He played two different lists (catched a stream where he was playing again). In the first night he played Shoalless, Looting, Discovery, Hugs, Morphose, Phoenix, Griselbrand and Emmi (with both Goryos and TTB).
The second night was a Shoal build with 4 Phoenixes and Discovery, but I have no idea what he cut (he went off once so saw a lot of cards but I didn't saw any "missing" cards to say it this way).
Greetings,
Kathal
Found the player and got to talk to him about his lists - and got permission to post it here. As a caveat, he said the ones he played on the twitch stream are still in tuning and thus has various versions:
Version 1: Grixis Shoal-less
Feels more consistent (Serum Visions / Opt) in setting up the combo turn - but shields can be down without much disruption (which looks like is available in the sideboard).
Slightly trades off the consistency of Serum Visions with the Temple of Malice, but offers the option to lightning bolt (which have been great against creature decks).
Seems to be very much like most Grishoalbrand lists - but Simian Spirit Guide was replaced with Arclight Phoenix. He said that he doesn't have enough data to really see if it's worth the addition/replacement as there were times were SSG would have won him the game instead of the Phoenix.
In essence, the Phoenix version trades off those insane Turn-2/Turn-3 SSG lines to add another dimension to the deck - but is still explosive nonetheless.
I am not sure if there is a clear better version of the three, but I think it's worth play-testing and building off of these versions and see what comes out of it. I'm always down to jam a Griselbrand deck.
I'm leaning more towards Version 1 with the blue - those dispels in the sideboard make me feel comfortable bringing it to a larger tournament.
He played two different lists (catched a stream where he was playing again). In the first night he played Shoalless, Looting, Discovery, Hugs, Morphose, Phoenix, Griselbrand and Emmi (with both Goryos and TTB).
The second night was a Shoal build with 4 Phoenixes and Discovery, but I have no idea what he cut (he went off once so saw a lot of cards but I didn't saw any "missing" cards to say it this way).
Greetings,
Kathal
Found the player and got to talk to him about his lists - and got permission to post it here. As a caveat, he said the ones he played on the twitch stream are still in tuning and thus has various versions:
Version 1: Grixis Shoal-less
Feels more consistent (Serum Visions / Opt) in setting up the combo turn - but shields can be down without much disruption (which looks like is available in the sideboard).
Slightly trades off the consistency of Serum Visions with the Temple of Malice, but offers the option to lightning bolt (which have been great against creature decks).
Seems to be very much like most Grishoalbrand lists - but Simian Spirit Guide was replaced with Arclight Phoenix. He said that he doesn't have enough data to really see if it's worth the addition/replacement as there were times were SSG would have won him the game instead of the Phoenix.
In essence, the Phoenix version trades off those insane Turn-2/Turn-3 SSG lines to add another dimension to the deck - but is still explosive nonetheless.
I am not sure if there is a clear better version of the three, but I think it's worth play-testing and building off of these versions and see what comes out of it. I'm always down to jam a Griselbrand deck.
I'm leaning more towards Version 1 with the blue - those dispels in the sideboard make me feel comfortable bringing it to a larger tournament.
I have been playtesting this most of the day and I new to this deck so I may not be the best candidate but the arclight can be a little funky at times.
Sometimes I wish I could use a little more card draw or discard outlets but I feel like to really combo off you need SSG to trigger with the through the breach. If anyone has played other versions I am curious about their updates.
Curious to hear what the Arclight versions are trying to solve. The deck loses to 1) clock+disruption and 2) GY hate. Adding the arclight package doesn't seem to help either cases
Curious to hear what the Arclight versions are trying to solve. The deck loses to 1) clock+disruption and 2) GY hate. Adding the arclight package doesn't seem to help either cases
I was just curious if you can pair them together for more damage if something happen, it doesn't work well in this shell.
Curious to hear what the Arclight versions are trying to solve. The deck loses to 1) clock+disruption and 2) GY hate. Adding the arclight package doesn't seem to help either cases
1. Add a main win condition in case that the combo gets difficult.
2. Add another wincon to make Surgical extraction less impactful. This deck with a SE literaly dies.
Curious to hear what the Arclight versions are trying to solve. The deck loses to 1) clock+disruption and 2) GY hate. Adding the arclight package doesn't seem to help either cases
1. Add a main win condition in case that the combo gets difficult.
2. Add another wincon to make Surgical extraction less impactful. This deck with a SE literaly dies.
1. you don't have the density of 1 mana/free spells to enable phoenixes reliably. You'd probably have to go grixis for SV and play more manamorphoses. casting phoenixes fairly seems bad
2. half the time they keep a surgical/gy hate only hand and you just breach them into oblivion. saying that the deck dies on the spot against one surgical is an exaggeration. Also you can play chalice of the void for 1 and cover that angle plus many other angles if you want to go down that road.
Curious to hear what the Arclight versions are trying to solve. The deck loses to 1) clock+disruption and 2) GY hate. Adding the arclight package doesn't seem to help either cases
1. Add a main win condition in case that the combo gets difficult.
2. Add another wincon to make Surgical extraction less impactful. This deck with a SE literaly dies.
1. you don't have the density of 1 mana/free spells to enable phoenixes reliably. You'd probably have to go grixis for SV and play more manamorphoses. casting phoenixes fairly seems bad
2. half the time they keep a surgical/gy hate only hand and you just breach them into oblivion. saying that the deck dies on the spot against one surgical is an exaggeration. Also you can play chalice of the void for 1 and cover that angle plus many other angles if you want to go down that road.
I never say that the arclight version is the way to go, but i think that this decks fails with the hate so hard, and have another win condition is not bad.
I test a lot this kind of deck, and i think that the best version is the old grixis one, with Serums, Thoughtseize, CB and with out Nourishing. I think that NS packet is so uninteractive and the lifegain plan doesn’t feel complementary with the main wincon, add to the fact that makes the deck “non-flex”.
He didn't play any Blackcleave cliffs but he relies mostly in Gemstone Mines do you think this manabase can work well? (I have amost all cards but the clifs and price is really unfair now)
Last deck talks about us, what do you think about ?
B00NTY
idk if that will be have good results, but the fact is that all the powerfuls non cost spells (wheel of fate, living end, etc.) starts to increase they prices because of Electrodominance.
Hey guys,
I just getting into modern, got almost full grishoal without collecting sideboard yet.
What is your game-plan with this deck against white leyline on turn1?
Are you trying to go face with Grisel, wurm and Borby to finish the guy or is there a reliable way to get rid of leyline?
Also, what do you do when opponent surgically extract Grisel, Borby and Wurm, do you just concede?
I'm just getting into the deck and not having played it before I am wondering about some of the popular sideboard choices. In particular, there usually seems to be a split between Anger of the Gods and Bontu's Last Reckoning. I don't quite understand why Bontu's is used here as the drawback is still very real for this deck. I suppose being able to cast it for 3 instead of Damnation on 4 is really that important? Happy to hear your thoughts.
Again, haven't played the deck but these seem quite obvious:
Due to the lack of enchantment hate in B/R, the white leyline will force you into a plan B of breach/vengeance on creatures to go to face (Wurm being the main plan plus Emrakul if you run it in the SB).
If you get all your win-conditions extracted you obviously concede in most cases. However, triple surgical is unlikely and you can always run more big threats in the SB if it's a real concern (though then it would be more productive for them to go for breach+vengeance).
hello every one , at my local fnm's im struggling a lot with the artifact decks , my current mu's are 2 whir decks 1 lantern and 1 harden scales that i compete every week
ive played 2 Abrade in the sideboard , switched one with shatterstorm but even this is not enough
is it worth to go full of 2 copies of shatterstorm or should i manage my hands better for the plan A or B on those mu's ?
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Found the player and got to talk to him about his lists - and got permission to post it here. As a caveat, he said the ones he played on the twitch stream are still in tuning and thus has various versions:
Version 1: Grixis Shoal-less
Feels more consistent (Serum Visions / Opt) in setting up the combo turn - but shields can be down without much disruption (which looks like is available in the sideboard).
4 Spirebluff Canal
2 Blood Crypt
2 Island
2 Polluted Delta
2 Steam Vents
1 Mountain
1 Watery Grave
4 Arclight Phoenix
4 Griselbrand
3 Simian Spirit Guide
2 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
4 Goryo's Vengeance
4 Manamorphose
4 Serum Visions
4 Through the Breach
3 Opt
2 Desperate Ritual
2 Lightning Axe
2 Izzet Charm
2 Abrade
2 Anger of the Gods
2 Ceremonious Rejection
3 Dispel
2 Engineered Explosives
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Jace, Vryn's Prodigy
1 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
Version 1: RB Shoal-less
Slightly trades off the consistency of Serum Visions with the Temple of Malice, but offers the option to lightning bolt (which have been great against creature decks).
4 Temple of Malice
3 Mountain
3 Swamp
2 Blackcleave Cliffs
2 Blood Crypt
4 Arclight Phoenix
4 Griselbrand
3 Simian Spirit Guide
2 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
4 Goryo's Vengeance
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Manamorphose
4 Through the Breach
3 Desperate Ritual
2 Lightning Axe
2 Tormenting Voice
2 Collective Brutality
4 Leyline of the Void
2 Abrade
2 Anger of the Gods
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Engineered Explosives
2 Fatal Push
1 Bontu's Last Reckoning
Version 3: Grishoalbrand
Seems to be very much like most Grishoalbrand lists - but Simian Spirit Guide was replaced with Arclight Phoenix. He said that he doesn't have enough data to really see if it's worth the addition/replacement as there were times were SSG would have won him the game instead of the Phoenix.
In essence, the Phoenix version trades off those insane Turn-2/Turn-3 SSG lines to add another dimension to the deck - but is still explosive nonetheless.
4 Temple of Malice
4 Swamp
2 Blackcleave Cliffs
2 Mountain
1 Blood Crypt
1 Steam Vents
4 Arclight Phoenix
4 Griselbrand
4 Worldspine Wurm
2 Borborygmos Enraged
4 Goryo's Vengeance
4 Nourishing Shoal
4 Through the Breach
4 Desperate Ritual
3 Discovery / Dispersal
3 Manamorphose
2 Lightning Axe
4 Leyline of the Void
2 Abrade
2 Anger of the Gods
2 Engineered Explosives
2 Fatal Push
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
--
I am not sure if there is a clear better version of the three, but I think it's worth play-testing and building off of these versions and see what comes out of it. I'm always down to jam a Griselbrand deck.
I'm leaning more towards Version 1 with the blue - those dispels in the sideboard make me feel comfortable bringing it to a larger tournament.
Thank you! I will try the grixis version tonight
Here is the list I am messing with right now:
4 Arclight Phoenix
2 Borborygmos Enraged
4 Griselbrand
4 Simian Spirit Guide
4 Worldspine Wurm
Instant (15)
2 Desperate Ritual
4 Goryo's Vengeance
2 Lightning Axe
4 Nourishing Shoal
3 Through the Breach
4 Faithless Looting
1 Night's Whisper
3 Discovery // Dispersal
Land (19)
2 Blackcleave Cliffs
1 Blood Crypt
4 Bloodstained Mire
2 Mountain
1 Steam Vents
5 Swamp
4 Temple of Malice
2 Abrade
2 Anger of the Gods
2 Blood Moon
3 Chalice of the Void
1 Collective Brutality
1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Leyline of the Void
2 Pact of Negation
Sometimes I wish I could use a little more card draw or discard outlets but I feel like to really combo off you need SSG to trigger with the through the breach. If anyone has played other versions I am curious about their updates.
I was just curious if you can pair them together for more damage if something happen, it doesn't work well in this shell.
1. Add a main win condition in case that the combo gets difficult.
2. Add another wincon to make Surgical extraction less impactful. This deck with a SE literaly dies.
1. you don't have the density of 1 mana/free spells to enable phoenixes reliably. You'd probably have to go grixis for SV and play more manamorphoses. casting phoenixes fairly seems bad
2. half the time they keep a surgical/gy hate only hand and you just breach them into oblivion. saying that the deck dies on the spot against one surgical is an exaggeration. Also you can play chalice of the void for 1 and cover that angle plus many other angles if you want to go down that road.
I never say that the arclight version is the way to go, but i think that this decks fails with the hate so hard, and have another win condition is not bad.
I test a lot this kind of deck, and i think that the best version is the old grixis one, with Serums, Thoughtseize, CB and with out Nourishing. I think that NS packet is so uninteractive and the lifegain plan doesn’t feel complementary with the main wincon, add to the fact that makes the deck “non-flex”.
this decklist:
https://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=20668&d=336165&f=MO
He didn't play any Blackcleave cliffs but he relies mostly in Gemstone Mines do you think this manabase can work well? (I have amost all cards but the clifs and price is really unfair now)
Also, I think Chalice is really good right now.
http://www.starcitygames.com/articles/38174_Electrodominating-Modern.html
Last deck talks about us, what do you think about ?
B00NTY
idk if that will be have good results, but the fact is that all the powerfuls non cost spells (wheel of fate, living end, etc.) starts to increase they prices because of Electrodominance.
I just getting into modern, got almost full grishoal without collecting sideboard yet.
What is your game-plan with this deck against white leyline on turn1?
Are you trying to go face with Grisel, wurm and Borby to finish the guy or is there a reliable way to get rid of leyline?
Also, what do you do when opponent surgically extract Grisel, Borby and Wurm, do you just concede?
I'm just getting into the deck and not having played it before I am wondering about some of the popular sideboard choices. In particular, there usually seems to be a split between Anger of the Gods and Bontu's Last Reckoning. I don't quite understand why Bontu's is used here as the drawback is still very real for this deck. I suppose being able to cast it for 3 instead of Damnation on 4 is really that important? Happy to hear your thoughts.
Due to the lack of enchantment hate in B/R, the white leyline will force you into a plan B of breach/vengeance on creatures to go to face (Wurm being the main plan plus Emrakul if you run it in the SB).
If you get all your win-conditions extracted you obviously concede in most cases. However, triple surgical is unlikely and you can always run more big threats in the SB if it's a real concern (though then it would be more productive for them to go for breach+vengeance).
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/1631350
Abzan Traverse / Traverse Shadow / UR Kiki
With the grixis version of the deck, you can play both
ive played 2 Abrade in the sideboard , switched one with shatterstorm but even this is not enough
is it worth to go full of 2 copies of shatterstorm or should i manage my hands better for the plan A or B on those mu's ?