I always ran a Bridge centered PW list when not landkilling. With Bridge based Planeswalker control lists you tend to run main deck Leylines. Once you run Chalice you tend to find burn is an easier match, more so with Blood Moons main as the modern Modern versions of Burn use a fair few off color spells that the Moon does work against. Helix and BA also work well, and I always liked Ajani in the PW mix in that type of build which also does well against burn.. Definitely worth considering that Prison can be tuned to beat burn main deck, especially as Nahiri can filter later Leylines. Of course Emrakul does not work with Bridges. The Leylines can be excellent- in the right meta.
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I always ran a Bridge centered PW list when not landkilling. With Bridge based Planeswalker control lists you tend to run main deck Leylines. Once you run Chalice you tend to find burn is an easier match, more so with Blood Moons main as the modern Modern versions of Burn use a fair few off color spells that the Moon does work against. Helix and BA also work well, and I always liked Ajani in the PW mix in that type of build which also does well against burn.. Definitely worth considering that Prison can be tuned to beat burn main deck, especially as Nahiri can filter later Leylines. Of course Emrakul does not work with Bridges. The Leylines can be excellent- in the right meta.
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I always ran a Bridge centered PW list when not landkilling. With Bridge based Planeswalker control lists you tend to run main deck Leylines. Once you run Chalice you tend to find burn is an easier match, more so with Blood Moons main as the modern Modern versions of Burn use a fair few off color spells that the Moon does work against. Helix and BA also work well, and I always liked Ajani in the PW mix in that type of build which also does well against burn.. Definitely worth considering that Prison can be tuned to beat burn main deck, especially as Nahiri can filter later Leylines. Of course Emrakul does not work with Bridges. The Leylines can be excellent- in the right meta.
Do you have a current deck list posted anywhere that I could take a look at?
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Modern - Pyro Prison
Modern - GW Tron
Modern - Mono G Tron
Modern - RWg Burn
Commander - Yisan, The Wanderer Bard cEDH build
Commander - Edric, Spymaster of Trest - Budget/Casual list - complete
Commander - Kynaios and Tiro of Meletis - $35 Budget upgrade
Commander - Edgar Markov - $150 upgrade
I always ran a Bridge centered PW list when not landkilling. With Bridge based Planeswalker control lists you tend to run main deck Leylines. Once you run Chalice you tend to find burn is an easier match, more so with Blood Moons main as the modern Modern versions of Burn use a fair few off color spells that the Moon does work against. Helix and BA also work well, and I always liked Ajani in the PW mix in that type of build which also does well against burn.. Definitely worth considering that Prison can be tuned to beat burn main deck, especially as Nahiri can filter later Leylines. Of course Emrakul does not work with Bridges. The Leylines can be excellent- in the right meta.
Do you have a current deck list posted anywhere that I could take a look at?
No, sadly- I have not played the PW version for some while- I am not a huge fan of Nahiri-bridge-Emrakul interactions, but most people rightly recognised Nahiri's power. What I can attest to is that for many years all the versions of PW-Bridge lists ran Leyline main- they should be in the Primer somewhere, unless they were junked. I also had some success with Rest in Peace main. The last time I played the burn match with a PW build was about a year ago, and I did win, I ran two Ajani and had Helix in there. I have been landkilling and playing pet enchantment decks of late when Modern-ing.
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While trying to figure out what deck to play to combat the prevalence of Spaghetti Monsters, Tron & U/W Control in my meta, I started tinkering with my Bridge Control list & came up with this strange monstrosity:
The idea came when I was trying to figure out how to close games out a bit faster while a lock was on. Since Bridge Control ran such few threats plus with only temples as card filter, many games were lost due to not being able to draw into any threat fast enough. Since Nahiri + Emrakul is a nonbo with Bridge, Infinite Cats were the next best thing.
Playtested a few rounds against different decks, came up with a few observations:
As long as we're careful on land drops & what to fetch, Blood Moon doesn't affect us
Creature removal from their side does come on but unless there isn't a Chalice in play, it doesn't really matter
T2 Saheeli is surprisingly decent, the scry effects helps immensely
Tron matchup still a nightmare but with the combo, able to steal games
It's not all roses though, here's a few cons I noticed:
loss of Helix / Blessed Alliance leads to weaker Burn matchup barring no Chalice / Leyline in opening hand
Magma Jet is still only okay, most of the time goes to face just for the scry effect. Occasionally kills a creature.
U/W Control is still an uphill battle
I'll still be testing this list for a while. Not going to take it to any competitive event as of yet until it's been put through it's paces.
UW control lists of today are tapout and not draw-go so they run a similiar gameplan to our PW control stuff. Difference between us and them is we're more threat and removal dense while they have more mana denial, cantrips and counterspells. Their mana denial plan doesn't work against us since our manabase is solid and we can present only nonbasic targets to Spreading Seas early game to turn them back to mountains with BM later on. I'm not sure about Defense Grid on the side against UW control here as I generally got better results running 2-3x Molten Rain. They're really light on basics compared to us even they run a 2 color deck because they have so many utility lands(GQ, Tec Edge, Colonnade, fetches, shocklands, checklands etc.). So with all this in mind, having a combination of Blood Moon&Molten Rains and good land drops, we can get us far ahead to cast a threat and go to town with it. Remember they run only a limited number of counterspells so you have to try to jam stuff in sometimes playing around Mana Leak if possible. They really can't put enough pressure against planeswalkers if their manabase and gy is disrupted so they can't get value off their Snapcaster Mage, Logic Knot etc. I side out most of the Chalices against UW control since it's only good when set on 2 and it's hard to resolve that one early on for it to matter. Leyline and Bridge doesn't do much if anything against them so those cards are really bad here. A resolved PW threat tho, that they'll have trouble dealing with.
You might be confusing Azorius Emeria Control with U/W Control. Both run the same colors but the first plays tapout with Sun Titans while the latter is definitely draw-go with a lot of cantrips and counterspells. Their basic count is also very high, running 5 minimum so Stone Rain can be good here though they do play Crucible. I agree Leyline is a dead card but Bridge definitely remains in as their only win-con is by attacking.
Eldratron is slightly different tho as Chalice doesn't do almost anything against them except shutting down Expedition Map when dropped on 1 preboard. Best way to stop Eldratron from casting eldrazi is to keep them off colorless by hitting Mind Stone and Wastes with Blood Moon up. If we manage to keep them off their colorless, their only threats left are Karn, All is Dust and Walking Ballista and they can't really create a huge Walking Ballista if they're off Tron so it gives us enough time to stick in a threat and go to town with it here. If they get to lategame, they can still find and hard cast All is Dust or Karn and we lose on the spot pretty much. Sweepers are pretty good against Eldratron especially since Anger stops Matter Reshaper / Hangarback Walker shenanigans and Wrath of God kills all their board. Alternatively, you can go for Leyline/Ensnaring Bridge combination which should lock them out of the game unless they can deal with Bridge using Ratchet Bomb or Karn.
Eldratron is just a nightmare since they attack from so many angles plus they just topdeck so much better in general. Even with adding scry, only games that were won were those where I got lucky enough to establish an early lock plus my opponent having mediocre draws.
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Anyway, took the list to a small 3 round event today to get some games in.
Round 1 vs Affinity. Win 2-0
Game 1 on the play. Both mull to 6. He keeps a mediocre hand but still vomits out a hand with memnites, ornithopters and a Ravager. Thankfully didn't see a Plating the next few draws and was able to resolve a Blood Moon and a Chalice for 2 in the next turn. He was drawing dead so was able to cast Ajani followed by Chandra to close.
Game 2 was pretty much a non game for him. Opened with Leyline into a Stony Silence. Was able to combo off on turn 4.
Round 2 vs Lantern. Win 2-1
Game 1 on the play. Had the best hand possible for the matchup. Opened with Leyline into a T1 Chalice for 1. He scooped.
Game 2 wasn't great. Opened with Leyline again but he had Ghoulcaller T1 into another Ghoulcaller + Pyxis T2. A lantern followed along with 2 Surgicals on my milled Chalice and Blood Moon. Sandbagging Chandra in hand but was kept off double red as he had Crucible lock.
Game 3 was close. Again with the Leyline opening along with Stony Silence. Had an early Saheeli but was stopped few turns later by a pithing needle. Hardcasted SSG to start beats along with Felidar as well but he was able to find a Bridge later on to stabilize on 5 life. Both in topdeck mode as I'm searching for Wear // Tear while he looks for Pulse to handle my multiple resolved Stonys at that point. I eventually find the card for the win.
Round 3 vs Eldratron. Lost 0-2
Game 1 on the draw. Had the best possible combo hand. 2 Fetches, 2 SSG, 1 Felidar, 1 Saheeli, 1 Leyline. Doesn't matter when my opponent drops a T3 Karn.
Game 2 was just as bad. Drops a Matter Reshaper which got Magma Jet but flipped to reveal another Reshaper. He drops TKS taking Saheeli. I draw and cast Wrath of God, his Reshaper revealing another Reshaper.. He casts Smasher followed by another Smasher the next turn all the while I'm wishing for Bridge to make an appearance.
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As predicted, Eldratron is still a nightmare as long as they have decent draws. We playtested the matchup a bit more but most games ended the same. Even with me having really good hands, only games that I won were when my opponent stumbled a few turns. Saheeli + Cat is definitely a value engine and I believe there's something here.
Then I guess my MTG terms must be outdated since I always assumed that Tapout meant lots of high-impact spells at sorcery speed while draw-go is lots of spells at instant speed. Then again, rare does a blue deck not have both synergies in it. Yes, I can see where you're coming from but a lot of these are ideal scenarios for post sideboard games where we have 2 Stone Rains in hand plus a resolved early Blood Moon in play & they never drew sideboard cards or counterspells.
You've made it clear that you very much prefer the R/W Sun & Moon version of the deck & yes, I agree that version plays better (puts up the most consistent results). I, however, play the original Bridge Control version of the deck as that's what I prefer to play. I could make my case why having Bridges & the 2 Leylines main can be effective but I've a feeling you're not going to want to entertain the idea any further.
WIthout Bridge, Nahiri is the best planeswalker to be played in this deck no questions asked. Unfortunately, it's a nonbo for my deck so I brewed & tried to tackle the problem. Saheeli gives me a way to combo under it.
Modern - Pyro Prison
Modern - GW Tron
Modern - Mono G Tron
Modern - RWg Burn
Commander - Yisan, The Wanderer Bard cEDH build
Commander - Edric, Spymaster of Trest - Budget/Casual list - complete
Commander - Kynaios and Tiro of Meletis - $35 Budget upgrade
Commander - Edgar Markov - $150 upgrade
Whenever I used Bridge/Leyline packages main I always tended to use Spirit Guides, speed was an issue and a T2 Moon was often very strong. Those decks had issues with counterspell heavy decks though, I even ran main deck Rest In Peaces at one point that nerfed Snapcaster type value as well as the Dredge strategies and other graveyard combo. Nowadays I run the landkill if I can, but Ajani always worked well in those PW Bridge lists, the turns that the Bridge bought could be used to ultimate it, and from there you could win eventually- frankly even if your deck's win con was a pair of Storm Crows you would get there....) I can't see the Nahiri version working as well with the Bridge nonbo, and Nahiri is better than Ajani in a vacuum, it is why Todd S chose to use Nahiri in the first place. The deck took off because Todd S played it, did well and wrote about it, but he no longer plays it extensively- remember as a Pro writer he needs copy, and a new deck to write about every few months is the easiest thing for a Pro to write about, and his latest one is good. There is no reason why the old Bridge/Leyline shells with Ajani won't work- they always used to periodically pop up on the same SCG events that Todd S played in, just piloted by non pros with less time to refine the list. Pro coverage and results standardise lists inevitably, but prior to one person playing the deck RW prisons of all varieties would pop up at big events. Truth is there never was a "best version" prior to Todd S playing it, and given a couple of years of minimal coverage there won't be one again.
Drawing cards mid game was quite easy to make up for those dead draws or spirit guides, the Nahiri card naturally filters on its own, of course, which is what made it so attractive, but card advantage could today be made up with cards like Chandra TOD, back then options were limited- Outpost Siege was not bad. The Nalars could also sacrifice Bridges as a win con potentially in a Nahiri build- I never got round to trying that for more than an event, may be too cute but you never know. Spot removal heavy lists existed prior to Sun/Moon breakout, although the Bridge versions tended to do better in bigger events, I have always wondered what would have happened if Todd S had started on the deck with Bridge list. .
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This is the current list that I am on. I am 16-3-3 in the last 4 tournaments I've entered. My only losses have been to 2 affinity players and 1 jeskai copy cat player who managed to top deck the only basic plains in his 75 to combo out with felidar. I love this deck and think it's extremely well positioned right now.
Hello,
I played similar Sestudan88's list on last Friday: 2-2
Win against scapeshift and jund
Lost against UW control and CopyCat
It seems that there is few chance against combo decks in general (previous week lost against UR storm) and NO chance against UW control, even if I prepared 5 cards in side against UW (1 boil, 2 defense grid and 2 Crumble to Dust: G1 lost because Celestial Colonnade)
So I am thinking: does have sense keep space in SB against UW control even if is not possible to beat? Isn't consider that matchup lost and improve chances against other decks?
Thanks
That match against UW: G1 I lost dice, he started with a fetchland. I played land, SSG and chalice at 1 and he took land and spell snare, LOL! I wasn't able to cast any spell from the beginning! at my t3 I tried small gideon, of course was counterspelled. I think there is no way to go until we play one only spell at turn...
Against storm in G2 with leyline I performed better, also if he played empty the warrens early.
I will try changing my SB adding a couple of stone rain and one or two boom/bust , useful not only against UW.
What do you think about Magus of the Moon in SB - when both players are removing the creature sweepers? like agains UW
So I was watching Saffron's UW Belcher video, and I says to myself: "Self, belcher would go pretty good into the RW Prison deck you already have".
I put this together, and took ito to 3-1 at FNM
Overall, I really like it and aim to refine it further. I never really felt that any matchup I played was unwinnable, and it was very fun to play. I beat Abzan Melira/Anafenza-Finks-Viscera Seer Company, 8-Rack and a jank UW Affinity/Combo deck. 8-Rack wasn't even close thanks to Chalice on 1 and Endless Horizons. Titan Breach beat me, but I lost game 1 to a play error and game 3 to topdecking errors. Despite the prison elements my opponents said they actually enjoyed it as well, kept them on their toes the entire time.
Going forward, the Prophetic Prisms could easily be cut or replaced with Chromatic Sphere. I only ever needed a single red, and the ability to drop it and cantrip for effectively a single cmc would have been welcome. I'm not sure if the loss of the ramp of the signets in subsequent turns would be worth the extra card by replacing them with Chromatic Stars, but I'd entertain the idea.
The prison suite could definitely be tailored to a meta. Suppression Field, although interacting unfavorably with Belcher, was actually great in my games. I never found myself sorry to pay 5 for a Belcher activation.
I'm guessing it's weak to Wear // Tear or Slaughter Games-type effects. I've been thinking about adding green for Ancient Stirrings to get the combo out faster against those perceived weaknesses, but I doubt that's worth it. I think I'd rather rely on the prison.
Hello,
I played similar Sestudan88's list on last Friday: 2-2
It seems that there is few chance against combo decks in general (previous week lost against UR storm) and NO chance against UW control, even if I prepared 5 cards in side against UW (1 boil, 2 defense grid and 2 Crumble to Dust: G1 lost because Celestial Colonnade)
Thanks
Problem is that Boil is a good, solid card- it comes in against a couple of decks in the format, and taps them out EOT. It is not a "I win" card. Defense grid is mediocre and works against Boil EOT- if it resolves it is ok at best in a game that goes long, and CTD is a bad, bad, card against UW control. If you are on planeswalker control builds, with or without bridge, you already run Blood Moon. 3 cc spells already have a hard time resolving, 4cc sorceries, that will go 1 and a bit for one? Just not happening. If you want a 4cc spell at sorcery speed it needs to be one that wins the game.
When playing some off the wall pre-nahiri RW prisons I have resolved cards like Crucible of worlds and beaten them by recurring ghost quarter and mixing with Boils- I am not saying that would work here, but it is a card that if it goes unchecked will eventually ruin them- recurring strip mines do that, cards like Ajani V or Assemble the Legion (and in RU Keranos) all do that- none of which especially fit in with Sun and Moon- but realistically if you are going to spend four mana/five mana the card has to be one that the UW player thinks "If this resolves I am dead if I don't draw X in Y turns".
Now there are some late game cards that really wreck a UW control deck- but they are pretty off radar and not much use elsewhere. Uncounterable X spells and Obliterate spring to mind- but you won't have many ways of abusing them and they are very narrow.
You might consider stuff like Luminarch ascension as the sort of card that can beat them if it comes down early as they don't put much pressure on early, and it can slip past their stuff. You might try running Ghost Quarters and Crucible, or playing cards like Outpost Siege to try and grind them, but really your options are limited to more Boils and tilting your deck towards cards like Lightening Helix over sweepers, which is something you may not want to do. Aim for Chalice at a higher number as well.
Not sure how you are losing to storm,4 Leylines and a couple of Rule of Law/Eidolons of R should go well ( they are also good against Snappies in UW and good vs regular Tron). Gifts can't target you (it is oddly a targeted effect) under Leylines, so they can't cast it. Spot removal on their dudes is good, bin hate- RIP - is good, Chalice is good.
I recently played the Central Pa eternal league and went 3-1-1 to a fifth place finish. I drew with esper vengence due to time constraint and lost to affinity off of them getting a nut draw game three and I kept a somewhat mediocre 5 land hand.
Next up, I played in a PPTQ this weekend. Beat burn twice, green white hate bears once and grixis delver round four so that I could double draw in at 4-0-2. I lost to eldrazi tron in quarterfinals after not drawing stony silence. O-stone and karn wrecked me hard both games. I even had quick blood moons but it didn't matter.
I've never beaten Eldrazi Tron with this deck. At least not at competitive REL.
I watched that the day that it came out. I'm not a huge fan of that list to begin with. On top of that, watching someone play it at such a suboptimal level was cringeworthy.
Hi there,
Report from last friday.
I keept same main and change the SB, removing 2 Defense Grid and Crumble adding 1 Boom // Bust and 2 stone rain.
First match against titan shift: win 2-1 (I had already positive result against this deck, but now probably much better with land destruction in side)
Second match agains affinity: win 2-0 (same feeling than against titan shift: also here with land destruction in side seems better)
Third match against 4C CopyCat same guy that I lost some week ago: same result: lost 2-0. No way. I have only 2 helix to kill saheeli at t3, never seen on both games.
Fourth match against UR Through the Breach (LOL really? XD): lost 2-0 , both games seen coming HIS emrakull at T5
Fift match against UWR, same guy I lost some week ago with UW. Lost 2-1. Lost dice and game 1 he killed me with Celestial Colonnade as usual. Game 2 I win with Chandra Emblem, game 3 was a long game: he countered / destroyed almost everything (my blood moon, my chalice at 2, my nahiri, my gideon, my chandra), I was able to destroy his jace, his nahiri and a couple of snapcaster. we arrived at top deck and he found Torrential Gearhulk so was able to do card advantage drawing a counter and win.
I found the land destruction not bad but against control/combo decks is still not enough
I'm thining to try a couple of Pithing Needle next time, what do you think?
Needle is super good, not as good vs. grixis decks running K. command.
I am afraid Modern is a format where you must win your great matches, because your rubbish ones are impossible. It is why so many decks are value town mush- they have fewest awful matches. UWR is a pain. I had a similar experience with UWR piloting landkill RW (as per the primer part 3)- even when I cut him to 2 lands and a nahiri I ended up dead to repetitive snapcaster beats (almost a de facto ambush viper )- I did a lot, but ultimately a deck with lots of counterspells hurts any non super fast deck without. Slipping down 1 cc permanents is good, disruption is good, but short of making the deck radically more aggressive UWR will not be easy for any RW prison, bridge, nahri-bridge or landkill based.
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I'm interested in Land Destruction again. Field of Ruin does something that GQ and Tectonic Edge never could.
Here's a Christmasland sequence on the play:
It's going to be the normal land destruction package, but with Field of Ruins, Aven Mindcensor and Crack the Earth replacing Boom // Bust.
Turn 1: Use Simian Spirit Guide to cast Crack the Earth, (I'll assume the opponent isn't sacrificing 1 cmc permanents...) then play Flagstones as your land. Net result 1 land / 0 lands
Turn 2 play a mountain, cast a second Crack the Earth. Sacrifice Flagstones. Net result 2 lands / 0 lands
Turn 3, a second Flagstones of Trokair and use SSG to cast Aven Mindcensor, then CtE targeting Flagstones. Net 3 lands / 0 lands.
We're down to 1 card in hand, but we're up three lands to zero and have a creature in play.
All of this was possible before, but now we're essentially out of gas. You could use Ghost Quarter and Crucible of Worlds at this point but GQ loses tempo, so you'll be locking yourself down at 3 mana. Field of Ruin otoh can be used freely (against non-basics) and is tempo neutral. You can get to 4 lands / 0 lands in this way, Then the final piece of the puzzle is Crucible. Get that and you can keep some opponents perpetually landless.
Now a smarter way to build this might be to aim for a "less than 3 lands". That would allow you to use Boom // Bust, make you less reliant on SSG and more consistent overall. You might even be able to play a tempo game if you play a few one-drops and your hand comes out just right.
Do you have a current deck list posted anywhere that I could take a look at?
Modern - GW Tron
Modern - Mono G Tron
Modern - RWg Burn
Commander - Yisan, The Wanderer Bard cEDH build
Commander - Edric, Spymaster of Trest - Budget/Casual list - complete
Commander - Kynaios and Tiro of Meletis - $35 Budget upgrade
Commander - Edgar Markov - $150 upgrade
No, sadly- I have not played the PW version for some while- I am not a huge fan of Nahiri-bridge-Emrakul interactions, but most people rightly recognised Nahiri's power. What I can attest to is that for many years all the versions of PW-Bridge lists ran Leyline main- they should be in the Primer somewhere, unless they were junked. I also had some success with Rest in Peace main. The last time I played the burn match with a PW build was about a year ago, and I did win, I ran two Ajani and had Helix in there. I have been landkilling and playing pet enchantment decks of late when Modern-ing.
4 Temple of Triumph
2 Arid Mesa
2 Flooded Strand
2 Sacred Foundry
1 Steam Vents
1 Hallowed Fountain
1 Gemstone Mine
5 Plains
2 Island
1 Mountain
2 Ghost Quarter
Creatures
4 Simian Spirit Guide
2 Wall of Omens
3 Felidar Guardian
4 Chalice of the Void
3 Blood Moon
4 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Runed Halo
1 Peace of Mind
2 Leyline of Sanctity
Spells
2 Anger of the Gods
3 Wrath of God
2 Magma Jet
1 Ajani Vengeant
2 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
3 Saheeli Rai
2 Pithing Needle
3 Stony Silence
2 Crumble to Dust
1 Leyline of Sanctity
1 Boil
2 Defense Grid
2 Rest in Peace
2 Wear // Tear
The idea came when I was trying to figure out how to close games out a bit faster while a lock was on. Since Bridge Control ran such few threats plus with only temples as card filter, many games were lost due to not being able to draw into any threat fast enough. Since Nahiri + Emrakul is a nonbo with Bridge, Infinite Cats were the next best thing.
Playtested a few rounds against different decks, came up with a few observations:
It's not all roses though, here's a few cons I noticed:
I'll still be testing this list for a while. Not going to take it to any competitive event as of yet until it's been put through it's paces.
You might be confusing Azorius Emeria Control with U/W Control. Both run the same colors but the first plays tapout with Sun Titans while the latter is definitely draw-go with a lot of cantrips and counterspells. Their basic count is also very high, running 5 minimum so Stone Rain can be good here though they do play Crucible. I agree Leyline is a dead card but Bridge definitely remains in as their only win-con is by attacking.
Eldratron is just a nightmare since they attack from so many angles plus they just topdeck so much better in general. Even with adding scry, only games that were won were those where I got lucky enough to establish an early lock plus my opponent having mediocre draws.
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Anyway, took the list to a small 3 round event today to get some games in.
Round 1 vs Affinity. Win 2-0
Game 1 on the play. Both mull to 6. He keeps a mediocre hand but still vomits out a hand with memnites, ornithopters and a Ravager. Thankfully didn't see a Plating the next few draws and was able to resolve a Blood Moon and a Chalice for 2 in the next turn. He was drawing dead so was able to cast Ajani followed by Chandra to close.
Game 2 was pretty much a non game for him. Opened with Leyline into a Stony Silence. Was able to combo off on turn 4.
Round 2 vs Lantern. Win 2-1
Game 1 on the play. Had the best hand possible for the matchup. Opened with Leyline into a T1 Chalice for 1. He scooped.
Game 2 wasn't great. Opened with Leyline again but he had Ghoulcaller T1 into another Ghoulcaller + Pyxis T2. A lantern followed along with 2 Surgicals on my milled Chalice and Blood Moon. Sandbagging Chandra in hand but was kept off double red as he had Crucible lock.
Game 3 was close. Again with the Leyline opening along with Stony Silence. Had an early Saheeli but was stopped few turns later by a pithing needle. Hardcasted SSG to start beats along with Felidar as well but he was able to find a Bridge later on to stabilize on 5 life. Both in topdeck mode as I'm searching for Wear // Tear while he looks for Pulse to handle my multiple resolved Stonys at that point. I eventually find the card for the win.
Round 3 vs Eldratron. Lost 0-2
Game 1 on the draw. Had the best possible combo hand. 2 Fetches, 2 SSG, 1 Felidar, 1 Saheeli, 1 Leyline. Doesn't matter when my opponent drops a T3 Karn.
Game 2 was just as bad. Drops a Matter Reshaper which got Magma Jet but flipped to reveal another Reshaper. He drops TKS taking Saheeli. I draw and cast Wrath of God, his Reshaper revealing another Reshaper.. He casts Smasher followed by another Smasher the next turn all the while I'm wishing for Bridge to make an appearance.
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As predicted, Eldratron is still a nightmare as long as they have decent draws. We playtested the matchup a bit more but most games ended the same. Even with me having really good hands, only games that I won were when my opponent stumbled a few turns. Saheeli + Cat is definitely a value engine and I believe there's something here.
You've made it clear that you very much prefer the R/W Sun & Moon version of the deck & yes, I agree that version plays better (puts up the most consistent results). I, however, play the original Bridge Control version of the deck as that's what I prefer to play. I could make my case why having Bridges & the 2 Leylines main can be effective but I've a feeling you're not going to want to entertain the idea any further.
WIthout Bridge, Nahiri is the best planeswalker to be played in this deck no questions asked. Unfortunately, it's a nonbo for my deck so I brewed & tried to tackle the problem. Saheeli gives me a way to combo under it.
Modern - GW Tron
Modern - Mono G Tron
Modern - RWg Burn
Commander - Yisan, The Wanderer Bard cEDH build
Commander - Edric, Spymaster of Trest - Budget/Casual list - complete
Commander - Kynaios and Tiro of Meletis - $35 Budget upgrade
Commander - Edgar Markov - $150 upgrade
Drawing cards mid game was quite easy to make up for those dead draws or spirit guides, the Nahiri card naturally filters on its own, of course, which is what made it so attractive, but card advantage could today be made up with cards like Chandra TOD, back then options were limited- Outpost Siege was not bad. The Nalars could also sacrifice Bridges as a win con potentially in a Nahiri build- I never got round to trying that for more than an event, may be too cute but you never know. Spot removal heavy lists existed prior to Sun/Moon breakout, although the Bridge versions tended to do better in bigger events, I have always wondered what would have happened if Todd S had started on the deck with Bridge list. .
Lands
8 Plains
4 Arid Mesa
4 Temple of Triumph
2 Rugged Prairie
2 Clifftop Retreat
2 Gemstone Cavern
1 Sacred Foundry
1 Mountain
Planeswalkers
1 Gideon Jura
2 Gideon of the Trials
3 Chandra Torch of Defiance
4 Nahiri, the Harbinger
Enchantments
4 Blood Moon
2 Cast Out
Artifacts
4 Chalice of the Void
Creatures
1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
4 Simian Spirit Guide
Instants
4 Lightbing Helix
1 Blessed Alliance
Sorcery
3 Anger of the Gods
3 Wrath of God
I played similar Sestudan88's list on last Friday: 2-2
Win against scapeshift and jund
Lost against UW control and CopyCat
It seems that there is few chance against combo decks in general (previous week lost against UR storm) and NO chance against UW control, even if I prepared 5 cards in side against UW (1 boil, 2 defense grid and 2 Crumble to Dust: G1 lost because Celestial Colonnade)
So I am thinking: does have sense keep space in SB against UW control even if is not possible to beat? Isn't consider that matchup lost and improve chances against other decks?
Thanks
Against storm in G2 with leyline I performed better, also if he played empty the warrens early.
I will try changing my SB adding a couple of stone rain and one or two boom/bust , useful not only against UW.
What do you think about Magus of the Moon in SB - when both players are removing the creature sweepers? like agains UW
I put this together, and took ito to 3-1 at FNM
19 Plains
4 Sacred Foundry
Mana Spells
4 Boros Signet
4 Prophetic Prism
4 Simian Spirit Guide
Prison Spells
3 Banishing Light
4 Blood Moon
4 Chalice of the Void
2 Suppression Field
4 Wrath of God
4 Endless Horizons
4 Goblin Charbelcher
2 Ghostly Prison
1 Journey to Nowhere
2 Leyline of Sanctity
3 Rest in Peace
2 Stony Silence
2 Suppression Field
Overall, I really like it and aim to refine it further. I never really felt that any matchup I played was unwinnable, and it was very fun to play. I beat Abzan Melira/Anafenza-Finks-Viscera Seer Company, 8-Rack and a jank UW Affinity/Combo deck. 8-Rack wasn't even close thanks to Chalice on 1 and Endless Horizons. Titan Breach beat me, but I lost game 1 to a play error and game 3 to topdecking errors. Despite the prison elements my opponents said they actually enjoyed it as well, kept them on their toes the entire time.
Going forward, the Prophetic Prisms could easily be cut or replaced with Chromatic Sphere. I only ever needed a single red, and the ability to drop it and cantrip for effectively a single cmc would have been welcome. I'm not sure if the loss of the ramp of the signets in subsequent turns would be worth the extra card by replacing them with Chromatic Stars, but I'd entertain the idea.
The prison suite could definitely be tailored to a meta. Suppression Field, although interacting unfavorably with Belcher, was actually great in my games. I never found myself sorry to pay 5 for a Belcher activation.
I think I'm going to bring this to my next FNM:
19 Plains
4 Sacred Foundry
Mana Spells
3 Boros Signet
4 Chromatic Sphere
4 Simian Spirit Guide
Prison Spells
1 Banishing Light
4 Blood Moon
4 Chalice of the Void
1 Journey to Nowhere
2 Leyline of Sanctity
2 Suppression Field
4 Wrath of God
4 Endless Horizons
4 Goblin Charbelcher
3 Crumble to Dust
2 Journey to Nowhere
1 Leyline of Sanctity
3 Rest in Peace
2 Stony Silence
2 Suppression Field
I'm guessing it's weak to Wear // Tear or Slaughter Games-type effects. I've been thinking about adding green for Ancient Stirrings to get the combo out faster against those perceived weaknesses, but I doubt that's worth it. I think I'd rather rely on the prison.
Problem is that Boil is a good, solid card- it comes in against a couple of decks in the format, and taps them out EOT. It is not a "I win" card. Defense grid is mediocre and works against Boil EOT- if it resolves it is ok at best in a game that goes long, and CTD is a bad, bad, card against UW control. If you are on planeswalker control builds, with or without bridge, you already run Blood Moon. 3 cc spells already have a hard time resolving, 4cc sorceries, that will go 1 and a bit for one? Just not happening. If you want a 4cc spell at sorcery speed it needs to be one that wins the game.
When playing some off the wall pre-nahiri RW prisons I have resolved cards like Crucible of worlds and beaten them by recurring ghost quarter and mixing with Boils- I am not saying that would work here, but it is a card that if it goes unchecked will eventually ruin them- recurring strip mines do that, cards like Ajani V or Assemble the Legion (and in RU Keranos) all do that- none of which especially fit in with Sun and Moon- but realistically if you are going to spend four mana/five mana the card has to be one that the UW player thinks "If this resolves I am dead if I don't draw X in Y turns".
Now there are some late game cards that really wreck a UW control deck- but they are pretty off radar and not much use elsewhere. Uncounterable X spells and Obliterate spring to mind- but you won't have many ways of abusing them and they are very narrow.
You might consider stuff like Luminarch ascension as the sort of card that can beat them if it comes down early as they don't put much pressure on early, and it can slip past their stuff. You might try running Ghost Quarters and Crucible, or playing cards like Outpost Siege to try and grind them, but really your options are limited to more Boils and tilting your deck towards cards like Lightening Helix over sweepers, which is something you may not want to do. Aim for Chalice at a higher number as well.
Not sure how you are losing to storm,4 Leylines and a couple of Rule of Law/Eidolons of R should go well ( they are also good against Snappies in UW and good vs regular Tron). Gifts can't target you (it is oddly a targeted effect) under Leylines, so they can't cast it. Spot removal on their dudes is good, bin hate- RIP - is good, Chalice is good.
I recently played the Central Pa eternal league and went 3-1-1 to a fifth place finish. I drew with esper vengence due to time constraint and lost to affinity off of them getting a nut draw game three and I kept a somewhat mediocre 5 land hand.
Next up, I played in a PPTQ this weekend. Beat burn twice, green white hate bears once and grixis delver round four so that I could double draw in at 4-0-2. I lost to eldrazi tron in quarterfinals after not drawing stony silence. O-stone and karn wrecked me hard both games. I even had quick blood moons but it didn't matter.
I've never beaten Eldrazi Tron with this deck. At least not at competitive REL.
PLZ HLP.
https://www.channelfireball.com/videos/modern-moonday-rw-prison/
Report from last friday.
I keept same main and change the SB, removing 2 Defense Grid and Crumble adding 1 Boom // Bust and 2 stone rain.
First match against titan shift: win 2-1 (I had already positive result against this deck, but now probably much better with land destruction in side)
Second match agains affinity: win 2-0 (same feeling than against titan shift: also here with land destruction in side seems better)
Third match against 4C CopyCat same guy that I lost some week ago: same result: lost 2-0. No way. I have only 2 helix to kill saheeli at t3, never seen on both games.
Fourth match against UR Through the Breach (LOL really? XD): lost 2-0 , both games seen coming HIS emrakull at T5
Fift match against UWR, same guy I lost some week ago with UW. Lost 2-1. Lost dice and game 1 he killed me with Celestial Colonnade as usual. Game 2 I win with Chandra Emblem, game 3 was a long game: he countered / destroyed almost everything (my blood moon, my chalice at 2, my nahiri, my gideon, my chandra), I was able to destroy his jace, his nahiri and a couple of snapcaster. we arrived at top deck and he found Torrential Gearhulk so was able to do card advantage drawing a counter and win.
I found the land destruction not bad but against control/combo decks is still not enough
I'm thining to try a couple of Pithing Needle next time, what do you think?
I am afraid Modern is a format where you must win your great matches, because your rubbish ones are impossible. It is why so many decks are value town mush- they have fewest awful matches. UWR is a pain. I had a similar experience with UWR piloting landkill RW (as per the primer part 3)- even when I cut him to 2 lands and a nahiri I ended up dead to repetitive snapcaster beats (almost a de facto ambush viper )- I did a lot, but ultimately a deck with lots of counterspells hurts any non super fast deck without. Slipping down 1 cc permanents is good, disruption is good, but short of making the deck radically more aggressive UWR will not be easy for any RW prison, bridge, nahri-bridge or landkill based.
Here's a Christmasland sequence on the play:
It's going to be the normal land destruction package, but with Field of Ruins, Aven Mindcensor and Crack the Earth replacing Boom // Bust.
Turn 1: Use Simian Spirit Guide to cast Crack the Earth, (I'll assume the opponent isn't sacrificing 1 cmc permanents...) then play Flagstones as your land. Net result 1 land / 0 lands
Turn 2 play a mountain, cast a second Crack the Earth. Sacrifice Flagstones. Net result 2 lands / 0 lands
Turn 3, a second Flagstones of Trokair and use SSG to cast Aven Mindcensor, then CtE targeting Flagstones. Net 3 lands / 0 lands.
We're down to 1 card in hand, but we're up three lands to zero and have a creature in play.
All of this was possible before, but now we're essentially out of gas. You could use Ghost Quarter and Crucible of Worlds at this point but GQ loses tempo, so you'll be locking yourself down at 3 mana. Field of Ruin otoh can be used freely (against non-basics) and is tempo neutral. You can get to 4 lands / 0 lands in this way, Then the final piece of the puzzle is Crucible. Get that and you can keep some opponents perpetually landless.
Now a smarter way to build this might be to aim for a "less than 3 lands". That would allow you to use Boom // Bust, make you less reliant on SSG and more consistent overall. You might even be able to play a tempo game if you play a few one-drops and your hand comes out just right.