsides which is why I still don't include them: being turned off by chalice (notice I don't run a single 1 drop) and turning on opponent's removal (only creature in the 75 is spellskite cause you know ssg don't count) respectively.
Anyway, I highly recommend running the deck right now. It's always been super powerful and only has 2 real bad matchups (and really it's remand/leak and decay), and the metagame is super hospitable to it right now. Matchup analysis below
Jund - you can't lock jund out because of all the axes it plays on. Nothing KO's it. that being said, RIP isn't bad, leyline is great, blood moon is traditionally great, nevermore is great against decay, wrath is good, ajani is good, bust is good, spellskite is good against decay, and of course recent addition chandra. It's not a terrible matchup, it's just hard and not ez mode like almost every matchup. Almost your entire sideboard is good against it.
Bant Eldrazi - Ensnaring bridge, wrath, torpor orb, blood moon, even chalice isn't terrible like against other eldrazi matchups.
Affinity - how can a deck with md stony and ways to tutor for it ever have a terrible matchup against affinity? spellskite is good, albeit the nonbo, chalice, wrath, blood moon (for nexus). Kinda slim pickins on super hateful cards, but shattering spree fills holes and can be upped in count
Infect - chalice, prison, moon, helix, bridge (eventually), spellskite, wrath are all good. pretty easy matchup
Merfolk - can be a tough matchup if they pack a lot of counters, but it's still a creature deck that has to battle through prison, bridge, helix, unlife, stony and chalice on 2.
dredge - stony silence is to affinity as rest in peace is to dredge. Again, still a creature deck that has to battle through prison, bridge, helix, unlife, moon (ish).
burn - leyline, chalice, helix, unlife is pretty much KO. blood moon is not even that bad
Tron - Not a great matchup, but moon, stony, o ring, nevermore, bust, and spellskite even pull some decent weight against them.
suicide zoo - See above. it's unfair how good this deck is against them.
Jeskai - the other baddie. Same deal as Jund. shave on a lot of things, but diversify. Planeswalkers for finishers.
RG Breach - bridge, moon, leyline, lock their main wincons. torpor orb from the side is great and bust can surprise them.
Ad nauseam - leyline, nevermore, chalice, stony, moon (ish), helix (for maniac) are all great. this is one of the matchups where nevermore shines. if it weren't for it's bonus use against decay, nevermore would be a looser choice. it's great against combo tho in a deck that is very dedicated to creature hate
Chord decks - could use a cage, but the one drop status is jarring. torpor orb, rip, prison, cage, moon, etc.
Bogles - bridge, spellskite, chalice, are great
Storm - tough and tense matchup since a timely echoing truth can beat us, but they have to get it before we lock them out completely with spellskite. leyline and prison lock out grapeshot and empty the warrens effectively so it's a matter of them finding anti hate
I'm losing steam but I hope you can see that the deck has great matchups
Edit: Chandra is really good fyi. The 0 is deceptively strong. Cashing in lands for gas is so good.
S field is better in landkill decks, without that it is not so stellar unless it does some other job- eg count toards enchantments in Pillow-Fort builds.
One solution for UR- matches is to board into Obliterate, if you are Enchantment heavy you get a good board to work with. It still does not solve Nahiri, but Pithing Needling her allows time to get rid of her.
One for Jund and decay decks in general is Karma. They need to draw the Pulse pretty quickly.
I like Outpost siege too against both UWR-X and BG-x, if you get enough cards like ATL, and Siege, i.e. ones that rapidly need answers, you can win games. C n P Nalaar works ok too.
Good luck with the Isochron build!
http://magic.tcgplayer.com/db/article.asp?ID=13466
Boros Control, our sort of stuff Chalice, Leylines, Boom Bust. A hybrid of Moon/Chalice/Bridge/Ajani type decks and Stax Landkill, only with a few more critters and no bridge.
I took some inspiration from the planeswalkers in that build. I have found chandra, flamecaller to be really good, which is way better than chandra, pyromaster
to be clear, her +1 takes over games if you don't have your bridge out.
If you are under bridge, then her +0 can cycle lands and redundant cards and provides real card advantage against Uxx and BGx decks.
Her -X is also bonkers because it adds 2 more sweepers, albeit really expensive, to the deck after the 2 wrath.
It's also possible you want a 1/1 split with elspeth, sun's champion
Personally I've liked Restoration Angel so far as an unboltable, instant speed creature that either presents a clock, or they have to tap some mana to counter it and hopefully you can push through a haymaker (Nahiri in my list) when you untap. Boil can hit a lot of Islands against something like Merfolk, but that should already be a good matchup with all the mass creature hate. Plus it'll feel really bad when you keep a hand with Boil and they kept double Spreading Seas lol. Blue Tron is much lower tier and it's not going to get a whole lot better with a pair of Boils in post board games anyway. I don't know... it just doesn't feel good enough to me... As they say, YMMV.
I haven't played this deck at all lately, but I if I were to sleeve it up this week I would probably run 2-3 Ricochet Trap in those slots. Not only does it give you a shot at pushing through your own spells (albeit slightly behind curve), the Misdirection effect is pretty sweet when you nail an Ancestral Vision with it while they're holding Spell Snare, Mana Leak or Remand.
WUBG Atraxa Superfriends
WRBG Saskia's Angry
UBRG Yidris Valuetown
WUBR Breya "not just for infinite combos anymore" Etherium Shaper
mana]W[/mana]UR Narset the Nerfed
WBG Ghave counters madness
BRG Prossh, Token Master
UBG Tasigur Seedborn Control
WU Brago Bouncy Castle
WB Karlov Voltron
B Erebos/Drana MBC
R Feldon jank